Is Scum & Villainy the best Star Wars RPG even though it’s unlicensed? | RPG Review
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0:28 The Saga Edition has absolutely nothing to do with 4e.
It's merely an iteration of the afore mentioned system that was meant to correct some quite fundamental mistakes,
like making constitution a more important attribute for Jedi than wisdom.
But Saga Edition is still 3rd edition D&D.
Claiming that Saga Edition is based on 4e either means that said person knows nothing about 4e or Saga Edition, or both. Sorry.
3:33 The D&D d20 systems never meshed well with Star Wars, 4e is a bit better suited, but it's also the least "D&D'esc", what might be a hint.
The FFG system is by far the best.
They didn't technically sell it off. When Fantasy Flight Games founder Christian Petersen retired, FFG merged with Asmodee shortly afterward. Since Tabletop RPGs didn't fit Asmodee's workflow structure, the TTRPG branch of FFG split off into a sister company known as EDGE Studios (named after Edge of the Empire I presume). Work has been slowed since but they are still around and still technically reprinting the FFG Star Wars RPGs with the EDGE logo.
EDGE is a much older company that Asmodee acquired. They held the license for translating many TTRPGs into Spanish and French... It's complicated because EDGE Studio (French) and EDGE Enterntaiment (Spanish) worked as wholly independent companies but they have merged since getting offloaded with all the RPG licenses.
The one thing that sucks about Edge is the speed of which they are releasing reprints and how long its taking for them to put out dice. People have been clamoring for these since they took over and they assured everyone they would be out "soon"....its been a good six months since that announcement.
@@hectorcornejo1468 I believe that there might have been licensing problems handing some IPs over from one company to another.
@@75kurai doesn't excuse how slow they've been to release for their own IPs
@@hectorcornejo1468 I'm more willing to blame Edge's Asmodee overlords. Asmodee ruins everything.
Saw video title: immediate thought 'yes it is'. S&V (fitd) is flexible enough to alter parts of the setting with minimal effort, whilst the FitD system is just excellent. Which is why Critical Role have borrowed it for their new games!
Star Wars does have Hyperspace Lanes. This is because objects with significant mass (planets, stars etc) generate wells in hyperspace that can obliterate anything travelling through it. That’s why Navicomps are so important. So, in theory, you can’t just jump from anywhere. However, in practice, it’s just a mechanic to allow your protagonists to get from part a to part b quickly so I don’t think George worried too much about that.
Scum and Villainy handles Star Wars better than any licensed Star Wars game that's come out, and I've got to play FFG and Saga Edition with one of the writers.
Scum & Villany fits nicely with the Firefly paradigm.
The Jump Gates are part of the Fading Suns RPG which is inspired mainly by Dune but also Star Wars.
WEG Star Wars was the first rpg I played with actual people other than myself. It was the Satanic Panic years, and my parents were the only sane ones, so I had the newest D&D box, but no one else was allowed to play it. Star Wars was actually super easy to learn and teach. The second edition got more complex, but I usually ignore all that complexity except when it makes things more fun, like I have a player who wants to get into the nitty-gritty of customizing their space ship, tweaking their weapons, or whatever. If the players don't want the detail, I gloss over and ignore it. I learned on the less complex 1st edition, and even though my rulebook is "2nd edition revised and expanded," I run it like 1st.
West Ends' SW ruleset was such a blast. It was that, AD&D, and Cyberpunk that I really cut my TTRPG teeth on.
Personally after trying S&V for a Star Wars campaign, I have opted into using Starforged to play a Star Wars campaign. Like you said, much like Scum & Villainy with the PBtA system, but it gives you more freedom to explore the galaxy/tell a story rather than constant cycle of mission, downtime, mission, downtime. Plus! You don’t even have to hack the system. You can add some Star Wars roll tables for random flavor or inspiration, but that’s it. It has all you need to play a Star Wars campaign in vanilla.
I just want to mention that sith holocrons can work as the glitcged/jinxed artifacts, and there are hyperspace-lanes in star wars as well which can work as those gates.
HERE FOR THIS. I love BITD and Scum and Villainy is on my shortlist of RPG purchases.
Edit: Also, first time I've ever had the first view on a video.
I honestly have never heard anyone describe the old West End Games D6 system for Star Wars as complex. Back in the day, it was generally thought of as just about the simplest system on the market. I tend to think of it as being way less complex than nearly anything else out there - hearing it described as a "complex game" is kind of jarringly bizarre.
Exactly, a strange comment for sure. I have actually heard the opposite a few times ('too simple') which would be fairer, but I like the speed of gameplay the simplicity brings.
I freaking love heist movies, and so anything that feels like one with the "wish I'd thought of that … oh wait, I did" sort of play style to it is just gonna be up my street. Scum and Villainy has that same vibe as Blades in the Dark, one step removed, so I knew I was going to have fun with it when I saw it. I just got my copy very recently, and just need to adapt all the play sheets to work for me. I think Critical Role's Illuminated Worlds system (Candela Obscura) is going to bring a lot of attention to this style of game, and I'm totally here for it. It definitely doesn't replace more vaguely-D&D-style games for me, but it does scratch an itch that they don't.
Ive been a part of a long running scum game the past 4 months. We meet once a week and my favorite part is the players ability to guide the story. In 5E, i sometimes feel like im just an actor in the DMs wider narrative, but in scum the players and the DM are more collaberative in how a session plays out.
The Star Wars FFG games are pretty amazing too. Heroic and larger than life and cinematic just like the source materials. I have the honor of playing it recently and the people who said it is great are right. It is a great and fun system.
It is indeed too bad that the custom dice are hard to come by and it does not have official online support on VTT.
That is why there are no official pdfs of the games either-LucasFilms won't license them.
I've been wanting to run this game for a while now and we have plans to after our current Fabula Ultima campaign. My plan was originally to run it as Star Wars but now I think I want to run it in an original setting of my creation inspired by Guardians of the Galaxy and Star Wars.
Really good timing on this. I just watched star war visions season 2 and am reaching season 1. And have really gotten the urge to do a star wars game.
Technically you could just say that you need to go to specific jump points in-system to use the hyperdrive, without formalising it with gates and stuff.
Also.. I LOVE your idea to placing the S&V setting in the far future of the SW setting. Genius.
Great Review. My recommendation for a Star Wars Setting with S&V is this: Take it to The Dark Age of the Old Republic. In this era (roughly 1000 years before the movies) there was a cyber attack destroying the holonet and stopping the ships to jump into the hyper space at will. The attack was executed by the Republic to cut off the Sith Warlords from the mid and inner rim of the galaxy. Now the characters have to deal with dozens of Warlords and their fleets and criminal organisations, jump gates and uncharted wild space in the outer rim. It's a perfect setting for S&V and Star Wars in general.
You mention the Devil's Bargain lets you subvert a roll completely. I've always applied this mechanic very differently; if a player accepts a devil's bargain for an extra die to roll, its consequence is guaranteed to happen on top of whatever outcome comes out of the die roll. I don't think it subverts the roll's effects, but rather is added on top.
Honestly, you nearly lost me at "WEG d6 Star Wars is too complex and hard to teach." I find it to be really simple. I stuck around to learn a bit about S&V, but honestly, not being familiar with Blades in the Dark, it doesn't sound simpler to me. I should check it out, though. Thanks for introducing it!
It is interesting that you say S&V is easy to learn. I have played RPGs for decades and cannot wrap my head around any Forged in the Dark game. I wish I still had this book though, some of the subsystems are fantastic.
It's likely _because_ you've played RPGs for so long that you struggle with FitD. It's far easier for people completely new to the hobby to pick up than veterans.
Another great and insightful review. After having hosted WEG's d6 game of Star Wars many years ago, I started with FFG's Edge of the empire in 2018. Still hosting sessions for it and loving it (just started another new group at my local University). I liked the fact that you brought up how expansive FFG's system is and that after a bit of a bumpy start, players and GMs usually get into the dice mechanics quickly. It's very cinematic and leads to awesome and hilarious moments every session. But I'll definitely look more into Scum and Villainy now after this review. Seems very promising.
One little request (if it can even be considered): a review about Earthdawn. FASA's cult classic DnD adjacent from 1993, now in its current 4th edition. The only high fantasy game and setting in which all the tropes of DnD do make sense. It's soo rich and is widely unknown (and beloved by its small fanbase for 30 years now). Thanks!
Two other RPG's you can check out that are NOT official.
Black Star, a rules lite (58 pages) that uses 2D6 with advantage and disadvantage, and "player facing roles" (that means the player rolls a skill to attack, and also rolls a skill to defend vs NPC's who never roll). Also, the game can group baddies together, and rate them in 3 ranks. It is normal to attack a group of minions and kill 2 or even all of them in just one attack.
Star Adventurer is a more traditional D20 style game, also rules lite at 35 pages. This game has your classic D&D six attributes and combat uses Armor Class. The characters have skills and knights have powers (which are nearly the same as skills). The one notable niche thing is that leveling up in Star Adventurer has a random table. You can roll randomly twice, or pick one. Some bonuses are more hit points, or skill points, or better accuracy with a weapon, or bonus to initiative.
Both also have vehicle combat rules, but neither are terribly detailed. In fact, neither game have any GM advice, including pre-made baddies for you to use. Black Star has a tiny bit of world building, but its barely half a page. YOU have to make up your world, but since both are CLEARLY the Star Wars universe I don't see that as a problem. Just watch the movies (or just Ep 4, 5, & 6, then ones that matter).
Ordered Black Star and it's expansion. The Star Adventurer seems interesting but the random rules... does that not risk making characters underperforming in their roles so to speak? Or ending spread very thin across a lot of competence fields?
I love Scum and Villainy as well as a lot of PbtA games that the FitD system is based on. I would love to take the Star Wars setting and use S&V to run a game in it. I learned and tried running the FFG Star Wars but felt that the mechanics were just to slow for the kind of game that I wanted to run. Thank you for the video and your thoughts on S&V.
I still have all of my West End Games 'Star Wars' stuff and think it's easily the best take on the franchise so far.
The neat thing about 'Scum And Villainy,' though is that it could pretty easily handle almost any setting with space opera elements, from 'Firefly' to 'Cowboy Bebop,' with just a little hand-wave.
What makes the WEG version better then the FFG version?
@@sly101s Well, in my opinion the system itself has a very ‘Star Wars’ feel to it. Players are slinging fistfuls of dice, and dice pools can be split to allow multiple actions, so it’s possible for your Tattooine farmboy to take a shot at the stormtrooper, kiss the princess, and swing across a deep chasm in a single action. Play is fast and the system leans into cinematic, heroically pulpy gameplay- the perfect marriage of system and setting, in my opinion, but beyond that, lot of people don’t know that half of the lore of the ‘Star Wars’ franchise was written by West End Games- it’s literally true- because there just wasn’t enough setting information in the two movies which had been released before the game was published to support an entire role-playing setting… West End Games’ Star Wars books created the lore and legendry that we all know and love around the D6 game system, instead of trying to devise a set of rules which allow characters to so the sort of thing you hear about in that lore. It’s a close organic fit.
@@sly101s It feels like Star Wars. It is fast fun and anything is possible. The books they published were so good much of it became canon.
There are some people who prefer physical books and some others who prefer ebooks. However, it's undeniable that it is better to have an ebook than nothing at all.
All new books should be available as ebooks. With ebooks, generally speaking, they should never go out of print (ignoring legal disputes). It shouldn't be required to pay $600 to get an out of print set of old books, because they should be available as ebooks. All new books are digital before they are printed. It takes very little additional effort to convert them to ebooks.
Ebooks are not only fantastic to avoid the "out of print" problem, but it can also reduce shipping costs since it's free to ship ebooks anywhere in the world, unlike physical copies.
The BEST Star Wars games are the old West End Games Star Wars D6 system. I've played and collected them for years, and their values continue to only increase.
It is certainly nice to have a game you own appreciate in price.
You should also give Star Wars D6 REUP (Revised Edition Updated) by Womp Rat Press.
Still have my books and play WEG 2nd edition.
I like Star-Wars as a Space Setting because it's recognized by everyone. I'm using it in a Traveller-like game and I don't have to explain nor do the players need to look up what I'm talking about when I say "wookie or twilik". And they don't need to nor do they have anything to do with the Empire or Republic except as various jurisdictions of Space Police. I've used GURPS and Savage Worlds for this.
I wish the Genesys System was still available.
I expect Edge Studios to start bringing some of the FFG stuff back to print. Since Asmodee bought FFG, they created that new child company for publishing their RPGs. Seems rather slow going but they've begun to put stuff out recently. Although yet another 5e adaptation was the first new one I've seen thus far. 😔 The Genesys stuff was popular enough, I'd be surprised if they didn't continue.
@@NefariousKoel I hope you're right!
If you're talking about Star Wars specifically, with the way licensing and IP laws work, it took some time for Edge Studio to officially start production of Star Wars content. So around the time Asmodee started to shutter Fantasy Flight's RPG division, which was not exactly overnight, and Edge started restructuring, the Covid pandemic happened, which created a massive drag on basically everything. It wasn't until about 2 years after that Edge officially got the rights to print the Star Wars books again. And seeing as they cannot legally sell Star Wars PDFs, it's really hard to get back into the Star Wars games.
But if you're talking about the more general Genesys games, they're still in production. In fact, they just recently released their Twilight Imperium sourcebook for the system. It's just that the production side has been massively slowed down. You can at least buy the PDFs of all the games though.
@@swordbreaker9741 - Thanks for the insight. I knew they were starting to release new stuff, but didn't know much of the details.
@@swordbreaker9741 I've been looking for the physical Genesys dice and haven't had much luck, even on eBay. I looked around for the printed core rulebook as well and came up empty. I hope they do reprint everything, along with the physical dice. It seems like a cool system.
Great stuff, as usual! I'd just add one approach to playing SW using S&V: reskinning on the fly, and renaming or retheming as needed. This worked perfectly for me while playing BitD and reskinning it to a different early-modern-fantasy-setting.
I've played all SW games except for FFG version but still feel Savage Worlds is the best rule set to use. It's pulp action nature just blends to that style of game.
I'm not going to argue your choice for best, but since you are discussing a game that isn't technically a Star Wars game, I'm a little surprised that you didn't at least mention White Star.
another alternative is Rebel Scum, but that one is more geared towards one-shots and very specifically reminiscent of episode 4. Still, pretty damn good for convention games and such
Dumb Edge of Empire game I am playing at the time writing is based on an insane concept that we players came up with and the GM allowed.
We are retired 80s action movie heroes.
Currently we are working as station repair techs, but we are waiting for the Next Generation to show up and trigger the Come Back arc.
So far it has been quite and slow burn, really good rp between the characters and players.
We are just waiting for the insanity to return.
You can stop reading now if you like, from here on out I am just going to ramble about back story.
So as a shared backstory most of us are from the same movie verse for lack of a better term. All the stories star very grounded by 80s standards, gang wars, commandos, hacking, and car chases, but quickly jump the shark with corrupt CEOs, organized crime, and private ninja armies. Given the setting is Star Wars they were using lightsabers. We actually managed to tie it into the Clone Wars era with minimal retcons.
My series of films starts with The classic martial arts revenge film. The gang gets wiped out by rivals and my character returns the favor. The second film includes/ retcons/reveals that a Trade Federation Executive was responsible so the revenge continues, and we get some cameos from other players. Most of the film is a running fist fight up a corporate tower. It ends with the Executive going from top floor to ground floor, beating the elevator. Then there are some cameos in other players films, a couple crossovers. The final film is post shark so is very crazy. The Executive is back as an evil, possibly Sith cyborg, with the above mentioned ninja army. It ends with a duel on a burning rooftop to the death. Jury is out on if duel wielding chain saws vs lightsabers happened in round one, but the Executive died in hand to hand combat. The movie series ended for my character and now he works as a space mechanic. He sends half his pay to his wife and his son is in college. A rather boring member of the galaxy.
Given the number of notes the GM took and the movie tropes, the party suspects that Executive Jr. will show up at some point and my kid may be a Rebellion spy. That is just was my back story, I am not going into the 80s hacker man or commando. Those are their stories, but I am certain we will have Tron and AvP stories as well. Possibly as a super crossover.
We had one player not join the group back story, and is playing a con man/grifter and we joke he is a late 90s early 2000s movie. The player is loving the pending insanity as his character has no clue, and he finds it funny.
I like to think in mechanical terms sometimes, and I like to think of Position and Effect in terms of clock segments. Position: Controlled 1, Risky 2, Desperate 3; Effect: Limited 1, Standard 2, Great 3.
Your average test would be a hidden 2-segment clock, and if the player wins the roll, they are rewarded the Effect. If they fail, the GM is rewarded the Position.
WEG SW was fantastic, but S&V is perfection *chef's kiss*
I've only just heard of Blades in the Dark since the sneak peak release of Candela Obscura, but the system seems like my kind of thing. I tend to like more narrative, story driven RPGs for the most part. I may have to pick up a copy of Scum and Villany. I've been looking for a good sci-fi RPG for space operas now that I've been using Mothership for sci-fi horror.
Yup, running a Star Wars/ Scum & Villainy game pretty soon myself. I'd come up with the time-jump idea as well, but it's good to hear other folks consider it a viable option!
Have had this book for a while but regrettably haven't had a chance to play. But I got it thinking more of playing Firefly or Mass Effect style adventures thought I admit it can work just as well for Star Wars.
A bit of an off topic question, but I'd like to ask if you've World Without Numbers. And if there are TTRPGs based on the Jurassic park/world franchise?
I’ve played WWN. I’ve reviewed a game that almost perfectly emulates JP called Escape From Dino Island.
@@DaveThaumavore I'll be checking out your review on Escape From Dino Island. And I'd love to see a possible review on WWN😁
where did you find the "rules summary sheet"?
i have the book and i dont see it in the contents table
I think I just Googled it!
imo SWFFG is always going to be the best star wars rpg - low-key it's one of my favorite rpgs overall.
What does “low-key” mean in this context? I’m old and don’t understand this slang. Would the sentence pretty much mean the same if you hadn’t added “low-key”? Does it mean “in fact” or “and actually”? Thanks for helping me out here.
@@DaveThaumavore yeah, "and actually" is a good parallel phrase in this case
There is an excellent Burning Wheel hack called Star Systems also.
I really struggle with this system. I'd need a GM to guide me through it. I can't get my head around the way to play their series of games, probably very good games but it just doesn't stick in my mind how to play them.
So... other than some obvious influences in some of the setting details.... not really very Star Wars at all? I mean, I know some people get into other aspects, which is why Edge of the Empire exists, but the Jedi and the Rebellion (but mostly the Jedi) are what make it Star Wars to me. None of this feels like a place a Jedi would fit, tbh. Maybe I'm missing it through where you focused your attention, though.
Regardless, thank you so much for a detailed review, but I'll stick to WEG :D
What is so complicated about WEG D6 Star Wars?!
This comment took me aback also. To answer your question, absolutely nothing. It is one of the most acessible systems I have played, and I have played a lot over the past 35 years.
Excellent video as always, Dave! One unlicensed Starwars RPG that you didn't mention and that is pretty darn awesome is Hyperspace D6 by Matt Click. Check it out :-)
I bought Scum & Villany pretty much when it came out, but I ended up really disappointed. The default setting just felt so flat for me. I studied it, I tried to map out the connections ... and I remember nothing. In the end I started a Traveller game instead, which wasn't the kind of system I wanted, but felt flexible enough that I could push it out of my way to focus on the science fiction ideas I wanted to show off without needing to rewrite a huge amount of material. For me, I think that was a good choice.
Isn't the default setting just Star Wars?
I always thought the point of Scum and Villainy was that it was kinda like Savage Worlds - it was just rules, but could apply to any setting. In this case, more specifically, ship-based sci fi... If anything, it kinda assumed you were doing pseudo Star Wars, pseudo Star Trek, or pseudo Firefly. But you still need to provide the details.
EDIT: after fully watching the video, I realized I probably skipped the setting sections because all I was interested in was the mechanics, and intended to co-opt it from the get go. My impression of pseudo-settings was more based on the three ship form factors.
Forged in the Dark games are very dependent on their factions and setting map, so it's quite a bit of work to replace, and perhaps more important, the characters are supposed to know the setting intimately, so you can't just fill things in as needed. Or at least, that's the impression I got.
@@MrTonypace Honestly, it's exactly the opposite. The settings in Blades and Forged in the Dark games are generally intentionally vague. Every table is supposed to make up huge swathes of the setting themselves. The vast majority of factions in Blades are literally just an evocative name and how powerful they are, for instance.
Well, this review just put this game on my 'To Buy soon' list.
No mention of the Savage Worlds Star Wars Companion?
With IP names, consider just as we have multiple names for the same thing, so too does the world you're playing in. So words like the Force and The Way may both be used in the same way that Ghost and Spirit are used. IP names are only necessary for content creators and need not restrict your game.
Happy to be an exception to the apparent rule- tried the fantasy flight Star wars game, thought the mechanics were a bloody mess. Not a fan.
Yeah, it was pretty bad. I was surprised by this comment in the video too, as the views of our entire group of 7 ranged from 'meh' to 'dog-egg'.
SaV really is a fantastic game (as is BitD). I ran a really successful Star Wars campaign using SaV, set pre- New Hope (and taking only the original trilogy as cannon).
Here's how I adapted it, other than renaming:
I changed jump gates to hyperspace beacons. In theory free-roaming lightspeed travel is possible but in practice everyone uses the beacons. I remapped the Procyon Sector, so that each star system became a Star Cluster, with fewer planets round each star, and linked by hyperspace routes. I decided the Procyon Sector was an Outer Rim territory undergoing bit of a gold rush due to the discovery of the Ur ruins - an ancient Force Sensitive civilisation, and this also explained the existence of the artefacts.
I also remapped all the factions etc, drawing a bit on the Hutt Space materials but also making changes of my own.
All this along with some tools (like interactive Clocks and NPC generators) is publicly available here: docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/183gBfWZXwtF94zIojm4y3kO4pBpc1Ta1otO9x6rWnQs/edit?usp=drive_link
I hope someone finds it useful, and enjoy this excellent RPG!
The real question is this the better Firefly game, honestly.
Best version of the Star Wars RPG is the WEG version.
This video is Gold!
West End Games Star Wars is a very easy and fast game. IMO it is not anywhere close to FFG. I have played a lot of PBTA and find WEG Star Wars easier. I can teach someone to play WEG in less than a minute. We can start playing in a minute is they play an archetype. Five minutes if they create a character.
S&V is a lot more complex and far more structured. Even you explanation of the system left my head swimming. Obviously if you played Blades in Dark you will be comfortable with S&V.
I started a WEG for a new group a while ago, who were all used to playing RPGs, but mostly D&D 3.5 and World of Darkness games - so this was very new. Within 30 minutes, they had all taken a character, and I told them about pips, how to roll dice from stats, difficulty numbers, and what stats govern which actions, and they picked a template they liked the sound of, and they were good to start playing in about 30 minutes. Sure there were a few things I had to remind them of, or explain later, but I can only think of a handful of games (I have played a lot) that are this accessible.
Awesome!
Bear in mind that the sequels and rogue one fail at portraying hyperspace. You shouldn't be able to jump inside a gravity well, and it also takes the computer a little while to calculate a jump. Otherwise, in the originals they would've jumped out of the death star hanger (something that they stupidly allow to happen in TRoS), or jumped out of Bespin's atmosphere in Empire (which they stupidly did in Rogue One). And TLJ also weaponises hyperspace, which also breaks everything.
In fact, TROS has a "hyperspace skipping" sequence, in addition to "hyperspace tracking" on snub fighters, both of which are utter nonsense and shouldn't be a thing. All of those movies were just so unbelievably bad.
Also, how the fuck does the Trade Federation's blockade of Naboo work if ships can just hyperspace into and out of the atmosphere?
@@MollyGermek True! I forgot about that.
Yeah.... No. I guess I'll nust have to wait for Edge to release those reprints if it ever happens. I hate it that most of the rpgs i wanna run are unobtainium for some reason
A pretty bold claim to say that everyone who learned the FFG system liked it. I for one thought it a dog egg, and the reasons for having specialty dice quite transparent. That being said, the quality of the FFG printed material was very good, something it has in buckets over the older games. You really can tell the books were printed in the late 80's and early 90's. As far as the too complex vs too simple, I think the WEG d6 system gets this just about right, maybe even a bit too simple, but it does make combat very fast. The system is very much written for a "theatre of the mind" approach though, so is pretty woolly around specifics in combat. Again I like that, some will not. The D20 version I played was just 'meh' - and I never played Saga edition, thank god.
Whilst this looks interesting, I would suggest if you want a StarWars game, play a StarWars game, there are plenty to choose from. I would recommend the d6 system personally, which is freely available (as in open licence) and get your source material from Wookiepedia (although details like stats will need some DIY work) or even better; get the unofficial SW WEG (d6) "2nd Edition Revised Expanded Updated" (REUp) edition for everything you need in one monster book. The licenceing of that is less straight forward, however.
Interesting video though, thanks.
Imagine not mentioning PEW PEW: Bounty Hunters in Space and its expansions.
I think I am the lone person that actually despises the FFG system for star wars. I have played about 6 times and find it frustratingly limited. The three systems they have do not cross over well, and I never have played with a group that wanted to just play as privateers, rebels or force users, it was always a mixed batch. I don't enjoy a funny dice system where I have to constantly look at a chart to identify what a die means and then have a interpretation of what they actually accomplish. It was the least star wars system I have ever played, I rank it almost last, just above SW5e which is horribly broken from level 1.
A lot of the newer systems feel like they would be best for one shots or short campaigns, but if I want a long term game I rather use WEG, d20, or Saga edition. I feel like those allow for a character advancement that usually makes sense.
I will never understand how people struggle with those dice. It's literally 6 symbols. If you can read and total a D6 dice pool you can read and total the FFG dice.
@@MollyGermek It's not just 6 (actually 9) symbols, it is also knowing the 7 colors and what each does. Why not just use normal d6, say a 1- 3 is a miss, 4-5 is a hit, and 6 a crit? Because they wanted to make an extra 10 bucks to make people buy funny dice. I didn't have a hard of a time learning it but feel like I wasted brain cells to do so for such a niche game. It was the first (and last) game I ever bought dice for that required "special" dice. (I play Vampire the Masquerade with normal dice and have as much fun as those that bought the "specialty" dice.)
Besides the dice, the system is not that good since I have played others that do what I just described originally (playing a mixed group of characters) and character evolution much easier and better for long term play. If you like the system of FFG, great. More power to you. However for me, compared to other Star Wars systems I have played over the years, it is by far one of the lower end ones and less fun.
I absolutely agree with you. It was a very silly system, one of the worst I have seen, and I have played a lot of tabletops over the last 35 years. Out of the lot, WEG(d6) was the best in my opinion (although I did really like the Starships of the Galaxy D20 sourcebook - it really was a masterful sourcebook that alone convinced me to run a campaing in D20).
I own and tried to play the Star Wars with the goofy dice and I think it's absolutely terrible.
Not everyone who learned and played FFG Star Wars loved it. It bored me, and many in my group.
Can't say I agree with it being a great Star Wars game specifically, but I do think it's a great game that can be molded into any IP you want. My upcoming game will be set in a world more similar to Firefly than Star Wars, but you could definitely do Star Wars in it easily.
No, the Star Wars movies are the best Scum and Villainy films, even though they're unlicenced.
5:17 Dave might not condone it, _but I absolutely do. Raise the black flag if it's your only option, mateys._
Dude, you had me until you said the WEG version of the setting was hard to learn or teach. Dude, no. I played 1e DnD in the early 80, and WEGSW was soooooo much simpler.
I played FFG Star Wars and the dice system sucks. The combination of different dice, colours and symbols is just bad game design. I love narrative game systems, but this just overcomplicates it and makes it slow.
Clarification on Devil’s Bargains. They don’t replace anything. They *add* to anything else already happening. When you ask for a Devil’s Bargain (or if one is offered), what you’re listening to is *A* guaranteed Cost of your Action. It doesn’t matter what your result outcome is- the Devil’s Bargain always comes to pass, even in a Full Success or a Crit.
So if you hear and choose to accept the Devil’s Bargain to get +1d to your roll and in exchange you’ll take +2 Heat at the end of the job, then no matter what you’re outcome is… you’re taking that 2 Heat. If you get a 6 or a Crit, you still take that 2 Heat. If you got a 4/5 or a 1-3 and the Consequence that was on the table was Level 2 Harm (based on your actions in the fiction and your Position)… then you take the Level 2 Harm *and* that +2 Heat from your Devil’s Bargain.
bi-bob der RPG go
Another nifty knockoff Star Wars RPG is White Star. Especially the Galaxy Edition. Uses a variation of classic original/0e D&D rules. Has Star Knights instead of Jedi, Void Knights instead of Sith, Star Swords instead of lightsabers, The Way instead of The Force, etc.
I personally dislike Forged in the Dark. I find it boring and cheap.
Really? I’d love to know what you find boring and cheap. I too find, with certain fitd games, that they don’t quite deliver what they advertise.
@Bobby Jennings I've tried it a few times, and It's just flat. One-shot is ok, I guess, but a campaign? I can not imagine it at all. The system is just way too light for me.
@@daved.8483 Thanks for the insight, Dave. Appreciate it.
I think a lot of people see it as a light system. I actually feel like it is pretty crunchy, but more because there are several, separate systems that are individually not mechanically deep, but make the whole game pretty challenging to keep track of its moving parts. Although, to be fair, I'm talking specifically about blades in the dark, the only one I've actually played.
@Bobby Jennings no drama. Although, if you are in doubt, you should try it. After all, I am speaking from a personal perspective.
I ran S&V for a while, and I'm not impressed. My main problem is that the designers are lazy af.
Now, that is on brand for the whole Forged in the Dark franchise. John Harper had some (awesome, no doubt there) mechanical design visions and then noted down some cool-sounding half-baked ideas inspired by other media, called it a day, and slapped a price tag on the product.
I totally get that every table has their own ideas for specific concepts of the game they run. But call me entitled - I'm used to a better breed of designer, one that offers a default implementation for their ideas and leaves it to the DMs and players to develop differing house rules, if they want.
S&V takes this laziness to a new extreme, though. This manifests in two problems: a lack of guidance, and a lack of understanding the rules the system copies.
For the lack of guidance, take the concept of 'ship scanners'. Going by the core rulebook comms modules include ship scanners, there are a lot of scanners near a jumpgate, and you can get long range scanners, which might (at least if you read past the immediate description, where such an information would be useful) let you spy on people without that technology.
Now, what can ship scanners pick up? Apparently, according to the play sample, they can detect weapons being warmed up.
Aaaand that's it.
Everything else - every other question - is basically met by the designers with a "yeah, sounds like work, eff no, me outta here". Now, I get it's a narrative system and hard number crunch isn't to be expected, but the very, basic, default minimum I'd expect from a narrative system is, you know, talking about the narrative. Just a page or two about what ranges to choose for a normal ship scanner range. What they might be able to detect, and how that influences play. What countermeasures there might be, if the scan can be detected, and how that may influence the narrative. There are a lot - A LOT - of questions to answer without putting numbers on a technology like that.
And the very basis of the game - the core of the gameplay - is technology. BitD's crew mechanics are replaced by a spaceship, a technological entity.
For BitD, most of the massive conceptual design laziness at least was in the realm of the supernatural. "There's a ghost field". "What does that mean?" "Eff me if I know, I'm just the designer of this game and world."
Here, every technological advance the ship gets is only worth one or two lines for the designers.
As for the lack of understanding the original rules: some of the BitD rules made only sense in the BitD setting. For example, Heat mostly relies on not being able to leave Doskvol, and Flashbacks rely on Doskvol being a place of a few thousand inhabitants confined to a city that can be crossed twice in a busy day. You can totally find out what Bluecoat lieutenant guards the governours ball that night and have him bribed beforehand. If you're smugglers transporting contraband into another starsystem, there is no way you found out which starship patrols the target sector in the second your ship is detected, and bribed all possible commanding officers using a goverment-controlled communcation system that may or may not (again, who can tell, surely not the designers of this game) even be able to reach all possible targets undetected. In the end, there will be a lot of "mother-may-I" regarding that ill-defined spaceship you've made spot-of-the-moment judgement calls about last session because the designer gave you eff-all of a guidance to base your decisions upon.
Which leads to the core problem: yes, a seasoned and smart DM with a proactive player group can do a lot with the little that is provided here. Arguably, that hypothetical group is also fine with "5e D&D, but Star Wars and all spellcasting classes are force-sensitive" (as evidenced in this video :-)).
It's the less experienced DMs, or the experienced DMs with a mostly reactive group, or the narrative DMs that like the system they run to cover the basics so they can concentrate on telling awesome stories, that are left picking up the massive amount of slack the designers of S&V left behind and, for some reason, expect to be paid for.
HyperspaceD6 by Matt Click
A free game that streamlines and modernized the original WEG game. When I read it a couple years ago it was doing some cool stuff too simplify the original game, and is a bonus it is easy to use with any of the Star wars supplements you may already have.
The game reminds me more of the video game "No Man's Sky".