How Bossware is Watching While You Work
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- čas přidán 10. 12. 2020
- Employee surveillance software has done booming business as many people continue to work from home. Supervisors use it to record everything their workers do on their computers, analyzing the data to see if your productivity measures up. They call it "Bossware," and it may be here to stay.
#FutureOfWork #BloombergQuicktake #Privacy
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We need some labor protection laws to ban this kind of software.
It's fairly illegal in Europe, there is law that prevents employers from doing that.
That would be a huge mistake. What you are proposing is way too radical.
Real-life situation:
If an employer cannot have some sort of general view of what his employee is doing, how would he decide the amount of money he is going to give you for your work?
As a work around, he will probably start paying you at a flat rate, for example. Way more manageable for an employer. So you'll basically become some sort of a Freelancer.
How would you fix your prices? Would they be competitive against let's say an Indian Freelancer, who has as much qualification as you do, but expects only a fraction of the money you would ask?
Don't forget, as a Freelancer, you are on your own. No job security, no medical insurance, no benefits, nothing...
My point? No radical measures. Both sides (employee vs employer) have there own concerns. Both sides need to talk to each other so that a middle ground can be reached.
@@jhhhjgfds We already have the middle ground - manager gives deadline, employee delivers within deadline. What the fk does he need to know my browsing history for? Creepy
@@jhhhjgfds No, you look at results. If an employee can do 8 hours of work in 4 hours then let them, don't punish sprinter because they took less time than the walker to finish the race. This level of distrust in your employees is a bad sign in a company and it WILL decrease productivity and morale. People will get stressed out, some will quit, some will fill their day with busy work, etc, but very few will actually be more productive.
@@monkemode8128 Getting paid for only the final work, the end result only, that might open a Pandora's box. How would you stay competitive in a global world where others compete with cheaper wages or less resources? What about those who are less productive? Or less talented? I'm talking about the social aspect of work.
If I had my own company, what you are proposing would be fine by me . However, as a business man, my goal is to make sure my company stays viable. If I'm offered those two possibilities: Paying someone $1000 for a job, or $200 for the same exact job? Which one do you you think I would choose?
And why would I feel guilty doing so? I don't know you, you don't know me. I owe you nothing, you owe me nothing. Anyway, way easier to outsource my workforce abroad (way less constraints). You understand where I am getting at?
Let me see if I understand this: When I was in the office, you felt the need to monitor me. When I'm working from home, you feel the need to monitor me. If you have the time to monitor me and all of your other subordinates, you're the one who needs monitoring because you clearly don't have enough to do.
That's literally the job of the human resources department, to manage the humans who produce the resources.
If you have a whole department whose job depends on monitoring the employees, why shouldn't they do their jobs?
(I went to college for business administration in Human Resources. The whole concept is to maximize those humans' efforts into corporate profit. How would you do that job?)
@@MsGenXodus Your degree is useless and garbage. HR is automate able and you shall be replaced.
@@aaronbirook4367 Yep. Haven't worked in HR since 2013. These days I'm in sales.
@@MsGenXodus If the job of human resources is to monitor people, what are managers there for??? HR and middle management are always fighting for the difficult job of who can make employees lives more miserable.
In my previous employer I had 7 bosses, do you think I was managed enough as a "human resource"?
thats a job also, a shepard, a guard, a monitor at kindergarden. police, etc
I've spent 15 years working remotely and the past 5 managing a small remote team, it has never crossed my mind to do this. It's absolutely unnecessary and invasive, at least in my experience.
A quick Slack/Teams/etc. message tends to do the trick lol.
There are a lot of people slacking and many who try to juggle 2-3 jobs at same time and you lose productivity.
@@SunnyGirlFlorida1. People slacking are entirely about results if someone can slack yet do the same level of work then they honestly have earned it if someone can do 8 hours of work in 4 then they should either be rewarded, given a raise or increase in responsibilities/ pay , or just be able to do what they want with the 4 hours. If you monitor them it’s been proven over and over again that they will just make the work take 8 hours
@@SunnyGirlFlorida2. People working multiple jobs unironically doesn’t matter if they can show results if you want people to give their all to your company then make that possible with higher pay/ benefits I promise you that people will find out how to get around this software
A manager creates fear, a leader creates followers :)
If you feel you need to monitor your employees in such detail, you’re the one that should get sacked.
I find it humorous how similar these tools are to RAT tools used by hackers since the early days. The main difference is that the one your boss potentially uses is more sophisticated and has a company behind it.
That's why you don't have your company and will always work for a boss
I first heard about this in 2012. This has been a thing for a long time and it is usually corporations behind this as opposed to managers. It is part of a 50 year trend of diminishing employee rights as the supreme court backs big money/big corps and congress has seen upticks in lobbyists. If we want this to stop, we need to organize and fight back. However, that will not happen and as the video mentions, it will soon become commonplace to be monitored this way.
i hate that we're made to feel guilty for working from home. like we're expected to work longer hours, now accept higher levels of surveillance. damn if yall really need me in the office to justify the electricity bills just say it
If you analyse my active hours and keystrokes then i"ll start on time, finish on time and take my full breaks. If I manage myself, I'll be engaged in the work and have no problem forgetting its 7pm.
So true there are so many times we give work much more hours into our personal time that we could’ve said fuck it! This intrusive behaviour won’t inspire great corporate culture and a willingness to go the extra mile if we’re gonna be tracked and marked down for where me may fall off. We’re humans these companies often times forget that.
It's simple. If you work at a place that uses this, plot your escape plan immediately.
But how do we know if they use it or not?
@@poochesworld I figured companies have to tell you. If they don't, someone will find out and tell everyone anyways. Then its even more incentive to bail from the shady company.
@@poochesworld Look at the process list in task manager. 99% of the time employer spyware will be listed. If you suspect it's there and not showing up, dump the memory of the system and do offline analysis.
As soon as you start measuring something, it stops being a useful metric. All of these employees are absolutely going to learn how to game the system to boost "productive time".
The qunatum mechanics of employment
Just 5 mins into the video and already having the UNEASY feeling creeping up!!
Makes me feel so gross 🤮
Problem is even CEO’s like jack ma have said we should be working 4 hours a day 3 days a week. There isn’t that much work to be done anymore with all of our tools. Constant working is for computers.
YES. Especially with climate change biting our butts, we need to reduce our energy consumption and this includes the workplace. I mean, it could go up because people are at home all the time, but, people would also probably get bored, so they'd go for bike rides or long walks or take public transit somewhere.
honestly just evaluate employees on their production and not how they do it it's not hard
Amazing to me that people need this. If your employee is meeting all of their productivity goals while watching youtube all day; I guess you do need to know that ASAP - so they can be PROMOTED. Or you need to be fired for not setting high enough expectations of your employee.
If you say we are willing to pay x for y and then notice they are crushing all of your y's in 20 hours a week - you can't just stuff them with 20 hours of other work for the same pay. Seems like that's what this is trying to get at.
If employees are meeting goals, who cares? I worked at a tech company who's founder always said "I don't care if you are on facebook or youtube.. don't take it off the screen because I walk in or avoid doing it because of me. If you get your work done and have time to spare who am I to bother"
Yes, there is a time to sit and think about innovation and improvements - but we are also human. No one smokes cigarettes anymore. We need instagram breaks.
Depending on the job, how someone does something is important, not just producing the results
I do fine without being watched. I like to work at my own pace, when I can. I do not work well when being watched.
Me either. A deal breaker. I walked away from a previous employer before because of this type of nonsense.
Technical slavery.....
@Yoo Wat it’s a choice of work or die for a lot of people. Not a great “choice”.
I wonder if these Bossware using bosses would be willing to subject their own time at work to this level of surveillance by their board of governors.
This is dumb, imagine how much time and resources would be wasted if most bosses behaved this way. Simply overblown and untrue.
It's been like this in car sales for years. Sales jobs have managers that monitor follow up time as well as several other metrics. Some even put microphones at the desks to listen to negotiations.
@@dachanist if this is the rule then we have major problems, I am okay with a few warranted exceptions but if sales managers, or any managers, need to be this tied into the work of their employees that its either:
A profession that needs adjustment
OR
A management style that needs erasure.
This type of behavior only enables “managers” to sit around and do even less, while their staff do all their work for them.
S.O.S. Meet the New Boss, Same as the Old Boss. Nothing new under the sun.
Some bosses are nosy and control freaks.
8:30 "We all behave a little bit better when we know, somebody is watching"
That isn`t a justification for such a violation of our privacy. That´s an euphemism.
People can work slowly, so time-spent is no indication on productivity.
Boomers still in the workforce monitoring everyone while doing nothing
I have found women in their 20s-40s to be the most busy body and wanting to surveil and control everyone.
What did your father do to you 😱😱😱
@@leludallasmultipass Mommy-mode is a real thing. If you don't need a mommy figure anymore, you have to get out from under her watchful eye and prove or develop your ability to work independently. Results speak for themselves.
And here we see the middle management of corporations desperately trying to justify their salaries.
There is a difference between the leader having a walk through the office once in a while and some Smalltalk with the employes and having every single step, every single move etched and saved for ever.
There is always a seemingly simple solution, and a smart solution. The smart solution is, to create a workplace, where people like to be and treat your workers not just as human beings, but as ham beings, you actually like.
The fact is very simple: control tools are normally excuses for bad leadership, which has to entreat some other bad leadership with phoney numbers that generally account for nothing. One has to choose if he’s going to spend money on incompetent managers, under-average employees and control softwares or with average employees, good leadership and weak control softwares that simply report key-numbers. This guy selling bossware looks like a typical high-maintenance kind of person. I wonder just how aweful it must be to have such a boss...
His WhatsApp
+...1....5....2....0....2....2....2.....9.....2.....7.....7
Do well to tell him I referred you 💯!!!!
Solution:
You have a monitored work computer that you use for work and your own non monitored personal computer.
Bam, problem solved.
I completely agree! lol
An easy solution to an unnecessarily complicated issue!
And the work computer can be supplied by the employer.
Lmao please do this to lawmakers/government people.. we voted them in they’re millionaires... we (Americans ) should be able to see if their being productive
Not the other way around
This should be implemented. Nice thoughts.
I would NEVER work for a company that uses this kind of software
The productivity score is utter BS for a profession that has to use creativity and thinking. A low-level programmer might have a higher score since he is constantly typing something, but a high-level programmer might just write a couple of lines of codes a day and spend a lot of time doodling and thinking wich no program can really measure.
this is borderline creepy, especially like the way they can try to see whether you're wanting to change your job or sth like heck
They can also turn your mic and camera on without you knowing. What's creepier than that
It's not borderline, it is creepy
@@notanartist9908 web cameras on your laptop has a small led light which will turn on when the camera turns on. You'll know
It really seems as if the industry has the power over everything in america.
Im glad that here in germany such software is simply not allowed.
That should be the case everywhere. It is a bad joke that the boss can see youre password for every site you are logging in. How is this not illegal in USA?
I used to work at a call center and we had this kind of software installed at every workstation. You had to sign a consent form stating you know about it and allowing it to monitor you as part of the training.
What's missing is comaradre with fellow workers. "What did you do this weekend?" "How was your son's baseball game? Did they win?" If you can't do this, then better find a job in an office.
Interesting video, thanks for the research!
:-D
I flat refuse to work for a company that uses this disgusting software.
Not only is it completely immoral, in my opinion, but it is also counterproductive.
Workers come up with all of there best ideas during that ‘unproductive’ time. The human brain isn’t just like a machine where more time in equals more production. The idea generation process in the human brain is like playing musical chairs, when the music stops that’s when things actually happen.
Jon. when jobs are scarce you compromise. that's the real problem
Or start your own business. Screw working for corporations.
In europe we have the GPDR so the user is protect from allot of this, and specific in my country companies are not allow to have this type of control. Shure they can block you from accessing some sites but the are not allow to block you from accessing your bank site our have acces to the information thats is encrypted like your password, or to take pictures of you, or see what you write or the emails that you sent. Why? Because of privacy or private information.
That's kinda creepy. It's like your system got hacked basically. I guess it's okay if it's during work hours. I wouldn't want it 24/7. That would be too much of an invasion of privacy.
Can't you disable it after you're done?
Humans behaving like humans and not machines, gee...
I wonder why
We have nothing like this either in the office or at home. There are expectations of what we are supposed to do and when we're supposed to finish it. They don't need to monitor us every minute they just want to see the results.
There are expectations during the course of the day with people I interact with and respond to. As long as I meet them they don't care
And believe me this makes for a very motivated happy workplace. If I were being subjected to this kind of stuff I would quit this job now and go into early retirement which I could do.
This kind of monitoring just makes for a very tense miserable place to work whether it be in the office or at home.
Great research, thank you.
oh, the irony that the newshouse that produced this content is owned by Mike Bloomberg
I literally started a company to help address this problem! Hourly Kapital helps organizations measure outputs, not inputs.
This concept ruined my home an family.
How?
Nice keyboard bloomberg guy btw!
Great video
So this is a managerial despot’s wet dream.
Just use the browser on your personal phone.
Bonus points: applying to other jobs on your android phone where they don't monitor you.
Just make sure you use a VPN if you're connected to the company's WiFi!
@@thelight3112 why would I be using the company's wifi?? 4g all the way, all the time. That's what unlimited data is for ya noob ;)
@@PaulsWildLife Our building is made of thick ass metal and concrete, so WiFi is all there is. Luckily I'm the only one monitoring the wifi, and only for illegal stuff.
Side story: At a different place I worked, the company network was horrible and there was no cell reception indoors, so I managed to get my own personal internet connection - just called up the local cable company and subscribed to the basic $30/month internet. Made work bearable lmao.
Staying idle or not active on computure doesn't mean somebody is not productive. You don't need to type on keyboard to be productive also. So, these software is total nonsense. In the end the important thing is if you take the ship to harbor safe after the storm.
Omber but they have a key logger in them. trust me those software are invasive as hell. i know this because my company use one. and this video is timely because i am working from home. and i got told off for being away from the computer ( on my day off ). i had to point the manager to the rota. The motherfather apologized.
Imagine the psychological damage when you find out you’re being surveilled- it would make you feel sorta like Truman. At the end of that movie I always feel down because I know his life didn’t get better after that. The lack of trust would stay with you.
I love this
The company I work for has a app where we can look at upcoming jobs/projects submit documents submit pictures things like that. All day everyday the app will say managing your location service. This obviously means they monitor where I'm at at all times.
Surely you will just go work for a company where you are treated like a human being, rather than a robot on a production line? How is it in your company's interests to make your employees miserable? If your workforce is happy and you convince them of your cause, they will become more productive and creative automatically. Don't treat them like they have nowhere else to go.
Make your employees happy and motivated by positive reinforcement. This is why so many people are unhappy. This boss should think why he needs this software.
Never work at companies which do this.
So this will be the norm in the States? Europe has something called the GDPR (General Data Regulation) which is a regulation in EU law on data protection and privacy. I don’t think that it’s acceptable software to use because its breaching the regulation but I’m sure that companies are using something similar to monitor their employees.
Bottomline... privacy policy doesn't exist..and when you press [ AGREE ] its nothing but hoax🤌
This is why I’m working for myself.
Those tools would be as needed before the pandemic. Warming a chair is not a measure of efficiency
We use TEAMS and Yammer and the reports, which we did in the office too.
"These pretzels are making me thirsty!"
If he's watching, then he's cool with the fact I only actually work about an hour per day. He hasn't said anything after a year.
thinking is also working, most of my work happens in my head.
Woow! I am in for that long-waited promotion if Coursera and CZcams are considered productive at my work.
This is tough. I’m an accountant and auditor. I sit in front of my desk for 9+ hours. But I literally can only get 5 to 6 hours of me clicking and typing. The other time is spent thinking. Brainstorming. Would I be in trouble if I was being tracked?
perfect example of how they would use that as an exuse to not pay you for the other 3 hours.
The question is, could the employer still monitor you even if you're using your personal laptop along with your work laptop since both of the pcs are on the same network?
I wonder if the data being collected could be used to train artificial intelligent bots.
When I'm trying to figure things out, sometimes I use pen and paper. So to my employer I must look like I'm not doing jack since my mouse is not moving and screen are not changing.
Me tooo!!!
No way, not for me. It'll make people too paranoid to function imo.
Sure. As long as upper management, CFO, and CEO are monitored and rated in the same manner. They are the most expensive employees and we need to make sure they are productive.
Ok but when you start to quantify like this, what is slacking and what is just the way it always been portrayed in a number?
People aren't machines. Monitoring for efficiency will generally lead to busy work. The appearance of work for the sake of metrics. That's the hallmark of a bad manager. Trust your people, and set larger goals for them. Let them work out the details of how to get there. Or don't, and get wrecked by smaller more agile businesses that actual value their people.
People aren't "Your" people. You don't own people. A boss who thinks of people as "theirs" are the shittiest of all.
@@GreenEnvy. Ya, that's not how english works. "Your people" in this context implies responsibility for. Given the prior several sentences, you think i'm talking about ownership? Read gooder... :/
@@fallen546 You don't put "your" in front of people if you're not implying ownership. You just say "people." Pretending the context is "responsibility for" is just something you pulled that out of your ass. Do better.
PS- shave your beard. You look like a bad Shakespearian actor.
@@GreenEnvy. I don't really understand why you hate employees. I'm saying trust them. You're grasping at straws to attack that idea. You seem suspiciously like a middle-manager who feels personally attacked by this idea. You don't have to take my advice. I'm sure you'll get plenty of busy work out of your people. :)
I NEED THIS SOFTWARE 😍
So basically bosses have no clue in products made, they interested not in "job done" results but in hours and amount of clicks. And bosses job is "bossing" because they are not fitting for work they surveilling.
Thank
Kevin?
The "pixel-grid dithering effect" used mainly on the display capture portions of the video looks really really bad and makes it hard to focus on the text. It also creates a weird artificial motion blur, as well as kind of hurts my eyes. That very well could just be me though.
The video, however, was fucking great.
creepy as all hell
Interesting. I wonder if schools use any bossware (sounds like a fancy, legal name for a spyware) to surveil their students. 😂
They do, and it's on the rise in higher ed, especially as cheating becomes more widespread.
@@mandisaw then they need to be transparent about it
Yes, Just do a search on Lower Merion school district in Pennsylvania a few years back this happened.
This is 1984
In the security industry starting in 2014. The security company would use the blackberry phones to track security guards everytime they do rounds. I left because it got way to deep they were tracking my footsteps and if I stop walking the security manager would be on site. I saw this coming before 2020.
What I usually do, it is wiping Windows or MacOS from a computer and install my very own copy of Linux. In this case an employer has much less options.
You get a laptop from work and you aren‘t allowed to change anything and you‘re not admin account, simple as that.
@@awdadwadwad1723 I heard about that, but I was lucky enough to do not work at such companies.
Would be interesting if anyone over here in Europe working at a big corp would do a GDPR request from their employer.
How does this software get downloaded if you don’t consent and you use your own non-company issued computer?
on your private pc it won't of course if you are not using he company's resources.
I've been surveillanced for years and I stopped thinking about it. It is what it is when you can't do anything about it.
Simple solution: dont use company devices for personal use.
I'd rather live poor and jobless !
That’s where my head is. Not playing this game. No wonder homeless skyrocketed. Probably smart to get ahead of the herd.
Go ahead. Nobody cares.
Sofiane, pariel. j'ai pas envie d'entre esclave
The worst about it is that we don't know if our company uses this.
Surveillance of dog walkers leaving dog mess on the streets please. 🤔
It's about time all the surveillance does something that benefits real people whilst the techno people eat their heads for a living, because not much else seems to be being achieved, but please correct me if I'm mistaken on that... 👆🏼
I don’t even care what my team work on their home or anywhere as long when I called them and they answer with sophiscated information, input or ideas. Then periodically we have full team meeting and make sure our goal is fullfill.
Jim was probably planning a prank on Dwight.
If you can ask for a company laptop, you can use yours for personal stuff
Take the red pill and join us.
Yeah. All bosses can just go straight to hell
Just use 2nd device
Virtual machine go brrr
Well, what about strategy time, thinking time? Fairly often I am way more productive if I take the time to strategically think through a process instead of just writing something on my keyboard with no clear goal and would always encourage my employees to do the same. Such software doesn't make too much sense to me - set goals in your company, have a clear to-do list - if everything get's done by the end of the week, I don't care how much time you've spent on your screen.
I know people that left companies that have a surveillance culture.
Just one more thing to consider when searching for a job... Hopefully empolyees will tun against employers who use this kind of stuff.
All that should matter is if the work is getting done or not.
It means that you cant use your company laptop to do other stuff
This is corporate totalitarianism!
Wow
We keep getting closer to 1984 😂
Yes, the is a serious issue for our future generations.
If you put your headset on mute, can your employer still record you?
computers-also-break-down-and-freeze(i-remember-this-when-doing-a-university-online-degree)workers-will-need-to-be-honest-it-may-involve-ringing-or-texting-the-office-daily-(there-will-be-problems-phone-rings-neighbours-cat-meows)what-about-the-electricity-bill/computer-repair-bill-printers-etc-some-may-be-able-to-start-work-early-as-no-commute-and-finish-early(as-long-as-fulfill-the-weekly-hours)