MELEE'S HALL OF FAME (ft. Cody Schwab)
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- čas přidán 7. 09. 2024
- I GOT ON Cody Schwab's stream during his subathon to discuss, "if the Melee community had a hypothetical HALL OF FAME, who would be on it?"
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edited by seanathan
outro: • Okami - The Tribe Of H... by sine skeller
streamed on sept. 15, 2023
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#tophbbq #smashbros #melee
FULL VOD: www.twitch.tv/videos/1936780281
I miss this old school melee talk. This game has SO much history. Being a doc kid felt like I was late to the party and now even that’s ancient history
I think druggedfox was also the person to finally convince the general player base that pure reaction tech chasing is viable and worthwhile.
I love that you bring Typo up. He's been my best friend since college (2010) and rightly deserves the title as the guy who pioneered GOOD controllers. I happen to have been his play tester for many of his commissioned controllers, for Mango, N0ne, Swedish, Hugs, etc. So cool to see him destroy Home Run Contest now!
If theres tech named after you, you're in. Bombsoldier suicide dair, amsah tech, wobbling, Johnny stock, my b, wombo combo, armada shine, etc
Similarly, anyone who pushed a character farther than anyone before gets in. Kage amsa and jmook for sure earn it on that basis
my b is my favorite melee tech
that would also qualify the legend John himself for the list
@@Pwrplus5 Putting John on the list would actually be hilarious, omfg
@@andrewferguson6901 I get what what you're saying about pioneering a character - aMSa and Axe are the two prime examples of players who are Hall of Fame contenders just for their character contributions alone even ignoring their competitive performance - but I feel like there is a line that needs to be drawn, tbh. And for me, Kage is *RIGHT* on that line.
Like, EddieMexico and Abate aren't on the list despite their contributions with Luigi. Junebug is currently doing some wild shit with DK. But even if you pioneer a character and are the best at that specific character, there is only so far that gets you.
You could can be the best Bowser in the world; discover brand new tech, and completely reinvent the way that Bowser is played. But at the end of the day, you're still playing *Bowser*. If you are unable to demonstrate that your innovations are actually competitive, then it only effects that one character, not the wider scene.
Cody explained this when Kage was brought up: Kage did great with Ganon, but his tournament record was inconsistent as a result of his character choice. The difference between him and aMSa or Axe is that the two of them demonstrated that their characters - who were previously considered unviable at the competitive level - can not only compete, but actually win majors.
Before aMSa and Axe came around, both Pikachu and Yoshi were considered worse than Ganon - hell Yoshi was literally considered a BOTTOM tier with the likes of Kirby and Bower until around 2010. Nowadays, however, both characters are solidly considered to be within the upper end of mid-tier/lower end of high-tier. Throughout pretty much Melee's entire span, Ganon has been considered a mid-tier. Yet the former low-tiers of Pikachu and Yoshi have won majors, and no Ganon has ever won a major.
I genuinely think that if Kage had a single year where he finished top 20, that feat *combined* with his contributions to Ganon would be enough to cement him as a Hall of Famer. But his work with Ganon by itself isn't quite enough in my opinion.
Obligatory "actually armada learned the armada shine from KJH", but its not like armada needs help getting on the list
I think Ice definitely deserves a spot. I don't think you guys focused much on it, but he did quite well considering his location in a time before Slippi and even NTSC standardization. He, Armada, and Leffen were pretty much the faces of transatlantic Smash. Also, I think you guys missed Kzhu?
Great video, also! I really like the idea of a Melee HoF and would love to see it organized and set into motion. Just wanted to chip in.
Just think of the “ice wtf is dat movement” clip.
What a legend
im 20 minutes into the video and ive learned so much about the history of this amazing game. love this kind of content, really lets your knowledge of smash shine. hope to see more cool video ideas like this!
i love these videos but they make me sad i’m not the kid watching 2014 melee anymore
this game is so old there are entire eras that modern players dont know shit about thats wild to me
I know it was glossed over when I was there, I still think KillaOR, Dekar(From Australia, check his tournament results from 2000's til now), Kira(Think he did end up getting on at the end), Quetz from Australia(Specifically for Peach, doesn't get enough acknowledgement), Ekinz from EU. Forget who else I had on the day, but there was quite a few
Oh that was the other one Cao (Caotic) Did a bunch of stuff in USA, was in the doc about it. And as far as I know basically launched and carried the Australian scene on his back for a long time
One player I dont remember you mentioning was KillaOR and his MTV True Life episode, that definitely brought a lot of players in during the MLG era
Yeee yeeee. Love this idea. Very excited to watch this. Released right at lunch time eeyyyy
I’m not gonna lie Pengboys was a massive melee lifeline for me. I couldn’t always watch tournaments live so Pengboys was the source of tournament highlights for me.
Great compilation of streams in the slippi and pre-slippi era when it's just not feasible to watch it all. Lots of great things. Probably responsible for a good portion of N0ne's viewership successes
I’m conflicted.. Pengboys stole so much content and screwed content creators as a result. But then there’s what you said
Falco isnt a character for another 3 years without bombsoldier, that's fox brain at work.
I think professor pro at least deserved a mention, ut otherwise I don't see any big omission
32:15 IBBW is actually crazy funny
We got a player in Manchester, UK whose tag is IBBW
@@deeptochatterjee532 sad state of affairs when you have to write "UK" after manchester
Thank god Fly Amanita got a mention, he gets overlooked a lot but he was amazing
47:36 Wasn't that Royal Flush?
No magus? The real old heads know his contributions to the understanding of core engine mechanics is second to no one
Yeah idk how you can overlook the number one chess playe-- nvm
the proto kadano
fr
Javi is the reason I started learning fox tech in 2006. Dude was nuts, and so was his brother, twin.
This is exactly what I wanted to watch thank you so much
Dang, what about KillaOR in the MLG era? That MTV documentary is still the only mainstream piece of media on Smash
That Javi clip does not look like a 2006 Fox lol.
So I know there really isn't a place for coaches outside of DruggedFox because there isn't many coaches. But a really interesting person I think might deserve to be in the hall of fame as a coach would be Crunch. He literally is a huge reason Hbox went from arguable bottom 5 Gods to the top two end of 2016 to then the best player in the world for the next three years. Crunch's impact on Hbox as a coach was so huge and Hbox has talked about this several times, I think its worth the conversation. We aren't talking about someone who coached a lot of people which doesn't get him in as a community influence end but the one person he coached was the best player for several years. I think he should get in as a coach, or at least be considered.
bach is who got me into melee. I found his travel vids with husband and wife . A big reason to why I fell in love with melee
I feel like it's crazy to not put Bombsoldier in? Is he not the grandfather of modern Falco play?
So nice to see a list like this that values contributions to the scene as much as results. Just a feel good video all around :)
Only about halfway through, but y'all gotta add Dan Salvato (20XX TE), Anther (Anther's Ladder), NezModGod (controllers), and Fizzi (Project Slippi) for their contributions to Melee.
Loving that G-town got a mention before all of them!
If you're only halfway through, then maybe you should get all the way through before making a comment asking for people to be on the list, because Dan Salvato, Anther and Fizzi are on the list.
@@Murph_E Yes, and I am happy for it! :)
I find it funny that the guy who made Doki Doki Literature Club is part of Melee's Hall of Fame
Kinda sad, that Hax$ made it in just by play. Deserved obviously, but I would've loved to see how you weigh his contributions. Between him pushing Fox and tech skill in general forward, being a big part of breaking down and communicating some of the more strange mechanics of the game and obviously the B0XX (and to what extent you think it's a positive development), but also on the other hand evidence 2 and becoming sort of a figure the more toxic side of the community was rallying around.
30:24 In Toph's chat, someone asked, "where is pm dev team". That question shouldn't have made me as mad as it did
it is a valid point, how many
melee players started with pm during those years?
@@J-WASH everyone has their own start into getting melee, I started with ultimate. But that doesn’t mean they get a consideration into the MELEE hall of fame. It’s not significant enough. Doesn’t it sound weird to put the developers of a Brawl mod into the melee hall of fame? They also didn’t make pm for people to get into melee. I’m sorry but it’s not a valid point
@@Rufus_BDwow i thought you were mad that they didnt make it in, ive met so many people who got into melee through PM and its basically melee 2 so i dont see how u say its irrelevant
@@vanillafella4893 I was wrong with being mad at the response, I don’t think I made that clear after responding to another commenter. I still hold the opinion that pm isn’t a significant enough to be considered into a melee hall of fame for helping people get into melee
calling HMs hidden machines from Pokémon is hilarious, glad they realized they’re Honorable Mentions
Do a Melee Hall of Shame next
this
Too long
Every transphobe and sex offender
best to not bring any more attention to 2020 banned players
Ken deserves the inclusion for knowing all the stages that would remain legal almost a decade early.
Petition for Hanky Panky, the 5th greatest player of all time according to the stats (but really Prof Pro overlooked)
2008-2012 isn’t the dark age it’s like the attitude era of melee with crazy language and shit that went down which would get people cancelled nowadays
Edwin budding snuffed
i guess theres a lot of people behind hardware and software that could have been overlooked like maybe nez or def Altimor
I gotta shoutout AsumSaus as a next up content creator
I'm glad Cody had forgotten to come back to consider BME for MLG-Era. Who cares about that old fogie? 🙂
(btw I'm just kidding. Cody actually apologized to me later and we laughed about it)
Oh it's itsbme! From Twitch chat! I am cynthiayg
@@Nawakooo0 yo!
God this video is so awesome
about half way in, and feel like they going to forget SilentSpectre and Tang purely for wombo combo. Which is unfortunate.
Before seeing this list: GR Smash, VGBC/gimr, Kira are the three I hope get brought up
didn't bomb soldier invent pillar combos for Falco? or at least be the first one to introduce that in tournament? regardless that's pretty game changing imo
a guy who just became a top player deciding the hall of fame, makes sense
Lovage is my favorite smasher
Where is Scar’s Dad?
Where's "John" of "No John's" fame?
Simple way to be added should be if you have a fundamental tech or combo named after you,
Like Chillin’, Zhu, Pc (walk), Mang0, Ken (combo), Wobbles, etc.
yay. nay?
Good to see
Phish got snubbed for the Code of Conduct
I do believe that just for longevity Drephen should be there. He’s the oldest active player
Does Cody know you can sort columns alphabetically
Silent Spectre is my goat
TIL that Drephen is the Mitch Richmond of Melee.
thanks for vid but would been cool to follow along with better editing like highliting when someone is added to hof and when we switch eras for example
I can srr a case for character ambassadors like Ringler
Where's Gimpyfish without Gimpyfish I can't approve of this list imho
Angelic thumbnail
Cody mentioning Milktea but not Emilywaves was a bit of a stinger :c
Did they mention Prog at all?
He's under dark age
Where’s hax 50:33
I would definitely put TurnDownForWalt and Magi on for modern era, and probably also soonsay for either modern/upcoming
Well there’s a reason traditional sports don’t rank hall of famers for the recent years. Toph and Cody are trying to determine the impacts of players from like the slippi years, but those are too recent. It’s impossible to see someone’s legacy only 1 year removed
Comment for the algorithm...
I'm a Toph fanboy, what can I say!? ❤
Oh and an IBDW fanboy too!
Gideon who made smashboards. Sakurai
Also Jackzilla and Chroma been around forever but Fourside Fights is such awesome content that I feel like that plus their contributions to commentary and TOing should get them on the "next up" list.
borp??
Does heeew count for all of smash cause I feel like he would count
gee i wonder why ludwig is in the thumbnail
no ice is a joke
he's in so many top 20s having the chance to travel to 3-4 tournaments a year playing in a region without competition. his movement was absolutely insane for its time. he literally traveled once last year and beat aklo while being semi-active...@Gundice
plus his 2on2 successes with leffen @Gundice
Does anyone know how Chillins been since his stroke?
Watch his streams, it seems like he's been doing well
Can't believe y'all just dissed my bro jvx3
The melee documentary should go into the hall of fame. The amount of new players after that dropped
samox, the dude who made it, got in
it is
Where’s Ludvix 😢
Just came here to make sure PewpewU was on the list
scar?
Cody no bookmarks bar and no adblock? Very interesting...
so why is he not IBDW now?
He just decided to go by Cody now. His name was Cody Schwab on a lot of platforms for years anyway
I can't believe they forgot Hax$ 😂
they put him in 2010
he should've been in fr
Amazing video I’m only 16 mins in
Ok but where is Hax
he is in there
@@cheryldragunoff4129 Nah it was a joke, I guess you weren't watching the stream. People kept asking where Hax was even though he was there.
the continued deletion of shiz from smash history because of religious views will forever be corny
yea bro having retarded views on things (his right as an american) somehow invalidates having arguably the most influential set in melee history. makes sense@Gundice
A little assault and battery is fine, but don't you dare point out that men are men and women are women.
"religious views" loool foh
quite literally is@@chadwicktouchdown
smashers have the intellectual maturity greater than a 15 year old girl challenge (impossible)@@goodwoodstudios3440
i would absolutely not put Ludwig in the hall of fame. Being popular shouldn't be a hall of fame qualifier.
LACS alone is enough for him to be hall of fame
@@devinbowen2046fr these people forget the first lacs was before he even really got popular
the events he sets up gets him in
Good thing 'being popular' isn't the reason he's on the list then
dude he created an entire smash and chessboxing event garnering probably tens of thousands of completely new eyes on the scene... among his many other TO and other contributions... recall the first LACS was well before his blowup (~2019) ( think SFAT won that over axe for $1000 or something like that.