You won't believe what Pete Rose had to say about Sandy Koufax and Don Sutton | THE HERD
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- Pete Rose had some compelling things to say about Sandy Koufax, Don Sutton and more.
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You won't believe what Pete Rose had to say about Sandy Koufax and Don Sutton | THE HERD
• You won't believe what...
The Herd with Colin Cowherd:
/ colincowherd - Sport
Pete Rose is fun to listen to.
ABoxOfBroken8Tracks happy and a good sense of humor. seems like a pretty nive guy
Could listen to him all day
Yes, I heard a recent comment by him when he was asked who would win between the 1980 Phillies snd the 2009 Phillies? He said ez, the 2009 Phils! How come? Because most of us are close to 80yrs old now ! Lmao!
The hit king! Could listen to him all day!
Especially when he talks gambling 🎲🎰🔫
Willy Stargell said that hitting against Koufax was like trying to drink coffee with a fork.
@Jerry Cowley I thought it was "eat soup with a fork"
He also described facing Sandy as a “comfortable 0-4” 😂🤣
Willie Mays described Sandy Koufax's curve ball as "a folding chair collapsing"!
@Jerry Cowley I lived in Philly and followed the Phillies closely in that era. the quote was "like eating soup with a fork." He was describing Carlton's slider.
@Jerry Cowley He said it about Seaver.
I could listen to Pete Rose talk baseball all day and night.
Jimmy King same
go to vegas there is a memorabilia store in the connecting areas of mandalay and luxor he is always there
I agree!
True babeball man to the core. Write tons of books mr hustle.
I hate it so bad that he's not coaching in some capacity. He should be a hitting coach. IDK about a head coach again,but definitely a hitting coach.
When I met Pete at a car dealership in NJ in 2013,I brought up a 1963 game to him and he told me details about the game that I had forgotten.
How does he do that and also he's old??
1963 was his rookie year, same year that I was born.
I love how Pete knows these numbers like he knows his sons birthday.
probably better, surprised if he knew his kids birthdays
betting also involves numbers...
His love for the game is unparalleled. Not talking about black Mark stuff just that it's obvious how much he loves the on-field sport of baseball
Wally your claim was that he knew the consequences and accepted the ban. That's flat out wrong. He was told the consequences, he agreed to them, and then they were changed. The HOF changed their rules the year before he was eligible for the simple reason of keeping him out. And that's where the "moral police" question comes up. The only valid argument for changing your rules before he's eligible is from a morality standpoint but that's completely nixed when you have an admitted gambler who better...
Reply
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Jonathan McCormick:
Here is my reply. No, my claim is not "flat out wrong." Rose was a rookie in 1963. I saw him play then and until the end of his career. In EVERY clubhouse that Rose entered since 1963 was written the words "no betting on baseball games." He could read those words every day during the baseball season. Since the 1920s "Black Sox Scandal" MLB has instituted a "no betting on baseball policy" and the punishment for such activity is "lifetime ban" from MLB. THOSE are the consequences and Rose knew .... KNEW .... of those consequences. Rose accepted and agreed to his punishment which included a "lifetime ban."
If you are talking "moral police" ... then the arrogance of Pete Rose to think he could flaunt those rules is "on" him. Don't make him out to be a victim and the HOF the "bad guy."
The HOF Rules Committee can determine who it wants in the Hall of Fame as it is a separate entity from MLB. If the HOF doesn't want a person who has been placed on the "Ineligible List" (which is a consequence of betting on baseball games), then the HOF can make such a decision.
This isn't a matter of the "moral police." This is a matter of the HOF making a decision regarding what it is able to do as a result of BEING the Hall of Fame. The "valid argument" is not "nixed" as morality DOES have it's place in our society, does it not?
Or does someone's arrogance, selfish-ness, and inability to follow a moral code supercede that "morality" simply because that person happens to have more hits than anyone else in MLB and you happen to like that person?
wally post it's absolutely a matter of moral police. As you said in your last sentence. But no the HOF does not have the right to play moral police with John McGraw enshrined. Look him up.
I could listen to Pete all day! He’s the perfect example of having confidence but also being humble and giving credit when it’s due. He doesn’t hesitate to admit when a guy had his number. Love him!!!
He lie to team mates the baseball commisnor everyone a know lier
@@WilliamFlickinger-ex2sd Your whining is irrelevant to this video.
The respect players give Koufax says it all.
There is no greater validation of this man's greatness.
PETE ROSE should have his own talk show
No he needs to be in the H.O.F
@@robertnunez5036 It's sad but no, gambling compromises the integrity of competition.
@@AverageLeagueHack agree,but baseball i very dishonest,still think he should be pardoned,to forgive is divine,and its divine to forgive.jst saying president pardon people criminals all the time,this is only baseball,since when a game worth more the a human life,they dont evn hve the 3 strike law anymore,no pun intended.
I agree!!! He holds your attention, and there’s no wavering in his tone
@@robertnunez5036 Exactly. He has paid his dues and then some. What kind of world would this be if we never allowed people to live down the mistakes they've made?
I don't care what Pete did or didn't do. I can listen to him talk baseball all day long.
Fancy seeing you here, bro. Didn't know you were a baseball fan.
@@thsu8 70s baseball fan. Once I started playing basketball I dropped everything else. Love old school football too.
It SURE was exciting and TOTALLY unexpected when he played for Montreal!!!!!!!
needs to be in cooper town
@@thsu8 are you still scared of clowns
mickey mantle struck out on 3 straight pitches to koufax. he turned to the umpire and said "How the fuck I am supposed to hit that shit?"
BAHAHA seriously?
Mantle described Koufax's curveball as breaking like it fell off a table.
Is there a book or something he said in?
That's such a great baseball quote! Good work, Robert.
robertk2007 the great Willie Stargell said "trying to hit Koufax is like trying to drink coffee with a fork"
Yogi Berra, who played in the most World Series games with 75, was quoted after Koufax and the Dodgers beat the Yankees in Game #1 of the 1963 World Series.
Berra said "I can see how he (Koufax) won 25 games. What I can't understand is how he lost 5."
Willie Stargell said hitting off Koufax was like trying to drink coffee with a fork.
Koufax was undoubtedly one of the greatest pitchers ever. I was glad to see him pitch, there will never be another like him, Gibson and seaver and Ford are up there as well butm behind koufax
The response, from one of Sandy's teammates (can't remember which) was, "He didn't. We lost them for him".
@@username-zj9id that was Maury Wills
@@mikeforte7585 thanks!
Met him in Vegas...as soon as I told him I was from Detroit, he started talking about Sparky Anderson and started rattling off stats about my own team that I might have known once. Talked about Trammell and how it was criminal he and Whitaker are not in the Hall. It was remarkable
I could listen to Pete talk baseball all day long.
Well, yeah; he can give betting tips.
@@asterisk911 Probably because he is the all time hit leader...so what if he gambled
I love Pete's stories
Sandy's curveball really did break that fast. He's not exaggerating.
Yes, 85 mile an hour curveball made it so dominating. I don't think anyone outside of Blyleven can compare with his curveball. Both usually finish one and two in every survey for curveballs....
B.J. Funk saw him pitch and there really aren't words to describe him, also saw Mantle, McClain, all the greats from 60"s and Koufax was #2 (after Mantle)
B.J. Funk DOC GOODEN AND BARRY ZITO HAD THE BEST CURVEBALLS I'VE EVER SEEN IN MY LIFETIME...BUT I'M ONLY 36
Milo Tucker Bingo! 80's kid here, and Gooden's hook was no mere Uncle Charlie. It got the name "Lord Charles" for good reason.
Milo Tucker correct Milo..im 43 Goodens curveball was filthy and im a Phiiles fan lol. wasted talent..loved Doc
In his first 7 years( 1955-1961) Koufax was 36-40 with an e.r.a. of 4.40. He had that fast ball but hitters would sit on it
because Sandy couldn't find home plate with his curve. He even thought of quitting but I forget who got him to change
his pitching motion. His last 5 years (1962-1966) was the greatest stretch of pitching excellence ever. He won 129
games-losing 47. Had an e.r.a. of 2.23. Won 3 Cy Young Awards, pitched 4 no hitters( 1 a perfect game ) Won
The Pitching Triple Crown-wins, earned run average and strikeouts- 3 times. Struck out over 300 batters in a season
3 times. When he did learn to get his curve ball over the plate that devastating fast ball became virtually unhittable.
Koufax only won 165 games which only averages out to 12 per year. and struck out less than 3000 batters but he
is in the Hall of Fame for that 5 year stretch between 1962-1966. Pete Rose shouldn't feel bad. Koufax made a lot
of hitters look silly.
Norm Sherry
And Norm Sherry didn't get him to change his pitching motion..just got him to not throw as hard as he could on every pitch
Koufax was at a bar one night during spring training when his catcher Norm Sherry had him go through his windup in the bar. Norm told him he couldn't see what he was throwing at based on his windup and follow through. Sherry told him to try and not throw so hard. Next day Koufax threw a 2 hit complete game shutout in spring training. The rest is history.
This is true. When a hitter understands a pitcher has a nasty off-speed pitch in their arsenal, a fastball becomes deadly. Pedro Martinez is a modern era pitcher with a three-year run of excellence similar to the great Koufax, imo (during the height of "The Steroid Era", no less).
@@kenbrickman4412 "Take your foot off the gas pedal."
Met Rose once. Great honor. Love his knowledge and memory of baseball, especially his own great career. He should have been in the Hall Of Fame years ago.
He was a cheater!!!!!!!!
Pete knew the rules. They're in every major league clubhouse. He placed bets anyway. Poor Peter Edward, his nose forever pressed against the glass.
He did his time. His numbers speak for themselves.
@@kennetheginton1182 cheater?... because he bet on the game. Give me a break - what did he ever, ever do on the field that would constitute cheating? He would run through a brick wall for his team. He would find a way to get a hit or get on base - hands down drive in the tying or winning run with 2 outs in the 9th. Sparky was desperate to light a fire under the Reds and get Foster in the line up in '75... so he goes to Rose and asks him to play 3rd base.. the hot corner - "sure coach"... 2nd, left, 1st, 3rd... he could play anything, would do anything for the Reds - thus one of the best teams ever in baseball... 1975, 76!
@@jimii2294 Listen to what you're saying! Yes, he bet on the game and that destroys its integrity. It is written in every clubhouse in major and minor league baseball, if you bet you are gone forever! Baseball players gambling on baseball is 'the' mortal sin!!!!
Love Koufax. Between 1961 and 1966 he was AMAZING!!!
Not just amazing but purely dominating.
Lights out. Epic.
That was Don Larson of the Yankees in 1956. That was a perfect game. Koufax had 4 no hitters.... and a perfect game in 1965.
He held out for $125,000 his final season!
@@coreyzimmerman9782 Yes he and Drysdale held out. Good for them. Wilt Chamberlain made $100k. Bill Russell asked for $101k just to be one up and compete with Wilt.
I saw him in Dodger Stadium in 1964 two days after getting out of the Marine Corps, he was the best baseball player I’d ever seen!!!!!
Pete's baseball stories are top notch. I had no idea Koufax had a season with 382 ks...that is incredible.
For the last four years of his career, Koufax may have been the best pitcher EVER in MLB.
What an absolute dork Cowherd is as an interviewer. He refuses to allow the guy to give great insight by interrupting the guy time and time again. Here, Pete starts to give insight and Cowherd interrupts and asks a different question. Damnit, let Pete ramble on about Koufax or whoever and let us enjoy the stories he may have to give.
huskyjerk I agree
How can he be paid to do this? If I sucked at my job this bad I'd be fired.
just another prettyboy that only knows what he reads about sports
There are breaks in the show so he has a limited time to ask these questions.
Joseph Ortiz, then you ask less questions and invite him to come on again. Even if he says, “no” to coming on again, at least you got something from him that no one else has heard.
I was at Dodger stadium in 65 when Koufax broke the season strikeout record. He did it against...Pete Rose.
Vry good information.
Wow
That must have been exciting; I had been, at Shea stadium, in '70, when Tom Seaver struck out the last ten batters in a row to end the game against San Diego; moments like that in baseball, is what its all about
Hey Colin, is it necessary to sit 6 feet above the guest you're interviewing?
And he calls him a liar.
Not to mention Cowherd being 10 feet above him, like GOD.......ridiculous.
HE'S SITTING UP THERE LIKE A JUDGE,LIKE THAT EPISODE OF THE TWILIGHT ZONE "THE OBSOLETE MAN".."YOU ARE OBSOLETE!"
Your prescription is ready Mr Rose
Probably more like 12 feet. 1:12 - WTF is up with that interview set-up? He sits high up on a podium like God, talking down at least four feet to his guest, who is also sitting 12 feet away. Incredible!
Here's a guy that can tell you what he batted against who 50 years later and we're going to miss it because it was easier to catch Pete than the guys who took the bets. Thanks I could watch Pete for hours.
Cowherd is so annoying. He does not even know how to ask questions. Just babble.
Pete says he got lot of hits off Warren Spahn, and the dumb interviewer questions whether Pete played against Spahn. Totally ridiculous.
Sandy Koufax at the top of his game was the best pitcher I ever saw. Great fastball, great curve, and just enough effective wildness that you didn't dig in.
yes. Kind of like Roger Clemens in a way. One never quite knew where the ball was going
Koufax pitched on two days rest in the final World Series game with the Minneapolis Twins. He could not get his curve ball over the plate, threw 90% fastballs and won the game on guts and a less than best fastball.
@@gkprivate433 Without the roids
Two absolute facts. 1: Pete Rose colors his hair himself. 2: Pete Rose will never get into the Baseball Hall of Fame.
Koufax sucked until MLB expanded the strike zone after the 1961 season. Then all-of-a-sudden Koufax could throw strikes! After Koufax retired, MLB shrunk the strike zone back down!
I started following MLB in 1969, when guys like Mays, Mantle, Clemente were past their primes. I've always said if I had the first pick in a MLB draft, and you could use only guys from 1969 on, I'd pick Pete Rose. He could play any position; he was a great hitter; and he would run through a brick wall to win games. The most passionate player I've ever watched.
I think a lot of people will disagree that Roberto Clemente was passed his prime in 1969. In 1971, he was world series MVP. A year after that, he was tragically killed. I personally think he had a lot of good years ahead of him. But that's just my opinion.
@@gregengel1616 You're right, Greg. My mistake.
Yes and no, he was a singles hitter, if a good one. The modern era Ty Cobb and the white Rod Carew. Robert at 68.
@@bobmalack481But because Pete could play any position well, he was much more valuable.
Also, I would contend that Pete's attitude ... his intense desire and hustle ... had a greater impact on his teammates.
Athletes love playing with winners. They thrive around passionate people. Pete made his teammates better.
Yeah I love Pete he was fantastic
But a guy very comparable to him, Paul Molitor was a better player!
Stole a lot more bases had more power
And was a better hitter.
Molitor was vastly underrated! Joe DiMaggio said nobody reminded him more of himself as a hitter than Molitor!
What a great ball player who absolutely loved the game. Saw all of his career and NOBODY played all out like he did.
The thing about Rose is that the way he is talking in this interview is the way he would talk about baseball to anyone. I got to know him for a few months at Marion. He didn’t think he was better than anyone there at least that’s how I took him. The few times he talked about baseball and told stories you could see in his eyes the love he had for it. When they banned him I’m sure it took away part of his soul. I’m glad he has moved on with his life and shows the determination he has within himself that made him the great player he was. I’m going to Vegas in May and I hope I get the opportunity to see him again and chat for a few.
I'm an old man and Sandy Koufax was the best pitcher in his prime that I ever saw. Mid-90's fastball, a curve like Rose described, and just enough wildness that no hitter ever dug in.
I saw Nolan Ryan pitch live in a day game in and against Seattle in 1991, he blew Griffey Jr away twice, and his other at-bat was a weak pop up at the plate, it was like watching, or it had the FEELING of what a no-hitter game would be like, oh, he was 43, and when he SO cooly walked around and about the mound area, it was like he was John Wayne kind of, what a swagger!!!!!!!
Do you think Koufax was wild? or was hejust keeping batterson their toes?
The stats answer that. For the first half of his career, yes. But then something changed. His walks dropped from 96 in 1961 to 57 in 1962. And he didn't throw high and inside the way Gibson and Drysdale did.
My dad said the same about Koufax. He saw him and Drysdale in person several times.
@@-sensibleChris Koufax/ Drysdale was the number one in the game; i'd say Schilling/ Randy Johnson a close second
Pete is such a sharp guy and absolutely hilarious I could listen to him talk baseball anytime.
The Herd said Pete Rose didn't face Warren Spahn. Spahn retired in 1965 Rose Debut was in !963. You gotta tighten up Herd he did play with Warren Spahn Herd Sorry to tell ya.
Yah...but sadly, Spahn was in his early FORTIES when Pete hit against him....Spahn in his twenties is a whole other thing...
Warren Spahn was 23-7 as a 42 year old in 1963....but he was overshadowed by Sandy Koufax...who was lights out at 25-5 with a no hitter over the giants...
@@mikeforte7585 also won his last cy young in 61' and he was almost 41y.o
Warren Spahn won 363 games, he had a late start because of military service. He was good from age 26 til his 40s. Good young and old.
I could listen to Pete's stories all day.
I've been a baseball fan since 1955..Koufax is the greatest pitcher I've ever seen. You can argue about second best.
This Giants fan agrees
Koufax stands head and shoulders above #2, Tom Seaver.
You gotta love Pete being Pete. I think he should go to the hall of fame. He never bet against his team and nobody played the game with more passion. He served his time, before he leaves us make it happen.
Yes. They should allow betting on games by players, managers and coaches.
I could listen to Pete Rose all day.
Cowpie, spahn retired in 1965, rose started in 1963
As a Twins' fan during the 60s and 70s, the 1965 World Series is a special memory. Game 7; most fans had an ominous feeling when Alston revealed Koufax as the starting pitcher. Not much of a curve that day, but he really didn't need it. That fastball was nearly unhittable. Killebrew got a single in the ninth inning, and with the score 2-0, a buzz went through the Met Stadium crowd as we had some power coming up...poor guys didn't stand a chance against Koufax.
heres a great trivia q: who hit the most homeruns in the 1960s? (Hint: you just named him)
@@dancooper5714 "who hit the most homeruns in the 1960s? (Hint: you just named him)"
Koufax?...No, that doesn't make sense. Must be Walt Alston. 😉
I had the opportunity to speak with Harmon Killebrew (a great thrill). He said that game 7 was the best pitched game he had ever seen.
@@dancooper5714 Harmon Killebrew...394?
IDGAF what the baseball writers and 'experts' say or think. This man belongs in the HOF
Relax, they'll let him in - after he dies, so he can't see or enjoy it. That's his punishment, and I think he knows it, too.
Writers shouldn’t get to vote on HoF ballots.
I love his memory. Met him a few years ago and after detailing what state I was from (rather small middle America) he proceeded to quiz me on every player born in my state.
Rose is amazing. Little kid growing up in Cincinnati and actually playing for them. He is all baseball and still like him. Just wished he would have signed that agreement
Pete Rose for the hall!!
It was terrible he didn’t admit to his gambling problems when it could have helped him.
Wonderful, joyous, happy moments with the Sweet Rose!
just think how great Koufax would have been had he not developed arthritis in that elbow at age 30 which forced his early retirement....he'd have ALL the records period
+Will Drucker He also pitched off the higher mound.
He also usually was given only a run or two to work with.
He also pitched every four games with some going the full game.
54 complete games I think in 2 years.
Higher mound made it easier to do. Must be noted.
I watched Sandy Koufax pitch as a kid. He was absolutely amazing. All of those pitchers he mentioned were. Interesting to ponder but they all had high kicks in their windups. Including Don Drysdale.
Let Pete talk! Less of you and more of the guests!
been down the rabbit hole of just listening to pete rose talk about baseball. incredible.
I saw Pete play several times in the 70's, including his 44th consecutive hit game down in Atlanta. I saw him steal three bases in one inning while playing for the Phillies (ironically, that game was in Cincinnati). Nobody ever hustled like Pete - every inning of ever game.
When the subject is purely baseball, Pete Rose is the absolute best at talking about it. He can keep it simple for dopes like me, and get as intricate as anybody
He’s proud of his numbers and he should be. He was great and he’s not gonna let you forget that.
for this alone, Pete Rose so much deserves to be in the Baseball Hall of Fame. who the heck is that attached to baseball even while they are playing, let alone decades after they were forced to retire?
Selling autographs anywhere they'll let him set up a table. Believe me, it's all he's got.
You never hear Pete say, "Let me think for a second..."
Colin - insecure much? How high could your desk get?
Haha
🤣
Love Pete’s interviews, he gives it to you full blast.
This guy needs to be in the Hall of Fame already
With all the talk about Clemens and Pedro being better than Koufax let us remember Koufax three two shutouts in 4 days in the 1965 series. He also clinched the pennant on two days rest for the Dodgers in 65 and 66 beating Milwaukee and Philly. Can anyone remember either Clemens or Pedro doing that? Not a chance.
Koufax had better stuff than Clemens and Pedro dreamed of. Like Rose said, his curveballs broke quickly downward and was almost impossible to hit.
Plus the rocket was on the juice.
Pedro pitched in an era with juiced baseballs, juiced batters, and he faced a lineup with a designated hitter. Martinez has supreme command of THREE pitches, compared to Koufax and Clemens having two pitches that they commanded. I watched the careers of all three of these great pitchers. Pedro is #1, Koufax and Clemens fall in behind him.
Sandy Koufax was my favorite player of all - time . Great pitcher and a real gentleman to boot . From 61 through 66 seasons I doubt there's ever been a more dominant span by a pitcher , In 1962 and 1964 he had his seasons shortened because of arthritic flareups . In 1962 at all-star break he was 14-4 with over 200 strikeouts and 1964 he was 19-6 in August and missed the rest of both seasons . In 1963 he was 25-5 1965 26-8 and 1966 27-9 . In that span there was another pitcher nearly as good with similar stats . Juan Marichal IMO is the best Right Handed Pitcher of my lifetime . It's a shame he was always in Koufax's shadow . Both of those guys were incredible pitchers .
Without offering an opinion on whether these pitchers were better at their peaks I present to you 3 who have a solid claim to being such. They were all amazing. This might be your starting pitcher Mount Rushmore. If not, who are you taking out?
Pedro Martinez (1997-2003)
3 Cy Young Awards (2nd twice)
Record 118-36 (17-5*)
ERA 2.20
ERA+ 213
CG 34
Innings 1408.0 (201.0*)
Walks 315 (45*)
Strikeouts 1761 (252*)
FIP 2.26
WHIP 0.940
H/9 6.4
HR/9 0.6
BB/9 2.0
K/9 11.3
SO/W 5.59
WAR 57.3 (8.2)
Randy Johnson (1997-2002)
4 Cy Young Awards (2nd in 1997)
Record 120-42 (20-7*)
ERA 2.58
ERA+ 177
CG 46
Innings 1487.1 (248*)
Walks 451 (75*)
Strikeouts 2037 (340*)
FIP 2.63
WHIP 1.068
H/9 6.9
HR/9 0.9
BB/9 2.7
K/9 12.3
SO/W 4.5
WAR 51.8 (8.6)
Greg Maddux (1992-1998)
4 Cy Young Awards (2nd in 1997)
Record 127-53 (18-7.5*)
ERA 2.15
ERA+ 190
CG 56
Innings 1675.1 (252*)
Walks 269 (39*)
Strikeouts 1286 (184*)
FIP 2.59
WHIP 0.968
H/9 7.3
HR/9 0.4
BB/9 1.4
K/9 6.9
SO/W 4.78
WAR 54.7 (7.8*)
Sandy Koufax (1961-1966)
3 Cy Young Awards
Record 129-47 (21.5-8*)
ERA 2.19
ERA+ 156
CG 115
Innings 1632.2 (272*)
Walks 412 (69*)
Strikeouts 1713 (286*)
FIP 2.16
WHIP 0.970
H/9 6.5
HR/9 0.6
BB/9 2.3
K/9 9.4
SO/W 4.16
WAR 46.4 (7.7*)
*Season average
Koufax had his best seasons after MLB expanded the strike zone in the 1962 season. It was so ridiculous that MLB had to shrink it back down after the 1968 season!
Not arthritis but a suspected stretched UCL that could have been fixed if Tommy John surgery existed at the time.
love pete talk baseball. wish i could hang out with him all day
Pete made himself laugh when he repeated “I’m not gonna lie to ya!”
this guy should be in the hall of fame simply for his post career analysis of baseball.
An absolutely moronic comment
It was nice to see Pete again laughing and having fun. I miss Pete’s humor and hustle plays. He had star power, I still wear Aqua Velva after shave. Hope he’s still getting a cut.
I still wear Vitalis.......
I can understand Pete not being in MLB. But, he deserves to be in the Hall of Fame.
Rose bet on baseball games. He violated the "no betting on baseball" rule which carries with it Lifetime suspension from MLB. To be on the Eligible List for the HOF, one needs to be on the Eligible List. Rose knew the consequences of betting on baseball and STILL bet on games ... lied about it ... and came clean when attempting to sell a book. He bet on baseball games while an employee of MLB. Recent information points to Rose betting as a player as well.
Would you go to a baseball game knowing the game was fixed? Where does the betting stop ... with the umpires betting ... with managers betting ... players betting ... front office personnel betting? People do not seem to understand the ramifications of Rose betting on baseball games.
MLB has a lot of money at stake. For games to questioned in terms of being "on the level" would cause MLB to make certain personnel do not bet on games.
Rose in the MLB Hall of Fame? No.
+wally post No Bonds, Clemens, McGwire, Sosa, Palmiero, Rodriguez, or Canseco either.
Those names you mentioned have different issues than Rose. Rose' betting on baseball games violated a specific rule that was "in place" at the time of his betting. Comparing betting on baseball to PED use is comparing apples to oranges. They are two separate and exclusive issues.
For the names you listed, in using PEDs, as unseemly as using PEDs might be to the baseball fan, didn't violate any known rule of baseball at the time of their "alleged" use. For example: McGwire confessed to taking androstenedione. At the time, however, use of that substance was not prohibited by Major League Baseball and, in addition, it was not federally classified as an anabolic steroid in the United States until 2004.
Therefore, his "future" as a HOFamer is to be decided by sportswriters and the HOF itself.
The rule regarding being on the eligible list came after Rose was handed the lifetime suspension. That's like driving 70 miles an hour on an interstate and the speed limit sign is changed to 65 after you pass it. MLB also said Pete would be able to apply for reinstatement after 1 year and that they would issue no finding that he bet on baseball. Of course the commissioner promptly went to a press conference and said that Pete bet on baseball. MLB hasn't been exactly above board in this matter.
Rule 21 d) BETTING ON BALL GAMES. Any player, umpire, or club official or
employee, who shall bet any sum whatsoever upon any baseball game in
connection with which the bettor has no duty to perform shall be declared
ineligible for one year.
Any player, umpire, or club or league official or employee, who shall
bet any sum whatsoever upon any baseball game in connection with which
the bettor has a duty to perform shall be declared permanently ineligible.
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Rose bet on baseball games. He was placed on the MLB "Ineligble List." If the HOF chooses to keep from induction any player on the "Ineligible List" that is their prerogative. Rose could apply for reinstatement after one year. That does not mean his application would have been approved even at the time he made the "deal" in AGREEING to the lifetime ban.
Don't make this issue into one where Rose is the victim. He bet on baseball games. He lied about it. Then, to sell a book, he admitted it. Further evidence indicates that Rose bet as a player. Because he has more hits than any MLB player does not absolve him from the violation he knowingly committed. If Giamatti openly stated that Rose could apply for reinstatement after one year and that MLB would "issue no finding that he bet on baseball" ... which is what Rose agreed to in his "deal" ... then, why did he agree to the deal in the first place ... KNOWING that he DID bet on baseball games? This is all on Rose ... not MLB ... not Giamatti ... not the HOF.
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"The banishment for life of Pete Rose from baseball is the sad end of a sorry episode. One of the game's greatest players has engaged in a variety of acts which have stained the game, and he must now live with the consequences of those acts. By choosing not to come to a hearing before me, and by choosing not to proffer any testimony or evidence contrary to the evidence and information contained in the report of the Special Counsel to the Commissioner, Mr. Rose has accepted baseball's ultimate sanction, lifetime ineligibility."
Statement by then Commissioner
of Baseball, A. Bartlett Giamatti,
August 24, 1989
Man, I looked up all these stats. Pete Rose knows them stat!! Wow!
What an incredibly intelligent nuanced interview. This guy needs to be interviewed a lot more. This is amazing.
Petes career gets more and more impressive when you think of the pitchers he had to face, Marichal, Ryan, Koufax, Spahn, Sutton, Gibson, Carlton, Seaver, Niekro, Perry, Blyleven, Drysdale, Eckersley, Sutter, Jenkins
Rose retired in 86. And Eck came to the NL in 84-87. The Cubs and Reds were in different divisions back then. So it would be interesting to see exactly how many times they faced each other.
Pete remembers his hits and averages off pitchers a hundred years ago ,that alone should get him in the hall !
You know, Pete has done some bad things. But Pete Rose is a tough guy, a smart guy, and has an outstanding sense of humor. He could also be kind to people.
Pete is Reason #1 why a team that was formed in 1883 and still is the losingest team in baseball, a team that lost 23 games in a row in 1961 and orchestrated the greatest collapse in 1964, blowing a seven game lead with only ten games to go, won its first World Series in 1980. The Philadelphia Phillies who Pete played for for five years (1979 - 1983). Pete and Nick Foles are gods in Philly sports history.
Yeah Mike Schmidt or Carlton had nothing to do with that championship!!
Outta the university of Arizona..........Nick Foles!
I sat next to Pete on a flight from Philly to Ft. Lauderdale. Talked baseball, his fight with Bud Harrelson, etc. It was great. He signs his autograph - "Hit King, 4256". No ego there eh?
You know what they say - if it's true, it ain't bragging.
I miss the 60's, 70s Era of baseball...Pitchers pitched complete games, they still had drag bunts, batters didn't show up pitchers when they hit home runs, no warnings after hitting batters. The good old days!!!
Crazy...I saw Pete Rose at Candlestick. Pete was probably the most dominant player I ever saw. He could dominate a game getting a walk and a hit. He really gave the Reds a winning attitude. Sad Rose isn’t in the HOF. He was a REALLY GREAT bball player. I remember he got a walk and him hustling down the first place line and the entire stadium gasped...knowing the game was over.
Great line by Pete Rose when he said that Ray Charles could have gotten a hit off of Don Sutton!😂😂
Just for those of you who don't know, pitcher Don Sutton was a 324 game winner, with 58 shutouts, and is 7th on the all time strike out list, with 3574 strikeouts! When Pete Rose talks about how he dominated Don Sutton, that tells you what a pure hitting machine Charlie Hustle actually was!
bubhub64 that's the truth. Sutton had a fantastic career. He was one of the most dominant right-handers of his era. What made DS so good was that he had that screwball plus his changeup. He wasn't a flame-thrower so he never blew you away with a 100mph heater. He just beat you.
Fosse played for like 10 more seasons after that hit.
Well what was Fosse doing blocking the plate if it was an exhibition game? Can't have it both ways. In those days, if you blocked the plate (without the ball by the way), you got hit - as it should be.
Bob welch wasn't bad either.. So was warren spahn.. The best lefty pitcher in mlb history.. Inarguably.
And Pete was a switch hitter.
Love Pete or hate him, he can tell a baseball story! So fun to listen to. Koufax was off the charts amazing. He's inspiring also. Didn't become great till a couple years of being in MLB. And, he wasn't a big guy; not that one has to be big to play baseball extremely well. And, he was a shooting star. Only had, and correct me if I'm wrong, 5 great seasons. It was Casey Stengal (SP?) that said: "Forget all those other guys, (talking about the other great pitcher's of all time), the Jewish kid from Brooklyn beats 'um all." That said, I think Satchel Paige was the best. But, Sandy, in his prime, was arguable just as good. He threw every pitch with not regard for his arm. If it fell off, hey, that's life. LOVE YOU SANDY AND SATCHEL
Pete Rose got shit on again, one of the greats, I would like to know how long he must pay, they are killers out of prison in less time.
"I would like to know how long he must pay,..."
---
Usually, a lifetime ban means exactly that ... a lifetime.
they are killers
The commissioners of MLB will never put him in- Never! He gambled on the games and that is strictly forbidden. The commissioners front office has documented proof that Rose did that. MLB will not have anyone in the HOF that tarnishes the achievements of those who achieved through hard work and honesty.
HOFer if there ever was one.
@mksrookies I thought they were all filtered out
1976 was my 1st yr in BB, and it was the yr Bad News Bears came out and the Big Red Machine was in full force and that was my team, and I loved Rose! And Pete Rose had as much love for the game as anyone, and helped teams win because of it!
Give Pete Rose his dues. He deserved regardles.
They did when they banned him from baseball for gambling on the games he played, a very big rules violation.
hahahahahahaha that's fucked up about Sutton. But damn, I wish I could've seen Koufax pitch.
+Matt X You can watch him in the 1965 World Series. It's the entire game but he was on 2 days rest so who knows if he had better stuff on regular rest
Matt X
Yup Koufax was the baddest pitcher , no question!!! I was lucky to have seen him several times including my very first game in Dodger stadium in 65'. Remember it well against Pittsburgh. The greatest I've ever since.
Go to you tube type hid Name there are some games he pitched at 80 years old I have see all most all the record holders..sandy was without a doubt the greatest I ever saw and there will never be another like him
Like secretariat
Like Jordan, like Gayle sayers, like ....I still watch those you tubes videos
I was lucky to see him pitch and lucky to pat secretariat's muzzle my greatest sports thrills.
Koufax curve ball was basically untouchable, let alone unhittable! It was like watching a magician. The greatest pitcher of all time!
I bleed Orange and Black. Sandy Koufax is my favorite pitcher of all time.
My dad told us, “listen to the catcher’s glove pop,” when Koufax pitched. You’d actually go to the Dodgers game with Koufax pitching with that being the highlight. Dodgers usually won, few hits in his game. It was all about the pure art of pitching.
Heard Pete Rose say the ball would Just Drop.......with Koufax,,,,Your Knees would buckle at the Plate,,,,,,,,....LOL..We loved Pete Rose in Philly........he, among others , gave us the 1980 World Series,,,,,,,,,Love You. Pete.........
growing up on Long Island back in the sixties i loved my Dodgers and Sandy.. all the others drysdale wills davis davis gilliam lefebrve parker johnson fairly osteen perranonski so many others..listen to the radio when mets went out to the coast and whenever channel 9 wor put them on against the mets..sure do love the memories..tks for great vid..ill never forget his performace against yanks in 63//
I love listening to Pete talk baseball. And there is no such thing as a rising fastball. And from the late 60s thru the 70s until the early 80s was a great time to be a fan of great starting pitching. An era that will not be duplicated, because the sport has changed and will probably never go back to the dominant starting pitcher who ate up innings and completed games. That grand era saw such greats as Koufax, Drysdale, Seaver, Gibson, Marichale, Carlton, Ryan, Spahn, and so many more. Great time for the sport. Now we are stuck with five inning guys, who look to bring themselves out of games, guys being brought out of shutouts, and no hitters. Ridiculous.
It just doesn’t sink as much.
@@sludge8506 That is right,it is thrown so hard that it basically stays on the same line or plain if you will, when most every pitch sinks by the time it reaches the hitter.
Tell that to a former Umpire like me. Lol All sorts of pitches do funny stuff. Koufax had a very low release so his fastball rose. Not all the time though
Always said, give me Koufax, Gibson, & Marichal and they will shut down any of the so called big offenses of today.
+Mryrhodesian dont forget Seaver and Carlton also. but strike zone different from 1960s, as are stadium dimensions. not to mention roids
+loyaldude10 Still, they were going nine not five or six innings and had about 8-10 more starts a year.
Kershaw>Koufax.
You can't really decide yet, but if he keeps it up until he's 30 (age Koufax retired at) he will objectively be a better pitcher
+Moffett's Solution Kershaw has had his problems in post season.
+Mryrhodesian the point stands
Pete needs to be put on the ballot. Let the voters have a chance to say yes or no.
Pete's a really funny guy!😄He needs to be in the HOF and with the MLB. Right now it's their loss!
Rose is awesome!
cowherd is a weasel.
Jack Stone you mean, cowturd
NL had awesome pitchers in the 1960s---totally dominated AL in All Star games that decade
+loyaldude10 arguably the greatest decade in major league history...not just pitchers either...Rose, Mays, Aaron, Mantle, Frank Robinson, Kaline, Killebrew...on and on and on....today's players are bush league compared to those true legends
+Will Drucker The game was not as balanced back then, probably lol. Now, everyone is throwing 95+ with their fastball and i'm sure it's much harder for the batters these days
And they were the faster league to integrate, getting the best Black players. Although, by 1960, even the Red Sox had integrated.
Love Pete’s candid approach to commentary
Loved Charlie Hustle since I first saw him at Crosley in '63.
I laughed when he spiked the melon.
Colin is talking about something other than the NBA and LeBron?
Pete Rose was an artist with a bat.
Switch hitter, he knows what he's talking about when it comes to great pitching
Colin doesn’t realize how long Warren Spahn played.
Ray Charles couldn't see the ball well LMAO
No he said "Ray Charles coulda seen the ball" noting his opinion of Sutton's pitching as poor since Rose did so well against him etc. The way you say it there's no irony, no real impact made. Sorry if I over-stressed the point.
No, Sean, he said "Ray Charles coulda hit Don Sutton and Ray had a hard time seeing the ball." To me, Wesley's comment is fairly accurate.
Wow. You agree that the statement 'Ray Charles couldn't see the ball well' is 'fairly accurate ??? lol Thanks for the comment Mr. Obvious.
Jamie Foxx might agree with Pete's assessment regarding Ray Charles.
I'D like to know his current opinion of former MLB umpire Dave Pallone, and of Nolan Ryan's infamous "six-hitter" against Robin Ventura.
922 strikeouts for Mr. Koufax ('64-66). Whoever saw him pitch in real life must be really lucky.
Saw him throw a no hitter against the Phillies in about 63 or 64. Had great seats on the third base line.
Could see that curve ball come in at shoulder height and drop to the knees.
Last hitter was Bobby Wine. Never had a chance.
@@jamesconnor7706 batters claimed that they could hear the spin on his curveball. Even with knowing it was coming, they still couldn't hit it.
good stuff. I wore #14 in LL in the mid 60's because of mr. hustle. I remember when my best friend, a dodger fan, and I used to camp out in a tent in his back yard listening on radio to Dodger v Giant games on some summer fri-saturday nights where both the LA (KTLA?) and SF (KMJ0 broadcasts could be dialed in) I was a Giants, Mays, McCovey, Cepeda, &Marichal fan. fun memories that later generations of players/fans will never know, unfortunately. Koufax was feared and, I think, was the best ever
I was glad to hear Pete Rose talk so highly of the great Juan Marichal. As soon as I saw Marichal pitch, he became my favorite player even though I was a New York Yankee fan as a kid. I was a pitcher in Little League baseball, and I copied Marichal's pitching style with the high leg kick.
Love him or hate him (and I LOVE him) how can any baseball fan not love listening to Pete Rose? He’s a walking living breathing encyclopedia of baseball knowledge.
Rose was Rookie of the Year in 1963. Spahn retired in 1963 with San Francisco. Not sure Pete is correct about facing Spahn
57 times.
And most of it is about himself.
@@jerrybrownell3415Spahn retired at the end of the 1965 season.
@@jerrybrownell3415 he said he was 10-57 off Koufax
@@johngalt60 -You are correct. My bad. I apologize. He was 17 of 32 against Spahn but Warren was past 40 and at the end of his remarkable career.
Cowturd's desk is raised so he can look down on people.
True and disgusting.
I wasn't the biggest fan of Pete Rose when he played but like someone else here said he is fun to listen to...what a character.Its personalities like these that make baseball the best game going
Pete Rose is just a great baseball man. He has a great memory for the game. some day maybe the veterans committee will vote him in to the Hall of Fame.