Physicists & Philosophers debunk the Kalam Cosmological Argument featuring Penrose, Hawking, Guth

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  • čas přidán 26. 06. 2024
  • We have assembled some of the world’s leading physicists and philosophers to reply to the Kalam Cosmological Argument for God (as presented in popular debates by the Christian Philosopher William Lane Craig). The argument says that everything that begins to exist has a cause, the universe began to exist, therefore the universe has a cause, which must be God. We show the flaws in this argument, featuring interviews we conducted with physicists Roger Penrose, Stephen Hawking, Alan Guth, Carlo Rovelli, Alex Vilenkin, Niayesh Afshordi and many others as well as philosophers such as AW Moore (co-editor of the world's leading philosophy journal Mind), Oxford logician Daniel Isaacson, Cambridge philosopher Arif Ahmed, philosopher of science specialising in foundations of quantum mechanics Alastair Wilson, and Alex Malpass and Daniel Linford who have both published multiple articles on the Kalam in leading journals. Most of the footage was shot especially for this film and all of those participants reviewed it carefully before release. All of the other living participants, where we reused interview footage from previous films, were sent a draft of this one in advance and asked if they objected to appearing or wanted changes. None objected and all changes are in the final film you see. Most participants gave extremely positive feedback and we hope you will too.
    Timecodes
    0:00 Introduction
    1:38 Actual versus Potential Infinity
    2:40 Cantor's Infinity
    3:06 The Infinite Property
    5:42 Hilbert’s Hotel
    11:16 Contradiction & not a Contradiction
    13:38 Jupiter and Saturn
    14:52 Physicists on Infinity
    16:38 Counting to Infinity
    18:36 The Infinite Future
    22:35 Spacetime Singularity
    24:50 Carlo Rovelli on Neo Lorentzian Relativity and Cosmic Time
    28:29 Hawking, Penrose, Vilenkin, Efstathiou on The Big Bang & Quantum Gravity
    29:37 Strings, Loops and the Big Bounce
    31:16 Guth and Vilenkin on the BGV
    34:00 Is a Collapsing Universe Unstable?
    35:31 Wall Theorem, Ashtekar and Afshordi
    36:36 Anthony Aguirre on Past Eternal Universe
    37:47 Singularities, Magueijo and Vidotto
    38:24 Second Law, Guth and Ashtekar
    40:43 A Universe From Nothing? Vilenkin
    42:53 Causality
    44:17 Interpretations of QM
    48:05 Tigers in Our Living Room, Vilenkin
    49:44 Causality and Philosophy
    51:25 Simultaneous Causation
    54:46 Can The Universe Create Itself?
    56:51 Ghazali's Argument
    57:53 Closing Arguments
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Komentáře • 3,1K

  • @HolyKoolaid
    @HolyKoolaid Před 2 lety +513

    This needs to be seen by every Christian apologist who's ever tried to use the Kalam.

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +31

      thanks so much

    • @danielgautreau161
      @danielgautreau161 Před 2 lety +80

      @@PhilHalper1 Bertrand Russell said that most of the arguments attempting to prove a god are just bad grammar.

    • @Andrew-pp2ql
      @Andrew-pp2ql Před 2 lety +7

      Wonder will Braxton hunter of trinity radio address it? He most of all after Craig uses and defends the Kalam as a near slam dunk argument for proof of god’s existence.

    • @eldjoudhi
      @eldjoudhi Před 2 lety +11

      Craig might need some cool aid to answer this ;))

    • @ecostarr
      @ecostarr Před 2 lety +4

      Thanks for the link to this on Twitter. I will definitely be forwarding it to others.

  • @rationalityrules
    @rationalityrules Před 2 lety +479

    So damn excited! Will be sure to share this an infinite number of times :P Thank you

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +31

      wow, it would be an honour if you did. I dont know if you remember but we met in Oxford when you debated my good friend Justin Brierley. I think you are going to love this film. Finger crossed, let me know what you think when you see it and yes shares would be great. We dont have the reach of yourself and Alex but i think when you see this you will want it spread far and wide. Hope you are well and happy new year btw.

    • @Hello-vz1md
      @Hello-vz1md Před 2 lety +12

      Maybe You should Mention this Film in your Kalam Series with joe (Majesty of reason ) as a Resource

    • @dawnmancaloriankeebals4262
      @dawnmancaloriankeebals4262 Před 2 lety +12

      I'm here because of Rationality Rules. So looking forward to it, though my mind might explode before the end. 😅

    • @eenkjet
      @eenkjet Před 2 lety +1

      Skydivephil is church for the naturalist/atheist! And I don't mean that in a good way.

    • @dawnmancaloriankeebals4262
      @dawnmancaloriankeebals4262 Před 2 lety +18

      @@eenkjet Obviously you don't mean that in a good way as atheists have no reason to attend a church. This is merely educational, which is not the purpose of a church.

  • @fensom80
    @fensom80 Před 2 lety +7

    Christians: God created everything. Infinite doesn't exist.
    Also Christians: God is Infinite.

    • @katamas832
      @katamas832 Před 2 lety +1

      My favorite

    • @ob4161
      @ob4161 Před 2 lety +1

      Except that the usage of the term "Infinite" is equivocal in both statements, so there's nothing inconsistent in affirming both.

  • @DavidJohnWellman
    @DavidJohnWellman Před 2 lety +137

    This puts my own videos on the Kalam to shame. Great job Phil and Monica. This may be the definitive response to Kalam for some time to come.

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +11

      thanks David , thats very gracious of you to say

    • @leeshackelford7517
      @leeshackelford7517 Před 2 lety +4

      The Kalam, as phrased by the WLC moron they are using...has been debunked MANY TIMES...

    • @Nai61a
      @Nai61a Před 2 lety +6

      @@leeshackelford7517 I don't think it is fair or justified to refer to Dr Craig as a "moron". He is anything but. Perhaps you were just using hyperbole for effect, but I think charity is valuable in these discussions.
      That said, what phrasing of the Kalam do you think has NOT been debunked or has been debunked fewer that "many times"?

    • @leeshackelford7517
      @leeshackelford7517 Před 2 lety

      @@Nai61a just saw your reply,
      Since they were using that version, I used THAT version.
      Of course they've all been debunked.
      It is stupid, to keep repeating the same BS, once the idea has been debunked to the speaker personally. That's why I call Ham and Hovind stupid
      WLC, is obviously well educated. Since he is well educated, his level of stupidity, is much much deeper, so I raised him to the "moron" level.
      (His level of education...he should see the nonsense as nonsense. I COULD be generous ....just lying for Jesus....and raise him up a level in his ability to lie)

    • @Revolt_west
      @Revolt_west Před 2 lety +5

      The people in this video are overthinking it, lol. A single moment actually does depend on the previous even if we could not witness it. The mathematical laws would still apply whether or not humans existed.
      We literally would NOT be having this conversation if the universe, theoretically, had an infinite past(which really just means it never even *began* to exist or never existed in the first place, lol). Maybe these people believe the universe is some sort of omniscient being😆

  • @tristanneal9552
    @tristanneal9552 Před 2 lety +90

    Honestly, this is so much more interesting than simply "debunking religious people who use the Kalam cosmological argument". I love the idea of taking these big philosophical questions and looking at them through the lens of science as we know it.

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +10

      thanks glad you liked it.

    • @Revolt_west
      @Revolt_west Před 2 lety +5

      The people in this video are overthinking it, lol. A single moment actually does depend on the previous even if we could not witness it. The mathematical laws would still apply whether or not humans existed.
      We literally would NOT be having this conversation if the universe, theoretically, had an infinite past(which really just means it never even *began* to exist or never existed in the first place, lol). Maybe these people believe the universe is some sort of omniscient being😆

    • @laggruntythirst
      @laggruntythirst Před 2 lety +2

      @@Revolt_west maybe it would help you if you actually watched the vid, bud. Here's a timestamp that addresses your point: 24:53

    • @Revolt_west
      @Revolt_west Před 2 lety +3

      @@laggruntythirst It must not be a good point if you cannot explain it yourself...bud🤓.

    • @TBOTSS
      @TBOTSS Před 2 lety +4

      @@PhilHalper1 Craig has MORE than refuted this video. Carlo Rovelli is straight out lying about Neo-Lorentzianism and Black Holes. A W Moore is lying about the work of John Barrow - even a casual reading of the web page in the video confirms this. The philosophers talk of the infinite singularity is contradicted by the physicists later in the video. A singularity in General relativity means the equations blow up and does not give an infinite cardinality. There are similar infinities in QCD as well and are resolved by renormalisation this might not be possible in classical GR but even than this does not imply an actual infinite as the Barrow article says. A Neo-Lorentzian does not imply or need faster than light travel, General Relativity does not rule out FTL travel both statements are lies.. The individual who interviewed Danial Isaacson lied - he told Dan that Craig was arguing against the consistency of higher set theory and not its metaphysical implausibility in the real world.
      TRY AGAIN.

  • @danieledgardoadorno-cruz5006

    Here because of Rationality Rules, I enjoyed the thorough response and analysis of the argument. And great documentary quality 👌 Keep up the amazing work… Subscribed 👍

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +6

      thanks very much , glad you liked it.

    • @TheWorldTeacher
      @TheWorldTeacher Před 2 lety

      Here from the “Critical Faculty” CZcams channel.
      Incidentally, are you VEGAN? 🌱

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety

      @@TheWorldTeacher Im vegetarian.

    • @TheWorldTeacher
      @TheWorldTeacher Před 2 lety

      @@PhilHalper1, you are urged to become VEGAN, since carnism (the destructive ideology which supports the use and consumption of animal products, especially for “food”) is arguably the foremost existential crisis.🌱

    • @everyzylrian
      @everyzylrian Před 11 měsíci

      Do you have any comment on Craig's refutation of this video? He put it up in his own video titled "WLC Responds to a Video Critiquing Him and the Kalam"

  • @Tshego_Mk
    @Tshego_Mk Před 2 lety +9

    Rationality rules sent me here
    I'm glad I came

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety

      what did you think of the film?

    • @Tshego_Mk
      @Tshego_Mk Před 2 lety +5

      It was quite entertaining and informative. It is a work of art, one of the many things I am grateful for, is now I have a topic I can pour my time into. The big bounce theory

  • @deeliciousplum
    @deeliciousplum Před 2 lety +10

    Thank you for creating this and for sharing these ideas and concerns. A huge thank you to all of the interviewees who shared their time with us. 🌺

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +1

      you are most welcome, appreciate the support.

  • @eristic1281
    @eristic1281 Před 2 lety +7

    Suggestion for a future video: Reaction of people as they hear Craig quoting them.

  • @romanbesel4759
    @romanbesel4759 Před 2 lety +26

    Looks super awesome! Glad to see Alex Malpass in there, his formulation of the unsatisfiable pair diagnosis is a pretty good response.

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +2

      Yes Alex is awesome , he has a lot of good points made in this film

    • @jmike2039
      @jmike2039 Před 2 lety

      I marked out when I saw Dr. Malpass, hes great

  • @ernest3286
    @ernest3286 Před 2 lety +41

    Came here from Paulogia. Love this thorough dive into the Kalam argument! It's difficult to fully understand the flaws of this argument with only a layman background, so breaking it down like this was very helpful!

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +2

      thanks glad you liked it.

    • @somebodysomewhere5571
      @somebodysomewhere5571 Před 2 lety +1

      @@PhilHalper1 why did you lie about a "nothingness" when you know full well its a quantum fluctuation? This "nothings" is a vortex which has this quantum fluctuation inside it that requires space and yes time to exist. It is not a nothing just a very small and complex something yet you chose not to say that.

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +3

      @@somebodysomewhere5571 did you even watch the film?

    • @somebodysomewhere5571
      @somebodysomewhere5571 Před 2 lety

      @@PhilHalper1 yes

    • @somebodysomewhere5571
      @somebodysomewhere5571 Před 2 lety

      @@PhilHalper1 It doesnt change the fact of the matter. You lied about nothingness and used "philosophers" who all they said was "its not one sided in the philosophy community" like obv but nothing ever is.

  • @yours-truely-sir
    @yours-truely-sir Před 2 měsíci +2

    As a mathematician I hate to see mathematics being misused with such wild claims such as 'mathematicians agree that infinity leads to self controdiction'. that is just the lowest of the low and you can see that they are scraping the bottom of the barrel for arguments

  • @epistemologicaldespair68
    @epistemologicaldespair68 Před 2 lety +60

    I am very pleased by the quality of the video, the caliber of speakers, the framing of the Kalam argument and the beauty of the refutations. This could easily be behind I pay wall so thank you for bringing this to us for free!!!!

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +4

      you are more than welcome, thanks for your comment

    • @thecloudtherapist
      @thecloudtherapist Před 2 lety +1

      Unfortunately, the Kalam is misrepresented here.
      Are we now in the age where whatever gets published online - because it fits a certain narrative or confirms our biases - that we take it to be true?
      You should look at Dr William Lane Craig's response videos on his channel, to this docu.
      Then come back and restate your above comment.

    • @jakek.403
      @jakek.403 Před 2 lety

      @@thecloudtherapist Lmao, "misrepresnted"; I love how everytime Craig's life, bullshit and sophistry are exposed; the sycophantic christ-cultists and jesus-fuckers come up with some "misrepresentation". Also, the calimnous video serious by craig has been responded to; and Craig has been, once again, in the eyes of all reasonable people, embrassed publicly. Craig is barely good enough to get a pass-by as a philosopher; his butchery and perversion of actual science however, is near unforgivable. So, tragically: you have openly misrepresented the state of the argument here; and I think you should edit your comment or reply with an apology to me and the commentor above.

    • @Pysoktus
      @Pysoktus Před rokem

      ​@@thecloudtherapist does this video ever make a transition from talking about infinity to talking about the argument? Where are they saying the argument is false?

    • @everyzylrian
      @everyzylrian Před 11 měsíci

      Sorry, Craig debunked this video. See "WLC Responds to a Video Critiquing Him and the Kalam"

  • @shriggs55
    @shriggs55 Před 2 lety +4

    Excellent! Gave me a lot of food for thought.

  • @greatunwashed9116
    @greatunwashed9116 Před 2 lety

    Great vid. Will be watching it a few times to process the information.

  • @whirledpeas3477
    @whirledpeas3477 Před rokem +1

    Don't buy a used car from anyone named Bill Craig

  • @JOSELOPEZ-rn2nl
    @JOSELOPEZ-rn2nl Před 2 lety +7

    Already watched 3 times ... Just amazing and i don't have any other words to add.
    Thank you so much for this !!

  • @phazecat446
    @phazecat446 Před 2 lety +5

    This response was absolutely fascinating. I'm not overly familiar with WLC's argument, but the one thing that has always stuck out to me is when pushed on A vs B theory of time, he never really provides an answer to B other than to ignore it.
    Illuminating video. Thanks to all involved.

    • @everyzylrian
      @everyzylrian Před 11 měsíci +1

      I suggest you look up WLCs response to this video, in another video titled "WLC Responds to a Video Critiquing Him and the Kalam"

  • @Aarika101
    @Aarika101 Před 5 dny +2

    Now ladies and gentlement and non-binaries, this is what you call a DEBUNKING video! No strawmaning, show the actuality of the person words, and asking experts to answer all of those!

  • @dynamic9016
    @dynamic9016 Před 2 lety +2

    Really appreciate this video.

  • @truthandlove971
    @truthandlove971 Před 2 lety +5

    This channel and Closer to Truth are the best and the most adventurous cosmology content on CZcams.

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +1

      thanks, thats very kind of you to say

    • @Hello-vz1md
      @Hello-vz1md Před 2 lety

      You would love this then czcams.com/play/PLROBLlvnR7BEF9b1NOvRf_zhboibmywJb.html

  • @Jay_in_Japan
    @Jay_in_Japan Před 2 lety +6

    I'm excited for this, should prove to be interesting!

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +1

      thanks, i look forward to hearing your thoughts afterwards.

  • @theophilussogoromo3000
    @theophilussogoromo3000 Před 2 lety +1

    Great documentary. A must watch! Would love one for the ontological argument as well.

  • @Zictomorph
    @Zictomorph Před měsícem +1

    "That video is so below threshold." What a great description 😅

  • @Burtimus02
    @Burtimus02 Před 2 lety +37

    Far and away the best and clearest response to the Kalam I have seen. Thank you for this!

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +2

      thanks so much

    • @CosmosMarinerDU
      @CosmosMarinerDU Před 2 lety +3

      I just want to add a extremely strong thumbs up to your comment! Far more than the one I'm officially permitted.

    • @donnievance1942
      @donnievance1942 Před 2 lety +3

      I've thought of a lot of these objections to the Kalam myself, but not being a mathematician or physicist, I lacked the confidence that I was correct. It's nice to see them confirmed by the people who have the goods. Craig founds his arguments on a cherry-picked list of hypotheses and interpretations that are not favored by the larger scientific community. The end result is a kind of theoretical Rube Goldberg machine that is constructed to bolster a predetermined conclusion. Interestingly, Craig has stated that even if his logical rationale for God was proved wrong, he would believe anyway. He bases this outlook on an incorrigible inner experience of God.
      Well that is fine for him, but to go on from there to create an ad hoc byzantine construction full of suppositions rejected or disfavored by most experts in the relevant fields, taking positive stands on propositions that no one can know, is pure dishonest sophistry.
      It has become clear that Craig's actual project is not to create a valid rationale for God's existence, but to put his argument on a level of sophistication where the average person cannot follow, but where they can be bamboozled by the technical esoterica that he can deploy. This can be seen when he lectures to general audiences. In those settings he makes outrageous absolute statements. He should hope that the God and Hell he believes in are not actually true, if he believes that God has a serious criterion for honesty.

    • @CosmosMarinerDU
      @CosmosMarinerDU Před 2 lety

      @@donnievance1942 I couldn't agree more. I remember once hearing him speak to some non-technical Christian audience and make reference to de Sitter space. And I remember thinking, how nice that his audience probably understands that he's referring to a maximally symmetric Lorentzian manifold with constant positive scalar curvature which is the Lorentzian analogue of an n-sphere (with its canonical Riemannian metric). Nice solution to Einstein's GR field equations too!

    • @donnievance1942
      @donnievance1942 Před 2 lety

      @@CosmosMarinerDU LOL.

  • @RealAtheology
    @RealAtheology Před 2 lety +22

    As I'm sure you're aware, despite the rapid growth of Atheism, at an institutional level Chriatian Apologetics enjoys a wide variety of support in terms of funding, influence, and organizational advantage. Simply look at the size of some of the biggest Christian YT channels as well as the quality of videos produced by organizations such as Reasonable Faith, Word on Fire, and others. With that in mind, it is finally so amazing to see a high-quality and well produced film that brings the best of Atheism in Philosophy and Science to take on the Kalam Cosmological Argument. Because of the argument's popularity, the majority of responses on both sides (from Atheists and Theists) have been relatively poor and uninformed. But with your video, where you highlight what relevant epistemic experts have to say on the matter, I'm hoping it can raise the level of discourse around the Kalam.
    Truly this is a remarkable achievement and this is something that as Rationality Rules said, I will be sharing multiple times over and over again. Thank you so much for putting this together as you have done a tremendous service to everyone who is engaged in the debate on the Kalam. Well done.

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +4

      Thanks so much , really appreciate what you just said. Rationality Rules did say he would share multiple times, but wed behapy for one tweet. So far he hasnt tweeted about it or given any reactions. Im curious to know what he thought maybe if you know him you could ask him ?

    • @Hello-vz1md
      @Hello-vz1md Před 2 lety +4

      @@PhilHalper1 you should tweet this video to Every Popular Atheists and Theists by this engagement on Kalam debate Will do better

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +1

      @@Hello-vz1md thanks. I have tried but that doesn't seem to work, maybe if you can as well that might help.

    • @RealAtheology
      @RealAtheology Před 2 lety +2

      @@PhilHalper1 I think Rationality Rules has now shared things from his end. For what it's worth, we've also been promoting this video where we can. One further suggestion, for any other projects dealing with the Kalam (or any other argument for Theism), I'd highly recommend inviting Graham Oppy, Wes Morriston, C.M. Lorkowski, Paul Draper, Evan Fales, Stephen Puryear, Stephen Maitzen, J.L. Schellenberg, Robin Le Poidevin, Felipe Leon, Gregory Dawes, etc for a production as all these people have published scholarly literature/boooks and are relevant epistemic experts in this area.

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +1

      @@RealAtheology thanks, yes I see Stephen shared it now so thats great. I think we may do fine tuning next, who do you think we should have for that? Im based n Uk so Eurpean names preferred but may travel further afield for it.

  • @Ryansghost
    @Ryansghost Před 2 lety +1

    Very juicy! Thank you.

  • @meaningoftheunicorn
    @meaningoftheunicorn Před rokem +1

    This channel is a sheer treasure. I do wish it had closed captions though. All these minds are brilliant but a bit hard to understand their accents sometimes.

  • @jaynajuly2140
    @jaynajuly2140 Před 2 lety +3

    WLC unironically said skeptics of his argument are deliberately abusing science LMAO

  • @ATipplingPhilosopher
    @ATipplingPhilosopher Před 2 lety +3

    Hey Phil - thanks for doing this. I'm excited to FINALLY watch it, especially given my book on the subject: "Did God Create the Universe from Nothing? Countering William Lane Craig's Kalam Cosmological Argument"

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +1

      let me know what you think

    • @ATipplingPhilosopher
      @ATipplingPhilosopher Před 2 lety +2

      @@PhilHalper1 it's brilliant. I'll blog it this week.

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety

      @@ATipplingPhilosopher about time mate! glad you liked it

    • @ATipplingPhilosopher
      @ATipplingPhilosopher Před 2 lety +2

      @@PhilHalper1 I'm so fricking busy I've been struggling. You know Carrier heavily cited it in a recent discussion?

  • @Self-Duality
    @Self-Duality Před 2 lety +2

    Excellent content. Subscribed.

  • @Zift_Ylrhavic_Resfear
    @Zift_Ylrhavic_Resfear Před 2 lety +1

    Thanks for the video :)

  • @allenjacob8926
    @allenjacob8926 Před 2 lety +3

    here after watching Trent horns rebuttal

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +2

      have you seen Majesty of Reasons reply ? czcams.com/video/dqmIQcNrzTY/video.html

  • @MrBendybruce
    @MrBendybruce Před 2 lety +7

    This was such a great video. It really exposes how Infinities can be abused by trying to apply arithmetic functions against them that are themselves, not logically defendable.

  • @prometheus3498
    @prometheus3498 Před rokem

    Wow this is fantastic! Subscribed!

  • @whlewis9164
    @whlewis9164 Před 7 měsíci +1

    This is a fantastic video. Thank you

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 7 měsíci

      You're welcome. Thanks for your kind words

  • @matthewknight7594
    @matthewknight7594 Před 2 lety +3

    Excellent work, I felt that Craig's arguments had some holes in them but I lacked the clarity to see exactly where. This video helped tremendously. Thanks very much.

  • @Phreemunny
    @Phreemunny Před 2 lety +11

    It’s incredibly to hear a theist say that without an eternal life with god, life is meaningless, and then accuse all atheists of being nihilists 😂
    Tell me again how everything else has more value the more rare it is, except life it self.

    • @feedingravens
      @feedingravens Před 2 lety

      Even funnier: So, when there is a meaning to life that ONLY God can prescribe and that can ONLY be revealed via the Bible, then what is it?
      Can God change the meaning of life as he fancies?
      Is the meaning of Life individual or the same for all people everywhere anytime and anytime in their life?
      When you ask such questions to a normal believer, you get crickets.
      And I daresay even when you ask a professional apologist, you will get vague commonplaces and nothing concrete (beyond everyone has to find the meaning of life for yourself, and for that I do not need God)
      I think the whole is simply created to give the people security/certainty; that you have to ultimately make up your own morals (consistent for living together in a society) and your own meaning, and that you are NOT special, but just a "random" product of many in a giant universe in which nothing is stable and lasting forever (except the principle of constant change) is disturbing for many.
      Would we admit that and teach how to COPE with that, how to find ways to handle this and fill the voids and to accept that this will be a constant process would be far better.
      I just have to look at how WE change throughout our lifetime, and it is clear that there are no absolutes.

    • @canwelook
      @canwelook Před 2 lety +2

      Theists like having meaning imposed on them.
      Atheists like finding their own meanings.

  • @williamturns341
    @williamturns341 Před 2 lety +1

    Excellent presentation!

  • @stefanheinzmann7319
    @stefanheinzmann7319 Před 2 lety +2

    Wow! So many nails for a coffin whose content has been rotting away for quite a while already!

  • @martifingers
    @martifingers Před 2 lety +12

    A superb focused exposition that is expressed in la language for the non-specialist. No easy task. We are all in the debt of the producers of this - it is a model of clarity, rationality and intellectual rigour.

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +1

      thanks so much, really appreciate your comment.

  • @CosmoPhiloPharmaco
    @CosmoPhiloPharmaco Před 2 lety +44

    Wow! No doubt this will be excellent! I love this subject of the Kalam. I'm glad Daniel Linford was invited. :) He surely deserves it.

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +2

      yeah he's brilliant and very helpful

    • @CosmoPhiloPharmaco
      @CosmoPhiloPharmaco Před 2 lety +4

      @@PhilHalper1 You were not kidding when you said you're working in a bigger project, Phil! :)

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +8

      @@CosmoPhiloPharmaco the Kalam video is not the bigger project. Thats something way bigger

    • @Hello-vz1md
      @Hello-vz1md Před 2 lety

      @@PhilHalper1 what's your bigger project?

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +4

      @@Hello-vz1md I cant say at the moment but Im sure you will hear about in time

  • @Epoch11
    @Epoch11 Před 20 dny +1

    Such a wonderful episode, I would definitely watch a deep dive on the concept of infinity. There was a really great special done in England on Infinity I think by Horizons but if you made one I would be the first person to watch.

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 19 dny

      We may do this in the future. Seriously looking into it

  • @babykosh5415
    @babykosh5415 Před rokem +1

    I can not measure properly the amount of thank you for being here.

  • @wax99
    @wax99 Před 2 lety +8

    Holy moly thank you so very much!! I've been asking to several religious people what exactly do they mean by an infinite regress and this does wonders to understand what I already suspected, that it's an invalid question or at least distinct questions not compatable with finite time.

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety

      you are welcome

    • @somebodysomewhere5571
      @somebodysomewhere5571 Před 2 lety +2

      If they didn’t just respond with “an endlessly long sequence of events” then they are bad at defending their faith

    • @Carlos-fl6ch
      @Carlos-fl6ch Před 2 lety

      @@somebodysomewhere5571 defending faith is not hard doing so without logical fallacies, misrepresenting science, assumptions after assumptions and overestimating the bible... That is the Challenger.

    • @somebodysomewhere5571
      @somebodysomewhere5571 Před 2 lety

      @@Carlos-fl6ch Sounds like you making assumptions about defending faith

    • @Carlos-fl6ch
      @Carlos-fl6ch Před 2 lety

      @@somebodysomewhere5571
      Assumptions. Hmm. Consider this. defending anything is not hard doing so without logical fallacies, misrepresenting science, assumptions after assumptions and overestimating your position... That is the Challenger.
      But better yet. Proof me wrong and I'll admit

  • @VicedRhino
    @VicedRhino Před 2 lety +3

    This is a fantastic video. Well done!

  • @creatinechris
    @creatinechris Před 2 lety +1

    Added to favorites after watching. So many great minds and nuggets.

  • @frogandspanner
    @frogandspanner Před 2 lety +55

    I'm glad I spent the two hours to watch this. Two hours you ask: yes - I needed time to look things up, or just think. This programme was worthy of that.
    I am pleased that this has confirmed much of what I thought (I am a Physicist by training, Biophysicist by research), and introduced me to concepts with which I was not previously familiar.
    I'd have liked a bit more on causality, in particular simultaneous causation. If two events are simultaneous which causes the other? Does the depression of the pillow cause the sinking of the ball, or vice versa? What causes photon pair production, as everywhere is simultaneous for the photon? There is the necessity of the nearby nucleus, but there is no sufficiency.
    To one of your contributors, Alastair Wilson: if you are ever in Staff House bar when I am I'd like to discuss this with you.

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +11

      thanks so much for your comment , and two hours of watch time. Alas we decided to try and keep it to less than one hour so inevitably there will be sections that could go further. Still Criags video on the topic are just 5 mins.

    • @JonS
      @JonS Před 2 lety +11

      Yes, but if you subtract those two hours from infinity, it's the same as subtracting zero from infinity. So we can say that in an infinite universe, you spent no time watching this video! 😂

    • @CosmosMarinerDU
      @CosmosMarinerDU Před 2 lety +2

      As I understood it, gravity acting on the ball caused the depression in the pillow. But if you deny that event, and just observe the ball nestled in the depression, the simultaneous cause and effect, then that state can only be understood in terms of an infinitely past event. That is, an uncaused cause or simultaneous causation.

    • @deeptochatterjee532
      @deeptochatterjee532 Před 2 lety +1

      There is no such thing as simultaneity though, both you and I should know that from relativity

    • @inthefade
      @inthefade Před 2 lety

      It took me at least 1.5 hours, but I'll be thinking about this for weeks or years.

  • @walkerflocker7811
    @walkerflocker7811 Před 2 lety +10

    Easily the best video on the kalam. Thanks for this.

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +1

      thats really kid of you to say

    • @walkerflocker7811
      @walkerflocker7811 Před 2 lety +1

      @@PhilHalper1 hey! It's just true. I'm in many debate groups on Facebook and I'm so tired of the argument. This gives me some new information to use I didn't have previously. I hate how science is constantly misrepresented by believers, but I'm not a scientist so it's hard for me to put in words these concepts sometimes. These people being paragons of intellect make it understandable to a lay person such as myself.

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +1

      @@walkerflocker7811 cool, feel free to link to this video in such groups.

  • @tenpotkan7051
    @tenpotkan7051 Před 2 lety +2

    I like the contrast between Craig's rather aggressive, asertionist approach soaked with an ever-present vibe of mockery and the scientists' calm, educational tone.

  • @billkeon880
    @billkeon880 Před 2 lety +1

    Excellent idea for debunking certain arguments. Empanel a handful of experts to deconstruct these seemingly complex arguments

  • @RooBot
    @RooBot Před 2 lety +1

    I'm on the edge of my seat!

  • @RodrigoOshiro
    @RodrigoOshiro Před 2 lety +6

    Reminder is ON!

  • @macieyid
    @macieyid Před 2 lety +29

    This is perfect! Every time I hear that ridiculous "we couldn't get to now from infinite past"' thing I start to cry and bang my head against the desk, and I'm sure I'm not the only one. Nice to see that the big minds have heard the banging.

    • @JonS
      @JonS Před 2 lety +9

      Yes, that argument is irritating. I wonder if WLC and his ilk would argue that Xeno's Paradox proves you can't shoot a tortoise with an arrow?

    • @christaylor6574
      @christaylor6574 Před 2 lety +2

      hahaha - I empathise with you. I tend to I always hold my head in my hands like that Cpt. Picard meme.

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +11

      yes Im so glad we could get some experts to explain why this is wrong

    • @CosmoPhiloPharmaco
      @CosmoPhiloPharmaco Před 2 lety +4

      This argument is indeed flawed. But I think it is the best argument they have (in comparison to Hilbert's Hotel and the Grim Reaper paradox and others). When I first heard of it, I was puzzled. Of course, after reading I realized it is fallacious.

    • @tomschmidt381
      @tomschmidt381 Před 2 lety

      @@CosmoPhiloPharmaco The Hilbert Hotel example was ridiculous with the statement an infinite hotel being full. That shows a complete misunderstanding of the notion of infinite anything.

  • @rodolfo9916
    @rodolfo9916 Před 2 lety +1

    Great video! I think that understanding the eternalist view of time is important to comprehend better the physical theories involved in this discussion, would be nice to have a video about eternalism.

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +2

      glad you like it, and thanks for your suggestion

  • @charlesdarwin-bt6uv
    @charlesdarwin-bt6uv Před rokem

    Nice video. Very helpful.

  • @sartajaziz5930
    @sartajaziz5930 Před 2 lety +4

    This video only proves that infinity can exist in theory but not in a physical realm.
    Here's why :
    let us imagine we believed that the universe was infinite. Because this universe is so large, (given a quantum probablistic universe) the chance of some configuration of atoms existing somewhere in this universe (providing it does not break the laws of physics) becomes certain. This means anything that could exist somehow within the rules of physics MUST exist somewhere in the universe. Often this property of infinity is posed using the Infinite monkey theorem.
    This infinite universe includes all number of absurd things. An infinite universe means there exists somewhere in space an exact clone of earth but where everyone has three legs. It means there exists a clone of earth where everything is identical but that I have one fewer atoms in my right hand.
    Ultimately, there needs to be a necessary existence, making the Kalam still valid and sound.

    • @laurentmaquiet5631
      @laurentmaquiet5631 Před 2 lety +2

      If the universe is infinite, yes these things exists, but you cannot simultaneously label them as "absurd" and physically possible.
      And I cannot the the relevancy with the Kalam

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +2

      if the universe is infinite then yes all physically possible states happen but not necessarily with equal probability

  • @THasart
    @THasart Před 2 lety +5

    Great video! Definitely will watch it again to better understand everything that being said here. Only thing it's lacking right now is an attention it deserves.

  • @Macabresque
    @Macabresque Před 2 lety +1

    Having proper subtitles would be really helpful. I have some auditory processing issues so I have trouble understanding what some of these professors are saying, especially the interviewees with heavier accents. Trying my best to understand these concepts but it's pretty challenging. Please consider making some. Thanks. ❤️

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety

      if you know someone that wants to make them we would be happy to upload them

  • @danielefosa1679
    @danielefosa1679 Před 2 lety +1

    This is beautiful. I'll be here when you reach a million subscribers.

  • @DouwedeJong
    @DouwedeJong Před 2 lety +4

    Thanks for making this video. Contradictions in infinity is infinitely beautiful. I am just amazed that my brain can grasp it. How is that possible?

  • @haroldfloyd5518
    @haroldfloyd5518 Před 2 lety +4

    You can’t prove god or disprove god, but science has zero need for god in its explanations of the universe.

    • @canwelook
      @canwelook Před 2 lety

      Yes.
      And you can't prove two headed fairies or disprove two headed fairies but science has zero need for two headed fairies in its explanations of the universe.

    • @hectorantoniodejesusibarra7431
      @hectorantoniodejesusibarra7431 Před 2 lety

      @@canwelook yes you can prove someting false , like a can prove that it rain water and not milk ..........
      so its false that nothing that it doesnt exist can be prove ....... just science cant prove that GOD isnt exist
      😉😉😉😉😉😉😉😉😉

    • @canwelook
      @canwelook Před 2 lety

      @@hectorantoniodejesusibarra7431
      Science doesn't assume things exist until shown to exist.
      Fantasy remains the realm of religion.

  • @LouisGedo
    @LouisGedo Před 2 lety +1

    This presentation is nearly infinitely enjoyable!
    😉

  • @JC-zw9vs
    @JC-zw9vs Před 2 lety +1

    Oh yes... Back in business!

  • @shaccooper
    @shaccooper Před 2 lety +5

    “Many of us are dubious that just simply pointing that something seems absurd is enough to forbid it from existing in reality philosophers have to be a lot bolder than that.” What irony 🤣

    • @alanpennie8013
      @alanpennie8013 Před 2 lety +1

      Tertullian's ghost smiles.

    • @knyghtryder3599
      @knyghtryder3599 Před 5 měsíci

      WLC has one of the weakest arguments based on fluffy assumptions, he stands alone making a bold baseless claim

  • @bustinjieber2673
    @bustinjieber2673 Před 2 lety +3

    AWESOME!!!!!

  • @magicker8052
    @magicker8052 Před 2 lety +1

    Fantastic job

  • @bigol7169
    @bigol7169 Před 7 měsíci +1

    This is a BEAUTIFUL documentary. Thank you

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 7 měsíci

      You are welcome. Have you checked out our follow up film?

    • @bigol7169
      @bigol7169 Před 7 měsíci +1

      @@PhilHalper1 the '2: physicists and philosophers strike back'? I just began watching it... It has Wes Morriston in it! My favourite modern philosopher! This is a total GOLDMINE of a channel.. thank you 💕

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 7 měsíci +1

      @@bigol7169 cheers and I hope you like our new animal suffering argument film too

  • @adreaminxy
    @adreaminxy Před 2 lety +2

    Imagine WLC watching this and feeling slightly embarrassed.

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +2

      my guess is cognitive dissonance might prevent that

    • @ArKritz84
      @ArKritz84 Před 2 lety

      I'm fairly certain that WLC is nowhere near humble enough, and far too arrogant, to have EVER felt embarrassed.

    • @somebodysomewhere5571
      @somebodysomewhere5571 Před 2 lety

      Ah yes I can see you are very mature

    • @somebodysomewhere5571
      @somebodysomewhere5571 Před 2 lety

      “WLC is a demon! A demon I say” -this comments section at this point

  • @thegroove2000
    @thegroove2000 Před 2 lety +4

    To be honest,. YOU DONT KNOW.

  • @lfelssordnry
    @lfelssordnry Před 11 měsíci +2

    This is the most comprehensive and complete examination of the Kalam. Kudos to you

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 11 měsíci

      thanks very much . Have you seen our follow up film? I think I like it better

  • @audio_boys
    @audio_boys Před 2 lety +2

    Blessed content

  • @Devious_Dave
    @Devious_Dave Před 2 lety +2

    Will WLC respond with "an incredulous stare"? I look forward to it. Great video, thanks.

  • @nooneatall5612
    @nooneatall5612 Před 2 lety +2

    Wow, the kalam just got destroyed so thoroughly that everyone who uses it from this point onwards either hasn't seen this video, is an idiot, or is dishonest.

  • @Demonizer5134
    @Demonizer5134 Před rokem +2

    It's really funny how much blabbering is done in this hour long video and yet nowhere did they directly address or refute the actual claims of the KCA. This is embarrassing.

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před rokem +5

      I wonder why then Criag felt the need to do not one but four podcasts replying?

  • @Carlos-fl6ch
    @Carlos-fl6ch Před 2 lety +1

    I consider this one of the best Kalam documentaries available so great job. I also understand that you have loads and loads of other information available as well please consider a part two.
    The most important question idd like to ask you is to also make a video that responses to WLC responses that were discussed in bad apologetics. And please add the link to that episode here. It's a must watch after this documentary.

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety

      thanks, we are making part 2 , Im editing now

    • @Carlos-fl6ch
      @Carlos-fl6ch Před 2 lety +1

      @@PhilHalper1 not only a great documentary maker but a great responder to. What are you the perfect CZcams content creator.
      Think you can even go for part three and four. Lol.
      Really appreciate your work. It's often hard for scientist to respond to such stuff because they don't have the audience nor the motivation..so not only are you doing a great job for us enabling them to briefly address such matters is a great service to them as well.
      You are appreciated.

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety

      @@Carlos-fl6ch thanks so much for your kind words, very much appreciated.

  • @jimmytorres4181
    @jimmytorres4181 Před 2 lety +3

    Damn, Arif Ahmed is really good. Great video by the way

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +3

      hes awesome, such clear thinking and so to the point and accessible. Definitely going to use him again!

  • @bastabey2652
    @bastabey2652 Před 2 lety +3

    Between Cantor and Penrose, the universe is without beginning or end

  • @AllanSegalMD
    @AllanSegalMD Před 2 lety +2

    So great to have you back and providing content again....and what great content it is! Can not find Hilbert's Hotel on my travel app, however.

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +1

      thanks i did read a SCIFI novel Called White Light by Rudy Rucker where the characters stay there.

    • @oldpossum57
      @oldpossum57 Před měsícem

      The Hilbert Hotel is vastly overrated. Room service takes forever to answer your call.

  • @beermerican
    @beermerican Před 2 lety +1

    Exactly what I’ve always thought. (They just say it slightly more elegant). I try to always assume I’m wrong, but lean heavily, and wait for others to confirm.

  • @casp6132
    @casp6132 Před 2 lety +3

    I learned so much. Thank you for this

  • @MLamar0612
    @MLamar0612 Před 2 lety +3

    WELP!!!
    Theists..... Run😈😈😈

  • @carlosenriquegonzalez-isla6523

    The problem is not what sofists like WCL say. The problem is why there are people that listen and repeat such ignorant, unimaginative and arrogant non-sense.

  • @juliuszsedzikowski
    @juliuszsedzikowski Před 8 měsíci +2

    Very professsional analysis of more problems than just the argument itself

  • @NickdeVera
    @NickdeVera Před 2 lety +5

    excellent work. i wonder if craig will respond.

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +1

      he has responded to ourmaterial in the past so maybe , we shall see.

  • @greyinggoose5495
    @greyinggoose5495 Před 2 lety +2

    Simply wonderful, thoroughly enjoyed.

  • @jasonimports
    @jasonimports Před 2 lety +2

    Excellent, wonderful work putting this together!

  • @mainsequence5712
    @mainsequence5712 Před rokem +2

    i saw that you had a new video coming up today and decided to check this one out. Absolutely fascinating discussion about Math and Philosophy. Great content. Subscribed!

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před rokem +1

      thanks , hope you like the new one, please let us know in the comment swhat you think

  • @MrArdytube
    @MrArdytube Před 2 lety +3

    The general problem is that we assume that reality must conform to our perceived and named categories of perception
    The fact is that “the beginning of the universe” is a logical concept that only appears to make sense…. When in reality we have no reason to think we know anything at all about how or why those events transpired

  • @ceceroxy2227
    @ceceroxy2227 Před 2 lety +7

    Craigs philosophical arguments are obviously correct when dealing with the infinite past, anyone who thinks the past can be infinite, just boggles your mind, whether your a physicist or a philosopher.

    • @laurentmaquiet5631
      @laurentmaquiet5631 Před 2 lety

      "obviously"

    • @sebafacuse18
      @sebafacuse18 Před 2 lety

      Hello, Mr, sorry for my English, I wanted to know if I can ask you a question, I hope you answer despite the time that has passed.

    • @katamas832
      @katamas832 Před 2 lety +1

      God who is eternal, and hence had an infinite past: Bruh

    • @somebodysomewhere5571
      @somebodysomewhere5571 Před 2 lety

      He remained outside of time until he decided to enter it. Hence avoiding an infinite regress. Bruh.

    • @somebodysomewhere5571
      @somebodysomewhere5571 Před 2 lety

      It is obvious and if it isn’t to you, well… I feel kinda bad for you

  • @I_am_Irisarc
    @I_am_Irisarc Před 2 lety +1

    Thank you to everyone involved in making this video, and thank you to the one who presented here.

  • @firefly4f4
    @firefly4f4 Před 2 lety +2

    I love infinity problems, as they're weird and fascinating at the same time.
    I know one video I saw not too long ago -- either by numberphile or veritiserum (apologies if those are spelled incorrectly) that actually dealt with Hilbert's hotel. He described an infinite bus pulling up to the hotel, and it the hotel was still able to accommodate everyone; just move the current guests into rooms 2x, and the new guests go into rooms 2x - 1. You can do Almost the same for any number of busses Y that show up: guests in the hotel move into room (Y+1)x, while new guests move into room yx, where (y=1..Y).
    The problem occurs when Y is infinite, as now there is no way to "count" the number of rooms. That's a simple case that deomstrates countable vs uncountable infinities, whereas I believe what's talked about here are different sizes of countable infinities.
    Still very cool once you wrap your head around it.

    • @Kalumbatsch
      @Kalumbatsch Před 2 lety

      There aren't any different sizes of countable infinities. There's only one.

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +1

      i thnk that was Veratasium , great video

    • @firefly4f4
      @firefly4f4 Před 2 lety

      @@Kalumbatsch
      *thinks about it for a minute*
      Yeah, your right. I just tried that exercise in my head and realized I was always coming up with the same set by definition.

    • @iron8851
      @iron8851 Před 2 lety

      Complex numbers or the imaginary element of mathematics, are also valid formulas or laws deduced by the human being, as well as laws of physics, to obtain reliable results from theoretical questions with relevance and correspondence in the real world. Just this.They are useful, applicable and coherent deductions for the real world. Now no infinite set of mathematics has any correspondence and coherence in the concrete world. Infinities already traveled are impossible in the real world and even in the mathematician. I think it lacks competent philosophers to correctly interpret what infinite set theories really mean. Craig, who is not even from this area, had to correct current mathematicians and philosophers about their misconceptions.

  • @joelgarland3161
    @joelgarland3161 Před 2 lety +10

    skydivephil : Thank you so much for taking the time to put together this video with such a deep variety of perspectives around the world from leading expert's. I am forever indebted 👍

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +2

      You are very welcome. Appreciate the comment

  • @JerryPenna
    @JerryPenna Před 2 lety +3

    This the gold standard on the kalam. It’s a reference worthy video.

    • @PhilHalper1
      @PhilHalper1  Před 2 lety +1

      thats really kind of you to say, cheers.

  • @hollis4th
    @hollis4th Před 2 lety +1

    you can't keep stacking if you didn't start stacking but you can keep stacking forever if you don't stop.

  • @johnquiett1085
    @johnquiett1085 Před 2 lety +1

    This explained a lot. Thanks for producing this video.

  • @fred_derf
    @fred_derf Před 2 lety +2

    WLC says infinities are impossible with one breath then says god in infinite with the next -- he's not someone to take seriously but his influence on others should be. Which is why this video is important.

  • @psyseraphim
    @psyseraphim Před 2 lety +3

    41:34 the irony of WLC using that phrase 🤦.

  • @achooothanks
    @achooothanks Před 2 lety +1

    This is one of the very few channels I have notifications on for. Great work!

  • @Kvothe3
    @Kvothe3 Před 2 lety

    Can we add Trent Horn's and Majesty of Reason's response, to the playlist?