Guys... i have been following Mike Day and Dave Butler all year long... their content keeps getting better and richer the more I understand. Please keep bringing them on!
Just WoW! I will never look at Eve the same way. She was deceived even as the Evil One deceives today and then after the judgment of God, the evil one was left broken on the earth. No wonder he has such anger and hatred to those who worship God and the Son!
I thought that same thing. However it kept removing my posts and comments because CZcams doesn't like it when I say the catchphrase during the Trogdor song.
This winged serpant like being with fire sounds to me a lot like a... DRAGON. And now there are no dragons, just snakes who crawl on their bellies in the dust
Galatians 6:7, it states, "Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap." This emphasizes the principle that God’s laws and commandments are immutable and that actions have consequences. Satan’s counterfeits can include false teachings, imitations of spiritual experiences, and deceptive practices that mimic the outward forms of godliness but lack true power and authority (2 Timothy 3:5). In Doctrine and Covenants 132:7, it is stated that all covenants, contracts, bonds, obligations, and agreements must be made and entered into by God’s authority to be valid, illustrating the importance of divine authorization...
Ever again. See D&C 132:22. "This is eternal LIVES" (not "These are" or "eternal life") And v26, "Verily, verily, I say unto you, if a man marry a wife according to my word, and they are sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise, according to mine appointment, and he or she shall COMMIT ANY SIN or transgression of the new and everlasting covenant whatever, and all manner of blasphemies, and if they commit no murder wherein they shed innocent blood, yet they shall come forth in the first resurrection, AND ENTER INTO EXALTATION; but they shall 👉be destroyed in the flesh👈, and shall be delivered unto the buffetings of Satan unto the day of redemption, saith the Lord God." Feels a lot like the same process satan went through... no? Satans progression was halted because he is no longer able to ever become a mortal AGAIN. If not from previous mortal probation(s), where else do you think Satan, formally Lucifer, Son of the Morning, received his Priesthood, and all other blessings that he now was being stripped of?! This is the time to prepare to meet God (Elohim), because after every lifetime, we return and report to our Heavenly Parents, until we have gotten to the same level and stature of character of Christ that we may become a savior. Read it people, the King Follet Sermon. Joseph Smith taught this clearly. It is likely, though we are resurrected, we can choose (never forced) to lay down our exalted body, again to take up a mortal body, and go through another Mortal Probation to learn a different aspect and Character trait that Christ has, and indeed all Gods have, until we have learned them all and in full.
@csmusix The pattern of a "serpent" is symbolic. The symbol of a serpent represents mortality. The reason the serpent form symbolizes mortality is because the life of one as they pass through time looks like a snake from the perspective of eternity or timelessnes. So Lucifer apperears as a serpent to both deceive and to mock. And the serpent on the pole represents the mortality of the Redeemer that the Israelites were to look forward to. So when God curses Lucifer that he would crush his head, this means he will not receive a mortal existence. The head of the "mortal existence " is the birth or conception of the mortal body. And the curse that he will go upon his belly and lick up the dust means that Lucifer will not have power over entropy, rather he becomes an agent of entropy. When God says that He is a God of miracles, He is saying that he has full power over Entropy. The resurrection is the ultimate triumph over entropy. Etropic spaces are the places that the gods go to, to be tested and tried.
Angels don't hav3 wings they look like men read genisis 18 and 19 . The men in sidim told Lot nephew of Abraham to send out the angels si that qe may rape them . They had no idea they were asking for angels to be sent out .
@@ensenadorjones4224 he wasn't cast down yet pay attention to the temple video . the devil gets cast down after Adam and eve are cast out of the garden
@@unholywarrior9007 It's quite clear that Eve identifies Lucifer as the one cast down for rebellion before they interact with God when He returns to the garden with Adam and Eve hiding their nakedness. Paraphrased: "Eve, I want you to eat the fruit of this tree" "You come to persuade me to disobey Father?" "I've said nothing about Him. Here, eat this fruit so you can become like the Gods because that's how They did it." "I know thee now. Thou art Lucifer who was cast down for rebellion." "Ah, you're already beginning to see...." "Adam, Adam. Adam! Where art thou?" "We hid because we were naked" "Who told you you're naked? Did thou eatest of the fruit..?" "We were beguiled and we did eat it" "LUCIFER! Because that hast done this...(proceeds to give further judgement and punishment)..."
@@unholywarrior9007really? I did not know that. Where in the Scriptures does it say that. Because I’ve always been slightly confused on the chronological order of that. I always assumed that that happened in the pre-mortal existence when Satan was cast out of heaven with the 1/3.
Satan was a dragon in the pre-existence, a light-bearer, who held much power and prestige. His power and prestige turned into pride as he thought he had what it took to save mankind. He would save all mankind, his way, and ascend above the Father in glory and honor. He did not have what it took to become the Savior. For reasons not known to us, only the Savior had what it took to go through the atonement and not quit before the end, and to then navigate the cross, and to live a perfect life. Christ needed to accomplish this and we needed him to. Satan was not ready-only a certain type of intelligence/spirit could navigate the role of a redeemer and Satan was not it. The grandiosity of Satan caused him to rebel when his way was not chosen. 100% success was more important than agency and accountability, and the ends of the law. So Satan rebelled. This is where his wings got clipped and he got cast down with a 1/3 the hosts of heaven. Now he was on earth and he was a drake (or a lizard)-I think drake fits better as he was a dragon before. He cannot leave the earth but he still has some kind of power that he had before he beguiled Eve. Eve, unlike the other first mothers of a planet’s civilization, feels it is necessary to eat the fruit from the tree (of knowledge) even though God forbad. This creates a fallen planet, and natures of mankind so debased that they would kill their God - a serpent on a pole, lifted up, who would heal and save us. Why a serpent on a pole and not a lamb on a pole or a lion on a pole? What gave Christ the determination and ability to be this redeemer? So after Satan beguiles Eve, Father curses and causes him to all his days go upon his belly and eat dust. You cannot suddenly go on your belly if you were already on your belly. You cannot eat dust if you were already slithering. No, the drake had its legs removed and became a serpent, because of what he had done without permission - but NOT a serpent on a pole. That is the difference.I am not sure what loss of power the removal of legs represents. I have not been taught this. But it is significant. “With healing in his wings” to me-just my opinion- is Christ after the crucifixion (serpent on a pole), when Christ is resurrected. So what animal would represent Christ in the resurrected state -an eagle or a dragon (good dragon)? Think of the Asian culture and what animal do they celebrate that is powerful and regal and fierce and good? And the feathered serpent, what do the feathers represent ? Wings? So when you get wings and you get legs, what powers do those represent?
Wow. It seems as if I have always known the a snake was a representation of Jesus but never understand how that could be. This was amazing and answered so many things. Thank you and come back soon with more
To add a bit to it, the snake symbol is one to represent power, authority, kingship. Pharaoh's used to use a cobra as a scepter. A scepter in their hands showed power and authority. Satan by using the symbol of the snake tried to portrayed power and authority to beguiled Adam and Eve. He tried to usurpate God's kingship, power, and authority.
After listening to this I am super excited for my next reading of Genesis and the Pearl of Great Price. Dave Butler and Mike Day have made reading the scriptures much more interesting by helping me look for layers of meaning that I was not aware of before.
In Dungeons and Dragons, Asmodeus, the lord of the nine hells of Baator, disguises himself in humanoid form. In actuality, he’s a giant winged serpent whose wings were ripped off for divine betrayal and fell to the lowest pit. I knew that had to come from somewhere!
This image of the fall needs to be animated with a Metal version of a Hymn, like maybe "The Spirit of God like a Fire is Burning", playing in the background.
Part of the reason we have such a "milk toast" version of the fall of Adam and Eve *could* be because we are still dealing with the softy-softy version of Christ preached by medieval priests who were trying to de-legitimize the rule of brute force, and we still aren't ready for the real deal. Don't know, of course; just guessing.
@@jesshawkins6496 It’s interesting that ‘milquetoast’, meaning timid or shy, is a perfect parallel to the cut up toast in a bowl of milk that my mother used as a panacea for an upset stomach.
Will there be an Audiobook version of “In the Language of Adam” coming? And if so, will there be a pdf that will contain the QR codes from the book so us who don’t have a lot of sitting to read time, or just pay attention better listening, don’t miss out on the extra information therein?
ohmyheck! This is a book you will want to read. I have read Dave's previous books on the Book of Mormon and this one is easier to follow, however, you will want to be able to sit down and read it with your scriptures. But as I'm typing this, for the first run through of the book - you could just listen. I suppose. And then you might want to go back to the paper or kindle books to read the words and to annotate and cross reference with your scriptures.
After learning about seraphim I totally put 2 and 2 together about what the serpent in the garden was and it all made sense. Especially the curse that was put on it. So glad my thoughts are reflected by people I love and respect.
my question to anyone is did Lucifer's rebellion happen in the garden? Was his deception to eve what caused him to be cast down ultimately or did that happen before the garden?
@@ensenadorjones4224 It is both. Lucifer was cast out for rebellion. Then he attempted to frustrate the Father's plan by deceiving and beguiling Eve and Adam. He then received further punishment for doing this. In response Satan's rage further intensified and threatened God that he and his demons would possess the bodies of men and women. God then put in place the restriction that disallowed that possession (enmity). Satan then responded with the resolve to use a worldly system that is monetary/vanity-based to drive the people of the earth to all manner of sin. War, bloodshed, false doctrine, etc, etc.
@@ensenadorjones4224 Lucifer was cast out for rebellion in the council in our pre-earth life when our Father in Heaven presented His plan of salvation and chose Jesus to be the Savior. Everything that happened in the Garden of Eden put God's plan into action. Adam and Eve's part in our Father's plan was to bring mortality into the world. They were to be the first parents. Satan thought he was thwarting God's plan with his deception, but no, he became the temptation that allowed Eve to use her agency to choose. Thus making it possible for God to "bring to pass the immortality and eternal life of man". Moses 1:39
@@ensenadorjones4224 from the scriptures we understand that his rebellion happened in heaven, before Adam and Eve were placed in the garden. Him and his followers were cast out to earth, where Satan tempted Adam and Eve soon after they were placed on earth.
@@Silarias that's what I thought. I was confused by the way this video described Satan being stripped of his power and glory and sent to the earth. To crawl on his belly.
And when My Father saw his great pride, and that his wickedness and his evil-doing were complete, He commanded all the armies of heaven, saying, "Remove the writing in the hand of the proud one, strip ye off his armor, and cast ye him down upon the earth, for his time hath come...And my Father commanded them to bring a sharp reaping-knife, and to stab him therewith on this side and that, right through his body to the vertebrae of his shoulders, and he was unable to hold himself up. And straightway My Father commanded a mighty Cherubim, and he smote him, and cast him down from heaven upon the earth, because of his pride, and he broke his wings and his ribs and made helpless, and those whom he had brought with him became devils with him. - Discourse on Abbaton
In looking for the source of this, Coptic Martyrdoms by E Wallis Budge, I found out then Elder Nelson quoted another part of the Discourse on Abbaton in his April 2000 talk "The Creation."
That makes a lot of sense, and Moses' comment about his being darkness to him was extra insulting. Satan perhaps thought he could still imitate the Son and fool Moses like he did Eve. It explains why he throws a complete temper tantrum after, especially since it says he ranted upon the earth, perhaps like a limbless serpent thrashing about.
Off topic, but we were watching the BOM video where Alma and King Limhi all unite with King Mosiah's people in Zarahemla. I was like, "That totally looks like Brad Witbeck!" My kids were like, "Who?" And, I said, "One of my Ward Radio boys!" I had to look on IMDB to confirm! It was a fan-girl moment, for sure. I am a new-ish follower, but I remember seeing a very bearded Brad in an old video back in the Midnight Mormon days.
Shout out to Biella! I love that city! It was my first assignment in January 1993. I know those streets well and I know Dave did a lot of work on them. He is in my highest tier of smartest people I have ever known. Brilliant mind! Awesome man!
Awesome Y'all! This paints a whole different picture of the events in the garden for me! Oh, and I personally drove down to the Provo Temple demolition zone and asked very nicely for temple rocks and was completely denied! The supervisor said the Brethren didn't want people taking materials once dedicated to the Lord and selling them for personal gain. I can understand that, moneychangers and all. Just goes to prove what a bad entrepreneur I am! I would have just given them away! But you know, somebody would have tried to make bank from the items. Just thought I'd let you know that I tried.
This kind of reminds me of "The Garden Story" chapter in Hugh Nibley's book, "The Message of the Joseph Smith Papayri: An Egyption Endowment." In that chapter, the various Egyptian temple rites discuss punishing the deceiver by removing his arms, legs (not wings, necessarily), and posterity along with crushing his head. Seems to coincide pretty well with these thoughts. pp. 311-318. When realizing that Abraham spent a lot of time with Pharaoh, that Pharaoh desired the priesthood but was denied that privilege, and therefore sought to imitate it (Abraham 1:26-27), I guess these common threads should not be too surprising.
Two thoughts...the command from angelic messengers to "fear not" could mean do not "worship me"......2nd thought....when the serpent introduces himself to Eve, he is introducing himself as Jehovah, which is why Eve is confused when she asks why he is telling her to disobey Father.
But spell it 'milquetoast', since I'm pretty sure that's what he meant. Means weak sauce; we need to bring it back into our everyday vocabulary, 'cause it's an awesome descriptor.
Go check out some of the winged sun disk images and sculptures in Egypt, a religion that was meant to copy the ancient temple ceremony as per the book of Abraham. The winged sun disks often have TWO snakes whose bodies wrap around the winged sun.
I always understood wings as symbolic of the ability to move through the heavens. Even as a symbol it still works as Satan "fell" and was unable to move up to where he used to be.
But I bet they could appear with wings if they really wanted to . . . Just for awesome effect 😃. . . Not that an angel would need any greater awesome effect than his glorious self.
Mic drop on beguiled! I'd already worked out the Christ impersonation perspective and I knew the entire significance of what happened in the garden rested with the word beguiled. But I was missing all the intertwined subtleties of timings and depths of detail like seriphs. Going to stick my nose in my copy of the book again.
I think the symbolism is thus for Seraphim. The first wings are for knowledge, the second for being able to visit any plane, and the third for being able to create. The serpent means wisdom so it would be an angel full of wisdom. I may be wrong though. Wingd maybe also indicating such that they have forbidden to current mortals. Or at least the uninitiated.
I like the symbolism of the wings of the Seraphim. Referencing Isaiah 6:2 ... Knowledge has to do with the face, the senses, processing information for the brain or intellect. The feet, modesty, procreative elements (regalim), having to do with creative powers. And flying being freedom to move anywhere, the power of literal translation, even between the temporal and eternal realms.
If you live in Utah Valley, I'm doing a signing at Writ & Vision in Provo on Friday, June 14, at 7:00 pm. I also have events coming up in September in St George, Fond du Lac, El Paso, Las Cruces, and maybe in the Colonias.
This reminds me of a book I read on my mission in Ecuador. I don't remember tge title or the author, I only remember that it was a Bible dictionary type book written by someone who believes in the trinity. I only read a small but because I read it at a member's house while she finished cooking us lunch. Tge part I read was about angels, and one part said how angels would introduce themselves in a way similar to "angel-J", meaning angel of the LORD, or messenger of the LORD. The author then mentioned how the LORD in some places is called "J-E", which might make you think the LORD sent by God, showing two different beings. The author goes on with the trinity view that this is showing the duality of God, and the difference in his aspects. God was E, the creator aspect of God, and is now J, the savior aspect of God. With the restored gospel, I see this as Jehova of (being sent from) Elohim just like Jesus of the Father.
But why a serpent? I get the negative “slyness “ to represent Satan, but what are the positives to represent Jesus? I mean I understand that the positive version still has power (arms, wings, legs) …. Totally distracted now thinking about the Chinese dragon…
I think the Chinese dragon is closer to the image they were picturing. Serpents were also symbols of power and divinity in Egypt, which was a cousin culture to ancient Israel, we often forget that because we imagine them both "looking" different. I think one of the reasons (iirc, been a while) was because they were believed to be able to transit between the world of the dead and the living world and inhabited the world of spirits.
Opposition is necessary for growth and understanding. The serpent as a symbol embodies this principle, representing both the destructive power of Satan and the healing power of Christ (2 Nephi 2:11) The brass serpent teaches about Jesus Christ's atoning sacrifice. President Gordon B. Hinckley emphasized that the brass serpent was a type of Christ, illustrating the power of faith and the need to look to Christ for spiritual healing. Chinese Dragon represents power, strength, and sometimes wisdom that parallels the positive aspects of the serpent symbol. Christ's miracles, such as calming the storm and walking on water, demonstrate His control over nature, similar to the Chinese dragon's association with water and weather. prophets and leaders have often used various cultural symbols to teach about Christ. For example, they might draw on familiar symbols and stories to illustrate gospel principles, making the teachings more relatable to diverse audiences.
The serpent shape reminds me of the shape of a light wave, or sound or frequency. Instead of pulsing out radially like the sun's influence in all directions, a sine wave is cut cross-sectionally and and is 2D.
@@TheYgdsI also include Quetzalcoatl fun fact he was considered the patron God of their priesthood order of the Aztec he was also considered a God of wisdom and could represent death and resurrection.
26:33 the tie of temple covenants and Book of Mormon is found in Section 84: Oath and covenant of the priesthood, People get locked into this oath only to Men. It’s not. We all enter into these oaths and both wear the robes of the priesthood in the Temple. Read verse D&C 84:24-42 cross reference with 124:47 (God administers the oath in the temple, we make covenants) verse 42 he is confirming something on them at that time (these men are already M priesthood holders so it’s not being ordained- it something more) 84:54-57 ties into the Book of Mormon being part of this oath and covenant in some form.
3 insights I had while listening: 1. This reminded me of the parable of the wedding feast and Elder Bednars oct '22 talk about the being that showed up to the wedding feast without the wedding clothes on and what immediately happens to him reminds me of Satan being stripped of his wings. 2. The 6 wings, symbolically giving ability to move in the 6 directions of 3D space made me think of Christ descending below all things, coming to earth and taking upon himself the sins of the world. He volunterily took off 4 of the wings as he descended from glory and eternity to be confined by linear time (back to front.) Then when He was RAISED UP on the cross with "healing in His wings" He received the 4 wings back. His arms were outstretched like a scale or balance breaking the bands of Judgement (left to right).The person at His left rejecting Him, the person at His right heading towards paradise with Him. He was lifted up upon the cross and feet nailed to it (downward) connecting Him with the spirits in prison who had died and giving Him power to break the bands of death. A crown of thorns on His head as He lifted up His voice asking His father to forgive for we know not what we do, breaking the bands of Hell allowing us to ascend back into the presence with the father and be crowned His heirs. 3. Adam is told he was formed from dust and to dust he will return. Satan is told he will eat dust all the days of his life.
Do you remember that one time in the book of Genesis when the snake was up in the tree about to tempt Eve and he said, "Yall gonna make me lose my mind, up in here, up in here!"
@@asarg1776Thanks, I believe you are one of the few people out there demented enough to appreciate my demented humor. I'm glad I have one fan at least 😊
@@asarg1776 It came to me like a vision, the snake is 'up' a tree, he is also 'in' a tree. I had this vision of him singing to Eve. Unfortunately it is common for me to have semi-blasphemous visions like that.
@@asarg1776 Do you remember the Lollipop guild from the wizard of Oz? Whenever they sing that "Hello" song in primary I always sing it like the lollipop guild and Invision those three munchkins singing it. Last I read, the red lollipop guild guy was still alive and in his 90s. The very last munchkin. This was a few years ago, he may have passed.
REALLY hope this Ward Radio, and all other Latter-day Saint videocasts, pivot from talking goofy stuff to reporting on good acts and deeds from fellow Saints, and those following Christ's pure and simple teachings, and move away from silly stuff like "satan's wings."
Just consider that Moses 4 comes after Moses sees God and then Satan comes to deceive him and demand the Moses worships him (Satan). The Garden scene is replayed with Moses.
ah! that part was taken out of the new endowment. The old version has Eve asking Lucifer, what are those 'coverings' you have on? Then Satan pretends those are such and such basically wearing something to trick Eve that he is the Lord. Hmmm
The coverings symbolize Lucifer’s attempt to appear as something he is not, highlighting the idea that Satan’s deceptions often involve counterfeiting or mimicking true principles and divine authority. Eve’s question to Lucifer about his coverings represents a quest for understanding and discernment. It underscores the importance of seeking true knowledge and being cautious of deceptive appearances. The interaction teaches the principle of discernment-recognizing that not everything that appears righteous or divine truly is. Removing certain elements, such as the specific details about Lucifer’s coverings, might aim to focus more on the core principles and less on symbolic details that could be misinterpreted. Despite changes in particular details, the core principles and teachings of the endowment remain consistent. These include recognizing true divine authority, the need for personal righteousness and covenant keeping, and the significance of seeking and adhering to true knowledge and revelation. Relying on prayer, scripture study, and the guidance of the Holy Ghost helps in discerning truth from deception. Regular temple attendance and participation in ordinances strengthens spiritual understanding and commitment.
I had an institute teacher teach about Jesus’s symbol being a serpent, and then showed all the Egyptian symbolism for Christ worship. I cannot remember which teacher, I took so many classes. There are some gem of men hidden in the Logan institute.
That was awesome. I know some people want to hear the watered-down version of stories because they don't have to think hard or act. I know there are people who want to know and crave the mysteries of God. I for one crave the deeper meanings but don't always have people around me to help me see them.. thank you for sharing this. PS I bought the book and I'm buying it for my father stepfather and brothers who care for Father's Day
Absolutely loved it. But when He came to J S to introduce Jesus. Pre earth and earth description. It was as Man . Out into words what my simple heart thought but dared not speak❤ why would he have to come as a "serpent"...unless it's the only way Eve could be deceived. She's the best of us all! Just shows us how alert we must be by God's scriptures!
In Revelation 20:2 it says; 2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years, So it say's that the dragon, serpent and Satan or devil as the same being. So I look as the serpent in the garden of Eden was a dragon which had legs and wings but when God cursed it, it became a serpent. In Revelation 12 4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born. Who drew a third of the host of heaven? Christ said; 12 And whosoever shall exalt himself shall be abased; and he that shall humble himself shall be exalted. Satan tried to exalt himself above the stars of God. Isaiah 14:13-15 13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: 14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High. 15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit. To exalt himself above Adam he needed Adam to fall. To exalt himself above the stars of God his plan had to go forth so he would get the Glory. It says in the scriptures Satan spoke through the mouth of the serpent because it was the most subtle of all the beast of the field. What dose Subtle mean? Beguiling which means misleading by means of pleasant or alluring methods slyness. Eve did say she was beguiled so no surprise why Satan chose the dragon to allure Eve. The dragon having to now go upon his belly and eat dust is a physical way of abasing the dragon plus Lucifer was cast down, because he tried to exalt himself. I believe that Satan and the dragon was in on this together probably an oath was made between the two, like Cain. In pearl of great price it talks about the serpent and the devil as two distinct beings colluding together. 5 And now the serpent was more subtle than any beast of the field which I, the Lord God, had made. 6 And Satan put it into the heart of the serpent, (for he had drawn away many after him,) and he sought also to beguile Eve, for he knew not the mind of God, wherefore he sought to destroy the world. 7 And he said unto the woman: Yea, hath God said-Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden? (And he spake by the mouth of the serpent. Just my thoughts 🤔
Im getting a lot of LOTR Morgoth Sauran vibes and knowing how faithful a Catholic Tolkien was wouldn't it be funny if he was inspired by God to tell the history of the world but in a fictionalized way but with truths sprinkled in. Also what if the Dragons were just dinosaurs which is why they died out a punishment from God for siding with the devil.
i will say that the correct translation of Genesis, which we read in Moses comes across different then the genesis account and what these gentleman describe. in Moses 4:5 And now the serpent was more subtle than any beast of the field which I, the Lord God, had made. 6 And Satan put it into the heart of the serpent, (for he had drawn away many after him,) and he sought also to beguile Eve, for he knew not the mind of God, wherefore he sought to destroy the world. which by all means could still be that the serpent had wings but satan deceived Eve through the serpent in this account by Joseph Smith.
Loved the content! Question.. Aren't we taught in the church that Satan fell before we started to come to earth? That essentially we all voted on which plan we wanted to follow. It doesn't seem to read that way in the Moses account. Adam and Eve were already created before the conversation with Satan and Jesus in Moses chapter 3. Could it be in verse 3 where it talks about how Satan rebelled is not before we all started coming to Earth but during the garden scene where he is beguiling Eve? Also, Mike day really likes the book The unseen realm by Michael heisner and it seems that his interpretation of the scriptures is that Satan was part of God's counsel and that even in the Book of Job, God is talking with Satan about Job. His understanding is that Satan was cast down at a later time then what we seem to believe as a church. If I'm remembering the book correctly.
There is the fall from dragon to drake-cast to earth permanently for a long time. And there is the curse of losing legs and going on belly. I believe they symbolize loss of different powers.
Genesis, Revelation, winged serpent, dragon, fiery flying serpents, Moses' brass staff, Jesus on the Cross (Ankh/Tree of Life), and Quetzalcoatl. If you take the Hebrew words for serpent and Messiah, convert them to numbers, and add the numbers within each word, the total number for serpent = Messiah.
Yahweh Elohim = I am of the God's. Now, the name "I AM" finally makes sense to me.
Guys... i have been following Mike Day and Dave Butler all year long... their content keeps getting better and richer the more I understand.
Please keep bringing them on!
I love Dave Butler & Mike Day!
Just WoW! I will never look at Eve the same way. She was deceived even as the Evil One deceives today and then after the judgment of God, the evil one was left broken on the earth. No wonder he has such anger and hatred to those who worship God and the Son!
When they are describing the armed winged serpent, I just had TROGDOR going through my head.
ME TOOOOOO!!!😂
I thought that same thing. However it kept removing my posts and comments because CZcams doesn't like it when I say the catchphrase during the Trogdor song.
You mean, like a wing-a-ling dragon? 🐉
Well, Trogdor was a man. I mean, he was a dragon man. Ties in nicely with Revelations.
@@Rodno376 Right!?
This winged serpant like being with fire sounds to me a lot like a... DRAGON. And now there are no dragons, just snakes who crawl on their bellies in the dust
That makes so much more sense in the temple when God says He will not be mocked...another understanding of mocked is counterfeited.
Galatians 6:7, it states, "Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap." This emphasizes the principle that God’s laws and commandments are immutable and that actions have consequences. Satan’s counterfeits can include false teachings, imitations of spiritual experiences, and deceptive practices that mimic the outward forms of godliness but lack true power and authority (2 Timothy 3:5). In Doctrine and Covenants 132:7, it is stated that all covenants, contracts, bonds, obligations, and agreements must be made and entered into by God’s authority to be valid, illustrating the importance of divine authorization...
Also, all in favor of a Mike Day translation of the Bible from the original Hebrew & Greek, say, "aye..."
"AYE!"🙋🏼♀️
Aye!!!
Aye
Aye😅
@@Onimasoo4083 Aye
The crushing of Lucifer's head is the curse of preventing him from having a mortal body of his own.
Ever again. See D&C 132:22.
"This is eternal LIVES" (not "These are" or "eternal life")
And v26, "Verily, verily, I say unto you, if a man marry a wife according to my word, and they are sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise, according to mine appointment, and he or she shall COMMIT ANY SIN or transgression of the new and everlasting covenant whatever, and all manner of blasphemies, and if they commit no murder wherein they shed innocent blood, yet they shall come forth in the first resurrection, AND ENTER INTO EXALTATION; but they shall 👉be destroyed in the flesh👈, and shall be delivered unto the buffetings of Satan unto the day of redemption, saith the Lord God."
Feels a lot like the same process satan went through... no? Satans progression was halted because he is no longer able to ever become a mortal AGAIN. If not from previous mortal probation(s), where else do you think Satan, formally Lucifer, Son of the Morning, received his Priesthood, and all other blessings that he now was being stripped of?!
This is the time to prepare to meet God (Elohim), because after every lifetime, we return and report to our Heavenly Parents, until we have gotten to the same level and stature of character of Christ that we may become a savior. Read it people, the King Follet Sermon. Joseph Smith taught this clearly. It is likely, though we are resurrected, we can choose (never forced) to lay down our exalted body, again to take up a mortal body, and go through another Mortal Probation to learn a different aspect and Character trait that Christ has, and indeed all Gods have, until we have learned them all and in full.
interesting, explain please?
@csmusix The pattern of a "serpent" is symbolic. The symbol of a serpent represents mortality. The reason the serpent form symbolizes mortality is because the life of one as they pass through time looks like a snake from the perspective of eternity or timelessnes. So Lucifer apperears as a serpent to both deceive and to mock. And the serpent on the pole represents the mortality of the Redeemer that the Israelites were to look forward to.
So when God curses Lucifer that he would crush his head, this means he will not receive a mortal existence. The head of the "mortal existence " is the birth or conception of the mortal body.
And the curse that he will go upon his belly and lick up the dust means that Lucifer will not have power over entropy, rather he becomes an agent of entropy.
When God says that He is a God of miracles, He is saying that he has full power over Entropy. The resurrection is the ultimate triumph over entropy.
Etropic spaces are the places that the gods go to, to be tested and tried.
All in favor of Dave redoing the visuals for the Temple say, "aye!"
AYE!🙋🏼♀️🙋🏼♀️🙋🏼♀️
😂
Argh!
Huzzah!
Aye!
Angels don't hav3 wings they look like men read genisis 18 and 19 . The men in sidim told Lot nephew of Abraham to send out the angels si that qe may rape them . They had no idea they were asking for angels to be sent out .
Hum I can't type the 2 angels in Sodom looked like men
Wings are a symbol of power. So that would make sense that angels would take away his power and revoke his right to priesthood.
wings give one the ability to ascend to heaven. He can't ascend on his own and is outside of Christs atonement. He is cast down and has no power.
@@ensenadorjones4224 he wasn't cast down yet pay attention to the temple video . the devil gets cast down after Adam and eve are cast out of the garden
@@unholywarrior9007
It's quite clear that Eve identifies Lucifer as the one cast down for rebellion before they interact with God when He returns to the garden with Adam and Eve hiding their nakedness.
Paraphrased:
"Eve, I want you to eat the fruit of this tree"
"You come to persuade me to disobey Father?"
"I've said nothing about Him. Here, eat this fruit so you can become like the Gods because that's how They did it."
"I know thee now. Thou art Lucifer who was cast down for rebellion."
"Ah, you're already beginning to see...."
"Adam, Adam. Adam! Where art thou?"
"We hid because we were naked"
"Who told you you're naked? Did thou eatest of the fruit..?"
"We were beguiled and we did eat it"
"LUCIFER! Because that hast done this...(proceeds to give further judgement and punishment)..."
@@unholywarrior9007really? I did not know that. Where in the Scriptures does it say that. Because I’ve always been slightly confused on the chronological order of that. I always assumed that that happened in the pre-mortal existence when Satan was cast out of heaven with the 1/3.
Satan was a dragon in the pre-existence, a light-bearer, who held much power and prestige. His power and prestige turned into pride as he thought he had what it took to save mankind. He would save all mankind, his way, and ascend above the Father in glory and honor. He did not have what it took to become the Savior. For reasons not known to us, only the Savior had what it took to go through the atonement and not quit before the end, and to then navigate the cross, and to live a perfect life. Christ needed to accomplish this and we needed him to. Satan was not ready-only a certain type of intelligence/spirit could navigate the role of a redeemer and Satan was not it. The grandiosity of Satan caused him to rebel when his way was not chosen. 100% success was more important than agency and accountability, and the ends of the law. So Satan rebelled. This is where his wings got clipped and he got cast down with a 1/3 the hosts of heaven. Now he was on earth and he was a drake (or a lizard)-I think drake fits better as he was a dragon before. He cannot leave the earth but he still has some kind of power that he had before he beguiled Eve. Eve, unlike the other first mothers of a planet’s civilization, feels it is necessary to eat the fruit from the tree (of knowledge) even though God forbad. This creates a fallen planet, and natures of mankind so debased that they would kill their God - a serpent on a pole, lifted up, who would heal and save us. Why a serpent on a pole and not a lamb on a pole or a lion on a pole? What gave Christ the determination and ability to be this redeemer?
So after Satan beguiles Eve, Father curses and causes him to all his days go upon his belly and eat dust. You cannot suddenly go on your belly if you were already on your belly. You cannot eat dust if you were already slithering. No, the drake had its legs removed and became a serpent, because of what he had done without permission - but NOT a serpent on a pole. That is the difference.I am not sure what loss of power the removal of legs represents.
I have not been taught this. But it is significant.
“With healing in his wings” to me-just my opinion- is Christ after the crucifixion (serpent on a pole), when Christ is resurrected. So what animal would represent Christ in the resurrected state -an eagle or a dragon (good dragon)? Think of the Asian culture and what animal do they celebrate that is powerful and regal and fierce and good?
And the feathered serpent, what do the feathers represent ? Wings?
So when you get wings and you get legs, what powers do those represent?
Wow. It seems as if I have always known the a snake was a representation of Jesus but never understand how that could be. This was amazing and answered so many things. Thank you and come back soon with more
To add a bit to it, the snake symbol is one to represent power, authority, kingship.
Pharaoh's used to use a cobra as a scepter. A scepter in their hands showed power and authority. Satan by using the symbol of the snake tried to portrayed power and authority to beguiled Adam and Eve. He tried to usurpate God's kingship, power, and authority.
And Moses' staff became a snake that ate the priests snakes. He also raised up a staff with a serpent for the people to look and live.
After listening to this I am super excited for my next reading of Genesis and the Pearl of Great Price. Dave Butler and Mike Day have made reading the scriptures much more interesting by helping me look for layers of meaning that I was not aware of before.
That’s right. Put your own ideas and thoughts and crazy theories into the Bible. I’m sure that’s what God intended.
In Dungeons and Dragons, Asmodeus, the lord of the nine hells of Baator, disguises himself in humanoid form. In actuality, he’s a giant winged serpent whose wings were ripped off for divine betrayal and fell to the lowest pit. I knew that had to come from somewhere!
WOW! BOOM! 💥
That slaps hard.
I need a special on Elohim, Lord, LORD, Yahweh, YHWH and what the Old Testament distinctions are between Christ and Heavenly Father.
Amen!!
Great stuff! Thanks for letting Dave get the info out!
This image of the fall needs to be animated with a Metal version of a Hymn, like maybe "The Spirit of God like a Fire is Burning", playing in the background.
😂 I'd watch that
Me too! 😂
Part of the reason we have such a "milk toast" version of the fall of Adam and Eve *could* be because we are still dealing with the softy-softy version of Christ preached by medieval priests who were trying to de-legitimize the rule of brute force, and we still aren't ready for the real deal. Don't know, of course; just guessing.
Some of us babies still need milk toast. Yikes!😬
It's milquetoast, fyi. Hope that's helpful!
@@jesshawkins6496 It’s interesting that ‘milquetoast’, meaning timid or shy, is a perfect parallel to the cut up toast in a bowl of milk that my mother used as a panacea for an upset stomach.
@@Sagart999 lol, for sure!
Will there be an Audiobook version of “In the Language of Adam” coming? And if so, will there be a pdf that will contain the QR codes from the book so us who don’t have a lot of sitting to read time, or just pay attention better listening, don’t miss out on the extra information therein?
I'd buy the audio version
ohmyheck! This is a book you will want to read. I have read Dave's previous books on the Book of Mormon and this one is easier to follow, however, you will want to be able to sit down and read it with your scriptures. But as I'm typing this, for the first run through of the book - you could just listen. I suppose. And then you might want to go back to the paper or kindle books to read the words and to annotate and cross reference with your scriptures.
After learning about seraphim I totally put 2 and 2 together about what the serpent in the garden was and it all made sense. Especially the curse that was put on it. So glad my thoughts are reflected by people I love and respect.
my question to anyone is did Lucifer's rebellion happen in the garden? Was his deception to eve what caused him to be cast down ultimately or did that happen before the garden?
@@ensenadorjones4224
It is both. Lucifer was cast out for rebellion. Then he attempted to frustrate the Father's plan by deceiving and beguiling Eve and Adam. He then received further punishment for doing this. In response Satan's rage further intensified and threatened God that he and his demons would possess the bodies of men and women. God then put in place the restriction that disallowed that possession (enmity). Satan then responded with the resolve to use a worldly system that is monetary/vanity-based to drive the people of the earth to all manner of sin. War, bloodshed, false doctrine, etc, etc.
@@ensenadorjones4224 Lucifer was cast out for rebellion in the council in our pre-earth life when our Father in Heaven presented His plan of salvation and chose Jesus to be the Savior. Everything that happened in the Garden of Eden put God's plan into action. Adam and Eve's part in our Father's plan was to bring mortality into the world. They were to be the first parents. Satan thought he was thwarting God's plan with his deception, but no, he became the temptation that allowed Eve to use her agency to choose. Thus making it possible for God to "bring to pass the immortality and eternal life of man". Moses 1:39
@@ensenadorjones4224 from the scriptures we understand that his rebellion happened in heaven, before Adam and Eve were placed in the garden. Him and his followers were cast out to earth, where Satan tempted Adam and Eve soon after they were placed on earth.
@@Silarias that's what I thought. I was confused by the way this video described Satan being stripped of his power and glory and sent to the earth. To crawl on his belly.
And when My Father saw his great pride, and that his wickedness and his evil-doing were complete, He commanded all the armies of heaven, saying, "Remove the writing in the hand of the proud one, strip ye off his armor, and cast ye him down upon the earth, for his time hath come...And my Father commanded them to bring a sharp reaping-knife, and to stab him therewith on this side and that, right through his body to the vertebrae of his shoulders, and he was unable to hold himself up. And straightway My Father commanded a mighty Cherubim, and he smote him, and cast him down from heaven upon the earth, because of his pride, and he broke his wings and his ribs and made helpless, and those whom he had brought with him became devils with him. - Discourse on Abbaton
In looking for the source of this, Coptic Martyrdoms by E Wallis Budge, I found out then Elder Nelson quoted another part of the Discourse on Abbaton in his April 2000 talk "The Creation."
Great, exciting discussion.
Love Hayden's understated shirt with "fear not." in all lower case on front.
Sounds like a reversal of the initiatory.
Moses 1:19 Satan demands to be worshiped as the "Only Begotten." Possible connection here?
That makes a lot of sense, and Moses' comment about his being darkness to him was extra insulting. Satan perhaps thought he could still imitate the Son and fool Moses like he did Eve. It explains why he throws a complete temper tantrum after, especially since it says he ranted upon the earth, perhaps like a limbless serpent thrashing about.
Yes!!
@@TheYgds We call that seen Satan's Kylo Ren tantrum.
Off topic, but we were watching the BOM video where Alma and King Limhi all unite with King Mosiah's people in Zarahemla. I was like, "That totally looks like Brad Witbeck!" My kids were like, "Who?" And, I said, "One of my Ward Radio boys!" I had to look on IMDB to confirm! It was a fan-girl moment, for sure. I am a new-ish follower, but I remember seeing a very bearded Brad in an old video back in the Midnight Mormon days.
I did the exact same thing!! Where in Canada is Brad from?
Me too!! 😅
Yea! I just realized that Brad is Mosiah! I was today years old.....
Funny aside: I just realized that Brad is king Mosiah.hahahhahaha!
Amazing stuff. I’m going to have to watch this again to fully comprehend it
Shout out to Biella! I love that city! It was my first assignment in January 1993. I know those streets well and I know Dave did a lot of work on them. He is in my highest tier of smartest people I have ever known. Brilliant mind! Awesome man!
Heavy!
30,000 SUBSCRIBERS!!!!!🎉🎉 🥳🎈 🎈🎉🎉🎉
All of them just superfluous after Wes... 29,999 Wes wannabes.
According to the shroud of Turin, Jesus was wearing a belt made from a viper when he was crucified
When he was crucified or when He was buried?
Always a blast when Dave is on the show.
Come on David. We NEED your temple books on audible.
Awesome Y'all! This paints a whole different picture of the events in the garden for me! Oh, and I personally drove down to the Provo Temple demolition zone and asked very nicely for temple rocks and was completely denied! The supervisor said the Brethren didn't want people taking materials once dedicated to the Lord and selling them for personal gain. I can understand that, moneychangers and all. Just goes to prove what a bad entrepreneur I am! I would have just given them away! But you know, somebody would have tried to make bank from the items. Just thought I'd let you know that I tried.
This kind of reminds me of "The Garden Story" chapter in Hugh Nibley's book, "The Message of the Joseph Smith Papayri: An Egyption Endowment." In that chapter, the various Egyptian temple rites discuss punishing the deceiver by removing his arms, legs (not wings, necessarily), and posterity along with crushing his head. Seems to coincide pretty well with these thoughts. pp. 311-318. When realizing that Abraham spent a lot of time with Pharaoh, that Pharaoh desired the priesthood but was denied that privilege, and therefore sought to imitate it (Abraham 1:26-27), I guess these common threads should not be too surprising.
Check out the Ancient traditions podcast. It dives into this even more. Good listen.
Yes!!!!
I keep on learning.
This into got me head banging big time 👊🏼
Two thoughts...the command from angelic messengers to "fear not" could mean do not "worship me"......2nd thought....when the serpent introduces himself to Eve, he is introducing himself as Jehovah, which is why Eve is confused when she asks why he is telling her to disobey Father.
He was even wearing an emblem of his power and priesthoods, wasn't he ...
Both of these are great insights!
WHAT AN INTRO! WOOOO!!
Okay, this was actually really cool.
So good!! I can’t wait for more!!
Waiting for my "How did we end up with this milk toast version?" Ward Radio T-shirt. 😂
But spell it 'milquetoast', since I'm pretty sure that's what he meant. Means weak sauce; we need to bring it back into our everyday vocabulary, 'cause it's an awesome descriptor.
Go check out some of the winged sun disk images and sculptures in Egypt, a religion that was meant to copy the ancient temple ceremony as per the book of Abraham. The winged sun disks often have TWO snakes whose bodies wrap around the winged sun.
The scene described by Dave Butler sounds an awful lot like the opening to the video game "Soul Reaver" and it's kinda blowing my mind right now.
MIKE DAY!!!! IN THE HOUSE!
Remember that symbolism isn't always literal. Even if angels were represented as winged... we know they look like people in natural, true form.
I always understood wings as symbolic of the ability to move through the heavens. Even as a symbol it still works as Satan "fell" and was unable to move up to where he used to be.
I think there is a reality to this symbolism, too.
But I bet they could appear with wings if they really wanted to . . . Just for awesome effect 😃. . . Not that an angel would need any greater awesome effect than his glorious self.
Wings are not just a symbol of moving, but also a symbol of action.
There may be in fact winged human like beings in heaven???
.WOW, thanks for the Kindle version of the book.
Mic drop on beguiled!
I'd already worked out the Christ impersonation perspective and I knew the entire significance of what happened in the garden rested with the word beguiled. But I was missing all the intertwined subtleties of timings and depths of detail like seriphs.
Going to stick my nose in my copy of the book again.
I love this kind of stuff.
Would have loved to hear Mike Day defend his source theory.
Love this!!!
One of my fav guests
This for me adds new meaning to the phrase ‘God will not be mocked’… isn’t one of the definitions of to mock ‘to imitate or to mimick’?
I think it's amazing! Thank you! ❤
I think the symbolism is thus for Seraphim. The first wings are for knowledge, the second for being able to visit any plane, and the third for being able to create. The serpent means wisdom so it would be an angel full of wisdom.
I may be wrong though.
Wingd maybe also indicating such that they have forbidden to current mortals. Or at least the uninitiated.
I like the symbolism of the wings of the Seraphim. Referencing Isaiah 6:2 ... Knowledge has to do with the face, the senses, processing information for the brain or intellect. The feet, modesty, procreative elements (regalim), having to do with creative powers. And flying being freedom to move anywhere, the power of literal translation, even between the temporal and eternal realms.
Yes and if you had an evil seraphim having all of his wings taken from him, what does he have left? Wisdom or cunning.
David I got my copy of your book, but I need an autograph! 😂 Hayden was going to help get me one. 🤨😐😑😬🤣😅
Me too.!
If you live in Utah Valley, I'm doing a signing at Writ & Vision in Provo on Friday, June 14, at 7:00 pm.
I also have events coming up in September in St George, Fond du Lac, El Paso, Las Cruces, and maybe in the Colonias.
Come to AZ! There would be a ton of folks that would love to come!!!!!
@@christireay2605 I'm up for it. Let's find a place and time.
God is omnipotent, but I think we all have no real grasp on just how bad-A He and all of the angels really are.
This was a lot of fun :)
This reminds me of a book I read on my mission in Ecuador. I don't remember tge title or the author, I only remember that it was a Bible dictionary type book written by someone who believes in the trinity. I only read a small but because I read it at a member's house while she finished cooking us lunch. Tge part I read was about angels, and one part said how angels would introduce themselves in a way similar to "angel-J", meaning angel of the LORD, or messenger of the LORD. The author then mentioned how the LORD in some places is called "J-E", which might make you think the LORD sent by God, showing two different beings. The author goes on with the trinity view that this is showing the duality of God, and the difference in his aspects. God was E, the creator aspect of God, and is now J, the savior aspect of God. With the restored gospel, I see this as Jehova of (being sent from) Elohim just like Jesus of the Father.
watching.
Notice that God commanded Adam to not eat. Eve was created AFTER that! This is another whole podcast discussion!!!!
But why a serpent? I get the negative “slyness “ to represent Satan, but what are the positives to represent Jesus? I mean I understand that the positive version still has power (arms, wings, legs) …. Totally distracted now thinking about the Chinese dragon…
I think the Chinese dragon is closer to the image they were picturing. Serpents were also symbols of power and divinity in Egypt, which was a cousin culture to ancient Israel, we often forget that because we imagine them both "looking" different. I think one of the reasons (iirc, been a while) was because they were believed to be able to transit between the world of the dead and the living world and inhabited the world of spirits.
I think the main "positive" characteristic of a serpent is the power of regeneration - shedding its skin and being reborn into a "new" body
Opposition is necessary for growth and understanding. The serpent as a symbol embodies this principle, representing both the destructive power of Satan and the healing power of Christ (2 Nephi 2:11) The brass serpent teaches about Jesus Christ's atoning sacrifice. President Gordon B. Hinckley emphasized that the brass serpent was a type of Christ, illustrating the power of faith and the need to look to Christ for spiritual healing. Chinese Dragon represents power, strength, and sometimes wisdom that parallels the positive aspects of the serpent symbol. Christ's miracles, such as calming the storm and walking on water, demonstrate His control over nature, similar to the Chinese dragon's association with water and weather. prophets and leaders have often used various cultural symbols to teach about Christ. For example, they might draw on familiar symbols and stories to illustrate gospel principles, making the teachings more relatable to diverse audiences.
The serpent shape reminds me of the shape of a light wave, or sound or frequency. Instead of pulsing out radially like the sun's influence in all directions, a sine wave is cut cross-sectionally and and is 2D.
@@TheYgdsI also include Quetzalcoatl fun fact he was considered the patron God of their priesthood order of the Aztec he was also considered a God of wisdom and could represent death and resurrection.
26:33 the tie of temple covenants and Book of Mormon is found in Section 84: Oath and covenant of the priesthood, People get locked into this oath only to Men. It’s not. We all enter into these oaths and both wear the robes of the priesthood in the Temple. Read verse D&C 84:24-42 cross reference with 124:47 (God administers the oath in the temple, we make covenants) verse 42 he is confirming something on them at that time (these men are already M priesthood holders so it’s not being ordained- it something more) 84:54-57 ties into the Book of Mormon being part of this oath and covenant in some form.
Love it love it love it
3 insights I had while listening:
1. This reminded me of the parable of the wedding feast and Elder Bednars oct '22 talk about the being that showed up to the wedding feast without the wedding clothes on and what immediately happens to him reminds me of Satan being stripped of his wings.
2. The 6 wings, symbolically giving ability to move in the 6 directions of 3D space made me think of Christ descending below all things, coming to earth and taking upon himself the sins of the world. He volunterily took off 4 of the wings as he descended from glory and eternity to be confined by linear time (back to front.) Then when He was RAISED UP on the cross with "healing in His wings" He received the 4 wings back. His arms were outstretched like a scale or balance breaking the bands of Judgement (left to right).The person at His left rejecting Him, the person at His right heading towards paradise with Him. He was lifted up upon the cross and feet nailed to it (downward) connecting Him with the spirits in prison who had died and giving Him power to break the bands of death. A crown of thorns on His head as He lifted up His voice asking His father to forgive for we know not what we do, breaking the bands of Hell allowing us to ascend back into the presence with the father and be crowned His heirs.
3. Adam is told he was formed from dust and to dust he will return. Satan is told he will eat dust all the days of his life.
Coolest intro ever!!!!!!🎉
So Legacy of Kain: Soul Reaver is canon now? Let’s do it
Dave, if you see this- Toad says hi.
2:12 eerie how that make sense now.
Do you remember that one time in the book of Genesis when the snake was up in the tree about to tempt Eve and he said, "Yall gonna make me lose my mind, up in here, up in here!"
😂
@@asarg1776Thanks, I believe you are one of the few people out there demented enough to appreciate my demented humor. I'm glad I have one fan at least 😊
@@wes2176 Lol. I got it alright and it’s been stuck in my head ever since. So thanks for that 😅
@@asarg1776 It came to me like a vision, the snake is 'up' a tree, he is also 'in' a tree. I had this vision of him singing to Eve. Unfortunately it is common for me to have semi-blasphemous visions like that.
@@asarg1776 Do you remember the Lollipop guild from the wizard of Oz? Whenever they sing that "Hello" song in primary I always sing it like the lollipop guild and Invision those three munchkins singing it.
Last I read, the red lollipop guild guy was still alive and in his 90s. The very last munchkin. This was a few years ago, he may have passed.
Does anyone have the link to their previous live steam conversation?
"angles do not have wings" but Seraphim are different from angels
Mental Adam bomb. That was epic!
Wheres Kwaku been?
REALLY hope this Ward Radio, and all other Latter-day Saint videocasts, pivot from talking goofy stuff to reporting on good acts and deeds from fellow Saints, and those following Christ's pure and simple teachings, and move away from silly stuff like "satan's wings."
Aye!
Just consider that Moses 4 comes after Moses sees God and then Satan comes to deceive him and demand the Moses worships him (Satan). The Garden scene is replayed with Moses.
This made sense when checking out the mayan god, a winged serpent. Lucifer was an unwinged serpent. Mayan's met Christ after he was ressurected.
ah! that part was taken out of the new endowment. The old version has Eve asking Lucifer, what are those 'coverings' you have on? Then Satan pretends those are such and such basically wearing something to trick Eve that he is the Lord. Hmmm
I remember that! I wish that part were still in there. I thought it was significant.
The coverings symbolize Lucifer’s attempt to appear as something he is not, highlighting the idea that Satan’s deceptions often involve counterfeiting or mimicking true principles and divine authority. Eve’s question to Lucifer about his coverings represents a quest for understanding and discernment. It underscores the importance of seeking true knowledge and being cautious of deceptive appearances. The interaction teaches the principle of discernment-recognizing that not everything that appears righteous or divine truly is. Removing certain elements, such as the specific details about Lucifer’s coverings, might aim to focus more on the core principles and less on symbolic details that could be misinterpreted. Despite changes in particular details, the core principles and teachings of the endowment remain consistent. These include recognizing true divine authority, the need for personal righteousness and covenant keeping, and the significance of seeking and adhering to true knowledge and revelation. Relying on prayer, scripture study, and the guidance of the Holy Ghost helps in discerning truth from deception. Regular temple attendance and participation in ordinances strengthens spiritual understanding and commitment.
Truth and Error hopefully because discernible!
👍👍🇵🇭
Awesome! The symbolic visualizations are profound.
Can we get a ward radio hosting Mike Day and Sam Shamoun? That would be very entertaining.
I had an institute teacher teach about Jesus’s symbol being a serpent, and then showed all the Egyptian symbolism for Christ worship. I cannot remember which teacher, I took so many classes. There are some gem of men hidden in the Logan institute.
I need to not hear "rock on" ever again.
Well you're no fun.😅
@@michellewoodland1914 true 🤣
23:30 recall "The same which has been done" on other earth's. When the wings were removed, that ability to go elsewhere is now gone.
That was awesome. I know some people want to hear the watered-down version of stories because they don't have to think hard or act. I know there are people who want to know and crave the mysteries of God. I for one crave the deeper meanings but don't always have people around me to help me see them.. thank you for sharing this. PS I bought the book and I'm buying it for my father stepfather and brothers who care for Father's Day
Absolutely loved it. But when He came to J S to introduce Jesus. Pre earth and earth description. It was as Man . Out into words what my simple heart thought but dared not speak❤ why would he have to come as a "serpent"...unless it's the only way Eve could be deceived. She's the best of us all! Just shows us how alert we must be by God's scriptures!
In Revelation 20:2 it says;
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
So it say's that the dragon, serpent and Satan or devil as the same being. So I look as the serpent in the garden of Eden was a dragon which had legs and wings but when God cursed it, it became a serpent.
In Revelation 12
4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born. Who drew a third of the host of heaven?
Christ said;
12 And whosoever shall exalt himself shall be abased; and he that shall humble himself shall be exalted.
Satan tried to exalt himself above the stars of God.
Isaiah 14:13-15
13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: 14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High. 15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.
To exalt himself above Adam he needed Adam to fall. To exalt himself above the stars of God his plan had to go forth so he would get the Glory. It says in the scriptures Satan spoke through the mouth of the serpent because it was the most subtle of all the beast of the field. What dose Subtle mean? Beguiling which means misleading by means of pleasant or alluring methods slyness.
Eve did say she was beguiled so no surprise why Satan chose the dragon to allure Eve.
The dragon having to now go upon his belly and eat dust is a physical way of abasing the dragon plus Lucifer was cast down, because he tried to exalt himself. I believe that Satan and the dragon was in on this together probably an oath was made between the two, like Cain.
In pearl of great price it talks about the serpent and the devil as two distinct beings colluding together.
5 And now the serpent was more subtle than any beast of the field which I, the Lord God, had made. 6 And Satan put it into the heart of the serpent, (for he had drawn away many after him,) and he sought also to beguile Eve, for he knew not the mind of God, wherefore he sought to destroy the world. 7 And he said unto the woman: Yea, hath God said-Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden? (And he spake by the mouth of the serpent.
Just my thoughts 🤔
Im getting a lot of LOTR Morgoth Sauran vibes and knowing how faithful a Catholic Tolkien was wouldn't it be funny if he was inspired by God to tell the history of the world but in a fictionalized way but with truths sprinkled in.
Also what if the Dragons were just dinosaurs which is why they died out a punishment from God for siding with the devil.
@@solisprime2669 possibility!
That makes so much more sense!
Good job, this was an interesting one.
I'm disappointed. Not one Samuel L. Jackson Snakes on a Pole joke?
Wait....What!? 1:09
Elohim was a winged serpent?
i will say that the correct translation of Genesis, which we read in Moses comes across different then the genesis account and what these gentleman describe. in Moses 4:5 And now the serpent was more subtle than any beast of the field which I, the Lord God, had made.
6 And Satan put it into the heart of the serpent, (for he had drawn away many after him,) and he sought also to beguile Eve, for he knew not the mind of God, wherefore he sought to destroy the world.
which by all means could still be that the serpent had wings but satan deceived Eve through the serpent in this account by Joseph Smith.
I guess I need to buy another book! This is awesome!
This is my new favorite video on CZcams. And it will remain my favorite until the next video of Mike Day and David Butler on Ward Radio. 😆
Loved the content! Question.. Aren't we taught in the church that Satan fell before we started to come to earth? That essentially we all voted on which plan we wanted to follow. It doesn't seem to read that way in the Moses account. Adam and Eve were already created before the conversation with Satan and Jesus in Moses chapter 3. Could it be in verse 3 where it talks about how Satan rebelled is not before we all started coming to Earth but during the garden scene where he is beguiling Eve?
Also, Mike day really likes the book The unseen realm by Michael heisner and it seems that his interpretation of the scriptures is that Satan was part of God's counsel and that even in the Book of Job, God is talking with Satan about Job. His understanding is that Satan was cast down at a later time then what we seem to believe as a church. If I'm remembering the book correctly.
There is the fall from dragon to drake-cast to earth permanently for a long time.
And there is the curse of losing legs and going on belly. I believe they symbolize loss of different powers.
Genesis, Revelation, winged serpent, dragon, fiery flying serpents, Moses' brass staff, Jesus on the Cross (Ankh/Tree of Life), and Quetzalcoatl. If you take the Hebrew words for serpent and Messiah, convert them to numbers, and add the numbers within each word, the total number for serpent = Messiah.