8 BIGGEST RULES MISTAKES!! Golf Monthly
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- čas přidán 20. 07. 2024
- ► Neil Tappin and Jezz Ellwood talk through the 8 biggest rules mistakes including what you do when you drop and where to tee off from!
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I really appreciate videos like these. Attention to details is something I love and I enjoyed learning more about seemingly small details about the game.
Always nice to hear Jezz chat about the rules and making it simpler to understand
more of this please, excellent work thank you
Played This course a couple of years ago, I holed by 3rd shot on this Par 5.Absolutely beautiful golf course.
Great job!! I really enjoyed the information on the rules.
I’ve played with people that every fairway stroke they pick their ball up to identify it. Even if making it the ball first it never seems to be replaced as deep in the grass after being picked-up and replaced as where it originally laid when found. Constantly improving their lay, but apparently within the rules.
Fairway grass is usually super short. How can you get the ball any deeper than just on top?
Excellent video, i learnt a couple of things
Thank you! Great advice! 🙏
Great video …reading the rule book is quite often very confusing for me so having someone explain the rules to me is much clearer…👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼
Good quality~and lesson Thanks~
Loved the video. One thing on nearest point of relief that should have been mentioned is that it can be totally different if you're right or left handed. I the case given, a left handed person would have been on the green side of the cart path.
I looked at what "Thunda watch" said in reply to a comment on this subject. "Thunda'" said the nearest "reference point" of relief in this circumstance, should be identified using the club that is intended to be used for the stroke. The one club-length area of relief is then measured using the longest club in the bag. I believe, then one may change which club will be used to play the stroke.
Brilliant video. I’m going to watch it a few times to memorise the content !
Very well explained situations, many of which I'm sure most of us will have come across. I must admit I'd not thought about that last one of declaring a ball lost. I don't recall ever choosing to do that! As you said, though, if a player wishes not to play the original ball then simply "reloading" without declaring a provisional (resulting in the appropriate "stroke & distance" penalty) will ensure the original ball is no longer in play, even if it is later found. Hard luck if it turns out to be in a great lie! That is, of course, why it is so important to be clear about declaring a provisional ball before playing it. Worth a mention, perhaps, is that it is wise to use a differently numbered or marked ball for the provisional so it cannot be confused with the original ball if the two end up in the same general area!
It's great to see Royal Ashdown again. I played there many, many years ago with your very own Rob Smith. Fond memories!
Excellent video!
Great video: very informative and should be viewed by all golfers. I must mention one inaccuracy, though. It is highly advisable, but not absolutely compulsory, to use the words ‘provisional ball’ when playing a provisional ball, Rules interpretation 18.3b/2 refers.
Great video
About the lost ball, although you can’t declare it “lost”, you always have the option to declare it “unplayable”, especially when you are familiar with the course, knowing you won’t be able to play from that given position. So, you can immediately play another ball, if you decide not to go and search for it.
That's correct..
And then you are only taking a 1 stroke penalty... swinging 2 now instead of 3 for the provisional.
@@garyco766 no you are still hitting 3.
@@johnnyutah482 sorry, meant hitting 3 instead of 4. The provision was 3 off the tee.
@@garyco766 yes either way you are hitting 3 off the tee
Sometimes etiquette regarding the rules is the best rule. Especially if it is accidental or the person is new to golf. (eg tell them before if you see they are in front of the tee markers
Absolutely always try to guide if you are more familiar with the rules. Saves a lot of grief
Nearest Point of Relief: I always try to bring a worthwhile perspective to others about this rule, you have to take relief if you pick up your ball. Since the nearest point might not be a particularly good lie, could be in a ditch, tall grass etc. It's always worth it to figure out your point of relief before you pick up your ball, because you can't just put it back down, that would be a penalty. If the nearest point is a terrible place to drop it, sometimes it's better to just hit it from the road instead, which you can't do if the first thing you do is pick up the ball.
If someone forced me to put my relief shot in the bushes that would be the last time I play with them
Hi there Neil....is there a relief from edging groove of a green....if there is what the proper procedure coz I've seen golfer rolling the ball back with one roll n some placing it within one score card back of the groove while other placing it on the green but not nearer the hole...
Whatever...the 30 handicapper I’m behind on Saturday morning should read all the rules and CAREFULLY consider ALL POSSIBLE OPTIONS! No hurry...we will wait...chunk...repeat...drop...chunk...repeat! It’s great fun to watch as my back muscles stiffen over the 45 minutes between shots!
I watched 3 different videos with Jess explaining the rules.
He showed us about making a drop.
But , I show him drop the ball from 3 different heights ( locations ).
One was from the height of the shoulder .
Two was about waist height ( belt ).
Three was about knee height , with him bending over.
So , which one is correct ?
Also , does one of the people playing in his group have to watch him do this to make sure it is done correctly and that the rules are followed !!
Amateur couch golfer.
Cheers Guy.
Toronto , Ontario , Canada.
EXCELLENT Review
How about rules for water hazard, unplayable lie and casual water. A good video would be weird events in golf like ball stuck in flag, playing the wrong ball, hitting another ball by mistake, hitting equipment, and any other unusual stuff that could occur on the course.
Again, excellent video
Neil. very informative added benefit would have been advise what the penalties are for breaching these rules
Thanks Mark and noted. Will keep that in mind for future rules vids
One I always see is when putting in a scramble. First person misses say a birdie put and taps in a par, and then the second person goes for their team's birdie.
Rules of golf do not address "scramble" games. That is a manufactured format and the rules about putting can be whatever the tournament organizer allows.
Once the ball is holed, its holed.
Very clarifying video. It does leave me with one question to which I probably know the answer already, just want to make sure. If you play your 2nd ball from the tee I assume it is automatically stroke 2, right?
If your tee shot is lost and you tee up another one, you're actually hitting shot #3. It's a 1 shot penalty stroke. I always think of it this way... When counting my strokes for a hole, I count the action of putting the ball down with my hand as a stroke.
@@mikeh1817 Thanks, that is very helpfull. I am going to use that rule.
Thanks.
I understand that there has been clarification of the provisional ball rule, you don't have to say provisional it is sufficient to say I'll hit another just in case or I'll hit another as I'm not sure
Should of also talked a bout the cart path relief is different if you are a left handed or right handed , in your example looks like a left handed golfers closest point of relief may of been to the right on the short grass.
Hello gents, in your last example regarding the inability to simply declare a ball "lost" without looking for it - in such an instance am I correct in assuming that a player would not have the right at all to pick it up - ie the first ball must wholly be abandoned if one hits their second shot without specifically declaring it to be their provisional?
Please clarify the lost ball rule. If I hit a ball into some bad rough and do not want to find my ball, my understanding from your video, is that I can then state that I am playing another ball (no mention of a provisional) and that ball then becomes the ball in play. This would, in effect, prevent any other players from searching for my ball. Am I correct?
I've been looking everywhere for a definitive answer to this question... What constitutes the golf ball moving when removing loose impediments. I removed some twigs near my ball and it "jiggled" without moving from its spot. Does that constitute a nice and therefore a penalty?
If you're playing with a group of friends and are this strict about the rules, you probably won't get invited out next time.
Depends on your handicap. I know the group I play with wants to have a true and honest score.
That's what I was thinking. Obviously tournament rules, but they treat this like "this is how you play golf"... my rules: ready golf, play the ball up everywhere, how many mulligans? Lol
Actually playing with someone who is 'a bit hazy' on the rules can be a complete pain in the bum. If things are done correctly no one can have any complaints
There are always different types of friends who play differently so if they are your friends you should know who they are and play accordingly. As for myself I always play by the rules but again if your group of friends allow for free relief for a better lie, I take advantage of that. Just like I have friends who play from red tees because they are older and I don't like to since I am a single handicap but since I drop money for skins, greenies (closest to the pin on par 3's) and low net, I play the same tees and they don't complain. I look at it as tuning my short game. When I play at a muni golf course and join up with players also on standby, I don't care how they play, I just play my game and by the rules.
When you play a pick up game of basketball do your friends allow you to take three or four steps after dribbling?
Teeing up at the wrong box is more likely than teeing up over the line. My marker hit off from the ‘tiger’ tee instead of the regular tee on the 17th. He called it himself. Even though he was 10 metres further back, still took his 2 strokes like the champ he is.
With it being winter a lot of people play lift, clean and replace what are the rules surrounding this? Great video though 👍
Hello Jonathan - yes, many clubs will adopt a Local Rule for preferred lies (often called Winter rules ) to help with the fair playing of the game outside of the main season. Here is the sample Local Rule for this from The R&A's website. As you can see, clubs are able to specify the relief area, but nearly all that we've played at have been 6 inches. Hope this helps...
Model Local Rule E-3
"When a player's ball lies in a part of the general area cut to fairway height or less [or identify a specific area such as 'on the fairway of the 6th hole'], the player may take free relief once by placing the original ball or another ball in and playing it from this relief area:
Reference Point: Spot of the original ball.
Size of Relief Area Measured from Reference Point: [Specify size of relief area, such as one club-length, one scorecard length or 6 inches] from the reference point, but with these limits:
Limits on Location of Relief Area:
Must not be nearer the hole than the reference point, and
Must be in the general area.
In proceeding under this Local Rule, the player must choose a spot to place the ball and use the procedures for replacing a ball under Rules 14.2b(2) and 14.2e.
good stuff... Have you done a video on GOLF ETIQUETTE? i.e distractions on teebox or standing 8 feet behind you as you tee-off :-) and same on the greens to help read the line. That way i can share with with a few of my bonehead golf buddies. :-)
Hopefully everyone knows the difference between knowing the rules and enforcing them. If someone wants to say they scored an 85, when you see them making multiple infractions a game, don't call them out on it, let them have their day in the sun, and they'll probably buy a round of drinks because of their good mood.
Let a judge from a competition worry about enforcing the rules and turning your 15 handicap buddy back to the 25 they should be.
One over looked by many is the need to mark your ball uniquely to you in order to identify it. Its not just a case of 'I'm playing (brand) number #' ......
Hello there - identifying marks are only something that the Rules advise via the word 'should' rather than a requirement. It is, of course, a good idea to do so, but not essential under the Rules. Here's what the full Rules say about identifying your ball...
7.2 How to Identify Ball
A player’s ball at rest may be identified in any one of these ways:
•• By the player or anyone else seeing a ball come to rest in circumstances where it
is known to be the player’s ball.
•• By seeing the player’s identifying mark on the ball (see Rule 6.3a).
•• By finding a ball with the same brand, model, number and condition as the
player’s ball in an area where the player’s ball is expected to be (but this does not
apply if an identical ball is in the same area and there is no way to know which
one is the player’s ball).
If a player’s provisional ball cannot be distinguished from his or her original ball, see
Rule 18.3c(2).
My club has declared all gardens are to be treated as GUR, hence a free relief drop. My question is; if having taken my nearest point of relief drop, the overhanging branches of a tree which is within that garden interferes with my swing am I entitled to further free relief? Your rules videos are great.
No, the tree isn't what you wanted relief from. It is possible for the nearest "free relief" to be in a bunker, in a bush, behind a tree trunk or any other terrible/unplayable location.
In your circumstance you have to either play from the garden, play under the tree or take further penalty relief.
When you marked the spot with a tee to identify your ball you slid it in behind the ball on a angle chances are when you removed the tee your ball could have easily moved …is that trouble or would you just replace it ?
I'm pretty sure you can now measure relief with the longest club in the bag (except putter). This was a 2019 change so you don't have to use the club you would expect to use.
Hello there Dan - the distinction between determining the nearest point of complete relief (as it is now known) and then measuring out the relief area remains. The former should still be done using the club you would use for the next stroke (this from Definitions in the Rules: "Estimating this reference point requires you to identify the choice of club, stance, swing and line of play you would have used for that stroke."). From this reference point, you then measure out the one or two club-lengths permitted for the relief area using the longest club you are carrying that day other than the putter.
Regarding the provisional ball, does the provisional have to be a different number to the first ball? I assume it does, but I've never really checked. Thanks.
You can use any ball (the rule only specifies "another ball"), but if the provisional ball is indistinguishable from the original ball, and you hit the provisional ball to where the original ball is supposed to be and is unable to identify which ball is which when you find one or both balls, it will cost you (under Rule 18.3c(2)).
If your partner or opponent finds that ball in a bush. Before you get too grumpy and try to hack it out. Remember you can deem it unplayable, take relief within 2 club lengths no nearer the hole at a cost of only 1 stroke. You’ll be playing your third from there. Instead of your fourth from the fairway. You may well be better off.
Or you can take your ball back to the tee (or previous spot) and hit yet another shot from that spot. If you hit it similar to your "provisional", you have lost nothing and if you hit it better you have gained.
Yeah I genuinely always thought the term mulligan was a legit word in the rules, welcome to golf!
With regards to the "nearest point of relief... is that the point with relief closest to where your ball came to rest? If so, is there not potentially two places depending on whether you are a left of right hand golfer?
Since you are either a right handed or a left handed golfer (not both at once), there is one "nearest point of relief" for each situation.
Do you play the provisional ball after the others have played their balls or do you play it right after the first one was hit? Also if the provisional ball is the same number with the same mark and the provisional ball goes close to the first one and both are found close together and the players are unable to tell which was the first and second ball? Are you hitting 5 if you were hitting from the tee?
You wait until everyone has teed off before playing your provisional. Rule 6.4c. If you find both balls near each other and can't identify which is which, pick a ball to play. That ball is considered to have been your provisional ball, which is now in play, and the other ball no longer has any status and must not be played (Rule 18.3c(2)). So if the provisional ball was played after the tee shot, you will be hitting 4 with whichever ball you choose to play.
Back in high school, I did a maneuver where I took relief from the cart path, to a bench, to a sprinkler head, and then the lie I wanted. I was not called for it, but it seems I should of been disqualified when I turned in my scorecard, since you literally have to find the nearest point of " *RELIEF* " and not play a game of "Connect the Dots" till you get the lie you want.
You did nothing wrong. Each time you take relief, you must take complete relief from that particular obstruction. If taking proper relief from a cart path results in obstruction somewhere else, you then follow the procedures to take relief from the new obstruction.
G'day, I have a question about nearest point of relief off a path was if the ball was closest to one side of the path and complete relief was to that side, you were on the 17th gravel path and on the green side of the path why was the relief on the other side of the path. It looked further away. Les
Les Williams probably because you couldn’t get ‘complete relief’ on the other side( standing on path)
YOu missed the lateral relief option. You also have the option to go to the lateral side equal to hole and take 2 club lengths from there too.
Must be a joy to play with
Why is the nearest point of relief on the far side of the cart path? Isn't the nearest point of relief where the ball would be dropped or where your feet have taken relief from the cart path no nearer the hole? It seems to me that would have been on the green side of the cart path to the right since the ball was closer to that side when it was on the cart path.
Is a lost or OB provisional a penalty stroke each time you hit it?
I have a rules question regarding playing a provisional.
I tee-off and I've hit it over the trees to the left and I cannot see the red markers along the hedge. I say I'm hitting a provisional (in case it actually hit a tree and I find it) and I knock that out of bounds right. We are playing Stableford so I don't hit another. I walk down and see there are red stakes where my first ball went over. Can I play 3 for my first ball even though I haven't found and I have hit a provisional? Had my second tee shot landed in the fairway and run for ever, which ball should I play a drop off the first ball or the second ball?
Chris - by coincidence we ran pretty much this same question as one of the reader queries in our November issue, so I've cut and pasted that query below with the answer from our contact at The R&A...
Question: In a recent Stableford, a player missed the green on a par 3 to the right and went into some bushes. Immediately he announced his intention to play a provisional, which he hit even worse going OOB left. When we got down there, we realised that the bushes were actually a red-staked penalty area. None of the players in the fourball knew that it was a penalty area when we were on the tee. He then found his first ball in the bush in the penalty area and we had some debate as to whether he should therefore have been allowed to play a provisional as his ball was in a penalty area, and whether or not he could now proceed with this ball. We decided that, since none of us knew the bushes were a penalty area, the provisional was indeed a provisional, so he could continue with his original ball or drop out under penalty and carry on. Did we get it right?
Answer: You proceeded correctly. A provisional ball can be played for a ball that might be out of bounds or might be lost outside a penalty area. As none of the players was aware of the penalty area at the time the provisional ball was played, it was permissible to do so. Once the player finds the original ball in the penalty area, or it is known or virtually certain to be in the penalty area, the provisional ball must be abandoned and the player can either play the ball as it lies or proceed under Rule 17.1d (Rule 18.3c(3)).
@@GolfMonthly Fantastic thanks. In that case in our game we proceeded correctly. But one player in our group insisted that as I had hit a provisional I would have to continue hitting off the tee until I hit a ball in play. I hadn't read that far in the magazine yet; I just took a look and there the exact question was. Thanks again.
Re relief from sprinkler heads around the green (16:05): At our club we have a local rule allowing clean and place on the fairways within one club length (not nearer to hole). Can the area around the green be interpreted as 'part of the fairway'...?
Yes if it is a closly mown area. You only get relief if it hinders your stance or the ball has come to rest on the sprinkler.
@@MrBarrynicholas OK thanks. But my point is, if local rules are in play and it's a closely mown area, then I can get relief regardless.
@@cscoetzee Yes, if preferred lies are in play, and it's a club-length, you shouldn't have any issues avoiding a sprinker head if your ball is lying on the fringe
In this instruction, Jezz says that when taking free relief from a path the player must use the club that is to be used to play the stroke. However, in the rules definitions, a Club Length is the longest club in the bag other than the putter. Otherwise, the longest club could be a broomstick putter. My recollection of the Rules prior to 1st January 2019 was that a player must use the club that would be used to play the shot. I have not found any statement in the current Rules that says the club used for measurement must be the club intended to make the stroke. Is my understanding incorrect?
The relief point is determined by taking stance with the club you want to use. Then you get to use the long club you determine the 1 club length arc
I was having a discussion with a friend, he said in your may/june issues there was a rule discussed that on the tee'ing area if you hit the ball but it does not leave the tee'ing area you can retee your ball without penalty and make your drive again ,is this the case ? thanks in advance of your answer
Struggling to find that in those issues, but by chance, we are running pretty much that query in the next issue we're working on in relation to an airshot one person in a foursomes pairing made on the tee. The answer is that whenever your ball is in the teeing area of the hole you are playing you may retee it, but the stroke you made at it originally would still count in your score. And don't forget that the 'teeing area' is not the whole of the teeing block you are playing from but rather a precisely defined rectangle two club-lengths deep from the front and outer extremities of whatever tee markers are being used. Hope that helps.
When you dropped off the path. You didn’t use nearest point of relief. Surely as your ball was only a few inches from the edge of the path hole side, you should drop the ball hole side but in a direction further from hole. You have actually dropped the ball on other side of the path much further from nearest point?
if a score is going to be recorded, then its no question that these rules have to be followed. If one is out for a casual round and just wants to play the game for fun then there is leeway on improving lies, how one treats penalty areas, etc but again, no score should be recorded in this situation.
Lost ball is a pet peeve in certain situations where a ball would be easily found but it may have plugged or leaves on the ground are hiding it. even in open areas of rough a ball can be lost that wasnt hit wildly out of play. but we amateurs dont have the luxury of fans and tournament officials tracking down errant shots in short order.
Looking at the rules as the sand in a bunker is the bunker and the face of a bunker is classed I think as in the general area, if you declare it unplayable is the nearest point of relief within the bunker or can you take it back in line with the flag as far as you like behind the bunker ( some of them are huge) for a one shot penalty? Or could the nearest point of full relief be no nearer the hole in a lateral direction. I found this difficult to interpret from the small rules book. Thanks for any clarification.
Ian - thanks for your query. We actually ran pretty much this question in the reader query pages of the mag a few months ago. The one thing you can't do is drop in the bunker, but I've cut and pasted the piece below with the answer from our contact at The R&A... that final spot if you can't get the ball to stay in the relief are when dropping twice or placing twice could be lateral depending on where the ball was in relation to the general area. Hope this helps...
Question: What is the new embedded ball rule when a ball is embedded in a revetted bunker face and what if the ball won’t stay in the relief area?
Answer: Unless otherwise stated in the Local Rules, a revetted face above a bunker is part of the general area and you would be entitled to relief if the ball was embedded under Rule 16.3b. If you can physically drop the ball into the identified relief area but it rolls into the bunker when dropping in the right way, you must try again. If this happens when dropping a second time, you must place the ball on the spot where the ball first touched the ground on the second drop. If the placed ball does not stay at rest on that spot, you must try placing a ball on that spot a second time. If the placed ball does not stay on this spot, then you must find the nearest spot where it will come to rest in the general area.
@@GolfMonthly Ian didn't say the ball was embedded. He was asking about declaring the ball unplayable, in which case the ball could be dropped in the bunker under penalty. 19.2b
@@davidgrieve3761 True, "nearest point of relief" has no meaning when a ball is declared unplayable. The reference point for an unplayable ball is the exact location of the ball when it is declared unplayable.
@@GolfMonthly He asked about 'unplayable' ball. 'Nearest point of relief' is not a consideration.
Randsurfer I agree.
I always thought that you had to specify the ball as well "provisional first was a Titleist 3 second is a Srixon 2" (eg)? Is this not necessary?
Not required but is a good idea. A fellow player could challenge your identifying of the original vs. provisional.
they should mark the place at the path- bepore removing.
bc you wil run around quit a bit before u finally decide where the right place is
I do not understand lost ball rule. I say provisional a ball can be found. Dont say provisional and just hit another ball I can play my second ball which will exclude the ball I figured was unplayable? It comes across to me not to say provisional at all if you think the shot is lost?
2:20 so the white dotted line is "lateral relief" and the black dotted line is "going back on the line"?
No, the black line is going back on line - the white line is going back to where you last played from under stroke and distance (the white line is simply showing the original shot that got you into the penalty area). Lateral relief is designated by the two club-lengths at point 3
When does the 3 minutes of "looking for your ball" begin? I could say I've been looking for it since I hit it. It can't have anything to do with being in the vicinity of the lost ball coz if it's lost how do you know if you're in the vicinity? Not knowing if you're in the vicinity is kind of the definition of being lost. And exactly how big is a vicinity anyway?
How do you know where to search for the ball if you have no idea of the vicinity? Your question is silly. And yes, the 3 minutes begins when you start searching in the vicinity of where it is likely lost.
Played yesterday..lots of brown autumn leave. A players ball gors out in penalty area, and the ball is covered in leaves.
We found the ball, he proceeded to clear the leaves behind the ball, in his swing path.
Was that legal?
Yes. "Without penalty, a player may remove a loose impediment anywhere on or off the course, and may do so in any way (such as by using a hand or foot or a club or other equipment)." (Rule 15.1a)
I see that infraction quite often watching videos where a player who hit a provisional will find their ball buried and decide to play the provisional ball…good to know I can now talk smack about them 😂😂😂
So I have a question that has come up multiple times in my career. What happens if you find a "lost" ball after the three minute time period?
It is no longer in play... You would have to proceed as if the ball had been lost
RE nearest point of relief. I always thought the nearest point of relief in your cart path example would have been from the side of the path where the ball is but no closer to the hole, not all the way back behind the cart path?
The nearest point of complete relief for where the ball was lying was where we dropped it. To drop it on the hole side not nearer the hole we would have had to go much further away from where it was lying
@@GolfMonthly hard to see that from the camera angle. From our view it is reasonable to question whether the nearest point of relief would have been closer to where the fellow on the right was standing. You've further complicated this by only giving the obvious example of the incorrect assumption that someone would "want" to drop on the hole side of the path by moving forward and to the left which is clearly closer to the hole. Again from where the ball lay on the path a more thorough review of where the nearest point of relief would be was necessary and also would have been really useful to the audience. If I had this scenario in a match I certainly would have measured this up.
The teeing problem tends to happen more on a par 3 where someone is looking for better turf or a more level lie
Agreed. I don't play tournaments (except scrambles), so I will flat out ignore this if I can't find a good patch of grass to hit from because the box is all chewed up, and I have 0 guilt over it.
If both sides of the cart path has severe rough, don't you have the option of playing the ball as it lies on the cart path?
Yes. Relief is optional, not mandatory for cart paths and most immovable obstructions. Sometimes a relief may be mandatory to protect GUR or young plantings, etc.
I had a putt of 8 inches, the flag stick was leaning towards the ball so I pulled it out and rested it on my shoulder and putted out because I didn't want to bend down to pick it up. I was told you can't do that but I have searched the rules and can't find the answer. Please help me!
I have researched this scenario for my club and it is NOT a rules violation .
From where you were on the front of the cart path, it appears that your closest relief was actually forward to the right, not backwards.
"forward to the right" would be closer to the hole. They have it correct.
@@kevinhawley403 I have not personally been to that course and the actual location of the example, but from the video, it appears pretty clear that going front right would not have been closer to the hole. Going left certainly was, but not to the right.
Is it fair to say that if you announce that you’re playing a provisional ball that you don’t get to hit it immediately but must wait for all others in the group to tee off before hitting your second shot ?
Yes, you wait for the others to play their tee shots first.
This came up a couple of weeks ago, so I wonder if you could clarify. My opponent pushed his tee shot right, toward heavy rough. He declared a provisional ball and repeated the error. He played a second provisional straight. However, amongst the four, we had different opinions on how long we had to look for the original ball, and first provisional. One player thought it was 3 minutes in total for both, one thought it was 3 mins for first- stop, then 3 mins for provisional. One thought it was 6 mins total.
We think it is 3 mins per ball - and might be best to let the group behind through!
one last one WHEN AS YOU SAY A PLAYER STAMPS DOWN THE ROUGH BEFORE AND BEHIND HIS BALL BEFORE PLAYING HIS SHOT . what do you do ? and what PROCEDURES do you take? I CAUGHT THIS CHAP DOING JUST THIS . I COULD NOT RESIST CALLING TO HIM ." ITS ALRIGHT WHEN YOU CAN CHEAT AND GET AWAY WITH IT ." WAS I CORRECT TO DO SO OR SHOULD I HAVE TAKEN SOME OTHER ACTION IN A GAME WHERE WE ARE SUPPOSED TO BE OUR OWN REFEREES. PAUL OF TINGLEY
So I am still a little confused on a provisional ball...you still have to mark the stroke penalties for the lost ball correct? it is not like the friendly mulligan rules
Yes. It is a strenuous penalty. And mulligans are a fiction :)
How about who goes first at the green when someone is on the green 30 feet away and someone is off the green 20 feet away ?
Pertaining to the penalty for teeing out of the marked area, if your opponent says nothing to you until the end of the match, it becomes his word against yours. What then, if he has no other witness?
In match play, the consequence of teeing off outside the teeing area is that your opponent can cancel your stroke, under Rule 6.1b(1) (in which case you'll be hitting 1 again, not 3). But that option must be invoked "promptly and before either player makes another stroke." Otherwise, there is no penalty. In general, "[i]f the player knows or believes that the opponent has breached a Rule that has a penalty, the player may act on the breach or choose to ignore it" (Rule 3.2d(4)).
In stroke play, it is the obligation of fellow players to speak up upon observing a breach of the rules, under Rule 20.1c(2). "This should be done promptly after the player becomes aware of the issue, and no later than before the other player returns his or her scorecard unless it is not possible to do so." "If the player fails to do so, the Committee may disqualify the player under Rule 1.2a if it decides that this was serious misconduct contrary to the spirit of the game."
What if I hit a long drive, that lands into a playable part of a penalty area. I play a provisional and duff it into the fairway. Can I opt to play the first ball?
Ah.. I think the last segment says I Have to play the first ball.
As long as you find the first ball, that one becomes the ball in play and the other is out of the game
Generally, if you know you've hit your ball into a penalty area, you do not play a provisional ball. You are not permitted to "opt" between two balls. That is why provisional balls are to only be used if a ball may be "lost" (not in a penalty area) or "out of bounds".
So if I slice my drive into the woods, can I declare it lost from the tee and then hit another ball (not provisional) if when we get to the area my original drive has actually bounced out but in a less favourable position than the 2nd ball can my playing partner insist I play the original ??
Once you have taken the stroke and distance penalty and hit your substitute then that is now your ball. You cannot play the original if you find it. This is why you have to state you are playing a ‘provisional’ if you suspect you will find it.
Technically you are not "declaring the ball lost". You are simply choosing to play your third stroke off the tee no matter what and once you hit it without stating provisional (or rule number) that is exactly what you have done.
One rule that I see confusion on is a yellow marked penalty area. If someone hits the ball over the penalty area but the ball then rolls back into the area where it cannot be played; doesn't it have to be dropped on the side that you originally hit it from?
John Wonderly would be good to know I thought if you carry it can drop where it pitched doesn’t have to be on the side you hit from. Would be good to know
I believe if it is a yellow-staked penalty area, you must keep the point of entry in line with the flag if you are taking relief. Red-staked allows you to drop 2 club lengths from point of entry, no nearer the hole.
Jd Wond is correct. If you know the old rule (Water Hazard, yellow stake), it is the same for the new rule (Penalty Area, yellow stake).
5:30 so what about those times when the pros hit the ball of the path?
You can always choose to play off a path or road if you so wish even when entitled to free relief - it might be that they didn't fancy the nearest point of relief and actually preferred their chances simply playing it as it lies
No penalty besides the nice scratches on the bottom of your club! Sometimes hitting off a path is preferable to taking a drop as you could end up in a worse position.
So when taking relief from a path you use the club you will use to play? Not a driver. Bit confusing. Also if a player puts their ball infront of the tee markers is it best to tell them then?
Sally - you should use the club you will be playing the next stroke with to take the stance that will determine your nearest point of complete relief and then measure the relief area out using the longest club in your bag that day other than your putter. And yes, you would hope that 99% of golfers would, of course, tell someone they were about to tee off in front of the markers
Golf Monthly in other words the longer the club,usually the wider your feet will be in the stance which will influence the position of the nearest point of (full) relief.
Nearest point of relief, behind a tree or bush, if there are no toilets/dunnys around.
Surely if you are close to a sprinkler and its on your line you should get relief always? It’s not a natural feature
I work at a golf course, I have witnessed players walk into the woods, get their ball and drop it in the fairway! Should I notify the Marshal to have the players removed or shot them myself?
It makes pace of play faster. as long as they arent competeing, I'm fine with it
Patrick Reed would like to talk about #2
Off the tee I play a provisional and then find my first ball but lose the provisional. Is there a penalty
No. When you find your 1st ball the provisional ball is no longer in play.
Only that you have lost the cost of a ball
Nomadic Golfer exactly why I don’t like buying titlest proV1s bc damn expensive
Confused by the 'don't say provisional' if you don't want to find a ball. What would be the deal then?
If you hit a ball into an undesirable lie, you can decide right then and there to take stroke and distance, and forget about the original ball, instead of playing a provisional ball. If you do play a provisional ball, and then find the original ball, then the provisional ball must be abandoned. You can't decide then to keep the provisional ball and abandon the original ball (i.e. to "unfind" the ball). If you want to take stroke and distance then, you have to go back to the previous spot and hit again. But with the original ball found, you may have other options, such as unplayable ball relief.
So, if you have to be behind or level with the Tee markers, does that mean you have to play through them for the ball to be in play? I refer to the Bubba Watson tee shot.
Ian - no, the ball does not have to physically pass between the two tee markers
My biggest confusion is balls lost off the tee that goes OB ( you know 100%). I have seen some people refuse to hit a provisional/re-tee, instead say "I'll go drop over there"... hitting 3. Well.. he just took advantage of 240 yards hitting from there versus hitting 3 from the tee box. SMH
He might be confusing OB and a red stake Hazard.
I think he needs to reload as his ball is 100% OB crossing a red stake he does have that option.
Club grips.
Did not understand hitting another ball off the tee and not saying provisional ?
Using the club you're going to play shot with to measure point of relief is now defunked now I think? All relief is allowed with longest club excluding a long putter (ie driver) ? 🤔
Hello there Dan - the distinction between determining the nearest point of complete relief (as it is now known) and then measuring out the relief area remains. The former should still be done using the club you would use for the next stroke (this from Definitions in the Rules: "Estimating this reference point requires you to identify the choice of club, stance, swing and line of play you would have used for that stroke."). From this reference point, you then measure out the one or two club-lengths permitted for the relief area using the longest club you are carrying that day other than the putter.
Right. That distinction was not at all clear in the relief from cart path example.
Golfer named Neil Tap-in :)
What's the rule if in the process of looking for your ball you step on it pushing it into the ground where it becomes an unplayable lie?
You replace the ball at its original spot (Rule 7.4), which "includes its vertical location relative to the ground" (Rule 14.2c). However, the original lie has been altered, so you'll have to use Rule 14.2d(2), which says to place the ball "on the nearest spot with a lie most similar to the original lie" (within 1 club-length, not nearer the hole, and in the same area of the course).
I’d hate to play a round with the old dude 😭😭
Why let golf be fun when you could just be a stickler?
@@JPWGolfChannel why play by the rules when you could just cheat?
I'd love it. He knows the rules. My favorite type of fellow player.
So are these the biggest or most common? Biggest mistakes result in largest penalties, most common ones happen most frequently.