Free Flight Basics #3 - Making Prop Hooks That Don't Creep
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- čas přidán 5. 09. 2024
- The 3rd episode focuses on making two kinds of prop hooks that help prevent long rubber motors from creeping or tangling around the prop shaft. First is the Z hook, often called the Reverse S hook. Then comes the SFA hook, a variation that evolved from the Czech hook by Tondra Alfrey. There are many, many ways to build & fly model airplanes. These films show how it has played out for me. Filmed with a Canon PowerShot SX20-IS & iPhone 11 Pro. Music via motionarray.com.
Here's the story of the SFA hook's development: hallmanstudio.c...
Step by step tutorial for the 'Z' hook: hallmanstudio.c...
Adjustable thrust templates: hallmanstudio.c...
K&S music wire is available here: easybuiltmodel...
A plan of the 20" Mureaux 170 is available here: thegeebee.com/...
Rubber Turns Calculator: hallmanstudio.c...
Article on the use of dethermalizers: www.hallmanstud...
Badge Classic DT & spring (at the bottom of the page): www.starlink-fl...
*** 10 steps to trimming a rubber model, by John Koptonak: www.flyingacesc...
I found 3.57mm OD silicone tubing at MotionRC.
A great source for F/F tutorials is this link to the Pensacola Free Flight Team's archives, posted on the FAC website. Any Q & A not covered on my channel may be found here: flyingacesclub....
Also, these tutorials from Easy Built Models: easybuiltmodel...
***Interview with Tom Hallman by John McAvoy on his Free Flight Fanatic podcast:
freeflightfana...
Flying Aces Club merchandise: www.cafepress....
Center of Gravity merchandise: www.cafepress....
For more info on free-flight rubber-powered models, check these websites:
www.easybuiltmo...
www.volareprodu...
www.flyingacesc...
outerzone.co.u...
National Free Flight Society - freeflight.org/
Mike Stuart's Flying Scale Models - www.ffscale.co.uk/
www.freeflight...
I've updated the Rubber Turns Calculator for any newcomers to FF rubber. With the way rubber can change throughout the years, this chart will give you a good place to start. Use it only as a general guide. hallmanstudio.com/rubber_turns_calculator.pdf
These videos you are making, will become the greatest reference for this hobby.
It shows the straight way to go for beginners and also for who is in the hobby for some time.
Thank you. 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
I tried S hooks from a couple of other youtubers that had aggressive circular bends that formed an actual S that was hard on my old hands with .047 and was hard to adjust but worked great when i got it right. After seeing this I went straight to my work bench and nailed it after a couple tries. The angular bends were a easier on my hands and easier to adjust and worked as well as the other method. I rarely comment on the many Tubers that I follow but these videos are really serving their purpose and upping my free flight game. Thanks again
Thx for the feedback, Duane. I too struggled 30 years ago when I first learned of them, trying to mimic the Reverse S design, using rounded needle nose pliers. It was so difficult to control their tapered roundness. At some point I came to realize that the sharper bend of the Z worked perfectly at any size, so I've never looked back.
Good Grief, no wonder averaging only 10-15 flights per motor using stock hooks, no silicon tubing or dental bands. With these fantastic, instructional videos you’ll make a rubber free flighter out of me yet! Thanks again.
Tom is The #1 Guru of this sport/hobby/craft/art and an inspiration to us all, modelers, retired modelers & non-modelers alike...Moses
Thx. Just doing what I can to take the mystery out of free-flight and show that it can be enjoyed with simple techniques that had been shared by my mentors. It's a great community...always willing to share.
I am getting into the hobby and this videos are solving many of my doubts, thank you very much!!!
Thanks to your channel and your generosity in teach all. Soon I will fly too!
Thx, Fabio. Enjoy ur flying!
@@maxfliart Yes I will sir. Thank you!
4 times the hook-to-peg length? Wow. I really need to up my game as that is impressive. Another great video.
Thx, Tom. Seems all of my dimers have similar motors. Amazed too that they can handle it.
I don't know how I've been missing these videos. They are fantastic. Every little step, you make clear to see. I am kind of getting that book I keep asking you to write.
Thank you Tom, for sharing your knowledge with the rest of the world! Where are my pliers..?!! Greetings from Belgium!
Haha. Thx. Give it a try.
Thank you for demonstrating rubber creep on a regular model hook! I tried a rubber motor on my recent build and I believe you have saved me certain heartache. Z bend shafts! So far I've got 1 out of 3 I can use without wobble. 1 out of 3 should provide a batting title. LOL! Thank you again!
I've seen the dreaded creeping but had no idea how to remedy it, thanks.
I am making my reverse Z hooks thanks to this video. They are working GREAT! I've already known them by pictures but the emphasis you have put on showing the advantages made me decide the right way.
Thanks Tom!
Wow 🤩! Just never understand the proper use of a great interpretation of a hand made device. Cheers 🥂!
Thanks for sharing your thoughts and your gift 🎁!
Thanks! Your videos are truly inspiring!
Inspiring, in its simplicity. THANKS !
Thx for recognizing that, Chuck. I'm trying to take some of the mystery and complexity out of F/F.
Love these Free Flight Basics videos, Tom:) The timing couldn't be better too, with the winter building season upon us. I've already adopted many of your techniques and it has helped improve my building experience! Just left my building board a few minutes ago where I was using some of your covering tips with greater success. Thank you, Barry
Good to hear, Barry. Glad they're impacting your modeling in a positive way.
Thank you Tom for doing these lovely videos. They are educational and enlightening. You might consider this knowledge as petty, since you grew up seeing your dad and you grew up into this hobby. But for people like me you are the mughal, the guru or the Pied Piper.
These videos will become the free flight bible. The editing, music and explanation are perfect.
Once again thank you and God bless.
This is awesome! All your modells are so meticulously built! I'm building my first model and your content is giving me a lot of insights and methods on what to use and how! Thank you so much! I would love to learn how to build a propeller and a nose. Maybe one day you'll be so kind to share how you approach its construction! Thank you very much again!
Have been making reverse s hooks will try the alternate z and chec hooks look much easier to make thanks
I skipped free flight/rubber power when I was a kid. Now as a70 something oldtimer.....time to revisit what I missed. Thank you for the help. Cheers
Wow, thanks! You answered so many questions that I had with this!
I learned a lot today, this is invaluable help whe you live in a country where tere isn't anybody around that can give advice. I had given up, now I'm back to building... will fly. soon. Thanks!
Thx, Jorge...I'm glad the series is helping ur return to free-flight. Enjoy!
Thank you Mr. Hallman. Great video as always. Now, it is time for me to re-fly my old models with Z hook and longer, braided motors.
Kolay gelsin Muzzafer bey. 11 yil onca Trabzon da OTURDIM. YARIM Kara Denizliyim.
Great video. For larger models I use a reverse S with a Tim White hook rather than looping the rubber over the prop shaft. It’s like a figure of 8 , one end that stays on the rubber and the other smaller loop fits on the winder or prop shaft. I don’t use silicone tubing in this situation.
I often fly mini vintage and use one and a half hook to peg length braided to stop bunching.
Thanks for this. I am going to make one for my next model.
Thank you again! Seeing your step by step bends makes it almost easy.
Good to hear. I hope it works for you.
Great stuff. Many thanks for posting these informational videos. I really appreciate it!
Tom, this is very very helpful. Many thanks. In time, I would also like hear what you have to say about about prop shaft/nose block bushings. Your videos are literally note worthy.
Tom, you answered all my questions above and ones I didn't know ask. Thank you.
K&S stands for Wally Simmers and "Stoop" Karsch who founded the company. Both were Chicago area free flight fellows of whom you may have heard,
Great tutorial!
Fantastic Information and Instructions 👍🌷
Thank You Very Much Maxfliart 👍
That music 😵💫
CZcams needs to replace the like thumbs up with a love this button!
Thanks for your videos. I'm learning a lot. In my club i am the only one who flies models whith a rubber engine. My next goal is to make them myself. Cheers from Spain.
Great Episode. Please keep going.
The video is great. Getting better and better！Could you record a video explaining the propeller bearing?
Nice video
Très jolie vos avion félicitation 🎉
So what is your preferred hook and why? Can't thank you enough for these super videos. I have modeled mostly alone for all the years that I have been into it, so most of the stuff I do I learned via trial and error. Now I see the error of my ways! LOL
My earliest models in the late 80s used the classic diamond shape, sometimes with a crocket hook. Didn't always work. Around that time I saw the Reverse S, and have been using it ever since. I've made 100s & 100s. Only recently did I learn of the wire version of the Czech hook. After testing last week, I see the benefits for many, and the ease of bending...not quite as tricky as the Z hook. I think either are ideal for most models. Thx for the feedback.
@@maxfliart One other question if I may.....is the tubing you use the same as 1/2a fuel tubing?
@@glennreach6930 yes.
@@maxfliart I'm afraid I am becoming a pest, but I have a couple of more questions. You say that you make your prop hooks from both .032 and .047 wire; which wire for what wingspan of model? And now that you have done the back half of the prop hook are you going to do a video on the front half?
@@glennreach6930 Glad for the feedback. I usually go with .047 for anything between 22" and 40". For everything smaller I'd use the .032". Many of the props I use are plastic, which have a simple free-wheel ramp, so all u need to do is a 90º bend on the prop shaft, and trim it. I might do a film on the adjustable thrust plate, which has proved very useful throughout the trim sessions.
max i love you vids and as model airplaner for 65 years i never flew rubber or ff.. but.c/l ...r/c.. as a retired orthodontist you have a correct bending method ,,hold the wire with pliers bend with finger... my i suggest a birdbeak plier ..one beak round one flat not serrations not nicking the wire.. or polish the wire ..im learning about rubber from you ...thx
Thx, John. I'll be sure to take a look at those pliers. Thx for the info.
For bending short pieces, especially thick wire, I push it with the end grain of a block of wood.
Wish I’d seen this thirty years ago.
I make a bobbin which is easy to turn and has always worked well. Have you used bobbins?
Excelente, gracias por mostrar como se hace!!!
¡Mi placer!
Thanks Tom for these helpful videos. Is the Z hook the better alternative? I'm looking forward to increasing my rubber motor lengths as well.
Thx, John. The Z hook works well, and is the only one I've used for the past 30+ years. But many have said the same for the Czech hook, so it comes down to which is easier for u to bend. Have fun!
Truly enjoy watching your videos. I have a question. Can you recommend any of your videos or others, and maybe articles on multi motor rubber powered airplanes. My first experience in real flying was at 4 years old. I have plans that I would like to modify for a rubber powered Super Constellation. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Thx for the feedback. On my channel, look for the MiG-DIS, Hodek, and the Burnelli twins. I call them either Start to Finish or Anatomy of a Trim Session. I also have a film showing the winding process of the MiG-DIS. I've seen a rubber powered Super Constellation by Pres Bruning from a few years ago, but I don't know if there's a plan of any film of the model. Good luck.
Thank you
Bobbins work well and are easily turned from aluminum or machinable plastic,
Thank you ...good idea
Is music required for bending? I suppose so as it is piano wire.
If you are using a long motor like 4-5x prop hook to peg length can you put more winds on the rubber per inch than you would if you were only using 1.5x prop hook to peg length? I am asking because this situation would involve putting a larger motor into a relatively short fusalage.
I would think that the winds per inch remain the same, regardless of the motor length.
Where are you finding the silicone tubing. If a crocket hook is being used would the z hook still be the appropriate shaft ?
I found the tubing at MotionRC. I bought the 3.57mm. I've gone back n forth with the use of the crocket on z hooks or others, since the crocket already has a slight Z shape on the rubber end. Mostly likely it won't matter, as long as whatever hook ur using keeps the crocket centered.
Your aircraft and videos make me want to sell my rc gear, batteries and all!
Haha. That would buy a lot of balsa, tissue & rubber! A friend at Wawayanda had done just that, and is loving it.
Beautiful Videos! We want to make one 3D printable. What should be the approximate maximum flight weight for the 20" model?
All up weight for a typical 20" FF model wound be around 28 grams or under an ounce. Depending on the builder, models can come in far less than that, or far more....so duration would become a factor. But regardless, all would fly.
@@maxfliart Thank you for your information! We would like to make a video together with you if you have a 3D Printer. We can develop a model together :D
Will O rings prevent creeping rubber on small models only requiring one loop of 1/8" rubber?
I don't know, as I've not used them before, although I've heard some have successfully. Best suggestion is to try one on a stooge and see what happens after fully wound. Better there than in the model.
thank you
Thank you for passing on your knowledge. I must ask, is there a reason why you are wearing a glove when handling the rubber motor ?
Thx for asking. In the case of the lube that I use (Dow Corning 33) the motor gets VERY slippery when the rubber is wound close to max, so much so that it can easily slip thru ur fingertips and explode a model. Sadly, I've had that happen. Ever since then, I've used a glove when winding the motor tight. I probably could have gone without it for the film, but when I saw that the darkness allowed the elements that I wanted show to stand out against the contrast, I kept it on.
@@maxfliart good idea. I will try that myself.
I don't think the Z or reverse S is necessary. Simply having the bar perpendicular to the rubber will do it. Looks like a stirrup, or equilateral triangle. The motor won't twist off, but if the motor gets off center, it will swing around inside the fuselage and bang into things, wasting energy. I devised the "Czech" hook many decades ago and didn't use it because I liked to use an O-ring on the motor. It is also hard to get a tightly wound, lubed motor over that wide part. You can grip it a bit from the end and let some turns out, to form a loop, but I didn't like to let any turns out. If you watch how the rubber twists off the circle, you find that it gets off the side, perpendicular to the circle and therefore twists off in the direction of its twist. Which way it goes is determined by which side of the loop the rubber goes to. It can go up on the shaft or it can go off the end. If it goes up on the shaft it will still turn the shaft, but if it goes off the end, you will have a lot of damaged tissue paper and a motor that is tightly jammed inside your fuselage. Getting it out can cause further damage. I finally settled on a circle with the end overlapping the shaft about a radius. It is made as a right handed pigtail. If the motor goes around to the end side, it will twist toward the shaft, but be stopped by the overlapping end. If it goes toward the other side, it will go around toward the end until it is blocked by the shaft. The end must be spaced away from the shaft enough that the O-ring can get onto the hook. It occurs to me now that the square loop could be made in a right handed spiral with the end overlapping the shaft. One that guarantees keeping the motor centered is a T-pin, with the motor around the shaft. The problem with that is getting the loop of a tightly wound, lubed motor over the far end of the T. Again, letting some turns out will do it. You must be sure that the two strands come around from behind the shaft on the side such that the shaft prevents them from going between the two doubled legs of the T. Otherwise the motor can get off center.
Thx for sharing ur experience with the gang.
to your opinion is gorila glue good for it 🤔
what if the rubber remains on the hook while you are winding it? Will it still climb?
I've never wound in this way, although many do, including the friend who showed me the wire Czech hook design. The Czech hook has never failed him. I would think if you were using a circle hook and a longer motor (2x - 3x etc) chances are high that the rubber would still slip off. Always good to test on the bench before risking the model.
@@maxfliart What are your thoughts on modifying a round hook to a flat one?
what type of wood gluo are you using
It's called Titebond.
to your opinion is gorila glue good for it 🤔
@@malihesharafi3243 I've never used Gorilla. If they have a wood glue, I would test it first, but Titebond or Elmers wood glue is quite reliable.
What is a plane without the prop
A glider.
@@aeromodeller1 yea i know but i don't like jet engines
Another great video. Time to get some wire and start bending!
@@kuul8955 Gliders don't have engines.
@@aeromodeller1 jet engines
good .. its easier then the S hook