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2000's Russian Carrier Group vs 2010's Chinese Carrier Group (Naval Battle 68) | DCS
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- čas přidán 15. 08. 2024
- 0:00 Intro
1:37 Details
7:20 Predictions
8:24 FIGHT!
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#DCSQuestioned #GRNavalBattle #DCSNavalBattle #Russia #China #Navy #AircraftCarrier #GR #DCSWorld #Aviation #AviationGaming #FlightSimulators #Military
You should do a us 1980s us battleship task force vs a kirov 1980s task force neither of these task forces have carries but u could include the proper number of helicopters, great video btw
czcams.com/video/0zMLfoA4OLs/video.html
@@grimreapers I was speaking in terms of iowa plus destroyer and frigate escort vs kirov plus escorts not ship vs ship sorry for confusion
I still think PL-12 and 15 are too good,just too much,also the AIM-120 si the only one combat proven
These kind of Naval Videos is what makes life worth living. It is always a treat when one of these comes out. Please keep doing what you're doing, GR. You are making a lot of people happy (including me) :)
Ditto to that 👍
Roger got more in pipeline.
Grim Reapers That’s good to hear 😊
Good as always, though would have liked the Liao Ming v Kuznetzov gatling battle. Maybe just do an entire carrier v carrier, every type, no escorts or planes or missiles, like a Thunderdome? Last carrier floating wins. You got French, Brit, Japanese, Indian, US, Russian, Chinese, am I missing anyone? Randomly assigned to all-human captains and all-guns.....FIGHT!
You forget the Thai carrier
@@ivanngarciavillegas9865 I had to google that to see if you weren't making that up. But yeah, Thailand has a carrier! Learn something new everyday in the comments of the Grim Reapers videos.
@@Kevin-hp5fk Thailand currently has more working carriers than Russia 😂
That would be incredibly filing to watch as all the carriers are ciws ing each other and the Russian one would probably win due to having 8 kashtans and an additional 6 single ak 630s which is a beast. All the other carriers have less ciws than that so Russia would prob win that carrier thunder dome but it would be amazing to watch 😍
Thai has a working carrier while Russia has a carrier in a drydock 😂
Infinite respawning leads to infinite stupidity. Maybe try letting human players spawn on the carrier after the AI has done its thing. Hand out extra lives only when everybody is dead on both sides. Humanoids should have the incentive to survive and land back at the carrier to get more weapons to break the stalemate. It's going to slow them down quite a bit which is not necessarily super desirable for videos but it's better than ruining the whole point of the thing. Not complaining overall, ship on ship action was excellent and about as good as it can be given the state of DCS.
All those millions and billions to radar guided missiles, just state of the art weaponry built upon centuries of weapons development, yet the biggest fighting group end up in the wooden ship era, slugging each other with massive cannons using sophisticated air defense gatling guns to manually aim at ship and boarding each other lol
That’s not how it would happen irl…. They wouldnt stand a chance! Russia is proving how trashy their military is rn
@@gamingclipz7309 alright dawg, its a game and i made a funny observation but sure whatever you say my dood.
This was an amazing video 🎉. These naval vids are my favorite! It would be cool to see a huge flotilla of modernized Iowa's with a few escorts fight a Carrier group
Roger
Now think if they modeled how poorly trained, maintained, and operated Russia's Navy actually is.
Then the Russian ships become "submarines" 😂
Hey, GR, just an idea: Remember the Juan Carlos I carrier that Spain has? Australia has 2 ships that are almost identical to that, and they are considering purchasing F35Bs to operate from those two vessels, with 12 being able to fit on each ship. Can you do a simulation to see whether this kind of loadout would be effective? I am thinking that maybe you could have a mission based out of an Australian fleet, with the goal of striking Chinese ground assets on one of the islands in the map used in this video, with some competent SAM, and maybe a small warship defending.
Or, the mission could just be fleet defense or something.
Working on something similar, will consider thanks.
@@grimreapers Nice!
@@totalnerd5674 got a link to them considering it, I can't find anything from defence on it.
@@bearcatracing007 Well, whatever happens, I hope the Australians make the best choice for themselves. But I do believe that the flexibility the F35B would add to the Australian navy would be undeniable.
Oh it got talked about the main reasons why they didn't want to do it is expensive deck modifications for the heat and the lack of defence for such an attractive target. Personally I think the 35 isent the right aircraft for a nation with such a large border and low number of defence assets. Maybe large numbers of cheaper drones could be a better option? Ps I live right next to a Raaf base where the super hornets operate and have yet to even see a 35 im wondering if they even exist at this point haha cheers
The Su-33/J-15 is one beautiful plane. If I could build models I would make one
Thank you for valuing us Cap.
Pleasure
Amazing naval battle as always, thanks for another masterpiece Cap.
I picture a big Kodiak bear dual wielding AKs going after two Winnie the Pooh using his little cork gun when the Russian carrier said, "I'll handle this myself."
lol
The carrier group versus carrier group battles are always the most fun to watch, especially with the new game mode. It would be interesting to see a US carrier group from the 90s with F14s, a battleship and hornets Face off against a modern carrier group. It would demonstrate if the carrier group with the battleship is superior, or if the carrier group with F35 is superior.
Roger
@SubtoPolecat324 I think it definitely would be better in reality. In DCS the Iowa is modeled in a mod with 32 tomohawks and 16 harpoons and the Burke in game has no anti-ship weapons. The Tico is stuck with only eight harpoons in game. That’s why I think the battleship could make a difference with a full complement of tomahawk and harpoon.
I believe in real life some of the Russian ships are armed with large torpedoes. Would have completely changed the outcome of the battle. Also I don’t think they would start firing guns at maximum range as it decreases accuracy. Sustaining such a high rate of fire also decreases accuracy over long range.
What you need is HMS Warspite and Scharnhorst to come by to teach the AI how to aim their main battery guns 😂
Good timing, China just launched their third aircraft carrier named Fujian
Yup I just saw it on news...
I’ll watch it even if it’s over an hour as long as it’s about current conflict and/or thing that I can anyhow relate to 😌
Great stuff - that Kashtan at close range was like a Borg cutting beam when the Chinese vessel cut across behind the carrier !
I'd love to see you take on a Tomcat equipped 1980's/1990's US carrier Group using WWII assets. It'd be tough, but I think your boys have the skills to pull it off with a coordinates strike. I'd expect multiple WWII carriers worth of aircraft would be required though
PS: Love the videos, they're always great to watch and make me wish I could fly :)
Great aerial combat from the boys. Fun video! :)
The Russian(Soviet) Navy doctrine is defense, supported by land based aircraft. Adding some Russian land based anti-ship aircraft would be inline with that doctrine.
The Chinese are building a navy capable of USN style power projection.
In a fictional scenario where the Russian and Chinese fight. Based on doctrines, Chinese entering Russian waters is most reasonable.
@@franklinhadick2866 You must have missed it. "Adding some Russian land based anti-ship aircraft" That was my point, my intent was adding to the algorithm.
"The Chinese are building a navy capable of USN style power projection." That was funny.
Re-spawning is kind of same as 2nd string or back up player? You can re-spawn an aircraft/player but not a Carrier or Battleship? Unclear.
Epic battle…. Thank you. Gripping stuff 👍
ey, i love the over an hour videos....actually what i seek out. probably exception to the algorithm. but i enjoy it.
I love people like you!
Also like the over a hour vids, I only have to plan a timeslot to watch it. but deff. watching them
Simba. 10/10 perfect S manoeuvre during dogfight.
The Indian carrier group is latest as follows. 1 vikrant class carrier with 24 mig-29k. 3 kolkata class destroyers with 16 supersonic antiship cruise missiles and 32 anti missile missiles and four kashtan ciws guns each. 3 shivalik class frigates with 8 antiship supersonic cruise missiles, 32 point defence missiles and 24 medium range buk anti air missiles with four kashtan guns. Additionally the carrier has 4 76 mm otpmelara strales rapid fire guns for air defence and 64 barak anti missile missiles for defence. And each surface combatant has a 76 mm oto melara rapid fire gun for frontal gun attack.
Fights between lesser forces would be fun to see too.
I think, for those gunnery things every carrier group should have a battleship.
Even if the enemy battleship destroys our 2 front turrets, you still have 1 left, that can destroy every ship
Who doesn't enjoy a good galleon battle?
agree
No no no. They would just spontaneously combust and not be able to put the fire out. IF they could get the ship out of dry dock before the dock sinks and collapse onto it. ;-P
Another great Video, Cap. Thanks...
With the Pyotor Veliky's turrett at the back, wouldn't it make more sense in this situation to REALLY close the distance and then turn in order to maximize the damage it can do vs ships?
Or for that matter, the second group of chinese ships turned away and stopped till the russians closed the range, then turn and open up on them..
i like it when the cwis fire best parts of the vids
You gunna love the end of this one then!
@@grimreapers you guys weren’t kidding, love it!
The 9M317E is the export version of the Buk-M1-2 medium range air defense system for the SA-11 Gadfly
The 52c has hhq 9, the 54a has hq 16 andthe 52c has a export buk missile system which was fireing late battle due to the slower launching of arm launchers. The Liaonings irl has a few hq 10 launchers and a few type 730 ciws instead of the kuznetsov loadout
Thanks
@@grimreapers hq 10 is kinda like a ripoff ram missile
Slight correction: the Kirovs are the biggest non CV surface combattants, but the Sejong the Great is a way more capable ship. And has more VLS Tubes.
Simba, you are the man
He was on the USS Momsen in the Pacific Ocean the squadron was the scorpions in 2016 and also got accommodation from the captain of the USS Greenville submarine for saving one they’re sailors
15:30 It is funny YJ-62 does not drop its rocket booster with wings still folded.
I will always watch you vids Cap. Love them all! Keep it up!!!!
thx
these naval simulations are my Fav!
“We need to make a video less than an hour long, because otherwise most of you wont watch it”
Meanwhile the video: 1hr 21mins long
Funny, there actually were 4 Slavas. The Moskva was sunk in April 2022, the Marshal Ustinov is currently with the Northern Fleet (Arctic and North Atlantic), the Varyag in the Pacific Fleet (and last heard of was in need of refitting and had a skeleton crew and reduced readiness)...and then one ironically named Ukrainia that was never finished and is currently docked in Mykolaiv, unfinished. As of 2019, it was supposed to be finished and sold to Brazil, but it hasn't been and probably won't be, with the current developments in that part of the world.
1:45 - We really need to make a video that is less than a hour long...
1:20:00 - Well shi......
lol
Around 0:41:30 in this video: That AWACS aircraft has _vibranium plot armor._ 😉
WWII Battleship mash, 10 to 15 Allied Battleships vs same amount of Axis Battleships. Each side can also have 1 Carrier with human and AI planes,the humans will be only air to air while AI will have both air to air and anti ship, humans can respawn. Most kills get bragging rights.
Love these videos Cap and GR!
That new chinese missile is their version of Naval BUK, the HQ-9 is the version of naval grumble
Hq 16 is a reverse engineered buk as the hhq 9 is a reversed engineered s300 gumble. The 9m317 missile was a export version of the buk that was on 52b and fired late match due to slower launching speed of arm launchers and still had them to that time
Ok thanks. Always get them mixed up lol
@@grimreapers the hq 16 should theoretically be better than export bucks since it is newer but sometimes people get missile names mixed up when so many of them are in the air
We went from cutting edge tech, to 1970's tech, to WWII, to US Civil War. Are we going to get ancient Greek ramming, too?
Theres the problem with the Indian and Chinese destroyers. They have less SAMs
That Russian carrier is a battle carrier. If they got it working 100 percent it would be powerful . It has missiles and huge guns on it.
Interesting battle!
In the end a modern sea war turns into 18 century canon war ...
Good Video.
It's kind of unlikely that a Russian fleet would have 2 Slava/Moskva cruisers. They have 2 of those left with one based in the Arctic and one based in the Pacific. They wouldn't operate together unless there was a "special operation". I would just use 1 in the future. The Kutnetzov is, of course, out of service until 2024/25 so there isn't any Russian carrier fleet. But then, there wouldn't be any video.
The Chinese type 052C is considerably better than the 052A or 052B. It would be fairer to include more 052C to balance out the Russian cruisers and the lack of the 055 or 052D.
Agreed BUT we don't have the modern Russian destroyers in game, so it's the best I can do.
DCS really needs to program in boarding parties. When the ships run out of ammo they try to ram each other and try to send boarding parties. When the boarding parties run out of ammo they need to program them to start attacking each other with wrenches and whatever they can find. Eventually they should be programmed so that when they run out of stuff to throw at them they get over their differences and join each other for a pint and become life long friends.
I wonder if ED is ever gonna properly model earth's curvature
Happy to say, i'm "almost nobody" not minding more than an hour.
And therefore any case glad you're not believing into the usual 20 minute dogma. Especially if it would mean cutting out things you would not otherwise.
I hope both fleets are not put at veteran. Novice will do. They have proven they have no veterans on carriers
How about a Russian SEAD mission against Ukrainian IAD with Buks Strela Tunguska and Gepards and what other things they got for air defense
Working on something similar.
Australian air defence systems are just the same as these technology missiles.
What happend to the Su-33 that landed on the island ?
The thing is with the J-15B payload thing. I suspect there's going to be quite a few people requesting a rematch with the U.S. Battle Group.
*with the actual-payload J-15s
Agree but will do it in a few months as only just did the original a week ago.
@@grimreapers use the Ford Carrier with the F 35cs...😁😁
Russian Titanium AWACS is unbeatable....
My bad
Modern Chinese missiles can orbit a target via programming to then swarm from all vectors in pairs or at once etc. Also decoy way points.
Swarm orbit attacks of programmed chinese missiles designed specially to confuse defence systems. With notching etc, don't just head right for target, they know the systems. They know it will prioritise and if off 10 15 degrees from vector to target can get close to orbit for a swarm... see my point
Simba my hero does the dive bomb you da man bro
Good video, but there's another carrier I want to see. (CC2 :D )
is the indian ships , a new mod?
kinda excited ,hope it someone can make it work
I found an old one but just don't work on DCS anymore.
My best guess as to why the ships were shooting with such horrible accuracy is it looked like at the end when it was nothing but ships, when the ships made a hard turn they would shoot especially horrible into the water. I would assume ships like that would have the guns controlled by a gimbal and gyros to know when the ship is rolling and pitching. I'm wondering if when they were coded if ships are sending the opposite information or the equipment is reading it backwards. Example if the ship is rolling ten degrees and its sending out negative ten degrees. That could explain why the airplanes couldn't take off they where getting a reading of one thing and the ship was sending them 180 off. Hopefully this can help someone debug this issue.
Another great video. Can the admirals tell when the ships fire? How about where they are Firing?¹
Did they have storm troopers firing those guns?
@grimreapers can you do Britain india and America vs Russia China and spain
CAn't get India to work :(
@@grimreapers can you do USA Britain vs Spain and Japan
Great stuff ! Shame there weren't any submarines
I wish the screen would not shake with the Naval artillery.
The camera isn't on the ship itself.
ALWAYS following the missiles NEVER showing the damn ships launching im gonna cry
In real life no carrier can launch aircraft while its doing evasive maneuvers, so the Chinese fighters being unable to take off during their carrier evasive maneuvers is accurate.
its like the aliexpress Harpoon
Yes!
Cap, you called it a draw. That’s a damn lie. There was a clear winner, and that was the viewers! But if the prize is the same from the carrier landing challenge, I think I’ll just let you keep it.
lol
Is it possible to give the AI more complex commands? For example hold fire with the ballistic missiles until all anti-ship aircraft have taken off and fire off everything at once, instead of in 2 ''defendable'' waves? I would be harder to defend against, considering that their would be more missiles in the air to stop.
You can program them to be more intelligent BUT you have to code them outside of game and I am not smart enough to do it. If anyone out there is willing to do it for me please let me know.
@@grimreapers I just emptied our kids swimming pool of about 1000l, by hoisting up one end and having the water slosh over the other, because the plug was stuck with a vacuum to the ground. Then I filled the side with air and noticed that it created a pocket so that it wouldn't get stuck while draining..... Needless to say, I am not smart enough to code
What about 80s US Assault ship like LHA Tarawa vs Kiev Helicopter Carrier "Aviation Cruiser" which did very similar things
Both carried a mix of Helicopters and VTOL aircraft.
Yak-141 vs AV8B Harrier would be fun and interesting to see too , especially given the 141s tie in with the F35 :)
Will combined arms be allowing for boarding modern warships?
I would love that!
For the love of God, can we program them to include ramming?
I have been wondering this for a while, when modeling the Russian carrier, do you include its most important support vessel, the mighty tugboat?
Still looking for the Kuznetzov's tug. It doesn't leave home port without it!! snicker
Hey Cap... Could you ask Simba to give details on what he is running for the DCS server you are running the missions on?
It is not my server to give the details about but I will ask.
It's Scott's server currently residing in RC's house.
Moscva's Have 8 Torpedo launchers!?
yes
Mr Cap, speaking of ships, have the DCS gods updated the Standard SAM's?
Not that I have noticed.
Any chance you can include the links to the mods you are using in these.?
Should all be in here: Mods: czcams.com/play/PL3kOAM2N1YJcbzwU5FCo0DRmCdF3owO1o.html
Could the Kirov firing it's CIWS into the sea be because the ship was turning to port which was making it lean to starboard?
SU33 is not supposed to have any chance against the J15, the SU33 is from the late 80s while the J15 air frame is based on the T-10Ks prototype, everything else is new, from the composite materials, radar, data link, glass cockpit, weaponaries, etc...the J15 should be at least at J11B level from the 2000s although they are not very advanced today, but still significantly a whole generation ahead of the SU33, basically just an evolution of the SU33. As the J11B are being upgraded to J11BG (apparently with AESA radars and new weapons), new J15 should also be upgraded to similar standard to stay competitive. Or else they have no chance against F35 and it is still a long few years until the Chinese naval 5th thing enter service.
It’s a great day!
Whenever I try to download the Chinese mod pack it stops my game from launching, anyone have some way to fix that?
Weird, mine always works fine with the pack...
and i actually want to see what happen if a full russian + chinese carriers battle group against say the US + British carrier groups...the F35 is going to dominate the J15 and SU33/Mig29K but the ballistic missile from 055 should be able to do some damage...
Change you have to look at who’s doing the programming for the game. I watched one more game and Guy admitted that the Chinese controlled a lot of the programming so course the Chinese forces were unbeatable.
Even though it's probably really unrealistic I just love the Russian carrier group
Ramming Speed
Cap- How can one apply to join the full time pilots?
annoyingly we've just closed the summer applications but keep an eye on the GR Discord please. It all happens there.
@@grimreapers will do thanks!
I would have thought it'd be the Russian CG that wasn't working.
For anyone who believes Russian ships/carrier groups are even as good as they are portrayed in DCS, I highly recommend reading up on the Russian Black Sea Fleet's attempt to secure and defend Snake Island. They've been repeatedly wiped out on that island after numerous reinforcement missions, and this includes drones still successfully attacking boats and small ships which are used to transport equipment to the island. Ukraine is essentially winning the Black Sea naval battle with limited use of missiles fired from the coast, limited use of aircraft sorties flying over the Black Sea despite not having any air superiority, and via the use of drones, up against Russian ships and boats along with anti-air assets on the island itself. The latest sinking was a tugboat that was apparently deploying Tor anti-air missiles.
Russia is losing the overall Black Sea naval battle against a country without a navy. This is an argument for these DCS naval sims using lower skill levels for the Russian AI perhaps. : )
In addition to the Moskva sinking and at least two large landing ships, the following has been documented:
1. From 26 to 30 April OC South claimed strikes on the Russian forces on the island left a control post hit and two anti-aircraft missile complex Strela-10 destroyed as well as 42 Russian soldiers killed.
2. On 1 May, Ukrainian Air Force Command South claims to have launched an attack on Snake Island that destroyed Russian equipment stationed there.
3. On 2 May at dawn, two Russian Raptor patrol and landing boats were sunk by a Baykar Bayraktar TB2 drone. Video footage was released showing Russian Raptor multi-purpose boats being struck by guided bombs followed by explosions and fires.
4. On 7 May, Ukraine officials reported and displayed footage of a Russian Serna-class landing craft located in the Black Sea being destroyed near Snake Island by a Ukrainian drone.
5. Ukrainian Baykar Bayraktar TB2 drones were used to destroy two Tor surface-to-air missile launchers, one of which was in the process of being unloaded from the Serna-class landing craft, possibly clearing the way for a pair of Ukrainian Su-27s conducting a high-speed, low level bombing run that day; satellite photos seem to back up the footage.
6. Footage of a Ukrainian drone strike on a Russian helicopter on Snake Island was released independently verified by Reuters.
7. Russian Ministry of Defense claimed Russian forces repelled Ukrainian attempts to retake Snake Island. These claims have not been confirmed.
8. On 9 May, Ukrainian presidential adviser Oleksiy Arestovych said that Russian army holding the island is an advantage for Ukraine, as they can repeatedly assault Russian targets on the island. The UK Ministry of Defense reported that according to their analysis, Russia was trying to reinforce an exposed garrison on the island, where upon Ukraine had successfully launched drone attacks against resupply vessels and air defenses.
9. On 12 May, Ukraine claimed it had attacked Russian logistics ship Vsevolod Bobrov near Snake Island, causing it to catch on fire and be towed back to Sevastopol.
10. On 17 June, Ukraine claimed to have sunk the Spasatel Vasily Bekh with two harpoon missiles.
Sais the viedo must be shorter than 1h.
Still posts the more than 1 h video.
I am watching this viedeo.
Yeh, the gunfight took longer than expected...