Exhaust Smoke! Bent Valve? Bad PCV? How to do a Leak Down Test?
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- čas přidán 6. 09. 2024
- Ohhhh man. If you missed the AutotopiaLA video of my 69 GTO, check it out here! • LOUD Pontiac GTO Custo...
As you can tell, in between shifts there's a puff of smoke out the Passenger Side exhaust... I have an X pipe, which means there's something going on with the Driver Side Valve train. Is it a bent valve? Bad Valve Guide? A PCV (Positive Crankcase Ventilation) issue? Let's figure it out! We'll read the plugs, do a Leak Down Test and go from there... fingers crossed I don't have to pull the head! If I can do this at home, so can you!
Make sure you also see this video, that I forgot to include... it's how to read a spark plug, which explains why I was targeting Number 7! • How to read a spark pl...
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This channel is all about how to's and what to watch out for, when working on your own car. Mike is at the tail end of rebuilding his Pontiac 400, which is now a Butler Performance 467, because a Roller Lifter Broke! (see link below). Also fresh off of installing a New TREMEC TKO 600 from Silver Sport Transmissions. Subscribe to watch more projects on this built, not bought, 1969 Pontiac GTO.
Parts in this video;
OTC Leak Down Tester;
www.summitraci...
Here's the original Hydraulic Roller Lifter Fail Inspection, and process:
• Something is still WRO...
Here's the Official Part 1, where Mike starts the preparation of Engine removal
• Pontiac V8 Camshaft Re...
Here's the start of the TREMEC installation, • How to install a Wilwo...
Enjoy, and ask questions by leaving a comment below... See you on the other side!
See the build pics, before and after, at www.fastmontysgarage.com
Instagram/fastmontysgarage
#GarageBuilt #Pontiac #DIY
I stop the video just before the bore scope part because I had a thought.
That thought being, that if the valve seems to be seating fine, then my first thought would be the valve guide or guide seal.
Taking into consideration that you had a catastrophic failure in the valve train, it is possible that you may have enlarged the valve guide.
(As we all say in the south, ya woller'd it out ) this is one way of getting oil burning and still have a seated valve.
Just a thought . Now, back to our regularly schedule programming.lol.
I learn something every day... Woller'd! Love it! Thanks!
Well I learned that there's a Teflon tape made for gas / oil resistance. Mike I am happy for you to find out it's not a bent valve or valve guide. 😌
Ha! You and me both! Thanks John!
@@FastMonty hi Mike was looking at your merchandise of all the tees which one would you recommend for comfort and durability.
@@johnkennedy8452 Thanks John... I've tried the Premium and the Triblend. I prefer lighter weight T shirts, so I like the TriBlend better. Thanks for the support! (Oh, I like the masks too)
@@FastMonty I'll get a tri blend no need to thank me ,it's my way of saying thanks for all the awesome videos you've made it's nice to have another Pontiac enthusiast s to follow . when do you think you'll start the EFI install.?
@@johnkennedy8452 thanks John! Actually just started the FiTech install today. I only have about an hour a day... so, it'll be awhile. Ha ha. Thanks again!
First test should be dry and wet compression test on all cylinders. This will tell you what you need to know. A bad valve will be low both dry and wet, after a squirt of oil.
If wet is higher you have blow-by so probably want pistons. Pontiac used cast pistons even on most performance engines so get her punched out with a set of forged racing pistons with compression ratio to suit what fuel you intend to use.
If it's low on wet compression pull the head, unless you have a hole in your piston it's not the problem. Check gasket for cracks or blowouts, then head. Pour liquid in combustion chamber with spark plug installed, blow air in ports and look for bubbles. Soapy water could help. Let's assume you see bubbles on one or more valves you want to send them for a valve job.
Check for ridge on cylinders that indicate wear and suspect high mileage and consider a full rebuild, such a classic deserves a fresh engine but don't swap out an original motor. Always rebuild, if original motor is long gone then a crate motor may be nice
Good points, Don... luckily I didn't have to go that far, reading the plugs and re-examining the wrong PCV plumbing... that was the issue. Thanks for the comment!
I paused this video at the point where you mention the firing order and that to rotate the crank every 90° after #1 cylinder.
Helpful hint; if you have a degree wheel and install it at the crank, you will be more accurate at finding every 90° of rotation.
For those that don't have 90 degree marks on their balancer, that's a great idea! Thanks!
Last thought, the PCV can go bad and not function as it should, allowing oil to get past, and into the intake. And sometimes, even reverse , not letting air to pass either way. So, just replace it. They're not expensive.
On a stock engine, for sure! But, for us modified guys... check this out... czcams.com/video/fdYFieOOGq4/video.html
This channel is so informative. Definitely using your channel when building a Pontiac engine. You cover a lot of good details
Thanks! I appreciate the support... good luck on your build!
I hate that kind of fun. :) My guide plates on my 70 Z28 wore out a pushrod until it bent a bit while going up the street. Found that what was suppose to be hardened wasn’t. Swapped them all out. The new ones I got were 1 piece design, black and hardened from Comp. No marks on them at all after yrs of use.
I made my own leak down tester which works great.
Here is the formula if your compressor can’t reach 100 or more PSI.
(Orig psi minus final psi) divided by orig psi mult by 100.
If orig pressure is 120 psi and the final pressure is 80 psi.
(120-80) / 120 x 100 = 33% leakage
If orig pressure is 90 and the final pressure in 80 psi.
(90-80) / 90 x 100 = 11% leakage
When using 100 orig pressure the math is straight forward.
If orig pressure is 100 and the final pressure is 97 then you have 3% leakage.
(100-97) / 100 x 100 = 3% leakage
During each test have the carb at WOT and oil cap off, oil dip stick out and rad cap off, then using a rubber fuel line to your ear, make note where the leak is coming from: carb, oil cap, oil dip stick, rad fluid with bubbles or the tail pipes.
In your case I’d go through and set all your valves. Try using the EOIC method which I found to be real accurate then test one or two of the cyl again.
I bought a new PCV hose from GM parts back in 1985 and it still looks new after 65,000 mi and it is angled 90* at the PCV which is correct for my 70 LT1 with the straight PCV valve.
PCV never goes to the air breather, in early cars/trucks it went from the carb to the drivers side valve cover. In some mid 70 and up cars they have a small filter on the inside of the breather locked in place with a sliding metal clip with the hose connected to a metal tube going into the pass side valve cover. My 70 LT1 Z28 has a metal tube in the pass side valve cover with a hose connected to it running into the attached tube under the breather where inside the top of the hole has a metal flame arrestor.
my1970z28.com/COPO/images/breather_1st-2nd_gen2.JPG
my1970z28.com/COPO/images/napa2095_air_filter4.JPG
Yep, hardened pushrods are mandatory... ha, ha... Thanks for the comment!
Great episode Mike! Glad it was something simple and not something catastrophic. Thanks for the how-to!
Thanks Johnny! Me too! Ha, ha...
Another great tutorial Mike..glad it wasnt a valve..it would be nice see the burning oil disappear on your next movie and let us know if performance has increased..hats off to ya.
Thanks Daniel! Actually, yes, the first test drive had noticeably more power. Not sure if the Number 7 was missing, or if the back pressure was preventing RPMs from increasing, or both. (And less back firing too) So, I consider it a major success, considering I was debating on pulling the head, if it was a bent valve. Thanks again!
Ive blown intake gasket and same result . Valve seals go bad.broken ring
Land. From hyper utectick pistons
The pistons caused that? Very interesting.
Thumbs up brother great video I also have the PCV valve in front of the Valley Pan going into the front of my carburetor which is a Edelbrock and you are right the original stock Pontiac engines of that error the valve cover Have a vacuum hose connected to the air cleaner on the carburetor so the positive crank ventilation will get evenly spread out this should solve your problem
And I know how much you like braided hose you can actually use a braided hose as a vacuum hose also just make sure you use the right size I have them on my Pontiac engine and never run into no issues
Same location on my 72 Ventura, PCV on the valley pan to the PCV post on the Edelbrock Carb
@@v8pontiacvent that's right brother
Thanks Luis!
@@firstgenerationgarage2803 Ha! Yeah... great idea! Thanks again!
Great video I learned a lot nobody does videos on that kind of stuff
Thanks John! I really appreciate the comment... I'm just trying to pass on what I've learned with this crazy hobby. This Friday's video is going to have some design and fabrication, which I haven't done much of yet. Hope it helps inspire some creativity! Thanks again for the comment.
Hi Mike, I recommend installing an oil catch can that will keep your intake system clean. Your videos are great! nice greetings from Switzerland👍👌
Thanks Chris! Yeah, as I mentioned, I'm going to monitor the situation after about 100 miles. Pull the carb, and check to see if oil is getting through. If it is, catch can will be next! Thanks for the comment!
Looks like your valley pan might not be baffled. The Tomahawk valley pan designed by Ace Brewer, is a very nice piece that is baffled, and it clears roller lifters.
Great idea! I welded in a baffle to mine, but will definitely check out the Tomahawk version. Thanks again!
@@FastMonty this wagon was plagued with oil consumption because of the pcv and a non-baffled valley pan.
czcams.com/video/kGgOTKvWZZk/video.html
@@nachomax1639 Thanks for sharing!
Glad everything is ok.✌️
It wasn't, shortly after this fix. Oil starvation due to poor PCV
Mike, don't scare us like that! :^D I was dreading a tear-into-the-engine conclusion. Glad it didn't turn out that way.
Your video sparked an idea for a change on my own car ('74 Formula 400), which is that the power brake booster is (now was) plumbed to that same #7 runner by the PO (I think I have the same intake manifold as you). I decided it made more sense to run the power booster hose to the base of the carb (Edelbrock Performer 1405), so that similar to what you said, the "load" of the booster is placed on all the cylinders, not just #7. Obviously, it will only make a difference in that instance when I step on the brake, but why not spread it over all the cylinders?
My PCV plumbing is like stock, where the hose comes out of the base of the front of the carb, with the PCV valve in the valley pan just behind the coolant crossover. So I was able to just remove the plug from the back of the carb base, replace it with a hose barb, and plug the port in the #7 runner. What the heck is that port for, anyway? I never realized that it's so far down the runner until I saw this video.
While I'm on the subject of power booster hose - remember, folks, don't use 3/8" fuel line. There is an 11/32" hose expressly for power booster usage. Hose meant for vacuum is measured in 32nds.
Thanks Griff! Good advice on the brake booster too... That #7 port is for an EGR valve. Exhaust Gas Recycling... so, on emission controlled cars I believe it pumps gas in there, when it's cold? Not sure, but definitely not optimum for a PVC valve. Thanks again for the comment!
@@FastMonty oh, right - you said EGR in the video. I’ve slept since I watched it. 😄
@@griffmillerii1885 Ha! No worries... I know the feeling. :)
Very Good Job Explaining Leak Down Test ,Just One More Addition,Check For Bubbles In The Radiator ,Head Gasket Bad ,Cracked Head ,Thank You For Your Videos !!!
Thanks Greg! You're absolutely right... that's the other thing a Leak Down Test will help determine. Thanks for the reminder!
great looking car .
Thanks!
I see you have a dual plane manifold so you are correct the pvc valve should be able to draw vacuum from all 8 cyclinders . Both plains .
Yep! Drives way better now!
Excellent video as always.
But have you ever thought of using a crankcase evacuation system?!
Thanks Brother... yes, it's on the list. Gonna see how the new plumbing performs first. Then determine if I should improve the baffel, add an oil separator, or, as you pointed out... adding a evac system. Thanks for the comment!
@@FastMonty keep up the excellent work !👏🏻🤘🏻💪🏼
@@19211265 Thanks! Doing my best!
Crazy how the devil is in the details. Cam timing right on, everything torqued, etc. One bad hose placement and she is blowing smoke. I will definitely watch to make sure I do mine correctly when I get to reassembling my motor. Thanks for the information on the Teflon tape. Never occurred to me that there is an automotive grade(oil/fuel resistant).
I totally agree! I can't believe I overlooked it, and wasn't thinking... crazy how it created so much havoc. Glad I was able to share something new with you. (Yellow PTFE). Thanks for watching, and I look forward to more comments from you! (Love your screen name too!)
I just picked up a dual flow pcv valve, hope it will help with my issue
Yeah, those are slick... I might add one too. Let us know!
@@FastMonty ,What is a dual flow PVC valve ?
He's referring to this... www.mewagner.com
Great video. Learned a lot!
Great to hear! Thanks for the support, and comment!
Great info Mike
Thanks Bill!
I’m wondering about your valve seals and guides? I had a early 80’s GMC that would blow blue smoke on shifts and on decel. Turns out I had hardened valve seals. In all it was an easy fix.
Will definitely keep it in mind... need to monitor the situation for the next 100 miles. Thanks for the comment!
Squirt oil in cylinders if compression comes up much its the rings if not
Its the valves ?
Agreed. But, you can typically hear it. Same with a blown head gasket, you can hear that through where ever that's leaking, ie through the radiator.
Thanks for such a good channel on Pontiac s , please what kind of brake master cylinder do you have on the GTO and is it a power brake system? Thanks
Thanks David! I do have power brakes, using Hyrdo Boost, with a CPP Dual Master Cylinder. It's awesome!
@@FastMonty Thank you I have 67 Firebird with the 400 and the brake booster takes up lots of real estate , and after watching how you do get research thought you would have the correct answers Thank you again , please continue the great detailed videos
@@davidbisnette7673 No worries! Welcome to the channel... see you soon.
I have subscribed .
Welcome to the family!
@@FastMonty
Welcome to the Pontiac family.
Signed, Grandpa Poncho.
Glad to be here! Thanks!@@phillipthethird42
What are some of the channels you recommend for learning paint/body? TIA!
You need to find/follow Kevin Tetz with Eastwood. He's who I learned from.
My intake manifold has a port. So it’s not plugged into my carburetor
That's awesome... as long as it evenly distributes the fumes to all cylinders. (As I've found with mine, it only distributed fumes/oil to Number 7) My first couple of test drives have revealed a LOT less back firing too. Thanks for the comment!
Awesome Content
Thanks!
@@FastMonty No problem, I’m in the process of building a 455 to put in my 67 GTO before graduation (if we have one) so I will be applying a great deal of your experiences.
My GTO has some fouling in cylinder #3, could this be coming from the PCv also?
It "could", pull the carb and see if you can look into that runner. Might help to look up how to "read" your plugs to see if it's fuel or oil. Good luck!
@@FastMonty sounds good I'll do that this weekend.
@@henrychavez824 I hope it's an easy fix! Good luck!
@@FastMonty I hope it's an easy fix to, I don't feel like removing the motor. Looking to sell also if you might know anyone who is looking for 64 Gto. Thanks Fast Monty.
@@henrychavez824 I'll keep my ears pealed for you... good luck!
What type of wiper motor are you using? If you dont mind me asking
Ha! A little off topic, but it's chevelle wiper motor from Detroit Speed. It's purely for looks, as I'm waiting for them to release the 69 GTO version. Thanks!
@@FastMonty yea sorry I know it's off topic. Lol. Thanks for the info. Just cought a glimpse of it in the video. Been following you for sometime now. You help me through my 72 lemans project.
For your sake I hope it's not a bent valve
Thanks John, doesn't seem so... I think they're be some glaring evidence during the leak down test.
I think my ass needs a leak down test because I am always blowing gas🤣