Toxicity in the Goth Scene - Politics, Elitism, Attention-Seekers
Vložit
- čas přidán 12. 02. 2020
- I give my thoughts and opinions on the ongoing toxicity within the alternative scene!
†††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††
- Instagram: / necrocrafts
- Twitch: / necrocrafts
- Discord: / discord
†††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††
If you would like to help fund me for things like my projects, hardware, stream environment, you are more than welcome to. Every penny counts will only go towards those few things. Thank you!
- Donate: www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr...
†††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††
I used to be drawn to the Goth scene, among other things, because I thought the focus is on individual personality and NOT group identity based on things that have little to do with a person's actual character and personal values. Unfortunately, humans are tribal, and in any community the majority will be conformists and intolerant virtue signallers. So that's why I keep my "gothness" to myself and don't bother to mingle will scene people who can't tolerate political views they disagree with. I'm definitely left leaning politically but I can't stand militant, dogmatic "woke" people. These are classic bullies in disguise who think they know better, but just enjoy feeling powerful and righteous. Just as bad IMO as close-minded conservatives and religious people, the attitude and behavior is eerily similar. But these tend to be people who are superficial, lack experience, and have no personality of their own.
When you mentioned the DJs playing the same mainstream shit in every goth club, you reminded me of a bar in Raleigh, NC (I forgot the name) that presents itself as a haven for punkers, goths, and other freaks of society but play a lot of pop music out of their stereo when they don't have punk bands playing live. The worst part was they put up a written sign that says don't request any songs.
I guess they need to protect their pretentiousness.
So if I have to hear so much pop shit, I might as well go to a trendier nightclub where the women are far more attractive than the blue-haired, man-hating feminists.
We have a club called numbers in Houston out here they pretty much just does that; play a bunch of techno electro noise on their “goth nights” it’s trash.
I think that goth, industrial and some metal belongs in the goth club. There should be clubs for people who are into music that isnt just radio - friendly music
@@3vReanimated I now remember the name of that poser bar. It's called Slim's in Raleigh, NC.
If I want to hear that pop crap I can go to the local gym.
To those of us who have been in this circle for a while, we NEED to stand up and stomp out bullying. If we allow those around us to chase away the Baby Bats, we WILL die out. This community should and needs to be a welcoming and loving one. We are not generally accepted by outsiders so we need to accept or at least tolerate each other. Us weirdos need to stick together and suppprt each other. Coz if we don't, who else will? 🖤
I’m 28, I rarely ever go out anymore now because it’s bad lol.
I am two years late on seeing this video, but you know, better late than ever and I gotta say, I respect the hell out of you for this, I'm also independent when it comes to politics in the Goth scene. Last I checked the subculture was supposed to be apolitical, I don't like to bring that in the scene, the Alternative is supposed to be escapism just like comic books are supposed to be escapism. I personally agreed with Trump on some of his policies and I didn't think he was perfect, but he was certainly better than the presidents before him and after him. I think you handled it very well with that psycho chick, her and her friends taunting you at the end teasing you while you were banned was very childish and that's what I've been seeing in the scene lately. Kids in adult bodies. I also agree we don't need racial reminders in the subculture either. I don't give a shit about your race, I care more about your personality and how you treat people. I actually quit following Goth pages for these reasons, I got tired of the drama and political debates. I actually quit following a lot of Goth CZcamsrs as well and Cemetary Confessions is a prime example of that. It's really become a witch hunt in the scene when it comes to the liberal Goths discovering conservatives in the scene. Conservative Goths is pretty much the boogieman to them. I don't mind Republicans and I don't mind Democrats, I just don't like radicals on both sides and I seriously cannot stand the woke either. I loved how you pointed out the scene may fall in a bad direction if this keeps up, it'll certainly cause the scene to get smaller and smaller and might just die down. We need to put aside our differences and seek common ground; agree to disagree, that type of thing. It's actually a good thing to to encounter someone who has a different view than you, but it's not good to have a screaming match and lack acknowledgement which that goes back to the point the scene will eventually just die out, if we don't get our shit together and stop dividing everybody in the scene exiling people over different political beliefs. It goes with a say "we unite, we rise, we divide, we fall." All on all, I respect you dude and you just earned my subscription and I wouldn't mind having a conversation about this type of stuff later on.
Yeup. I don’t go out much just aside from all that, but mainly because the music is so fucking awful these djs play. The Houston crowd is smaller than so cal and it’s still all the same. I enjoy myself more at just drinking sitting alone minding my own than to talk to any of the twats at these clubs. It’s a pitty, maybe rozz killed himself because he realized how fucking bad the scene was starting to become 😂
@@3vReanimated He certainly was miserable which certainly led to his suicide. Rozz died back in April 1st, 1998. I did like his music indeed more than other singers who were in Christian Death. The problems with the DJ is not only because of the same set of music they are playing in the club to my experience, it's also because they cater to the wrong crowd and that being these big framed glasses manbun trendy sleeve tattoo poofy beard gelled mustache wearing Hipsters who aren't there for the music, but to get drunk and act like idiots in the club dancing by bouncing up and down or spinning each other around getting in the way of others who are trying to dance, but keep getting bumped by them idiots. Some also go in the club just to see the chicks dressed up Alternative and likely would grope them which would likely lead them to getting their asses kicked by the girl or her boyfriend/husband. They start moshing to The Sisters Of Mercy to The Cure to Clan Of Xymox to Even Softcell which aren't really groups to mosh to which im sure you know some of these groups. Some of these Hipsters in the club in my town will stand around and look like they own the place and think they're so cool and that they know everything and about the scene looking down on those who are there for the music and all dressed up. Pretty much acting like they're better than the real deal, but they can't even name an actual band in the subculture that we dance to. These weirdos are really just there to dance just to dance (despite their severe lack of knowledge to the bands that play there weather they are Darkwave, Deathrock, Industrial, Gothic Rock or Synthwave and just don't bother to go to the DJ to ask who's playing).They're there to get drunk and plenty of them will talk about politics (which are just woke leftist like that woman you spoke of in the video), I don't hear anything about the music coming out of their mouths or anything about the subculture and the DJ caters to these people and more and more of them keep showing up, hell the DJ doesn't play much of the genres I just listed above, he just plays mostly Synthpop to New-Wave music. Plus it's led to making the club have a new decoration, where it's more colorful with crappy paint on the wall looking like it was done by a kindergartener. I see no gargoyle statues, no webs, no dark arts on the wall, it just looks crappy and the paintings outside the club how it's designed outside is like Summer land with a sunset. It is so out of place for the scene, so I quit going there along with those who quit as well. You try to address this with the DJ, he disregards it and gets defensive saying nothings going wrong, the club is fine and still going great. Yeah only because he has the wrong group of people in the club that he keeps attracting more and more of them and they're what's keeping the club going and more of them keep coming causing the real deals to come in less and less.
@@3vReanimated Now I get that the music is more important, but I'm the person who embraces both style and music and I've heard stories of Hipster problems in other scenes as well aside from the Alternative scene.
@@3vReanimated I get you said the scene should be welcomed for everybody, but like I said in the club in my town, our DJ caters to those who don't care for the music and are just attending the place to be goofy and they have that pretentious attitude like you said about the folks in the club in LA you said.
Kool hairstyle my guy.
When looking at how discrimination that exist directed towards transgender people and POC or other groups, in the US and other countries, I think its great to see that goth subculture are one of the places that welcome transgender people and other groups.
Yep, they welcome fake trans people and people obsessed with gender, and they conflate gender and personality. But this is generally a problem in normal society anyway, not just the alternative scene. They basically make a mockery out of being trans.
I know I am way late but finally someone that calls this out. I live in SC so not much here for goths but the toxicity of politics and the disrespect of southern people is ridiculous. Didn't know geographically placement means I can't be goth or I have views that are considered conservative nowadays to kick me out of forums, bars, and get assaulted for. Same people screaming for tolerance and inclusivity destroying the community for attention seeking. 💔
Im late to the party but I was literally just talking about this with someone. There's been a HUGE shift in the subculture and its pretty toxic and the worst type of people are gatekeeping it and propagating it. Its sad because I've lost some good friends over radicalization of leftist ideologies. Goth was never meant to buckle to any specific political or religious stance period. I literally watched a video of a "Goth" girl explaining how if you have right wing beliefs you can not be a Goth.. So in her mind you have to support socialism and communism because Communism is the way if you are true goth. Lmao, well the sad truth is my family escaped Communism because they massacred certain types of people and so they came to the US. I can tell you its not good and this new shockwave of misinformation and radicalism in every genre or subculture is ridiculous. I believed the true Goths are well read individuals that just rebel and have a hatred for stupidity and shallow antics in general but thats just me.
Couldn’t have said it better myself. At least I’m not alone. I haven’t been out much anymore since I moved to Houston, but it is generally the same as it was for me in cali. Everyone in this scene are beyond broken.
I've never had that problem with the goth clubs in CA, but I picked up on pretentiousness from a goth club in Seattle. I always thought the pretentiousness stemmed from the people being from Seattle but a friend of mine from another goth club in Seattle, although agreed with my statement, explained to me that the pretentious douches in the said goth club were transplants from California
(talk about irony). And when I lived near Seattle, I never picked up the vibe that I would get attacked just for agreeing on one or two conservative beliefs, but I always picked up a vibe of hardcore feminist hypocrisy, especially in the said goth club.
I mean the type of feminist hypocrisy where the women will try to convince you you're victimizing a woman but at the same time try to convince you all men need their permission just to breathe. And if a man even looks in their direction, they'll to convince that man that he's a rapist.
i was involved in the L.A. punk scene very early 80's and believe you me there was tons of snobbery and elitism then too. before i cut my hair it was long and i almost got my ass beat because of it at my first real punk gig. most of the people were cool or indifferent but the shithead minority were total assholes male and female and ever present. you know the type people who get off on negative empowerment and just love fucking thangs up fer others.
people are tribal it's very much part of how our species has evolved and that includes gossip, judgementalness, etc. nowadays the goth scene is much more chilled and welcoming and if anybody is judgemental about how yer dressed (especially we know women love to hack on each other) people keep it to themsleves. you'll never get rid of tribalism completely but since the advent of the internet and other modern tech i'd say the goth scene probably has the least of it as far as subcultures. the guys who work security at goth clubs say goth clubs are the easiest gigs because there's never fights or any of that other crap.
I cant comprehend how the US have got to this point.
I dont feel like its a big issue, personally. When it comes to politics, Im not very political, but there are certain issues that cant be distinguished from politics that are also very important.
Transgender issues and issues around racism and fascism cant be touched upon wo it being political.
Im not really sure how much I agree or disagree with when it comes to trans rights activists, but I aknowledge and agree that their fight is actually a very important one.
In terms of fascism I think everyone should be concered even if we are not very political.
Attacking or bullying someone isnt cool, however.
Agreed. Im very interested in LGBTQ- issues and discrimination,but Im not very political other than that.
. My problem is when people use shaming in a conversation where you should be able to engage with people.
I feel like its all over the boarder if you think outside of the box, the rigid conformists will attack you. Conformity can destroy critical thinking.
Contrapoints did a video about cancel culture. I love it.
What club in LA was this at? I Def don't miss the CA scene. New York & Texas were alot more welcoming from my experiences.
I live in Houston now and visit Etro sometimes numbers is not really goth when they do their “underworld nights” but it was a club by the name of “club dominion” down in downtown riverside.
While I'm not conservative and will admit that I don't agree with a lot of conservative politics, I don't think that being a conservative means that one can't be a goth. Goth is not a political ideology, it's a music-based scene and so long as you like and enjoy the music, that's really all that matters regardless of your background. That said, while I am more left-leaning in my views, I have definitely faced the backlash of the more extreme people in the scene because of my views on transgender ideology. Long story short, I don't believe in trans ideology period and as far as I'm concerned, it's a homophobic, misogynistic, and child abusing (the belief of "trans kids" and giving them irreversible puberty blockers that'll jeopardize their health) cult. But to a lot of goths within the scene, they have seemed to swallow the dogma and seem to not be open to critical thinking on that topic and if you speak out against it, you're viewed as essentially a heathen. Needless to say, after facing the backlash and getting banned in the more active online goth spaces I used to participate in, I haven't really talked to many goths (or rather alternative people in general) these days because in my experience, many of them do vehemently believe in gender ideology and I'd rather not deal with people calling me things like "phobic" and "bigot" when I know more than likely that I've done much more research and critical thinking on the subject than they have.
In a way it kinda is a bummer because back then I used to be excited when I'd see alternative people IRL but these days, I don't really feel that excitement much anymore.
Anyway, it's interesting and rather nice to come across a video like this of a goth who isn't as nose deep in extremely far left politics.
I left the goth scene long ago because of the left drama and unfortunately it seems to many goth women and men are feminist and unfortunately the lgbtq community was not something I agreed with but unfortunately I left do to all this and now unfortunately since I left I have no place to fit in
Always described myself as Ghetto Goth, felt home in the Goth scene since i was 10, took the abuse from society and school etc on the chin, not a liberal, not a comme, but dont care what someones political ideology is if we exist in the same scene, I enjoy Goth music, i do enjoy the fashion aspects of Goth culture, yes more "Mall Goth" not as much into the traditional Victorian Goth style, but nontheless, I am what I am, and have been since the early 2K. Oh and I am libertarian right leaning. But again, Has nothing to do with the Goth culture. Anyway just my perspective
Just be safe friend.
Aladeen I was
I'm more into metal myself, so your perspective as an alt-individual about the alt scene makes for an interesting watch :). Unfortunately politics is a touchy subject in nearly every scene.
Not an American, but I do support Trump myself for the most part, which has gotten me a lot of shit - even just being right-wing-leaning. I'm at a stage where I don't tend to talk about my political values unless it's necessary.
I want to join animal rights groups and do work with them, but in my own experience I've seen them to be very left-wing organisations. Which itself is fine, but from past experiences it's a cause for concern for me when I don't believe my politics matters for such a group.
Hopefully you make more videos like this in the future!
whale4116 I agree, but I I had to talk about it in terms of how it affects the alternative scene and my experience with it. I don’t really like talking about politics but I felt it necessary to get my point across.
I identify as a liberal but I do support the daily wire and conservative people out there like Arielle and Blaire white.. I wish being lgbt wasn’t political
Unfortunately through capitalism it has made it so. Companies using others “identity” to get people on board to buy company products. It’s one of the reasons why i stopped supporting anything and anyone ok with this. Dead by daylight for example was one of my favorite games constantly pushing this shit down our throats so I had to stop playing it and it’s a damn shame
@@3vReanimated making a character lgbt or putting some lgbt stuff in a game isn't "pushing down our throats", it's representation. If you feel so bothered by that then there is a problem there my friend
@@dongdingulus7954 you can “include” progressive shit without having to be upfront and annoying about it to cater to these weirdos. The same weirdos that then over-sexualize these characters on steams community page.
So yes, it is being pushed down our throats when the entire entertainment industry is doing this shit; movies, games, television all trying to normalize this crap. Gender swapping old characters, demonizing whites, skin swapping. It’s fucking bizarre when it’s unnecessary.
Feel like I’m beating a dead horse, but I’ll say it again. Companies do not give a damn about you and your lgbtlmnop identification, they do it to put themselves on a golden pedestal, money, and in good graces with the minorities that play games like dbd. If they don’t, they bitch and moan about it on Twitter, word of mouth means profit loss. We knew characters like nea were gay by the representation of their characters, we don’t need to be told they’re apart of some cult. You are not special and neither am I. I don’t get special privileges for being heterosexual and white. I’m just some turd trying to survive like everyone else.
@@3vReanimated cult ? what the hell man. Honestly, as long as they are not making being lgbt all about the character, there isn't really a problem or something to be pissed about, it makes us feel seen sometimes. I don't see how representation is bad. Yes I understand what you mean about them wanting money, but sometimes its not about that. I never played the game you mentioned, what exactly did they do ?
@@dongdingulus7954 I’m not attacking you nor “true” lgbt people. The people who play dead by daylight are not lgbt, they’re weirdos that probably use it to mask their pedophilia. Some of the streamers play dbd I’ve seen I’m just like Jesus Christ…..
Dead by daylight use to be a pretty neutral grounded horror game, you had some characters you could choose from as survivors to play as. Some that were developed you can tell had queer type qualities and that was ok don’t mind that at all, cool, whatever. But this was back in 2016-2017, since the game blew up and being a “horror” title people recognized it more. The problem is the company is too in touch with social media and not their actual game thinking the minorities that play this is what they should transition the game into. So they kept adding lgbt related content into the game, rainbow flags, lgbt related events and then when the developers made mention they were not going to sexualize the characters and leave it up to us to decide, they did it anyways and broke that 2 years later and let us know that David king was gay by lore…..
It’s a horror based game, I don’t expect to see a bunch of weird identity politics pushed into a game I enjoy playing much like the same if they kept pushing a bunch of stupid Hetero shit. I want to detox from life, not be put back into the matrix.
There were other issues with the game too, people using black masked leather face to troll black streamers which just sounds so absurd and sounds like Reddit trolling. People over sexualizing the characters both female and male making them nude or fucking through art after the game got bigger.
There’s just too much wrong politically with the game that I ended up leaving and have not touched for a full year now.
I don’t know why I do t look up goth CZcams… I gues dayly life I should CZcams as well
Hopefully you changed your belief regarding abortion by now. It is NEVER ok to murder an unborn baby. This isn’t just some political thing. This is a human rights issue. Unborn babies are treated as if they are not human.
Lol idgaf about none of that dumb shit. Just tired of it forced into the scene. It’s your body and your life and your kids life, none of my business. I don’t control your life and neither should politicians.