The reason my parents ended up going to an IBLP seminar was because my sister went, came back, and then refused to tell them about it. My father got so frustrated with her, he ended up signing he and my mother up. My life became a nightmare after that. I was 13, had grown up watching my older siblings date and do normal things, then I was suddenly told I could do none of that. My father became abusive after having been a normal dad for years. Fortunately, ATI wasn't a thing then so I did escape that and went to a public high school. Every afternoon I dreaded going home to be told about rebellious children being stoned to death in the Old Testament. I am in my 60s now and it was only about five years ago that I came to terms with the fact that I had been in a cult.
Bless your heart, I hate to hear these stories of cults teaching children /who grew up totally confused in life. I wish I knew the answer, I hope you are doing well. God bless you.
One other thing...I am REALLY blown away at how she and her mother resisted Bill Gothard to his face. Not everyone who has been indoctrinated this way succeeds in defying a cult leader in any way. I hope Emily will see that immense strength that she had, even back then.
Absolutely agree. She was always fierce. What a beautiful thing. Thank God for her mother’s strength in that moment too. I kept wondering, what does the mother say about choosing to stay with the rapist criminal, child abuser husband once she discovered what he was doing to Emily? I wish that question had been asked.
@@elizabethkettle2323 I would want to ask more questions there. I also wonder if her mother was being abused because sadly, abused people will take a lot of actions that are to their own and their family’s detriment because of the massive fear they have been indoctrinated with.
@@elizabethkettle2323 That is exactly what I was thinking!!!! I just can't believe her mother did not protect her and get her away from her child molesting father. In essence her mother allowed this abuse to go on, and bears some responsibility. It took him leaving for the abuse to stop! Hopefully he is in prison now, and if not, I hope she will make sure to seek legal help to make sure he is convicted of sexual molestation.
Break the cognitive dissonance. Break the mind control spell. Break me off a piece of that KitKat bar... inappropriate joke, yes. Am I going to hell for it? Nope, we broke the mind control spell, so I'm safer than an Olympic swimmer in a kiddy pool.
@@Heather.R. my last job was as a graphic designer for educational tests. Unfortunately I don’t have a functional computer setup. Otherwise I’d make one asap!
I remember some silly things that were said at my husband’s church that blamed women back when I was a teen in the 70s. I had no idea it had its basis in the IBLP but it makes sense now. I was Presbyterian and we didn’t think that way. Of course, my church was considered heathen.
Seriously. If you, as a mother or father, feel attracted to your child and feel the need to force them to dress a certain way so you're not thinking about abusing them then the problem is with you. Not every other man/woman in the world. The majority of people do not think like that and to try to claim they do itd these evil degenerates way if feeling better about their disgusting urges.
I want to vomit, cry, then give this fierce woman a huge hug and validate that she did not deserve any of this and definitely did not invite it! So proud of what a powerful force and voice against all the abuse and abusers! Stay strong! I’m in awe of your strength ❤
Saaame. I was speechless for most of this interview. Pure and utter shock and sadness and then joy for her when she got out and shed all of it. **sigh** so much
Everyone who knew of this crime is a criminal for not reporting! This includes your mother, sorry, she should have protected you, the state or county should have got you out of that situation, yet they were probably never notified. I'm sorry, there is blame everywhere, justice needs to be served.
To me the father was always a degenerate scum, however her mother is most disgusting. She is the one who joined this cult in the hopes of changing this demon of a man at the expense of her daughter.
As a man it hurts my heart to hear of men who should be protective of their daughters ...not sexually abusing them. It also angers me to hear it taught that men just can't help themselves. To Hell with that! We most certainly can. It isn't a woman's fault if they get assaulted or raped.
I love that Bill spoke over her/her mom that she would become this bitter, rebellious, evil person, and yet even after all she’s been through, and after leaving the cult, the exact OPPOSITE is true and what a BEAUTIFUL testament that is
???? ....I am not a fan of Gothard- ites, but she is clearly a foolish rebel , and MORE THAN a little foolish ....and smiling 😅 about it ...shining about it 🤯
I don't think it is about religion. These predators are going to be wherever they are allowed to abuse children; even none religious daycares, schools, and groups have pedophiles. The solution is to not allow these criminals to hide. Organizations need to expose them and make them pay for their crimes. Most probably are fearful of the very thing you are doing here. Which is to blame an entire organization for the crimes of some sick individuals.
@@alleducation1982true but it is hidden and allowed to continue in churches more often due to “Freedom of Religion” in USA. So the coercive control of forgiving and purity culture and shame creates breeding grounds for this group. Look at the Catholic Church among others.
@@alleducation1982 It has everything to do with the religion. Everything you said is correct, but religious ideologies that oppress women and girls like IBLP does allows for predatory men to excuse their actions and blame the child for the assault they committed against them. And people within this religious group agree with him, and vilify her.
@@seranathenecromancer3470anything with an ideology can be a breeding ground for abusers. NXIVM wasn’t a religion. Sports organizations aren’t religious. People need to be aware in all these contexts
It’s ironic that cults tell their people that they will be in danger if they ever go out there- you might meet a rapist on a date- when all the while, the most dangerous predators are inside the group! Thank you for sharing your story ❤
They say you're more likely to be assaulted by someone youy already know. So messed up. You would think that knowing someone would make you more compassionate and less inclined to hurt them.
Bill Gothard should be rotting in a prison cell for sexual crimes, not in his upscale home which happens to be a few miles away from me. The IBLP institute is 6 miles away and I never knew about this until these documentaries and interviews. Thank you for speaking out and exposing this dangerous cult. And thank goodness Emily’s mother didn’t leave him alone with that predator!!
Well she left her with her father who she knew was a pervert and allowed it. It's really sad how easily people can be brainwashed but I will say I'm impressed her mother went head to head with the cult leader
I was in one of the Bill Gothard’s Institutes. I lived at the Indianapolis Training Center in Indiana between the ages of 13 and 15. I knew Gothard personally. When I refused to come out of my room and stay with my leaders 24/7. I had gotten beat with a really huge paddle that was half the size of me at the time. When I refused to accept them changing my leaders over and over again to make me submit, I had enough and started fighting back. 6 grown people held me down and hog tied me while beating me and one threatened to kill me if he could. Gothard tried to groom me but I wasn’t having it. I dropped their percent of saving children down to 99 as they say with them claiming I was rebellious, out of control, and hardheaded. I suffered a great amount of PTSD from living there. They gave me what ever I wanted. Bribed me with everything. I got better treatment than all the other LIT’s in that center. I was allowed to leave when no one else could. I could go on trips. All I had to do was ask and it was given, but the punishments were so much worse on me because I refused to be abused, I refused to be groomed, and I refused to come out my room a lot. I was sexually abused and sold as a toddler until I was 7-8 years old so I wasn’t going to be abused in that way again. And I knew what Gothard was doing from the moment I met him on my 14th birthday. That whole day I was getting prepared to meet him. They took me to the 13th floor to have my makeup and hair done. Then I went to get dressed before my birthday dinner. Gothard had just gotten into town. My table was at the front. His table was beside the podium while mine was right in front of it. He couldn’t keep his eyes off me. He spoke at the end and then came straight to my table to speak to me. He wanted a meeting with me in the Gergeni’s office. So the Gergeni’s escorted us to their office. Now women were never supposed to be alone with a man. EVER!!! It didn’t matter who it was unless they were married. We always had to be chaperoned when the opposite sex was around. But Gothard was aloud to be alone with us. Mr. Gergeni couldn’t be alone with but Gothard could which did not make any sense. The Gergeni’s escorted us to their office and then left leaving me alone with Gothard. He kept talking but I refused to speak cause I was very uncomfortable. He put his hand on my leg and I froze. He knew he wasn’t getting anywhere with me. He finally asked to pray for me and then called the Gergeni’s back in to tell them I wouldn’t speak. Mrs. Gergeni laughed and said but she is the loudest one of them all. They couldn’t believe I wouldn’t speak to him, but I knew what he was trying to do, and I didn’t want to give him any room to make any moves on me. He tried several times after that even trying to scare me using the judges, mayors, and lawyers to make me submit. Even the police officers were on his side but I refused. I called the police one night. Mr. Gergeni found me and snatched the phone out of my hand and told them I was there for treatment and I was an unruly child. The police never showed up, but the reporters did the next day. They shut the whole building down and refused to let anyone in or out. Gothard called bribing me to stay up stairs out of sight because I was the one they wanted to talk to. I had told the dispatcher the night before about the abuse. The reporters wanted my story but Gothard shut it all down. Gothard called to talk to me begging me to stay out of sight, bribing me with anything I wanted. They finally released me to go back home to my hometown in Augusta Georgia, because they didn’t want what happened getting out. Gothard came and asked me what was it I really wanted, and I told him I wanted to leave. They tried talking me out of it because I was about to start my career as a singer In his program. I had just gotten his permission to join the children’s choir. But I couldn’t take it anymore being there. That’s all I kept asking for was to go home, and he finally agreed to send me back home. My adopted father wasn’t happy to pick me up, and I ended up in foster care and mental hospitals, and group homes. But those were better than being there and being with my adopted parents. My parents knew about the abuse and the hog tie but did nothing to protect me. They said it was my fault, and they had given their permission for them to do whatever they had to do to make me submit to their authority. I endured 2 years of hell there until I forced them to release me. They only released me because the reporters were in front of their doors refusing to leave until they talked to me. I don’t know how they got them to go away. They were out there for a day I know, and then Gothard showed up at the center the next day to talk to me. I didn’t see them again after that. But shortly after that I was released from the training center.
Let me start with I am so sorry you had to live through that, but holy cheese muffins, that was bad! I don't know where to start, this is the kind of comment that you don't know if you should thumb it up because you're happy the op could get that off of his/her chest or not because it's horrific and makes you want to hug whoever the op because it seems like something he/she could use.
I don't understand how these people get away with this. I'm so sorry this happened to you. You deserved to be protected. I hope you have gotten the help you needed!
I am 53. I didn't grow up in the IBLP, but I did grow up in the Christian community. At age 12, my parents put me in a Christian school. The pastor/principal was a huge believer in Bill Gothard & the IBLP seminars & 100% backed Michael Pearl! All of this craziness is sounding very familiar. I didn't even realize the IBLP is what they were trying to brainwash us with until I watched Shiny, Happy People & started to watch this channel. And, I 100% agree...YOU ARE NOT GOING TO HELL FOR WEARING PANTS/JEANS!
Just a reminder for folks: Rusty and Andrea Yates tragedy. They were in a very similar "Quiverfull" type cut. Besides the sexual abuse. these cults put mothers in horrific living conditions.
I agree. I never felt that woman was entirely responsible for those murders. Just the family portrait shows a mother on the edge of psychological collapse. She needed help, not another baby to homeschool.
Funny how so often the disgusting creatures who make its living exploiting murder victims and the trauma and grief of their loved ones just have to shove its way in
@@nickywal If you're referring to me, I make no money off Yates tragedy. Nor am I employed in any industry that does. I lived down the street from the Yates when the murders happened. I've moved away, but return to the area periodically. I also personally knew a couple of other families practicing Quiverfull-type philosophies. So I have relevant personal feelings on the matter.
@@stillhere1425 Rusty and Andrea were told by psychiatrists that she shouldn’t have more children and shouldn’t go off her meds to have another child, but she did anyway due to these religious beliefs. Rusty knew she had psychosis and has thought about killing the children. He was told not to leave her alone with the children. He did it anyway. They also lived in a high stress crowded environment, home schooling in a converted school bus. She was found not guilty by reason of insanity.
Emily sharing what young girls have to endure in terms of sexual assault (making one “mighty in spirit” as a victim, for instance): I pictured the Duggar girls, having to sit through this as a school lesson. What a horrible horrible thing Gothard unleashed- like a primer on how to create victims and predators.
I just began watching the docuseries, I knew a lot of it but it’s blowing my mind how blatant some of the inappropriate behaviour was/is and it’s sooooo normalized and abusive. I’m so glad some exposure is being given to those issues
Talking about sexualisation of babies.. I was in a maternity ward with some religious Caribbean women. One took off her baby's nappy to change her, while some family were visiting. The little one started to cry; babies often do when suddenly unwrapped! The mother smiled and said "oh so good, she already has shame!" I was stunned. The baby was less than a week old!! As for this story.. let's remember how OLD he was when doing this to a teenager!
I don't know how you did this interview without crying - I was watching it with tears of both sadness and anger. I almost turned it off, but thought that if Emily could live it, I could hear it. I remember being admonished by people when I mentioned years ago that there was something wrong with 19 kids and Counting and being told that I was being judgmental and not following scripture. When I asked for scripture to back up their beliefs, I was told that I was not letting the Spirit lead me. (My Dad is a pastor and has never expected me to believe anything just because he says it - I was taught to search for the answers and then we could discuss out individual results.) So many red flags ... anyway, I praise God, Emily, that your Mom took you away from headquarters and I cried happy tears when you talked about your celebration of freedom day!
Geez, I just feel physically ill after listening to what she went through. I cannot FATHOM the bravery and fortitude it takes to leave that church, let alone tell these stories.
As someone that was sa'd for years, and then ended up with a fairly severe case of Crohn's Disease, I felt more of a connection with this story than most of the Mormon ones (I was raised Mormon). Crohn's was just my first autoimmune diagnosis, but it wasn't my last by any means. My heart goes out to you, Emily. Crohn's Fighters stay together. Hearts and spoons to you!
You're a good dad. I am a total Daddy's girl, so the idea of a father doing that to his daughter is just unthinkable for me. My father is the opposite - he makes any guy nervous who wants to date me LOL
I grew up in highly conservative mainstream religion (Greek Orthodox) and came across some Mormon missionaries, JWs and Scientologists over the years. I feel sorry for all the people brought in these abusive groups but especially for all the women that get conditioned and primed to be self-blaming victims at the hands of these creeps...
Same... Abuse was happening all around, and knew from an early age that things weren't right in our family, church, etc... It wasn't until I took myself to therapy as a young adult, (after being declined that during younger life, because we should just have faith that God would fix everything) that it all came together. 💔 All these years later, the healing is still in process.
@@Ell5589I was raised a JW. Never baptized. Still have family in the organization. I was raped at 15 by 2 Baptized JW. The elders counseled me and did nothing to the perpetrators. It is straight up a cult. But they are so brainwashed it’s hard to convince them otherwise. There are so many good people too :(
I lived in a cult 45 years ago.When I left the the cult I never left my faith.Deconstuction is a difficult thing to do.I joint the cult because of my faith and later left the cult because of my faith.I had to redefine my faith and found a church 13 years ago that really restored my faith and the relationship with the Allmighty.I am really happy now after all these years.I love your Linda listen.We are not going to hell for wearing jeans.
Emily is so intelligent, well-spoken, and self-aware. This video is definitely familiar and triggering at times, but it is so so important to shine a light on this. Thank you.
My oldest son of six children (now 35 years old, married and has one son, my beautiful grandson who will be one in July);just watched the documentary “Shiny Happy People” was completely shocked and triggered. He had a full blown panic attack! I’m grieving as a mother. I think I have a lot of denial on how much damage that IBLP did to our family and especially my older children. I’ve realized I HAVE to watch this documentary to help me heal and help my adult children to come to grasps with the damage this fu*king cult did to our family. I need to make this right with them!!! I need to ask for forgiveness for exposing them to this atrocity that sucked us in to thinking they were mainstream Christianity. I feel sick just thinking about all of the ramifications! So much more I can say about this! So much guilt as a mother who exposed them to this absolute bullshit!!! Thank you so much for sharing more on this dangerous cult!!!! I actually remember going to church functions where women would leave the table I was sitting at because they thought my shirt was too tight or cut too low and felt so ashamed and like a black sheep so many things coming up in my memories right now that I can’t believe I tolerated back then I am literally feeling sick to my stomach right now and I’m going to have to watch this later but thanks so much for sharing it needs to be exposed to the world people need to wake the hell up
Please don’t be ashamed to get professional help for yourself and your family if you need it! The resources with this video might help you locate a professional who is familiar with recovery from IBLP and other cults.
@@nerysghemor5781 thank you so much for your kindness and encouragement❣️My grown children have, thankfully, gotten some great therapy for their specific needs. Unfortunately, we lost my third born son, along with his wife and my granddaughter back in 2018.(small private plane accident 🥺) Some of my grown children are still in therapy, others are not. But they are all doing well and I am so grateful for that❤️🙏🏼 I am struggling, and I’m not saying that they’re not. One day at a time ❤️
Being raised in an environment where sexual abuse is happening, has continued to bring challenges in my life at 65. Every now and then, I am slapped upside the head with yet another character defect that I used to survive childhood, but now it just holds me back from how I relate to my fellow humans. I am so sad for these young women who are going through or have been through this kind of situation, yet so grateful that they are helping me deal with my own past. ❤
I'm a survival an abusive household because a religion, I left my parents home at 15 and emancipated at 16, nowadays I batle with MS and my doctor said me with all words that my MS was trigged by the abuse and stress that I deal with. This podcast strike a nerve in a good sense, because I'm not alone, thak you ❤
It wasn't because of the religion or because of religion but because of the people. Religion has nothing to do with what a person chose to do. It was the opposite of religion or God. Satan. So it was because of Satan not religion
26:37 I am not a violent person. But I am in a rage when adults abuse children. I feel so much for her. What a mental torture in addition to everything. Any child abuser deserves a life of torture in repayment.
What makes me enraged is that these groups are trying to point at drag queens as child abusers because they put on a princess dress and entertain kids why reading a book.
@@carolbaker2773 Yup. The actual predators are not those who are living their lives with inclusion, it is statistically the people that support child marriage, removal of women's rights, and are closer to home.
@@carolbaker2773 You don’t have to exonerate one evil to condemn another. The "Alphabet" political movement is as much a *cult* as any fundamentalist religion: BOTH gr00m the underrage. BOTH are incoherent and irrational. BOTH are intolerant of opposing views. And *De-transitioners* struggle with PTSD as much as any ex-cult member.
Thank you so much for sharing your story. I am a 40 year survivor of human trafficking. I don't know your personal pain but I can relate. There's not much support for HT Survivors. I would love to talk to you. I'm so thankful you were able to hold onto your faith. God is the only reason I'm alive. Stay strong my sister of survival.
My family did this program for a while when I was little. My dad grumbled so much about the beard thing. I don't know to this day why they left it, but they were totally on board with it until suddenly one day we weren't. Totally not suprised Bill Gothard was outed as a harrassor. Anyone who puts a woman's responsibility to maintain her appearance on the same moral responsibility to NOT Commit Adultery is someone who doesn't control themselves.
The husband of a close friend who was raised fundamentalist Christian left her and she had a total nervous breakdown because she could not exist without him. Her children, certainly she herself were nothing to her without her man at her side. She was literally in a useless fetal state. Women need to be something outside their marriages and families and they must be taught to be someone from infancy. And they cannot feel utterly responsible for holding their nuclear families together.
I went to his seminar when I was a baby Christian. Thankfully, I thought it was really wrong. The people who took me there told me, "You. are just being rebellious if you don't accept these principles." Thankfully, I prayed about it and asked God to show me if I was being rebellious. I never accepted Bill Gothard's teachings! I hate that they have hurt so many using scripture the wrong way. They will answer to God. I pray your future is bright!
Thank you for your transparency Emily. I definitely have to take a break on this one. I was abused from 12-18 and the church as asked me to sit with my moms husband while he apologized for being “inappropriate”…. I snapped. I didn’t go. They said I was being difficult. My mom is still married to him and gets upset when I say he is not allowed around me or my DAUGHTERS. Most of what she’s saying happened to me and was said to me. wild. So wild.
I’m so sorry to hear that. Their teachings are horrific and they have no idea the pain and suffering it causes those who are cursed with it. Sending my love ❤️
I watched Lindsey's interview of when she met Bill Gothard. Her interview, I don't think is on Cults To Consciousness, it was on a different channel, but Lindsey's story and Emily's story, when they met Bill Gothard are nearly identical.
This is absolutely HORRIFING!!! I am soo sorry that this happened to you !!! And the fact that you are not the only one ...that this happened to hundreds of girls is just unimaginable !!! The fact that this man is not in prison is even more unimaginable !!
The way your mother was able to protect you from Bill Gothard, and yet would do nothing to protect you from your father is repulsive. I'm glad he finally left, since she was clearly unable.
Forgiveness is not to set the abuser free of the wrong done but to set the victim free. However forgiveness does not mean we trust them again or have them in our life. I’m so sorry what happened to you. As a victim of religious abuse and molested by my father…there are parts of the story that really hit home. Thank you for being brave and strong and telling your story and helping others in similar situations.
I admire you two ladies so much for talking about what you have been through, expecially the sexual abuse, with so much strength and openness, it is hard to even listen to it without tearing up. You are doing so much work for the world, thank you for sharing your story, thank you for raising your voices ❤
When I left the Christian Church (pentecostal) and escaped my marriage with my kids to a Domestic Violence Shelter, I had to do group therapy 2 times a week at the DV shelter, and the book we had to all read was "Why Does He Do That? INSIDE THE MINDS OF ANGRY AND CONTROLLING MEN" Can also be Women, but they don't learn to abuse in churches. Written by a psychologist that specializes in treating abusers. He had the statistics that the number one place to get abused is in a church. It didn't matter what kind of church/religion. Basically, in all religions, men are not only given permission to abuse women but taught to. I do believe that because when I complained about the abuse to the pastor, he told me, "I made it easy for people to be mean to me!" Now there is sexism in that statement, but even more, is the ableism as I am autistic/ADHD. It is interesting because back in 1994 or 95 when I was diagnosed with ADHD I was given an IQ test. The psychologist never gave me the number I had scored. All she kept saying, and not so much to me, but to my husband was that I was absolutely brilliant. My ex is very proud of the fact that he is slightly above average in intelligence. I have come to the belief that she didn't want to give me the number because she feared what that might do, and what danger that might have put me in. Fast forward to 2021, I finally got my autism diagnosis which I prefer to call a recognition, and again I am told I am absolutely brilliant. We will one of these days retest me to find out what that means, but for now... LOL, I had to go see an occupational medical doctor and within the first 5 minutes, he looked at me and said, "Wow! I don't have to give you an IQ test!" I really think that a lot of the abuse from the church that I received was based on my intellect and my constantly asking questions. You know, questions, like: In your sermon today you said, this and quoted this scripture, but that scripture doesn't make any sense because it doesn't mean that, and especially when you look at these other 20 scriptures in all these other books. Then when they couldn't answer my questions, I would look at them like they were lying. I finally started to volunteer every Sunday morning in the nursery, because the Christian religion makes no sense if you actually study the bible with any kind of thought (ugh! I don't think that is the right word).
I was born in 1950. Although I didn't grow up in a Cult, there was physical and emotional abuse. There is so much more help available now. It is amazing. I'm so glad.
@@lilasfaves7846I was born in 1955. Someday I’ll verbalize why I dragged my kids into ATI back in 1988. So many regrets. I wish young adults could visualize that we lived in a world pre-internet, pre-Google, etc
@@MJCargile-or9ln yes I couldn’t agree more. We don’t know til we know do we? Would’ve made so many different decisions if I knew then what I know now! We can only make our amends and be honest with them. And forgive ourselves too as we can’t change the past ( hard to do I know) take care 💝
As someone who's suffered from severe migraines and chronic fatigue for many years, I know all too well what it feels like to have well-meaning but ignorant people endlessly ask me, "Don't you WANT to feel better? All you need to do is WANT to feel better and you'll be better!" It's maddening and beyond frustrating to deal with. I'm so sorry.
The problem is that no one joins a cult when they're happy and the recruiters, whether that's missionaries or MLM uplines whatever, they're trained to find the weaknesses and exploit them.
Teach the girls how to escape and survive in the outside world. And prisoners serving time would help with this as I believe many prisoners loath pedos - in all shapes & guises..just a thought..
I think to do that we need to overhaul the system as a whole. Cults form during times of unrest and unease and prey on vulnerable people. Unless you were born into the church, most find the church when they have a tangible need (food, shelter, community, help with drug and alcohol abuse, etc). The USA has barely any support systems and mostly rely on churches to do it.
@@carolbaker2773 Exactly, we're going to be dealing with the fallout of covid for a long time on this, Look how many people were radicalised religiously or politically, how many conspiracies sprang up everywhere, because that has happened in every pandemic in history. There were mass persecutions of Jews during the black death for instance. Scared humans just don't act rationally
Your mom sounds amazing, and so are you for not being willing to sell yourself. That story about Bill pretending things were fine, was so familiar from my experiences in a narcissistic family. It is such outrageous entitlement that most "normal" people can't imagine.
I thought I'd learned a lot about the IBLP from research and learning about the Duggars, but this is absolutely harrowing. Just shaking my head at the horror of it all. I have no words. Emily, thank you.
I'm so excited that this is coming to light. Even in regular family abuse without the cult like me. It's helping victims know that we can break out of the abuse. So thank you.
The amount of sexual abuse that happens in these cults is always one of the most appalling things to hear. To basically approve of and support predators in IBLP and blaming the victim even if they're a BABY. How dare that baby show her foot
It absolutely was his fault though. Sure, a church or whatever you want to call this IBLP thing is may lean towards women must be subservient to men and abuse is swept under the rug and there's a victim blaming going on. but I don't buy it at all that he had nothing to do with it and it was all the cult or whatever. At some point deep down inside somebody has to know what they're doing is wrong and either they continue to do those wrongs just don't commit those wrongs. You know exactly what he was doing his parents did nothing to help but try to cover it up.
So I was 20 years old sitting in a pew after my father's funeral, sort of shell-shocked, and a lady I had never met before approached me and said "What a shame it is that he's in hell now." I've always believed that she was genuine, he was a very nice man and she probably did feel sad because that was the way the world had been explained to her. But the experience affected the way I've felt about Christianity going forward. Even teachings that are supposedly personal and not intended to be harmful in any way can still hurt other people. But I was lucky, I had a path in computer science and communication that meant I never had to deal with any of that religion stuff. And now refugees from IBLP are showing up here online in my own back yard. I'm so happy you're using the technology for healing and kindness. Thanks for sharing your story!
@@starlingswallow It didn't really hurt me to have a reason to go off in a different direction, especially given that the book I ended up following says "In dealing with others, be gentle and kind."
Who says that to someone after a funeral? I do believe that Jesus is the way the truth and the life and that no one comes to the father except through him, but to say something like that to someone is very cruel
I didn't expect to relate to Emily's story as much as I do. My first experiences with Christianity were in an IFB Church. Though I have many friends I love there, I had to step away. I too tried to speak to authorities about verbal and emotional abuse ( with threats of physical ) happening at home in high school but it was ignored. The dad was the head of the house and it was my responsibility as a believer ( he was not one ) to win him to Christ through my actions of forgiveness and submission. I'm 34 now and spent the majority of my life trying to make him happy vs stepping out and having a life of my own because I thought it was my duty to. So much unhealthy thinking so tightly wound up with identity.
@@CultstoConsciousness Thank you so much Shelise ❤ Deconstructing daily. Finding that it IS healthy to step away, that it isn't a sin and that my life matters too. ❤
Listening to this conversation has me in tears. What Bill did was truly horrific and I applaud you for your bravery to speak out against him. I do believe our words can bring healing. Keep speaking your words, Emily! ❤
I didn't grow up in a cult nor in a high demand religion, and yet I feel so seen with this types of interviews, because my mother was the high demanding individual in our family, and in retrospect I'm glad it was her and not my dad. Since women cannot climb the ladder of authority, it could have been WAY worse. She has the potential of making a cult on her own. What I experienced in my house was so similar to all these survivors of cults and it was (and still is) so isolating because nobody understands why I became an atheist, nobody believes the things I lived in my house. Even the sexual abuse at the hands of a sibling, my mother still to this day believes it was the devil's work (you know, the good ol' lack of accountability). I was the sacrificed lamb so they could continue living as if my brother didn't SA for years. For all of you out there who have gone through this or are going through it currently, you're seen and heard. This destroys people and families.
Awesome that after All this Horrific Abuse and Wrong Teaching that you still follow and love The True Jesus!!!! Absolutely Amazing coz so many people RUN away from Him!! You have been through so much Horror in “ The Name of Christianity “ and HE HAS brought you through Wonderful PTL🙌
I was in a authority/patriarchy message for 45 years, 2 different places. I didn’t know I suffered emotional and spiritual abuse until I did. So grateful for people like you both who reveal the truth about the abuse. Keep it up. I’m also so happy for you getting out. So many are still being deceived, groomed and abused.
Wonderful episode today and interview, thank you for inviting Emily on the channel. She did a great job detangling the truth from fake religious garbage and abuse. Strong woman!
Shelise, I feel like you have been putting out so many videos! Do you even sleep? Thank you for all of the thoughtful content. I hope you are taking good care of yourself .
Thank you!! I end up staying up till 1am or later editing then wake up to make sure it posted at 7, then go back to sleep for a bit haha. Thanks for recognizing the hard work! ❤️ we are trying for 3 videos and 1 livestream per week 😁🥳
Emily is so much more beautiful now that she has broken free from mind control. I am so proud of all of these young women who are actually changing the world!
I actually just binge watched the docuseries earlier this morning. My heart hurts for the victims of these toxic cults, and I am so appreciative of those who are brave enough to share their stories and bring these atrocities to light. Thank you Emily for sharing your story and educating us on what's happening. I am currently listening to the portion of this interview that deals with Crohns disease. For the IBLP teachings to say it's ties to bitter feelings while also claiming this program is somehow equivalent to pre-med education is just unbelievable. Again, thank you both for sharing these stories ❤️
The amount of triggering this caused in both myself and my older sister who were both in a branch of this in Los Angeles in the 90's is unfathomable.*Edit - I in no way meant this in a negative context just more so that a lot of the things I thought I had dealt with some 20 years later I realized I have not come full circle out of yet. Thank you for the comments of support.
Maybe it will also be healing. Remember that you are out, that folks love you, and that these ladies are here to educate about what you went through. Take a bit of time to go outside and just breathe and remember you are free now.
i still haven’t finished but i’m just sat here in AWE. i’ve never heard a story so similar to mine. i grew up IBLP adjacent, we didn’t go to the conferences or anything but we homeschooled and home churched and had fairly strict limitations on media and such. but it was my mom that did everything - my step dad was christian ish but did not want to be involved. we prayed for him all the time because it was scary to not have him as “the head”. then i had visitations with my dad, who was not at all christian and sexually abused me, which pushed me further into religiosity. i have a very painful genetic disorder, and as it’s genetic so does my mom and my siblings but it’s SIGNIFICANTLY milder for them; i’m completely disabled by it and they all live normal lives. i’m the only one who experienced sexual abuse so… i wasn’t blamed for my genetic disorder or other health stuff as a kid, it just wasn’t taken care of because my mom didn’t take us to the doctor, but i was blamed by the second cult i joined as an adult 🙃 anyway, i know this story is going to get so much worse (and then hopefully so much better!) as creepy ass bill gothard is about to enter the picture, i just had to share because i’ve never heard of anyone else who was raised similarly but with more of a matriarch situation. and the CSA, and chronic illness, etc. edit: and i was born in 1992!
Oh my gosh I’m so sorry that happened to you. My heart goes out to you and your little self. Thank you for sharing. I hope you’re doing better now and finding healing and peace. ❤️
I’m an iblp survivor as a male. It was horrible. My family eventually left because my it became so evil. Every male leader that surrounded Gothard should be investigated fully. People should sue the organization.
You sound like mob thought. If Gotherd or anyone else raped, stole, or molested people,. arrest them. But merely because peopel joined of their own volition but later decided it was too strict or whatever, does not give them reason to form a lynch mob. ""arrest them all! Sue them all! That is NOT JUSTICE,
@@marisamartin3664actually all of the people around him who bore witness to the abuse, sexual impropriety, and virtual imprisonment of children ARE ALL GUILTY OF BEING ACCESSORIES TO HIS CRIMES
@@marisamartin3664He said “investigate.” He also said “sue the organization.” It’s a thought. Consider the Catholic Church’s “systematic” coverup of abuse. ✌🏽
@@marisamartin3664he said "should be fully investigated" not "should be lynched" and if men were protecting or colluding with Bill.... They should be investigated and prosecuted.
Thank you. Watching from Alaska. Gothard influences are a part of my story. Starting in the 60s. It's heartbreaking that this is still going on. I must state that it is important not to overlook or dismiss the importance of understanding and addressing the male victims in this discussion. The destruction of their construct is as unhealthy and destabilizing, needing an equal level of attention and care.
Emily, thank you for speaking out…I also was in an abusive “church” system, I was married to a very toxic man, and I sought church counseling…I was told I needed to just pray. What? Just pray. It was so dismissive and I left the room laughing! Churches are filled with narcissistic people, who have no soul. I have divorced my ex, and am going through the process of healing.. it’s very time consuming and I thank you for your testimony. Again,thank you for speaking the truth. Blessings❤️
What strength and courage Emily has! I'm thankful she's willing to talk about this despite the difficulty! Great call her mom made, not leaving her alone at headquarters!
Had to subscribe!❤ I didnt grow up in the IBLP but I grew up strict Southern Baptist. After watching the documentary I realized how far Gothards teachings really stretched. It made me sick, angry, sad, soo many emotions. My heart absolutely breaks for everyone that man has hurt. You are soo strong and brave!❤ I was personally hurt by my church that adopted his teachings and used them as their own. Like the umbrella, submitting, the fault and guilt placed on women... I could go on and on. Seeing these amazing warriors has gave me so much hope and clarity on some of the most confusing and depressing times of my life. Your stories are soo important and I thank you so much for sharing. You have touched my heart and have helped me. Sending so much love and good to you all!❤
Absolutely. Just take a look at the "Church" of Scientology. They're making millions and not getting taxed on a dime of it. And there's also the LDS Church they have nearly a billion dollars that's been reported to be in their coffers, an old church members are required to tithe 10% of their income. If they don't tithe they don't get to go into the temples. Yet, they don't pay a dime in taxes.
When she talked about trying on skirts and doing different moves to make sure NOTHING shows ,,, literal Flashback of doing this!! Even swimmin in the Ocean fully dressed with a dress to the ankles btw its dangerous 😂.. I was raised Southern Pentecostal/HOLINESS. Ive been noticing sooo many similarities, home schooling, discipline, no contact with anyone outside of our family & esp blaming the females regardless of the situation. Im Happy that she has left and is continuing to Grow!! I feel obsessed with you guys ❤❤ I ❤ this channel!! I love the real Raw Honesty etc ❤❤❤ Have a Great Day ❤️
It's like sheep being led to the slaughter. One person with such a pull/control on very trusting people to the point of molding their minds to believe that sexual abuse is ok, especially of their own children, is so maddening. Part of me screams, 'WHAT IS WRONG WITH THEM??", yet part of me realizes that the mind is so powerful and can be twisted so easily when someone puts their entire trust in the wrong person/place. I hope they can all come to a realization how wrong it all is. 💞
I can identify with almost every word you have said in this except for the sexual abuse. I also grew up with the same teachings and was also diagnosed with Crohn's Disease at the age of 15. It's crazy how similar your story is to mine. Thank you so much for sharing. I am still working to heal from this dangerous doctrine but am so thankful I now know truth.
It’s so encouraging to hear Emily’s testimony…as I endured very similar experiences within the churches we attended in my youth. Including SA, Physical A…and emotional, psychological manipulation and abuse.
Sweet girls I am so sorry these things happened. I went through a similar thing. I was also raped 3 years ago. Even as an adult, I was blamed. People asked me what I was wearing and other things. I hate this evil in the world.
Emily, you’re such an inspiration, and a warrior! The way you’ve turned tour tragedy into good by sharing your story and now advocating and providing resources to others in similar situations 💪 and you kept your faith thru it all! What a blessing! And Shelise, you too! You’re both rock stars imo! 👏👏👏
Thank you Shelise and Emily... both of you are strong, wise, women who are paving a path through and out of all this horrible abuse while providing many others with healing, kindness, release and yes, even a few sassy gems of hope. Linda listen. "My jeans are not the problem, your ignorance about them is." Thank You! Anne 💜💜
This is soooo important... to talk about the different ways people are abused. As a kid, I was s.a.'d, and when I would go to the library and read books on it, I convinced myself that what happened to me wasn't s.a., because what happened to me didn't "look like, sound like" what happened to the people in the books.
I agree & thank you for this comment. Similar for me. I had no words for what was happening to me as a child. Later as a teen, when I heard about s.a., it seemed like I was better off than others by comparison, & since no one I ever told, actually helped me, I minimized what happened, just like they did. And of course because of my similar religious upbringing to IBLP, I figured somehow it was my shame to bear in life, even though I wasn't sure what I had done to cause it. As an adult, when I started to piece together everything over the years & realized it was an escalation of abusive behavior from early on, I was livid & even more repulsed than I had previously been. I am 53 years old now & even though I am mostly functional, the damage lingers. I have experienced healing to some degree, but I am amazed at how many unexpected things bring it back to the forefront of my mind. Especially when people say things like, "You should have told a teacher or reported it to the police." Yeah. Right. Because I had that kind of knowledge & power to confront my Ultra-Christian parents at 11. 🙄 Thank you Emily, for sharing, & for your strength & courage. 💜
emily’s story brought be to tears. i think it was the thank you note that really got me. by the time she got to the Crohn’s disease i was ready to set fires. protect emily at all costs!!!
That story was SO beautiful how it ended (not the beginning of course). She was on the verge of tears the entire time. She’s so inspiring and it was great to hear the whole story. I like the way she didn’t let her pass religious experience effect her relationship with God. New follower of hers and new sub of yours too.
"How do we seek justice for victims, how we seek equality for men and women, how do we..." - like this is the perfect summation of positive Christianity and not the dogmatism that she (and I, to an extent) were raised in. Very much channeling Micah 6:8 there, "What has he asked of you, o mortal, but to do justice, love mercy (sometimes put as kindness), and to walk humbly with your God." Emily is such an awesome person for managing to come through everything she did, and to go, "I want to help others."
Emily, I'm so sorry for what you experienced in this horrible cult and your home. And I'm so proud of you for taking back your power! Thank you for supporting others! Blessings to you always! 💚🕊️💕
I had to come back to listen to the rest of this, i only got halfway before i broke down about the Childhood SA. You are both so strong for talking about these topics that need to be addressed
I don’t like watching horror movies, and this woman’s life was a horror show. The amount of manipulation Bill exercised over this woman and other women is astounding. And the control he created over a massive amount of people to create his empire…mind boggling. I’m so sorry what happened to her. I hope now in her life she finds comfort, peace, security and love.
I'm so sorry for all that has happened to both of you. As a born again Christian, I can say with full confidence, that Jesus is love. What he desires is a personal relationship with his believers. This is freeing and not a loss of who we are, but an expression of Jesus in us. He created each of us with gifts, compassion and forgiveness is so important. It starts with forgiving ourselves.
My heart breaks and bursts for you, both.. the ability to take back your bodies, minds and souls is nothing short of PROFOUND! You both break so many generational curses each and every time you share your stories!!!!
Emily, thank you so much for your vulnerability and being willing to speak out about abuse. I know it's not something everyone is able to do, but it's so helpful. Thanks to both you and Shelise! ❤ Edit: You mentioned your freedom day. I celebrate mine from Mormonism: October 15th. I hope everything in your life continues to improve.
The sensitivity with which you conduct the interviews, Shelise, is really something else. So much in these which reaches into my own experiences. Emily, what a strong and inspiring person you are. You mother sounds amazing too. It seems such a common goal of survivors to help others where they can. I know that not all of us can do the work that you are all doing, but the people who have changed my own life, are almost exclusively survivors themselves.
I attended IBLP seminars in the 70s as a teenager. What I know now looking back, is that there are always grains of truth in these cult groups. My parents never attended, I was there with a youth group from my church. I actually attended multiple seminars, and still have the material in my home 45 years later. Sitting here listening to this podcast, I just want to throw up. God bless you, Emily. I am so thankful that you were able to get out of it. And thank God for a mother who resisted. Thank God for a mother, who did not turn you over to a monster.
Wow! I'm blown away by Emily's story. You can see how difficult it is for her to recount. I admire her for sharing it, to help others. Shelise, I love your compassion in these interviews, I know some of them must weigh on you. Take some self care time girl. Kudos to The Hubby behind the scene working hard, It shows! Y'all are great!
The reason my parents ended up going to an IBLP seminar was because my sister went, came back, and then refused to tell them about it. My father got so frustrated with her, he ended up signing he and my mother up. My life became a nightmare after that. I was 13, had grown up watching my older siblings date and do normal things, then I was suddenly told I could do none of that. My father became abusive after having been a normal dad for years. Fortunately, ATI wasn't a thing then so I did escape that and went to a public high school. Every afternoon I dreaded going home to be told about rebellious children being stoned to death in the Old Testament. I am in my 60s now and it was only about five years ago that I came to terms with the fact that I had been in a cult.
Woah! That’s so hard. I’m sorry you went through that. I hope you’re on the path to healing now ❤️
Letting 13 yr olds date is very dangeorus for them. They are a walking target for predators and preganancy. Look at statistics.
Thank you for sharing
Bless your heart, I hate to hear these stories of cults teaching children /who grew up totally confused in life. I wish I knew the answer, I hope you are doing well. God bless you.
It takes a lot to come out with the truth. Good for you! Keep working on the healing.
(Are your parents still involved?)
One other thing...I am REALLY blown away at how she and her mother resisted Bill Gothard to his face. Not everyone who has been indoctrinated this way succeeds in defying a cult leader in any way. I hope Emily will see that immense strength that she had, even back then.
Absolutely!!! Major props for that
Absolutely agree. She was always fierce. What a beautiful thing. Thank God for her mother’s strength in that moment too. I kept wondering, what does the mother say about choosing to stay with the rapist criminal, child abuser husband once she discovered what he was doing to Emily? I wish that question had been asked.
Yet the mother made no effort to protect Emily from her father?
@@elizabethkettle2323 I would want to ask more questions there. I also wonder if her mother was being abused because sadly, abused people will take a lot of actions that are to their own and their family’s detriment because of the massive fear they have been indoctrinated with.
@@elizabethkettle2323 That is exactly what I was thinking!!!! I just can't believe her mother did not protect her and get her away from her child molesting father. In essence her mother allowed this abuse to go on, and bears some responsibility. It took him leaving for the abuse to stop! Hopefully he is in prison now, and if not, I hope she will make sure to seek legal help to make sure he is convicted of sexual molestation.
Break the silence. Break the cycle.
Break the cognitive dissonance. Break the mind control spell. Break me off a piece of that KitKat bar... inappropriate joke, yes. Am I going to hell for it? Nope, we broke the mind control spell, so I'm safer than an Olympic swimmer in a kiddy pool.
This needs to be on a shirt!!
@@Heather.R. my last job was as a graphic designer for educational tests. Unfortunately I don’t have a functional computer setup. Otherwise I’d make one asap!
I remember some silly things that were said at my husband’s church that blamed women back when I was a teen in the 70s. I had no idea it had its basis in the IBLP but it makes sense now. I was Presbyterian and we didn’t think that way. Of course, my church was considered heathen.
@@susanfeil7729 it goes back further than that. He just co-opted it into iblp.
These men are disgusting!! A girl should feel safe around her dad no matter what she is wearing😢
Absolutely. Say it louder for the pervs in the back!!
Yessss. That lack of safety breaks my heart. NOT OK.
her, having to put all her body weight against the door to prevent her dad from coming in, I'm a guy, and hearing that, to me, is really scary
EVERYONE has the right to feel & be safe, especially in their own home. EVERY child deserves parents who provide a secure environment.
Seriously. If you, as a mother or father, feel attracted to your child and feel the need to force them to dress a certain way so you're not thinking about abusing them then the problem is with you. Not every other man/woman in the world.
The majority of people do not think like that and to try to claim they do itd these evil degenerates way if feeling better about their disgusting urges.
I want to vomit, cry, then give this fierce woman a huge hug and validate that she did not deserve any of this and definitely did not invite it! So proud of what a powerful force and voice against all the abuse and abusers! Stay strong! I’m in awe of your strength ❤
Saaame. I was speechless for most of this interview. Pure and utter shock and sadness and then joy for her when she got out and shed all of it. **sigh** so much
Happy to hear she didn’t turn her back on Jesus.
Emily, you deserved not to be violated. My heart is breaking for you. IT WAS NOT YOUR FAULT. YOUR FATHER IS A CRIMINAL.
Everyone who knew of this crime is a criminal for not reporting! This includes your mother, sorry, she should have protected you, the state or county should have got you out of that situation, yet they were probably never notified. I'm sorry, there is blame everywhere, justice needs to be served.
Emily, all the adults present shoulder this blame! Not you! For sure!
To me the father was always a degenerate scum, however her mother is most disgusting. She is the one who joined this cult in the hopes of changing this demon of a man at the expense of her daughter.
As a man it hurts my heart to hear of men who should be protective of their daughters ...not sexually abusing them. It also angers me to hear it taught that men just can't help themselves. To Hell with that! We most certainly can. It isn't a woman's fault if they get assaulted or raped.
You sound like a good man
What a blessed Alpha Male. I have my own.....
I love that Bill spoke over her/her mom that she would become this bitter, rebellious, evil person, and yet even after all she’s been through, and after leaving the cult, the exact OPPOSITE is true and what a BEAUTIFUL testament that is
Rebellion is not bad. I love our rebellious nature, it protects us.
@@GreenGorgeousnessexactly. This is it exactly.
???? ....I am not a fan of Gothard- ites, but she is clearly a foolish rebel , and MORE THAN a little foolish ....and smiling 😅 about it ...shining about it 🤯
The sexual abuse in so many religions is so horrendous. Sorry for this brave young woman. Lots of love
I don't think it is about religion. These predators are going to be wherever they are allowed to abuse children; even none religious daycares, schools, and groups have pedophiles. The solution is to not allow these criminals to hide. Organizations need to expose them and make them pay for their crimes. Most probably are fearful of the very thing you are doing here. Which is to blame an entire organization for the crimes of some sick individuals.
@@alleducation1982true but it is hidden and allowed to continue in churches more often due to “Freedom of Religion” in USA. So the coercive control of forgiving and purity culture and shame creates breeding grounds for this group. Look at the Catholic Church among others.
@@alleducation1982 It has everything to do with the religion. Everything you said is correct, but religious ideologies that oppress women and girls like IBLP does allows for predatory men to excuse their actions and blame the child for the assault they committed against them. And people within this religious group agree with him, and vilify her.
@@seranathenecromancer3470anything with an ideology can be a breeding ground for abusers. NXIVM wasn’t a religion. Sports organizations aren’t religious. People need to be aware in all these contexts
@@amde8554 Yes. And in this case, religion is directly contributing to this behavior, which people should also be aware of.
It’s ironic that cults tell their people that they will be in danger if they ever go out there- you might meet a rapist on a date- when all the while, the most dangerous predators are inside the group! Thank you for sharing your story ❤
They say you're more likely to be assaulted by someone youy already know. So messed up. You would think that knowing someone would make you more compassionate and less inclined to hurt them.
Bill Gothard should be rotting in a prison cell for sexual crimes, not in his upscale home which happens to be a few miles away from me. The IBLP institute is 6 miles away and I never knew about this until these documentaries and interviews. Thank you for speaking out and exposing this dangerous cult. And thank goodness Emily’s mother didn’t leave him alone with that predator!!
Well she left her with her father who she knew was a pervert and allowed it. It's really sad how easily people can be brainwashed but I will say I'm impressed her mother went head to head with the cult leader
He is in a far worse place, I fear.
He sounds like a creep to me
I'm.shocked, I thought he was in prison. But it's the pedo cop that Jimmy B was hanging with
I was in one of the Bill Gothard’s Institutes. I lived at the Indianapolis Training Center in Indiana between the ages of 13 and 15. I knew Gothard personally. When I refused to come out of my room and stay with my leaders 24/7. I had gotten beat with a really huge paddle that was half the size of me at the time. When I refused to accept them changing my leaders over and over again to make me submit, I had enough and started fighting back. 6 grown people held me down and hog tied me while beating me and one threatened to kill me if he could. Gothard tried to groom me but I wasn’t having it. I dropped their percent of saving children down to 99 as they say with them claiming I was rebellious, out of control, and hardheaded. I suffered a great amount of PTSD from living there. They gave me what ever I wanted. Bribed me with everything. I got better treatment than all the other LIT’s in that center. I was allowed to leave when no one else could. I could go on trips. All I had to do was ask and it was given, but the punishments were so much worse on me because I refused to be abused, I refused to be groomed, and I refused to come out my room a lot.
I was sexually abused and sold as a toddler until I was 7-8 years old so I wasn’t going to be abused in that way again. And I knew what Gothard was doing from the moment I met him on my 14th birthday. That whole day I was getting prepared to meet him. They took me to the 13th floor to have my makeup and hair done. Then I went to get dressed before my birthday dinner. Gothard had just gotten into town. My table was at the front. His table was beside the podium while mine was right in front of it. He couldn’t keep his eyes off me. He spoke at the end and then came straight to my table to speak to me. He wanted a meeting with me in the Gergeni’s office. So the Gergeni’s escorted us to their office. Now women were never supposed to be alone with a man. EVER!!! It didn’t matter who it was unless they were married. We always had to be chaperoned when the opposite sex was around. But Gothard was aloud to be alone with us. Mr. Gergeni couldn’t be alone with but Gothard could which did not make any sense. The Gergeni’s escorted us to their office and then left leaving me alone with Gothard. He kept talking but I refused to speak cause I was very uncomfortable. He put his hand on my leg and I froze. He knew he wasn’t getting anywhere with me. He finally asked to pray for me and then called the Gergeni’s back in to tell them I wouldn’t speak. Mrs. Gergeni laughed and said but she is the loudest one of them all. They couldn’t believe I wouldn’t speak to him, but I knew what he was trying to do, and I didn’t want to give him any room to make any moves on me. He tried several times after that even trying to scare me using the judges, mayors, and lawyers to make me submit. Even the police officers were on his side but I refused. I called the police one night. Mr. Gergeni found me and snatched the phone out of my hand and told them I was there for treatment and I was an unruly child. The police never showed up, but the reporters did the next day. They shut the whole building down and refused to let anyone in or out. Gothard called bribing me to stay up stairs out of sight because I was the one they wanted to talk to. I had told the dispatcher the night before about the abuse. The reporters wanted my story but Gothard shut it all down. Gothard called to talk to me begging me to stay out of sight, bribing me with anything I wanted. They finally released me to go back home to my hometown in Augusta Georgia, because they didn’t want what happened getting out. Gothard came and asked me what was it I really wanted, and I told him I wanted to leave. They tried talking me out of it because I was about to start my career as a singer In his program. I had just gotten his permission to join the children’s choir. But I couldn’t take it anymore being there. That’s all I kept asking for was to go home, and he finally agreed to send me back home. My adopted father wasn’t happy to pick me up, and I ended up in foster care and mental hospitals, and group homes. But those were better than being there and being with my adopted parents. My parents knew about the abuse and the hog tie but did nothing to protect me. They said it was my fault, and they had given their permission for them to do whatever they had to do to make me submit to their authority. I endured 2 years of hell there until I forced them to release me. They only released me because the reporters were in front of their doors refusing to leave until they talked to me. I don’t know how they got them to go away. They were out there for a day I know, and then Gothard showed up at the center the next day to talk to me. I didn’t see them again after that. But shortly after that I was released from the training center.
Let me start with I am so sorry you had to live through that, but holy cheese muffins, that was bad! I don't know where to start, this is the kind of comment that you don't know if you should thumb it up because you're happy the op could get that off of his/her chest or not because it's horrific and makes you want to hug whoever the op because it seems like something he/she could use.
Incredibly traumatic. I hope you have or can find continual help to process and heal.❤
You are very brave to share this story! I am so sorry that happened to you. Hugs and love to you. ❤️
Ll
I don't understand how these people get away with this. I'm so sorry this happened to you. You deserved to be protected. I hope you have gotten the help you needed!
This is the system that allowed Josh Dugger to feel free to abuse women and not understand it’s wrong
Exactly!
ALLOWED? ENCOURAGED!
Encouraged, enabled and abetted an incestuous pedophile. This culture creates Josh Duggars intentionally and it needs to end
He understood it was wrong, He knew he lived in a system that would enable him.
AMEN. I question what Josh and even JimBob went through as kids....hmm
I am 53. I didn't grow up in the IBLP, but I did grow up in the Christian community. At age 12, my parents put me in a Christian school. The pastor/principal was a huge believer in Bill Gothard & the IBLP seminars & 100% backed Michael Pearl! All of this craziness is sounding very familiar. I didn't even realize the IBLP is what they were trying to brainwash us with until I watched Shiny, Happy People & started to watch this channel.
And, I 100% agree...YOU ARE NOT GOING TO HELL FOR WEARING PANTS/JEANS!
Sounds familiar to me same happened to me I rejected the cult programming called them out on it
Just a reminder for folks: Rusty and Andrea Yates tragedy. They were in a very similar "Quiverfull" type cut. Besides the sexual abuse. these cults put mothers in horrific living conditions.
I agree. I never felt that woman was entirely responsible for those murders. Just the family portrait shows a mother on the edge of psychological collapse. She needed help, not another baby to homeschool.
@@stillhere1425 I often think of the horrific conditions in their household.
Funny how so often the disgusting creatures who make its living exploiting murder victims and the trauma and grief of their loved ones just have to shove its way in
@@nickywal If you're referring to me, I make no money off Yates tragedy. Nor am I employed in any industry that does. I lived down the street from the Yates when the murders happened. I've moved away, but return to the area periodically. I also personally knew a couple of other families practicing Quiverfull-type philosophies. So I have relevant personal feelings on the matter.
@@stillhere1425 Rusty and Andrea were told by psychiatrists that she shouldn’t have more children and shouldn’t go off her meds to have another child, but she did anyway due to these religious beliefs. Rusty knew she had psychosis and has thought about killing the children. He was told not to leave her alone with the children. He did it anyway. They also lived in a high stress crowded environment, home schooling in a converted school bus. She was found not guilty by reason of insanity.
Emily sharing what young girls have to endure in terms of sexual assault (making one “mighty in spirit” as a victim, for instance): I pictured the Duggar girls, having to sit through this as a school lesson. What a horrible horrible thing Gothard unleashed- like a primer on how to create victims and predators.
Exactly. It’s awful
I just began watching the docuseries, I knew a lot of it but it’s blowing my mind how blatant some of the inappropriate behaviour was/is and it’s sooooo normalized and abusive. I’m so glad some exposure is being given to those issues
Yes!! I agree
Talking about sexualisation of babies.. I was in a maternity ward with some religious Caribbean women. One took off her baby's nappy to change her, while some family were visiting. The little one started to cry; babies often do when suddenly unwrapped! The mother smiled and said "oh so good, she already has shame!" I was stunned. The baby was less than a week old!!
As for this story.. let's remember how OLD he was when doing this to a teenager!
Noooooo. Ugh, I hate that! Makes me sad.
I don't know how you did this interview without crying - I was watching it with tears of both sadness and anger. I almost turned it off, but thought that if Emily could live it, I could hear it. I remember being admonished by people when I mentioned years ago that there was something wrong with 19 kids and Counting and being told that I was being judgmental and not following scripture. When I asked for scripture to back up their beliefs, I was told that I was not letting the Spirit lead me. (My Dad is a pastor and has never expected me to believe anything just because he says it - I was taught to search for the answers and then we could discuss out individual results.) So many red flags ... anyway, I praise God, Emily, that your Mom took you away from headquarters and I cried happy tears when you talked about your celebration of freedom day!
Geez, I just feel physically ill after listening to what she went through. I cannot FATHOM the bravery and fortitude it takes to leave that church, let alone tell these stories.
As someone that was sa'd for years, and then ended up with a fairly severe case of Crohn's Disease, I felt more of a connection with this story than most of the Mormon ones (I was raised Mormon). Crohn's was just my first autoimmune diagnosis, but it wasn't my last by any means. My heart goes out to you, Emily. Crohn's Fighters stay together. Hearts and spoons to you!
As a father of two girls, I'm disgusted. I don't know what I would have done if this happened to one of them. I would probably be in jail
You're a good dad. I am a total Daddy's girl, so the idea of a father doing that to his daughter is just unthinkable for me. My father is the opposite - he makes any guy nervous who wants to date me LOL
I grew up in highly conservative mainstream religion (Greek Orthodox) and came across some Mormon missionaries, JWs and Scientologists over the years. I feel sorry for all the people brought in these abusive groups but especially for all the women that get conditioned and primed to be self-blaming victims at the hands of these creeps...
I'm LDS and am watching this video with the same horror and disgust as everyone else. My religion is not at all like the iblp!
Same... Abuse was happening all around, and knew from an early age that things weren't right in our family, church, etc...
It wasn't until I took myself to therapy as a young adult, (after being declined that during younger life, because we should just have faith that God would fix everything) that it all came together. 💔
All these years later, the healing is still in process.
I’m an Ex JW and can definitely relate to this beautiful woman. Thank you so much!
@@Ell5589I was raised a JW. Never baptized. Still have family in the organization. I was raped at 15 by 2 Baptized JW. The elders counseled me and did nothing to the perpetrators. It is straight up a cult. But they are so brainwashed it’s hard to convince them otherwise. There are so many good people too :(
@@lizktbut you have to admit that you are a religion does sweep abuse and SA under the rug. That's a problem with all religions I believe.
I lived in a cult 45 years ago.When I left the the cult I never left my faith.Deconstuction is a difficult thing to do.I joint the cult because of my faith and later left the cult because of my faith.I had to redefine my faith and found a church 13 years ago that really restored my faith and the relationship with the Allmighty.I am really happy now after all these years.I love your Linda listen.We are not going to hell for wearing jeans.
Emily is so intelligent, well-spoken, and self-aware. This video is definitely familiar and triggering at times, but it is so so important to shine a light on this. Thank you.
Thanks for your support. I agree, she’s awesome!
It’s sad because some cults prey on people that feel like they don’t belong anywhere the outcasts
My oldest son of six children (now 35 years old, married and has one son, my beautiful grandson who will be one in July);just watched the documentary “Shiny Happy People” was completely shocked and triggered. He had a full blown panic attack! I’m grieving as a mother. I think I have a lot of denial on how much damage that IBLP did to our family and especially my older children. I’ve realized I HAVE to watch this documentary to help me heal and help my adult children to come to grasps with the damage this fu*king cult did to our family. I need to make this right with them!!! I need to ask for forgiveness for exposing them to this atrocity that sucked us in to thinking they were mainstream Christianity. I feel sick just thinking about all of the ramifications! So much more I can say about this!
So much guilt as a mother who exposed them to this absolute bullshit!!! Thank you so much for sharing more on this dangerous cult!!!! I actually remember going to church functions where women would leave the table I was sitting at because they thought my shirt was too tight or cut too low and felt so ashamed and like a black sheep so many things coming up in my memories right now that I can’t believe I tolerated back then I am literally feeling sick to my stomach right now and I’m going to have to watch this later but thanks so much for sharing it needs to be exposed to the world people need to wake the hell up
Please don’t be ashamed to get professional help for yourself and your family if you need it! The resources with this video might help you locate a professional who is familiar with recovery from IBLP and other cults.
@@nerysghemor5781 thank you so much for your kindness and encouragement❣️My grown children have, thankfully, gotten some great therapy for their specific needs. Unfortunately, we lost my third born son, along with his wife and my granddaughter back in 2018.(small private plane accident 🥺) Some of my grown children are still in therapy, others are not. But they are all doing well and I am so grateful for that❤️🙏🏼 I am struggling, and I’m not saying that they’re not. One day at a time ❤️
My heart goes out to you and your story. Be gentle to yourself
You're 💯 correct. Maybe the more exposure, that's what it's going to take to make authorities take notice and take action
@@sandybowers5085 ::hugs::
Being raised in an environment where sexual abuse is happening, has continued to bring challenges in my life at 65. Every now and then, I am slapped upside the head with yet another character defect that I used to survive childhood, but now it just holds me back from how I relate to my fellow humans. I am so sad for these young women who are going through or have been through this kind of situation, yet so grateful that they are helping me deal with my own past. ❤
Is it really a “character defect” or just a coping mechanism that is now maladaptive outside of your previous environment?
I'm a survival an abusive household because a religion, I left my parents home at 15 and emancipated at 16, nowadays I batle with MS and my doctor said me with all words that my MS was trigged by the abuse and stress that I deal with. This podcast strike a nerve in a good sense, because I'm not alone, thak you ❤
It wasn't because of the religion or because of religion but because of the people. Religion has nothing to do with what a person chose to do. It was the opposite of religion or God. Satan. So it was because of Satan not religion
26:37 I am not a violent person. But I am in a rage when adults abuse children. I feel so much for her. What a mental torture in addition to everything. Any child abuser deserves a life of torture in repayment.
Lots of people say that yet so many kids goes through it as I write this reply.
What makes me enraged is that these groups are trying to point at drag queens as child abusers because they put on a princess dress and entertain kids why reading a book.
@@carolbaker2773 Yup. The actual predators are not those who are living their lives with inclusion, it is statistically the people that support child marriage, removal of women's rights, and are closer to home.
@@carolbaker2773 You don’t have to exonerate one evil to condemn another. The "Alphabet" political movement is as much a *cult* as any fundamentalist religion: BOTH gr00m the underrage. BOTH are incoherent and irrational. BOTH are intolerant of opposing views. And *De-transitioners* struggle with PTSD as much as any ex-cult member.
Thank you so much for sharing your story. I am a 40 year survivor of human trafficking. I don't know your personal pain but I can relate. There's not much support for HT Survivors. I would love to talk to you. I'm so thankful you were able to hold onto your faith. God is the only reason I'm alive. Stay strong my sister of survival.
My family did this program for a while when I was little. My dad grumbled so much about the beard thing. I don't know to this day why they left it, but they were totally on board with it until suddenly one day we weren't. Totally not suprised Bill Gothard was outed as a harrassor. Anyone who puts a woman's responsibility to maintain her appearance on the same moral responsibility to NOT Commit Adultery is someone who doesn't control themselves.
The husband of a close friend who was raised fundamentalist Christian left her and she had a total nervous breakdown because she could not exist without him. Her children, certainly she herself were nothing to her without her man at her side. She was literally in a useless fetal state. Women need to be something outside their marriages and families and they must be taught to be someone from infancy. And they cannot feel utterly responsible for holding their nuclear families together.
I went to his seminar when I was a baby Christian. Thankfully, I thought it was really wrong. The people who took me there told me, "You. are just being rebellious if you don't accept these principles." Thankfully, I prayed about it and asked God to show me if I was being rebellious. I never accepted Bill Gothard's teachings! I hate that they have hurt so many using scripture the wrong way. They will answer to God. I pray your future is bright!
Thank you for your transparency Emily. I definitely have to take a break on this one. I was abused from 12-18 and the church as asked me to sit with my moms husband while he apologized for being “inappropriate”…. I snapped. I didn’t go. They said I was being difficult. My mom is still married to him and gets upset when I say he is not allowed around me or my DAUGHTERS. Most of what she’s saying happened to me and was said to me. wild. So wild.
😢
I’m so sorry to hear that. Their teachings are horrific and they have no idea the pain and suffering it causes those who are cursed with it. Sending my love ❤️
Shame on her!!! Enablers allow the abuse to grow!!!
I hear your story and I'm so sorry that that happened to you. Church abuse can be so so so bad it's disgusting
I’m glad you’re protecting your daughters! I’m sorry that happened to you but impressed by your strength to break the cycle.
You are doing a great service by exposing these terrible organizations.
I watched Lindsey's interview of when she met Bill Gothard. Her interview, I don't think is on Cults To Consciousness, it was on a different channel, but Lindsey's story and Emily's story, when they met Bill Gothard are nearly identical.
This is absolutely HORRIFING!!! I am soo sorry that this happened to you !!! And the fact that you are not the only one ...that this happened to hundreds of girls is just unimaginable !!! The fact that this man is not in prison is even more unimaginable !!
The way your mother was able to protect you from Bill Gothard, and yet would do nothing to protect you from your father is repulsive. I'm glad he finally left, since she was clearly unable.
Brainwashing is a HELL of a thing.
@@aromaladyellie😊
Forgiveness is not to set the abuser free of the wrong done but to set the victim free. However forgiveness does not mean we trust them again or have them in our life. I’m so sorry what happened to you. As a victim of religious abuse and molested by my father…there are parts of the story that really hit home. Thank you for being brave and strong and telling your story and helping others in similar situations.
I admire you two ladies so much for talking about what you have been through, expecially the sexual abuse, with so much strength and openness, it is hard to even listen to it without tearing up. You are doing so much work for the world, thank you for sharing your story, thank you for raising your voices ❤
When I left the Christian Church (pentecostal) and escaped my marriage with my kids to a Domestic Violence Shelter, I had to do group therapy 2 times a week at the DV shelter, and the book we had to all read was "Why Does He Do That? INSIDE THE MINDS OF ANGRY AND CONTROLLING MEN" Can also be Women, but they don't learn to abuse in churches. Written by a psychologist that specializes in treating abusers. He had the statistics that the number one place to get abused is in a church. It didn't matter what kind of church/religion. Basically, in all religions, men are not only given permission to abuse women but taught to. I do believe that because when I complained about the abuse to the pastor, he told me, "I made it easy for people to be mean to me!" Now there is sexism in that statement, but even more, is the ableism as I am autistic/ADHD. It is interesting because back in 1994 or 95 when I was diagnosed with ADHD I was given an IQ test. The psychologist never gave me the number I had scored. All she kept saying, and not so much to me, but to my husband was that I was absolutely brilliant. My ex is very proud of the fact that he is slightly above average in intelligence. I have come to the belief that she didn't want to give me the number because she feared what that might do, and what danger that might have put me in.
Fast forward to 2021, I finally got my autism diagnosis which I prefer to call a recognition, and again I am told I am absolutely brilliant. We will one of these days retest me to find out what that means, but for now... LOL, I had to go see an occupational medical doctor and within the first 5 minutes, he looked at me and said, "Wow! I don't have to give you an IQ test!" I really think that a lot of the abuse from the church that I received was based on my intellect and my constantly asking questions. You know, questions, like: In your sermon today you said, this and quoted this scripture, but that scripture doesn't make any sense because it doesn't mean that, and especially when you look at these other 20 scriptures in all these other books. Then when they couldn't answer my questions, I would look at them like they were lying. I finally started to volunteer every Sunday morning in the nursery, because the Christian religion makes no sense if you actually study the bible with any kind of thought (ugh! I don't think that is the right word).
I was born in 1950. Although I didn't grow up in a Cult, there was physical and emotional abuse. There is so much more help available now. It is amazing. I'm so glad.
Hello friend! I was born in 1950 too and times were so different then… we knew so little about the wider world didn’t we? X
@@lilasfaves7846I was born in 1955. Someday I’ll verbalize why I dragged my kids into ATI back in 1988. So many regrets. I wish young adults could visualize that we lived in a world pre-internet, pre-Google, etc
@@MJCargile-or9ln yes I couldn’t agree more. We don’t know til we know do we? Would’ve made so many different decisions if I knew then what I know now! We can only make our amends and be honest with them. And forgive ourselves too as we can’t change the past ( hard to do I know) take care 💝
As someone who's suffered from severe migraines and chronic fatigue for many years, I know all too well what it feels like to have well-meaning but ignorant people endlessly ask me, "Don't you WANT to feel better? All you need to do is WANT to feel better and you'll be better!" It's maddening and beyond frustrating to deal with. I'm so sorry.
Teach people not to fall into this cult.
The problem is that no one joins a cult when they're happy and the recruiters, whether that's missionaries or MLM uplines whatever, they're trained to find the weaknesses and exploit them.
Teach the girls how to escape and survive in the outside world. And prisoners serving time would help with this as I believe many prisoners loath pedos - in all shapes & guises..just a thought..
I think to do that we need to overhaul the system as a whole. Cults form during times of unrest and unease and prey on vulnerable people. Unless you were born into the church, most find the church when they have a tangible need (food, shelter, community, help with drug and alcohol abuse, etc). The USA has barely any support systems and mostly rely on churches to do it.
@@carolbaker2773 Exactly, we're going to be dealing with the fallout of covid for a long time on this, Look how many people were radicalised religiously or politically, how many conspiracies sprang up everywhere, because that has happened in every pandemic in history. There were mass persecutions of Jews during the black death for instance. Scared humans just don't act rationally
Your mom sounds amazing, and so are you for not being willing to sell yourself. That story about Bill pretending things were fine, was so familiar from my experiences in a narcissistic family. It is such outrageous entitlement that most "normal" people can't imagine.
Emily, you were one of my favorite people in the docuseries and I'm so glad I got to hear more from you. You are incredible. Your story matters.
I thought I'd learned a lot about the IBLP from research and learning about the Duggars, but this is absolutely harrowing. Just shaking my head at the horror of it all. I have no words. Emily, thank you.
I'm so excited that this is coming to light. Even in regular family abuse without the cult like me. It's helping victims know that we can break out of the abuse. So thank you.
The amount of sexual abuse that happens in these cults is always one of the most appalling things to hear. To basically approve of and support predators in IBLP and blaming the victim even if they're a BABY. How dare that baby show her foot
Absolutely agree. It’s disgusting
Yeah
I always wondered why the Duggars protected and hid Josh. I understand now; it wasn’t his fault!?!? 😡😤🤦♀️🤷♀️
It absolutely was his fault though. Sure, a church or whatever you want to call this IBLP thing is may lean towards women must be subservient to men and abuse is swept under the rug and there's a victim blaming going on. but I don't buy it at all that he had nothing to do with it and it was all the cult or whatever. At some point deep down inside somebody has to know what they're doing is wrong and either they continue to do those wrongs just don't commit those wrongs. You know exactly what he was doing his parents did nothing to help but try to cover it up.
My family almost followed this program. I pushed for it. But my wise husband said no. That is a true leader.
Your husband is not a leader
So I was 20 years old sitting in a pew after my father's funeral, sort of shell-shocked, and a lady I had never met before approached me and said "What a shame it is that he's in hell now." I've always believed that she was genuine, he was a very nice man and she probably did feel sad because that was the way the world had been explained to her. But the experience affected the way I've felt about Christianity going forward. Even teachings that are supposedly personal and not intended to be harmful in any way can still hurt other people. But I was lucky, I had a path in computer science and communication that meant I never had to deal with any of that religion stuff. And now refugees from IBLP are showing up here online in my own back yard. I'm so happy you're using the technology for healing and kindness. Thanks for sharing your story!
I am SO sorry that woman said that about your dad. 😢 I am horrified. I am so glad you are a part of people getting their voices out there!
@@starlingswallow It didn't really hurt me to have a reason to go off in a different direction, especially given that the book I ended up following says "In dealing with others, be gentle and kind."
It's fucking horrible that she said that to you, but I'm glad it ended up turning you away from harmful belief 🖤
All religions are dangerous
Who says that to someone after a funeral? I do believe that Jesus is the way the truth and the life and that no one comes to the father except through him, but to say something like that to someone is very cruel
I am so proud of this woman. What a story she told, so heart breaking. She is incredibly brave to come out and speak her truth. ❤
I heartily agree
I didn't expect to relate to Emily's story as much as I do. My first experiences with Christianity were in an IFB Church. Though I have many friends I love there, I had to step away. I too tried to speak to authorities about verbal and emotional abuse ( with threats of physical ) happening at home in high school but it was ignored. The dad was the head of the house and it was my responsibility as a believer ( he was not one ) to win him to Christ through my actions of forgiveness and submission. I'm 34 now and spent the majority of my life trying to make him happy vs stepping out and having a life of my own because I thought it was my duty to. So much unhealthy thinking so tightly wound up with identity.
I’m sorry you went through that. I hope you have been able to deconstruct and find some healing ❤️
@@CultstoConsciousness Thank you so much Shelise ❤ Deconstructing daily. Finding that it IS healthy to step away, that it isn't a sin and that my life matters too. ❤
Listening to this conversation has me in tears. What Bill did was truly horrific and I applaud you for your bravery to speak out against him. I do believe our words can bring healing. Keep speaking your words, Emily! ❤
I didn't grow up in a cult nor in a high demand religion, and yet I feel so seen with this types of interviews, because my mother was the high demanding individual in our family, and in retrospect I'm glad it was her and not my dad. Since women cannot climb the ladder of authority, it could have been WAY worse. She has the potential of making a cult on her own. What I experienced in my house was so similar to all these survivors of cults and it was (and still is) so isolating because nobody understands why I became an atheist, nobody believes the things I lived in my house. Even the sexual abuse at the hands of a sibling, my mother still to this day believes it was the devil's work (you know, the good ol' lack of accountability). I was the sacrificed lamb so they could continue living as if my brother didn't SA for years. For all of you out there who have gone through this or are going through it currently, you're seen and heard. This destroys people and families.
Ditto. (((hugs)))
💙
I'm sorry your abuser was never held accountable and that you went through that.
Awesome that after All this Horrific Abuse and Wrong Teaching that you still follow and love The True Jesus!!!!
Absolutely Amazing coz so many people RUN away from Him!!
You have been through so much Horror in “ The Name of Christianity “ and HE HAS brought you through
Wonderful
PTL🙌
I was in a authority/patriarchy message for 45 years, 2 different places. I didn’t know I suffered emotional and spiritual abuse until I did. So grateful for people like you both who reveal the truth about the abuse. Keep it up. I’m also so happy for you getting out. So many are still being deceived, groomed and abused.
Wonderful episode today and interview, thank you for inviting Emily on the channel. She did a great job detangling the truth from fake religious garbage and abuse. Strong woman!
Shelise, I feel like you have been putting out so many videos! Do you even sleep? Thank you for all of the thoughtful content. I hope you are taking good care of yourself .
Thank you!! I end up staying up till 1am or later editing then wake up to make sure it posted at 7, then go back to sleep for a bit haha. Thanks for recognizing the hard work! ❤️ we are trying for 3 videos and 1 livestream per week 😁🥳
Emily is so much more beautiful now that she has broken free from mind control. I am so proud of all of these young women who are actually changing the world!
I actually just binge watched the docuseries earlier this morning. My heart hurts for the victims of these toxic cults, and I am so appreciative of those who are brave enough to share their stories and bring these atrocities to light. Thank you Emily for sharing your story and educating us on what's happening. I am currently listening to the portion of this interview that deals with Crohns disease. For the IBLP teachings to say it's ties to bitter feelings while also claiming this program is somehow equivalent to pre-med education is just unbelievable. Again, thank you both for sharing these stories ❤️
The amount of triggering this caused in both myself and my older sister who were both in a branch of this in Los Angeles in the 90's is unfathomable.*Edit - I in no way meant this in a negative context just more so that a lot of the things I thought I had dealt with some 20 years later I realized I have not come full circle out of yet. Thank you for the comments of support.
So sorry. Maybe in the future it would be good to listen to the trigger warning or watch with support.
Maybe it will also be healing. Remember that you are out, that folks love you, and that these ladies are here to educate about what you went through. Take a bit of time to go outside and just breathe and remember you are free now.
if you are beginning a healing phase, i suggest reading 'the body keeps the score'. it gives an accounting of many different healing modalities.
i still haven’t finished but i’m just sat here in AWE. i’ve never heard a story so similar to mine.
i grew up IBLP adjacent, we didn’t go to the conferences or anything but we homeschooled and home churched and had fairly strict limitations on media and such. but it was my mom that did everything - my step dad was christian ish but did not want to be involved. we prayed for him all the time because it was scary to not have him as “the head”. then i had visitations with my dad, who was not at all christian and sexually abused me, which pushed me further into religiosity. i have a very painful genetic disorder, and as it’s genetic so does my mom and my siblings but it’s SIGNIFICANTLY milder for them; i’m completely disabled by it and they all live normal lives. i’m the only one who experienced sexual abuse so…
i wasn’t blamed for my genetic disorder or other health stuff as a kid, it just wasn’t taken care of because my mom didn’t take us to the doctor, but i was blamed by the second cult i joined as an adult 🙃
anyway, i know this story is going to get so much worse (and then hopefully so much better!) as creepy ass bill gothard is about to enter the picture, i just had to share because i’ve never heard of anyone else who was raised similarly but with more of a matriarch situation. and the CSA, and chronic illness, etc.
edit: and i was born in 1992!
Oh my gosh I’m so sorry that happened to you. My heart goes out to you and your little self. Thank you for sharing. I hope you’re doing better now and finding healing and peace. ❤️
@@CultstoConsciousness thank you and thank you SO much for what you do!! ♡
I’m an iblp survivor as a male. It was horrible. My family eventually left because my it became so evil. Every male leader that surrounded Gothard should be investigated fully. People should sue the organization.
My parents brought us in but when they found out the truth they pulled us out.
You sound like mob thought. If Gotherd or anyone else raped, stole, or molested people,. arrest them. But merely because peopel joined of their own volition but later decided it was too strict or whatever, does not give them reason to form a lynch mob. ""arrest them all! Sue them all! That is NOT JUSTICE,
@@marisamartin3664actually all of the people around him who bore witness to the abuse, sexual impropriety, and virtual imprisonment of children ARE ALL GUILTY OF BEING ACCESSORIES TO HIS CRIMES
@@marisamartin3664He said “investigate.” He also said “sue the organization.” It’s a thought. Consider the Catholic Church’s “systematic” coverup of abuse. ✌🏽
@@marisamartin3664he said "should be fully investigated" not "should be lynched" and if men were protecting or colluding with Bill.... They should be investigated and prosecuted.
Thank you. Watching from Alaska.
Gothard influences are a part of my story.
Starting in the 60s.
It's heartbreaking that this is still going on.
I must state that it is important not to overlook or dismiss the importance of understanding and addressing the male victims in this discussion.
The destruction of their construct is as unhealthy and destabilizing, needing an equal level of attention and care.
Thanks for sharing!
@@CultstoConsciousness
We are in this together.
her raw emotions, I have no words. her strength will be (and probably has already been) a huge, huge help to others.
Emily, thank you for speaking out…I also was in an abusive “church” system, I was married to a very toxic man, and I sought church counseling…I was told I needed to just pray. What? Just pray. It was so dismissive and I left the room laughing! Churches are filled with narcissistic people, who have no soul. I have divorced my ex, and am going through the process of healing.. it’s very time consuming and I thank you for your testimony. Again,thank you for speaking the truth. Blessings❤️
What strength and courage Emily has! I'm thankful she's willing to talk about this despite the difficulty! Great call her mom made, not leaving her alone at headquarters!
Had to subscribe!❤ I didnt grow up in the IBLP but I grew up strict Southern Baptist. After watching the documentary I realized how far Gothards teachings really stretched. It made me sick, angry, sad, soo many emotions. My heart absolutely breaks for everyone that man has hurt. You are soo strong and brave!❤ I was personally hurt by my church that adopted his teachings and used them as their own. Like the umbrella, submitting, the fault and guilt placed on women... I could go on and on. Seeing these amazing warriors has gave me so much hope and clarity on some of the most confusing and depressing times of my life. Your stories are soo important and I thank you so much for sharing. You have touched my heart and have helped me. Sending so much love and good to you all!❤
What makes me super angry is the tax exempt status that these groups have.
Absolutely. Just take a look at the "Church" of Scientology. They're making millions and not getting taxed on a dime of it. And there's also the LDS Church they have nearly a billion dollars that's been reported to be in their coffers, an old church members are required to tithe 10% of their income. If they don't tithe they don't get to go into the temples. Yet, they don't pay a dime in taxes.
If I was telling that story, I wouldn't be able to not cry. Girl, you are strong. The God of heaven continues to keep you strong
When she talked about trying on skirts and doing different moves to make sure NOTHING shows ,,, literal Flashback of doing this!! Even swimmin in the Ocean fully dressed with a dress to the ankles btw its dangerous 😂.. I was raised Southern Pentecostal/HOLINESS. Ive been noticing sooo many similarities, home schooling, discipline, no contact with anyone outside of our family & esp blaming the females regardless of the situation. Im Happy that she has left and is continuing to Grow!! I feel obsessed with you guys ❤❤
I ❤ this channel!! I love the real Raw Honesty etc ❤❤❤
Have a Great Day ❤️
YES end of religion LUKE 17:21
It's like sheep being led to the slaughter. One person with such a pull/control on very trusting people to the point of molding their minds to believe that sexual abuse is ok, especially of their own children, is so maddening. Part of me screams, 'WHAT IS WRONG WITH THEM??", yet part of me realizes that the mind is so powerful and can be twisted so easily when someone puts their entire trust in the wrong person/place. I hope they can all come to a realization how wrong it all is. 💞
I can identify with almost every word you have said in this except for the sexual abuse. I also grew up with the same teachings and was also diagnosed with Crohn's Disease at the age of 15. It's crazy how similar your story is to mine. Thank you so much for sharing. I am still working to heal from this dangerous doctrine but am so thankful I now know truth.
It’s so encouraging to hear Emily’s testimony…as I endured very similar experiences within the churches we attended in my youth. Including SA, Physical A…and emotional, psychological manipulation and abuse.
God did call her to a great purpose at IBLP… she was meant to tear it down and expose it’s abuse! Sending love, thank you for sharing!
I mean that’s…. Really twisted.
@@aromaladyellie, actually, that does sound rather twisted.
I am so humbled by these conversation. Keep doing what you are doing girls! ❤
Thank you! ❤️
Keep speaking out about the abuse of the cult. I’m glad to hear your free from the cult and that you’re helping others in their difficult times..❤❤
Sweet girls I am so sorry these things happened. I went through a similar thing. I was also raped 3 years ago. Even as an adult, I was blamed. People asked me what I was wearing and other things. I hate this evil in the world.
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I'm so sorry you went thru that. ❤ Humans can be so brainless. I'll think of you today & pray for you, and send you love! Go after your best life!
Emily, you’re such an inspiration, and a warrior! The way you’ve turned tour tragedy into good by sharing your story and now advocating and providing resources to others in similar situations 💪 and you kept your faith thru it all! What a blessing! And Shelise, you too! You’re both rock stars imo! 👏👏👏
Thank you Shelise and Emily... both of you are strong, wise, women who are paving a path through and out of all this horrible abuse while providing many others with healing, kindness, release and yes, even a few sassy gems of hope. Linda listen. "My jeans are not the problem, your ignorance about them is." Thank You! Anne 💜💜
This is soooo important... to talk about the different ways people are abused. As a kid, I was s.a.'d, and when I would go to the library and read books on it, I convinced myself that what happened to me wasn't s.a., because what happened to me didn't "look like, sound like" what happened to the people in the books.
I agree & thank you for this comment. Similar for me. I had no words for what was happening to me as a child. Later as a teen, when I heard about s.a., it seemed like I was better off than others by comparison, & since no one I ever told, actually helped me, I minimized what happened, just like they did. And of course because of my similar religious upbringing to IBLP, I figured somehow it was my shame to bear in life, even though I wasn't sure what I had done to cause it.
As an adult, when I started to piece together everything over the years & realized it was an escalation of abusive behavior from early on, I was livid & even more repulsed than I had previously been. I am 53 years old now & even though I am mostly functional, the damage lingers. I have experienced healing to some degree, but I am amazed at how many unexpected things bring it back to the forefront of my mind. Especially when people say things like, "You should have told a teacher or reported it to the police." Yeah. Right. Because I had that kind of knowledge & power to confront my Ultra-Christian parents at 11. 🙄
Thank you Emily, for sharing, & for your strength & courage. 💜
Gothard is the epitome of evil 😢 it’s sad and astonishing how many lives he ruined and left horrific trauma 😢
emily’s story brought be to tears. i think it was the thank you note that really got me. by the time she got to the Crohn’s disease i was ready to set fires. protect emily at all costs!!!
That story was SO beautiful how it ended (not the beginning of course). She was on the verge of tears the entire time. She’s so inspiring and it was great to hear the whole story. I like the way she didn’t let her pass religious experience effect her relationship with God. New follower of hers and new sub of yours too.
Thanks for sharing! I agree. She’s a shining light. Welcome to C2C!
"How do we seek justice for victims, how we seek equality for men and women, how do we..." - like this is the perfect summation of positive Christianity and not the dogmatism that she (and I, to an extent) were raised in. Very much channeling Micah 6:8 there, "What has he asked of you, o mortal, but to do justice, love mercy (sometimes put as kindness), and to walk humbly with your God."
Emily is such an awesome person for managing to come through everything she did, and to go, "I want to help others."
Wow Emily I’m so sorry you went through all that trauma and abuse. You’re both doing such great work 🙏🏻🕯️🫶🏻
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Emily, I'm so sorry for what you experienced in this horrible cult and your home. And I'm so proud of you for taking back your power! Thank you for supporting others!
Blessings to you always! 💚🕊️💕
The men who perpetrate these cults make me sick,sick,sick. It’s always about sex and control
I had to come back to listen to the rest of this, i only got halfway before i broke down about the Childhood SA. You are both so strong for talking about these topics that need to be addressed
Ooph tell me about it. I had to take a long break during editing at the same point. So hard. Thank you for sharing and listening ❤️
I don’t like watching horror movies, and this woman’s life was a horror show. The amount of manipulation Bill exercised over this woman and other women is astounding. And the control he created over a massive amount of people to create his empire…mind boggling. I’m so sorry what happened to her. I hope now in her life she finds comfort, peace, security and love.
I'm so sorry for all that has happened to both of you. As a born again Christian, I can say with full confidence, that Jesus is love. What he desires is a personal relationship with his believers. This is freeing and not a loss of who we are, but an expression of Jesus in us. He created each of us with gifts, compassion and forgiveness is so important. It starts with forgiving ourselves.
My heart breaks and bursts for you, both.. the ability to take back your bodies, minds and souls is nothing short of PROFOUND! You both break so many generational curses each and every time you share your stories!!!!
Emily, thank you so much for your vulnerability and being willing to speak out about abuse. I know it's not something everyone is able to do, but it's so helpful. Thanks to both you and Shelise! ❤
Edit: You mentioned your freedom day. I celebrate mine from Mormonism: October 15th. I hope everything in your life continues to improve.
The sensitivity with which you conduct the interviews, Shelise, is really something else. So much in these which reaches into my own experiences. Emily, what a strong and inspiring person you are. You mother sounds amazing too. It seems such a common goal of survivors to help others where they can. I know that not all of us can do the work that you are all doing, but the people who have changed my own life, are almost exclusively survivors themselves.
I'm sorry, but this poor woman's Mother deserves to go to prison with her Father. She knew what he was doing and allowed it.
I attended IBLP seminars in the 70s as a teenager. What I know now looking back, is that there are always grains of truth in these cult groups. My parents never attended, I was there with a youth group from my church. I actually attended multiple seminars, and still have the material in my home 45 years later. Sitting here listening to this podcast, I just want to throw up. God bless you, Emily. I am so thankful that you were able to get out of it. And thank God for a mother who resisted. Thank God for a mother, who did not turn you over to a monster.
I'm so glad Emily's mom followed her instincts!!!!! YAY EMILY'S MOM!!!
But, why did she not protect her from the very person who SHOULD'VE protected her?
Two words: EYE TRAP. They're not kidding about this. Deeply troubling for sure.
Wow! I'm blown away by Emily's story. You can see how difficult it is for her to recount. I admire her for sharing it, to help others. Shelise, I love your compassion in these interviews, I know some of them must weigh on you. Take some self care time girl. Kudos to The Hubby behind the scene working hard, It shows! Y'all are great!