Solo Miniature Games: An Overview
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- čas přidán 8. 06. 2024
- Most of the time, we play miniatures games with others, but what if you want to play and have no one to play with? That's where solo miniature games come in. I've been looking into various rule systems recently, and this is a sort of thumbnail sketch of what each of them does in a solo setting.
Rules Links:
OPR - onepagerules.com/
Planet 28 - www.wargamevault.com/browse/p...
Space Weirdos - www.wargamevault.com/browse/p...
Frostgrave - (pdf) www.wargamevault.com/browse/p...
(physical) amzn.to/3PJ4k4o
Stargrave - (pdf) www.wargamevault.com/browse.p...
(physical) amzn.to/3J7Intn
Reign in Hell - www.wargamevault.com/browse/p...
Forbidden Psalm - (pdf) www.wargamevault.com/product/...
(physical) www.exaltedfuneral.com/produc...
Rangers of Shadowdeep - (pdf) www.modiphius.net/en-us/colle...
(physical) amzn.to/3vm403g
Five Parsecs From Home - (pdf) www.wargamevault.com/product/...
(physical) amzn.to/3JbsJx4
Five Leagues From the Borderlands - www.wargamevault.com/product/...
Linktree: linktr.ee/manningthefort
Instagram: / manningthefortminis
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Timestamps:
0:00 Solo Games
2:18 One Page Rules
4:00 Planet 28
6:14 Space Weirdos
9:10 Stargrave and Frostgrave
11:34 Reign in Hell
13:44 Forbidden Psalm
16:36 Rangers of Shadowdeep
18:35 Five Parsecs and Five Leagues
Music Credits:
“Rising Tide”
Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 License
creativecommons.org/licenses/b...
“Limit 70”
Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 License
creativecommons.org/licenses/b...
“Night Vigil”
Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 License
creativecommons.org/licenses/b...
“SCP-x3x (I am not OK)”
Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 License
creativecommons.org/licenses/b...
“New Hero in Town”
Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 License
creativecommons.org/licenses/b...
“Beauty Flow”
Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 License
creativecommons.org/licenses/b... - Hry
writer of forbidden psalm here, thank you so much for covering FP :)
I love the feel of the game, and I sincerely doubt it'll be the last time I cover it.
As a solo skirmish player, I can say that Forbidden Psalm is my game of choice 80% of the time now.
I pretty much love FP for solo.
OPR continues to get more and more popular. Love to see it :)
Thanks for talking about Space Weirdos! And solo play options in general.
I'm looking forward to trying it for a street-level, Necromunda-esque skirmish game.
Five Parsecs is sooooo cool, highly recommend it!! I went overboard and made terrain for every possible planet type and printed minis for every possible enemy type but if I do something I like to go all out and make the experience as unique as possible :)) I also want to try five leagues and have it tie into my five parsecs world eventually.
I have started playing Five Parsecs, and it is a lot of fun! I didn't go too nuts printing enemy minis for it, but I did print a foot-long spaceship 😆
We love Frostgrave because you can use any models you want. Most of the scenarios are about grabbing loot and getting off the table.
Pulp Alley is worth a look as well. It provides a completely different genre to the typical sci-if and fantasy. It is both solo and versus. Dave has quite a collection of videos explaining and playing the game including live Sunday morning games. An awesome game!!!
Thanks! I'm guessing the genre is what the name suggests? I do enjoy some pulp action.
@@MTFTabletop The fantastic thing about Pulp Alley (my favorite solo TT game) is that it’s not only miniatures agnostic, it’s GENRE agnostic! Due to the broad range of subjects “pulp” covers (sci-fi, cowboys, superheroes, spies, war stories, horror, etc. etc.) and the great job the rules do at providing for that range, you can use PA to play ANYTHING! I mostly use it for gothic horror and hardcore cyberpunk, and have never actually played anything “pulp” with it. It’s a fantastic set of flexible, fun rules that builds story into the actual tabletop experience, instead of just throwing two sides at each other to the death. Try it! (It’s cheap, too!)
@@rhedd5911 This! It may be Pulp but I've used Pulp Alley to play a steampunk-based Arthur Conan Doyle type Lost World scenarios as well as sci-fi using my Imperial Assault Star Wars minis and even Weird War II. All solo.
Glad to see Space Weirdos getting some recognition (here and elsewhere)...very cool system.
I may or may not be sorting through bits to make an Inquisitorial team to use with Space Weirdos...
I am exclusive solo player. When I play Grimdark future solo. I use a simple system of dice rolls to determine a lot of things. I don’t mess with flow charts, I set up the table into 3 deployment zones per side, roll a d3 (d6) and set up the units in the chosen sector. I then roll on the armies turns to see what section the rolled unit is in. I play to the best ability for both armies completely devoid of any preclusions I may have for said army. Any situation that does not have a proper outcome is subject to a die roll (unit selection and activation, enemy action prioritization) and try to play to the strengths of both sides. If I’m playing nids, I’m using cover and strength in numbers, thousand sons will try to deep strike with sorcerers to do some damage. The trick is use these games as a framework not a sacred text that must be followed to a T.
Some people need absolute rule sets that have to tell you what to do, but as a solo board gamer and wargamer, it’s easier to have some ambiguity with either army.
Long story short, build the rules you want to play with, use whatever resources you like and stitch them together. Want to add weapons, units, movement restrictions, activations, do it. Your playing solo have fun with it do what you want and don’t feel beholden to any one set of rules. I wish everyone good luck and happy gaming!
I absolutely adore Planet 28 and Space Weirdos.
I got the Hardback for Planet 28 a while ago but only recently picked up Space Weirdos, and I seriously appreciate the rules and randomness, it is brilliant
I'm a big fan of 5 parsecs, I like the crunch and bookkeeping almost as much as the skirmish element.
Definitely worth noting that Nordic Weasel releases a ton of extra material on the Patreon, including rules for space dwarves. So much extra stuff though, I haven't even read half of it.
Yeah. I'm just beginning my journey (literally and figuratively) with Five Parsecs, and I look forward to diving into more of the supplementary material
Thanks for the heads up!
I know it’s been a while since you posted this, but do you know about when the space dwarves content was posted? Can’t find it on the Patreon. Thanks!
@@olskoolsouljah May 23, 2021. He calls them the Nirn
@@wurzella1 Awesome, thank you!
I can recommend with many plays of the following: (1) Rangers of Shadowdeep (2) 5 leagues & 5 Parsecs (3) Nightwatch: simple Fantasy one shots (4) Sellswords & Spellslingers: fantasy (5) Blood in Space & Blood on the Blade (6) Horizon Wars: Zero dark (7) Elder Scrolls: Call to Arms (8) Fear of the Dark: Cthulhu Mythos (9) Insurgent Earth: Alien Invasion (10) Country Road: Z -zombies.
Great list!
A good point to make about OPR is that if you subscribe to their Patreon (and if you 3d print, you will want to anyway) you get a set of rules that allows you to create custom armies and units and pulls back the curtain on their point formulae.
Interesting. I had skipped the Patreon for now since I don't 3D print, but that is another nice incentive.
@@MTFTabletop The tier 1 patreon gives you full access to everything except the 3D STLs, for half the price of the tier 2 patreon. Including discounts for getting their minis printed, of you want to get some.
I'm partial to "Fallout Wasteland Warfare" and "Elder Scrolls Call to Arms", both by Modiphius, of the two I prefer the Elder Scrolls one, since it has less tokens etc. that clutter the table.
Unlike most of the games described in the video, there are official miniatures for the games, a little expensive if you're collecting the entire range but the models are really gorgeous.
Sword wierdos also exist for people who prefer fantasy games.
Also 5 system goes WAY beyond fantasy or sci fi. There is FiveCore that I recommend for people that have mixed collections with a bit of anything. It started as WWII game called 5 man in Normandy that is excellent and one of the best sole experiences around.
As a canadian i have often blasted the imperial measurement system and the fact that americans cling to it so ardently is a bit mysterious and a little worrying in regard to the future BUT...
After doing some rpging and wargaming i will say that the imperial system is very human centric and all the measurements work very organically when determining spacing and movements proportional to the human body.
Besides that its a mathematical nightmare.
There are also solo expansions for Frostgrave (Perilous Dark) and Stargrave (Hope Eternal) now, so those are very good options.
Thanks for the vid - I've been looking for more solo options!
How does Stargrave play solo with Hope Eternal? 5Parcecs feels like it's designed for solo and with Stargrave I always thought it's just an addon but a clunky one, since whole game was more pvp focused.
@xTaikoen same as frostgrave plays solo. More focus on pve and pv environment.
Excellent overview, just what I was looking for.
I already got some of those and still preparing minis and everything, but I might have a look at the others you brought up. Now that things are opening up a little it is a good thing that you can play a lot of that cooperatively. Especially great for getting new people into the hobby or letting them participate when otherwise they would not necessarily pick up minis themselves but can enjoy the experience.
Planet 28, 2nd ed, is now available. I've only skimmed my copy but it condenses the 3 volumes into one, has expanded a number of abilities, equipment, etc including armour which I did not like in 1st ed. Definitely worth a look.
Excellent video mate. Very well presented. Well done!
Great content! Because of this, I found out about Bestiarum miniatures which I will be printing. I also got Forbidden Psalm. Those minis will be perfect! Thanks!
Bestiarum is fantastic for FP.
I have also enjoyed the concept of solo play.
I know this video is older but a couple to add to it would be Acolyte- an INQ28 inspired game that uses combat similar to Kill Team. Deep, Abandon (and the upcoming Deep Space Abandoned) that is a miniature agnostic game similar to the newer Warhammer Quest games like Blackstone Fortress, Silver Tower and Hammerhall in it utilization of dice to perform actions.
I have subscribed and will check out your video log for follow ups that you may have already done since this video.
Looks like general scifi and fantasy are covered pretty well so far, so I want to suggest 4 Color Studios for superhero gaming. They have a lot of options. I prefer Super Mission Force with a solo rule set the author released as a free download but they also publish Slugfest, a superhero game inspired by Rangers of Shadowdeep. They(I think it's really just one guy) also produce scifi and fantasy versions of the SMG ruleset as well as a couple different takes on skirmish gaming.
Also, Gangs of the Undercity is a cyberpunk skirmish game inspired by Shadowrun with rules for solo play which work with their campaign system. The developers had a rough time getting it out but I think it's a great game.
I've enjoyed Nightwatch by Patrick Todoroff. He has several games using similar mechanics, including Zona Alfa and Exploit Zero.
Thank you for a really fine and useful review.
Great list! There's one missing from the list that might be up your alley: Horizon Wars - Zero Dark.
Sci-fi, miniature agnostic, can be played solo, co-op or pvp (though this last way to play it is by far the worst for me). Uses a very interesting activation resolution based on D12s and uses a deck of cards as both a clock for the mission and to determine the enemy activation.
There's also an expansion Zero Dark: Operation Nemesis which includes a 12 scenario campaign for solo or co-op.
Not the cheapest but worth it on my opinion. Available on wargame vault :)
Thanks for the suggestion. I'll check it out!
The Reign in Hell guys recently came out with Space Station Zero, which is solo/coop. There are also some other solo mini games that were interesting to play, such as Chrome Hammer Ascension, which is cyber fantasy. Also, two solo mini games called Insurgent Earth and Nightwatch, by the author of Zona Alfa.
There's also Country road Z, that fits in the last category of built from ground up to be a solo game with a strong campaign.
Set in the zombie apocalypse, it does have scripted missions and the best base building I've ever read in a wargame. It also does have an activation system for the enemies that rewards strategic or stealthy play.
Steve Jackson 'Car Wars'. this game is really good solo.
I also play battletech solo.
Great list! I've just gotten into 5 Leagues From The Borderlands and am really enjoying it.
Thanks! I'm gearing up for Five Parsecs and Forbidden Psalm atm.
There is also a very interesting game doomed (grimlite), this is an indie skirmish with new mechanics and 40 missions that can be played both with friends and solo. You can also play lasting tales, this game is similar to rangers shadow deep.
Sounds interesting! Can you tell me who produces it?
@@MTFTabletop Grimlite author Chris McDowall is published by Bastionland press. Author lasting tales Mark Latham publisher Blacklist games.
What a great video, 1st time watcher of your channel. Mate, I'm so fascinated by these games, I wish I'd be able to start but I have no idea how to even begin this journey! It seems so complex and complicated, what should I do as a guy with absolute ZERO experience with ttg? Please advise, if you can! Thank you so much for this video!
Final girl is a pretty cool solo board game. Just picked up demonship and made my own terrain for it. Havent played yet.
Also been playing ironsworn, and apothecaria
Cheers to OPR!!!
Fallout Wasteland Warfare is my favourite war game to play solo, both it and Modiphius’ Elder Scrolls: Call to Arms have a very good AI system built in and play well solo.
I have been tempted by the Wasteland Warfare starter. As an old-school Fallout fan, I have a question: Is Dogmeat a playable character?
@@MTFTabletop Oh yes! They needed him actually because out of the box he was too good! There is also an armoured Dogmeat model!
@@MTFTabletop not only is Dogmeat a playable character, (with 3 different sculpts to choose from, iirc) he is an absolute unit. He is a heat-seeking missile of destruction and one of the best Survivor models you’d want on your side. 🐕
I just got into space weirdos, Ive played one game its pretty cool so far. You need quite a few dice to have enough for two teams, which amounts to 4 sets of rpg dice. Reign in hell needs more and I haven't got around to trying it yet cuz i gotta buy so many dice for it. I have lately been favouring game with less paperwork required between games. Feels like those things throw a spanner in the works of me getting a game in.
Some other solo games I’ve played or own:
Fallout Wasteland Warfare - mentioned in the comments already, this was designed for 1v1, solitaire and co-op play from the beginning. The solitaire rules are robust and most FWW youtubers tend to play solitaire.
Operation Last Train - solitaire sci fi game designed by Joseph McCullough. Think Starship Troopers and you are attempting to rescue civilians. Money raised goes to charity.
Starbreach - this is a minis-agnostic 1v1 game, similar to One Page Rules with a solitaire expansion called, “Hunter”. You can easily play the base game solitaire as well, since unit activations are pulled from a blind bag ala Bolt Action. Lots of scenarios to play in the core book.
Exploit Zero, formerly titled “Hardwired”. This is a solitaire Cyberpunk skirmish game (minis agnostic), which I got Print on Demand from Amazon just before COVID. I got a 3D printer to make all the minis for this game, but any Cyberpunk minis will do. Polyhedral dice. You’ll want 6-10 low-, mid- and high-level security forces to fight against. I use droids for low-tier, cyber-cops for mid-tier and armored up space-goons for high-tier. Your team of 4-6 infiltrators have to get in, get the goods and get out. There are a couple expansions available.
Honorable mention:
Zone Raiders - a super-sci-fi skirmish game, that (imho) mixes dystopian Infinity with AT-43 for its lore. This is a minis-agnostic campaign game which is primarily designed for 1v1 battles, but does have co-op rules and scenarios and many adversarial NPC models/factions to go up against. Has potential for solo play using those rules. I really like the setting and unique factions for this one.
This is very helpful. Thanks!
Manning the Fort I remembered one more: Chrome Hammer Ascension. Another solitaire Cyberpunk skirmish game. Published by Nordic Weasel Games (5 Parsecs & 5 Leagues) with a different author. I don’t own this one yet, but have watched the game designer play through a mission here on CZcams and it looked pretty good. You can find it on WGV.
Exploit Zero's author has also produced a dark fantasy version of the rules called Nightwatch.
@@darkaiel awesome! Thanks for the intel, I’ll check it out.
Thanks for the overview, Looking at starting a new campaign with 5 parsecs and have thoroughly enjoyed Fallout Wasteland warfare. Have you ever heard about the game All Things Zombie: Miniatures - Fade to Black, it seems to be solo and miniature agnostic as well.
Hey bud there are many amazing games out there for solo :-) as well as TTRPGs I have several atm. Also I love everything Mork Borg, there are solo stuff out there for it and you can use it in everything Mork Borg that dont have in set solo rules. The main one is Sölitary Defilement and Sölitary Depths expansion done by another person both together are like 15 bucks and well worth it :-) I am also a big OPR fan
Two simple cheap solo skirmish games are Nightwatch )fantasy) and Exploit Zero(cyberpunk)
Good job, comrade! Subscribed!
Thanks!
I haven't tried them yet, but here are a couple more for soloists to check out:
-Brutality Skirmish Wargame by Scott Wainwright
-Vanguard: Seeking Sanctuary by Kai Bettzieche
Thanks! It's kind of shocking to me how much is out there in this space.
Some more, though haven't played it yet:
- Dungeons & Glory (it's from ONE PAGE RULES, listed under "One-Off Games")
- Maze Rats (don't know who made it)
@@eldritchmorgasm4018
Legend!
Thanks for these, I'll check them out!
@@shaneannigans If you play D&G & make a video, tell me, somehow nobody seems to play/review it, or even know about it 😅
@@eldritchmorgasm4018
Had a look at D&G but it doesn't seem to be a solo game
5 parsecs sounds great Ill have to check it out. Have you personally played through any of the solo campaigns yet?
The best is anything made by Batlle Systems : Maladum and Corespace.
Play 40k, but with dice in a bag activation like Bolt Action. Perfect for solo play as it is random and generates narrative.
Interested to hear your thoughts on Snarling Badger’s newest effort, Space Station Zero - thx for the quick overview!
You're in luck, I just put out my first impressions a few days ago 😉
Supers fans may like Super Skirmish Gaming by Scott Pyle of Four-Color Studios. He has a few other games that will play well solo.
Majestic 13 also a brilliant one
These look awesome. I’m looking for a miniatures based game around the simplicity of HeroQuest. Do you know of a game like that?
Would love to see some more info or a playthrough of Reign In Hell.
It's definitely on the list, and I heard on Uncle Atom's live stream the other day that their next game is coming soon.
Now THIS got my attention
Glad you found it intriguing. Is there a system in particular that speaks to you?
Table Salt Games (vids on youtube) have a superhero skirmish solo-friendly game that might work for your Marvel Crisis Protocol minis.
My favourite solo skirmish game is Battlespace, also by Table Salt Games. Other interesting options are For What Remains (uses tokens, not minis) and Killwager & Black Powder Red Earth (not sure how these play solo). I'm pretty sure Moonstone could be solo because of the combat card system.
Thanks! I'll take a look. Supers is one of those genres that I wish got more love overall.
Forbidden Psalm is my favourite on this list.
They all have their selling points, but Forbidden Psalm is definitely in a league of its own for flavor.
No mention of the king of solo games? Two hour war games have every genre covered and an unmatched solo play reaction system.
OPR ain't free. The full rules are locked behind a subscription if you want to stay up to date.
No mention of Two Hour Wargames?! THW is a pioneer of wargaming solo; their rules include the best ones for the Vietnam War (FNG), the best WW2 rules (NUTS!) and the best sci-fi rules (5150). All of these can be played, solo against the AI of the rules, with two players, or with a group against the AI.
When I made this, I (perhaps surprisingly) wasn't aware of THW. I'm putting together a new list for a future video Soon (tm).
Weird question, but do any of these use a 52 card deck? I thought there was one, and i cant remember the name.
Rangers of Shadowdeep does
What about the fallout wasteland game? That has solo play dosen't it?
Does it? That's on my list to check out down the road.
@@MTFTabletop I'm almost 100% positive it dose but I don't own it but I have watched videos online of someone playing a solo campaign
@@darkcow7of9 Yeah, I just looked it up. Neat!
Yes, Fallout Wasteland Warfare was designed with solitaire play in mind from the beginning. Every model in the game has an A.I. card that can guide its actions for solo or NPC play. They also have solo scenarios and campaigns available on their website and in print. The solitaire aspect convinced me to get into the game earlier this spring and I’ve enjoyed every battle so far.
What about Space Station Zero, that's also from Badger
I made this video before that dropped. I actually have that book on the table next to me right now. I did a first impressions video, and plan to get a few games in for a full review soon.
@@MTFTabletop that's awesome, didn't realize this was an older video, algorithm decided to toss it my way on autoplay. Glad I found you though
Everything two hour wargames sells is designed for solo play.
Fallout: Wasteland Warfare should have been on this list.
Metric makes your brain hurt?
It's a base 10 system. If you can count to ten, you know can figure out metric.
It's not like Freedom Units that use fractions and odd base systems.
I can understand metric, it's just that everyday life being in Freedom Units means I feel like I have to internally convert it in my mind. That said, it was (mostly) a joke.
In freedumb land, the real issue with metric system games is the lack of measuring devices, in my experience. I don't typically see tape measures with metric measurements here.
@@TundraGheist That's also true. It does help things like the Kill Team widgets make sense. I bet there are stls for metric measuring widgets that would make life a little easier with metric.
@@TundraGheist GW made a killing with their tape measures that were like $15 back in 2002. The reason? All of their games were in inches, but often sold in countries using metric and didn't have tape measures in Imperial.
Check out the sewing section of your local Wal-Mart or similar store. They have tape measures that are metric on one side and inches on the other. I searched them out when I wanted to play Cruel Seas.
No historical ones...
I'm not very informed on historicals. If you know of one, I'd love to hear about it!
06:00 I don't get why using a decimal system would make anyone's brain hurt. For starters in the US they don't even have actual imperial, which was the worldwide standard used in the UK, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, South Africa and India, because those standards were set in 1824 in London and the US were not at that meeting, that's why you don't use stone in dry weight or why all your liquid weights are out of whack as well as your tiny short tons.
So it's not even imperial that you have there anyway, but a mickey mouse version that no one recognised worldwide, like with your dictionary.
I live in a country that has both, and metric is always easier, because it's a decimal system, unlike imperial. I don't have to bother with 8ths or 16ths of inches, because I have millimeters, which are a lot easier to understand and measure, since they are consistent and all interchangeable, unlike in imperial, even the mickey mouse version you have over there.
But we get it, you had this revolution and copied lots of things from the French, like their social contract as the constitution with rights and responsibilities, you copied them in driving on the wrong side of the road, you copied them by having a president, you copied their decimal money and not the old English system of how many copper coins go into a silver coin and how many of those go into gold sterling. You instead got a decimal system of money, like the French had. You still have it and it doesn't hurt your brains collectively, they way that system hurt British brains until the 1970s, when they adopted a decimal system of currency, but at least they were consistent.
In weight, I weigh about 14 stone and I know my weight in kilos, it's easy. No one says their weight in pounds only, because we only use those for smaller weights, like with bread or sugar, you don't weigh people using pounds, those are just random numbers to us imperial users, as if I can be bothered to divide 200 pounds by 13 to get the normal weight in imperial in stone that we use for people out here in the real world.
You actually went to copy the French in going metric, but are the only ones on the entire planet to say that a decimal system is "too complicated" and are still unique in thinking that to a man, which is why we all joke about you guys and metric, because everyone else down here on planet Earth finds it a lot easier, and that's probably why NASA use it, as do most of your scientific community.
13:45 yeah, I remember the Satanic panic, that was something that happened abroad where we sent a bunch of puritans where would would not have to think about them ever again.
All of a sudden our D&D books were vandalised, suddenly demons were daemons, which looked really hokey, because it was, and now the books are in normal English again, mostly.
Reminds us all of how only you guys had problems with the Harry Potter children's books, or how only you guys banned booze or abortion again out of all of us. Not really normal out here in the free wold though, is it, so don't normalise that, because it's not normal in free countries, that's more normal in places like Afghanistan. Out here we believe in freedom of speech and conscience, unlike over there.
Nobody read this. Nobody liked it. Nobody, besides me, commented. Don't you feel silly now? I would.
@@Amfortashe is right though. It's weird over in bizzaro land.
Did anyone ever hear about computer games???
Check out acolyte. A solo or coop mode of play for kill team
Good overview thanks. Now go try “Sellswords & Spellsingers” by Ganesha games. Also I think it bears mentioning that the Stargrave solo rules supplement are free & were rushed out at the time when it became apparent that the pandemic wasn’t ending anytime soon.
Thanks for the tip! And yeah, the Stargrave solo rules as they stand were definitely meant to be a stopgap. I am hopeful there will be more coming, as I do like the base system.
@@MTFTabletop my last comment was a bit trite. Thank you for making this vid and promoting these alternates to the GW behemoth. I think there can be a great space for these kind of solo & coop games. the more people that know these games are available, the better.
@@nickharling3902 I think you were right to point that out about Stargrave. The context of it being released in 2021 is definitely relevant.