The REAL Way To Clean Up A Muddy Metal Guitar Tone
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- čas přidán 5. 05. 2021
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You’d think achieving killer guitar tone would be as simple as finding a tried and true rig that seems to be producing great results for someone else..
Well, in reality, a great sounding guitar tone DOES NOT start with gear or magical settings.
In my latest tutorial, I share the real way that pro producers get their guitars sounding awesome within the context of a production.
It’s small tweaks like these that most people tend to overlook that give you the real results in the studio that we're all after.
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What is the song? I want to hear the whole thing!
Since I started tracking DI's I've noticed that rhythm guitars have been a major part in my mixes sounding muddy. Makes it a lot easier to edit them!
A must do! Playing extremely tight to the grid is really hard, this is one of those issues that jumps out like a sore thumb once you've gone through recording yourself and polishing as close to pro as possible.
Recording yourself to do a high quality demo will really help reveal what you should work on as a player, highly recommend it
100% correct. Couldn't agree more.
So true. I could not believe the difference myself initially. I had been recording myself for what, 20 years, and always considered myself "tight". Recently I picked the guitar back up to properly practice, metronome, recording myself, etc. I had one track with one riff that I had practiced enough to actually be very consistent across takes, and another riff that I didn't have that much time for to practice. I thought I was tight enough for it. Same session. Same guitar. Same settings. Same player. VERY big difference in "guitar tone" even without editing. Still learning how to splice takes and edit to get this more consistently, but no question, 99% of my years of tone issues has actually been tightness of takes.
I can't even count all the times I've wanted to say "when it comes to practice: more tight rhythm playing, less mindless sweeping" to metal guitarists.
Send those guitarists to Riffhard.com. Less work in editing (though never "none").
Couldn't agree more! Crazy shredding means nothing to me if the meat and potatoes ain't right.
Yeah, right
The thing is, shredding or rhythm chugging, it's still music. If you shred just for shredding, then there's no music in there, it's just your fingers moving fast or else.
No matter what you do, it's music only if it sounds musical.
This is pretty cool, and I honestly didn’t know you could do this as I’m pretty new still to recording.
I’ve been spending a lot of time on my guitar parts to get them as tight as possible.
I’ll still continue to do that obviously, I want to be as good a guitarist as possible, but this is awesome to have at my disposal if I choose.
Thanks for the video man, I’ve learned a ton from you.
Cant wait to try this I think this is a huge problem I have been having and didn’t even know about this. Thanks man!!
Hey bobby thank you for this video ! From now on when bands send me their own tracks for me to mix i am sure to send this video
Ive been doing this for quite a while and man i have got to say it changed my mixes to a whole new level!
Thanks man! This is invaluable and right on time for me making my first steps in editing
I just downloaded your free IR. Thanks to that and the tricks you have shared my guitar tone has improved. Thank you very much! 🤘
Thank you Bobby. Apparently I've been my worst enemy.
OMG!! This is incredible!! Sounds much better with simple corrections. Thanks!
Somewhere Glenn Fricker is pulling his hairs out of his skull.
Great video. What I learned hard way is not to use auto alignment plugins in cases like that to align both guitars. Yes, you can splice and drag single notes to align them nicely but DO NOT use auto alignment to fit one whole track into the other one as it will create phasy, messed up guitar tracks. Unfortunately I learned it hard way one time mixing one of my songs.
Great tips Bobby! Thank you so much
i use the exact setup on X50 lol, that one really never gets old when it comes to tone shaping.
Clear and useful as usually 🙏👍
Bobby- you are gold! As a producer myself, I knew you were going to address transients - transient alignment ? - I should have caught that! Good on you for this knowledge! Cheers!
Your Pro Tools color selection is so cool.
That’s crazy! Blew my mind.
That is a huge difference. I've always kind of struggled with having my guitars sound muddy or too dark. I double track my guitars and I can almost guarantee this is the issue. Thank you so much for this video. I'm excited to try it out for myself!
very helpful! Thank you.
Fantastic video sir🤘
Thanks for the video, that really is something that people usually overlook because it's not as fancy as a plugin.
I just have one question, why do you set your transients after the beat? I usually set them before the beat, because the beginning of it tend to be the pick scrape and the peak is the actual note, so I get a bit of pick scrape "building up" to the actual note on the beat
Remarkable example. Sinks in. Thank you for this one.
At first I couldn't say it was bad, once you started fixing I can definitely tell the difference. There is sure a lot of work, but it's worth it !
I gotta try this approach. However I have to admit that even original performance sounds really nice.
Many thanks!
I never did before but I do now because of you and it's a Major Difference. Night and Day. It's like I'm a really good Guitar player now. Lol
Guilty of this myself... This is a gold lesson. Subbed.
What I need to do from now on is record rhythm guitar as a dry signal and get my hands dirty with crossfaders. Thanks for the lesson!
Anytime, Brian!
Love your videos! What guitar software did you use in this tutorial?
Thank you 🙏
greaaaaat, thank you!
So can you give your reasoning on if you prefer this way as opposed to using time stretching/elastic editing with warp mode? I like both of these ways and think they have different results depending on what you're looking to achieve. I've even took the method in the video a couple steps further which becomes really tedious but can get insanely tight. More often, elastic audio is my main go-to. Opinion?
really helpful bobby...you still need to come by one of these days and give me some tips!
Nice video that's a real practical trick 👍
One question though I struggle with amp sim to sound as good as the standalone versions , why do they sound worse when I load them as plugin in my DAW . Is there any way to make them sound as good as the standalone ??
Thank you!
that was a great video , focusing over editing
Thank you so much bobby. I'm new to guitar editing about a week.
since now i love quad tracking and with quad tracking you can hear the sloppiness even more than double tracking.
Any tips if i can still hear the hiccup in the split part? Even with fill the space and crossfade
If you have too big of a gap to fix with slip editing, first if you can get another cleaner take that is the best option. If you are stuck with the track, consider cutting the preceding note somewhere in the decay/tail of the note after the transient and time-stretching that a bit plus crossfading the slip edit. This works 10x better if you do it on the guitar DI BEFORE you re-amp or if it's an amp sim. This will sound kinda crappy on physically recorded takes.
I’ve only recently started doing this. I do find that in a very few instances things can sound robotic and more mono sounding if you’re using the same amp plugin on both guitars. Sometimes guitars slightly off give you a bigger sound due to the washiness (is that a word? 😂)
This editing tip is invaluable! I'm guilty of skipping this major step every time! :/
One of the most important pieces of advice ever! Thanks once again Bobby, you are doing an amazing contribution with this!!
“If you don’t mind your mixes sounding jumbled and muddy...” 😂😂 a little salty today?
I've actually had people claim sloppy playings sounds better to them. No, I'm not joking. I don't get it, but to each their own!
@@FrightboxRecording I mean...I’m all about human elements, but the music has to be tight.
Yup. Editing may not be sexy but it's absolutely vital. The cut and nudge function in Reaper makes it pretty quick and simple though
This is where the fun in your performance ultimately ends. But it is satisfying to listen to it after all this ridiculous labor.
Editing is very hepful and needed in most cases. The only thing I struggle with when it comes down to editing is the speed. I just wish I could do it faster cause right now i feel like im spending too much time than it's needed. I guess the solution could be recording tighter takes at the source
Its Ok. It takes time. Often even more time than tracking itself. But it pays off bigtime. Overtime you'll learn to do it faster. You'll learn shortcuts. Memorizing some crucial key commands on your DAW helps a lot. I'd say tight playing (i mean... ehem... editing) its more important in metal that the "TONE" itself, once you got a nice "in the pocket" guitar track, you'll find you can change the settings, the plugins, the amp sim itself and it wont matter that much to make the guitar sit in the mix.
@@victorcadavid5761 Nice, thank you!
hey man where can i find that snare sample? can i buy it from you?
I have a question about editing but using time stretching audio? I understand creating a clip like you do then nudging it but I have a feature like most daws, that allow you to stretch transients back or forth using elastic algorithms. Obviously you can not stretch far because of artifacts but what about stretching small amounts.. would you recommend? This should have been my email question... sorry bobby.
Mark.
I never use stretching unless it's on overdubs or background elements. Too many artifacts.
@@FrightboxRecording good to know.. maybe i don't have the ear for it but i feel like it works for me in small amounts.. but lately have been sticking with your method!
nice stuff Bobby, have you thought of making more than 1 IR though? :)
Got something cool coming in the near future :)
@@FrightboxRecording siiick!
OK... I'm a Reaper user and have not seen this Batch Fade tool before. Can you clarify is this built into Reaper or something you added on ? If so where can *I* also get a copy of it ? I've written some actions to do similar things in the past but think this Batch Fade tool would be super useful!
You don't even have to batch fade in Reaper. Just set it to "auto fades" and you'll never have to think about fades again.
@@FrightboxRecording Could but I think that tool would be useful in general. Any idea where it came from ? I cannot easily find any references to it in the Reaper forums.
maybe using audio bend will yield better results with less editing hassles
Can you achieve similar results by quantizing the audio automatically vs manually moving?
Yes, but it'll sound more robotic. By doing it like this, you keep the human feel.
Is this song released yet? I love that chunky riff. Reminds me of some dying fetus slow grooves.
www.nefariousindustries.com/collections/voidscape-odyssey-of-spite
@@FrightboxRecording thanks man
Can i ask you something? Matt Tuck, when you release a new album?🤔
i dont really know whats wrong with my guitar man but it doesnt sound right at all, my amp sounds really messed up
@1:38 if you took the drum track out I could pay attention to the guitars 😂
One good way I found to check if your guitars are tight enough is to listen to your guitars in mono.
Things be on the grid is my main concern. I care to be playing in time than a good tone, because the tone I can always change it.
You're right man. I'd say tight playing (i mean... ehem... editing) its more important in metal that the "TONE" itself, once you got a nice "in the pocket" guitar track, you'll find you can change the settings, the plugins, the amp sim itself and it wont matter that much to make the guitar sit in the mix.
@@victorcadavid5761 absolutely. Unfortunately a great bunch of musicians think only of the tone
Hi Bobby and Everyone... I have a weird phenomenon that fits in slightly to the cleaning portion of this, and was hoping maybe someone has heard this before and knows what the deal is. (I also understand if this isn't the place to do this, so I apologize and would love to know where these things might be discussed, if anywhere)
I have a baritone 6 with emgs 81/85's and I go into a digitech drop tune put down 3 half steps. I've encountered a weird what sounds like EQ sweep that starts happening in some places for some reason. I'm just using the Archetype Gojira plugin for an amp sim with nothing else going on. I have a small clip demonstrating this. Pickup height? Battery? I have no idea. I can only assume it's the pickups, though. Thanks for any input, and again, I apologize if this isn't the right place to post this.
soundcloud.com/integralbird/weird-sweep
More EDIT videos, with details, waveform explanation (pick attack, transient information, body of the note..)..
This is a workflow I adapted in Reaper. czcams.com/video/kjanI08-7QY/video.html
How do you consolidate a track so it doesn't have a lot of cuts in the audio sample?
Use crossfades like I do in the video.
In reaper at least, select all the items and right click any of them while selected, click "Glue Items." You will lose all of your takes if you do this though, this would be a final "bounce" step when you are 100% satisfied with the edits
Awesome, thanks a lot for both of you 😎🤘🏽
link doesnt work
Just tried it and it works. Send me an email at bobby@frightboxrecordingacademy.com
i do this, but in a different way. way less cutting.
editing/moving single chords/chunks/etc = makes the audio feel sterile, dead and mechanically stiff. same with the "drum plug in has hits right on the bars", which is literally saying "machine like accuracy with absolutely no human groove in it anymore". the note on "be slightly behind the beat, and keep guitars as steady as possible beat-wise is a good one, but the best sounding results can only be achieved by rerecording parts until they are as good as it can get. worst choice imo is to edit everything as long as it fits. a trained ear will also be able to tell the cuts in between chords as there is something missing usually (micro slides, frequences that mix naturally from chord to chord) that a crossfade can't emulate well enough. try it out, record 10 chords, edit them all, record 10 chords, listen to them unedited. the tiny "unevenness" in between has it's function, allthough it's not straight "core musical" mostly.
also, hardly edited music has the flaw that it will never sound close to you on stage then, as this is where the human factor is back in it big time. easy to edit things and loose sight of what a player is capable of in a situation where you have to do the stuff again in a decent way. of course - a bit of editing is ok, and everbody does it to a certain degree. but i'd recommend to find a healthy common ground / compromise in between rerecordings, taking small mistakes as "human" and therefore, leave em in, and editing. 5 mins of song, and you have maybe 5-10 edited small areas - fine. if it's 50+ or 300 edits, well, not so good.
/ cheers to frightbox still, of course. /
So, the secret is to get good, basicly)))
Ok, what if it's only guitar and it's muddy? lol
Why not just copy/paste the good performance onto the bad one?
LMAO this is not muddy. What I make is muddy. Literally impossible to EQ out. I have no idea what is going wrong.
Duplicate tracks to dub and invert phase!
U dont need to time aling to sound good ask any band that recorded live off the floor analog
edition is what artists pay for. Jaja its a joke