How To RUIN Your Outdoor Wood Boiler! Dont Do THIS!
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- čas přidán 2. 07. 2024
- Hi everyone lets discuss an ongoing issue I have seen with outdoor boiler owners is discussing water temp and what to set the machine water temp at! Thank you for all that have sent photos of their outdoor wood boiler set ups! I love seeing the setups!
ONE REASON I SOLD MY CENTRAL BOILER AND REPACED IT WITH A PORTAGE AND MAIN...COULDN'T TAKE THE SMOKE BILLOWING OUT OF THE DOOR ALL THE TIME. HAD IT 12 YEARS (A 6048) AND TRIED EVERYTHING BUT ALWAYS BILLOWED SMOKE OUT THE DOOR. MY LUNGS STARTED FEELING IT. LIKE YOUR VIDEOS...KEEP IT UP
Thanks Bear! Yes the smoke is a issue but similair on other models. Some are better than others! OWBS are like different brand of cars each has pro and cons. I dont like the smoke either. Maybe I can figure out something to help mitigate this!
I'm the 2nd owner of an indoor Cheppee wood boiler that's been in the family since 1982.
Even though it's not an outdoor boiler I've still learned alot on what not to do.
I look foward lowering my oil usage especially with these insane prices. This winter will be our fist season heating with wood so I can only hope the 6 cords I have will last the winter, and burn as little oil as possible. Thanks for taking us along on your homestead adventures.
Thanks for coming over to the channel! Much appreciated! Happy heating! I cant wait to start wood heat!
I enjoy seeing how someone else feeds their boiler. I have the CL6048 and love it especially with propane getting so high this year. This is my second season but will be my first full season, last year when we bought our house we didn’t plan on using it (moved in feb 1st) but after seeing how fast we went through our propane we decided to turn it on sadly we didn’t have any wood and learned the hard way that people selling seasoned hardwood aren’t always honest. This season I am well prepared and finally feel I have a better handle on how much and how Often I need to load it to keep it running right. Thanks for the videos and look forward to seeing more!
Hey J! Yes my first few years were BRUTAL! I had no wood, no shed, no tools... the machine constantly burning out... It was a mess! This was before the channel! Now I can tell you almost to the minute how long the machines gonna run with a load of wood! You get used to it and you will develop habits and you will see how each wood burns in the machine which is real cool. I.E pine burns hot and fast so there is a quick recover time and maple burns slow and not as hot which is a longer recovery time etc... its fun to heat with wood! I hope you enjoy it and it works out! Long live the classics! Send me a photo of the machine and I will put it in a future video! Homesteadjay35@gmail.com
U’ll never go back !!
Hi Jay happy 2022 to you and your family we love watching your videos I look forward to more to come in the new year.
You too thank you! Sorry for late reply!
Great info on temps. A neighbor of mine says the worst feeling is waking up in the morning to the sound of the oil furnace running and realizing that the fire ran out and you are trying to 'back heat' the wood furnace with oil. I'm sure it happens very rarely but my hvac guy says you could put a thermostatic shutoff on so that if the fire burns out the circulator pumps from the wood furnace would shut off. It's a thought.
Thats not a good idea because whats preventing the boiler from freezing? My oil does this exact thing it will "backheat" the heat exchanger which will keep the water in the boiler from freezing. Its super inefficient but the purpose of the oil is to prevent the machine from freezing so im not worried about efficiency, Id rather use a few gallons of oil then wreck a $10000 machine lol Per NH code these machines need a backup either oil, gas, propane, etc...
@@HomesteadJay That's an excellent point of course. A lot colder where you are than where i am. Working on a first time install now.
Ha! I used to wake up in the middle of the night when the indoor boiler kicked on...wife to this day still mentions from time to time, this would get me out of bed but a crying baby I'd just sleep right through...
Been using a classic for 13 years !! I keep my temp at 160 until outside goes below zero then turn up. One thing I can say is the more wood u put in the more will burn anytime ! I only put in enough to get to the next fill. To much wood n not cold enough my stove boils over. It’s a learning experience til u figure it out but what isn’t ? I only burn hardwood when needed. With the old version I can burn most any wood. I keep a coating of creasote on the inside but keep the bottom n sloped sides clean.
Boils over? You should have a boil over under any condition if im told correctly. Only boil overs ive seen are when you leave the door open and the water exceeds 185 up into the 200 degree field
Great info! Love all the different wood boilers too!
Glad you like them! I do too! I think its cool to see everyones set up!
Would love to see a video showing how you manage the water in a wood boiler. Specifically, adding water - where? Checking water level. Testing water. How all the valves, etc... associated with water.
I will be doing this soon as I’m relocating the boiler so it will basically be a “new” install. So subscribe and keep checking in!
Great advice Jay, I guess we are officially in that season 😕!
Slainte,
DC
Oh yes! Thanks for watching!
This was a very informative and interesting video!
Glad it was helpful! Thanks for watching!
I feel running between 175 & 85 does several things to our benefit.
Keeps algae n bacteria to a minimum inside the water jacket (even though i/we get our water checked yearly).
Blower on furnaces run less to bring the buildings up to temp ,therefore uses less electricity.
If the fire does go out, it continues to heat the buildings for longer period cuz of more "reserved " heat in the water.
Running these Temps also keeps the condensation inside the firebox down AND there's noticeably less creosote buildup too witch aids in better heat transfer from the flames to the steel without creosote "insulating" the heat path.
Hey Van! Might as well copy paste your comment in the video lol spot on with wood FACTS! Thanks for chiming in! Glad we think alike!
Great advice, I have a heatmor outdoor boiler which I heat my house with , I have in floor heat both in the main living area and in my basement. I also use the furnace for my domestic hot water as well in the winter months in Nova Scotia. Canada
Cheers to you my canadian friend! Thanks for tuning in!
Great video jay. My Heatmor was pre set for me at 170 by previous owner but I’ve been wanting to up that to 180.
Gonna see what installer thinks. Would feel better about the fans having to kick on less/smother out faster. Lately it’s been sitting idle during the day time as it’s still warm out/above 0 Celsius here in Canada
Hey Elmwood! Same issue across all brands. Warm days less heat demand sometimes they all have issues firing back up lol seen it happen on mine late season where its 65 during day and 30 at night lol
Yes my wood stove is at 185 now doing really good buddy you did a good on your video god bless too you guys love your video buddy
Rock on!
Good night too you guys buddy
Your doing good Jay... ( Good advice today also )
pc
Appreciate it!
The automobile analogy was kind of a bad one. A vehicle does not add or subtract fuel to control the coolant temperature. Maintaining a hotter shell temperature requires the boilers controller to add air more often to keep that temperature up. More air = more fuel (wood). The actual downside to cooler shell temperature is your furnace fan in your home has to run longer costing you in electricity; plus below 150°F, promotes microbes (bacteria) to grow. When they die, they turn to an acidic muck that fouls heat exchangers and erodes piping.
Hey Jay, great video again and thanks for the pic upload of the wood stove. The one thing I don't see you do is throw any ashtrol in your boiler. What's your take on that?
Hey Max! That sounds like a good video topic LOL ill add it to the list! Thanks for tuning in brother!
I run 160 in the summers, 175-180 in winter. Here in the kenai peninsula. I've had a central boiler for 15 years and I guarantee if your on wood, without dual fuel on you will save wood. I agree it's not the healthiest for the circulation of water, i burn it out once a week and keep coals rolling I havent had any problems since i started. Completely flush the water system yearly and check the ph and nitrates, install a automatic fill float and let er eat.
Wood heat is deff the best way to heat in my opinion! Thanks for chatting!
Agreed.
I only turn it to 170-180 to help the machine from boiling over on warmer days.
hi there if you have problems with overheating put a dump zone on it . john
Hey Bill! I havent seen any issues on the warmer months but never ran this unit when it was over 60 out so dont know after that point! Either way 170-185 you are in the clear!
If you have a tight door gasket and a tight damper it won’t over heat but as we all
Know they can start to leak a bit. 170-180
Is normal for just about any stove in operation. 185 is fine but isn’t necessary. I would definitely keep it above 160. Most new stoves on the market like to run longer burn periods because it causes more efficiency. These stoves run 160-180
I have a Wood Master 4400 and in past years the temp has worked pretty good (except a few issues I had with the stove, door rope etc) but this year I fired it up and the fire was going great but it wasn't heating my house. I called my maint. guy and he said it was my water pump and had to put a new one on. Now it is not getting up to temp and the fan is running all the time. I plan to call him tomorrow but thought I would check on here first. Also I am seeing a green star (or fan icon) next to the temp and I don't know what that means. I don't remember seeing that in the past. Thank you!
I can’t speak for wood master boilers. Not sure how they operate in comparison to central boiler. I’d google search what the fan icon means. Could be a bad relay? The central boilers don’t have fans so I’m not sure. I’m assuming the fan runs when it’s calling for heat and shuts off when at temp so continuously running fan means something isn’t tripping
I disagree with this guy! Bad advice! Yes, a good operating temperature is between 175 -185 degree F. But do NOT keep the boiler hotter than this! If your boiler is able to produce temperatures over 200 degrees, you are likely to cause your pump to malfunction. Also, if your water runs low, and you run the furnace at high temps, you can melt wiring, PEX tubing and cause warping of your tanks (and possible leaks). Keep an eye on the temperatures and make sure it does not go higher than 185.
I never said go over 185 but thank you for the panic comment. Not needed. I never said over 185
Do you know anything on the combuster??? We are just starting it up for the season and the numbers are all funky and the combuster isn’t working????
I had a. Central boiler like that forn23 yrs we heated 2 houses with it and had the temp set at 160 saved lots of wood not trying to reach that extra 20 degrees ,also learned that the faster you move your water the better your stove works since your not having so much heat loss from your lines to the stove
Ive gotten comments like this before "I did this for years". I am just relaying info right from CB. Just like your car, it gets up to an operating range where thats "best" performance. Running low temps and drawing heat from the machine is not the best, you may not have any "issues" but its still not good practice. I talked with engineers and people right at CB and they recomment running it 170/175 to 180/185. Also many other manufactures run at the same temp across many brands so whats that saying too. Either way God bless ya for cranking out 23 years with one. Were on year 8 lol
Different subject but I have been meaning to ask you when are you going to bring out the old homelite on a firewood cutting video ?
You know whats funny... I just got new reeds for it and going to see if that fixes my issues ive had with it! I retired it after I couldnt get it to run straight so just got the package today and will see if I can get to it this week! Funny you asked I just got the new quad reed set today LOL
I have a older model it has a set temperature probe it 170> to 150> and I stack my wood as close to the door as possible from the floor to the top of the door.
Hey Hank! You are correct! Wood closer to the front is way better for max heat transfer!
How long is your winters? What is your square feet on home (let's say 4000)? How many cords would you need for winter season roughly? Fond du lac WI here, 5-6 months. Using a central boiler edge model.
Mines about 3200 square feet. I dont really calculate how many cords I use its tough to tell since I get a lot of free wood and dead wood from our land! Our winters are usually 5 months here in NH
I'm more interested in hearing about hot water storage vs direct fire like you have for wood savings, seems like people that have the 600gal insulated tanks (think of a battery) fair a bit better with consistent temps vs direct fire where the blower is kicking on and off, although with the storage there are more mechanical parts involved so things maybe be a bit more complicated or prone to break downs to.
Keeping 600 gal of water hot would cost a fortune no matter what way you go with it, plus the complications you mentioned with additional parts. My domestic hot water heater is 50 gallons, those are built specifically for efficiency for the same purpose of keeping water hot and aren't even kept as hot and that is 2/3 of my energy costs. I use radiant heat from my outdoor boiler which also heats my water for free in the winter plus wood is a renewable source and much cleaner than any of the alternatives that the climate mafia promotes when you learn about all of the factors involved and it's free and not owned or controlled by the globalists. The old simple ways are usually the best and are why they were used for thousands of years.
Hey Kenny! I cant speak for water storage as I have no knowledge of those systems but would be cool to see if it makes a difference in wood usage!
Hey Knight! Interesting points! I cant agree more with you about wood being FREEDOM!
@@HomesteadJay it’s minimal is wood savings. What it can do for you is give you a longer buffer period of when you have to fill the stove. Say you’re gone for 16 hours you can easily get that at below 0 temps this way but when you’re back at the stove you also need to heat that water back up. Garn stoves do it this way. They batch burn. It works and can be efficient if done correctly. But remember a btu does not change no matter what form it’s in.
It has been proven many times now that 140 degrees is the absolute minimum temperature you want your stove. Letting it fall to 160 before a refill isn’t going to hurt anything. That isn’t necessarily the return water but the water jacket temp. That being said, “delta” temp is what you call the difference in temp. The word you were looking for. That shouldn’t be much greater than 25 degrees also. That way you do not shock your water jacket. You should always be monitoring that. Get yourself a fire board so you can do that, graph your burn times and check everything from your phone while at work.
Sorry for the late reply! Thank you for tuning in! Hope you had a great holiday week!
I am new to this. I recently bought a house with an OWB that heats the house via radiant floor heating. The system was not maintained properly so i have been working on getting the bugs out. Its been a bit of a roller coaster. I know several people that use a central air handler and heat exchanger method but not the radiant floor method. 2800 square feet if concrete can suck the heat out quick. My water returns at 70 degrees to the tank regardless of what the supply temp is. Once the floor is satisfied, it may go all day without needing any heat. Also, if the supply temp is near 180 the temp in the house will overshoot the thermostat setting by 5 degrees or so. My system seems to work best at a lower hot water temp. I realize that will negatively impact my boiler life. Looking for any advise.
Hey there. You dont want return temps at 70 degrees to the boiler thats WAY to cold for the boiler. Im not sure how your system is built its hard to say "whats going on" via comment but you dont want that cold of a return temp. Drawing 110 degrees off a system is a MASSIVE heat draw im not sure where the draw is going even for a slab that large.
Hey jay do you or have you ever used “ashtroll mc”? If so what are your thoughts
It works just haven’t gotten any more of it lol
If you run any colder then 150° you will definitely cause condensation issues and will rot it from inside out. This is even for regular indoor gas or oil boilers.
Yes for sure! Hotter the better
I take pallets cut it in 1/3rds put I piece in as kindling.
Put big wood on top.
Air circulation under the pallet burns up moisture on the bottom. I never leave the door open with big flames in there. That will burn out your rear T pipe early.
Hey Bill! I dont usually leave the door open like that but for the sake of the video I thought it would be cool to see the fire grow on camera! Thanks for tuning in!
Any wood boilers that would heat home without electricity? Maybe a hybrid. Uses electricity, but can still use if grid goes out? I know you could get indoor models to supplement.
I wish they had some type of mechanical non electric but 400 gallons of a lot of water to circulate so that would be tough! A wood stove inside would be a good fail safe for sure!
I know our units are completely different beasts. But I run my boiler from about 110° - 210° in the winter time. But great point for your units!
Very cool! Looking forward to the collab!
Subscribed cause im buying a house with a boiler and want all the insight and the name! Lol
Well sit back and relax I have plenty of wood boiler videos for you enjoyment!
Big help!
Welcome!
How are you backup heating your stove when it goes out?
Oil furnance will kick on and backheat the heat exchanger and basically reverse the process. Instead of going from OWB to home its going home to OWB via heat exchanger! Any more questions just ask :)
I wonder if a wood boiler had a building around it, if it would keep the wind from cooling it off as fast, and therefore, be more efficient with the wood in the firebox? 🤔
I got building around mine does make a difference yes
I have wondered the same thing for a little while now. I haven’t found any solid evidence proving it does or doesn’t help. If the machine was out where wind could blow across a large field I would guess it could make a small difference. It also would depend on the insulation in the machine itself
This is a GREAT questions for sure. My theory on this would be is the building heated? If the building was heated ( assuming off the same wood boiler ) if you took out the percentage of wood needed to heat said building and compared to normal usage I would say it would use less wood BECAUSE these outdoor wood boiler are non pressure units and basically have an open vent at the top so the cold weather does play a roll in it so I would ASSUME in a heated insulated building ( minus the wood needed to heat the building ) I think you would use less wood cause the machine isnt subject to negative temps anymore it would be prob a cool 65 or whatever. This is a fantastic question! I am now curious!
@@HomesteadJay One thing that I wonder about , is if the boiler was heating a building that had wood stored in, would be the amount of moisture that would be driven out of the wood before being used in the boiler. Would it be cost effective to dry wood like this? If the building was a garage, it would be more easily justified in heating it.
I see what you mean. I honestly think ( educated guess here) the amount of "energy" aka wood needed to burn just to dry the wood faster wouldnt be cost effective. Why use wood to heat wood to dry when you can leave it out in the sun and dry naturally. I think if you heated a green house with wood in it with heat and proper venting that wood would dry incredibly fast but at what wood cost? I think If I did a insulated garage lets say around an OWB with the machine in the back corner I wouldn't store cords and cords in there. Prob bring in a few weeks at a time so it wouldnt be strickly for the boiler id want a nice working space of course LOL I think it would be cool to do!
Do you know anything about the combustor? We are just starting it up for the season and all the numbers are reading, funky and flashing and the combustor is not working. If you can print provide any help that would be greatly appreciated.
I do not know that model machine send me an email with more detail and see if I can help. Send info on machine. Model number. Etc. homesteadjay35@gmail.com
How do you hook up two separate loops to 2 different buildings. thanks
There are multiple ports on the side of the unit. You can run two loops ( 1 per building ) off this model. So there are 4 bung fittings. Obv you need 2 per loop so you can run two off this model.
Jay do you recommend a specific furnace?
I have only had this CB for 5 years. Its been heating this home before me since 2008 and have had no issues with it. Wood boilers are like anything, you can get 100,000 miles plus out of any ford chevy or dodge (maybe dodge) LOL it all depends how you take care of it. Id go with Central Boiler. Their dealer support is unreal, any questions they will go out of your way to help you. Thats what Id recommend! Now what actual unit you need depends on your heat need. Talk to a CB dealer they will guide you with what you need!
hi there BTUs are BTUs good show thanks john
Thanks for tuning in John!
That amount of wood you tossed into the beast is how much I would use two to three days in a RMH. I know one group that used an outdoor wood boiler beast and they told me they had to load an entire tree in it every night in NE Wisconsin. I was using two grocery bags of cut up pallet wood for a night in a RMH.
Mine isnt that bad for usage. Its not a tree a day like you mentioned. As technology progresses they get more and more efficient!
What brand/model is RMH?
@@stevethiel5838 DIY. I built a 20' dome a few years ago and heated it with a RMH. I grew veg in an aquaponics system for 28 months straight through two harsh Wisconsin winters. I have literally written a book about it, but I am having trouble finishing it.
When you say RMH what are you referring too?
@@HomesteadJay My design consisted of a 55 gallon barrel and another half of barrel stacked. A tall riser inside with a cinder block (paver) j - channel. I dug it into the ground because I didn't want any possibility of an out of control fire. This proved to be a mistake because the ground flooded and many nights I had biochar soup in my burn chamber. There were nights I had to light a fire on a floating log barge in order to heat my dome. I learned quickly how to rebuild a RMH because it was the only heat source during the night. During the day, the sun would keep the dome above 50 degree even on the coldest days. But, at night the RMH had to work or my 900 gallon aquaponics system would freeze. The first winter I rebuilt the RMH at least six times, each rebuild had to work by the following night. It was an incredible learning experience. It gave me a focused view at what those who came before us did to keep warm on cold winter nights. I could simply walk into the house, but they never had that modern failsafe. I managed to keep the dome warm and lost plants to cold.
How much wood do you burn through the winter in the winter in the boiler
No sure! Don’t really keep track
Jay I like your Chanel Please fix the Door.
Exactly I been asking for years lol
HAHAH That dang door!
My Wood Doctor Boiler is now 35 years old and still running. The newer boiler systems seem to have far thinner metal than the ones bulti in 95. Do you know anyone that refurbishes old boilers in the Upstate New York area?
No I dont but if you do let me know lol I want to run my classic as long as shell go. Theres no warranty on mine since I am second owner so if it fails id love to repair it! Let me know if you find someone!
I do. My primary business is excavating and grading. But I also have a welding shop. I am in Mayfield NY. I have built them from scratch. In all reality though, 9 times out of 10 when you get a leak the whole boiler is shot. Sometimes you get lucky and its just a stress crack in a corner. But if the leak is in the middle of the panel, most of the time when you slice it open to weld in a patch you will find most of the boiler has been reduced from 3/16", 1/4" to the thickness of the sheet metal your car is built with.
@@HomesteadJay I am in upstate NY. My primary business is excavating, but I also have a welding shop. I am located in Mayfield NY. I don't know how old that CB is you have there. The most common repairs on the older cb's are the door openings, and where the chimney passes through the water jacket. Another unique problem the older CB's had was the outer water jacket. They used open cell spray foam insulation instead of closed. The foam was directly applied to the bare steel water jacket. They didn't apply any coating first such as epoxy primer. If you didn't run the boiler year round the water jacket would sweat in the summer and the open cell insulation would become a wet sponge rotting the water jacket from the outside in. The dealers started getting complaints. I had a customers dealer located in Schaghticoke tell them you need to drain the boiler in the summer if your not running it. Who does that? That's a hard pill to swallow if your running antifreeze. Anyway that just started causing the inside of the water jackets and back side of the fire boxes to rot.
Interesting to hear. Ive heard of boilers rotting from outside in before for similar reasons. The door opening on mine will have to be repaired after this year as the door seal just barely makes a seal and you can see where the metal is fatiguing. Luckily thats outside the firebox so its only a matter of welding in a small section which I have a local guy for that but I was curious when I asked if people out there repaired them and what they noticed. Thanks for taking the time to let me know! It makes sense that once you have a leak generally its not worth it to patch as you are just chasing a continuing problem!
I have been running my central boiler cl 5036 temperature at 150/160 for 17 years no problems!!!
Hey Dave! They recommend 175-185 or 170-180 but hey its your machine lol. Interesting to hear though. Thanks for sharing!
Mine is set as it was delivered. I think 175 to 185. Works great for me. CL 5036. Love it.
@@HomesteadJay just make sure if your doing 180 that is stays at that , pex is not rated for over that consistently. i turned my heatmore down to 170 with 15 diff. its all stainless steel and the door is water jacket cooled/ 17 years old and still banging. it has saved me thousands on propane
I’ve been running my cb5036 at lower temperatures. I just feed as needed. I have a layer of thin creasote coating the inside n hopefully preserving it but ... The only moisture I notice is around the door n the bottom edge is a lil imperfect allowing moisture to leave. I see small ice cycles outside the door on very cold days. I don’t overload the furnace except for the coldest nights n have learned to reduce the amounts according to the need. I burn “ junk” wood at least 2/3 of the season n save the “ good stuff “ for when it’s needed. My 5036 “ is like a sore dock - u can’t beat it !! Paid for itself in 3 years n now it’s 13 yo best return ever no broker here n not needed. N I keep my temp down too til I need the heat. Central minn winters no problem here !! I chuckle all winter as I see all of the propane trucks delivering to my neighbors
What if I want my wood stove to burn out because of summer and want to use oil boiler to heat domestic water
Shut it down then for the summer. Clean out the ash. Test the water. Then shut her down if you’re not gonna use it during the summer.
This is my first winter in NW Wisconsin, im running ours at 195, dips to 185 and I have noticed it actually runs on less wood the hotter it is. I can load it to the top and make it about 14-16 hours on a full load. I add 1 to 2 logs in the 4-8inch range at between 10-11 am and refill for the night around 5-6pm. We have been in the mid to low teens this last few nights and we a heating about 2800 sq feet with a CB 5036.
Can I ask what brand of underground piping you chose with your setup ?
Hey Rick! Thats cool to hear for sure! Id love to see the actual "thermal" science behind all this! I wish I had more resources to really calculate wood usage vs. temp etc! Thanks for watching!
Van I have the standard insulated PEX recommended from CB
We have the standard insulated pex, our machine was built in 2008 and the previous took really good care of it and I plan to do the same.
Your vehicle reference is wrong, your vehicle is using more fuel when it's cold, that's how they got rid of chokes. You're vehicle is designed to run at a set temp. But I agree with your boiler advice. The hotter the better.
Hotter the better indeed!
What is the temperature of the exhaust coming out the chimney?
Not sure! I will do a experiment one day and find a way to measure!
Central boilers range from 500 and up to even 600-700 as most conventional do. Multipass units can get down to 4-500 and gasification stoves can be 2-300.
for some reason mine was at 193 .. the vent did not stick thinking it was not calling for heat .. and just cooked up if that is a word lol but I noticed when I checked last night sparks poping out and suspecting a wate leak inside fire box .. " ( and mine has antifreeze so not water treatment other than that not sure what could leak my guess is a weld not sure but only ran 3 or so fills so far so shold still be pretty clean .. figure I will have to address this but not sure how to go about it .. might have to see if warrenty is still good for fire box ???
Is there some thing that would leak and then stop .. I am guessing not as normally just blows it out the top .. had that when temp setting unit was bad once .. and lost my anti freeze " ( ,my best guess is a weld leak and depending on where .. it may still work .. but needs addressed my thought it is slightly over full on the water gauge as it was to hot .. and if the leak is near the top .. may stop leaking .. always some thing it seems LOL
I will get back to you when I’m on my
Computer. I have a few suggestions
I am hoping it was a false alarm as I did not lose any water? so it may have been moisture accumulated in the wood .. as for sure they build a very good product .. but you could understand my dismay .. when I saw a puddle of water and dripping water from the top into the fire making rather large sparks shoot out .. for sure share your thought on what to check .. but as long as I am not losing water .. think things are going to be ok " ) @@HomesteadJay
Hello again! As far as temp rising higher than 185 thats either a bad door seal OR non circulating water. Those are the only real cases of temps going above 185 is a door leak letting extra air in, a stuck damper ( which you said it wasnt) or a blown circulator pump. If the water isnt circulating it will climb higher than 185 since theres no "heat draw"
If you have moisture coming from the top of the firebox it COULD be moisture from the wood but you could have a pin hole leak. There is 400 gallons of water in there you wouldnt even notice if 25 gallons was missing at the sight glass so be careful as to not dismiss it. Best bet is to let the fire die down and see if you see any dripping then. Let your fire burn down and then check out the top of the firebox to see!
I run my 5036 at 165, the question I have is during the off season there is no heat so the condensation makes no sense to me, explain!
I wouldnt run your machine at 165. run it 175-185 like it calls for factory settings. In the offseason there is no cold weather to worry about. In the summer the machine is acclimated and temp doesn't change so there is no issues. Winter time you have heat draws, weather fluctuation, hot water going out and "colder" water coming in etc... so hotter the better. fights off condensation from all the prior stated factors involved. Hope this helps!
Thanks
Jay, when do you typically dig out ashes? I have like 1/3 of the boiler is ash but i don’t wanna get rid of the hot coals. Should I let the fire go out, empty it and start over leaving some coals??
Get some 1/8" expanded metal to "screen out" the coals and dump back into firebox. Works wonders !!
If you watch my last video or few videos ago I talked about ash clean out! "generally" the coals will sit on the ash so if you can comb the top layer of coals off and leave all the ash on the bottom then pull the ash out do that! I showed and went over it on that video. head to my page and check it out it will help more. You dont have to empty it, push the fire to the rear and pull ash out the front! It helps to let the fire be "small" but you dont have to let it fizzle to nothing!
@@HomesteadJay thx bro, you’re the most helpful you tube guy around
I try to help! I know how frustrating it is to find answers so I like to help! Anytime you need something just let me know. If I dont reply leave a new comment cause sometimes the replies get burried in notifications
Central Boiler is proactive sharing relative information related to extending boiler life.
Yes they are. Despite what people think they want their units to last.
My heatmaster wood furnace is full of smoke , woods inside cannot burn! water temperature dropped from 130 to 85, I dump the ash every 2 days, if there something I need clean ? Chimney or somewhere? Desperately now! My bedroom is only 12
I bought dried maple woods, not pine
I am not sure. wet wood? Just cause you bought wood doesnt mean its seasoned. split a round and check with moisture meter! Id check the chimney could be obstructed and not drafting properly!
@@HomesteadJay yep something is wrong
I’d b checking the draft n chimney. Sounds like she’s chokin. Also the pump. If u had a central boiler they’d know. Call the manufacturer. Maintenance helps
It is more wood efficient if you drop down the temperature for night time but it is less convenient because in the morning it will take few hours to get that furnace water up to temperature and your house up to temperature. Ideally if you could have the temperature increased about 2 hours before your wake up by a timer would be ideal. Otherwise you are waiting for few hours in a cold house.
This is false. You need to keep machine at 175-185 for the duration of running it. Dropping down the temp is bad for machine and more prone to condensation. Plus you are going to use MORE wood by heating up 400 gallons up to 180 during the day. Its like slowing down on the highway and then racing back up to speed versus maintaining cruise control.
@@HomesteadJay So it is important to have well insulated lines and an efficient boiler and the proper size of boiler for your house.
You are correct that these boilers life span will be longest and most efficient heating will take place when they operate constantly at their design temperature and to keep it this way for whole winter.
The temperature of the house should be allowed to drop down 10 degrees F during night time when people sleep for 9 hours it does not have to be 75F inside the house, 60F is plenty, the water does not have to circulate as much and boiler fan can turn on less frequently when you are over night keeping the house at medium temperature. It also makes your load of wood last longer. So true it is not good to vary the temperature in the boiler much but still your house should be ok to be cooler for night time when you are under blankets in your bed. This is the best way to save wood. I would keep it 75F during day and 60F during night time. Ideally have a timer thermostat so when you wake up the house is back to at least 70F.
@@HealthSupercharger I get the house change in temp that makese sense but the boiler water temp shouldnt change from 175-185 now if you turn your heat down or off it doesnt matter the boiler is going to keep the water at 175-185 no matter the heat draw. If you turn your heat down resulting in less heat demand from the boiler ALL that changes is how many times the machine cycles. The only thing I disagreed with you on is the physical lowering the temp of the unit for overnights. Leave it 175-185 and adjust the house like you say and the boiler will run "less" with less heat demand from the home.
Will the furnace heat your home without electricity?
No unfortunately it needs electricity to run the pumps and operate the draft door
The theory of heat transfer is. Heat travels to cold the greater the difference the faster it travels. Therefore by keeping boiler water cooler than the outside temperature there is less heat loss. Insulation can not stop this heat loss only slow it down. Water that is circulating through the heat emitters needs to be as low as possible and still satisfy your comfort. This water temperature needs to be controlled by an outdoor reset control. A four way mixing valve at the out let of the boiler will allow the boiler water temperature to be above the condensing temperature to protect the internals and cooler water sent through the under ground pipe will result in less btu being sent into the ground. A mixing valve also can help protect the boiler. The pump between the boiler and the mixing valve can be controlled by a triple aqua-stat shutting the pump off until fire brings boiler back up to a safe temperature. Water temperature circulating between mixing valve and through emitters that is at 90f rather then 180f can save 35% of the fuel. Hope this information helps boiler operations in or outdoor operation and no matter the fuel used.
Thanks for sharing! These models may be more primitive that your describing but these units do not mix with any other water in the system. The boiler is its own closed loop and the house heating water is its own loop as well. The heat exchange occurs at a heat exchanger. Hope this info helps. I get your principles you explained but these are a tad different from what you were explaining.
The system I was describing applies to all boilers, the four way mixing valve uses the same water , it does require another pump to bring water from boiler to mixing valve where the return water from rads is mixed with the hot water from boiler to bring the temperature of the supply water back up to temperature set by the outdoor control unit, I use a Teckmar control.
The result of using a mixing valve is the boiler water can be at 180f while the mixed water ,boiler plus return water can be at a lower temperature. The extra material required is , a four way mixing valve, a triple boiler aqua stat , another pump usually called a primary pump, an outdoor reset control which supplies the control with the out door air temperature which then sets a target temperatures for the supply water to rads,three thermistors to monitor return ,boiler ,and supply water temperatures.The Tekmar control uses an adjustable heating curve to find the best supply water temperature to heat the home at any out door air temperature. Once the heating curve is selected it automatically adjust the supply temperature based on the outside air temperature.This set up will use the least amount of fuel, protect boiler from internal condensation
@@lionelscott5839 Thank you for the feedback! I have a good understanding of what you were getting at so thanks for sharing some insight!
Supply water at 90F is going to be WAY below the BTU ratings of your emitters. So you'd need much bigger radiators or what have you then you'd otherwise need. Also, the flow rates needed to deliver the BTUs necessary will be much higher, meaning higher pressure losses, higher energy costs and maintenance on your pumps. And frankly, a 90F shower is a borderline cold shower.
How long have you been burning wood
Long time now!
How much do they run now?
Jeez idk deff 10-12k id say! But dont quote me
I couldn't handle that much smoke coming out the door when loading
Its a known issue!
Need a chimney flue fan
Please educate yourself on standby heatloss. Hotter does not burn less wood
Also love to know how your stove “low” point is 130°
All the Central boilers I have ever seen can only be set to 150
They also all have a preset differential of 10 degrees
150-10 equals 140
Some can be set to 195 and some loop from 195 to 150 if keep pushing the up button
Furthermore the safe low temperature varies by so many factors your head would explode
Also, have never seen the return temperature affect stove
I have run two houses and one apartment all on 1 1” line with no problems. All had limits on thermostats at 72 and they stayed there
I would not be so critical if you weren’t multiplying false information
Dale,
I understand very well a lot of information on heat loss and thermo dynamics actually. You seem to be the only one who got "false information" from this video. My premise was run to the machine at 175-185 OR 170-180 as this is the best overall for every situation. I never said hotter burns less wood what I meant was ( I went back and rewatched the video again) You will use MORE wood to get your boiler BACK UP to tempertature when it burns out lets say down to 130-150 or whatever the "bottom out" temp is. My outdoor wood boiler doesnt set down to 130, my oil kicks on when it senses 130 degree water if we had a total fire loss. I never said I had the machine low set at 130... There is nowhere in my video that gave any false information so correct me if I am wrong but I think you misinterpreted what I meant by those few things I corrected earlier in this comment.
@@HomesteadJay As you said, there certainly are benefits to having the water hot as it goes, but saving wood wouldn't be one of them. And that's also what I heard from your comments at the beginning.
Hotter water means more heat loss from the boiler itself and more heat loss in your piping. That's just a fact of thermodynamics. Now of course if your boiler is already hot it's going to take less wood to keep it hot than if you have to raise the boiler temp 30-40 degrees. But you have to keep it hot in the first place, plus make up for the higher losses in the meantime. There's no free lunch or perpetual motion machines here. Now combustion efficiency and flow rates needed for a certain BTU output are another matter...
The best addition to help out with any outdoor wood furnace is to have an indoor wood stove just to keep the need for having to heat the air in your home in the first place at a minimum. The best solution as always is to build a basement to get your water up to room temperature as well. Great comment about the problem with algae etc tho. Yet again another reason to build down before building up imo.
Yeah I would love a wood stove in the house in the grand room which is centered with tall ceiling so I think it would transfer heat upstairs and also the ground floor! It would be nice to have the ambiance of wood heat! That I do miss but theres pros and cons to anything!
not in my experience i used to heat with wood stove insert and gas furnace i have 24 ft ceilings in a log home. i put n outdoor boiler in 2005 a heatmor and now heat 3000 ft 2 story much more efficient and cheaper than the gas furnace insert combo. hands down the best way is to do it is through your heat ducts. on sunday i run the gas furnace just to keep it in working order and to dry any moisture from heat exchanger. i still do the insert from time to time like today in NC i am getting sleet. i run my heatmor from 150 to 165 and it has been flawless. i have a coil in the upstairs heat pump system and the downstairs system and they can run by themselves or together. no way an insert is as good as a duct system. each room is about the same temp. you just cant do this with a stove in one part of the home unless its a small home
@@HomesteadJay how big is your home? my insert is at one end and i have a log home 2 story. it will not heat the other side like a boiler will using ducts. i been doing this since 95 and finally got the boiler. never looked back, still do the fireplace now and again cause wife like the ambiance but the boiler is so much easier, cleaner and efficient. i run mine at 150 to 165 or 170 here in nc
If you want to save on wood consumption, buy a gasification unit. I replaced my old woodmaster 4400 with a new 560 classic edge this year. Been running for a little over a month and just burnt my first face cord last night. My dealer recommended I set my temp to 185° with a spread of 13°, so it kicks on at 172°. Though these units are waaaaaay different. It’ll pulse air in the firebox between cycles to “save the coal bed” which tends to keep your water temp from dropping near as fast. Looking at the Firestar controller, my unit only runs a full cycle around 4-5 times on a 12 hour load. It was only in the 40’s last night, but it only ran a full cycle one time. They get a lot of hate on the forums, and it hindered my decision for a long time. Now that I own one, I wish I made the switch years ago when I first started looking at them. Once you understand the difference in using one over a traditional, it’s sooooo nice. Everybody needs one!
Thank you for your feedback my only question is how does it do for pine? I burn a lot of pine and can’t justify giving it up. I’ve heard that those units don’t like softwood and 50% of my land is soft wood so I can’t pass up that opportunity
@@HomesteadJay I don’t have any pine in my stack this year. I had a lot of ash given to me, so I’m running it. I will say I watched a CB video of a dealer out west and he said they burn a lot of soft wood; spruce, pine, birch, because that’s all they have. The upper chambers of these gassers are kresote making monsters, that’s just the nature of the beast. They don’t burn a real hot fire in the fire box to make heat. Just kind of a lazy fire to make smoke to burn in the reaction chamber for heat. As long as you’re not getting kresote in your lower reaction chamber, you’re golden pony boy. I’ll look for that video and post the link in this thread if I can find it. It’s more of a sales pitch I think, but it might be worth the watch.
@@HomesteadJay czcams.com/video/jmuIvMyWFSg/video.html the talk about wood species starts at 4:50
Thank you I will check it out! I just dont want to loose out on ability to burn softwoods
I just traded my cb for a woodmaster 500 love this thing
How long have you had your out boiler
It was installed in 2008 and we moved in in 2015
Next year will be 9 years
Thomas Butler my new friend cause of his comment I even gave him ideas how to do it , like I say to my kids like beating a dead horse hahaaaaaa
HAHAHA I saw that LOL
Got a hicks water stove….burns wood and coal…had it since 07….absolutely no problems whatsoever….that thing will burn anything you throw in it…
Heck yes! I love the classic beast style boilers lol
With the door open, why is there so much smoke rolling out? And, why is the door full of incomplete black char?
Thats just how they work, they solved that problem in the newer models. The door has buildup on it since its a wood boiler and we burn wood close to the door theres just transfer!
@@HomesteadJay When dark colored char appears, the burn chamber is inefficient and the burn is incomplete. Measure the temperature of the exhaust. My Rocket Mass Heater barrel would get very hot over 500 degrees, but the exhaust was around 100 or below. Most all the heat generated was transferred inside the dome with very little escaping.
@@rjaquaponics9266 These units do not have a burn chamber or lower burn chamber. The new ones do. As I said these units are basically bonfires inside a box with water around it. I will measure though and see as I am curious
@@HomesteadJay Yes, that would be great to know how much energy is merely heating the sky. I've heard those wood boilers are efficient, but I've never been able to get a simple answer for how much heat is escaping and how can they come up with any efficiency stats when most heat escapes. I guess it's smoke in mirrors advertising or something.
Not sure but the new style ones a gasification so they "re burn" the hot gasses. Like a cat converter on a car if you will. So they maximize the wood heat generated as its not so much the fire heating the water any more its the hot gasses... very cool stuff! That technology didnt exist when these classics came out so they are less efficient comparing to the new stuff. Its like anything. Compare a car from the 60's to now hahah light year difference on emissions!
??? This does not make any sense to me. I have a Wood Master 4400 and I've been using for the past 15+ years and frequently let the temperature drop to below 175 degrees F (after late spring through autumn). My unit works perfectly. I do use an additive in the water to prevent rust. In the winter, I keep the burner going 24/7 and it stays at around 195 degrees F.
The purpose of this video is an extreme heat draw with the temp of the boiler set to 140 or lower. You want what you doing, run it hot consistently. Its people who think running the boiler at 140* over 185* is some miracle wood saving trick but its not. The hotter the better to fight condensation. Not sure where the confusion is but you seem like your doing fine. The occasionaly "burn down" here and there is fine but im talking consistent daily running at low temps is bad.
Put a good dip in!!!!
good chaaaaaw dude
175-185 standard central boiler factory setting the guy in comments doing 195 that’s too hot to close to getting to boil and you will lose water
Hot stuff indeed! Had a few boil overs in my early years lol
@@HomesteadJay also over the heat index for PEX pipe
Can you just fill it as full as you can get it so you don't have to fill so often
It burns more wood that way.
@@HomesteadJay what %more
idk but deff more@@defender6657
Actually a car burns more fuel when cold (gasoline) that is.
Thats kind of the point! Hot machine runs better just like a car
The efficiency of that system is appalling.
My heating will use about 100 kWh per day in a 3600 sq ft home in cold weather.
At about 5.1Kw per kilo of fuel you should be using about 22kg a day (80% efficiency on burn) 48lbs.
I can see by the creosote build up the burn temperature is way to low as well, when wood burns properly the residue should only be white ash.
If you had a gasification boiler the efficiency would be over 90%.
Hello andrew, Im not sure how you can make that assumption I never even showed or explained what I was heating the unit with so how can you say its not efficient? Obv a gasification wood boiler is more efficient. Show me where I said mine was better or more efficient? It is easy to compare mine to a new one. Mine was built in 2008...
what kind of boiler do you have and what was the cost . thnks
We had a 2009 Central Boiler 6048. The only thing it did well, was burn lots and lots of wood. These are 50% efficient on a good day. They talk about this thing called a heat lock baffle on this stove. Ya right, you can't put your hand on the insulated chimney when stove is running from all the heat being lost. My neighbor had a C.B. rust thru between the spray foam insulation and outside of water jacket. The sprayed on foam trapped in moisture. Good luck with this stove, and plan on burning lots of wood.
Hey Angie. First things first. I did buy this unit, it was here when we moved in. In 2008 this was the best you could get the gasification units were not a thing. Its real easy to compare this to something brand new in 2021 after 13 years of r&d with gasification technology. I love this machine and I will use it as long as it lasts because im saving money and saving for a new technology stove. Thanks for tuning in.
I disagree. My 5036 does not consume lots of wood and has a great burn time. Typically I can go 12 hours plus.
@@kilowatt02 Ive tried telling people this but you can lead a horse to water but cant make it drink. Glad you have had good luck with yours as I have with mine
you got a bad unit them or a dummy intalled it wrong. even a fireplace is better than 50% . you just dont know what your speaking about. i dont have a cb i have a heatmor and it is great. way better than propane or fuel oil for heat
More than likely your water pumps were to small and wasn't circulating your water fast enough and losing too much heat from your lines
Temp 175-190
Yes! Hotter the better!
I disagree, ive worked in the power industry for 35 years , on fossil plants and nuclear plants working with commercial boilers ,ok .The principle is the same when metal fatigue applies, its called "nucleate boiling" .Over a long period of time , it depletes the molecular structure of your metal. The water is not actually boiling but where the hot spots are in your boiler you have small bubbles forming on your metal. If you don't believe me put a pot of water on the stove,when those little bubbles start forming it creates hot spots ,this is happening over and over for years .My outdoor boiler is 20 years old and still no issues, i keep it at 135 f .
Thanks for watching!
My dealer told me that a thin layer of creasote protects the inside. But do keep the bottom 4-6” free of the buildup. I’m guilty of trying lower water temp will admit that the more wood u put in the more wood that will burn up. I can see the temp from inside my house so I monitor it n over the years I’ve learned how much to put in as then easier to clean it out cause coals r down. Key for me is that I keep a good amount of kindling which is all it takes to get r going from the leftover coals. Don’t burn as much wood currently because of the global warming n more sun. I really only get anal when it gets -20+ below then I alter my method. Question for you is ur opinion on throwing in a few aluminum cans periodically for creasote removal ??
Hey Scott. Never tried the cans before but many have said something about that lol. You have to be careful with the creosote in the off season as it can hold moisture! Ive seen some boiler photos of people leaving creosote buildup in their machines and when they scraped it off there was rust under! Thanks for tuning in!
I Run my wood boiler at 200°F
Yikes ive never run that that high
I left the door open on my bosses and it started boiling on top???
The door is what regulates the temp. I wouldnt make that mistake again. There is a damper on the door which lets air in so it opens and closes due to heat demand. If you leave door open for too long the fire will roar and road and roar
I get the point of burning wood is cheaper than oil. When your power goes out that boiler is useless tho so if you do not have electricity that is a big paper weight, unless you had a generator…… that never made sense to me you really think you’re doing something but without power it’s useless
Its called solar power, although not everyone has it.
Yes thats a con of a OWB is it needs power. I could not heat my whole home with a single wood stove but there are so many pros ands cons! I will address this is a future video!
@@HomesteadJay thanks for the response man I love your videos and you’re always so upbeat looking forward to your reply video on the subject !!!
@@joeromano5484 Yes sir! I will work on it!
In fall and spring I turn mine down to 110, don’t listen to this guy.
Thanks for watching :)