Jordan Peterson - Controversial Facts about IQ
Vložit
- čas přidán 27. 08. 2024
- original source: • 2017 Personality 18: B...
Psychology Professor Dr. Jordan B. Peterson lays down facts about intelligence that shouldn't be controversial. How do we define intelligence and how do we account for different types of categories?
Dr. Peterson's new book is available for pre-order:
12 Rules for Life: An Antidote to Chaos: amzn.to/2yvJf9L
If you want to support Dr. Peterson, here is his Patreon:
/ jordanbpeterson
Check out Jordan Peterson's Self Authoring Program, a powerful tool to sort yourself out:
bit.ly/selfAuth (Official affiliate link for Bite-sized Philosophy)
"You're going to have a child, do you want the child to have an IQ of 145 or 65?" If intelligence didn't matter you wouldn't care, but the fact is, nobody is going to wish a child to have 65. That's the crux of the matter. I think given that question, everyone will agree, it is an important distinction.
People love to spout platitudes and virtue signal, but when things get personal reality bites hard.
Look up the Polgar family.
You’ll understand why the concept of intelligence is ultimately stupid. When talking about intelligence, where talking about what we see as the principle of talent, which the Polgar absolutely slaughtered.
People are more competent then others, no shit. Yet do we know if that’s because of their parents, teachers, adversities, sufferings, friends or coincidences.
I have no clue.
But ultimately, intelligence doesn’t mean anything as a whole, because the one who claims intelligence has certain criterias
The example of 65 vs 120 is ludicrous, because a prescribed IQ of 65 is, no doubt, cognitive disabilities, yet a prescribed IQ of 130+ is a membership to an organization (MENSA). One being something you don’t wish to anyone and the other which is only positive.
That’s persuasive rhetoric though. That’s like saying “If strength in a man is not important to you, then you should be happy with a crippled man in a wheelchair.”
The person is essentially saying that they don’t mind a man who is weaker than average, perhaps to a fair degree. To choose someone who is functionally disabled is a horse of another color.
Watch out for quotes that resonate deeply. They’re usually persuasive arguments and/or rhetoric, and in many, many cases, they represent logically flawed thinking.
11 11 You need to cite sources. Don’t forget, we’re talking psychology, here. It is an incredibly in-precise soft science. Assessing psychology and sociological studies for validity is absolutely essential. Some of the most poorly conducted studies I have seen come from these fields.
As for your suggestion, I seriously doubt this “hypothesis” has been properly tested. For one thing, you would have to control for differences of race and class - two majorly correlative factors in listening to rap music, and two (most likely) critical aspects in determining IQ.
Even then, your results would be a poor suggestion of real science. What about controlling for city-living verses rural-living? The mother’s age when she gave birth? Rap culture in different parts of the country or on different continents? There are so many factors that could skew the data that developing a proper sample is highly impractical.
That doesn’t mean that studies shouldn’t be conducted. However, any scientist would understand that the results from the studies are mere correlation, and they mean very little.
Judging by your statements regarding cultural sentiment, I can make a rough assumption that what you would like to say here is that there is a decent probability that people who listen to rap music are stupid, but we just aren’t allowed to say it.
That is the kind of untrained arrogance that leads to scientific studies being abused and misrepresented in the media. I hope, if you are working within this frame of mind, your education helps to raise you to a more unbiased, higher standard of analytical reasoning. Please don’t take that as offensive or patronizing, though. First off, I could have completely misunderstood your bias, and secondly, everyone is at a different point along their intellectual attainment, and it seems that you do very much value science, which I find to be a respectable attribute.
@11 11 what metric are you using to measure intelligence? IQ? Level of previously acquired knowledge? Academic performance?
"What good is your ruler if it stretches when you use it?".....I .think that defines alot of mentality today....when the ruler doesn't say what ppl want to hear ppl stretch the ruler
I feel like a more relevant version of this would focus on an example with a scale since there are a lot of overweight people today. Who tries to stretch a ruler vs how many people don't want to believe their scale
This. I'm surprised that if average IQ at UofT is 120 and yet still we have triggered individuals who don't believe in facts and stats and will operate on emotions.
@@stellaofthelake3451 IQ simply allows you to learn quicker and analyze complex information. If your taught the wrong things and taught to analyze from a particular point of view high IQ allows them to learn that method quicker. The hope is these high IQ kids will experience enough of the world by the time their 30 or 40 to see a real picture of the world
@@troystreacker8829 that is true I see that the left has done a great job with indoctrination.
@Sweet Maxine found the fatty
0:32 when you bite a very hot potato and you don't want to spit it out
NICE
Oh man,I laughed so hard at this. Thank you
Tomáš Hauser oh my god yeah that’s perfect! I’ve noticed super smart people often have some strange verbal or physical tics. A friend I had growing up would always rub one eye while contorting his other hand in front of his face. And when talks went confrontational he’d talk in this goofy kid voice and flail his wrists. Now he’s a double masters degree technician who works on satellite software lol
😂😂😭😭😵😵💀💀⚰️⚰️👻👻
Hehe
The reason why I really like Jordan Peterson is the fact that he seemingly has no hidden agenda, therefore I know that he wouldn't teach anything he himself didn't believe in. I can't recall a single time he's been caught in a lie.
That's really very rare in a person, and it brings a lot of trust.
Sk8erGoat oh good grief 😂😂😂
What a ridiculously cold take this is, haha.
Bro please watch any video that criticizes Peterson. He’s FAR from someone with “no hidden agenda”.
@@jase37 oh fuck off
Ye shall know the Truth, the Truth will set ye free...
"-Obviously, If you have any sense" ought to be his catchphrase.
He tales up the question from the student and elaborates on it. That is Real teaching.
So you’re saying women don’t have any sense?
Make your bed took that spot
"It's like, yea, good luck with that, bucko."
That for sure!
11:22 "Well that's basically how you end up with IQ"
drops mic, sips coffee, stares down students
James Kincaid he didn't
@@anondoggo oh no he di-int
Sometimes it seems like I have 120 IQ, and other times it seems like I have 80 IQ
Yeah IQ pretty trivially correlates with success if they are both measured without like at least 5 year gap
that means you have 100...easy
That means you should add them together and your real IQ is 200.
I think in this case you multiply them together to get a 9,600 IQ. Congratulations.
I have an overall score of 122 as of a few days ago, but for computational speed I got a 79, you might just have that kind of situation. I mean, these things can be improved, too.
What I love about this guy is the clarity with which he can discuss very complex ideas.
He knows next to nothing about most of the things he talks about.
@@gertstronkhorst2343 then why do people lisen to him?
@@modestassleinius9088 Have you considered the possibility that people can be less intelligent? People listened to Jim Jones. In itself, having people listen to you says nothing about the validity of what you're saying.
@@gertstronkhorst2343 Smart guy on comments always knows everything.
@@rlrihards948 No, I don't pretend to know everything. He does. And he knows very little. Btw, what a useless comment!
Jordan Peterson is probably one few psychologists who understands the importance of statistics
but is also aware enough to know that ALL statistics matter, and doesn't just pick and choose the few statistics like an ideaologue.
Funny you say that, as most of what peterson communicates is from his own intuition instead of evidence or statistical data, I mean he knows these information, but he infers from them from his own reasoning, which basically muddles the data, it's like making an experiment based on another experiment, except it's in your head and not empirical.
reiwell del psychology in general is mostly theory. Some of it is based on observation, some of it is not. Psychologist do perform experiments but they are not properly done since most psychologists do not understand how to properly use statistics. Although Jordan Peterson is one of the few who understand statistics, but a lot of what he lectures is based on observation
I don't think you'd officially be a psychologist if you couldn't decipher statistics to conclude an study, seems a bit absurd.. But hey I'm certainly not a psychologist. I think the general public neglecting statistics / very rarely psychologists taking a very broad spectrum of factors in a study/debate would make more sense?
Correlation does not equal causation. That's what psycologist understand. It's why they don't go around blabbing at the mouth, misrepresenting statistics. They wait until they have all the facts. I assume a simplistic thinking ( jump to conclusion) dumbass like your self doesn't do that.
Discovering Jordan Peterson's lectures has been the best thing that has happened to me in years.
Same
Has Peterson ever talked about the Flynn Effect: Crystalized IQ increases by 8 points every generation in almost all countries. This is almost certainly an environmental effect because evolution doesn't happen in such short time scale. Shouldn't Peterson focus more on policies that provide equal opportunity to all people so we can better those environmental effects?
@@bohanxu6125 Well said.
Your life must be sad lol
@louis Those are both certainly better than a lot of JP's content!
Imagine having every professor as passionate as JP.
This world would be much smarter.
It seems that IQ is largely genetic...so...maybe.
They would be much more educated. Intelligence and education are mutually exclusive. Although I personally believe anyone can truly be as intelligent as they want, if they put their mind to it. That’s just my personal opinion, though. For myself, I’d rather not be put in a box that some other person created.
A world of very frustrated professors would be the result.
In a world of mostly deaf people there's hardly any need for microphones and speakers
There are many passionate professors out there. The problem is many of them are crazy ideologist whom are busy to indoctrinate little kids.
the Chad IQ:
uses factor analysis and other stochastical methods to get to the truth
vs
the Virgin Multiple Intelligences:
uses anecdotes to make people feel better about themselves
imma make the meme out of it lmao
Not directed at you (obviously a joke) but to some other people I see on the internet. I wonder what is the correlation between the level of unsolicited self-declared "alpha chads" with IQ.
@@caiheang Real question would be whether IQ is correlated to original jokes. Even then, better question would be if IQ is correlated with creativity, which it isn't, according to this lecture. So you can be smart and make chad jokes.
The multiple intelligence model applys better on neurodiverse individuals. People with ASD have inconsistent intelligent scores and don't have a specific G like neurotypicals.
IQ has been equated to socioeconomic function through rampant factor analysis. In its current form it’s the best predictive measure of academic performance and GDP contribution, which is what it’s been tuned to, meaning the same neuroatypicalities that affect social or economic functioning disproportionately affect IQ scoring. That’s not the “truth” of intelligence, that people people with emotional or developmental barriers to engagement have less cognitive potential (in fact, very intelligent people have a higher prevalence of mental disorder). It’s just the economic reality. IQ now is basically a measure of how good you are at playing that game, and has come to ignore other facets of intelligence in favor of this predictability. I think most historical geniuses would test lower on the modern scale than a CEO, due to their social/attentive deficits and the irrelevance of most of their cognitive strengths to education.
Cathy Newman: "So what you're saying is IQ is real and we need the toss out the baby with the bathwater''
"I'd like our views to know why you hate babies so much." So much cringe in that interview.
died of laughing ..rofl
This is so fucking hilarious! HAHAHAHA
Only keep the ones smart enough to crawl out before you pitch it.
Eliminate the least intelligent babies, and breed smart children
This clip ended up longer than I wanted, but this just speaks for the quality and density of the lecture. If you are interested in this topic and have 2 hours of spare time I highly recommend clicking the link in the description and watching the full lecture on Dr. Peterson's channel!
Bite-sized Philosophy Thanks for posting all of these. It's nice to get a quick overview of something so you can decide which things you want to pursue further.
The full lecture was great and anybody who enjoyed this short clip should watch it
Thanks mate!
Long clips > Short clips
EDIT: This comment would make more sense if your channel weren't called "Bite-sized Philosophy". DERP!
Bite-sized Philosophy its 1 AM and I've got a chemistry final tomorrow but this is interesting af, let's see that two hour lecture!
I love hearing someone talk about intelligence when they have a great deal of it.
@书中自有黄金屋 Jordan Peterson is definitely well above average in intellect. This is borderline objective. Sure simpletons will find him more intelligent than he actually is but he’s definitely smart.
Man, this Prof. is addictive.
I've known lots of smart people that have been broken by life and ended up not doing to good in it. IQ can be applied in social statistics, but not individually because it negates one's complexity.
You never apply statistical findings to individuals. IQ isn't special.
Your Internet Friend of course you can. Many drugs work on only on 80%of people, but that’s enough possibility for you to risk trying. A workout plan that works for 80% of people is enough for you to take a 12-week shot. We apply statistics all the time on our personal life on almost everything we do. So is IQ, a low score on IQ is probably enough to persuade you to learn a practical talent in order to have a sustainable job in the future.
@@jiadizhang4107
What you are doing is isn't applying statistical findings on an individual. Saying that this drug works for you with an 80% probability is the same as saying that the drug only works on 80% of all people.
Your Internet Friend saying a drug has 80% of chance to work on an individual is the same as the drug works for 80% of the people before the person tries and drug and the person’s group identity is a part of the statistical population. What is your definition of applying statistics to an individual then? If you find out a person has only an IQ of 80, you pretty much know that you should suggest him to learn and skill in order to make a living and that he is probably not up to high standard academics. You can keep you faith in him and give him another trial by sending him to college, but an IQ of 80 certainty says a lot of the person, and most of the evidence that you shouldn’t be too hard on a 80 IQ person are generated for statistics. If you say statistics cannot be applied to individuals you are saying that we should abandon all studies that are done on groups when it comes to individual treatments.
@@jiadizhang4107
OP gave an example of applying statistics to individuals.
If a "fact" is controversial to you, something is wrong with your world view.
Jordan Peterson proposes aren't facts, he tries to ease the fact that whites and asians are more intelligent than blacks.
Gabo LongQua Whites and Asians on average are more intelligent. That is a fact.
A fact is -- in fact -- illusory. There are not really such things as facts. There are only very, very, very succesful models and theories. New evidence could come out tomorrow which might disprove our present understanding about gravity and the whole scientific community would have to rethink what they thought about the 'fact' of the Theory of Gravitation.
I think it would be better to say that if something with enormous evidence, rigourous empirical measurement and high predictability power is controversial to you... something is wrong with your worldview.
There's a reason it's illegal to judge job applicants based on IQ. A deterministic view on IQ has been shown throughout history to be problematic.
michaelq Yeah... and we call those things "facts" instead of breaking our tongue during every other sentence.
He is much better like this than his usual debate approach. He gets bogged down in terms and philosophical stuff. Here he is quick and concise. A very smart guy.
his debate partner usually lower the quality of his approach.
instead of deeper understanding in one subject,
his debate opponents keep jumping around multiple different subjects, making JP explanation seems shallow
He also had those sweet benzos back then
-"Where do you land on the dumbness scale?"
-"Yes."
-"Okay, that's all I need to know."
No.
@@dinviesel2866 Maybe?
Indubitably my IQ point on the distribution of the bell curve ranges from .96 to 1.16 standard deviations left shifted from the top of the bell curve given various conditions of sleep, current state of body chemistry and whether I'm watching a Jordan Peterson video at the time 😜 in which case I am of course always right shifted and almost flatlining 🙄
Same
Trust me I am low IQ genetic piece of shit, and its fucking hard.
Too bad I didn't blew my head with a double barrel sawed off
Added English subtitles, and now Romanian as well.
Hungarian is next.
This bite-sized introduction is damn important.
Funny that so many people are butthurt about this. He isn't discounting anything, he's making distinctions and removing a redundant correlation. Watch the video and consider the facts before you cry about having your special branch of 'intelligence' taken away
Robert Poll ayyyy we have almost the same political spectrum
@@j.r.h.6698 Where is your data on that claim?
I have a IQ around the room temperature of a mid winter central California room with the window open.
I’m not sure, but it sounds like he is calling me stupid.
Celsius?
Lmfaooo
@@danielgao4590 if he's using Celsius that would be around 20. But i doubt someone with 20 IQ would be using the Celsius scale. He could be using fahrenheit making hes IQ around 70, quite normal for people with below average IQ to use fahrenheit. Or he could be using Kelvin making hes IQ around 295. Very normal for someone insanely smart to just naturally use the Kelvin scale.
Meaning he would either have the IQ of a rat or be godly smart.
Fakhri Asyraf I was just making a joke😂 probably not a very good one...Take it easy dude
@@danielgao4590i know.. i was building on your joke lol
I'd love to take a pyschology classs from this guy, he seems like someone who could actually maintain my attenttion even with ADD.
ADHD right here. Hope you’re still young, one powerful thing I’ve found is age. 23 right now and finally able to delay gratification. I’m in the clear and able to make decisions, moving towards my goal of becoming a psychologist. I hope you can to. For me it’s connected to my existence, understanding myself, better helping those I care about and a platform to help more. I can’t die without this information or opportunity to do so. I don’t know what it means for you but I wish you the best.
@@sylan4094 Do you know if there is a correlation between ADD or ADHD and an inability to delay gratification?
@@sylan4094 how’s everything going with the psychologist field?
I’d hate to take his psychology classes … he is so brilliant that he’d rip my papers apart and I’d likely get lower grades than I am accustomed to …
Well considering his lectures are essentially the speech version of ADD, it's a perfect fit. I love watching his college material
"Intelligence is the ability to take in information from the world and to find patterns in that information that allow you to organize your perceptions and understand the external world."
*Brian Greene*
But it is not. IQ is the ability to score well on a given test created by PhD and Masters assistants to judge 'mental plasticity' and pattern recognition. The largest single predictor of a high score on an IQ test is an advanced grasp of the English language. Someone who does not have a very advanced grasp of written English will consistently underperform even if they have knowledge of multiple languages and in an academic setting have shown to advance more quickly and develop comprehension faster than peers who simply have a more advanced grasp of English. Sad but true fact of measurements...the biggest part of this video is the opening when Dr Peterson discusses how you MUST accept current IQ testing methodologies or you must discount all of psychoanalysis. That is a very telling statement for a concept that has long been known to be very unreliable at best.
Fortus Victus he’s talking about intelligence not IQ; but otherwise, I think you are confusing perhaps the correlation of the English language with IQ with actual causation. Knowing English does not raise IQ far more than any other language
@@dogie9548 I did not pull that from the back pocket. English is not the commonality, just the native language of the test in this case. A multi-cultural study throughout Europe, Asia, and North and South America showed that the SINGLE largest predictor of a high score on IQ testing was proficiency with the native language of the test as self reported. This was corroborated by having multi-lingual students take the battery in both their native language and English as the control. Test found that if a subject did not have at least a collegiate reading level in the test language their performance was effectively capped. The reasons why were not established to my knowledge but common assumptions are on the nature of how the tests themselves were devised (by PhD/Masters level review). This also correlates with some previous (somewhat controversial) studies that attempted to link lower mean IQ scores of minority populations in the USA, Africa, and South America. If the tests were in fact biased towards language proficiency it would go a long way to accounting for those study results as those results have no corroboration at all about certain racial or ethnic populations actually having lower IQs.
@@fortusvictus8297 astounding display of knowledge, kudos for knowing all of these! I want to know if i understood you properly, so:
-the main takeaway is that we need to control for language skills?
And 2 questions:
IQ == intelligence or IQ =/= intelligence ?
Have you considered that *what helps you score higher* on IQ tests also *helps you have a better understanding* of a language?
Thank you for your time!
Fortus Victus
These IQ tests you talk about, are these the old ones that were made to basically label non-white people as stupid or the more valid new ones?
The IQ test I took was just pure pattern recognition, there wasn’t even any words!
I'm 25 and grew up in an extremely dysfunctional family and suffered through many physical ailments but always had a good mind going for me. My upbringing is partly why I always had really low consciencounes, an extremely lazy person who missed class 2 or 3 days a week but still got As and Bs. Funny thing is out of sheer boredom I read and listened to many podcasts and eventually became conscientious after formulating a logical and ambitious outlook on life. In other words their is some anictodal evidence that high IQ can eventually override low consciousnes.
Either that or you gained better mastery over your emotions allow increased access to IQ
hmm I seem to be similar to that. I scored an IQ of 130 and scored 0th percentile in industriousness in a personality test. My family was pretty damn dysfunctional (though I wouldn't say 'extremely', we weren't physically fighting all the time). They sent me to boarding school in a different continent when I was 15 to get rid of me basically, and I had some of the most depressing years there. I didn't do well in school except for at the end and had very few people I could relate to. Over the years though I built relations with my family back up (largely thanks to advice from Jordan Peterson) and when I finally finished school I felt so free, and my grades are now really good at university where my social life is so much better.
Goes to show there's so many things that can affect you and help you. I honestly think if it weren't for Jordan Peterson I would be a lot less than I am now.
Conscientious can be trained. Intelligence - not.
@wulfloft5805 That's so great to hear how many people's lives have been changed for the better by Dr. Peterson
Such a high IQ that you can’t even spell
Advice from me, a middle aged guy who has been considered gifted by many of his peers but never reached his full potential, to youngsters who might be reading:
- Intelligence is only one parameter among many that determines outcomes in almost every situation
- Never assume someone’s intelligence
- Always assume that the person you are conversing or reading, is smarter and more knowledgeable than you
- Never dismiss an idea just because you think it was put forward by a less intelligent person
- Never accept an idea because it was put forward by someone you think smarter than you
- The dumbest person can outsmart you any day, may say something you never thought about
- Intelligence is like huge waves on water. But it is hard to know what is in the depths
- Never take your intelligence or lack of it, as granted
- Hard work trumps intelligence in almost anything; but efficient and self suited goals are the best
Thank you Kemal for the wise words
You just somed up what it means to be humble.
respect for the camera man panning non stop lmao
Stanfod & Binet stated repeatedly that their testing assumptions are not to be used to define human potential in absolute terms, it is a tool, and there are many tools for determining an individual's range of ability - the ultimate one is how they solve the problem of their own existence.
How you solve the problem of your own existence is better handled with higher IQ
Ultimately it always gets back to IQ, which is the central Nexus & Flow from which all wellsprings originate...
So much of the other attempts to supplant IQ have a left-wing agenda, obfuscatory nuanced attempts to make that which is sound, reasonable and duplicatable nebulous... If only to attempt to play the egalitarian diversity game of political correctness, a false morality
How is any of this in the slightest "controversial"? This is a standard introductory lecture. Nothing controversial is being discussed. It is completely standard established pedagogy.
My thoughts exactly
His suggestion that Emotional Intelligence does not exist is controversial!
hes not talking about what is said, everybody knows the controversy behind IQ..its because different races score different on them, more specifically its controversial because black people score very low
Tommy Dolan black Obsession.
How is any of this not controversial? The guy practically just said that if you're born shit, then that's what you'll be for the rest of your life. Say goodbye to aspirations, respect, and essentially any form of high-achievement--apparently that's reserved for intellectual elitists. This is most definitely a monstrous statistic.
People do love to have a Guru, as it is quite evident in comments. When people are only praising a person on his arguments rather than adding on to it & giving their opinion on the matter, you know people's comments are not worth reading.
My family is a high iq family. It doesn’t mean we are all successful. Alcohol, drugs, and early pregnancies has destroyed many of my family members. They are all super smart. Doesn’t mean they are very wise. My dad was the only one who got out of the toxic family and taught me how to properly live life. I’ve been blessed with a high iq and good set of parents and I hope I can teach as many people as I can how to get out of bad situations.
Same with my Family. High or above normal IQ does protect you from maligned behaviors and evil Plots. Street smart, Morals, Ethics with self confidence, an ability to read or understand intentional behaviors and not worrying what others think helps keep us on the straight and narrow. It’s really a battle field outside the Family circle, however the Family circle could still have their own set of behavior problems. Often times inner Family influences might not show up until the naive are in their later years. Sometimes these more serious behaviors surpass counseling and require Law Enforcement or even Military attention. There are many levels of how behavior problems are dealt with.
Happiness is one of the rarest traits in people with very high IQs, so in my mind it is ideal to be of above-average intelligence, where one can solve problems on a daily basis as they occur but also enjoy their life without constantly overanalyzing things.
That may be because people who believe in IQ are extremely judgemental. They judge everyone to be "dumber" than them and in doing so, they believe the World is Doomed. Speaking from the perspective of someone who studies inteligence, IQ is one of the most (If not the most) limiting takes on intelligence I have ever studied
@@Mhurilo10 That's a fairly one-dimensional perspective. Consider how IQ relates to boredom, and see where that gets you... unless that sounds too boring for you. I'd hate to have to make you do something you didn't want to, like consider abstractions that don't pertain to your personal estimation of the world, or imagine what things would seem true or false from a perspective other than your own. It's almost like thinking is like a kind of work that takes effort! Go figure.
@@ladymercy5275 it's one dimensional because it's one of the possibilities I decided to point out. That's why I said it *May* be. But you clearly didn't get it. (Which is not a bad thing but it seems like you think it is).
IQ doesn't relate to boredom is my conclusion. It relates to the very specific and limited scope it tests people at. (Geometrical patterns, reading academic dialects and calculus).
I wonder what is your conclusion since you concluded that I had never studied enough to even consider boredom. Monumentally worse to consider I will reach the same conclusion you did.
@@ladymercy5275 "Consider abstractions that don't pertain to your personal estimation of the world" That is a LOT of word salad to say 'consider personal experience'.
If you wanted to be more accurate you would have said Qualia. If you wanted to make your message clearer you would have used simpler language. It looks too much like you want to sound smart by using synonyms to make your idea less accecible. That only makes you sound dishonest and malicious.
@@ladymercy5275 How blatantly dishonest do you have to be to think I do not want to hear perspectives other than my own? Do you think I'm some evil cartoon character? How childish is your estimation of people who disagree with you?
That’s the thing about schools and passing exams to get in to uni. I think conscientious is much more a factor of success because working hard and having a good memory will get you a lot further than intelligence which usually results in boredom and disinterest in school work. As the great Rick Sanchez once said “school is not a good place for smart people”.
The Dunning Kruger effect is a real thing. I've met a lot of stupid people whose arrogance have blinded them to the fact that they are complete idiots.
Kruger*, bud
@@JacksHardenedLiver sorry, i have big hands and sometimes when i type on my phone I hit the wrong keys.
I feel completely retarded and never smart enough. I can't tell how dumb I am
Wish I had such a professor in College. Very enlightening.
I have heard some people say that being smarter than others is ableist
Isaac Chay said by the less intelligent :-)
Isaac Chay ableist?
garr
“Ableism” is a buzzword used by intersectional feminists to say that you would rather hire/use/etc one type of person for their physical, or in this case mental, capabilities.
It’s absolute garbage
garr
So essentially hiring someone who is 6’2 to lift boxes is ableist against people in a wheelchair, and therefore oppressive.
@@obviouslykaleb7998 No one uses that
Sam Harris' last podcast was all about IQ, man if their first conversation wasn't so bad (the second one was better, fortunately) I would love to hear them talking about something more like this
Dare to dream.
Daken Nine My thoughts when I clicked this video
Nicholas Lornadek I kind of liked the first podcast though I think Harris looked worse but I'm biased against Harris.
The conversation will go like this:
Peterson: this is how Iq is defined.
Sam: ok cool.
Peterson: cool.
Sam: ok bye.
My measured IQ is 175 (measured by three different top psychologists in NYC) and I disagree with the regressive views this guy holds. I think he missed his era by a good one hundred years. He also doesn't understand complex biochemistry and underestimates environmental factors.
I was as thick as shit. But I invested in houses at a young age and retired when I was about 45. I am 60 now and still as thick as shit.
Several people ranting in the comments without citing anything he's said as wrong are doing an excellent job at proving him right
Hi, Billy Mays here.
Even a dead man wouldn't pass up the savings found in Billy Mays excellent products!
*True Hero*
I enjoy the chipotlaway
I heart you Billy Mays!
Nigga wild for this
I have never met a dumb good piano player.
Green Deane I have never met a smart drummer, and I'm a drummer.
Green Deane but have you ever seen a dumb person that's highly interested in learning piano?
Dumb in what terms ?
smart people are usually just more able to do the whole persistence thing
If that good piano player makes a mistake every 4th word he writes, is he dumb?
5:58 I love how he unconsciously represents low correlation as two orthogonal vectors with his hands. Probably most of the students watching wondered what he was doing!
Actually I think that most of the students got that
Come on! Have more faith in them :)
5:10
Hmmm, what did she say?
I listen back to it twice
Atill, what is she saying?
I know! The captions will say!
She said "*idea from a student*"
-_-
"Maybe the controversy is that, whatever you're measuring is your common sense" that's what I'm hearing anyway
I love his lectures. Thank you for posting them.
Native Daughter iq tests are subjective.. 100% of our dna is African and we are 99.99% the same .. lol 😉 "You and I, in fact everyone all over the world, we’re literally African under the skin; brothers and sisters separated by a mere two thousand generations. Old-fashioned concepts of race are not only socially divisive, but scientifically wrong."
www.nationalgeographic.org/activity/all-africans-under-the-skin/
There is definitely a distinction between logical/mathematical/theoretical/abstract intelligence and linguistic intelligence.
Altum Novo Incorrect. Linguistic analysis is very similar to algebra and formal language theory (i.e. the theory behind programming languages) is an applied theory of semigroups.
I believe the only sensible distinction between intelligences is analytical and creative intelligence, and even then there are cases (i.e. mathematicians) where those are highly correlated with each other.
How do you explain people at a young age horrible at maths and great at reading and writing and vise versa. It's pretty well documented to the point where there is really no case against this. Linguistic analysis is NOTHING like algebra. Completely different.
Altum Novo Do you actually believe the garbage early-educational system we have now is any good indication/differentiator of intelligence? Do you also think making connections based on similar symbols (e.g. morphemes) and parsing the meaning of said symbols is not similar to algebra? If you answer yes to either of these questions then you're in absolutely no position to "argue" whatever point you're arguing.
Hint: abstract algebra has nothing to do with numbers by the way. Try graduating from your community college first, dropout.
President Aria, just because the two domains are analytically similar doesn't mean that they invoke the same parts of the brain in practice. Language and grammar, as an activity, is principally parietal/hippocampal whereas most problem-solving is done by the frontal lobe, i.e. the executive function. Although, Altum, I'm gonna have to disagree with you slightly on the left-brain/right-brain dichotomy, as the language centers actually happen to be mostly on the left side.
Altum Novo I would assume that linguistic and logical intelligence are very correlated (in people without mental disorders, namely autism), and perhaps the same thing. I mean, what are you doing when you write or speak? You're combining words to form a logical statement. Is language emotional? It can be used emotionally. But is language itself emotional? It's not. When writing, the meaning behind the words and the creative way that you use the words give the text emotion. If you were creative enough, you could give math emotion. "The plane flew overhead". Was that emotional? It was not. But it was logical, it made sense. Language is logic.
This is, in my opinion, the most interesting topic that Jordan Peterson discusses. One of the reasons why is that the number of interesting questions that can be asked about it is infinitely many. Here’s one that’s been in my mind: how do universities account for formal training skewing intelligence tests and how effective are these systems? If universities really do exist to attract truly brilliant people to use as assets in our society, then one has to wonder how to balance this out.
The answer is that you ask a wide variety of questions. There's a limit to how much you can learn in the time you have available, and if you've learned more in that timeframe, then by definition you must be more intelligent, because you have to be smarter to parse that information more rapidly.
There's a difference between intelligence and indoctrination.
I would say that there is such a thing as musical intelligence, somewhat apart from
regular intelligence. There are those who can succeed at very complex musical
achievements, but who are very low functioning at other life tasks. Musical achievement
is like a parallel ability, that others have in more conventional realms.
Music is math. Math is music.
"Emotional Intelligence - which does not exist." quote by Dr. Peterson. The term "Emotional Intelligence" has always appeared to be an oxymoron to me. Whilst I very much enjoy the lecture...I am also glad I am not required to take notes and write the midterm.
The fact the sociopathic behaviors and personality traits exists it proof that emotional intelligence exists. That would be an example of one who is very low on the EQ scale sense the have no concept of empathy or love. EQ is the ability to under stand one emotions and the emotions of others and how to react and handle and emotional situation or conversation. And the fact that we has humans are emotional beings also proves that EQ is 100% real.
@@gundamcollector77 Thank you for your response and thoughtful comment. Emotional nature, Emotional perspective, Emotional response, Lack of Emotion, Excessive emotion ... are all valid descriptors IMHO. Emotional Intelligence is an Oxymoron ... Like "Military Intelligence", "Accurate Estimate", "Bitter Sweet". Intelligence and emotion are both interesting and highly motivating aspects of life, but are to some degree, mutually exclusive. The Myth of Emotional Intelligence is a Newby Buzzword for the increasingly less well read population now running around on our increasingly self congratulatory orb of existence. I think you mean Empathy or dare I say it ... Wisdom. Be Good and Have Fun.
It’s made up by people with low iq who are mad they’re dumb
Here's a Controversial Fact: stupid people don't like being called stupid. Here's another: fat people don't like being told they're fat. And so on and so on.
So does your holy ghost
Skinny people don't particularly like being called fat, and smart people don't particularly enjoy being called stupid......
Don't forget the most controversial fact.
This really boils down to simple isometrics
I think what people don’t realize is that the socio economic pressures on the intelligence hierarchy is flawed at best.
So if we collectively have a proclivity towards corruption of the basic fundamental principles underlying the hierarchy then the whole substructure is corrupt to begin with
As professor Peterson has said this is basic arithematic. What he fails to see or demonstrate is that this problem can’t be solved within the hierarchy because the whole system is corrupt.
What’s needed is criticism or constructive criticism from beyond the hierarchy.
Would you want your defense to be judge and jury at a judicial hearing? I think not.
That there are people with different levels of intelligence is not a "system" you can "critique". Might as well critique the shape of mountains or reprimand the trees for growing too slowly.
I'd like to see intelligence defined as a person's ability to process information. Like in a computer processor, it's a factor of processing speed and data bandwidth. The amount of information you can process at once times how quickly you process that information is intelligence. Yes there are different types of information; mathematical, abstract, spacial, social, linguistic, etc., but I think that there is a root ability to process information that is applied by different individuals to different degrees in there various areas.
That's part of an IQ test already.
@@rleeboston33
Right, but when people use the word intelligence, they usually mix it up with knowledge, wisdom, and experience.
@rysio ochódzki
I'd say that depth is bandwidth, but speed is still involved. I'm saying that processing power, thus intelligence, is the coin that speed and bandwidth/depth are the heads and tails of. You can't have one without the other. Speed means nothing without any content and depth means nothing if it's static.
(People treat the universe as though it's a thing, but it's more of a happening; a verb, not a noun. It's appearance as an object is an illusion, although a valid aspect. It's a stream or a feed, like streaming media. Our perception is like sampling analog music for digital storage and reproduction. You have the sampling rate and the bit depth. The higher the resolution, the more accurate the reproduction. We all sample the world at different resolutions. Some people are low resolution and some are high resolution. Meditation is the master, but not the only, tool for increasing one's resolution.)
In IQ testing there is a component of interpretation called the information processing model. Many psychologists are lazy in interpreting IQ tests.
There is processing speed and perceptual organization
I don't like IQ intelligence and and the GRE as metrics because I can improve my scores by studying a few books. My GRE score went through the roof by going through all of the math in an SAT and GRE book over the course of about 4-5 months. Pair that with some linguistics texts that focus on vocabulary and comprehension and you're well on your way to improving your score by 30+ points. If I had to take the GRE again with a near blank slate, having not studied in a couple yearrs, I'd have a shit score.
"If I had to take the GRE again with a near blank slate, having not studied in a couple yearrs, I'd have a shit score."
That is correct, which is why IQ is stable over time. You can modify test results in the short term, but long term it's pretty much stable.
+Misael Hilario then why does he say standardized tests like the SAT are IQ tests? I was shit on the SAT because smoked weed all through high school and didn't know anything. I scored near the top on the GRE 8 years after. What makes IQ tests so stable, but not the SAT or GRE?
Because generally, IQ tests measure actions which are independent of knowledge. Manipulating shapes in your mind, identifying patterns, and so on. SATs and similar standardized school tests are more focused on testing one's capability of solving knowledge based problems. There's understandably a correlation between being able to solve knowledge based problems and more abstract problems like object manipulation or pattern recognition which is why you can use certain metrics to convert SAT scores to an IQ score. The correlation isn't perfect and not incredibly reliable, so your best bet for an accurate intelligence test is to just take a legit proctored IQ exam.
But frankly, regardless of how much you dislike IQ tests, they are very stable. From the age of roughly 10 years old onward, IQ scores remain relatively stable for the people who take them. So stable, in fact, that one could claim that IQ is fixed in the upward direction and be correct. There are obviously methods of lowering IQ. If you're drunk and you take an IQ test, you will do worse than if you were sober. People who take IQ tests while tired also score lower than when awake. In many cases, differences in IQ that show up between childhood and adulthood can be attributed to extraneous factors like tiredness, duress, or other temporary environmental phenomenon. When one is free of those, then that person's true IQ can be measured. This reality explains why you did so poorly previously while you were smoking weed. Your true IQ, free of intoxicants, is bound to be higher than when you took a test while being a regular drug user.
In my experience, IQ test surrogates like the GRE have subsections that are more and less amenable to gaming. I doubt that results on the verbal or analytical subtests are subject to much change with study (unless you memorize the answers, as is suspected by pervasive efforts in China to game the USA's SAT) while the math subsection does require a certain level of prior knowledge, which might be missing if the test-taker avoided such training (because he or she didn't like math.)
But that would have happened with any kind of test. Wether it was IQ, SAT, GRE or anything. It's like going to a marathon after a shit diet. And you're like: "Wait. I underperformed. Do marathons really have anything to do with physical abilities?" Of course they do. You just sabotaged your own performance over a particular period of time.
"So do you believe in intelligence or not? Well, obviously if you have any sense."
I literally screamed YES at the end of this. I hate when people try to downplay IQ. Its like they don't want to admit that intelligence is measurable because of their own insecurity.
@rysio ochódzki I think your over simplifying it. It's obviously a valuable vector to measure intelligence to a certain extent. See what I believe the best way to find your IQ is take as many tests as possible then average your score. The value I think these tests have is they let you know kind of jobs you would most likely be good at so you don't waste time and energy on a career your most likely not going to be optimal at. It's like a physical assessment. If your 5'8" you probably won't make it to the NBA, but does that mean you absolutely can't? No. Does it mean you would probably be better at something else, yes. We need people of all different intelligence levels or we couldn't have cooks, janitors, welders, computer programers, CEO's, brain surgeons. Imagine a janitor trying to be a brain surgeon or vise versa. Obviously intelligence matters for what job you're fit for.
@rysio ochódzki it isn't hypocrisy. So are you assuming no women like short men? Are you saying being short doesn't have it's advantages? Are you ignorant to the fact some women like having a man who isn't handsome because they have low self esteem and like the idea that they won't be bombarded by women trying to steal him away? Everybody has advantages and disadvantages. Intelligence is only one quality and has its own disadvantages. Imagine being Einstein, how challenging it must have been for him to deal with people of much lower intelligence. Or how lonely it must have been having barely anybody who could relate to his life experience. Some of the least intelligent people I know are some of the happiest, because their lives are simple. Less stress of the complexity that you have the burdon of dealing with on a regular basis.
@rysio ochódzki leftist humanism? Eugenic standpoint? I'm too complex and sophisticated to belong to one train of thought or ideology like any intelligent human being. Biology? Please, you probably think we evolved from apes. I love human biology and physiology. Learning about the two make up a good bit of my free time. And I can say with absolute certainty that the more I learn the more I learn we don't know. Trying to explain everybody by saying 1+1=2
@rysio ochódzki I just gave an example of why a women might want a man you consider ugly. There are many reasons. I might find really skinny women attractive and you might find borderline fat women attractive. Sometimes people just like what they like. Even if there was a biological answer 10 years from now it will probably be "proven" to be wrong like so many other things we think we know.
@rysio ochódzki you proved my point. You are probably above average intelligence and you prefer loneliness yet act like you dont understand the plight of Einstein not having many peers intelligence wise. If you want to bring bullshit biology into it, people subconsciously feel the need to fit in and when you are more intelligent than 99.9% of people on earth you simply don't. You enjoy complexity while most people loath it. You can't stand oversimplification and that's what the majority operates on. I'm miserable having to work around the people I work around who are obviously of lower intelligence than myself, is that just being annoyed because you say so? Do you believe I can't tell the difference? In 37 years I'm pretty sure I can separate the two. You are miserable too. People don't isolate their selves because they are well adjusted and accepted by their peers. Also the more intelligent people are the more nuanced they are which makes it harder to find people like you even if they are as intelligent. Your obviously intelligent but I still have vastly different views than you. But I'm sure you're used to that.
This is one of those classes that stick to you brain and keep you having those long shower thoughts for days. Peterson is my guru.
Love it: "If you have any sense (intelligence) you'll believe in intelligence!"
Love this guy. He's a breath of fresh air compared to all of those snooty left wing politically correct profs who seem to be dominating higher education these days.
Andrew excuse me, this comment is being reported for not being politically correct
The man is completely deluded. He still on an archaic theory of 'intelligence' that is about crumble within the next 20 year.
All these "snooty left-wing" professors are still more intelligent than a significant portion of right-wingers, of which the bulk is made up of low-IQ cavemen.
He isn't a right winger either, he sits in the middle mostly, both far right and left hate him
Dingus Dow that is so extreme and you know it.
He was describing the basis of artificial intelligence (the math behind it) at one point. I love this dude.
Im so dumb that I don't even understand the point being made here lol
Someone explain to me please
@@jamespak8175Well, AI people realised that if you can quantify intelligence objectively, then maybe you can replicate that intelligence in a machine. And in fact that is difficult, we have made little to no progress when it comes to replicating fluid intelligence, which is basically AGI (Artificial General Intelligence).
It would make a definitive impact on my life to have a sit-down with this man for a couple of hours. His mind operates in a way that I've not seen before (with the exception of a few rare authors). I'd love to pick his brain on the subject of cosmological existentialism and Buddhism; the nature of matter and how it affects behavior. Man, to me: that would be like hitting the lottery!
As a 40 year old engineer i'd love to go back to university and attend all his lectures. By bringing everything back to quantifiable demonstrable data he destroys a lot of the arguments of these millennial SJW's
heckubiss1 be careful what you say based on statistics because you might lose your engineering position *cough Google...
ah engineers... the oompa loompas of science
ho disperatilor oompa loompas get shit done
heckubiss1 do you know the difference between race (African physical traits) and ethnicity (origin and culture)?? iq tests are subjective so comparing actual ethnicities is pointless.. 100% of our dna is African and we are 99.99% the same .. "You and I, in fact everyone all over the world, we’re literally African under the skin; brothers and sisters separated by a mere two thousand generations. Old-fashioned concepts of race are not only socially divisive, but scientifically wrong."
www.nationalgeographic.org/activity/all-africans-under-the-skin/
Bit ForLess what you said was not only incorrect, but it's illogical. The oldest of the Nordic and Icelandic people are of the denisovan (Hispanic African) bloodlines- they popularized (along with young Asians or neanderthal Africans) and passed on the African depigmentation genes and African eye colors so many cry about thousands of years before cauc-asians (an Asian and Hispanic) mix left asia 1,500 years ago. The Nordic people, along with the oldest Europeans (Denisovan Africans), helped African depigmentation genes flourish in Europe 5-8k years ago. African depigmentation genes and other racial (race means African physical traits) traits like eye color or noses or ear shapes have never thought to affect iq development. Iq testing and development is subjective and mostly depends on environmental (nurture)- where global twin studies backs up the facts. All human differences can still be attributed to Africans because 100% of our dna is African, we are 99.9% identical, and from the same family tree.. "IQ development shifts from nurture (environmental) influences to nature (genetic) influences as children move into adulthood, approximately from age 12 to 16."
journalistsresource.org/studies/society/education/nature-nurture-intellectual-development-children
My IQ is 82 but watching Jordan's videos makes me feel smarter.
More smart*
@@Brand00d he is correct the comparative adjective is "smarter"......
Hallowmancer you are the most smart
@@Brand00d "smartest" exists
Hallowmancer intelligentest
Loved the end of that vid. Hard conclusion 🤣😂 I really enjoy watching his lectures. He always finds a way to personalize his ideas so that his audience can understand and relate. Hes a really special and gifted human. Brilliant mind to say the least.
How does IQ relate to relationships? For example, if one person has a high IQ and the other low, is there any chance of a long-term, successful relationship? I remember Dr. Peterson talked about this subject once; can someone link the video?
Probably not, but matching by IQ is a good guarantee for success as much as possible
12:40 of intellectually stimulating discussion followed by 30 secnds of destruction of every objection ever made against IQ measurement.
Thanks you for being brave enough to speak the truth in this time of insanity.
this is such a controversial topic because it really plays with our egos. you may be considered intelligent by your close ones or friends but the "truth" will come with the test
Yes then the, killing and burning.
People will watch an entire video of a subject matter expert discussing how real something is and then say "Well I know this one guy that doesn't correlate with your information, so you're wrong." Amazing.
I agree with intelligence being a major factor in terms of success in life but from personal experience hard work/motivation is probably just as strong a factor. According to a few tests my IQ falls somewhere between 145 - 155 yet my motivation to persevere through challenges I view as daunting is slim to none. When faced with a tough road I always choose the path of least resistance and at times it is incredibly depressing. I know all the things I need to do to be at the place I want to be, but I lack the motivation to do them.
Unless it's an official IQ test I'd be skeptical your IQ falls in that range. If it does you should consider applying for your local Mensa group. I've scored unofficial IQ tests ranging from 125-200, they don't mean anything unless official.
DarkStar_Blizzard I don't see the point of having an official recognition of my IQ since that's not the major hurdle that I view personally affects me. This is based on anecdotal evidence of myself, I know, but I think I would rather be average when it comes to intelligence but be extremely driven in my endeavors.
DynamicUnreal I don't disagree, my point is simply using your own personal experience as evidence means that evidence is up for questioning. You made an assertion based on your own experience, I'm saying even your own experience may not be relevant if you're not even talking about the same scale as Peterson is.
There are many charts that correlate surrogate test scores to IQ tests. Older versions of the GRE, SAT and ACT were quite reliable estimates of how someone would perform on an "IQ test." Oh, and MENSA, as you know, isn't really that selective. One-in-fifty is hardly a mark of genius. Colloquy is one-in-200, Triple Nine is one-in-500 and we go higher from there. I've only met one true genius in my life; my guess is his IQ was well in excess of 160. Life bored him to tears.
Oh, and high IQ societies (in my experience) are filled with insufferable, insecure jerks. Most very bright people don't seek such interactions, or sour on them quickly (as i surely did.)
I agree, which is why intelligence is not a virtue. Perseverance, courage, honesty, duty, and yes motivation. These are the virtues that the every day decent person should consider, regardless of intelligence.
I just don't get his views on intelligence. I've listened to Peterson on this topic numerous times and I am not wrapping my mind around his limiting intelligence to IQ and the traditional model of language and logic. As a teacher of cello for over 30 years and a professor of cello for 20, teaching all age groups, I can say without any hesitation that those with high academic intelligence (high IQ, high SAT scores, etc.) are not necessarily quick at or show mental horsepower for 1) conceptually mapping out the finger board, 2) reading rhythms, 3) hearing pitch, 4) hearing a tone or timbre and translating that to Kinesthetic movement, 5) catching on to musical ideas, 6) listening to those around them to fit into a musical ensemble, and 7) doing all of the above in one grand gestalt. To say music is only a "talent" and doesn't require an some sort of mental "horsepower" seems completely naive to me and would only be uttered by someone who can't do it or hasn't tried. I love his views on postmodernism but his views on intelligence...well, agree to disagree...strongly.
I undestand your point, but I think you don't understand what he says and how statistics work. You have to invert the question
Do my students have high IQ?
Maybe you're just a bad teacher to people with a certain type of intelligence, if you identify your area of expertise you could push that, or else work on the areas you find more difficult. Oh and don't forget to tidy your room
Or just try teaching someone with an iq of 90 how to play cello
What you all miss out on is that IQ is a mean average, most people that are very good are just good in one thing, perfect math brain but suck at anything non math realted. So somone can be a genius musician but suck at the buissness side and the social side etc.. Its atcually very common.
It would have to do with working memory. A man with 110 iq and superior working memory will always outperform another man with 150 iq and average bor below avg working memory in rule based systems such as music, math etc. It's the secret of child prodigies too
I think he’s spot on regarding the definition problem. One of the issues I constantly run into when discussing the idea of “life success” with friends is what does that mean? Often one of us is talking about financial success while the other is talking about happiness and another is talking about stability. I think this is why discussions of “other intelligences” have come up -though I think such terms are bad because they aren’t seeking to measure intellectual capacity or performance. People want to explore what predicts success in different areas, using different definitions of success to start with.
" other intelligence is bad." IQ is total crap. My brother used to practice IQ tests. It's a false proposition.
Come back, JP. We need you now more than ever.
He's gone?
@@carlosv4782 He took a sabbatical for rehab on some kind of anti-depressant.
I've never mesured my IQ. It was never a requirement in my life so far. Now I am rather scared about looking into it because I might not like the answer.
I guess I mesure IQ as a sense of self-worth. And right now I am not sure I need that sort of information.
Just do it, and get someone to give you advice on how to increase it. Because you can increase it to some degree.
And if all else fails, just apply yourself. Knowing where you are weak at is an incredible advantage.
IQ is not a deterministic mechanism... It's just a measure that shows trends statistically. Even if you know your IQ, it shouldn't hold you back at all. JP would agree.
That's quite an insightful and philosophical assessment. I would suggest above average.
You don't get to change the definition of IQ based on your feelings.
But you could formulate that sentence so you already know your IQ is above 95 lol
I have a serious comment to make. I first watched this video not so long after dropping out of a Masters in Software Development. I struggled beyond what was reasonable with the course material and quickly saw how I was seemingly incapable of grasping what many of my peers were picking up with ease. I've been unemployed and depressed since then, and was recently diagnosed with ADHD-PI (this is the inattentive, not hyperactive type). The root of my depression I believe is the nagging feeling that I'm just not smart enough, and after seeing this video, it was like swallowing a golf-ball sized red pill.
I find it almost disturbing that we can simply assign a number above someone's head which is so determinant of what they are capable of, and these numbers are effectively assigned at birth and there is nothing you can do to raise that number. Sure, I obviously always knew people were smarter than others, but I also reckoned that people thought in different ways that were advantageous in different circumstances. I'd not really considered that raw IQ trumps virtually everything else when it comes to a person's cognitive abilities, that it's effectively like a PC's RAM, or an engine's horsepower.
Since this video I've been so depressed and insecure about myself like never before. I've become socially withdrawn, and job searching has become an emotionally torturous experience of ruling out 90% of the jobs I see due to my feelings of inadequacy. In the end, I did find a job as a Trainee Pharmacy Advisor, but I struggle daily with self-doubt, even more than I would have before. I'm now seeing everything through the lens of this video. If it takes me longer to do something than someone else, I immediately assume it's low IQ and not just inexperience. If I'm not understanding what's being said to me first time, it's due to low IQ and not how it's being explained. And these aren't thoughts I'm having after the event, these thoughts are literally running through my head as I'm being spoken to, just utterly crippled with self-doubt.
I spend hours each day searching the web for stories that relate to mine and for some answers on how to get past this paralyzing feeling I have. I feel like my entire life is in doubt so long as I am questioning how intelligent I actually am.
I am terrified at getting my IQ officially tested, but at the same time I feel like it might be necessary to somehow get past this feeling, for better or worse. I did a couple of the more reputable online tests - the GIQ test and then iqtest.dk (the latter uses purely Raven's Progressive Matrices). I'd read that if you take your average of these two tests, that you've a good approximate figure of how you'd fare in an officially administered IQ test. I scored 132 and 115 respectively in these tests, and while I felt extremely relieved at the time, since then I've really doubted the validity of them at all, as daily life seems to indicate that I'm at the other end of the scale. I feel extremely slow, forgetful and seemingly incapable of applying common sense in any unfamiliar scenario, I'm like a deer in the headlights.
Should I just bite the bullet and get my IQ tested? Or am I going down a dangerous path with all of this? I just don't know how I can drop this way of thinking about things, or how I can snap out of it when I feel like I'm constantly reminded of it in daily life. I don't know what to do.
I wish I'd never come across any of this stuff, ignorance truly is bliss.
Disclaimer: I am not a trained professional
First of all I think it's safe to assume that you are above average, because of how clearly you are able to explore and to outline your ideas and the more serious online tests are also a good indicator for that. I also wouldn't be too dismissal about what you have so far accomplished in your education.
I have no idea how hard your course material was, but I think I get what you are saying: While people can close the gap with hard work, having a competition that is significantly more intelligent makes it unreasonably hard to constantly work more than anyone else just to become average in comparison.
Now two things need to be questioned:
a) Was it really the lack of intelligence that made you struggle? Are you oriented properly?
b) Are you putting too much weight into the significance of IQ?
The first question is really hard to determine with an IQ test, because let's say you get a score of 115. Even with something over 120 you might talk yourself into thinking that your peers are still way above that. I am not saying that you shouldn't do an IQ test, but I have my doubts that it would put anything to rest.
You said you have depression and I must say that your post indicates a lot of negative emotion, so that's definitely a case for therapy and a good psychologist can help you to answer all these questions. Seriously, get help immediately.
Regarding the second question: While IQ is a huge indicator for life-time success and income there is definitely a lot more than that to life. Watch these clips where he sheds light on the limitations and the arrogance of the intellect:
czcams.com/video/rl7_pwO7R0w/video.html
czcams.com/video/txyINNJU6Qc/video.html
You’re like me 4 years ago lol I know this is going to be hard but you need to distract yourself. I’m from a family with very smart Individuals, high IQ, photographic memory, all that jazz. I used to get shit on by my dad for being dumb/illogical and believe me the only thing you can do is to distract yourself and not think of it any more
How are you now?
It actually sounds to me like you are just suffering with high neuroticism... Seek therapy and the rest will fall into place.
I would say your experiences are much more connected to your ADHD diagnosis than your IQ.
One noticeable thing is that picking btw 65 and 145 is not a fair comparison. It should be 135 or 65, or 145 or 55.
It seems people want to water down the concept of intelligence for the sake of not offering unintelligent people.
The cool think about intelligence is that through hard work it can improve but even people with high iq can turn out to be losers in life or waste their intelligence being couch potatoes..so what really matters is finding a hole in the universe and filling it making the world a better place..do what you love and you'll find a problem for which you have a solution to.
That's a great point, and I agree with a lot of that. However I think the issue that Dr. Peterson brings up also states that intelligence, or IQ, is a static trait that cannot be improved upon substantially. Yes, there are ways to increase competency of completing specific tasks which require a high level of intelligence, but this effect does not sustain itself across different domains, or the ability to learn across different domains. Because of that discrepancy, it becomes exponentially more difficult for someone with a lower IQ to get ahead in life.
IQ doesn't improve with hard work. It's highly correlated with reaction time which is also notorious for being unimprovable.
An intelligence quotient (IQ) is a total score derived from several standardized tests designed to assess human intelligence.
There are many types of tests but Aristotle suggests perception as possibly the best indicator due to it can not be learned. Many IQ questions fail because you can learn them.
These are not facts these are opinions
You could clearly state that intelligence is an individual’s capacity to solve problems.
I got a high IQ score when I was 8 and now I’m failing three classes watching this video for validation.
IQ is one predictor of success. Conscienciousness (the hard work aspect) is the other major one.
Consciensciousness does tend to increase with age, so you do have a chance.
Also, consider seeing a psychiatrist to see if you don't have some sort of disorder like ADHD or ASD? You may have a lot of raw reasoning ability, just be unable to use it productively.
80 is not high hunny
@@Olivia-W the correlation is more modest than high tho.they are low to moderate,and socioeconomic factor play a lot about this.
IQ correlate to 0.5 with high school grades(meaning it explains 25% of grades variance),certainly less when we add socioeconomics factors.for undergraduate,it correlates up to 0.5 for verbal IQ,and a very poor 0.22 for performance IQ(meaning it explains 4.84% of grades during undergraduate).
terman famous study also showed that IQ is a modest predictor of academic sucess,most of them did the same jobs as average people,and a lot of people who did ivy league got help and letter of motivation from terman itself.
IQ is a limitor though,but a relatively low one.Terman study showed that if High IQ don't correlate with High sucess,it correlates with low failures.the rate of sucess in high school was wayy higher,even compared to average white males/females.the main conclusion from it was that average is sufficient for undegraduate(and i'm saying sufficient,average would be more around 105,so would be harder but still very easy),110-115 would be sufficient for a master,and 120 for a PhD/Ivy league.the other main conclusion was that being 10-20-30-40 or whatever over 125 won't change things that much to be a genius.you need 125 to be one,more won't change anything,it's then other factors that will be important.
@@orangegames3284 You can't even structure a comment properly, let alone punctuate properly.
@@LaughingMan44 so instead of arguing,you do an ad hominem?and loose your time to do so?cool man
You're at university because your IQ is high.....WHAT??
Man, you MUST be in Canada. Because here in the States, if your parents' checkbook is big enough, you WILL be at university, sure as you're born.
And if the checkbook is REALLY big, your professors will mysteriously notice an IQ in you that remained hidden from everyone else.
Aside,
What job or career on Earth are you preparing the students in this class for, save becoming fellow professors??
IQ is a lot of fun to talk about in the waiting rooms of people who DO, FIX, MAKE, and IMPROVE things in real life.
John ORourke Well at all colleges in the U.S. worth attending, finances are no issue because assistance is plentiful. And if you're parents are wealthy, you're probably pretty intelligent.
John ORourke That is not true. You might find the rare case, but the overwhelming majority of people at university are there because they met the grade requirements. People don't just end up at Harvard if they are dumb as rocks. Harvard wants to have successful graduates, because that attracts more successful people to then graduate.
You missed the part right after where he said social class is also a factor in university attendance.
yeah he teaches at U of T which has some of highest entrance averages in Canada, even for a simple 4 year Arts BA. So he is somewhat correct in that assertion. Most people there would be considerably intelligent.
university ≠ college ;)
1 + 1 is 2. Factual. If you realise which shape comes after which patern puzzle, you're smart, is subjective.
Univariate Regression: which variable best predicts y. Multiple Regression: what is the value of learning a single predictor, once we already know the other predictors.
My IQ depends on what I'm watching on TV at the time.
If I'm watching 'Cosmos' or 'The Ascent of Man' my IQ is about 150.
If I'm watching an American sit-com it's about 70.
If I'm watching a party political broadcast it doesn't even register!!
It also depends on which version of 'Cosmos' you're watching. The Sagan one is superior.
Directly in ratio to the waistline
“...emotional intelligence, which DOES NOT EXIST by the way!” 9:20
Love it. Our Prime Minister is praised for his emotional intelligence, I guess he really has no intelligence then.
He means it is not real in the realm of science.
"no real intelligence then" that's not what he said. He said that what people call emotional intelligence is actually some sort of mixture of high IQ AND some personality traits.
I know plenty of people who got high marks in school but are terrible at socializing and making connections. I know plenty of people who failed in exams and excelled in business. So how come emotional intelligence doesn't exist?
@@stevefernando94 they failed in school because they weren't motivated enough to study, and the succeeded in business because of the power of their iq.
Emotional intelligence is that type of intelligence which only dumb people claim to have.
I consider myself to be a fairly intelligent individual by most measures, yet Dr. Peterson's intellect keeps me very well grounded on my place in the pecking order. He's a treasure to those in this world that care about facts and insights. Master level stuff.
If you are listening to Peterson than you are not fairly intelligent.
@@michaelwright8896”…than you are not fairly intelligent.”
@@ch33zyburrito36 im not listening to him for the same reason.
Music ability. Language knowledge. Communication skills. Emotional inteligence. Sports skills. Where are these represented in IQ tests. Thus far I only seen visual and numerical abstract patterns.
Emotional intelligence and extraversion arent the same thing. People with autism can be extroverts, but their ei is lower than average
Im pretty sure he said emotional intelligence is looked at in psychology as more correctly described as 'agreeableness'.
That explains why there's such a high correlation between IQ and academic performance: it was made that way. That being said, I think the "job success" criteria is where it all falls apart.
Take Einstein, for example. His name is now synonymous to intelligence, and for good reason. You would think such a man would have the highest IQ possible, right?
Unfortunately, that's not the case. As a matter of fact, there are many people today with similarly high scores. But I can guarantee you that the vast majority of them will not have the same level of "success" as Albert did.
There is something else that is entirely immeasurable, yet deeply linked with intelligence. That is why IQ will never be a true reflection of a person's ability, but it will tell you how good you are at IQ tests.
Because success like that also requires other traits. Nobody is saying if you have a high IQ, you will necessarily be successful. You also need to be creative and disagreeable to some degree.
What Jordan Peterson is trying to say is people are NOT created equal. Some people are born smart, and some people are just not. It doesn't make one person BETTER than another, but it absolutely means that there are things that some people just can't accomplish.
Intelligence = academic success = economic success = better social status = higher happiness => successful life? Is this measurement of one's intelligence just a modern way of classification of people?
Had a guy in my home town who thought IQ was a vision test.......
His vision must be kinda bad.
@@gabrielkaz5250 I think it was. He said he failed the test.
I hope you didn't insult his father with a pap smear.
Maybe he thought about computer graphics or camera quality, because IQ is also used to refer to image quality.
i’m just looking at the comments and watching people try to make themselves look smart, it’s a sad world.
If we don't try, then we never will achieve. Failure is required for success.
edward heaney bruh
cashmoneyghost lmao I just noticed this too. I see so many comments trying to sound philosophical or scholarly it’s honestly kinda cringe.
Scroll down for people pretending to be smart bc it looks cool to be in the video
About the only thing I've read here that's honest
Statistics are important, but this speech has three problems:
1. Accepts as an axiom that performance is related with intelligence. I believe that is an opinion. For example, university is not only one. In careers as art the requirements to "success" are totally different than careers as engineer.
2. Denies the role of intelligence in successful social interactions. Isn't about personality in most of the cases. It's about take a series of logical and rational decisions to deal with a ton of complex input.
3. It's undeniable the relevance and utility of statistics in the current world. The problem is to understand a whole cognitive process from finite measured data, that is located historically in an specific moment and place. This approach takes us back to the pre-cognitive period. As an educator I can assure that intelligence doesn't work like this, and IQ is just a number that may show the abilities of a person to deal with specific problems. Without count that take pure evidence is almost impossible. Where is the pro Lem of the assessment?
Why is this even contraversial? This is pure common sense?
Actually is not , you just haven't quite understood the problem.
It's controversial I think because with IQ you can put a number people's intelligence that can be compared to other people's IQ. Due to how big a role intelligence plays in success in life and usefulness to other people a large part of a person's value to other people depends on his or her intelligence because it is closely correlated with ability. With higher IQ you will become better educated and get a higher paying job that helps more people. People aren't equal. That means that some people generally are inferior to other people and that is possibly the most controversial topic of any topic.
He has a persecution complex and his wife won't have sex with him any more
@@tarkamlokar9709 the school of science changes with the age tho and if one doesn't keep up then yea ,you will be considered to be dumb by the study of focus in the society. One who is a farmer is nuch smarter then a computet scientist if they were both trapped in the middle of nowhere.... in the days of antiquity astronomy was regarded as one of the most important sciences so people who map the sky were alot smarter then just math.
And to a greek philosophy was a much valued study then or things we would consider science today
That why it's controversial. He's using common sense, or just speaking factually. Both are enough.
1. Intelligence (IQ) vs. Hard Work, Motivation and Persistence = Success ?
2. Success in University = Happiness and fulfilment in life?
Measuring someone's IQ to forecast a future pattern, successes or failures just doesn't cut it for me. Many more things have to be taken into consideration. The real solution to success and self fulfilment is dedication, motivation and hardwork, across all walks of life and in all levels of IQ scores.
MONTERO _ what “cuts it” for you is irrelevant. What actually *is* relevant is the corpus of peer-reviewed scientific literature showing that IQ correlates with success, with conscientiousness being a much weaker predictor, but still significant
What is success?
Income?
Life satisfaction?
Life length?
Self-fulfillment?
Motivation and persistence does not lead to success if you’re not capable of solving problems. A fish can’t simply climb a tree if it keeps doing it day after day what is important is figuring out how it going to climb the tree. Success in university usually means success in life in all aspects, if you’re capable of solving problems you will know how to solve the problems and you will be happy and therefore success.
0:32 WTF was that sound XD
Brain-gasm during lecture
(Colourised)
It's like a very deep voiced baby laughing at something
ShadowboyTV lmaooo
The point at the end had amazing comedic timing 💀💀💀
Idk if he meant to diss that girl, but the "Obviously, if you have any sense"