Molten Speed Wax - The Epic Guide to Chain Waxing!
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- čas přidán 2. 02. 2018
- Links to the products in the video:
Molten Speed Wax - www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...
Lavany Wax Warmer - www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07...
Dry PTFE (Teflon) Powder - www.amazon.com/dp/B017C159RS/...
Dry Hexagonal Boron Nitride Powder - www.amazon.com/dp/B01N4CSJCB/...
Here's everything I have learned over the past couple years of using paraffin wax for my bike chains. I highly recommend wax over wet lubes, unless you habitually ride in wet, muddy conditions.
I'm trying Molten Speed Wax - so far, so good! It seems like a great product that saves some steps, compared to mixing your own paraffin with additives - which I also talk about in this video.
Thanks for watching - please like, subscribe, and comment! - Sport
A $3 crockpot from Goodwill works great. Put an elevated screen on the bottom of the crockpot to filter out the dirt. Filter the mineral spirits through a coffee filter.
Mr. BianchiRider I had a small crockpot before. The heavy stoneware liners in most crockpots are kind of a pain. Plus they tend to be much bigger than you need. Nothing wrong with the crockpot or double-boiler approach, but these cosmetic wax heaters are really nifty.
I've tried filtering the mineral spirits. A lot of the small fines go right through paper filters, and the mineral spirits takes forever to flow through. So usually I just decant the clear spirits carefully, and wipe out the fines left behind with a paper towel.
@@BikesBlades The bigger ones are good for doing multiple chains which makes the effort of doing this more worthwhile.
I prefer a cheap rice cooker. Melts the wax faster. Melt the wax (about 8 to 10 min). Put the chain in and immediately shut off the power. Remove the chain 20 min later.
Awesome Mr. B. Thanks. Now I can envision all sorts of ways to keep my mineral spirits clean.
Thanks for this great guide. I was hesitating for a while but now i’ll defenitly try.
I just realized a couple days ago that I've been using one form or another of chain wax for almost eight years.
Great presentation! Keeping this in the back of my mind. Using a wet lube now but my chain is a gritty mess after each ride. Cannot enjoy any hard pack dirt roads due to worrying about how much damage I am doing.....and that grinding noise!
I'm not 100% sure that wax is right for really dirty conditions. The main thing I like about it on the road is that the chain doesn't leave Fred marks on everything it touches... And technically it's very efficient. But in dirty or wet conditions, I think maybe traditional oil-based lubes are still best.
Awesome explanation! I use a 1/3 beeswax + 2/3 paraffin wax mix, which lasts for about 300km in mostly dry cross country mtb riding. Having said that, I believe different wax combinatioms should be used in different temperature ranges. Cheers!
There is no end to the experiments! :) Thankfully, I live in a climate that is basically warm year-round.
Awesome video. I have been interested in waxing my chain and found this while researching. My only suggestion would be to be careful with storing mineral spirits in a plastic container. I have used it for cleaning chains for a while and used to store it in cheap used yogurt or sour cream containers. I found that the mineral spirits would soften those considerably over time. Perhaps the tupperware plastic is a better formulation but I always use glass containers know. Thanks for the great info.
Michael Prucka thanks! I know the Rubbermaid container isn't perfect, but it's held up fine for a couple years now. I think disposable food containers are polystyrene, while Rubbermaid/Tupperware is probably polyethylene.
Hi, great video very helpful- thank you. I tried waxing my road bike chain, started off simply with just paraffin wax... very pleased with the results. I am a bit to novice to tell if doing this gave me any extra power, but the cleanliness is 100% worth it. I do have a few questions:
1- I want to try adding HBN next time I do this. What proportions of HBN to Paraffin wax do you recommend?
2- How much millage between waxing? Are there any telltale signs that indicate I need to re-wax?
3- I am completely sold on waxing, I now want to do this on my mountain bike. The terrain I ride in is mostly very wet and often very muddy; any suggestions?
Hello Tomasz - when I experimented with HBN, I bought a small 0.4oz container from derbydust.com, and added about half or so to two blocks of Gulf Wax (one half box). www.derbydust.com/shop/hex-boron-nitride-hbn-powder/
I know it's time to clean and re-wax a chain when I become aware of drive-train noise during rides. For me it's pretty obvious when I need to do it, but it's also subjective. Probably 300 miles or so.
For mountain bike use, I would suggest checking out some other CZcams videos that describe adding paraffin oil to the hard wax, to produce a softer and more tenacious paste. My conclusion with long, dirty gravel rides is that traditional wet lube might be better in those conditions.
Cheers for the vid!
Thank you!
I also have had no trouble just using a regular stainless pot, no messing around with double boilers or crock pots. I just use a regular digital cooking thermometer to get the temperature right. If you can heat cooking oil safely on the stove, you can heat paraffin wax safely too. Then I just leave the wax to harden in the pot inside a plastic bag to prevent contamination. And the pot is ready for the next time I will use it.
One thing I also tried to do is to preheat the chain that I am going to wax to about 200 degrees before I drop it in the wax, it comes up to temperature more quickly and I feel it sticks to the wax better.
Those are all good tips. My goal is to limit the number of steps and processes, so that waxing remains quick and convenient for me. But I applaud those (like yourself) who invest more time and effort in pursuit of excellence!
great video men!!
Thanks!
Yes, Sheldon Brown did say the lubricant a brand new chain came in was a good one; but back then Shimano actually used a wax lubricant on their brand new chains that lasted out of the box for at least a couple of hundreds miles; and a chain still looked as clean as new. I don't know if anyone remembers that. Now they switched to that sticky greasy stuff for some reason (to save on cost or something). I am not sure why.
Just put a new Shimano HG93 on. That stuff definitely smelt and felt like lanolin to me. It's a great corrosion inhibitor, but yeah, sticky as all shit.
I agree; that new-chain lube sure feels like lanolin. It probably isn't, but that's how it feels.
I was watching this as I was waxing my chain...good info. Do you do a final rinse in denatured alcohol ?
No, I don't. My experience is that the mineral spirits alone does a good job of cleaning the old wax and dirt off the chain; I don't feel that it's worth the extra time, mess, and expense to do additional rinses. I'd rather spend that time waxing more frequently... In other words, I could spend 40 minutes waxing my chain once a month with extra rinsing steps, or I can make the process simpler, and spend 20 minutes waxing my chain - and do it twice a month, for the same overall time spent. The latter gives a better "return on investment."
Everyone keeps talking about the cost but the lowest price I found for a pound of wax is $5.50 at Home Depot plus about $15 for the PTFE powder which is the same cost as this 1lb bag for about the same price
Look for Gulf Wax at your local grocery store. You can use it as-is, or add WS2, hBN, graphite, or PTFE...
www.heb.com/product-detail/gulf-wax-household-paraffin-wax/156662
www.derbydust.com/shop/hex-boron-nitride-hbn-powder/
I'm still using that first bag of Molten Speed Wax that I opened for this video in 2017. Only about halfway through it.
Superb video - thank you. I've just waxed my first chain (via the Oz Cycle videos). However, I didn't know about issues in the wet - I live in Hamburg (Germany). I'm guessing this will increase the frequency that I'll have to re-wax. If you have any thoughts it would be greatly appreciated. Thanks again - that was really helpful.
Hello Andy! I think if you follow the Oz Cycle recommendations and include paraffin oil in your mix, it will probably hold up better under wet riding conditions. I live in central Texas; we do get rain here, but not so often that we are forced to ride in it regularly. So for me, re-waxing after a rainy-day ride is an infrequent inconvenience. I'm general, I can remove, clean, and wax a chain with maybe five-ten minutes actual "touch time" so it's really not too onerous, anyway.
@@BikesBlades Thanks for coming back to me. I went all in - Petrol, degreaser, isopropyl and then a paraffin wax / PTFE mix - so fingers crossed. Either way, I'm with you - it should be a much easier process to keep everything clean and re-wax. Stay safe with all of the craziness going on and thanks again for coming back to me.
Thanks for the video. I found it to be very informative. What is the ratio of alcohol to Boron? Do you apply that some miles after you have a waxed chain? When you mentioned PTFE, was that before you started using Molten wax, or do you still add that to the wax? If so what is the ratio?
I only use the alcohol/HBN mix as a "quick fix" when my chain needs waxing, but I don't have time before my next ride. I just added a teaspoon or two of HBN powder to a couple ounces of drug-store isopropyl alcohol, and I shake it up before using it. The consistency is about like skim milk. I have not experimented with PTFE yet... so far, Molten Speed Wax has been working great, so I haven't felt a need to try it. But maybe someday!
I just use naptha (which I've found to be far better than mineral spirits, evaporates rapidly, and is a good wax solvent),in a small plastic bottle to soak, agitate, soak, drain, repeat with clean naptha if needed, then air dry. Lay the coiled chain on 3/8" thick cold paraffin in a 5" pan, put on low heat on a small electric hot plate until the wax melts and the chain sinks. Stir for several seconds with a medium hemostat, grab with it and lift slowly so extra wax drains off; lay down on layers of folded newspaper, wrap and agitate while blotting excess off - careful of the hot chain. After chain cools, hang until needed. Once mounted, a few yards of pedaling is all that's needed to loosen up the links. Done.
That works too! There's probably no wrong way. One risk of heating the wax directly on a hot plate or stove is that there's nothing to limit the temperature, so you can get it dangerously hot if you aren't paying attention. I'm a forgetful person, so I like a little safety margin. :)
Hey, nice video ! If you can use your kitchen stove (as I do too) melting your wax in a boiling bath-marries gets it to the perfect temperature, and it costs you just an old saucepan
Yes, that certainly works - but here are the drawbacks, as I see it:
1. You must work in the kitchen. That's OK for some people, but for others: their spouse/partner is not going to approve
2. You have one choice of temperature: boiling hot (100C, 212F)
3. Risk of fire if you spill or splash wax by accident
4. An old saucepan lacks the "cool factor" of a dedicated wax-warmer
I think there's always a way to save money by using an incorrect or inferior tool. But those short-term savings sometimes cost more in the long run. :)
@@BikesBlades I live at 1441 m asl which gives me more convenient 95°C. For 93°C I could set up a waxing station on my daily training course at 2100 m asl :) Water and hot wax in proximity remains a dangerous combination though.
To resolve the problems with the wife/partner it can be expanded into a combined hair removal and chain lubing session!
@@cls9474 ha ha, yes!
Thanks for the video... great info. I'm looking to move to waxing my chain and Molten Speed Wax seems like a great option. However, I've got some long multi day rides planned. What would recommend for someone that will be away from home for several days doing approximately 400 miles on their trip? How do you top off the chain if you are using the Molten Speed Wax? I liked you little bottle for quick application using your personal concoction. Can you provide measurements for your original recipe of waxing and for your little squirty bottle? Thanks again for the video.
Hi Tim! If I was going on a trip with a lot of riding and no way to do maintenance, I would bring a spare chain that is already prepared. That way you can swap when one chain gets "dry," and you have a backup. Honestly, I'd also bring (or buy upon arrival) a small bottle or can of liquid lube. I always have a squeeze bottle of Tri-Flow in my "bike box" just in case.
Regarding the mixtures I used... I answered this question for another viewer a while back, but it's buried in the replies now. Basically, I just "eyeballed" it on the HBN-alcohol mix. It has a consistency like skim milk.
I used a dropper bottle kind of like this: www.amazon.com/Needle-Dispenser-Solvent-Applicator-Dropper/dp/B00UG08QDC/ref=pd_lpo_sbs_201_t_1?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=T5QC0SDNJVXGXZSSQPK2
And you can get HBN powder from several sources: www.derbydust.com/shop/hex-boron-nitride-hbn-powder/
I have the exact same question. I asked it to MSW, and they said you could top up with UFO drip. But that's a little pricey for me. I'm still interested in anyone's experience topping up a waxed chain on a multi day ride with a drip lube.
I have just converted to wax. I used Gulf wax but I added some lamp oil (super clean kerosene) to lower the melting point to around 100F from Gulf's 130-140F. I got this from Oz Cycle's videos. This also makes the wax less flaky and the newly waxed chain more flexible. One comment below talks about riding in cooler temps and I think this lower melting point will help with that. I add lamp oil until the congealed mixture will smear on my finger without being flaky. Someone (Molten??) could expand this method by making a range of waxes with specific melting points. You can also put some of your mixture in solution in acetone or xylene for between off-bike waxing. I prefer acetone as it evaporates quickly at room temperature leaving pure wax behind with no solvent residue. In any case, I've got enough chain lube to last many years for about $9 at WalMart.
My understanding is that solid paraffin wax (e.g Gulf wax) is not soluble in acetone. Xylene works because it is a non-polar solvent. Have you been able to actually make an acetone-paraffin solution?
...in fact, mineral spirits might be the least-noxious way to make a liquid paraffin solution, but the downside is much slower evaporation.
Hi, will a 500ml capacity pot contain a chain or will I need a larger size? (great video by the way, lot's of worthy detail) IIt would be good if you added a list of the items you used in the comments (makes it easier for those who want to follow your guide)
A 500ml pot is more than enough. For comparison, the total volume of the pan in the wax warmer I show in the video is 575ml. But, I only have about 85ml of wax in there, and that's enough wax to immerse one road bike chain, about 114 links long. I've added links to the key equipment and materials described in the video.
I tried molten speed wax on my regular SRAM 8-speed chain. It went on well, hardened up and I cracked it off and tried to leave most of the pieces in the pot with the rest of the wax. However since I have found with hot wax in the past that it rusts on the surface after only a couple of days outside, I wet my fingers with a few drops of tri-flow and spread a very thin coat over the outside of the chain just to prevent surface oxidation. After a month or so it doesn't seem to have caused it to attract much dust like a regular oiled chain would.
I found in the past (before using MSW) that adding about 25% by volume of synthetic motor oil to regular paraffin brought the melting temperature down a bit and left it not completely dry on the surface - so that might be an option to prevent surface rust and improve low temperature performance.
@@Auriam that's a cool idea. I know some people blend solid paraffin with liquid paraffin (mineral oil, I guess?) to achieve the same thing... More of paste/gel consistency, and better corrosion resistance. Because you are 100% right: solid paraffin does not do a good job of preventing corrosion if the chain gets wet.
of course it is a bit of a trade off since having the oil film on the external parts of the chain does cause it to attract little bit of dirt. But not nearly as much as just oiling it completely with tri flow.
Great vid. I'd add a step - after the mineral spirit clean, place the chain in some methylated spirits (basically pure alcohol) - once you remove the chain from this bath the methylated spirits acts as an evaporative agent to remove any remaining mineral spirits. I'd also have the wax hotter. Personally, I would wipe the chain even with hotter wax (I hate build up of any kind flaking off).
Other than that, this is the best 'how to' video about chain waxing I've seen - great job.
Thanks! I might try your methylated spirits tip (denatured alcohol, here in the USA.) I already have a can of it in the garage.
The Denatured Dip after the Mineral Spirits dip is actually exactly what MSPEEDWAX tell you to do in their cleaning instructions. Definitely makes the process faster.
I might try it; so far, I haven't felt the need... the chain comes out of the mineral spirits pretty clean. For what it's worth, Molten Speed Wax also says:
"...a chain used for training or everyday use only needs to be cleaned once before waxing; from that point on it can simply be re-dipped without cleaning (the hot wax cleans the chain)."
The issue is that mineral spirits leaves a residue that inhibits the adhesion of the wax, adding the denatured alcohol bath removes this residue thereby increasing wax adhesion. And yes, once you have properly cleaned the chain from either new or used with drip lube you only have to re-wax it (training chains anyway).
One more question: How long do you leave the chain in the wax before you take it up again and let it dry?
Alexander Karlsson just long enough for the chain to come up to the wax temperature. Usually I put it in, start some other little task, and then come back to take it out in 5-10 minutes.
Thanks for this. I've been watching Oz Cycle's video on this paraffin wax lube subject.
Yes but he recomend PTFE what is cancerous and harmful for the environment.
@@Gieszkanne PTFE is hard to get and super expensive! but thats the combination the pros use. I believe molten speed wax makes powder with ptfe in it to add to your chain as well.
@@Gieszkanne PTFE isn't carcinogenic/toxic below 202°C (392°F). PFOA, which was used during PTFE production, was problematic too but has been eliminated by most of the manufacturers (because legislation put pressure on them). What I find problematic is the virtual non existent biodegradability of PTFE. So we should check the other recipes and their ingredients.
Oz Cycle is the "godfather" of the Chain Wax Mafia. ;)
Wow. That was a complete review. But... how much time will last that layer of wax? When will you need to do it again?. Because the whole process is long and messy (I've seen a whole bike build up in a shop in the same time). Thanks for the vid.
If I'm not making a video, I can get the chain off the bike, cleaned, waxed, and reinstalled in 30 minutes or so, with maybe 5-10 minutes of actual "touch time." One treatment lasts me several weeks of riding, especially if conditions are dry.
Yes, it's more bother than just dripping oil on the chain - but for me, the lack of mess is worth the extra work.
@@BikesBlades I absolutely agree on that. That black grease lives on my nightmares.
I think they say about 3-500 miles but you can do it as often as you want. After the initial stripping and waxing MSW says you can just warm up the wax and throw it back in without cleaning if its just a training chain.
I heard adding a bit of regular oil lube to this mix prevents rust, but I'm not sure which is best for that.
Hi! I would suggest adding some paraffin oil - namely, mineral oil. Check out "oz cycle" on CZcams; he has done a lot of really good experimentation with this: czcams.com/users/Musiksteven
The difference between pure paraffin and molten speedwax is the added teflon powder and molybdendisulfid but that only gets you 0,7W lower friction. Save your self a lof of money and simply use pure paraffin, it is almost as good and way cheaper.
True! but friction isn't the only factor in choice of chain lube. There's also wear-resistance and frequency of application. Part of the reason I'm interested in additives is that they might extend the useful life of the chain, and also might reduce the number of times I have to clean and re-lube, especially in wet or dirty conditions, where pure paraffin has trouble holding up.
Further - I think the bag of Molten Speed Wax was $20, which is certainly more expensive than pure paraffin - but still less than a tube of chamois cream! So, it's a minuscule contributor to my overall cycling expenditures. I'm not going to save "a lot of money" by using plain Gulf Wax. :)
Yes I guess that could be true. I tried get the additives in the start but have trouble finding them so I ended up using only paraffin. I use 4 chanins and distribute the km on them evenly to see how long I can keep my cassette and chainrings going :-).
@@Tearstank
You only need 5 grams of PTFE powder per kg of wax. At £3.96 per 100 grams (2019 prices),
the cost of Teflon is only 20p per kg of wax lube. Pretty reasonable in my opinion.
www.aliexpress.com/wholesale?catId=0&initiative_id=SB_20190215022346&SearchText=ptfe+powder
I had a friend that was X-country skier and had an extensive variety of waxes some very very expensive! He recently passed away and left it for me I'm guessing a lot of those waxes would work?@@BikesBlades
@@hedleykerr3564 Maybe! But I don't know anything about the waxes used for skiing. One guess would be that they might be formulated softer at lower temperatures for use in cold conditions, which could be useful.
What ratios or amount of PTFE and Molybdenum disulfide and Paraffin wax to make your own Molten speed wax? Any success stories?
I don't have any specific formulas. Because paraffin works great by itself, it's hard to go wrong by adding a little graphite, HBN, PTFE, or MoS2. Maybe there's some optimum recipe, but probably no one has done the scientific experiments to actually figure it out.
U should setup a test bench with old crank set so when the wax is hard you can run the it in.
That would be cool!
Another trick I tried is taking the chain out of the pot and laying it flat on a paper towel in a plate like you would with fried food. I feel that hanging it up will cause the coating of paraffin to be thicker on one side due to the weight of the chain pulling it down. I feel that laying it flat will let it cool down and Harden in a more symmetric position.
Yes, good theory. Because I remove the excess wax by wiping with a rag, I'm not as concerned about the wax getting thicker at the bottom of the chain as it hangs to cool.
I see what you're saying but what I mean is that I feel like the coating of wax underneath the rollers will be off-centered if it is biased by gravity hanging vertically... and that might cause the interior coating to wear off more quickly. But that's just my theory, I haven't done any kind of test with it one way versus the other - that would take a long time.
I've also heard that some people are using microcrystalline wax instead of paraffin since it is a bit more flexible, has a higher melting point, and sticks to metal better. It's got branched hydrocarbons instead of straight paraffin which is brittle and flakes off more easily.
Very interesting! I use Renaissance Wax for finishing/protecting knives, and I understand that's a form of microcrystalline wax. One counter-argument would be that microcrystalline wax is tackier than paraffin, which might take away from the cleanliness.
@@BikesBlades true, we would have to do some lab testing to see which one actually collects Road dust more. I guess you would have to actually vacuum up Road dust and apply it in some way since it would be very hard to accurately compare riding on actual roads with different bikes and riders over different terrain over a period of time
I think Absolute Black also uses microcrystalline wax in der Graphene Wax (not Graphene Lube). According to Adam Kerin from ZeroFrictionCycling the Graphene Wax is not that good, because it is too soft and does not prevent metal on metal contact as well. There's also a detail review on the Graphene Wax on ZeroFrictionCycling.
I think its a good idea to soften the paraffin a little bit (using softer paraffin or some microcrystalline wax), because i found my paraffin wax too hard and brittle when temperatures get under 8°C, especially near 0°C, wihich is quite common here in Germany in winter, so my chain was too stiff and not usuable in these conditions, because the chain jumps on the rear sprockets.
hi how long does this wax last on the chain, as i clean my bike once a week i usually clean the chain and reapply lube each wekk but how long would this last if i applied it
For me it lasts 3-4 weeks of riding, maybe 50-70 miles per week or more (100km in the "civilized" world). Definitely I have to re-apply wax if I ride in the rain or wet/gritty conditions. If you are in the habit of lubing your chain weekly, switching to wax will save you time and mess anyway, even if you stick with a weekly schedule.
Makes me appreciate ozcycles even more 😄
Clean with alcohol after mineral spirits, don't use high temperatures in the end before you get the chain out, it will just flow out of the upper links and if your chain is hard waxed like that, you might want to add additives to decrease the melting point ever so slightly.
On the other hand, it's not rocket science, and there is such a thing as diminishing returns. Half the comments on this video are from viewers who think I'm going way too far, and then there are viewers like you, that want to add even more steps and complexity to the process. So, tell us: what additives do you use to reduce melting point? What is your wax-bath temperature at time of chain removal?
@@BikesBlades well first: you should have done more research and experiments in my opinion. It's not about adding to the complexity but optimizing certain steps and use common sense (for example you don't try to wash your clothes with muddy water).
Anyway. If you use paraffin oil, things get much smoother and less rigid, as does the type of wax you use. Homemade recipes let you control that, dunno about the bought wax products. In really hot summer conditions, I add one in six parts stearine wax for example to increase the melting point slightly. Regarding the temperature: just before the paraffin changes from liquid to solid, which is dependant on the amount of oil and additives you put in, but usually 48 to 56 degrees Celsius in my garage :)
@@audio4apes - now, that's a useful reply. ;) What do you consider to be hot conditions? Here in central Texas, it's typically 38C from late May through September.
@@BikesBlades that's hot. I wouldn't leave the house that hot. Guess the hard way is perfect for your area.
Just a reminder, thoroughly cleaning your chain with alcohol and hot water after the degreasing let's the hot wax penetrate the chain much better. You will see the difference in wear and chain noise.
@@audio4apes i agree! the point of waxing is to make it penetrate deep into the metal pores. don't need to have a coat on the chain. like this it creates an auto-lubrication effect. the more the metal gets scratched, the more wax it liberates.
Thanks for the video.
Just to clarify. Can you reheat the same wax again the next time you have to wax your chain?
Yes, absolutely! I turn off the wax warmer and let the Molten Speed Wax return to the "not molten" state. :) Then next time I need to wax my chain, I just plug it back in and heat it back up to 200F. The additives settle out, so I just stir it before I put the cleaned chain in, and then agitate the chain a bit while it's in the wax (just like in the video, for example around 19:00.)
You can get several chain waxings out of one fill in the wax warmer - and the bag is big enough to fill the warmer two or three times. So it's a good supply; probably I'll get a couple years out of this bag, for the three bikes I'm maintaining.
Thanks!
I use mom's crockpot and premium mower gasoline, cuts like a buffalo. Using Squirt, will try Smoove, lighter viscosity and will try MSWax.
Awesome! But gasoline is such a nasty solvent to work with. Be careful, anyway.
My only concern on this video is the cleaning of the chain. With this method is the chain really clean? No degreaser has been used. Is a degreaser needed with this method of cleaning?
So, my thinking is that a "degreaser" would be required if there was any grease involved in the process. Degreaser is just a trade word for a solvent. Mineral spirits is a great solvent for paraffin. So it's a de-waxer. All I can say is: the chain gets pretty darn clean. You can try it yourself.
I spy Hammer Recoverite! :-) My favorite company!
I don't use all the Hammer products, but I really like Recoverite. I think it appears incidentally in three or four of my videos!
do you recommend waxing for motorbike chain ? if so, shall we follow the same process ?
Hi! I don't work for Molten Speed Wax, I'm just a customer. So I can't comment on whether it is suitable for motorbike applications. But my guess is that it's not a good idea; you should probably stick to traditional motorcycle chain lube.
@@BikesBlades This chain might have two O rings per pin and the heat might harm the rubber, not sure, ask manufacterur. Moto chains are pretty $$.
@@rterry2752 Yes, good point! Unlike motorcycle chains, bicycle chains have no o-rings.
Good video, although I would do more cleaning ahead of waxing. My experience is that the factory grease is extremely difficult to remove and requires a 3x alcohol treatment with vigorous shaking and hours in the alcohol to be fully removed.
I think you are probably right - to COMPLETELY remove the factory grease, I'd have to do more cleaning cycles. But I simply have not found it necessary - a little grease in the wax doesn't hurt anything. Also - just for what it's worth - alcohol is a polar solvent, while mineral spirits are non-polar... So the mineral spirits do a pretty good job of stripping the grease. Isopropyl alcohol won't be as effective.
I noticed OZ dipped the chain in cold water after the wax dip. His reason was to freeze the wax at the links before it drains out.
That's an interesting theory, but the downsides of getting water inside the freshly lubricated chain outweigh any potential benefits of suddenly solidifying the wax. Anyone who has ever tried to clean a chain knows it's just about impossible to remove stuff from inside the links and rollers - In my experience, the paraffin doesn't "drain out" while it cools naturally.
This does result in excess wax all over the chain.
Yes that was his more recent vid but the one from 2 years ago he did not do that. Even my pea brain questioned his sanity after seeing that! Then he took a brush to each link to clean off excess wax! At that point it crossed my mind that viewers were being played but on second thought - nope, he was serious!
How do you re-wax your chain when the wax needs to be re-applied?
Easy! Just repeat this process. The mineral spirits dissolve the old wax, cleaning the chain for re-application. (Chain removal and replacement is simple if you use a Wipperman Connex link or KMC "master" links that are compatible with your chain.)
Thanks for your quick response. Based on your experience after about how many *dry* miles do you have to repeat the process? I've read *somewhere* that waxed chains are noisy- true? I do appreciate your input, and thanks for sharing the crockpot-type wax melter. All good info!
@@rononyourleftretired5144My waxed chains actually run really quiet, at least for several weeks. When I start to hear more noise, it's time to re-wax.
1. You could use coffee filter paper to filter the crud from your used mineral spirits.
2. A cheap rice cooker also works quite well to melt wax.
Mike W Ellwood - I've tried paper coffee filters. Surprisingly, a lot of the fines seem to go right through. Plus, the mineral spirits do not flow well in the filters, so you either have to wait forever, or you have to throw away a certain amount of the mineral spirits each time. I have had better luck just carefully decanting the clear fluid off the top of my storage container, and then wiping out the sediment.
True enough. It can take quite a long time to filter through, and then you are probably losing a lot due to evaporation.
@@mikewellwood1412 Use an Aeropress to do this.
Would it help to run the mineral spirit through a coffee filter between uses?
Hi Larry! I have tried this. For whatever reasons, the mineral spirits don't flow through the filter very well, so it takes forever. What has worked well is placing magnets underneath the mineral spirits container when I'm not actively cleaning a chain, to attract any metal "fines." I'm thinking about making a video about this, but it's a niche topic, so I'm not sure that many viewers would be interested.
@@BikesBlades I tried this and it was a complete mess.
@@dcolum23 Yeah, filters just don't work very well.
Nice apron.
Thanks!!! 😆
from my research Mineral spirits or paint thinner - Never recommended for cleaning a surface because it can leave an oily residue. ... Typically not used for cleaning tools and equipment. Curious, have you thought of using a degreaser then rinse with water let dry and then soak in wax. I think I will go that route. Thanks for the video
Hi Richard - this is a frequent topic in the comments on this video. Here are my thoughts... First, it's a chain - we are trying to lubricate it - so what's wrong with an imperceptible "oily residue?" Second - the chain goes into a hot wax bath at 200F (93C), so any remaining mineral spirits get evaporated or dissolved into the wax pool pretty quickly. Finally - as I have discussed before: typical degreasers are almost completely ineffective on wax. It comes down to the difference between polar and nonpolar solvents. Polar solvents like acetone and alcohols are pretty good on greases and oils, but they have little or no effect on long-chain hydrocarbons like paraffin... for which you need a nonpolar solvent like mineral spirits or xylene. Using water at any point in the waxing process seems like a recipe for corrosion. But that's just, like... my opinion, man. :) And on the subject of acetone - I know from personal experience that acetone leaves residues that interfere with paint adhesion, so it's not the panacea some people think it is. And acetone stinks.
I am waxing my chains with $2 paraffine candle from ikea. Is moltenspeedwax any better for this?
Well, yes. "Better" for sure. But the question you are asking is probably more like "is Molten Speed Wax $18 better?" And that's harder to answer. For me, I'm still on my first bag, so it's a good value in my judgement.
Bikes & Blades thanks! It’s actually $18 plus $26 international shipping :) but anyway I decided to give it a try with a hope the wax stays for a bit longer due to extras added to it.
How much boron nitride powder do you need for the amount of iso-alcohol?
I was very unscientific about it... I have a small squeeze bottle with a metal "straw" tip about 1mm in diameter, and it holds maybe 1-2oz of isopropyl alcohol. I just added "some" HBN - perhaps a teaspoon or two. It looks like skim milk. Keep in mind that the HBN won't stay suspended, so you always have to shake it before use.
www.johnsonplastics.com/2oz-hypo-applicator-bottle-empty?m=Abstract&gclid=Cj0KCQjw28_XBRDhARIsAEk21FjACaso71Lq9O89ifMYrN3ZhGNKwRmDMToLgFIsXrr7baLRGBZ6gg8aAuSIEALw_wcB
Thank you!
www.derbydust.com/shop/hex-boron-nitride-hbn-powder/
How long does it last? How often do you have to reapply?
Generally I can go 300 miles or more before I start hearing chain noise; telling me it's time to re-wax. So, depending on how much riding I'm doing, it's every month or so. If I ride in the rain, that kind of wears it out fast. It's not a great solution for wet conditions.
@@BikesBlades thanks
can it be done without of use of pots, fryers.
i think that somebody should invent some procedure that is easier and faster to clean and wax chain on bike in 15 minutes
Well, if ease and speed of application is what you want, there's nothing wrong with plain old liquid chain lube. And I know that some others posting cycling content on CZcams have figured out some clever solutions of paraffin and xylene that go on liquid, but dry to solid wax.
i use inductive heater to heat up chain on bike, and put wax on when is warm to melt it, check it on(czcams.com/video/ORA6xFPTZXU/video.html), it can be done on parking lot, it just need 12v current
@@BikesBladesthis is what Oz Cycle has shown. Worth a watch if you've got some time. It's a good stand by quick fix if you want to clean your chain and rings without removing chain and then re-apply with the squirt bottle.
Are you faster on the bike with wax chain?
In theory, yes! Ha ha... But for me it's not about going faster. I like the cleanliness.
can you use a regular pot on the stove with low heat?
Yes, but be careful. It's safer to put the wax in a small pot, then place that in a boiling water bath in a larger pot. That limits the temperature and reduces the risk of fire.
@@BikesBlades nice tip! thanks buddy.
DO NOT do this on an open flame, burn the house down will piss off the wife big time !
Oz Cycle has done a video on Molten Speed Wax and compared it to two other lubrication methods, one of which is his personal homemade wax formula. Here's a link to that video - czcams.com/video/953QTThT4_M/video.html
In that video he shows how his new formula is better than MSW when it comes to chain wear. He shows how MSW is light-years better than oils of different types, but his homemade wax does show less wear than the MSW. He hasn't released his formula yet and I suppose one could use that to call his results into question. But the guy has lots of good advice and seems to be just another biking fanatic who wants to share his knowledge, just like you Mr. Bikes & Blades.
Yes, Oz Cycle is a great CZcams channel - and he seems way more passionate about chain waxing than me! I'll watch that comparison video soon.
Have you looked into graphene
I think graphene is a word for a single-layer molecule of hexagonal carbon; in other words, graphite is just multiple layers of graphene. I have not tried adding graphite to wax, but it should work similar to hexagonal boron nitride, etc.
How much time does it take to dry? I have no garage, and small kids, so I need to do these while they are sleeping :)
Hello Edson Ochoa! Maybe it helps to explain that the wax doesn't "dry," it re-solidifies as it cools down... Just like wax dripping from a candle. It does take a few minutes for the chain to cool down, maybe 5 minutes or so. A fan or a cooler environment obviously speeds this up.
Yeah, I understand that. Just didn't explain myself properly :) My concern was more if I had to let the chains hang overnight after cleaning to dry, and then more after waxing. But I guess I can do this in the evening when the kids are in bed :) Thanks!
I usually don't worry too much about letting the mineral spirits dry off completely. Immersion in the hot wax essentially "boils off" any remaining solvent.
Have you seen them chill the chain in cold water afterwards? It seals the chain more in wax.
Someone asked me this before. I think it's a bad idea - more wax crusted on the outside of a wet chain seems messy and silly, and is more likely to cause corrosion. But to each his own. :)
How many km can you ride with one waxing?
Hi Martin - it depends on conditions. If it's dry riding, probably about 500km. If I ride in the rain, I usually plan on re-waxing the chain soon after. My indicator is noise: on my 1x11 bike, a freshly-waxed chain is virtually silent. When I start to become aware of any chain noise (not squeaking or creaking, just the whir of the chain becoming audible again), I know it's time to clean and wax.
i tested wax/parafin oil in 50/50 on hg70 and if rewax every 100-110km it can last duble at least, but when made over 180km chain was destroyed
I ride a recumbent trike so my chain is about 2 3/4 chains long. Is there enough room for that?
The Avani wax-warmer I bought has moderate capacity... You can see in the video that I only use about one third of the total volume. For your recumbent chain, you'll need to add more wax compared to what's needed for a typical 114-link road bike chain. I would suggest starting with a modest amount of wax, then add your chain, then add wax until it is submerged adequately. You might also want to check out Silca's new wax, which ships in a "sous vide" bag, so you can put the whole thing in a pot of hot water, with your chain in the bag too. czcams.com/video/fAyjdmbm0CY/video.html
Acetone will clean more quickly and is not known to be carcinogenic. It is an exceptional degreasing solvent and will dry quickly without residue.
This question has come up before. Acetone does not dissolve paraffin. Acetone is a polar solvent, and it is ineffective on paraffin wax.
@@BikesBlades, it is a better solvent to prepare for waxing. The cleaning in this video is not of the wax.
Ah, OK! I agree, for the initial degreasing of a chain that has traditional "wet" lube on it, using acetone could be an improvement.
The best cleaner for metals is inustrial acetone. Works great!
I may be wrong, but I don't think paraffin is soluble in acetone. Mineral spirits are far less noxious, and in fact do dissolve/remove the old paraffin quickly.
Isn't PTFE bad for the environment?
It's certainly accused of environmental harm. But the quantity here is really small, and it's trapped in wax, so I'm not too worried about it. Let's face it - most bicycle lubricants are also pollutants and possible carcinogens, technically speaking.
@@BikesBlades Thanks for the response. I've been thinking about using a wax lubricant. What are your thoughts on topping up with Squirt lube, have you tried it?
@@tomh9487 I haven't tried it, but it looks intriguing... www.squirtcyclingproducts.com/portfolio_page/squirtchainlube/
It seems to me that if you hang it and let it drip dry hot, all that wax you worked so hard to into all the links, will drain out and not provide the most lubricant possible. I have been waxing my chains for about a year. I turn the pot off and let the wax cool and then take it out and immediately lay it flat on a piece of cardboard to minimize internal wax loss.
Interesting. In my experience, the wax stays in the links and rollers very well. In fact, I usually wipe down the chain with a paper towel while the wax is still molten - but there is still enough wax left to make the links rigid when it cools. There's really no way to "remove too much" of the wax.
No paraffin oil?
Hi Andy - I've seen other tutorials and videos that use some paraffin oil to soften the hard paraffin wax, and I think it's interesting - especially to make a liquid "refresher" lube to use between full "hot wax" treatments. But for me, a major attraction of using paraffin wax is the dry, non-greasy nature of it. If I "liquify" or soften the wax, it might last longer, but then I worry that I'd be back to having a dirty chain that leaves "Fred marks" on everything it touches.
Bikes & Blades same here. I don't really care about the watt or so it saves, but not having to clean the chain is a real plus. I have tried both with and without oil, I must say the chain is not noticeably dirtier, while it does reduce flaking. Also paraffin wax is very sensitive to temperature change, if you use wax in colder weather, I think it's quite important.
Andy Ma that's good to know. I might try introducing paraffin oil. Maybe. :) (It's pretty hot here in Texas, nearly year-round.)
@@andyma1986 How much paraffin oil is used, as a comparison to how much paraffin is melted?
some people like to add a lot, until it is the consistency of solid coconut oil, but I think at that point it will start to get sticky and attract dirt. I like to add just a little. There's no right answer really, just add a little every time and if you don't like it, just add a little bit more. Paraffin wax is very sensitive to change in temperature, so I adjust the amount depending on the time of the year. Make sure to give it a good shake or stir, otherwise you will have oil floating on the top and won't do much.
Or you can skip all the fuss and just use Squirt wax lube as I do for years... ;)
The curious thing is: I see this process as fun, not "fuss."
@@BikesBlades But it could be a solution for a re-wax on long rides. I do a lot of long distance rides - just came back from a 2 times 650 km (400 miles) trip which is on the upper end of the waxing range. And I had some pretty rainy passages midways...
@@cls9474 I agree! You may have noticed that I described my own mix of HBN and isopropyl alcohol that I use for quick touch-ups between waxing, as needed.
@@BikesBlades Yes, I took some notes from this comment section (and your video of course - thanks btw!). It's a pretty new field (outside the pro circus) and probably subject to a lot of new innovations. There are still some issues to be solved for me as a long distance speed cyclist who cycles in the Swiss and European alps where it can rain a lot as well. In short: re-waxing and rain endurance are the two fields which I follow extensively. And I can't probably carry so many spare chains with me to accommodate latter. But perhaps some sort of re-heating and re-flowing with a blow torch could be a solution. Or hi-jacking the kitchen in a hotel :) As said before: lots of fields to explore here.
@@cls9474 Silca just came up with a great idea: their wax is packaged in a "sous vide" bag that you can drop into a pot of boiling water. Pretty clever.
fastest way to melt wax is microwave...and costs you nothing really just find a container that you can use over and over and can handle the heat.
Adam Grayman I suppose. With the extremely high thermal expansion of paraffin, that could result in a waxsplosion in your microwave. Plus you have no way to keep it hot while the chain is immersed, unless you want to microwave your chain too.
Cheaper is rarely better. ;)
Here's the thing: microwaves work by flipping polar molecules (water) back and forth with radio-frequency energy. Paraffin wax is a long-chain non-polar molecule, so it really won't absorb the RF energy properly. General Electric, for one, specifically says "don't do it."
products.geappliances.com/appliance/gea-support-search-content?contentId=18773
old pliers and a large paper bag. If you have a wife, she is not going to like that chain hanging over her kitch floor! Large oval sardine can on an electric stove works just fine and at low temps is completely safe.
I'm sure you are right - but I have really enjoyed the convenience of the portable, "standalone" wax-warmer.
@@BikesBlades I don't have the link handy, but I have been using a 3 part mixture of paraffin, mineral oil and white gas, roughly equal parts, but I have to warm it in the squeeze bottle before application. Chain stays on the bike. It's been the best lube that I have ever tried, cheap and lasts 3x longer than other lubes I was using in dirt. A bit more adherent than just plain paraffin, but much more convenient. Oz cycle youtube channel, but don't use xylene!
Bro just use new mineral spirits for gods sake lmao
I don't like to throw away chemical solvents (into the environment) if I don't have to. For me, letting the sediment settle out and decanting the spirits works well.
what will tell you your wife when see what you are cooking in her kitchen
Ha ha! The great thing about the "cosmetic" wax warmer is that you can set it up anywhere. I usually don't work in the kitchen, but I did when shooting this video. ;)
Remind her that it’s not 1919 and it’s your kitchen too. Then remove your balls from her jar and place them back where they belong.
Misspelled molybdenum. Amateur.
Darn it! Yes, oops... you're the first to notice in five years!
I use used synthetic motor oil 😈
Yeah, that probably works fine! I just really like the "no mess" aspect of solid paraffin.
@@BikesBlades I ride in the mud. Synthetic oil seems to really stick to the metal better than most.
Molten speedwax is both worse performing and more expensive than regular parafin wax.
It attracts more dirt, and the chain wears out faster.
Don't buy commercial chain wax, make your own.
Look, if you can back that up with any kind of evidence or test results, I'll let your comment stand. Otherwise, I'm deleting this as idiotic trolling.
moltenspeedwax.com/pages/velo-lube-test-2
@@BikesBlades I havent written anything on it, but after trying both molten, and a regular parafinwax mixture and cleaning the chain after the same amount of dry road riding, the molten was slightly dirtier, and more expensive.
I'm not saying it's bad, just that you can make a better product cheaper if you put in the work.
Edit: also, the chain wear was slightly more with the molten speed wax, both waxes are far superior to any oil.