Can You Tell the Difference? Montage M vs Montage M ESP Plugin: A/B Challenge
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- čas přidán 27. 05. 2024
- Yamaha has released the Montage M ESP plugin for DAWs, a plugin version of their new Montage M. It purports to be a perfect replica of the Montage M. In this video, I create a multi-part performance, load it into my Montage M as well as the ESP plugin, and run tests: analog recording, digital USB recording, and ESP recording. Play along with my challenge and see if you can tell the difference!
Montage M6: amzn.to/3RTKaZt
Montage M7: amzn.to/46tAwkI
Montage M8x: amzn.to/3ZSOj1w
My keyboard Z stand: amzn.to/3Ix5xuF
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0:00 Intro
0:41 How I set it up
3:11 ESP Setup
3:49 Three Recordings
5:24 The Test
5:36 Recording #1
6:39 Recording #2
7:44 Recording #3
8:49 The Answers
9:33 Side by Side Comparison
10:36 The Differences
11:09 Montage M DAC
#Yamaha #Montage #ANX - Hudba
By the way - those of you who thought you could identify the answer by looking at the various level meters in Cubase as it was playing - I'm on to you. I realized this in an early edit of this video, and went back to change it, so it uses the same piece of video for all three tracks. :)
Great video Scott. As a Developer I have always said that Halion 7 and the Montage M are the same “core”. This just nailed it for me.
Nice test tune! I am still blown away how great the Montage M ESP sounds and it's just on first release. Glad they fixed the transfer between the synth and the plugin, it's so awesome to have the freedom to sound design late at night in "chill mode" then push the patch to the synth next day.
Really...thanks, I guess. I just played some random stuff in to have something to hear with the different engines. Wasn't actually meant to be a song. :)
@@ScottsSynthStuff the baseline was catchy and had an arcade feel to it. It wasn’t a jab or anything.
Love your channel Scott!! Thank you.....
Fantastic comparison, Scott. For me it was 3, 1, 2. Really appreciate the detailed testing. Thank so much. Ben
Perfect contribution. Now we know that ESP plays like the hardware. It was probable but not sure. Still asking myself if price of hardware is acceptable...
Thx for the comparison. I turned on my Bowers & Wilkins Zeppelin, and I seriously could not tell any difference in the sound quality.
It’s not huge difference, but to me track number 2 (analog recording) sounds the best.
Would you make a comparison between the System 8 analog modeling plugout synths with Hydrasynth? But it would be nice if you would include both plugout synths that have the new feature of aging such as Jupiter 8 and Juno 106, but please include also some plugouts from older Roland classic synths from 70s such as Jupiter 4, System 100, SH2 plugouts, that have more raw sound. It would be really interesting to compare System 8 with the Hydrasynth and which synth sounds warmer and more analog. Until now I couldn’t find a video that would compare those two synths. :)
For me it's: 1, 2, 3. Thank you!
#2 sounds slightly different and I immediately thought that’s the analogue chain. Can’t tell 1 and 3 apart.
I was distracted during the first part of your video, so really just knew you were playing three songs for comparison … the second sounded better than the first to me, and the third sounded much the same as the first. 🤷🏻♂️
Hey Scott, thank you for your great videos! Do you happen to know if the new FMX sounds for Montage M are also available for the old Montage? Greetings from Berlin
The FM-X engine is unchanged (except for polyphony) so yes, they can be played on older Montage's (and MODX).
@@ScottsSynthStuff Thank you!!
Hey Scott, any plans to restore any synths this year (if so, are you willing to share the potential plans)? I really liked your restoration vids.
I haven't got any plans at the moment - busy restoring my airplane right now! Lots of videos of that going on in my Canard Boulevard channel if you care to watch. :)
The only difference I could hear though my Apple earbuds was in the Montage lead sound when you hit the chords in the middle of that track. It seemed a little less dynamic in the first pass compared to the other 2, but that could maybe just be gain staging.
#1 was the "harshest" sounding, especially in the bass line. Personally, I kind of liked the bass in #1 the most because of the extra umph, it did have the most noise in the trail-off after the last note. #2 was the "tamest" sounding one; nothing really to report otherwise. #3 was the most "balanced" sounding one, it sat right in-between #1 and #2. #2 and #3 had a smoother noise falloff at the end.
The ESP was my #1, the Digital USB recording was my #2, and the analog recording was my #3, in order of best to worst. Yeah the ESP version just sounds the best, to me.
It would be nice to understand how many instances of Montage Vst plugins can be played before to saturate the cpu. Also what happens if you set your daw at 96 or 192Khz? Does the Montage Vst run good?
Hi Scott. Thanks for the nice video. How useful are the preset performances in the M, -especially if your a 80's synthwave nerd? I really could use a synth with good inspiring performance presets that could be used for kick-starting. Nobody really have gone through the performances, -but everyone is always focusing on the same stuff such as the piano sound etc, and showing off their playing skills...crazy boring by the way.....That's really a shame I think, now that the Montage-M can do so many things. best Regards Thomas
I think the main reason you aren't seeing people going through presets is because there are THOUSANDS of sounds, tens of thousands of arps, and pretty much unlimited combinations of effects. I think if you have a sound in mind, you're going to find it in the Montage M, or at least something close that you can tweak.
Listening with a pair of Etymotic in ear monitors, the ESP sounds very slightly richer than the analogue.
Wouldn’t be the easiest way to check if it’s the same to change phase on one of them and do a null test ? Layering then both should result in zero sound if they are the same.
Scott cannot get ESP to work at all
Downloaded by stienberg authorised installed but 4 DAW will scan it but DAW says tell me appears to be a VST 3 but won’t show up to use
Called steinberg
They said all good there end and should work
Opened a case with Yamaha they not got back to me yet
Do you know of anyone else with this issue I have hundreds of plug in no issues except this one
I've not heard of this happening at all - it installs and works in every VST host that I've tried.
What your computer setup ? My current computer 2017 MacBook Pro runs it but not very efficiently
It's actually fairly new, on a Ryzen 7950. I did a video on it here: czcams.com/video/AzavwxLTIic/video.html
-- Your t-shirt keeps changing color! I saw this happen in a previous video of yours too. Are you changing the color on purpose, or is this just a fluke? I’m just curious. 😊
It's just for fun. :)
What is the secret?
I would like to hear you play the same piece either a cheap workstation plug-in like XPand!2, which sells for about $10. I bet you could get pretty close.
Xpand2! cheap? Yes, the current price is cheap. It's said to be the most sold instrument plugin ever and the sound quality is top notch. Xpand2! is no Yamaha emu, though, so a comparison wouldn't make sense.
Now you need to run it through some fancy preamps and see if blows away all 3. :D
Mate , where did you get your shirt of a different colour?
I need to know how this is done as well.
Adobe Premiere. :)
@@ScottsSynthStuff premium FX from a premium product :)
I can't hear any difference between the digital recordings. The analog recording is marginally different, sounds a bit less harsh maybe? But overall I'd say all these are equivalent.
I picked out the ESP quickly as number 3 as I work with a lot of VST's and recognized the more expansive detailed upfront sound right away.
LOL!
So they replicated the Montage M in software, but unlike the Minifreak plugin, they won't let you purchase it separately? That's... disappointing.
Not yet, anyway. I suspect they will...eventually.
I can't do this test myself, because I have a real problem with the USB ASIO driver, with the Montage M, on my Windows 11 Asus Zenbook Pro Duo, with an 11th Gen i9-11900H @ 2.50GHz, and 32GB of DDR4! I can't for the life of me, get rid of the pops and clicks, no matter if my buffers size is 8, 2048, or anything in between!! This is consistent across both my DAWs, Cubase and Ableton, when trying to play any VST's (not just the ESP). This is NOT a problem when using any other interface, INCLUDING the original Montage!! Has anyone else had this problem with the M?
I had a similar problem that you are having a while back. Even though my system is more powerful than yours with more ram, I found my audio interface usb cable was not plugged in all the way. The first thing I would do is check your usb cable for your audio interface. If that does not work try a new cable. I ran all my plugins and synths on my old computer which was much less powerful than yours now and it all worked without crackleing. So I was going nuts with the crackleing and pops when all I had to do was plug my usb cable in all the way. It was almost in but not quite all the way. It could be you have some other settings to high, but I doubt it. Hope this helps
I suspect that Montage m is a type of computer with ESP-montage software installed..😂
Montage, Montage M and MODX are at their hearts, Linux computers running software and interfacing with DSP chips. Those systems were NEVER meant to run on anything except their dedicated hardware platforms. The fact that Yamaha has managed to build the same control system and DSP functionality into a VST for multiple platforms is a pretty amazing feat.
I aks my self why Yamaha makes a very expansive synth when thy can make the same on a plugin.
I think there's something wrong with my monitor...
so...is the point of this video to say that there isn't a real reason to spend $4-5k on the hardware when the plugin version will do basically the same thing and sound basically the same? If so, when in the heck will the non-M-buying those of us get the opportunity to buy the plugin? Seems silly to withhold it from those who don't want the redundancy of both hardware and software...
Yamaha wants to sell the expensive hardware versions as much as possible before starting to sell the cheaper VST alternative.
It’s hard for me to focus on anything you are saying because your color-changing shirt is so distracting….
It is funny you say that. I did not notice it for a long time and even when I did it was not distracting from what the post is about. It is kewl now that I have noticed it, but forget all about it after a few seconds.
This T-shirt thing is getting old. We saw it. Thanks. Lets focus on the video's content. Your production value is suffering and the masking could be better if changing the color is a priority. Perhaps it isn't.