Voge 300 Rally or Honda CRF 300 Rally - It doesn't really matter which
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- čas přidán 6. 12. 2023
- Just a rough chop of some footage I got whilst out with mate on the CRF and the Voge, riding a few local lanes. I was just interested in a second opinion on the bikes. Ben's input is good because he's coming at it from a semi novice perspective - which is the market these bikes largely appeal to - so I was keen to hear what he thought and he could see much difference.
Quick conclusion; he's bought a Voge.
Voge is probably the ideal intro low cost bike. I like my Honda Rally but to make it a more complete bike you have to improve the suspension and then the price differential becomes even greater. As you say people, like me, will go for the known brand of Honda, as its reliable, safe and good availability of parts but you cannot rest on your laurels too long with competition like Voge and CF Moto coming along.
I have the rally, wanna race ?
Great to hear someone elses opinion on this bike
Think the tide is changing and people are realising that they don't need to spend loads of money to enjoy the lanes
Voge seems to be a good package
commie lover
Yourself & Ben certainly gave them a good outing, enjoyed watching & Hearing Ben's opinion 👍👍
Just had my running in service done on the voge. At 6'3", coming off a cb650r... it's like an arm chair! Proper comfy /great position for a big un. Added bar risers and a couple of bits and love it.
At 6'3' with a dodgy knee and not a lot of money the Voge gets my vote, hoping to buy one in the next few weeks😁
Brilliant review 👍.... Really good to hear from someone riding older machinery, great vlog👍👍👍👍
Thanks 👍
Got to love the little Honda Rally. Have taken mine all over the place in Australia. Cheers for the up-load 😎👍
The real difference is just one: for the honda you can find tons of aftermarket stuff (even new ECUs and big bore kits!), while the offer for the Voge is still very limited.
My preference is for the Voge, but the idea of mounting a new ECU on the Honda is so appealing!
Great real world review guys, very enjoyable watch
Cheers peter
Great piece, Nathan, thanks for sharing. Your student was a natural on cam & audio; fair play to him. Those Voges seem to be defying their price-tags, eh mate? Exactly as your student intimated; most folk buying i to that category and level of biking, I think are going to have his point of view. Take care, nate.
Great video Nathan, very informative. Thanks👍
Nice to see these ridden back to back, good video. It's great to see good choices coming through for trail bikes.... I've had my '18 plate crf250rally for 2 years, realistically for trail it was that or a himi or wait half a season for the crf300's ...now there's the Voge, benelli have a 300 trailie on the way and the CF moto & RE on the way at the heavier end 🏍😁, competition is good, maybe the rest of the Japanese manufacturers will realise there's a segment they're missing out on.
If I was starting on to trails now I think the Voge has it, if its going to land in a hedge anyway you just want something to get going on.
I think what you do is genuine adventure.i like your outlook on things. I hate bike snobbery and like these small cheaper bikes. All off road riders know the tougher it gets the smaller and lighter the bikes need to be.
Nice vid Nathan and Ben. I bought a 300 Rally after spending too much time getting stuck under my Africa Twin. It was a revelation in terms of confidence and being able to go off exploring the lanes. I only potter about on the lanes and I’m certainly no enduro rider, but I have on occasion found the limits of the suspension. I’ve decked mine out in the OM crash bars and a set of decent handguards/bars and foot pegs. I’m toying with the idea of the suspension upgrade now too. The Voge wasn’t available a couple of years ago when I got my Rally. It would have given me plenty of food for thought if it had been. Real world reviews such as yours are a great help. Who knows what route I would have gone down…..?
A slippery and muddy one for sure, but on what bike…??
Great to see Ben again, he's a top man. Do we need to expect a spin off channel Ben's Blasts?
Very good video, useful information. In my case, I consider the weight I'd be putting on a bike. I'm 6'3' and a heavier chunk than Ben. If he's bottoming out on that ride, I'd be taking a pounding on the CRF. Stock Voge or Honda plus the cost of suspension makes it a wider cost difference. I also liked Ben's observation that Voge riders may be more apt to be the people that would do their own wrenching, less daunting to work on a 4,000 pound bike vs a 6,500 pound bike.
Ben's a good co-pilot for your 'thinking aloud' style of bike review commentary!
The Voge seems a compelling option. I learned, whilst in Kazakhstan, there's good & rubbish Chinese engineering - the Vogue sounds like 'good'!
Best honest ever heard on youtube ever of an honest review ever ever. Totally 100% agree.
Its really exciting to see more choice in the sub 500 class stops companies resting on their lorals. :) i wish we had more bikes in this class though.
I still miss the lightness in weight from the 300 Rally I had, one thing on value when i sold my 300 Rally it did really good on the resale although as usual some dealers try it on (ive always found it varies widly), one actually bought it for stock for private money so couldnt argue with that.
If id hung onto it i might have looked at a better seat an a different wheelset for tyre choices size wise to suit my needs (personal thing) as i stopped green laning but it all starts to mount up doing that expecially if you sort the suspension.
It did make a big difference though when i fitted the RR level 1 shock. Going back to more road based adv travel riding a bike swap made more sense.
Having said that the weight saving over the 200kg+ bikes in my mind wasnt to be underestimated (reminded me of a rd250lc) an itd chug along nicley on our UK smart motorways. I do miss how light it was.
Its interesting to see the price point on the Voge though, quite a considerable saving from the get go. Itl be interesting to see how they settle into the marketplace.
Awesome video as always Nathan :)
I think Honda really over egged the price on the 300 Rally though it was interesting though on the rocky trails in the peak district the soft suspension was decent on that all trade offs :)
Hi Nathan just bought my son the Voge as a surprise birthday present - now he can film his dad falling off😂😂
I will keep you posted on his progress… ps great wee comparison video. 🏍👍🏴🍺
Interesting comparison. Makes me want to fix my XR400! Whilst I found the CRF a bit buzzy on the open road, the XR isn't really happy on the open road at all. Did Morocco on it, but in all honesty either of these modern bikes would have been better tools for 90% of what I did there. Personally I think the Himalayan would have been even better but the low ground clearance would have been an issue on some of the trails I rode.
Thing is, I dropped the XR several times and suspect I would have done some plastic damage on these two....q
I live on a narrowboat and due to space limitations, I had over nine years two Chinese 125 monkey bike copies. Both were ridden in the summer only and given oil changes every 500 or less miles. The first lasted 5000 miles before the engine gave out , the second lasted six weeks before the engine had to be replaced under warranty.
Every time I went out on either bike I had to take an extensive toolkit with me. Breakdown’s ranged from headlights falling out to kickstarters kicking off etc etc.
I finally gave in and bought a 2022 Honda monkey.
In the first summer of riding I did 3000 miles with zero problems.
At the end of the day we all want to save a little bit of money, but personally I want to get home safely without pissing around at the side of the road re attaching parts that should have been screwed on properly at the factory.
I’d never buy another Chinese bike.
Yeah it's an example of buying a cheap Chinese knock off but I'm not sure of it's relevance here. The parent company of Voge is loncin, who build the engines for the BMW f900gs. Honda builds bikes in china. It's not really where they're made but who makes them.
And what was the cost difference, and if the chinese monkeys were those seriously cheap versions,or how many years ago they were bought ect
@@nathanthepostman The CRFL 300 is parts made in China assembled in Vietnam. No Japanese has been harmed making it.
Hi nathan ran a himalayan for 3yrs mostly on road and bit off road was superb ive no issues at all sold it and regreted it thinking of going back to one but this voge has me thinking both same money now ...if you had to have one only where would you be .???? no offence if you dont have a preferance ..ps my main road bike is 2011 vstrom 650 ...as ever cracking channel ...👌👌cheers dave
The Honda may be the conservative quality option. But you need certain parts the Voge has (like a crash bar) stock, and you need a costly new suspension/setup. In Germany those final versions will be 3,500 Euros apart, in the case of the cheaper Honda CRF 300 L. You can have a lot of adventures on the Voge with the money saved. Cheers, Günter/Nürnberg PS: I do love your green lanes, enjoyed TET Wales this summer on my Beta Alp 200 (even softer, even weaker than both 300s, but at least as confidence inspiring)
Suspension yes. Crash bars - most people I know don't fit them, preferring to save the weight and width. On narrow forest trails crash bars can be a liability, and the plastics seem to handle moderate falls with no issues.
More of a concern than side plastics is how the tower holds up when you drop it on its head. There's even more stuff waving around up the front of the Voge than on the CRF. Most journos don't do crash testing (understandably), but what's going to fall off when you crash is pretty important on this sort of bike.
@@jaimemetcher388 Thanks, these are valid observations. Never thought about the "tower". But yes, in case of a downward crash it'll get expensive. My old Transalp 600 has a similar "tower", but nothing's happened yet. Needs a crash bar, though, due to its plastics excess. On my Beta Alp 200 there is no protection (except for my hands), but it is such a light bike. Cheerio, Günter/Nürnberg
Hello Günter, on your Alp 200,what is an acceptable cruising speed on the road, can it hold 90km/h?@@enduromotorradtouren
@@Niki_Parvanov Depends on your transmission ratio, Niki. With the normal front sprocket (15 teeth) yes, no problem. With 13 or 12 teeth, very popular for slow trail riding, not really. The Beta Alp 200 is best at riding trails, not roads. Best roadholding trails tyre is the Heidenau K67 due to its rounded profile, especially the rear tyre. Most Alp rider love the stiff Pirelli MT43 as a do-it-all tyre. I rode Mitas ET-01 as a bargain. Cheers from Nürnberg, Günter
I installed the lower crash bars on my CRF, because I dropped it twice when I first bought it, and decided that I didn’t want to be one of those people who end up cutting all the fairings off the lower portion of the bike. The lower crash bars have saved my body work. Additionally, the crash bars that I have installed add protection around the shift lever, avoiding contact with the ground when laid on its side. If you follow “Wheeled Geezers” channel, you will see where the owner of the 300l dropped his bike on the road at a dead stop, and the weight of the bike jammed the gear shifter just enough to jam the gears and he had to pull the right side of the crank case apart to fix it. So the gear shifter can cause big problems if struck just right in a crash. But I no longer have that to worry about. As far as the top portion of the bike, the bark busters that I have installed to the triple tree bolts (not the handlebars) provide sufficient protection to the top portion of the bike when the bike is laid on its side. I’ve yet to drop the bike on its head, but I’m sure that would cause some sort of damage that most likely can not be prevented. Additionally, I have a radiator guard to protect the radiator. Case and point, I believe the lower crash bars and bark busters (bolted to the triple tree) are about the best protection that can be added to the CRF Rally. If you want to save weight, the biggest things are upgrading the battery and exhaust.
I have run both those front tires and the fresh ax41 is an advantage in those conditions.
As always a great video, I think it has to be a Voge, I can’t justify the Honda price
Great video chaps, I’ll stick with my voge.
Good video nice comparison ! I go for the voge £2k cheaper that pay for nice trip as Ben said Honda suspension soft both good bikes 👍
Been looking at the Honda reviews the past few weeks and didnt even know the Voge 300 existed. Reliability, ease of use, is a thing for me...I see Voge give a 5 year warranty...still, the Honda clutch seems so light and easy, on longer trail rides definitely a thing for older hands (I am 71) to think about. I positively hate the redness of the Honda...still I´d go for the Honda. Not everyone hates the Honda suspension.
Now Voge needs an Itchy Boots type vlogger to get traction I suppose.
Great review. Subbed.
There's a review from a guy same age as you who put 10 000 kms on this bike ! the channel's name is: Live Long Ride On!
@@Fraktall_ Thanks, meanwhile I found him, and a bunch of Spanish rave reviews. A dealer in North Portugal has both Honda and Voge Rallys in the showroom.
So, I got me a Voge. Did the first 100km on it yesterday, slow revs, still breaking it in. So far, very happy.
@@gammaraygem Glad you're enjoying it !
I'm getting one in a few months hopefully
Voge gets my vote, value for money and fit for purpose
Great vid Nathan
Ben summed it up well didn’t he? Great video.
We like Ben !! A Cornishman “overseas “in Devon !
Haha. They allowed him north of the border for the day
If I was going to spend what the Honda costs I'd have a Himalayan 450, which is also a better fit for shorter riders. But then the Benelli TRK702 is "only" £6.5k so if unlikely to go off road... aaaaaaaaargh. Good video nathan you should do more of these, all the best. And Ben enjoy the Voge...
And as Nathan mentioned a couple of videos ago the Moto Morini X-cape has deals on at the moment and you can pick them up for £6.5k too.
Benelli, Himalayan, Morini, etc. are all good bikes but way more heavy than these two.
Not the ideal choice for those who are searching for very light "solutions".
Great real world comparison
The led system of the honda is very good at night compare to the voge old lights
Other voge is a winner
Hi Nathan.
Have you heard about the new Beta Alp 4.0 in U.K ?
(350cc / 35 hp for ....... 140 kg so they reckon).
Take care.
Tony from France.
It sounded to me like Ben `just` preferred the Voge, the price just clinched it. Would heavier fork oil work on the crf, or preload spacers if poss?
It's the rear shock that let it down the most so many owners end up swapping it out for something better. I think he liked both, but definitely price was the clincher
The new Kove/Rieju/CF moto tickle my fancy but want a Retro as 2nd bike.
Local dealer wouldnt give me a tradein price on my 2023 Himmy vs the new one till march. But I do love my Himmy.
P.s Not sure I'd want to do those muddy lanes on stock tyres.
Any recommendations for a tyre for the front wheel on slippery muddy downhill ? I couldn’t get going the other day because the front was continually sliding. I’m on the standard tyres on the Serrow 250. Seem OK on most things, but terrible on mud.
I've never tried them but I know a lot of people swear by Michelin trackers for the trails. Not sure they do them in serrow sizes
@@nathanthepostman thanks. I shall have a look.
Have always rated the MT21 - have them on my CRF300 rally
As someone said the MT21 is a great tyre for all round use but the tracker is way better in mud and grass. Depends what terrain you ride the most 👍
Honda any day Ichy boots has proven to the world of its capability
Have the CRF250 Rally with 118.500km now, only thing it uses 3.2 Liter oil on the last 8.800km, so around 4 liter / 10.000km. Original clutch, gaskets and fork seals. How is the valve clearance intervall on the Voge ? Had mine checked last time at 72.000km. Will run the Honda till engine dies, I think. Then the Voge might be interesting if the valve clearances don't shift that much, just like on the Honda.
Enjoyed the review but the camera angle was a bit frustrating.
How would these 300s compare against your CCM GP450 on the same terrain?
Ccm has a stronger engine, better suspension, same weight, but not as novice friendly. It needs a confident rider to get the most of it off road.
I was about to ask the same question 😂 voge to me looks great but I think the ccm 450 offers a pretty great package for £3-4k. Arguably all round better parts suspension, rims and brakes wise. Also a lot of them come with pannier racks and luggage so that’s a few quid saved. Personally I’m really keen on the ccm but they’re not the most reliable bike and parts aren’t the easiest to get hold of (although I’ve been told ccm factory still supply parts and bmw too). electrics are a known weak point so you’d have to faff with one a bit to get it right (as Nathan has). I guess the ccm would be probably go a few places the voge wouldn’t and could be ridden harder and faster with a very good rider (which I’m not) 😂. I’ve not ridden the ccm off road but maybe it would be a case of a few months riding it on the lanes to get the hang off it a bit more, or get the voge then upgrade later down the road. Crf is lovely but depending on how much it would be to upgrade the suspension maybe a bit pointless unless you’re happy for it to be a bit like a rocking horse and you just want to ride quite gentle stuff.
New presenter for the channel :)
Longevity and parts availability would be a factor. All well and good saying one is cheaper, but how easy is it to fix if it breaks ?
There seems to be a good supply of parts for the Voge and the price of parts are cheap.
What's the tyres called ?
Is the Voge 300 motor based on the Honda 300 or is it an original design?
I think 🤔 the voge 300 is based on the kawasaki 300 klx engine.
You can see 👀 this video on you tube: voge 300 rally vs kawasaki klx300 engine. The name of the channel: On the pegs.
They do a 10bhp hop up piston kit for the crf which transforms it.look on youtube . By the way any idea why my post is late .
Which post Martin?
Apologies. Got it. Postman. Very good
😂😂
550 performance 301 Big Bore kit.
Time will talk
It would be the Voge for me. Nick
I'd have no problem with owning/riding the Voge, the only thing that would sway me to the Honda would be cheap and plentiful spare/service parts. That may be a problem with the Chinese bike, I don't know.
Yeah parts have always been an issue with the Chinese bikes. So far the importer of voge moto GB seems to have quick access to a full parts catalogue and the prices are very low. Hopefully that continues. There's also a lot on AliExpress
Back in the seventies the term japcrap was bandied about. Seems theyve not done too badly
As I always say with Chinese bikes, costs WILL have been cut to deliver the lower ticket price (they don't just make a loss on each one) it's all about working out where they cut the costs and whether that cost cutting matters to you. Ultimately the biggest cost is invariably the depreciation [i never quite get the whole "I don't care about resale" thing, "I want to save two grand on the purchase price but then I'm happy to throw it away!" doesn't make a whole load of financial sense to me] and if the Voge value falls off a cliff or no dealer will take it in Part Ex then the Honda might not be as expensive as the ticket price suggests.
It's a valid point but I think we saw it with the Himalayan that actually that bike hung into its value far more than people expected and I think the voge will be the same for the fact that there's a lot of happy owners who will spread word around and so I don't think it'll plummet. And I can't see it ever going below £2500, not for a few years. But if you want cast iron residuals there's always the Honda.
I’ve got a Voge which I bought to be my main off-road bike. For the price I paid I don’t care about depreciation, it’s a false debate for a bike like this. It’s going to get dropped, it’s going to get dirty it’s going to be a lot of fun and my plan is to keep it for a long time. If I decide to sell it after a couple of years and I lose half its value people like you will laugh and say I lost 50% but in truth I will have lost a lot less in real terms than somebody who has bought a new bigger bike, done a small mileage on sunny days, fretted every time they thought it might have got a stone chip or a minor scratch before trading it in a year later for something else. Earlier this year a friend of mine lost over £5000 on a Tiger 1200 that he had done less than 6000 miles on. There were quality issues with the Honda that he wasn’t happy with and bought something even more expensive instead. That’s depreciation to worry about, spending a small outlay for a great little off-road bike to go out and enjoy riding, depreciation is the last thing on my mind.
@@davidmatthews3093fair play and each to their own I just don’t get the ‘I don’t care if it’s worth nothing after x years’ whilst at the same time choosing it because it’s a few grand cheaper on day one.
@@nathanthepostmanfair point Nathan, perhaps the knack then is to wait until we can see if a model is solid and well regarded like the Himi. My only sadness is that it’s easy to focus solely on the ticket price and if that’s what most people want we can’t blame the big four Japanese brands if they also drop quality / support in response to market demand. You only have to compare an early CG125 with a current CBF125 to see the impact and personally, I think that’s a shame and a backwards step.
When tyre changing, put cardboard down to kneel on. Your knees will really thank you when you get a bit older!
I have carpets in my garage 😊
@@mark.e.p He's got planks + scaffolding + ladder = a nice workbench. My old knees would scream in protest, even with cardboard/carpet.
What about the BMW gs310 in the mix with these?
In stock guise it just wouldn't compare and neither would the 390 adventure, both road based adventure bikes with 19 inch fronts and in the BMWs case a very broad front tyre that makes it difficult to get good purchase in the mud. I'm still to finish fitting the rally raid kit to mine which does transform it. But still not a trail bike like these two. But better on the road
Your audio is on the left side only
right only
Nathen is cool no boring data. Real world riding
The choice thankfully, is getting wider.
For me, the Voge suspension and power is not really “exciting” enough.
For a little more money, (well double 😳) the Kove 450 delivers a truly compelling adventure bike. Arguably as capable as a KTM EXC 450 but with the “essential “ rear subframe that allows you to carry camping gear.
It's £5k more expensive to be fair and I do think that bike's going to be too peaky for most UK trail riders, certainly novices. But for good riders, for sure, it's going to be a massive step up from either the voge or the honda
That’s a completely different sort of bike, chalk and cheese.
£8500 KOVE, versus £5800 for a CRF300L … I think it’s worth considering. (You’ll need to spend £1500 fixing the CRF 300L suspension)
I totally agree that the Voge is satisfactory and astoundingly great value for your £££
Nathan,it was your review that sold the idiea of getting a Himalayan quite a few years back , I love it and still have it and won't part with it ,but you have done it again and sold me the voge , being delivered Saturday, so I'm going to unsubscribe before you sell me some thing else ,, 😂😂😂
Ipak cu se drzati podalje od Kineza imam Hondu crf 250 standard nista od ovjesa nisam menjao vozim je sve bukvalno do crvenog polja i nikakav problem do sada nije pokazala,u Kawasakijeve agregate nemam ni malo pouzdanja a kamoli u Kinesku sasiju,zato od sportskih motocikala vozim vecinom Suzuki jer su mi kawasakiji mnogo glavobolja zadavali!!!
I own a honda 250 rally which after a little use on trail and road UK and Portugal/Spain on paper it ticks most box's but biking aint just ticking box's it seems its OK but just does not say to me lets go play and to buck the trend I prefer my GS 12 on the trails. between these 2 the Voge clearly appears the better package as a riders bike, never bought a new bike unsure how the long term value thing would work out, if you were a rider and wanted to ride through the stingy's etc and scratch all the plastics etc, the Voge again sounds better, but will it hold together my hunch it will. cheap is best, Chinese it will be, thats what history tells us anyway.
Crf300 good for 100k km while kove good for 30k km. There are videos in russian dissasembling kove motor.
Kove or Voge? This a Voge 300 using the Kawasaki KLX 300 engine.
The Voge is a half the price of the Kove….It’s incredible value.
You might have a point about longevity… who knows ?
There will not be many CRFs that do 100,000 miles and there’s nothing to suggest that the Kawasaki 300 engine will only last 30,000 miles. Even if it did that’s still twice as many as my 20 year old DR125 has done, these sort of bikes rarely do huge mileages after all. I think you are plucking numbers out of the air to prove a point that does not exist.
Has Nathan changed the oil on the Voge yet? If I compared the gear change on mine just before and just after it’s first oil change it would be hard to believe it was the same bike.