7 Reasons to Avoid Vintage Hi-Fi
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- čas přidán 27. 07. 2024
- Want to get into vintage hi-fi? It takes a certain type of person to embrace all that comes with this rewarding hobby. Do you have what it takes? Let us know why you think some people should avoid taking the plunge.
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Number 8. It's a highly addictive hobby! You find yourself constantly looking for deals, always seeking that magical sound with synergy between amps and speakers, learning new skills as you learn to maintain your own equipment and having a camaraderie amongst fellow vintage audio enthusiasts. Then when you get to the point where you find a particular brand you fall in love with, you then end up buying multiple pieces to try to find that one that will be "the one". For me, it has been Sansui and my newest addiction is ADS speakers. I believe there is a magical synergy between the two brands. The whole hobby is a rabbit hole because there is always something better out there and it seems like we are always looking for something better. It's a craving that cannot be quenched. As much as this hobby makes me crazy, I absolutely love and enjoy it immensely!
You're absolutely right: I think I ought to start psychotherapy soon....😂😂
I was going to say the same. The addictive part helps with #9 which is you need backups for when the main unit dies. I’m a big ADS fan also though I slightly prefer Pioneer to Sansui
@@paulv22 my Pioneer SX-636 is the receiver that began my addiction and I doubt I'd ever part with it.😎
You are right on target ! One time Kevin mentioned that one of his favorite receivers was a Pioneer 780. After that video, I decided I wanted to add one to my budding "collection/obsession". A couple of weeks ago, I actually got one. I came across a guy on Ebay, a couple of hours away from me. He auctioned off a 780, and I did not get it. I messaged him back, telling him that I used to sell audio, back in the "vintage" days. A conversation or two later, he told me that he actually had an even better 780 that he was really going to hang onto. He decided he wanted me to have it, and made me a really good deal -- BETTER than the original deal I missed. We've chatted back and forth, and I now have MY 780. It is like a new found CLUB. Rip
Right there with you, this hobby made me get a degree in electronics and work for a hifi audio company 😁
I happen to love that vintage smell with old equipment and furniture etc. Reminds me of a happier time in my life. I have an old Sansui 7070 that I had gone over, I have a bluetooth adapter hooked to it as well as a cd player. I love listening to it. I grew up in the 70s so I know the value of those old units, and don't mind the limitations of them.
I need to make a sign that says "free smells" for the shop. People tell us, all the time, they love the smell of the vintage electronics for the same reasons.
@@skylabsaudio or you could tell them to take up smoking...
Our house was built in 1900 and we love the creaks (gives it character) and vintage audio is no different. This home is still standing strong after 123 years as well as our vintage audio is after 40.
Exactly right. I have a room full of vintage audio, some of it restored to perfection, some of it on its last legs, all of it charming and beautiful and made of things like real wood. I’ll take all of it over the latest amp. I am fortunate to have two audio experts near me who can recap and restore items, so that they not only sound better than the original, but will last for another 50 years.
@@davidserlin8097 Not where i'm at here in Alabama, have to try and repair things myself and so far so good.
Very good advise 👍 A few years ago I was at a flea market and found a Pioneer PL 540 turntable for $30. It was dirty but good condition and I replaced the rotted feet and cartridge and stylus with a good cleaning. I'm happy to say it has worked great so far.
High gauge speaker wire is only important if
1. you like your music loud at all times, and
2. if you place your speakers a good long distance away from the system.
Otherwise, it really doesn't matter too much.
The problem with modern audio is that none of it is made to last
and most of it is very un serviceable friendly.
Vintage say between 1960's to early 1990's is always better than anything modern
hands down all day long!
This is an absolutely solid list. Going through the list and I have answers to all of them, which is why I am 100% all in for vintage audio. This is a hobby that requires a little more understanding and hands-on maintenance of your gear. If you're the type that wants stress free, plug and play type of experience, go with new. Otherwise, vintage, while it has its caveats and finnicky issues, offers both a greater experience and there is some amazing sound to come from it.
I'. 63 years old and vintage myself! You brought up all very good points for someone who didn't grow up with this equipment. I, on the other hand, know what to expect. And you are correct on all points. I still like the look and sound (for the most part) of vintage home audio, I still have my highshool Techniques linear tracking turntable and receiver from the mid 1970s. They work and sound like new. Thanks for this. It will definitely help younger people.
Appreciate your videos, Kevin. This is precisely what folks need to hear. I ride a 1954 BMW, love it, and really appreciate its idiosyncrasies. Same with the vintage hifi gear, especially the tubes. But both are not for everyone. Good run down of issues to consider.
Had a 1968 Bonneville. Missed it for 40 yrs. Now I have a 1983 Honda cx-650. Movin' up in the world;my first electric start. I'm a 1978 Onkyo TX -4500 with mint Pinnacle AC-550's and 650 speakers that nobody knows about. All are treasures I discovered myself - that's what makes it cool. Saves ya money too.
The biggest frustration i experience with vintage audio gear today is finding a qualified technician that can service them without shipping it out of state and risk damaging it in freight. Audio technicians are sadly a dying trade, and the few who are left are swamped with repairs and backlogged for several months or years before they can even look at your gear. Worse yet, many vintage gear have faulty or failed components that are impossible to find due to the age of the unit. I have a ton of vintage gear that are now boat anchors because of that.
Yup i need to send my pioneer few hundred kilometers to Service
I'm an electronic technician, I repair and rebuild vintage audio equipment, and yeah, we have backlogs, and it's worse after the pandemic because there's some parts, like output transistors, that are back order until January. They have almost a year backorder, and speaking for myself, since there's not many technician available where I live, I currently have 5 receiver that are waiting to be fixed, a couple of power amplifier/pre-amp and tuner too. There's certain parts that are difficult to obtain, like proprietary IC and I outright refuse to service anything with the STK power pack because the parts aren't available, it's time consuming and it often doesn't worth it.
Yes #8 it's highly addictive.. The magical sound , the quality and the look. Been into for over 50 years. I have over 80 pieces.
# 9 finding PARTS specially for tape decks. A few times I have to find a 2nd one( same model) to make a whole one.
Couldn't agree more!
❤
I started my vintage journey about 5 years ago trying to buy a Marantz 2270. I called a local hifi shop and asked if they had any or if I found one if they could recap it for me. They said it would be $1k plus to recap and $1800+ to buy one recapped. After that I spent many, many hours on CZcams learning vintage electronics repair, bought some test equipment and then I found a Pioneer SX-780 and completely rebuilt it including redesigned amplifier module boards. It turned out great and I just went on my journey from there. I rebuilt a Marantz 2245 for a friend and while it turned out well it was harrowing. The board traces are very delicate. Suffice to say I no longer want a 2270. My advice for the non-technically inclined is to take time to find a repair facility or person you trust and be prepared to spend more than you paid for a thorough rebuild/recap job. I love vintage 70s, early 80s equipment and although I have some more modern pieces the drawbacks of vintage are easy to overcome.
You rebuild my SX 780.
How much?
Recapping is expensive and risky. Most of the time it isn't needed.
Fun video, as usual. Got me thinking a bit about why 80% of my audio is pre-2000 (and 60% of that pre 1980..). With the unevenness, quirkiness, and all the other things you mentioned being acceptable (the smell ... to a certain extent), outside of the obvious "Sound", I tend to prefer older equipment because (1) the 'how they work' is normally more mechanical and easier to understand than the IC chip heavy modern equipment .. thus easier to diagnose/fiddle/fix, (2) older stuff tends to be built better to last, and (3) I have a romantic attachment to the "golden age" of audio.. the sound that was coming from my father's kit. I have no idea if my father's kit sounded any good ... but that was the tonality that I grew up with, and it just feels comfortable. As you say, it is not a cheap hobby though..
This video is a public service, and I really think you may have saved somebody a lot of trouble by pointing out the drawbacks. Every point you made is totally spot-on.
Personally, I LOVE my vintage gear, with the "Crown Jewels" being a Pioneer SX1250 receiver, a Pioneer PL-530 turntable and a pair of Phase-Tech 8.5 speakers. I'm also lucky enough to live in a town with excellent technicians, and I've never been bashful about giving this equipment the TLC (and $$$) that it deserves, because I get so much joy out of this hobby.
All are great points Kevin! My Nakamichi 482z is 40 years old and both my Yamaha PX3 and Technics SL 1610 are as well! Amazing bang for the buck in comparison to new turntables but certainly need tlc to keep them tip top! I think the number one reason people want vintage systems is the look! I put a vintage system together for my daughter, and she adores it every day! She grew up with all of this around her, so I think it’s a part of her nostalgia as well! another great video!
You’ve made good points on why vintage may not be the way to go. I purchased a vintage reel to reel several years ago and partially restored it. However, I realized what it would take to fully restore it, and it’s not worth the time and expense involved. Cosmetically, it’s in good shape, so it’s a great conversation piece.
Your videos are refreshing from the standpoint that many are here to promote the sale of one thing over another. While you, on the other hand, suggest it's more about having a fun, relaxing hobby.
I, for one, enjoy the way you bring my interest down to earth.
Thank you :)
I used to have the old pioneer receiver that weighted a ton. And a nice turntable with a good real to real. I also had very nice speakers. Then I got caught up with the new technology of digital stuff. So I gave all my old stuff away but not the speakers and bought new tehcnology. BOY was I excited. All the new equipment weighed way less than my old stuff.Hooked it all up and played my favorite album. SOUNDED TERRIBLE. I checked to make sure I had hooked it up properly. After that I went back to to store to complain how bad it sounded. The guy asked what I had before and I told him. He said go get it back this stuff is junk. Thats why people want the old vintage stuff. However your points are well taken and should be considered.
Phew, dodged the bullet there! I think I'm certified to enjoy vintage electronics.
1. I'm not a warranty worrier. If I buy something new, and at least semi expensive, I always go into it knowing that anything can happen. Even if it has a warranty, there could be things that it won't cover.
2. I don't need my music listening to be particularly convenient. All of the extra fiddling around, just adds to the experience. Plus I get to touch, and see the beautiful vintage equipment more, when I "have" to go and mess with it.
3. Again, the smells kind of add to the experience too. I can't admit to liking a unit smelling really heavily of cigarette tar. But usually even that's something that has "evolved" into a kind of sweet odour, mixed in with the smell of electronic components warming up.
4.Luckily I'm mechanically inclined, and taking apart a vintage receiver isn't a big deal. In addition to that, I've learned a lot about electronics because of this hobby. So fault finding, changing components, and just generally understanding how these things work, is becoming ever easier. If worst comes to worst, I can fall back on a reliable tech.
5. I trust what the manufacturer's recommended to use in the first place. I've never understood the need for monster cables, if the unit itself isn't even designed for that.
6. I went into this hobby (collecting vintage receivers), knowing that it takes all the money you are willing to throw at it. I've been building, and driving vintage cars for more than 20 years now, and it's exactly the same with them. I never looked at buying vintage audio equipment with a budget in mind. Which you can totally do, and get quality stuff for less than new price. That is, if you know where to draw the line! I don't, for the most part.
7. I guess I'm a bit OCD but I think of it as a superpower, that helps me to focus on fiddling with these things. I have the mental strength to sink hours upon hours to making stuff look, and work the way I want them to. Sure, there's just some things you have to live with. And being used to vintage stuff from an early age, I can accept that.
And like Ms. Mosier said, it's a highly addictive hobby! You shouldn't get into it, if you don't have any self control, and/or very limited resources. Right now I have a collection of sixteen 70s receivers/integrateds. That's fifteen too many, if you ask any sane person. After buying a few junk/un-interesting units in the beginning, I think I'm getting a grasp on what I really like. Sansui is my favorite, followed by Harman/Kardon, and Kenwood. Pioneer, and Yamaha don't seem to do much for me, and I don't even look at Marantz because of the insane prices. I now know to steer clear of the more esoteric (cheap) marques/models, as they can be hard to get rid of when the time comes.
Anyway, thanks for an interesting, left field type of video!
Love the comment!
Vintage audio looks, feels and sounds better alot of times vs new stereos once restored and dollar to dollar is a solid deal. The only people who seem to complain about vintage stereos is someone who doesnt have a restored one or its been restored by a hack tech so it may technically "work" but its not working 100 percent.
For music, a good quality vintage receiver/amp is the way to go. Speakers, new or vintage are all over the place.
Once you find a good match for your amp, your set.
My 6.1 surround set-up from early 2000's sounds great for movies, but my vintage system sounds WAY better for music.
The pop ups are a hoot but that dangling fir thee air freshener... datum I am still rolling on the floor laughing 😂 Great vid Kevin and agree with your 7, my 8th? I cannot stop looking for more vintage gear, having more than one is a problem. Have a good one!
😁
Vintage stereos, classic houses and old-fashioned, unvarnished wisdom. So refreshingly rustic that I’m gonna do something thoroughly modern and subscribe to your YT channel. Thanks again!
Well son of a gun, I guess I’ve already subscribed. The beauty of bad memory is enjoying thing multiple times ;^)
Lol
I bought my first integrated amp in 1975 so I'm all about vintage audio. I use a Sabaj A10h headphone amp as a remote volume control in a tape monitor loop,. I also use subwoofers that have speaker level ins/outs and I use a remote control power switch. All the conveniences along with beautiful vintage gear. I never have to get out of my grandpa recliner. LOL
Up until last August, I lived in a 125 year old house that had been rehabbed by a community org with some funding provided by the city. They had opened up some of the spaces on the first floor, updated electrical and HVAC systems, the kitchen and bathroom, and carpeted all the other rooms. It was pure 80's condo (with tall, narrow windows) but it worked for me. There was also a 1930's addition/repair that had stripped every splinter of original woodwork out of the house except for the railing and newel post on the steep stairway to the second floor. After a few years, all of the things that were money pits that you'd associate with a 100+ year old house started to emerge. When I sold it as-is to a commercial buyer after 26 years, I knew the location of every imminent money pit that I couldn't afford to deal with.
I'm very happy in my senior co-op now.
Thanks for info. Helps me realize what I should buy.
Terrific advice. As the owner of 30 yr old kit, Denon, Technics and Pioneer. Nothing high end, but they do need caring for. Excellent video, very helpful.
As always, you are always on point.... Totally agree... I'm sure you've had to deal with customers in the past that you sold vintage electronics too and regret ever doing it because they didn't realize what they're getting into... So hopefully this video will make people not familiar with vintage electronics better-informed on what they're getting in to....
Totally agree with the OCD regarding vinyl records and turntables... I was very OCD about my records and cleaned them carefully before each use.. and making sure the turntable was dust free.... Same goes for making sure the tape player heads were always kept clean...
Maybe if you had a few techs that could repair like most good shops have u woudnt be whining. You didnt mind taking the cash?
@@user-qp4sy2dp5b LOL... What the hell are you talkin about?
I came to vintage audio from collecting and repairing vintage computers, there is a lot of crossover with the skills I picked up along the way. I am now on the path to getting officially qualified to do the repairs. I plan to start doing mods for both vintage audio and vintage computers, I try to encourage people to do their own basic repairs if they are comfortable.
I have a lot of appreciation for vintage audio gear, but a lot of these apply to me. Scratchy pots & intermittents are deal-breakers, for instance. I do have nostalgia for the tuning knobs with a heavy flywheel from my childhood. I have salivated over many a Sansui, Marantz, etc. receiver in my day. Maybe I'll pick one up when I have need for a 2nd room system. In the meantime, my living room needs remotes, a good DAC, and high S/N ratios. Excellent points you've made here!
I bought all of my gear new back in the 80's and early 90's. My subs were made in the early 2000's and are the newest gear in my collection. I became a vintage HiFi enthusiast over the decades as a result of watching it age along the way. Luckily the gear I own can accommodate 12 gauge speaker wire. I might consider new speakers at some point, but I'm quite happy with what I have now. None of it has needed any work so far other than an occasional cleaning and such but if it does I plan on doing it myself.
As the owner of a dead Yamaha B-1, I can attest that this man is talking truth. I should have done more research first. I thought I knew enough to know better.
Like walking by your turntable and your Blue Ortofon jumps & skips! I live in a raised older home in FL
I still have my Bryston 1B 3B combo that I bought new in 1983 for $1350. A lot of money back then, but just $33 a year for having great electronics and sound to go with that. The Bryston 3B had a cap job in 2013 (I thought it would be good preventative maintenance) and both units still give me daily enjoyment to this day.
As someone that doesn't really have an audiophile mentor, I'd love to see more videos on record cleaning and basic turn table maintenance. I don't want trade secrets but good things to know.
Noted!
Older home/new home is a beautiful and accurate analogy.
Great Video! I have to say this! Most people who buy vintage audio, have a very skillful background in repairing them! I have over 30 years experience in this field!
I've went small and am using an old RCA mini amplifier. They were so cheap I picked up 3 to have backups. The phono preamp and amp combo have such a classic old warm analog sound.
Man RCA...you really have the top of the line rig there bud. Classic old sound, there a amp body shops use to play old tapes.
Great information kevin and I may add the lack of USB's , HDMI's, etc limits they way you want to use these vintage equipment.
Another reason to avoid vintage hi-fi. Sellers claiming that a unit is fully restored but the only thing changed is a few light bulbs. Then they bring it to my shop when it fails and I tell them it needs a full restoration because of ageing components and poor repairs- and I'm the bad guy!
been there!
It's happening often in the last few years with the flippers that sell supposedly "restored" equipment. It's unfortunate.
I have peace of mind now. I have an akai 1050. The lights don't work ,the red light flicks, a couple of buttons don't work, and the knob is bend. I just got a pioneer sx 626 and is missing the plugs for the speakers. The same thing goes for old cars. You have to be ok with what you have or spend money to make it better.
I'm in this hobby since 1976 and I have room full of vintage electronics from Sansui,Pioneer, Technics, Teac, Nakamichi, Jvc , and many more which i will be selling them soon i still bought brand new Yamaha 5000 series pre/power, only thing I can say is life is too short I don't want to waste my time to get vintage electronics repaired and hoping and praying it will be in good working condition for few more years, my best advice is buy new use it for 5 ~ 7 years and let it go and buy new one again if you loose $ 2~4 k in 7 years it's ok at least when you turn your electronics On its always in good working condition let the money go save your time which is more important.
Good points all. My point you hit is distance to a good technician. I've become willing to drive further and/or pack the unit well.
As a long-time vintage fool, my experience agrees with your warnings 100%. I would add shipping agony. Shipping agony wears many hats: Incredibly poor packing, insanely rough shipping company workers, "Oh, that happened in shipping -- you'll have to contact the shipper...", surprise tariffs, and packages left in the rain. Glass tubes and faceplates are 99% impossible to ship. Glass replacements and replicas, shipped directly from a reputable vendor, account for the other 1%. And you'll be buying many replacements and replicas after receiving shipped vintage equipment. Great video.
That Sansui receiver on the bottom, the 8010, maybe I should go looking for one of those - it surely IS a thing of beauty ! :)
Having worked as a Hi-Fi repair tech since the early 70's i have seen how the gear has changed
some for the better, but from a repair point, todays gear is a pain just getting access to remove
faulty components.
Vintage vs modern gear from my point of view is that although we remember the past as the
good old days, there is no denying that todays gear is more reliable, but when it fails the repair
costs are much higher due to the time it takes to find the fault then spend hours taking it all apart
to replace the faulty components.
In this respect vintage gear is far easier to work on, they have access plates that make it far
easier to replace parts, today they are all built like a biscuit tin made out of thin metal with sharp edges.
The main issue with repairing vintage gear is that due to ageing, the pcb's and wiring are very brittle
and you risk causing more faults by trying to find the original one.
I still prefer the sound of vintage gear, it doesn't give you listening fatigue that todays "Digital" gear
suffers from.
In 2022 I took my turntable in for a service and replace the cartridge (which I will get refurbished). I spent as much on the service and new cartridge as the original system cost in 1990 of £2300. You can buy a very good new turntable for that kind of money but nothing close to the classic Linn Sondek LP12 as updated.
Also last year I got my active speakers recapped. A long term problem with one of the amplifiers was finally removed but the service was over £700. Not bad after 30 years good service from them but also 10 years in and out of the workshop to fix faults. It was taking longer in for repairs and more frequent repairs that got me looking at current model replacements. I was not looking for an upgrade just less hassle in keeping them maintained. I have speakers from 1990 that I use in a surround sound set up. The electronics particularly the DAC have issues.
Respect for the design and quality of vintage items has kept me seeking services. It is hard to justifying a current model that is not anywhere as good unless I go to something I really can't afford. I still enjoy my vintage system.
A new issue has been with keeping them running together for surround and potential solutions expensive and not clearly cover my needs. Hence looking at modern designs to be easier to maintain that work together out of the box. For home theatre passive speakers with an A/V receiver or analogue active speakers seems to be easy to work with. Go wireless or DSP active with modern features and you are either stuck with stereo or have problems not known to the analogue world.
So my replacement speaker B&O Beolab 28 is eight times the cost at £12500 (I purchased second hand 1 year old for £7k). Whilst different to my large floor standing 1980 £1500 Meridian M1 they are clearly not better as stereo but do better as part of a surround set up. I have Beolab 17 for rears (replacing the far large and far better 1990 Meridian D600) and a Beolab 19 for sub woofer to replace the analogue active B&W PV1 (three times the cost to go wireless). I would not go this route again.
The 1990 Meridian D600 has a remote. A big chunky one made of metal but a remote. I also have a 1986 Beocenter system that has a very 21st Century touch interface and a model looking remote that is a solid performer with CD, one of the best ever cassette systems (Dolby HX Pro, Dolby C) and a first class FM radio. These are now very cheap. You can even add a small box to give all the streaming and internet radio you could ever want. B&O do enable much of their vintage system to link in with current models. They even make a four channel amplifier to back onto a Raspberry Piu computer to turn old passive speakers into a smart steaming speaker or stereo active speakers. There are many high end and one time very expensive equipment that can be purchased for the same as a new budget system. But it might need s service in a couple of years - still worth the effort.
Regarding odor, I stumbled onto a product from Biocide Systems. It’s a pouch you open and place in water and it starts fogging. It can go in a musty car that got water in it or was a smoker car, and they make them for rooms in your house. We had a dead mouse in a wall in the room where my stereo is and it did not harm the equipment at all. The equipment had no odor and not sure this would have helped if it did, but it definitely worked in the room and in several cars I’ve had. Leaves the area smelling chlorinated like a swimming pool for a couple days but it clears up and is non toxic. Might be worth a try if you have some nasty units you want to put in a small room and set it off.
SO TRUE SO TRUE.....Usually the older stuff had a lot of little pesky things that we just dealt with. Even when there was possible audible distortion or "coloring" in the audio. The stuff we have now is just a lot of whistles and bells. The reproduction of the sound TODAY is so much cleaner.
Reason #8.... Vintage Hi-Fi components can take over your entire house.
The clip of that shiny Sansui 771 made my mouth water.
Another consideration is cosmetic and electrical parts availability, specifically those required only for the particular unit (proprietary) which may be unobtanium now such as phono cartridges for B&O turntables.
Just a couple of staticky knobs on my Marantz 2325 Receiver had since 2019 replaced Stereo light partially recapped but sounds great over my new 2007 Rotel separates.
Man, I can’t thank you enough for this video 👍
I've been lucky so far with most of my vintage gear not needing any repairs. My turntable needed a lot of fiddly work, but I eventually got it working perfectly.
Weirdly, the piece of vintage gear that needed the most work is a 2003 prosumer CD player/duplicator. I finally got it running, only to have the capacitor plague hit it. One day, I'll have the time and patience to replace all the caps.
You had me at 'cheeto dust'! All 7 valid points. Thanks mister vintage man.
I love my old '74 Technics SA-5200a. I can plug a Bluetooth box into it and I'm all set. And it looks beautiful. And if something burns out, I have a soldering iron. 😀
"Cheeto dust" (on turntables) 🤣🤣🤣 I've had my Marantz 2325 w/ four JBL L-65 speakers since new in '77, & I wouldn't trade 'em in for any new piece of electronic/s! And I can't imagine why owners let their CATS lay on top of their equipment!!! 🤢🤢🤢 I'm driving my 2325 up from Florida to a very reputable shop in Michigan for a routine 'oil & lube' job, plus a lamp housing replacement in a few months.... can't wait!
It's addictive and can become costly if you don't watch out. My set was good enough 10 amps and 15 speakers ago, but still you'll be hunting down the next best thing. At the moment I have a Technics SL1210 turntable combined with a Marantz 2215b receiver and b&w DM14 speakers. It's great. It's fine, and at the moment I can't wish for a better sound ...but still...that Sansui looks very nice as well...and those Chario Lynx speakers sound pretty good too....oh damn here we go again 😅
On the turntable, I'd be wondering what the rest of the house is like.
I do have a radiogram from 1968 and a couple another's 1950's. And you are spot on they do need that little extra bit of attention. Haven't used for a few years now , just a bit concerned about potential fire.
I have recently moved into a 110-year-old building with my 80s NAD Hi-Fi where they have just started to replace the structure's electric cables and the freshly encountered fluctuating level of buzz in my speakers makes me feel that I have the privilege of knowing when my neighbours are switching their electric equipment on/off. But hey, you can't spell vintage without buzz... I mean age :D
I am positively hooked on my relics comprising of P2200, PC2002M, M50, MX-1 Yamaha amplifiers and four pairs of NS1000M speakers here.
I think part of this hobby is to learn electronics and try to repair vintage by himself to avoid the technician issue.
Yes good udea? Go rip into a Fisher tube amp and touch the wrong part and be 3 blocks down the road when u wake up? Your the guy that I see when I pick up my gear asking the tech why it dont work you watched u tube it should work. We see this all day. Transformer wired to the volume pot and wonder why?
@@user-qp4sy2dp5b unkind and imprecise comment, dude. You dint know me to say this and i really wouldnt like to know you. Most of the issue can be repaired since they are not that conplex and for them, most of technician sucks at time to deliver and price . Of course a very complex fixing would be addreses for the few of good technician and surely they are hard to happen. Be more intelligent on things u say befire being this rude.
Yeah it's a good idea in my opinion. Just start working with inexpensive stuff from goodwill shop, learn to read schematic, it's not overly complicated, and with inexpensive stuff, if you make a mistake, you can always learn from it and understand why and what you did wrong. I'm a electronic technician since the early 80s, and I won't discourage you from doing it as I have a lot of work and backlog, and I don't feel the need to protect anything or gatekeep you from doing it yourself, qualified technicians are never out of work. So get a cheaper unit, learn to read a schematic, and maybe some reading on forums might help you to understand some electronic principles. If I was able to learn to do it, anybody surely can. Also, the thing is, I never ever needed to advertise my services, it's only from my reputation, and the fact that there's few good tech where I live, that are honest, I work as fast as I can, and I usually give the clients detailed information on the work that I did with pictures. People usually like to have these documents especially when the equipment is collectable and valuable, it an added value, just like keeping the original manual. I also make an additional effort in keeping the devices as original as possible, and replace old parts with newer equivalent, no mods, and always gives back the old parts, even if they're not good, for the clients to keep with the equipment. It's something people appreciate and doing so gives me an excellent reputation as I'm as transparent as I can be. That's the difference between good tech and bad ones. The good ones don't feel the need to hide anything from the clients.
Edit: english isn't my language.
@@frmagnecio I agree. That user-qp4 guy made a rude comment to you.
Two other things that are worth mentioning. Energy efficiency and electrical safety.
Solid state electronic components use much less power than valves and even before we touch on the ravages of time, older gear is built to older standards. Safety features that have become standard now weren't even thought of then.
#7 is so true. I have an EQ with a monitor button that makes the right channel really weak sounding. I have cleaned it so many times with DeOxit I am about ready to just bypass it entirely. I have to wiggle it a bit to get the sound to come out. Same with a Vintage JVC Receiver (401). Sometimes the Right channel has no sound. I turn it off, then back on, there it is! Right channel is back on. Crazy.
Another thing you have to get used to with a used turntable is staying on top of the cuing at the start of a record so that the stylus doesn't land with a thud.
I tend to be a new buyer because I don't want to buy a box full of mystery problems and I always end up with the same feeling about selling my gear when I'm aware of everything I don't like about it. However, I've been buying new since the early 70's so I have a pair of JBL L-100s and a Dual 1229 (both 1975) and luckily I'm close to some good tech shops in the Twin Cities. The only equipment that I regret letting go was a Harman Kardon 930 with the factory wood cabinet. It was getting to the point where my own OCD (#7) was getting triggered and I just had the hots to get something new (which turned out to be unrepairable).
The HK 930 was awesome! Sold HK through Schaak Electronics in the late 70s, early 80s.
@@anthonymalovrh2912 I regret getting rid of that receiver so much now. 😭 I'm not sure if I bought it at Schaak or Sound of Music, but I was a regular lurker at the Rosedale and Dinkytown Schaak stores. I definitely bought my L-100s and 1229 at the same time at the Rosedale store.
Congratulations for having bought that $599.00 / pair JBL L-100s [ I have the JBL 4311 studio monitors; same upside-down innards , same price in 1972. Their asking price these days ranges from $ 1,200.00 to $2,000.00 depending on the condition. Another nostalgic experience I had; I also bought the iconic Altec-Lansing "Voice of the Theater" in the form of "VALENCIA" for $599.00 / pair for home use in 1974 and traded them in valued at $400.00 because I wanted to buy the Vintage McIntosh MA-600 integrated amp ($650.00; now $1.900.00). In late 2019 during the Pandemic, I was surfing the eBay internet and came across that Altec Valencia selling for $2,400.00 plus shipping; I made an offer ($2,000.00); agreed with the deal for "free" shipping. At my age [78 then], I have to be tangible with my VINTAGE Ex after almost quarter of a century, I just missed the sound of a HORN type speaker design is capable of. The transient response, the smooth balance of the horn and the15" woofer reproducing that "midrange bloom", the absence of listening fatigue, the musicality, presence, air that you feel, the coherence and synergy driven by low wattage single ended tube amp will grab you or better still embrace you. These efficient speakers are exciting and fun to listen to. The Vintage price these days -- surf eBay. My Hi-Fi journey to become an Audiophile who hoards or collect(?) VINTAGE audio equipment [ Audio Research-Quad ESL-63,-B&W-Linn - Studio Otari R-to-R Sondek-etc,etc,etc,etc. The NEWEST gear I just purchased - Schiit DAC. I said to Valencia: "Till death do us part.
@@marvieachanzar4674 I actually got a package deal on the JBLs + the Dual 1229 + a Stanton cartridge for a little less than $640. I had gotten a quote from a mail order (pre-internet) hi-fi warehouse in CA, showed it to a salesman at my local mall hi-fi store, and the local store met the price.
You wouldn't happen to have a spare H-K 930 that's taking up too much room?
Hey thanks for your videos! I agree there are reasons not to get into vintage audio.
I have a question regrading how you and others connect multiple speakers and multi amplifiers together so you can switch AmpA and AmpB to different speakers. I have seen speaker selector switches but are there AMP selector switches? I hope this is is a thing? I have two amps and 4-5 sets of speakers and want to switch between them without moving wires.
love to hear the pros and cons to these setups.
I graduated in 1982 . Many of these pieces were involved in wild parties . They will smell . I have been putting together a system and so far have picked up a pair of Bose 601 Series 1 's , a Luxman RX 103 , a DBX 20/20 EQ . Looking for the right CD player next .
I love my vintage audio setup. Not that I go out and shop for it, but because I’ve owned most of it for 40 years! 😂 Visonik David 502s make awesome computer speakers.
My only concern if ever is pretty minor, scratchy pots, other than that I love that warmth and tactile interface of vintage gear... so much personality etc too... tbh honest you can be thrifty with vintage hifi but you have to know what to look for because what may look good may need some form of repair a.s.a.p.
P.s. never have had a problem with cleaning vinyl with a record brush and a little solution everytime before I drop the needle.
Location plays big into this conversation. Vintage electronics have a sound and muscle all their own, and modern gear just can't. compete. But like you said, there's going to be some attention that they need, and in my case, there just are no techs in Central Wisconsin, so if I want vintage equipment serviced right, it's a five hour drive to Skylabs. 😉 One day I'll make it there.
excellent video. lots of useful information. Thanks
Right now I am listening to Empire Scientific Grenadier 8000 speakers from 1964 with a class a tube amp with about 6 watts. It is a unique and lovely sound. But expensive and not for everyone. I am not a snob. When I was young it was always cutting edge 400 watt amps and the latest gizmo. And, at 70, I still like to shake the walls sometimes with the Allman Bros through 8 big 15 inch woofers, etc. Or just browse current hits with Alexa. I think we sometimes get in a kind of rut where we can turn a fun hobby into a drag. And getting pulled into vintage when it is not right for you, especially if you have young kids and lots of responsibilites is probably a mistake. I am retired. I have time and money to rebuild Bose 901s and clean pots and try out 50 different speakers before I keeps one. And it is a great source of fun and pleasure for me. But most folks are better off with a good new home theater, lots of streaming, and some new portable electronics, especially an excellent set of headphones and modern indestructibe speakers. And with a flexible digital audio processor like the Puffin preamp, honestly, you can get much of the sonic thrill of vintage gear. But give me Electro-Voice Aristocate 12RTX coax drivers with a big old folded horn from the 50s and a Denon DL-103 from 1962 on a double-belted Thorens with my hand built Dyna Stereo 70 and PAS preamp and I'm in geek antique audiophile heaven. It's all about the beauty!
I'm 63 and all my vintage audio set up was bought new at the time. 1980 Pioneer and 1990 Carver receivers. Early 90's Direct drive turn table, 90's Sony cassette deck with Dolby S. All bought at the peak of representative technology. Oh, and five 13" boxes of vinyl. A stack of CD's and cassette tapes including some shrink wrapped unopened.
Stereo, just two channels. Retiring soon, might sell it all to a knowledgeable person.
Agreed and please add No.8. If you are old which I am, it is too heavy to lift your gear and it could hurt your back.. As of today, I have more than 40 pieces of siver face Marantz. My son wants a modern gear and he does not want to take any of my goodies for free.
Thanks for the video.
Great videos Kevin, you got any thoughts on the Pioneer QX 9900 ?
Great review Kevin at skylabs...know ya said there's things to add to your audio, ol tuners when ya change the radio stations of hiss and static, keeping ur records. Cds cleaned, cassettes or 8tracks with keeping the metal heads ,that play the music clean , my mid 80s kenwood rack system had preset stations...old tuners do not...anyway..thanx for the video , .yt and music streaming is all preset..no loading or cleaning.....great review kevin....
Thanx for your ,reply ,Kevin, yeah...I luv ol vintage stereo...but since, started listening to yt. My cds ave found there way into my closet....Ave great cds too...Hendrix, band of gypsy. At the fillmore. Beatles white alblum, Stones, Black crowes. You name it ...I probably ave a cd for it....I luv the vintage stereo, but my system now is a ue wonderboom 2 bt speaker Anda cell phone....Would be afraid the vintage would find its way into the closet too..buttt!! My girl has a vintage bose cd sub / 4 speaker system, she wanted to get a soundbar..I told er no way..hooked the bose up to the tv....it sounds great and it's all wired....thanx again
One issue I had was some cd's were burned with hot levels, and I had to use a tape deck volume adjustment to stop the clipping
The #1 reason is what changed my mind. I had "vintage" stuff for years, but I couldn't keep it running, and no one in my area was competent enough to work on it. I finally gave up, bought all new, and haven't looked back. Now I have a garage full of expensive junk.
You right about this too, I got a Harmon Kardon 430 unit recently 25 watt, but I have a newer Sony and Yamaha receivers . I got the 430 unit for radio listening and playing tapes . I need to clean it the controls, and later replace the caps on it too., but I got this unit by swapping out my electronics I had a while too, I been around vintage audio nearly 50 years, so that being said I am a old timer 50s generational kid. You right what you saying it not for everybody facts.
Wished I lived closer and I’d be doing business with you folks….. Living in Ct it’s a bit of a haul….
Thanks, great video….
I recently broke up with what we call vintage audio for many of the reasons you mentioned here. I still love the looks and sound but got tired of carting the heavy gear to the shop every few months. I still use older separates but not the stuff from the 1970s and early 80s. Plus speaker technology has moved well past the kabuki boxes.
I have a good collection of both, if you like the 80s and 90s music, it sounds better on very high quality gear from that era. Biggest issue is the crazy power consumption of the 90's class AA amps, every night we accidentally go to bed leaving the power amps ON we come down to a sauna. So today, I have just taken delivery of a cheap amp (if you can call $400 cheap) that we are really impressed with that we can leave on 24/7 and it consumes about 5w with no input or output! At todays crazy electricity prices, It will pay for itself within 6 months
Class AA wasnt power hungry. Class A was. So i think you had class A amplifiers
Don’t forget, no hdmi interface. And, depending on year/ manufacturer, may not have a sub output. (There may be a “work-around“ for this problem).
I have an electronics engineering technology associate degree and I enjoy repairing my vintage equipment; I listen 👂 to a Dual 1019 turntable through a Pioneer sx-3600 reciever with a 5 CD carousel and Yamaha nx-e150 🔊
What is a fair price for a pioneer 737. Looks to be in great shape. The printing on the glass for the buttons is still perfect. I was surprised at that one. Most have the printing worn off or gone. What would also be considered a deal price on one? Im new so i have no clue. Looking for current market prices.
Required watching! I was fortunate to learn these lessons on not all that expensive Onkyo cassette decks. Repair doubled the cost and I ended up losing a function. lol It's for the hobbyist and audiophiles. The rest us can get by with working gear. lol
I do tend to agree when we're talking about amps and to a lesser degree about speakers. These just got better over the years. With turntables however, it is a different story. Turntables have gotten considerably worse in my view. Try to find a new one with wow and flutter below 0.1% RMS and a wooden plinth for example. In the 80's, almost all turntables came with a degree of quality that you have to pay over 500€ for these days. These things were just better built back then and putting together a vintage table will give you much better sound than buying a new one for half the money or less. I'd say that that is more than worth doing some tinkering and if need be then old electronics are very thankful subjects to start learning some soldering on. They are, in that sense, much easier to maintain than the new ones.
I use my PS Audio Sprout100 as the front end to my 1985 Yamaha A1000 integrated amp. The Yamaha has a slightly more pleasant sound quality to it.
Just picked up a beautiful condition Pioneer sx-1280 to go with my Thorens td124.
I do home remodels as well customer told me to get rid of a 1974 Yamaha CR-1000 receiver. I took it home researched it, turns out the mic input was stuck or corroded, bought a fix it kit from some company in NY replaced lights with leds and it's the most amazing sounding receiver. I have the cheapest Bowers and Wilkins speakers, I have no words, no one can believe the sound quality. It must weight 25 plus pounds. Why don't they make receivers' with wood cabinets anymore? Too expensive
Just a little advice as i own vintage sansui equipment and some new modern equipment if you dont have a shop near you or cant afford to get repairs i would not invest in it.I taught myself to repair it but there is a big investment there as you will need some test equipment and skills. Just my two cents !
As someone that's into electronics repair myself, vintage gear isn't always better. It can be a serious pain in the neck. I've seen things as weird as volume knobs worn out (not dirty) that can be difficult to replace in some models. Uncommon as it is. Also just measurably, the old ones are less well behaved with low impedance loads, especially tube amps for obvious reasons. You might not like the sound that has with your speakers if not designed for low damping factors.
Old amps should use a full recap at this point, ESPECIALLY pre-80's ones. That can be expensive and getting a good tech that can do that for you properly and cleanly is important, and they can be expensive.
Most importantly, the looks.. they look old. That might be your thing. It might not. But as for sound, they're going to be technically worse in most cases than decent new ones, which might sound subjectively be better to you
Great list 👍
Agreed the turntable has to be spotless (as do the records) to have perfect playback. or close to it.
I have four record decks all working perfectly comprising a Luxman PD272 (owned from new) a Garrard AP76 (I refurbed) a Dual 505-1 and 505-2 and I would not swap any of them for some of the mass produced "hi-fi" decks that flood the budget market now. The ONLY concession to an easy lifehas been adding an autolift to the PD272. I'm also still running a Kenwood 3020SE (bought new) amp which i sold to a friend and then bought back, because it's so good.
Living in a house built in 1895 I can relate to the creaking and other "guest" sounds. Purchased a pair of B&W dm620 speakers recently whose grille's stunk of cigarette smoke but I'm happy to report that the odor is gone now. I'm just wondering how old do electronics or speakers need to be to be considered vintage?
Good question. I honestly do not know
Definitely gonna be a fun one
As a fix-it guy......... ROTTEN CAPACITORS. I like to build things, so I've made my own tube amps based on classic designs.
There's vintage and Vintage vs new. I have one that appears to be a sweet spot. After 60 years it still operates (though it was gutted of the Dual Auto turntable). By now I am considering replacing several electrolytes. And another concern is though it has FM I think there is an artifact from Delta-Sigma extrapolation for 24 but resolution at the broadcast station. I have heard the same sounds in a couple of sound systems. Me thinks that's a problem with deep base since the Deltas are small. But some slightly newer vintage used foam surrounds for wolfers and they turned to mush in five years. New has the issue of design for replacement. Tube especially oil-paper caps. My Vintage is Germanium-Nuvister hybrid. My issue is sun damage to the cabinet. I like the restoration sites and and keep a watch.
Good comparison to remodeling an old house. How much "quaintness" are you willing to put up with?
I own over 10 vintage turntables, none of them came without issues. It is actually so bad that I now prefer to buy one that says it is broken. At least the price reflects that. Having said that, for me the cosmetic condition is very important and most of them tick that box. They also break down after you repair them, that is why it is good to have a few spare ones ready to go. I have a few vintage receivers (including Sansui) and amplifiers but I am only using a Luxman L210 amp. It has proven very reliable and has been trouble free from when I bought it for a few years now. I even forgot to turn it off when going on vacation and it survived a heat wave whilst being on for a few weeks. I like the sound of it as well.