PRACTICE CHALLENGE pt. 3 (Paganini Concerto ORIGINAL KEY)
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- Äas pĆidĂĄn 29. 06. 2019
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Practice Challenge: Me trying out the famous Paganini's Violin Concerto No. 1 in its Original Key of E flat Major using the special and incredibly difficult, virtually impossible technique called: "Scordatura"
Scodatura is - well, actually perhaps wikipedia might better define it:
âPaganini intended the Concerto to be heard in E-flat major: the orchestral parts were written in E-flat, and the solo part was written in D major with instructions for the violin to be tuned a semitone high (a technique known as scordatura) so that it would therefore sound in E-flat. This enables the soloist to achieve effects sounding in E-flat, which would not be possible with normal tuning. An example of this is the opening of the third movement, where the violin plays a rapid downward scale A-G-FâŻ-E-D, both bowed and pizzicato, which is possible on an open D-string, but extremely difficult in the key of E-flat (i.e. playing Bâ-Aâ-G-F-Eâ) because two strings would be required to play this downward scale, whereas only one string is required to play it in the key of D. In addition, having the orchestra playing in E-flat appears comparatively to mute the sound of the orchestra compared to the solo violin, because the orchestral string section plays less frequently on open strings, with the result that the solo violin part emerges more clearly and brightly from the orchestral accompaniment.â
R E S U L T : This was an interesting (and difficult) challenge because I honestly donât know a single soul in the world who has done this, and now I think I know why. It completely messes with your sense of pitch on the violin - an instrument that doesnât have frets per note, and one can only rely on open strings and perhaps a few natural harmonics as a basis of orientating oneself. Too bad the entire piece is in the stratosphere most of the time and goes by way too quickly (at performance tempo) to be able to consciously think out each note. Definitely made me thankful to go back to the regular tuning!
Much love to you all and thanks for watching! :)
If you enjoyed this video, check out these other PRACTICE CHALLENGE videos:
Practice Challenge pt. 2 (Paganini Caprice No. 24 in ONE hour) : âą PRACTICE CHALLENGE pt....
Practice Challenge pt. 1 (Paganini Sauret Cadenza) : âą PRACTICE CHALLENGE pt....
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Thanks for watching! If you enjoyed watching me struggle like a lost kid in the desert, and want more (you sadistic ppl), please go ahead and give this vid a thumbs up and subscribe to my channel!
Give it to Brett and he will nail it.
Elnar Dastan he sorta does if he tries (end of the QnA vid)
No, he will just shred and then look listlessly into the distance.
Or he will act like a dead as he does in his life mostly.
Nah he will use the edit
i think he meant relative pitch?
Yes, this is what playing without perfect pitch feels like.
*cries silently in the corner* no perfect pitch gang, where u at....... oh right we're suffering
Right? This is like every day of life in my practice! đđđ»
does ray have perfect pitch
or playing wind instruments probably (don't play any)
no this is even worse, because what we hear actually contradicts what we see in the score
reminds me of twosets "when you have perfect pitch and try to play in baroque tuning". just the opposite direction lol
when you have perfect baroque but play in pitch tuning
Ok
lol there is actually an A=465 tuning (Venetian pitch) in baroque tuning so it could be considered baroque hahahahahahahđ
This is definitely easier for people without perfect pitch. For us, there is no mental conflict between what we are reading and hearing. You just play the notes as written and accept whatever comes out lol
Yip, no problem for us "relative pitchers"!
@@megcsa thanks. Didnt think we have a name for it.
or probably for anyone with wind instrument experience (transposition)
Oof reading clarinet parts, and trying to play it on the violin
I canât stand to listen to it at all, off pitch. I wanna plug my ears, stat. I donât know if I have perfect pitch because I donât know how to read music. I can hear when anything is off pitch, though, and I just want it fixed fast.
I think Paganini hated musicians who had perfect pitch and found a way to destroy them
Hahahahaha
I guess it should be played without reading, no?
But Paganini had perfect pitch?
@@sloth6200 wtf are u doin here my lord
Jeremiah Parker who knows?
"Is this what a person that doesn't have a perfect pitch feels like? "
Brett has joined the group chat
Eddy has left the group chat
Lol lavya đđ
Eddy has Perfect pitch, Brett does not
Jakob Grene came here to say the same haha
D becomes E flat
and B FLAT BECOMES B NATURAL
Interesting
@Deimante Grigaliunaite Alma Deutscher
gnitseretnI
B becomes C
E becomes F
Dude like why
iNtErEsTiNg
Ray: *new tuning* "i can't even play a scale :""") "
Me: i can't even play scale in tune with the modern tuning :"")
So true đ
Honestly đ
"It completely messes with your sense of pitch on the violin". Well thankfully us unperfect pitch plebs wouldn't be affected as much. +1 to us hah
Bryan Lin -1 for me lol
I love how Ray's eyes get super intense when doing something very hard.
I have no perfect pitch. Absolutely easy for me. Tune the violin as you wish, it'll always be the same finger positions
Links Awakening but can you play paganini
;-;
LITERALLY HOW IT FEELS
@@nychi7007 damn đđ
SAAAAAME HAHAHAHAHA
Paganini was certainly the biggest rock star of all time.
Ben lee approves
Your Asian mum doesn't approve
Yes, Ray, this is what it's like for someone without perfect pitch to learn a difficult piece. You have to read and then try EVERY NOTE and EVERY INTERVAL and only then you can go ahead.
Well, there is always youtube recordings ...
@Deimante Grigaliunaite I remember melodies in the wrong key lmao
Oof guys can I get a F in the chat for Bretts soul after this flex
E#
TheBlueGaming 7 bruh thatâs backwards itâs f#
@@bithaniaandemariam1453 no you see there isnt a E# since e and f are semitones apart and not whole steps so e#=f
TheBlueGaming 7 WHOOSH EVERYONE KNOWS THAT ALREADY
Eb in original tuning
Ray it would be kinda epic for you to be the first one to play this scordatura in concert (other than Paganini of course)
It's already done. Massimo Quarta did it and here in CZcams you can find the CDs, just search "Massimo Quarta paganini" .
I also heard Ilya Gringolts play the scordatura version in concert with the Australian Chamber Orchestra, on gut strings too! Authentic to the core and absolutely awe inspiring, it was one of the greatest treats one could ever wish for. Gringolts is an absolute magician.
It sounds so shiny and brilliant in its original key. I actually kinda like it more.
That was pretty amazing though.
"I'm not even reading notes right now. I'm reading numbers" Welcome to playing viola after playing instruments written in treble or bass clef for 9 years. I still can't tell you what note is what in alto clef... only viola fingeringsđ ... Of course Ray still sounds one hundred times better than I ever do...
As a cellist whose had to do tenor and alto, change of middle c, and bass clef, but mainly tenor I feel you
As a violist that's how it feels to switch to treble clef, especially something like the intro to the Hendemith Viola Concerto (Der Schwanendreher)
Dont read numbers, learn to translate the notes conceptually as well,
Me after trying to read alto clef: -_-
fascinating. paganini found a way to turn perfect pitch into a handicap. he was more genius than people realize XD
that said, also thought the piece sounded better in Eb than D
Not if you have good enough relative pitch.
but it sounds way much better in half note higher version!!
Get why paganini did that
Eb sounds way too high for me, almost impossible to listen to. Makes me even happier I chose the cello over the violin :)
Ray totally changed the perception of classic music. In the past, I felt those world-class musicians are so far away because I only see them on stage. They are all prodigies who are a different type of human. But after watching Ray Chen's channel, I get to see how he practices, how he improves himself, and how he wants to share the joy to inspire normal people like me to learn about music.
Twoset will be like
Eddy : This is too hard!!!
Brett : This is too easy
Me : I N T E R E S T I N G
Try it with noise-cancelling headphones! I think that would be easier
World's okayest violinist should be change to *The Ling Ling violinist* because you're too good to be world's okayest violinist :)
Presto likes pasta too okay to be worldâs okayest violinist^ ^
@@Lan-ek1qz yuppp
Another reason why mr perfect pitch doesn't know rachel podger. Respect to baroque players hahahahaha
Ps, came here for his alleged diss on brett hahahahaha 10:11
I love how in the devil shop there is also "Ling Ling 40hr practice". Good job Ray, good job
The real question is are those both strads?
Ray....I had quite the experience of having to perform with a reverse scordatura technique. I did a lot of performing with blues and jazz in Vegas, and was in a huge bar in New Orleans. There was a great fiddler who was playing, and my buds told him of me.
He invited me on stage, hands me his violin, and I am ready to jam with his band. Then he tells me, after giving me his violin, that the strings are tuned down half a step. Great panic immediately ensued (as I believe the words "Holy F.... came to mind), particularly as I had just consumed my 4th Hurricane of the night (which from that I learned a valuable lesson.....don't drink and play!). I bleerily stared out at a couple of hundred people, and just pretended the strings were the usual. Whatever music came out, unlike your audiences, this crowd was so hammered....they thought it was ok!
Thus no sheet music and complete improvisation, with a reverse scordatura technique, while being legally intoxicated. Since that musical experience/trauma of many, many years ago, l don't drink, have run 25 marathons, and give you kudos for staying in great shape. So Ray, if you want a real Ling-Ling challenge, have 8 shots of tequila, and then pick up that $69 violin you did a video on (for God's sake not your Strad!), tune the strings down half a step, and see how Paganini comes out. Likely...way, way better than almost all of us!
As a person without perfect pitch, this is exactly what sightreading is like.
Those were some of the best, most ridiculous faces ever.
I'm impressed you got as far through that nightmare as you did.
That was stupid-hard.
0:38
specials: 1 soul
Lingling 40hr PRACTICE
EXTREME VIOLIN POWER
anyone notice? dats cute awww
How do you tune the E string to F without breaking it
Daniel Chieng IKR!!
The string will break at F-sharpish
ling ling can play perfectly no matter what the strings are tuned to
Even if it sounds like viola.
lingling can play it on the clarinet
Ling Ling can play paganini on drums, and make it sound like violin.
lingling can play it by clapping hands
Ling ling would play perfectly on a completely out of tune instrument
1:27
"Ah...IntErstIng ! đ€"
Child prodigy pianist vibe anyone ? đđ
sameee. it reminded me of eddy's interesting facr
@@zeynepy exactly !
I appreciate your Paganini challenges so much! BECAUSE, my parrot has taken to trying to sing along with you and he is mostly in pitch. The last 6 months he has spent hours a day imitating a smoke alarm needing a battery change which has been a horror story. Now my parrot is trying to sing left hand pizzicato passages.
But the standard frequency of tuning would have been much lower in Paganini's age. I'm not sure of the specific number, but it must have been somewhere between the Baroque pitch of A415 and the modern A440. So this means you might have already been playing a semitone higher!
genius
No, in the 19th century tunings were actually getting higher than the universal standard we use today. Pitches high as A=450+ were getting used in orchestras and is the reason why 19th century France passed a law that A=435 should only be used by orchestras to counter the pitch inflation.
@@vesteel A country passed a law on the frequency of A?
@@da96103 yes, it was called the "French Tuning" or "diapason normal"
@@vesteel paganini was born in the 1700s
Ummm donât quite understand the struggle sorry Ray :)
Canât relate since Iâve got relative pitch. Team Brett Yang rules lol!
"RELATIVE pitch. Can't RELATE" :>
please keep posting these they help me learn how to practice, and have fun while doing so.
This is a common "technique" for double bassists. The double bass sounds a tone step higher than what is written in the notes. It's called solo tuning and is used to get a more solistic sound.
Paganini: Want to play a prank?
Publisher: What?
Paganini: Lets create a fake story that I actually wanted the piece to be in the key of E flat and tuned my violin a semitone higher when I played it in concert and see if anyone in the future does that.
Paginini: HAhAHaHSH
I really like the sound of this. So bright!
I've been waiting so long for part 3
Love you so much! Always support for youâ€â€â€
I agree Ray! That's making my head hurt! LUUUUV the shirt!
I love your Practice challenge videos!
Love your videos, Ray!! You are great! Thanks!â€đđđđđ
Beijos do Brasil!đ§đ·đ§đ·đ§đ·đ§đ·
Love it in this key! My sense of relative pitch is very happy that the intervals are what it's used to.
Yay your back. I can't wait to get my violin and re learn everything
I really like these videos. super helpful on how to practice the hard violin sections of any piece.
The opening is basically : "I went to look up how to contact the Devil regarding a few points in our contract... but then..."
Please continue with the practice challenges! I used to play violin and I enjoy learning from your videos. My 15 month old son stops in his tracks to sit and listen. Educational for me and entertaining for him. âșïžđđ»
Loved it! Thank you Ray.
I really like it in this key. It's hard to describe but it definitely has a different sound.
ray we need more of this pls
Well jokes on you, I make more mistakes than you when you are like this and when Iâm in normal tuning. Take that.
At last I found the scordatura tuning more beautiful indeed.
Thatâs just because it sounds higher than youâre used to. If you only listened to the higher key your whole life, and then at the end listened to it at normal key, you would think it sounded better too. Even if youâre hearing the piece for the first time here, he showed the original first, which means youâre comparing the higher tuning to the original anyway.
I wish you all the success in the world because you deserve it. Abraço Oiara â€â€â€
I was hoping for the last rose of summer, but this is even better, one of my favourite concertos and a technique I have been very interested in!
I guess this would be easier for a player without perfect pitch, because they couldnt really tell the difference, or atleast it wouldnt bother them as much. I think they rely on muscle memory and intervals anyways.
Paganini when composing scores..... *IT'S JUST A PRANK BRO
Holy crap, my respect for you!
Omfg, original key sounds so much better and brighter than today's
This is amazing! I will never be able to do this. My niece can do it though. But she's not a violinist, she's a fiddler. Plays everything by ear. I asked her to play a fiddle tune with me (I play them on guitar) but I preferred with a capo on the second fret. Meaning the song that is in the key of G would be in A. She said, "no problem". I was sceptical, but whatever. She played it perfectly the first time through up to speed. No mistakes. When we were done I looked at her like she was an alien and said, "how did you do that?!?" She said, "easy, it's just patterns". WTF? I think she must be an alien. That can't be in the realm of a normal human. Especially not someone related to me. Sheesh.
i need more of this
I could probably stop anywhere in the video and find a mood. Ray's practice face has to be the best thing in the world :O
I bet... if you recorded yourself playing it with headphones on so you couldn't hear yourself and was only looking at the sheet music. You'd be surprised at how much your fingers know.
the original key is so beautiful
The temptation to get my violin out is high... please no its midnight;-;
Girl, I feel you. Ă©_Ăš
This is so interesting to see, Iâve learned violin almost entirely by feeling (as in, orientations of notes on a staff represent location of the fingers for playing violin) so seeing someone struggle with this stuff seems very odd to me! I had to practice with tons of ear training to get perfect pitch, so for me I can turn it on and off! I learned everything on violin by noticing that odd numbered positions always land your first finger on a line or ledger line. Iâd say maybe try practicing notes by corresponding them to lines and spaces while ignoring note names themselves, it might help with scordatura pieces!!
He nailed it
YAYYYY!! SOUNDS SO MUCH BETTER IN Eb!!!
Rip Brett
Nice Video! Please continue playing Violin
These videos actually make me want to practice. Thatâs so cool lol
We all know that youâre an amazing violinist, but when you play this piece, your T-shirt matches so well with this piece. J/k! You played amazingly. What a great challenge! And LOL, you added Brettâs photo for someone who doesnât have âperfect pitch.â =D
10:12 LOL Brett. Ray youâre so savage XD
"hey practice buddies" is the cutest intro ever
Ray - Great job - you're courageous! I'm absolutely certain that the difficulties encountered with the scordatura tuning are simply because of the tuning setup of the violin. I never just simply tune my violin strings - what I mean is that I don't just tune my violin strings - I first tune the short part of the strings which goes past the bridge : so the short part of the d string should sound an "a" exactly two octaves and a fifth above the open D string (the short part should sound in other words at exactly the same pitch as the first harmonic on the next higher string - the A string's harmonic on the 'd' note on third finger first position). Each string has to be treated like this - it involves having a precise configuration of distances with respect to the bridge the long and the short part of the string. When you tune your violin sounds magnificent! the most important thing is to have your violin setup in a way such that the bridge is in its usual position between the notches in the f-holes : this usually means adjusting the bottom tailpiece so that it is at a precise distance from the bridge in order to achieve this precise tuning of the short part of the strings. It's worth it - makes your violin sound magnificent! Believe it or not it also means that your volume is always going to be into him even when the long strings maybe slightly out-of-tune - take my word for it, your musical brain will thank you. If the short parts of the string are not tuned in any specific way it causes your brain to be confused - I know because I have perfect pitch. Anyway this whole system applies to scordatura tuning also : you just make sure that the short part of the strings is tuned to scordatura first - otherwise you may have the short part of the strings tuned to the normal non scordatura tuning and then youll try to tune the long strings to the scordatura tuning which will make a terrible terrible conflict between the two systems of tuning.
omg ray you uploaded this at the wrong time i had to perform this at my recital in june and i watched your practice vid on your sauret cadenza but i neeeeeeeded this
Well actually there's a type of notation standard called çźè°± that expresses music as numbers (and apparently everybody hates it especially those who have studied normal sheet notation with clefs and notes), but coming from a perspective of a person that has learned both I can say both of them have their strengths and weaknesses. The çźè°± ïŒjian pu) notation style itself makes changing keys a lot easier. Not to say this piece would be easier with that or that this piece is easy in itself. The notation itself does not express music not as individual notes themselves, but rather as the relationship between successive notes, well not really the 'relationship' but the position of notes in a scale, if that makes sense. Thus it's much easier to change keys and the whole music sheet does not need to be rewritten (yeah, it enables musicians to change keys on the spot, without any changes to the sheet music). Granted a mastery of the keys are required for instant key change to be easy as the fingerings are different.
If you have any questions regarding the notation standard I would be happy to answer them for you :)
I am basically just watching this video for the ricochet technique so great watch it slower so much to learn
I was today years old when I learned that Curtis students could forget to play an E Major scale
What really helps is to put on noise cancelling headphones and play the piece. I recorded it trying this and it sounded pretty decent cuz itâs all muscle memory at that point.
Possibly the reason why this is in E-flat Major, was because Paganini played pieces by Johann Sebastian Bach. And back during the Baroque period, strings were tuned *down* a semitone. (Example: Playing a piece in D Major would sound as if it was in D-flat Major.) And I believe Paganini wanted to know what it sounded like tuning the strings *up.* Please note this is just my belief. It may be true, it may not be.
It's wonderful watching you work on the challenging and fantastic Paganini works. However, Paganini was actually not the first performer/composer to use left hand pizzicato in his compositions. It was recently rediscovered that Carl Stamitz indicated left hand pizzicato with a "0" above the notes in his original transcription of his viola concerto in D Major.
I feel like you need a compilation of all the different faces you made. đ it was still amazing to watch!
Haha yes thats how it feels to not have perfect pitch đ
And also Ray, sadistic as I am, I loved to see you struggle as much with this as I do whit a beginner version of Ode to joy
This is aMAzing!
Anyone else notice how he becomes a beginner at his technicals while playing? His right arm basically became rock
WOW! Great job!! Lololol I'm still working on forgetting the sight-reading sessions I did one or two months ago of this one and number two!! It's so I can post really slow practice clips of trying to learn one of them, then fresh sight-reading videos of the other one before the rest of the slow practice clips lol đ
i play the double bass and we use this very often. basses are tuned like gdae and most concerto pieces are played in solo tuning which is aebf#. its so hard, i relate so much bc when i tell music friends how hard solo tuning is bc i have perfect pitch
Omg, so difficult đźđź I loved the TwoSet refferences đ
Mahlers 4 has this too. The concert master has the "devil plays violin" parts where the violin is tuned up half a note. I struggled a lot playing it (and broke quite a few e strings too). In the end it turned out that for me it was easier to write the notes as they sound (so c becomes c# written and so on) and just have akwared fingering over having them written as fingered but sounding completly wrong.
Hey Ray, love these practice videos, it gives more perspective on how important patience is. Also, I was wondering what strings you use? Cheers
Came for the playing, stayed for the faces
Whoa, also--that difference in sound at the end! I mean, I know you said that's why he did it, but still...!
Damn still sounds great
Hey! And Brett has to be the perfect example of a non-perfect pitch violinist?!
Simeona Martinez yass
I'm not playing violin but I DEFINITELY CAN RELATE when I played on electric keyboard. Because I'm used with playing acoustic piano, so when I played on the electric keyboard and the key was transposed, it feels like they're messing up with my brain đ€đ€đ€
If you have good relative pitch and can play by numbers rather than by pitch, it's easier to do than for someone who's perfect pitch is alway telling you your wrong. A good Twoset experiment.
Lovely
When he said itâs not my tunings fault I felt thatđ«đ„șđ„ș