Why I would NEVER buy a VW UP! GTI
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- čas přidán 14. 01. 2018
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![The up! GTI is the best Volkswagen GTI product in years. Here's why! [Review]](/img/n.gif)
Suddenly, the UP is now also for rent! 80€ per lap inc fuel OR 60€ if you book before February! Shoot me an email: misha@apex-nuerburg.com
supreme
Love this video. You really know your UP's! Great to hear all the differences and improvements with the 7UP
Misha Charoudin ö
Misha Charoudin
TC off in UP! :
1. Car off but key switched on
2. Put hazards on
3. Push the gaspedal 5x (tc off light must go on now)
4. Start car and have fun 🚗💨🔥
Commie moron, aren't renting a car capitalist thing???
If you think of the difference in price not as 5000 euros more, but as 40 - 45% more, then it becomes even more ridiculous.
javoresku yep
Rule number one for creating m.strategy for firm that makes money from selling cars or financial services. Never tell the price difference in %. Подобно на бързите кредити, не казват лихвата на година, а на месечна база.
TC off in UP! :
1. Car off but key switched on
2. Put hazards on
3. Push the gaspedal 5x (tc off light must go on now)
4. Start car and have fun 🚗💨🔥
It work only at low km
@@jonathan2fast4u I know
@@kevv010 so its useless
Love the video, thanks for posting. I have a stock standard Up, and I absolutely love the car. Incidentally, it's the 2 door version with leather seats (or probably pleather) as opposed to the usual cloth seats. I'd love to do some mods to the car, but that'll have to come later when finances allow. I'm from South Africa.
Nice Vlog as always - well done for keeping content coming during the winter. I agree with you on the UP! GTI - you've done so much to your own UP! that a GTI would be a disappointment at this stage.
I totally agree with you, i'm looking for a Up! as my first car and was also looking into the Gti but wasn't impressed, and this makes my choice much easier. Now i just need to find some good seats for in the front. Btw Thank you for going into so much detail to explain your stance on this topic
I like the 6-speed gearboxes... But i get the point... not even a TC off on the GTi!? Why is it a GTI then?
1.4 TSI with that 6-speed, better brakes and a more sport-focus suspension (and the TC button) would be perfect!
Here in Canada, you can get a base Civic Sedan LX for $12k GBP (with K20C2 engine, heated seat/mirror, climate control, android auto/apple etc). Cool thing is, when you turn off the Civic's traction control, you can completely fry the front tires while standing still and TC stays off. Perhaps VW should check out Honda's TC tuning for everyday use.
edcunhaph its an UP! It is marketing and not an track car. If you want those specs get an Polo GTI.
Its cheap. Maybe they build a 30k Up in the future.
TC is part of the ESP, and that got mandatory in the EU after 2014. You can't really turn it off in new cars, hence "Sport Modes". I Gues VW simply did not wanted to program a specific ESP software for a cars that was sold only in homeopathic numbers in it's very short production time.
@@borisbommenif you’re goner spend the extra money better off with the Fiesta ST slaps the Polo GTI
Here in Brazil the TSI came with 105 HP and 16.8 kgfm, so a bit more then in Europe. That makes the difference even smaller. People are remapping and getting something around 150 HP without any related engine damages. But the biggest gain I see is that they found a way to attenuate the TC in the process and forcing it to be less intrusive. A huge nice collateral. I'm driving one abanero TSI CrossUp!
I have the naturally aspirated 60 hp one... I wanted to configure my own with 75 hp because 60 sounded ridiculous... VW told me we'd had to wait over 3 months and I just couldn't, so I got it from a dealership that had the 60 hp automatic ones in stock.
The single clutch automatic is kinda bad, but once you learn how to drive it, it's... okay.
The 60 hp engine is what surprised me though: I was able to pull off a 0-100 in about 8 seconds and the engine doesn't sound too bad when accelerating! It has a deep beefy roar to it, compared to a four cylinder. It kinda sounds like a V6 tbh... love the sound of the n.a. engine!
Even on the highway, people are so surprised how quick it gets up to speed... The transmission happily downshifts to a (very) low gear (which is necessary to have at least some torque) and will overtake pretty much everyone.
It has done 180 km/h at a little over 4K rpm (it's limited to 4K but sometimes will exceed 4K just a little bit) and is so much faster and snappier than my friend's 70+ hp Smart ForFour that does 130 at like 5000 rpm...
I never thought about the TSI engine because I haven't had very good experiences with VAG's 4 cylinder TSI engines (very high fuel consumption, unreliability, misfires, uneven idle, ...). I see why a turbo makes so much more sense in this car, but honestly, even the 60 hp got my wheels spinning more than I want it too when it gets just a little wet outside because it's so lightweight and because it sends almost all of its torque to its wheels so quickly...
Only when turning into a street that goes uphill (car goes to second), you notice it's a small three cylinder: even while flooring it, it picks up speed rather slowly...
It's not my dream car, it's *very* basic and it's kind of too small for me, but it's a fun little car though!
Nice video, very informative. Good points!
Keep up the good work.
Still think the G40 Polo is the best small sports car VW have ever made, that had vented discs up front and again drums on the rear, brake fade was pretty alarming on it. It put out about 115-120 BHP as standard, which doesn't seem much but as it was supercharged the power was available pretty low down, and it had close ratio box too, which gave it pretty good acceleration for the late 80's, and pretty nasty torque steer, still a nice wee car to drive, I loved mine.
Hi Misha,
Although I agree with you normally, I do think that your missing the point slightly on the GTI, not everyone would want to modify a 90ps TSI as it would void the warranty and the GTI is about creating some theatre everyday for normal journeys which it does very well, it also looks cool and handles quite well given its size. I wish it had LED lights as standard and better bolsters on the seats but it doesn't take away from how much fun the car is it also sounds great when you are driving it. I work in sales at a VW dealership in England and have been driving the Up! GTI for a few days and it never fails to put a smile on my face, that's what makes this car special :)
9:35 i payed for the whole speedometer so i will use the whole speedometer
My Seat Arosa did 170kmh
The top speed is 151kmh
The speedo goes to 200kmh I am kind of disappointed...
The reason i bought my Up Gti, is because its as close to the original Golf Gti as its possibly to be.
Almost identical horsepower figures, 0-60 times almost the same, as is the top speed.
The original 1977 Gti ALSO HAD REAR DRUM BRAKES, as does the UP., so there's no complaints there.
The Up is a back to basics fun warm hatch, just brilliant fun to own and drive.
The biggest reason for my purchase, was because i already own a Move Up!, which is a great town car, and i simply love the looks of the Up Gti.
That's all that matters.
The first time I saw it was last year in Worthersee.. First reaction : no rear brake discs , no decent support on the seats and a lot of hard plastic on the dash , doorpanels ,.. It is most certainly not worth the amount of cash you have to pay for it.. So Misha , I'm with you on this one. If you want a performance UP! , buy the TSI and use the extra money to do upgrades.
Agreed. "We" have the same problem with the Renault Twingo/smart forfour : traction control can't be desactivated.
Such a pity for a rear engine/propulsion car.
Well thought out explanation Misha, you brought up a lot of good points that VW should be able to address if they care to do so. Perhaps they will do so in some sort of "UP! R" version?
Totally agree mate! When I bought my original 70bhp UP in 2013 there was talk of the UP GTi coming out, fast forward 5 years and its finally here, yet it has nothing to shout about at all, how can VW badge something "GTi" and have the cheek to slap drum brakes on it and not allow ESP to be diss engaged. The 6th gear would be welcome on the highway though, proving its actually longer than the current 5th. Cheers buddy
For a big part of customers, marketing > product value. Look at McDonalds, Apple...
has the same performance as the orignal golf gti, which they were aiming for, considering they have the nearly the same dimensions and weight.
They should have put the 1.5 EVO in it!
It should be named UP-R! and have a 2 liter 300hp engine.
Have you actually driven one? The brakes are fine for one thing, and most people would never trouble the ESP let alone want it disengaged
Had the same thoughts about the Up GTI a couple weeks ago while planed to buy one.
At the end it was to expensive for what it is and what it overs so I ended up with a used Twingo RS for a third of the price.
Sure it has a totally different Engine but still they very comparable.
And most important difference, you can turn off the TC to 100% just by pressing the button.
I love how he pans to the empty space where the GTI would have been :D
When I was watching the grand tour and they mentioned the traction control, the first thing that came to my mind was you Misha xD
Agree 100 % regarding the standard seats. I got an up as a work car but had to swap it out for a fiesta, just because the seat hurts my back!
Here in Brazil, people do not have much issues with traction control. Here we have one thing called "Tork One". It turns the traction control off and increases power.
Great video!
A GTI still won't allow you to disable the traction control = EPIC FAIL!
yes you can. but you need i man who can do it for you :)
you just have to remove the first fuse (nº30) to turn off the TC, we have some OBD2 TC controller too....
I just have to push a button in my car which is ...not a GTI.
Easily done.
I am buying one to stance out. Air ride with some nice simmons rims. Might get a large roof rack carrier case too. Love the aesthetics of the Up!
I was looking for a used TSI after having had 2 regular 75 hp ones that I absolutely loved as daily drivers. TSI's are rare as hens teeth (Sweden in my case) I've seen 3 for sale in a year, about the same for the GTI's. Got a GTI Yesterday, 23000 km's, one owner, mint condition from a private seller and they are the same price here as a used TSI, so in that case it's a no-brainer to get the GTI if not for the looks of it alone and again, for the rarity if anything with just 46 sold, dunno the sale numbers of the TSI ut it's more, I've yet to spot ONE GTI on the road.
I have a Up! TSI here in Brazil and our model comes with 125-130hp proved on many dynos, our Up model is flex-fuel too but we don't have many accessories and the TSI model only come in 4 doors --'.....some people are using the Golf TSI 1.4 turbo and reaching the 200hp in that little 3 cylinder engine...........and if you want so much to turn-off the TC, just remove the first fuse (nº30)
lol misha don't forget to breathe :D
hi misha.nice videos.what mods have you done on the 7up enginewise?
I have a up TSI in Brazil, and here it comes stock with 105whp using etanol and 101whp using gasoline, measured in the dynamometer(our cars are flexfuel). Some piggybacks, already can turn TC off, without turning ABS off. One of them is the TORK ONE, and their remap, reach 156hp, with intake and exhaust. For me the only thing i want of the GTI is the 6-speed gearbox.
Pedro Cesar Matos aeeeee ó o BR aqui huehuehuehue
ta curtindo o carro? so no remap pega quanto? to considerando pegar um
Nelito G. Vieira Junior de velocidade vc fala?? Up remap pega 230 de gps, se for uma puta descida e muito longa deve chegar nos 240. O meu tá original, consigo relativamente fácil 201~202 de gps e numa puuuuuta de uma descida muiiiiito longa consegui pegar 206(de gps, pq de painel tava marcando quase 215). Mas o remap o carro chega nisso muito rápido, em reta normal pega 220 fácil, outro nível..
E o carro fica estavel? Tenho um gol g6 e a uns ~150 ja nao passa confiança
Nelito G. Vieira Junior ahhh, 200 por hora no aro 14 com duraplus, qual a chance?? Acho de boa andar até uns 160 dependendo da estrada, acima disso começa a encher o saco..
Thank you for this video! I was thinking about getting a GTI but this actually gave me good doubts about it. Will probably start looking for a normal up! if the numbers add up. 👍🏻
Go for TSI!
You forgot about the part where the GTI weighs almost 100KG more then the TSI which is just plain stupid.
Hi Misha, reallynice and informative video. I really like your UP.
I have a quick suggestion on the Traction Control issue. JP is building an 1.8t up and in one of the videos he disabled the TC by pulling a fuse. I check a fuse diagram and there are 4 or 5 fuses for the ABS. If you try removing them one by one, you could find a scenario where you have ABS but no TC.
Other people unplug an ABS wheel sensor and so disable ABS.
The 3rd option is to wire in a button. Some Skoda's use the same ABS module and have a TC off button wired in, where the UP doesn't. I hear if you wire in the button you get the TC-off funktion even without coding.
I hope I have been helpful :)
Ceers!
Yavor Tsanev where to would you wire the button?
Hi Misha, the button should wire in to the ABS control module. Here is the thread i read it in. Reply 2 or 3. forums.ross-tech.com/showthread.php?3911-ABS-Module-on-VW-UP-help-disabling-Traction-Control
You can look into details on the skoda rapid and compare with what you have in the up. Normally such circuits work by adding +12v or a ground to the pin to activate or deactivate a certain feature.
I hope i helped :)
Yavor Tsanev THANKS!!!
The best content for day off!
Actualy I love the up with your smaller wheels than the ones on the gti
Good argument mate ..But 90% of Gti buyers will be driving it around the city and parking outside gyms and coffee shops and love the brand name i personally love the Up Gti its a great little package and the 5K premium u pay will hold more on resale than a ur lower model in stock form ..Great vid
Why does everything these days have to be brand, but not actualy do the things the brand stand for. Its for all consumer stuff. After they have "the name" they lose quality.
U know.. still waiting for the rg video hahahahaha..
I'm very interested but also a bit confused about the Up. Which models have the TSI engine? In the UK I go on Auto Trader and there is no sub varient called the TSI. So what model has it? Or have I missed something?
Hi Misha,
I have become a big fan of yours and all the Apex crew in recent months. I'm slowly getting through all of your vlogs one at a time. I'm disappointed to her your negative views about the UP! GTI, but it strangely wasn't put me off. I'm not looking for a track car, just something to drive to work in without the car boring me to tears! I have a track/race car already for spirited driving and am currently building another, so out and out performance is not important to me. If I do end up buying an UP! GTI I will come to Nurburg to visit you and Apex. That would make for an interesting I'm sure. Keep up the fantastic work and we will talk again I'm sure.
Kind Regards,
Mario
Well standard 60HP Up the Sub7Up has UPped the game a lot 😎 😉
Just clarify, you get a lot more standard features on the GTI.
You will get more options included:
Heated door mirrors
Heated seats
Brakes are larger.
Proper GTI steering wheel.
Beats sound 7 speakers
And a few more... well worth it.
Buy a Clio like mine (1.6l 107PS), give it the full "Apex Treatment" and you have a better car for 11k. If maintained well, I'm sure the engine will do around 200.000km, even if bought with 100kkm and run on the track from then :D
Watched further in now - do a few UK track days a year mostly leave my traction control on, never had disc cracking issues maybe I should switch it off more!
Love this vid. Proves all my statements about the Gti!
Keep it up guys!
Well JP wants to give his up a quattro system and tune the 1.8T to 500hp, but I still wonder what could the max. power output of the stock 1.0l can be... Maybe around 200hp while still getting good economy and being reliable?
I'm thinking of getting a 90 PS 2018 Up! and tunning the software to 130hp. My biggest concerns are the transmission/clutch and warranty. Also I haven't found one to drive, I don't know if I'l like the handling coming from a 260PS Alfa 147 Q2 with a LSD and Koni suspension.
I found out that my mk2 fabia 1.6tdi Monte Carlo came factory with 103bhp and 184ftlb of torque and took it to a dyno and it made 119.4bhp and 225ftlb of torque which is surprising and yet also came with drums on the rear in the uk for some reason.
I know this is an old upload but @3.07 you're saying that with decent fuel 98 octane or higher this engine produces 90hp on the wheels or even higher. Now I have the same engine on the polo and always have had this fuel dilema. 95 or 100 octane. Vw suggests 95 octane for the engine and the general consesus is that higher octane fuel is wasted since the engine can not take advantage of the extra octanes. I have been using both 95 and 100 but havent yet fully understood. Is higher octane fuel better for this engine ?? Ive also tuned it with APR stage 1 95 RON still tuner suggests I only use 100RON !! My question is, should I use 95 or 100 Octane ?
I'm still waiting for the UP! R420 4Motion
i want this as my first car. its a dream car for me! its soo cool!!
Completely understandable. A modified and built TSI or even up cup (lol) would still be a better route to take.
Why can't they put a different and bigger, better engine, i am sure they have the resources.
Well said Misha! Lots of knowledge in that brain of yours...
CARMRADES Sticker in the right lower corner, i like this :-)
Hi there what clutch kit have you installed which can handle abuse
If the up reaches more than 200 kp/h in 4th gear, wouldn't it be smart to chance the gears in the dif (if possible) to shorten the gear ratio? Tell me if i'm wrong.
I'd still get the Fiesta ST, especially given its price.
I don't like the interior of the ford, resting on laurels come to mind.
I am a fan of the last polo gti i think it's more on the sprite of the original golf gti. But sill if get an st150 or try and get a 200 iirc the 200 rrp is 18k.
We don't even get the TSI in my country, guess I'll have to stick to my 1ltr ecoBoost Fiesta.
Whats happening with the e90 in the corner, when we getting an update on that?
jp's upgewixxt projekt :D
Your UP! is the best because is was sculpted by craftsmen (e.g. Guerilla for the exhaust and Tom for the cage). Sculpted it is, not welded together by robots that only make money for VW.
RumbleBelly I read the last sentence as Yoda....
the 5th gear is already a huge leap from 4th, on the highway i'm getting 500-600k's on a single tank the economy is amazing. I just don't see the point in a 6th gear when i'm already getting 2.5-3k rpm on 5th
Cant you turn off the traction control like may in the grand tour by pulling the fuse out?
It is linked to the ABS, so no,
So switch off ABS. Again fine for the track
Fun stuff, there's no TC button, but it can easily be disabled through VCDS or OBDEleven. It even shows a neat "Anti-Slip Regulation (ASR) Has been disabled" on the dashboard's LCD Panel.
I honestly wonder why they didn't add a TC OFF button, when they have everything necessary to logically single out the Traction Control. Marketing reasons maybe?
GTMoraes VCDS said there was no permission. OBDElevel only does ESP, no TC
Oh, modules might be different between our cars, then
I own a brazilian Up TSi, the ASR toggle is located in the Brakes module here. Maybe TC is regulated by your ESP module (which we stupidly don't have. Thanks volks brazil), so it might be different than what I'm thinking
i.imgur.com/GgEMOJf.jpg
Watching this makes me want to swap the TSI engine into my Skoda Citigo... shouldn't be that hard and would make a nice project!
Most interesting thing for me now when up isnt that much on the channel is that when I go back and watch videos of UP UPsetting supercars and think about that, it is like "holy sh*t", but back in the days it was normal thing to see everyday on vlogs.
5rdjo Graphics yeah, waiting for the track to re-open again
Absolute perfekt and helpfull describtion ! I hate all the "car magazines" they just Talk shit that nobody needs Really you explain it so perfekt i was Really Close to buy one now but u hold me off Thank you. No tcs off shit brakes shit seats shit Suspension they build this crap call it gti People Think wow i have a racecar and they have done nothing. Good sports cars that dont weight 3000kg getting so rar..
okay misha i see what u are saying , where i live there are laws regarding how much u can tune your engine(max20percent extra)so the gti model can be tuned harder(more max power) then the lower powered models , but that's here in rule denmark :( .when i grow up i'm going to the ring 4 a drive !!!
Question: would you have suggestion how to tune the 60HP version to an enjoyable level? Like maybe around 120-140 HP? Those are really cheap now used while the TSI is like double priced, so I was thinking if it would be possible to just get a 60 HP, then remap, add turbo, intercooler and all those step by step (meaning I could periodize my expenditures). What do you think?
Bit late to the party but the gearbox would be your issue. They can only handle like 140nm or something before you'll wreck em
Did you try to remove a fuse for the traction control? It worked on the older model, so maybe it works in yours.
It kills ABS too
Misha Charoudin another thing you don't need as proper racing driver :D
Brazilian up tsi with turbo upgrade do 9.0s in 1/8milha (201m)
Let talk for real here, the Up needs an Aero Pack next. Maybe wider, lower, harder?
Is your price comparison between a High Up TSI and a Up GTI? I don't have yet the retail price for a GTI but I guess that it wont be 5K, nor near, as you indicate.
It’s funny. In Brazil, we don’t have the Up! GTI, and the Up! TSI comes stock with a 105 hp (advertised) engine, and trust me, our gas is pretty much the worst quality you can get.
Hi Misha have you installed a Sub in your UP?
You forgot another disadvantage of the GTI compared to the TSI: Due to the newer regulation it has a particle filter (similar to DPF for Diesel cars) which makes it harder to tune legally.
BTW: Did you easily get TÜV on your TSI with the Racechip? I'm thinking about getting one, too.
Can you fit the new Vw up high up steering wheel with commands on the older model Vw Up High Up?
I want a customised tsi up now....
And trust me vw is a brand that i dont especially like but that car is amazing
2 years late BuT i got a Question,Can they be Shipped to the USA? Or would that fall into the 25yr thing like the skylines and stuff like that?
Here in Brazil the up! Tsi already have 105hp so that makes the 115hp of the up gti more non-sense than in the europe. And if i'm not wrong the tsi only have the 4 doors variant here in Brazil.
What tires are you using?
maybe you can program the TC out, from the ecu?
It is a pleasure to listen to someone who knows what he is talking about
Yes, the seats are the UP's worst feature for spirited cornering. Fly round a corner on the grip threshold and you end up almost sitting on the passenger seat...
Which Recaro seats have you fitted?
I agree with you. The standard seats are shit on longer journeys.
Pole Position
GREAT VIDEO, MISHA, YOU MAY HAVE SAVED US A FEW THOUSAND QUID. WHAT IS THE GRAND TOUR VIDEO YOU ARE REFERRING TO THOUGH?
Misha ihr habt ja die recoursen könnt ihr vielleicht nen Up! Mit nem Polo GTI motor bauen? Einfach aus nem Totalschaden polo den Motor raus und rein in den UP! (Ich weiß es ist nicht so simpel) Aber ich glaube das wäre nicht so teuer wenn man nen alten up nimmt. Ich denke mal wenn man es vernünftig macht krigt man sogar TÜV
good video
I'd have the new swift sport over the up gti if I had to choose (more power + jdm points + lightweight)
The thumbnail is confusing. I thought there will be a foodshot but there wasn't any. So what was in that bowl?
I really wonder how the up gti will be sold and how those cars will be used
Chips.
Why Haven't you put disc brakes on the sub-7 Up? That would be a great UpGrade.
Wow never been this early. Good 17mins ahead.
Great points Misha. Buy the tsi and spend the balance to get proper parts and you probably will get a better car than the Up gti.
I've seen one run 135bhp on a dyno on 98 fuel. For me just seems Misha is justifying a modded car over a standard one. I run a modded mk4 and an ED30 and I'm getting tired of insurance issues (getting work use for both cars is almost impossible).
I quite fancy the Up GTI with everything on it and simple insurance. While I don't like the rear drum brakes the car weighs under 1000kg, for road use these will be perfectly adequate if not nice to look at! The whole review feels a bit "sour grapes".
Like the golf R a up R with a bigger engine and 4×4 would be a crazy little car alot of fun to
I love the Sub7UP.... But.. Currently in the UK a 3 door brand new base model 'High Up - 90PS TSI' is priced £12,675. The new base model 'GTI UP' UK price is £13,750. So for £1,075 more I get: 23PS more power, 6 speed gearbox, 15mm lowered and stiffened MacPherson suspension, Polo ventilated front brakes, Golf GTI sports steering wheel with quicker ratio and slightly heavier, 195/40 tyres on nice Brands Hatch 17in alloy wheels, GTI finishers like grill, roof spoiler, strips, tartan etc, close-couple fuel filter, full colour 5" Beats DAB and ambient lighting. So lots of goodies for just over a £1000 more in the UK.
Seen this guy in other ring videos. Suscribed immediately.
.:: KOEN ::. Welcome!
Welche Bremsscheibe beim VW up vorne ist gut für die Nordschleife ? EBC? BREMBO? Welche fährst du? Liebe Grüße aus der Eifel 🥳
Plus your up looks sweet 😎
How would you compare this UP! GTI compared to say the 6c Polo BlueGT 1.4TSI 150ps ACT (what I own - & yes I do a few UK track days a year). I know the 6c BlueGT is now a superseded model but basically is a detuned 6c Polo GTI (150ps to 192ps) in that you get all the negative sorted with the BlueGT (like discs all round, GTI sport seats). Thought maybe a interesting comparison?
Polo is better on all fronts
Thank you Misha about nice Polo comments. The 6c BlueGT 1.4TSI 150ps sold well as a sort of "budget GTI" & the 6c GTI (driven but not yet owned) is fantastic nimble thing & like MK2 Golf GTI's of old but sadly overlooked & overshadowed by the Golf GTI but that is not on par with the Polo nimbleness.
The funny thing is that the E-UP have the option for shut down the TC :D ...