Douglas Murray: I want Christianity to be true
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- čas přidán 6. 09. 2024
- Douglas Murray explains why he wishes Christianity were true and talks about experiences in the Holy Land that have drawn him close to belief.
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Perhaps the phrase Douglas Murray is looking for is, " I want to believe." It is evident from this and the previous podcast with Esther that his faith was something very key to his life and being, then he lost it - rebelled for a while - then realised from time and experience that something was missing, a quite palpable something. Maybe a certain something missing from not just his life but his heart and even his soul. One gets the sense when Douglas talks (about so many things) that he does wear his heart on his sleeve so to speak, it is self-evident that he feels things (arts, music etc) very deeply. You do get a sense from the man of a void within, almost too difficult to describe but he tangibly perceives it. But that sense is balanced by his rational side, by science, history etc which will weigh heavily in his mind. Douglas does appear to function on a different plain to most people. I cannot ever get to within a million miles of the depth of character and the sheer intellect that he possesses - I am just a working class oik from the NW of England. In that spirit I am reminded of a lyric by Joy Division (that is about as smart as I get) from their track, 'Transmission', "Touching from a distance, further all the time." I kept being reminded of these lyrics, listening to Douglas in his conversation here.
Douglas may also be fighting within himself about his himself.
Douglas Murray needs some Peter Hitchens in his life.
Everyone who trusts and obeys Jesus gradually becomes more like him in character (2 Corinthians 3:18). So that can be you! You already seem to have humility, which is a beautiful character quality.
I would say you’ve expressed the situation beautifully, with depth and intellect!
He’s diagnosed with sociopathic zionist fairy tendencies, it ain’t that deep bruvo.
One thing I have always admired about Douglas Murray, aside from his great intellect, articulateness, personal courage, and self-confidence is his innate, almost Christian like, decency. He exudes that. I know that he is an Atheist and Gay, and unapologetically so, and lives a life that many Christians would term as sinful, but there you have it. One cannot shake the feeling of his innate goodness. I pray for him.
He's living life as he should if some people see that as sinful thats their problem also what's the difference between Christian decency and normal decency?
PS. I'm aware that you are saying nice things about Douglas even though your faith may tell you not to so good job and stay safe during these trying times.
Exactly. But none of his goodness means a thing, because, according to the Apostle Paul, he is numbered among the "arsenokoitai", and therefore cannot inherit the kingdom of heaven. Translation: Douglas Murray is going to Hell. Are you beginning to understand the problem skeptics have with Christianity? No matter how hard you try to polish it, under Christianity, Douglas Murray is going to Hell, and no amount of sighs on your part is going to change that. For me, this makes Christianity, well, unforgivable.
@@erichodge567 I will not get into a great theological debate with you because I have neither the training nor the inclination to do so. I agree that it seems harsh to think that a man of Douglas Murray's fine qualities, if he remains an unrepentant and unconfessed sinner, is going to Hell. That seems very harsh to me as well. I feel obligated to remind both you and myself however what is not being said. That because of Christ's living a perfect life and conducting a sacred ministry; then voluntarily submitting to not only an unjust sentencing, but a brutal torture and a humiliating execution on the Cross, He paid the price for our Sin. The caveat being of course that we go and sin no more. Or at least strive to do so in all good conscience. Christianity provides a way out. That being said I acknowledge Christianity is a muscular faith. Not for the faint of heart.
Well, I think that’s the difference between atheists and anti-theists. An atheist could want to believe in God, but might struggle with belief on an intellectual level. An anti-theist, on the other hand, is hostile towards religion and belief in God. I can respect the former, but not the latter.
If Christianity is true then the universe was created by and is run by a God who has constantly failed with the plans he comes up with.
@@garyheron Name a single failed plan that God didnt let happen in a way. Name it- the fall? Israel sinning? Name it and get the right response.
Like George Orwell. :) He was personally a devout Christian, though he could never intellectually reconcile his personal belief with his modernistic atheistic philosophy.
@@garyheron you have a large gap of knowledge of Christian theology
I am not hostile towards religious people in general. But I am hostile towards certain doctrines that are extremely harmful and dangerous such as hell, original sin, the bible's anti gay stance, and it's zealous take on pre-marital relations which spawned purity culture, and bible also condoned slavery.
The bible has a lot of good things in it. But the bad stuff is just that- really bad. And I do not respect it, nor should any child or adult be forced to respect it.
the more you want something to be true, the more sceptical you should be
yes atheist should apply this..
@@dtgb7 That's like accusing fish of being hydrophobic.
@@dtgb7 everyone should, the easiest person to fool is yourself
@@dtgb7 I do
Yes but that is not what religious people do because they are in a bubble so they can’t see the whole thing, now that I am not a Christian I am truly skeptical of everything like I should have been!
So he wants to believe Christianity to be true but he is gay. How Does he reconcile that? The Bible Does not have good things to say about his lifestyle....
I wish so much for Murray to have a 💯 ✅ transformation of the holy spirit he is so close.
Hello how are you doing 👋👋👋👋☺️
This is a similar thing between Murray and Jordan Peterson. Sometimes you just have a let go, stop waiting. If you don’t humble yourself before God, you’ll never truly know him. A child comes to his Father with questions with the understanding that he is his Father and to a child, no other child’s father knows as perfectly as his own father knows.
Could your father be wrong?
Would you even know if your father was wrong if "you let go, and stop waiting"?
Don't hold back any longer. Don't wait. Just let yourself go and you will surely realise that in fact unicorns DO live at the bottom of your garden.
Just because you really really believe it.......it does NOT make it true. It's self deception at best.
@@nickphelan6159
God cannot be wrong. He gave us the law on our heart and he gave us the scripture, so if you are being told things that do not coincide with those things, then you are not hearing from God.
@@nickphelan6159 If you feel your father is wrong, challenge him.
@@holdontoyourwig
Hilarious 🙄
Note to Douglas Murray:
Just read Stephen Meyer's "The Return of the God Hypothesis"
Because all atheists need to do is read more apologetics?
@@anonymousprofessor7954
He’s not an apologist.
He’s a Cambridge PHD scientist and also an Engineer.
How Reason Can Lead to God or Necessary Existence by Joshua Rasmussen would be better options for Murray.
@@anonymousprofessor7954 and believe in the creation that never happened, the exodus that never happened, babel never happened, the flood never happened, jesus birth from a virgin never happened, now tell me what is true in the bible, take your indoctrinated godglasses off.
Meyer is a charlatan
The truth of the Gospel of Jesus Christ is the most transformative event in your life if you simply believe and accept the Lord Jesus Christ. Welcome all who accept Jesus as Lord.
Amen !
Question: can somebody transform their life through something they believe to be true, that in reality is not?
@@Adam-gl1qv
Of course it is possible to transform one's life if they believe in something yet that something not be true. It happens many times through many means. A person can lie to someone and tell them what they want to hear in order to get them to change.
If you are suggesting that Christianity is false and if someone transformed their life through meeting Christ than it is a false transformative experience, well you Adam are very much mistaken.
It is why l said that Christianity is the most transformative event which can and has changed billions of peoples lives.
Nothing else comes close, and as l speak the Lord Jesus Christ continues to change hearts and minds, fulfilling His promise to build His church, the Bride of Christ. This church is made up of those men and women throughout the last 2 thousand years who asked Him for forgiveness of their sin and believed in His death on the cross for sin and believed He rose again from the dead.
From the time of Adam and Eve going forward those who had faith in God Almighty looking forward to the Messiah of God were transformed into the church of Christ as well.
Jesus Christ, even today, is adding to His church daily, like minded souls that do believe in the Gospel of Christ. The Gospel is the Good News that Jesus died for sin and that He rose from the dead. If you as a human being believe those two things, the Bible says Jesus promises you will have eternal life with Him in heaven and later on a restored New Earth.
Adam, you have a choice to make, you can believe this good news l just told you about, that you are now going to be held to account about, or you will not believe this Good News. That is up to you. The Bible says a word to the wise is sufficient.
It says the beginning of wisdom is the fear of God.
Obviously if you have no fear of Almighty God, well, let's say you can't be too smart.
Adam, you will be held responsible for rejecting such a precious gift from God.
If you have a problem with God and have issues with Him and how He does things, then the proper thing to do is not be on the outside of the boat that is trying to save you, swimming in place and shaking your fist at God, NO !!
GET on aboard, and get saved than ask God all the questions you want to ask Him. Adam, the truth isn't afraid of being exposed, because it is the truth. There are no lies inherent in the truth so ask God anything you want, He wants you to investigate, go ahead.
People have investigated Christianity and all of the doctrines of Christ and it has always passed with flying colors.
It is those who lead a sinful life, lives controlled by Lust, that ask silly questions like you do Adam. You have unresolved SIN in your life and you want to continue to live in that sin, so ultimately you have to decide on having your sin forgiven by Jesus Christ or NOT !
PLEASE READ JOHN 3:16, 17, 18, 19, & 20.
Remember Jesus is speaking there and He is talking to a great big Jewish Leader Nicodemus.
Remember also, what Jesus said there, "the condemnation is men Loved darkness more than the light."
The attraction of sin is so strong.
I will keep you in my prayers and have others praying for you. I hope you make a good decision, you have until your last day of life.
@@jbjoeychic Yeah I'm not reading all of that. Second question: two people come to you telling you they have spoken to Jesus, you know for a fact one of them is delusional and only heard his own voice in his head and nothing more. How do decipher which one actually spoke to Jesus?
If it looks like and idiot, talks like and idiot, it is probably an idiot.
I’m at where Douglas Murray is at. I don’t believe it, but wish it were.
I wish I will win the lottery next week. I really wish it to be true. I believe I will, and the more I want it to be true , the more I believe it will be true. That has no impact on the likelihood it will be true. In fact, if I believe that I will win the lottery next week and I’m aware of the fact that really want it to be true, surely that counts against it actually being true. Wishful thinking is a dangerous game.
The first part of your statement tracks. I'm not sure I follow the next bit that if you believe you'll win the lottery that counts against it being true. Neither of these things affects reality.
@@Mic1904 I’m not saying it makes it less likely, I’m saying if my reason for believing that I will win the lottery is because I want to win the lottery, it stops you from considering the facts rationally and objectively.
@@marquisinspades1 But surely rationality and objectiveness does tell you it is possible to win the lottery otherwise why buy a ticket? Who having bought a ticket would throw it away simply because they cannot imagine winning it? The other problem is with regard to faith, everyone wins both here and now and in time to come.
Trust what is in your heart let go and see what happens. God may well find you and you him.
@@andrewdock7288 I do trust what is in my heart. The world makes much more sense to me without a god in it. What do you mean by “let go”? Surely letting go is to stop trusting what is in your heart? Why wouldn’t God be able to find me? He supposedly wants a relationship with me and has the power. Why hide? Why do I have to initiate the relationship? The more I look for a god, the less likely I find his existence to be.
If christianity is true and hell is real it would be the most disastrous and horrific thing ever imaginable.
Think about it. 80% of all humans would be thrown in hell just because they didnt believe in the right God.
And christians call this thing the good news. Eeeh.
powerful , the people whose relatives were with jesus are still alive living in the region...
Hallelujah 👍
I’ve been watching quite a few videos of the evidence for Jesus. I haven’t actually seen any of this evidence, but nevertheless it is still very encouraging
You are looking in the wrong place go with your heart.
I mean, the historical reality of 'Jesus' is fairly well established among historians and scholars, and is about as controversial as the existence of Caesar Augustus or Plotinus, with one or two dissenters (and that's fine of course). In question are the miracles, the meaning of his life, and of course the alleged Resurrection.
So you are frightened of your own mortality ?
@@1414141x not sure what that means, but I know about alot of the evidence for Jesus, just that I haven't physically gone into depth in the evidence for Jesus. For example I haven't gone and researched the reliability of the new testement in detail, but know enough to say that it is reliable.
Perhaps like an evolutionist will come to the conclusion that evolution is a thing without actually becoming a bio chemist (or whatever you would need to be).
I feel like morality is probably the best argument for God, because without a standard like God, there is no right or wrong. But I'm not afraid of that morality, but I do fear God.
" I want eternal life to be true. I don't want to have to figure it all out---I want God to tell me, give me the answers. I want to be a part of the righteous group OR I don't want to have to leave the righteous group."
I don’t know if it’s true but I choose to believe it’s true and to try to live by its ideals. Anyone who scoffs at Christianity and ridicules Christians or who chooses to believe it is inherently violent and/or intolerant truly has not read the Gospels with an open mind or heart. That does not mean it’s all rainbows and unicorns. True love can be very tough indeed.
You're making a false dichotomy. There are many things in the bible that teach love, but there are just as many other things that are toxic. The bible is a mish-mash of all kinds things with centuries of different writers having many different opinions and ideas. You can't just say it's all about love or this or that.
The threat of eternal hell, original sin, the genocidal old testament, and it's acceptance of slavery is nothing short of disturbing.
This is why Christianity has gotten more modernized in the west - because many Christians know that they cannot hold onto a literal interpretation if they want it to keep believing it.
@@pwoods100 No. I did not make a false dichotomy simply by mentioning the word “love”. There are MANY other words I could use, like “sacrifice” for example, or “discipline”. I’m not writing a thesis here, simply stating that I CHOOSE to believe in CHRISTIANITY. I didn’t even mention the Bible, a library that consists of 66 books of various genres (80 if you include the Apocrypha) written over centuries by various authors. I only mentioned the Gospels (4 books). I CHOOSE to be a follower of The Christ. That is what Christianity means. And it is hard, a narrow path. We “pays our money and we makes our choice”. I made mine. You made yours. No more discussion required or desired.
@@louk6196 "We “pays our money and we makes our choice”. I made mine. You made yours."
That's exactly what you don't understand. You don't get to choose what to believe, because you don't get to choose what makes sense to your brain.
You can't change what makes sense to your brain. Circumstances have to change that. You don't have any control over that.
Christianity doesn't make sense to my brain anymore. Therefore I could no longer believe in it, no matter how much I tried. I did not choose to become a non-believer, it just kind of happened little by little.
@@pwoods100 I understand perfectly. You think that your thoughts MUST be right. When you are confronted with a concept that contradicts what you think is right you suffer from cognitive dissonance. That makes it impossible to have, not just a rational conversation but also a polite one hence “no more discussion required or desired.” I have an IQ in the 99th percentile, an Oxbridge degree and other various qualifications. Not only do I understand perfectly, I also do my research thoroughly. Now, since I expect that you will continue to squabble and insult until the cows come home, I am going to block you.
This Passion story is that of Baal or Bel of Babylon/Phoenicia, as revealed on a 4,000-year-old
tablet now in the British Museum:
1. Baal is taken prisoner.
2. He is tried in a hall of justice.
3. He is tormented and mocked by a rabble.
4. He is led away to the mount.
5. Baal is taken with two other prisoners, one of whom is released.
6. After he is sacrificed on the mount, the rabble goes on a rampage.
7. His clothes are taken.
8. Baal disappears into a tomb.
9. He is sought after by weeping women.
10. He is resurrected; appearing to his followers after the stone is rolled away from the tomb.
That routine was repeated many times before and after Baal's time. It all proves that you can fool some
of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you can fool yourself all of the
time when you desperately need to---as Douglas Murray does here along with billions of others.
“At present, the stupid people are in an absolutely overwhelming majority all the world over.” - Henrik Ibsen
I'm not sure how on earth you could wish for the stuff in the Christian bible to be true but everyone to his own...
Who wants to live forever
@@evangelistkimpatrik I certainly don't... do you?
@@5678efgh3 Of course. When there is no more pain and suffering, which would be the case if Christianity is true.
@@evangelistkimpatrik If you're willing, please tell me, will there be free will there and will you still have your own mind?
(I'm genuinely asking, I know it sounds silly of a question but I want to know your response on that)
Also what about the majority of the human population who'll be in hell, can you accept that while you're having a good time in heaven?
To know the creator of all existence isn't intriguing to you?
The Christian faith that Jesus taught did not involve any churches. Organised religions don't want to major on this point, but so many parts of His mission point to the simple relationship between a single person and God. So often it is the people in churches who stop others from coming to that simple, but satisfying relationship with God, (whether you can believe in His existence or not). This relationship is so powerful that the power-hungry will try to 'own' it and therefore control. I don't know if you read these postings Douglas, but if you do I would suggest a solitary search. I also see that singular relationship approach in other world religions and would not try to deny their ability to help you find God. The bottom line is that all churches will let you down in some way but a personal relationship with God will not. In my view, the ideal way is to find a personal guide or spiritual director who walks with you but does not tell you which steps to take. I wish you well in your walk.
“For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith. For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things. Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves: Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen. For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet. And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient; Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers, Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.”
Romans 1:16-32
“The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God.” Psalms 53
At least he disproves the theory that atheism is born out of the will of not believing in order to sin. And by saying he wants to believe but he can't, he shows atheism is born out of reason.
Understand your point. Given that words carry connotations, I believe agnosticism is a better word to describe Douglas’s use of reason. While he has no direct evidence of “God”, he has scientific understanding that, in this universe, effects have causes. As a result, a person using reason is at a loss to explain how our universe (or any universe/multiverse) could come into being.
Christianity true? Don't be stupid. That means that everyone who lived before Christianity, is now roasting in the fires of Hell. Their sins were not forgiven, because there was no-one to forgive them their sins. Sheer madness.
Most of us would certainly hope that there would be a God. A father like being of what could then serve to bring about justice, and also allow for a way so that bad things what had occurred to us here in this life, might then not need to seem quite so bad/important (to us and our feelings). However, this can also have a sinister aspect in that it can also serve to create a apathetic minded way for people to set aside problematic issues of what they very well might be far better off to be more actively concerned with attending to right now
The apathetic way comes from more a non need of God - being contented in the pastor's message and being "blessed" without a real struggle in the spiritual realm. Wanting God to be true can come from the place of skepticism and an end of searching within and not finding much significant. No, I nor man has all the answers. There's a drive in not knowing, and this can come from man not knowing as well as religion not knowing. The things that happen to us can surely trip up our faith, but in the end it would be better to know a God works through these things. A wavering faith is a strong faith - we don't have perfect faith. There are times we should look in other places and God may be showing us, although our religion doesn't.
@@EaZiE01 well that's your view and of course you are welcome to your view. However i'd question whether your view would match with reality of what we can see. For instance think about the extent of apathy with regard to sex abuses, within church followings , take note of how "much time it had taken" to get any of those people to agree face up to the situations in court, so as to begin with making some sort of reparation. Or how many well meaning believers had stood by in silence too, during the inquisitions?. How would we begin to explain this phenomena, unless we would consider that quite possibly the thoughts were that there'd be less reason to speak up against such situation, promptly, as there was the thought that a God might still be able to make amends "at a later time" in and after life
Atheism/ agnosticism has thoughts of no such luxury in mind. The thought rests on the idea that this life might "be all" that there ever is for us. Therefore it follows that action toward reparation is obviously required to need to be prompt
Even i regard to pollution, or resource management, i suspect there are believer who'd feel that they'd have less reason to need to be bothered to worry or feel concerned about such matters, as they'd quite possibly believe that their God would be able "to keep his own eye" on such matters as well .
@@EaZiE01 further to my previous reply we should also consider the plight of people caught up within cult abuses. Who have no real freedom. Specially so with the young children. Realistically they'd often have very little more freedom that what a North Korean might also have. And yet worldwide there are millions of believers who'd seem to feel more than happy to take no action themselves. How would we ever begin to explain this phenomena, unless we would consider that its some sort of "faith induced apathy"?. An apathy whats foundered on the belief that justice might be able to be served, by a God, at some later date in time
@@EaZiE01 then there is the apathy whats been shown toward animal rights as well too. I'd suggest that faith induced apathy toward animal rights might be explained once we consider biblical ideas about animals.
I didn't expect to see my hero Slim preaching facts and hypothesis here. Have a good one mate.
You want it to be true that you can live forever if you can bring yourself to believe an utterly preposterous story and if you can't bring yourself to believe it you still live forever but in a horrible place. Why would anyone want that to be true?
I want it to be true as well, but it simply doesn’t seem to be the case when it comes to the evidence.
why would anybody want Christianity to be true??
That thought gives me the willies beyond comprehension.
Makes the hair stand up on the back of my neck.
I love Christianity ❤
It IS true, brother. Come, rejoice in Christ, the King of Kings, who lived and died for our sakes.
Ok xtians. Can we PLEASE quit saying that jesus "died". He was resurrected. You dont' get a refund on a sacrifice.
And if he's King, then why is most of the planet not xtian? Why is his theology in a death spiral?
You don't know it's true, sorry. Reinforcing it, praying, deluding yourself and shrouding yourself in confirmation bias does not get you to what's true.
If Mr. Wrights is a Christian apologist, he’s a very milquetoast, warm and fuzzy one. Murray is talking about concretes, absolutes, and Mr. Wright is speaking of seamless garment form of Christianity. You can’t have the garment without the foundation.
We created God.
I am an atheist. I have no struggle with your belief unless you want me to believe as you do and act according to your beliefs. I don't know any atheists who are opposed to Christianity or any other religion suddenly becoming "true" - in other words, that the metaphysical claims of the religion becoming physically evident. Let's see Baal, Yahweh, Moloch, or Vishnu suddenly appear and prove their provenance. "Blessed be those who do not see and yet believe." I really don't care about being blessed. If anyone feels the urge to pray for me - thanks, but use your time more profitably.
Remind me how many genders there are again?
@@joehouston2833 Depends on which you are.
@@joehouston2833 gender is a social construct. If you ask how many semesters there are that's a different question
@@nathanmckenzie904
Social construct?
Said what scientist?
🤡
@@joehouston2833 Atheism is not of the left.
How is the world going to believe that the Father sent the son? the 50.000 denominations of divided Christianity is not the result of His prayer: "Father let them be one like you and I are one so that the world may believe that you sent me" The pattern of ACTS 2:44 remains the same for the true church: "All those who believe ARE together and share all things in common, no rich or poor" @
Free Julian ASSANGE!
On the 3rd of July 2021 he turned 50 years old with 7 years traped in an Embassy and months in a British prison.
I agree.
What does that have to do with this video?
@@tecumsehcristero nothing at all but it can't hurt to spread awareness I suppose
Do not do the crime if you cannot do the time.
Powerful conversation! Thanks to all.
Any chance of getting some atheists back on the channel soon? It’s been a while
No.
@@andrewdock7288 great input
I mean...That just means he's halfway there. Keep going Douglas !
The reason that there are many non-Christians that do not want Christianity to be true, is because their concept of what Christianity is, is different from many of those that wish Christianity to be true.
For example, would I like there to be a truly loving God that actually loves us unconditionally? Yes, most certainly that would be great, but I do not think such a God is compatible with Christianity. A truly loving God clashes with two central parts of Christianity, parts without which I think Christianity no longer can be called Christianity.
Part one is that God needs to make a blood and pain sacrifice to himself in order to forgive us for the way he created us, the second one is that God needs us to accept and worship him in order for the forgiveness to apply. Both are things that are simply incompatible with a truly loving God. A truly loving God would be motivated by their love to forgive without making a blood and pain sacrifice or needing us to accept and worship him and since God himself determines what he needs, he would need such useless unnecessary things.
For me and many others when they think of the God of Christianity, they would be thinking about the child rape and slavery endorsing genocidal, murder of innocent Children that is the God of the Old Testament. Yeah, I think the World is better off without that.
Agreed. Their friggen book is definitely a problem. It characterizes a god in such a way as to prompt us to question everything from his nature to his motives to his desire to create in the first place. Lose the book and these guys will be just as clueless as they say the rest of us are.
Laying hold of Jesus and being added saved will cost Murray his homosexuality. The question is, is he willing to give up his cherished lifestyle?
You speak about homosexuality as if it's just a lifestyle that one can simply give up and be cured by excepting the Lord. That just leads me to think you have a ridiculous and outdated understanding of homosexuality that is most common in more fanatic like groups of Christians. I get the feeling your from the US
Our knowledge is always limited, not least the spiritual dimension bc the key is the point when we accept God's grace in Jesus Christ as Saviour! Even then some things will remain a mystery or hidden from us. But the knowledge of the things of God in relation to our world and destiny is a gradual and ongoing process. Humility and desire to trust God is the first small step...
If you say our knowledge is limited, how can you say there's a "spiritual dimension", or that your specific religion and the stories within your specific holy book are true? Also, there is no "humility" in thinking the cosmos was created specifically with you in mind.
@@siim605 the spiritual dimension is accessible w/the help of the Spirit after we are born again in the Spirit. W/o his insight & revelation of the things/ truth of God that dimension is really beyond our comprehension. Those who seek truth find it.
@@aprilsim7604 You just said our knowledge is limited, yet you're making factual statements about reality, and ignoring other religious claims of revelation. I rest my case.
@@siim605 Followers of Christ can attest to the reality of God & the trustworthy Bible bc God is in our lives. We experience him just as the early apostles do too. Paul's theology is wrought from a life that is lived in and for Christ who is "the way, the truth, & the life." Therein, the essence of Christian living and faith is manifestly revealed as it is - truthful, life affirming, God attesting. Also abiding in God's truth is also his way of reconstituting us in the image of his Son - the first born of the second, & sinless man, Jesus.
@@siim605 it is mind boggling to realize that such an immense universe was created for our existence & sustenance. David was awed and humbled at the thought of how wonderfully we were made!
Does jordan peterson believe in god
Don't fall for it 🤣😂
he said he can't really understand people who don't want christianity to be true?!? up till now I always thought this guy was intelligent don't know what to think of him now though....
I know, I don't get what's going on...
@@Jbird54247 thank god im not alone 😉
Yes I agree, I've lost a bit of respect for him after watching that
Just close your eyes tight, then click your heels three times, and say "Anonymous stories written decades after the fact ARE rational reason to believe in magic!!! Anonymous stories written decades after the fact ARE rational reason to believe in magic!!! Anonymous stories written decades after the fact ARE rational reason to believe in magic!!!" ... and then ALL your wildest dreams will come true!!
It works EVERY time!!
What "anonymous stories written decades after the fact" & that teach we must "believe in magic" are those? Answer me. Do not ignore me. Do not play your games with me. Answer me.
Religion is rarely rational. Religion is often emotional.
Douglas needs to talk to Jonathan Pageau
I want fairies to be true. If a billion people believe in them well that makes them real, right??
Douglas Murray wishes christianity where true. A religion which, at its heart, is based on a blood sacrifice to save mankind from the fall into sin that christianity created in the first place. And if you don’t accept this fabulous gift, you are condemned hell forever.
He needs to yield to Jesus Christ as long as many people do
He really doesn't mate
The lord will come indeed
Why not yield to Mithras or Thor or Zeus?
It must be annoying to wish that a certain religion were true but not being able to bring oneself to believe in its claims. I'm sure Murray is not alone. Many people wish that the world revolved around them, that they were fundamentally special and different from other parts of nature, that there was a divine plan with them at the center, etc. But ultimately they can't just choose to give up their view that "we have not been given the lead in the cosmic drama", as Carl Sagan put it.
If you cannot understand why people would not want there to be an unjust sadistic celestial dictator, you havent thought about it
I agree. I can also tell you're a fellow fan of Hitch.
Isn't that working backwards. By wishful thinking 🤔 I could successfully fool myself of anything
The integrated complexity of the Bible proves it's true--- across 66 books by 44 authors and 3000 years; it reads as one author and is intra connected. That could, in theory, be contrived. That is why God points to prophecy as the proof of his existence via the Bible. Can't fake that. Daniel's Weeks---Landing A 'triumphal entry' into Jerusalem on a day hundreds of years in the future; his being 'cut off' (killed) and the end of sacrifice (the destruction of the Temple and it to remain un-built) is not contrivable. There are 300 Prophecies of Christ alone. Prophecies are the preserve of God. To my knowledge, there are none in the Koran.
It is easy to write prophesy being fulfilled if you have the original prophesy to look at when you are doing the writhing. ie: the writers of the new testament had the old testament to look at when they wrote the fulling of the prophesy stories in the new testament. no mystery. Kind of like now, Christians are very protective of Israel now because in the bible it says Israel is Gods chosen people.
But evangelicals’ support of Israel isn’t simply driven by a theology that compels them to love the Holy Land, detached from its convulsive domestic and global political implications. For many “Christians Zionists,” and particularly for popular evangelists with significant clout within the Republican Party, their support for Israel is rooted in its role in the supposed end times: Jesus’ return to Earth, a bloody final battle at Armageddon, and Jesus ruling the world from the Temple Mount in Jerusalem. In this scenario, war is not something to be avoided, but something inevitable, desired by God, and celebratory.
Regarding Daniels 70 weeks: Many attempts have been made to make the 70 Weeks of Daniel 9 fit Jesus, but all interpretations ultimately fail. I’ll address the two major views:
The first interpretation starts the clock at 457 BC, when Artaxerxes made a decree granting the Jews permission to furnish the Temple and offer sacrifices. 69 weeks from this date brings us to 27 AD - the start of Jesus’ ministry.
The problem with this is that the date is supposed to begin with a decree to “rebuild Jerusalem with its street and walls.” The decree in 457 BC did not authorize the rebuilding of Jerusalem, so this interpretation fails. What’s worse, this view interprets Jesus as the prince who ‘abolished the daily sacrifice’ and ‘set up the abomination of desolation.’ Awkwardly, this same language is used in Daniel 11 to refer to Antiochus Epiphanes IV, a wicked king who harshly persecuted the Jews. Doesn’t sound much like Jesus.
The second interpretation starts the clock at 444 BC. Luckily, this is the correct date for the decree that authorized the rebuilding of Jerusalem. But there’s a problem. 69 weeks after this date brings us to 38 AD, several years after Jesus had already come and gone. To fix this error, we must convert the years into “prophetic years”. A prophetic year is a year consisting of 360 days and is allegedly the calendar Daniel would’ve used. Now when you re-do the math, you arrive at 33 AD, the year Jesus died.
There are several problems with this. First, a 360-day calendar is impossible to sustain without some form of leap weeks or leap months to re-align it with the solar year. So even with a 360-day year, the leap time would distort the final date. And secondly, the prophetic year is applied inconsistently. For example, the book of Revelation mentions a 1000-year reign which (when converted to prophetic years) comes out to an awkward period of 986.30137 years. But no Christian seriously believes this timescale.
A final problem with this view is that it forces us to push the final 70th week out to a future time separated from the other 69 - an ad hoc approach not supported by the text. In fact, the whole aim of the prophecy was to give Daniel an accurate timeline for Jerusalem’s vindication (especially since the original 70-year prediction seemed bleak). It would be quite misleading for the angel to tell Daniel it would take place in 490 years when he really meant thousands.
Conclusion: Both of these interpretations ultimately fail. If there’s another plausible interpretation that I’m missing, feel free to explain. Otherwise, it’s safe to say that Jesus does not fit this prophecy.
Christianity still wouldn't make sense even if it were "true." For example, I don't see how the belief in "going to heaven" solves anything. What if you go to heaven, then you rebel against god? I have never heard or read an apologist who addresses this problem, though if I were to write a book about Christian apologetics, I would try to answer it as a priority.
> I have never heard or read an apologist who addresses this problem
St Thomas Aquinas directly addresses it in the Summa, in heaven we are only capable of good acts. It's for this reason it's said the new promise is higher than even Eden, because no possibility of falling again exists.
@@willl389 Sounds like we would become automatons.
If the free will is intact, then we should have the possibility of sinning, even if very small.
The king of wishful thinking.
The knowledge of God is the beginning of wisdom… and the good news of the gospel is foolishness to all whom are perishing … guys don’t be prideful just seek the lord while he may be found , fear the lord and shun evil.
Nope. Christianity is just another afterlife cult preying on peoples fear of death and using in for power and control. It is the opposite of wisdom.
Is the gospel foolishness to the billions of Indians, Natives, and Chinese who never got to hear this important message about a human sacrifice? Your god made NO effort to do anything about the huge majority of the world perishing. NOTHING.
Your 'lord' is evil.
People who wish God was true have never read anything in the bible.. it's historic fact even Roman history talks about it and they don't believe in Christianity at the time..
Indeed. JC was not mentioned by anyone at the time he lived. Quite telling considering all the gospel claims.
That's the number one thing with Christianity... you know something happened that never happened before nor will again.
It is true. He just doesn't want to submit to Christ. I pray he does!
Wishing Christianity to be true sounds kind of silly, actually. Maybe Murray is silly.
Maybe??
Islam confirms Christianity to be True, we believe only the followers of Jesus and Muhammad will enter Paradise. in the Quran Allah says he will raise the followers of Jesus above all nations and give victory to the Romans and that those who will be closest in love and affection to the believers will say we are Christian because they are not an arrogant people. Christians have been deceived to think Muslims are their enemies when we are the only other people who believe in them.
How I wish what you said was true but sorry the quran that you read is full of hate towards non-believers of Allah which includes the Christians. Stop this double standard hypocrisy.
I do not personally hate muslims but actually loves them including you though I do not know in person.
If you really do love Jesus, try reading the New Testament. Amen.
May the Almighty guide you through.
If Christianity is true, non Christians who did lust even just once in their lives will go to a place of eternal torment called hell... let that sink in!
You really don't know Christianity..
Jesus came for the Sinner..
@@joehouston2833 thank you for writing back.
Do you really want to believe in a creator who will allow billions of his creation to be tormented forever because they were not perfect like him?
Most of them having never done anything too bad like killing or raping? But yes they lied once or twice and lusted once or twice, and what about the “Saved” they don’t lust, they don’t hurt others? yes my friend they do, there is no difference between the 2 groups. It’s just not fair.
Don’t be afraid of God, think for yourself that’s what he wants you to do I am sure.
Take care!
@@franswa7251
Again your view of God & Christianity is misconstrued..
Firstly, only God *KNOWS* the Human heart and is *Just in Judgement* .. the Bible is Very clear about this.. No *Innocent* person will be In Hell, this is clear also.
At judgement, Everyone will be rewarded for the fruits they produced on this planet and again, God knows the human heart, your intentions behind everything you did.
Jesus came for the Sinner full of Grace and Mercy and was the atonement of humanities sin..
This is very fair, every human being has fallen short of grace. Look at the world now? Do you honestly think it's ever been perfect?
@@joehouston2833 it is true that the Bible says “Everyone will be rewarded or punished, for the fruits they produced on this planet”.
But this verse contradicts the core of Christianity.
Because if that was just that,
then Christianity would be irrelevant and a waste of time!
What I see is that the Bible talks about, the Christians ONLY being rewarded, and not the non Christians as well!
Therefore Christianity is unfair because why would the non Christians be punished for eternity just for not having done the sinners prayer?
The non Christians refusal, for the most part, to not become Christians, is not because they are unrepentant, but because the idea of a free card out of jail prayer to Jesus seems absurd and unfair.
One more thing, God knows the heart but we’re also told that by their fruits we can see who people are. What I see is good fruits and bad fruits on both the non Christians and the Christians, it is obvious!
Take care.
@@franswa7251
"What I see is that the bible talks about the Christians only being rewarded" ..
Your ignorance is bliss.. There will be "so called Christian's" who will be damned in judgement.
(Matthew 7:22)
No offence, but you clearly know nothing about Judeo Christianity, it's Covenant(s), Christ; who he is and why he came.
It's not a good look to be living in ignorance.
damn plot twist murray
It’s religion which causes so much division. The more religious the country the more violent.
I wish it were true that there was a divinity who brought about a world with cancer, famine, and disease. I really desire that a creator who will destroy his created beings, possibly with eternal torture and torment, really existed, that a loving father has in fact hidden himself from his children for dozens of millennia. I wish, I wish, I wish.
Why wish Christianity was true rather than wish that there was a better god in existence?
well said!
Man chose to sin with Satan instead of siding with God. Sin created all of those problems, not God. So really, it's our fault. God gave us a perfect way to save us, faith in Jesus Christ. It's an open door. Only those who believe in the name of Jesus are Children of God. What people don't understand is God is Good, there is no evil about Him. Anyone who attributes God to evil is being misled by Satan, who is the true evil one. Think of the relationship between a loving father and a rebellious child. The father will not tell the child what to do. The child must come to a place where he realizes that he needs a relationship with his father (prodigal son).
@@mrweaverface what a fascinating collection of self-deprecating thoughts. Have you ever once considered it may not be true? What if Satan has actually convinced you to believe that God is an ass who would punish his children eternally, let the world fall into ruin and such when actually God really is good (and will not torture people, did not bring about the Fall and so on) and he’s pissed because you readily attribute such horrific behavior to his character? Would be better to have a millstone tied about you and be cast into the sea than to lead one of these little ones astray with your erroneous belief. Be careful.
@@BigIdeaSeeker Believe what you want. Just trying to help.
@@mrweaverface Me too. Good luck.
Unlike many other things in like, specifically sciences, religions only exist in the mind of the believer. There is no evidence. There is nothing apart from a will to believe that exists about religions and that is quite frustrating because for someone who wishes for it to be true... the answer is simply "believe it and it is." Which is no a reasonable response. That is drastically different than believing that planes can fly because it's tangible.
Actually there are many scientifically proven miracles, that is, there are many events that were recorded with the scientific method for which scientsts had no explanaition. Now I am aware that just because science has'nt found an answer it doesn´t mean that there is none, but it begs the question: should´nt scientists be excited at the possibility of a viscerally new discovery that would explain what complex modern science hasn´t yet?
To give you a particular example look up the apparitions of the Virgin Mary in Medjugorje, Bosnia. A scientist wrote a book about his examinations on the seeres WHILE they were seeing the Virgin Mary.
Even if you think this doen´t prove Christianity, it proves there are many we don´t know about human beings, for instant the capacity to connect with one another and receive the same message.
So you don't believe the world exists, and that it was created at some point ? The Big Bang theory (which was actually developed by a Catholic priest) is false ?
Wishful thinking gave us Zeus throwing lightening bolts
My goodness. This video just proves how very intelligent people can believe utter nonsense. A visit to Galilee gives Douglas a warm fluffy feeling ??!!
Christians, do you wish God was a better god? If you say no, you’re lying. If you say yes, it makes the point that God is not the best god that could exist. That’s the kind of silliness you’re pulling off by making this question and its response anything more than an insignificant, but interesting point.
The Holy Bible is a science...a science called righteousness. Just as in the teaching of Moses, Jesus showed us that it is our thinking and our behaviour that ignites this science. It all revolves around our spiritual energy. If we store it and use it righteously it interacts with our genetic health but if we follow the dictates of mankind we use it and waste it wildly as if our nervous strength is of no consequence to us and by the wastage of our nervous strength death came into the world.
Wishful thinking is such a hallmark of theism, particularly Christianity. You see it in the opening gambit; the moral imperative that you are command to believe the doctrine. It's as if the authors expect you to CHOOSE to believe something, as if it were a matter of concious choice, what to decide is true. That's pure PRETENCE, or literally MAKE BELIEVE. You're expected to just MAKE yourself BELIEVE this repulsive insanity, and then employ every skerik of confirmation bias you can muster in its favour. This is the opposite of being sceptical and thinking critically.
You'd think someone with the intellect of Douglas Murray, would know better, not only than to *want* to believe such ignorant bronze age rantings, but that anybody should care or consider it relevant, what he, you, I, or ANYBODY merely wants to be true.
Only in the hallowed halls of theological musing, is this a sanctified state of mind. Moreover its called FAITH, and its revered and considered a virtue.
Why does this remind me of the gay argument?
When Jesus says in Matthew 17 that epileptics can be cured by prayer and fasting, I say he is talking gibberish.
I'm so glad christianity is not true. A god who blood sacrifices his son to atone the sins that he invented so that humanity can end up in a never ending worship frenzy in heaven. How boring and tedious. Anyway Justin I do enjoy your content. Thank you.
Christianity cannot be true. Jesus is God, says Christianity, " No, I'm not" replies Jesus . "Why do you call me good, no -one is good except God alone" Luke 18 verse 19.
“Why do you call me good?” Is a question not a statement about Christ’s goodness or His the deity.
Ian, dear stranger on youtube. In Luke 18 verse 19 Jesus is using a parable to signal to his listeners that he's God. He says only God is (morally perfect) good, and asks why the rich ruler calls him good.
Jesus never denies he's good (morally perfect), but wants the ruler to tell him (Jesus) why he thinks he's (morally perfect) good.
In verse 22 and after he tells the rich ruler to sell everything he has and says "follow me," while declaring treasures in heaven lie in store to everyone who has sacrificed anything to follow him (Jesus), and will receive eternal life. Who can offer and promise eternal life but God (Jesus).
@@wm5000
You’re correct! That’s exactly how it reads. The Bible is so FOS that the reader can literally make it say whatever they want.
Hell…I see Twinkies when I read it. God is the cake, Jesus is the cream filling, and the Holy Spirit is the wrapper that keeps all things fresh.
And…if you’re truly sanctified…there’s chocolate! FTB!
But yet he calls himself the first and the last, a title ascribed to God alone in Rev 21:6
He said in Matthew 11:10-11, he called himself the God of the Old Testament by quoting Isaiah 40:3 and applying it to himself 🤦🏻♂️
@@mr.c2485 No it is, genuinely how it reads. Do you understand what a parable is?
Its unfortunate that Justin speaks to this man and asks him nothing about his racisim. Not very christian of you Justin. This man hates muslims, yet you never bring that up With him. And remember Justin, as a muslim I love and revere Jesus, whereas this guy thinks Jesus is a fairytale. Yet still you feel closer to him than muslims. Strange.
I think the reason for this is that Justin wants him to truly come to know Christ which would then have profound effects on his outlook on race. And, while you revere a man you call Jesus, he is not the same Jesus we worship. The Jesus we as Christians worship is God Himself, not a mere prophet. That is a fundamental difference that cannot be overlooked for the sake of feeling close. Also, AI think what you are sensing as feeling close stems from love for the man, not the man's beliefs. I have no doubt he would treat you with the same love and kindness if you sat down with him.
Oh my 🤦🏻♂️
1) Islam isn’t a race mate.
2) you don’t revere Jesus. You insult him. I rather Jesus be classed as a fairytale than him to be insulted
3) who the heck is Isa? Is that meant to be the counterfeit of your so called “Jesus “ that you love?
Mate, I believe the clip is about Murray and Christianity and it has nothing to do with Islam or the Islamic allah 😉
What racism?
Amazing that Douglas Murray has poised himself as a conservative intellectual without without ever having anything original or interesting to say.