A Love Letter to GOTHIC's Open World Design
Vložit
- čas přidán 15. 06. 2024
- The trend of streamlined open world games these days makes me nostalgic for how games like Gothic and its brilliant sequel Gothic 2 approached open worlds back in the day.
I’ve been wanting to talk about this wonderful action RPG for a very long time, so here’s my most important reasons why Gothic’s open world design is still, after over 14 years since its release, amazing!
Both games can be purchased DRM-free on gog.com:
(I highly recommend GOG's version since it's better optimized for Windows 10)
Gothic 1: af.gog.com/game/gothic?as=162...
Gothic 2: af.gog.com/game/gothic_2_gold...
In this video, I use a modded version of the two games, adding high resolution textures and Direct X 11 support to the games.
Check this video for details on how to install it (and skip the L’Hiver modification [Steap 2] if you don’t want the original map to be altered)
• Video
Game Design Focus is a show that revolves around the art of making video games.
Subscribe to RagnarRox for more videos in the future.
Visit me on facebook for news and updates:
facebook.ragnarrox.com
If you want to donate and support the show, consider joining my Patreon:
patreon.ragnarrox.com
Footage of Fallout 4 teddy bear explosion provided by Slex:
• Video
______________________
Games shown in this video (in order of appearance):
Fallout 4
Assassin’s Creed Syndicate
Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain
The Elder Scrolls: Skyrim
Dead Rising 3
GTA V
Assassin’s Creed: Black Flag
Mad Max
The Elder Scrolls: Morrowind
Gothic 2
Fallout 2
Goat Simulator
Minecraft
GTA 4
Assassin’s Creed Brotherhood
Gothic
The Elder Scrolls: Oblivion - Hry
NPC: "There's a very dangerous monster in that cave!"
2017 games: "Yay, let's get more loot!"
Gothic series: "I should stay the fuck away from there"
Precisely.
Also, I think you forgot to mention how almost every npc adds completely different dialogue as the story progresses.
It was like my first time play. But ended died in a sec. Even it says it only a goblin
Typical RPG NPC: Don't mess with the soldiers around town they will kick your ass
You: Picks a fight with soldiers because you were standing up for a poor peasant. Become the hero and the rebels want your number
*Done and simple.*
Gothic RPG NPC: Don't mess with the soldiers around town they will kick your ass
You: Picks a fight with the soldiers. You lay there screaming because you didn't saved while they take half of your money.
The poor peasant is also helping himself to your stash
@@kissme1518 "Thanks for the ore, you hero."
Important to mention that Gothic locations were 100% handcrafted, nothing generated or copy-pasted.
I hate that main selling point of modern open world games is "Our new game is X times bigger than game Y". I would rather appreciate more detailed & intense open world than bigger.
That's not true. Sure, the world seems unique, so do the assets (trees, bushes etc.) ... but most of the rocks and mountains were edited duplicates. The developers did a great job at this so you can't see a difference that easy, tho.
"Our new game is X times bigger than game Y" copy pasted shit everywhere
did you notice that every single open world game has same caves and so on...?
gothic literally has unique places and since its not that big (trust me you can still spent 100 of hours in it) its really detailed and everything has its own story
+Cyphex it feels like that because Piranha bytes filled the world with much content and crafted much by hand... but also... if you watch in the Gothic 2 mine tunnels, you'll notice, that these tunnels are copy-pasted and then changed. The assets are put in by hand afterwards. Sure it is a million times better than the elder scrolls tunnels, but they copied things. ;)
Witcher 3 too. You can hear the developers diary saying this.
I remember visiting the same cave seven hundred times in Oblivion...
Love the game. Look in the credits of Gothic 1 under "Special Thanks" for my nickname. I created the first Gothic fanpage back in the day. I got to stay with Piranha Bytes for a week in the development of Gothic 2 and they motivated me to study Information Engineering instead of Biology :D, because I wanted to be a game developer. Gothic literally changed my life.
That's really cool, congratulations
Hey, that's great to hear! So, are you actually a game developer now? I love the game since I was a child, also changed my life, maybe not my career, but the way I perceive nature and color palette. I run and paint :)
Maybe he died
czcams.com/video/vCWq3-5cS0M/video.html
2:07
you are part of a legend
one of the absolute best aspects about the Gothic games i found was that progression doesnt only mean stats and gear, it means SOCIAL progression in the game-world as well. This makes just so much sense and is incredibly satisfying. Joining the shadows in the old camp, getting your own first "real" armor, npcs showing signs of respect etc...
Yeah but i mean, having 200 strength and 100% crit also helps :)
Loved that about kingdom come deliverance and gothic
One of the novices called me "master" after increasing my rank in the monastery, I felt rewarded like I dropped a mythical weapon or something. The same guy was complaining about skipping jobs to me when we were both novices... With just a few variables, social progression can turn into a very interesting psychological basis that speaks with the player's mind like no other progression system in a game, when done right...
Hey *GENERAL* I marked another settlement on your map that needs help. Go get it like the filthy foot soldier you are!
Sadly many other games fail to deliver on the aspect even when they have great opportunities :/
Becoming a paladin was fckin something. Felt better than getting a degree for me
Most underrated game of this century
In Germany, Poland and (especially) in Russia - it is not, it is widely acclaimed (I remember the times of holy wars on Russian forums like ag.ru about what is better - Morrowind or Gothic 1-2? Oblivion or Gothic 3?). You can even call it a cult RPG.))
Im German and it does have a huge fanbase.
I'm peruvian and I love this game.
I'm Polish and some people here even claim they rather Gothic over The Witcher, even I couldn't last to the second witcher's third chapter, but enjoying Gothic's large modding fanbase and play this game to this day.
I can't get into Witcher at all, I played all Gothic and Risen games. I simply hate how you don't fight in the Witcher but dance around like a princess. No other game ever game me the same satisfaction of learning enemies' attack pattern and being able to kill higher level enemies with timed dodge like in Gothic 1/2. Dodge in Gothic is the best, screw the dodgeroll you find in every game nowadays.
At first glance Gothic seems clunky, laggy, weird and boring.
As you start getting into it, you start understanding it. This game is perfect. Everything is just perfect. The story is a masterpiece, the combat is extremely rewarding, the exploration is fulfilling. Gothic is just everything you want in an RPG and it's everything that none of the current games have and probably won't have anytime soon.
it isn't perfect but damn good
It is nearly perfect
Yeah, I honestly can't think of any other aRPG that's as complex, nuanced, varied and large-while-still-finely-detailed as NotR. The game has hundreds of hours of gameplay yet it has just as many minute details as most any other far shorter game. There's still nothing since then that's even come close, even from Piranha Bytes themselves.
urbium new vegas
urbium unfortunate but true. Piranha Bytes have been knee deep in the shit since Gothic 3 release though, which is sad
I remember 2001 when Gothic came out there was a short hype where I live.
We thought Piranha Bytes would become a developer of international rank and the Ruhr Area would become some great games hub.
But sadly German politicians were more interested in fear-mongering about "violent" video games than funding local businesses.
It's so sad to see Piranha Bytes stagnate as a low-level studio for 30 years. If anyone would deserve to be on the top it would be them.
Well they reharsh a game for like years tho.
The problem with any medieval combat system is you either need to be more like M&B or bust (M&B is from 2008, and Warband is 2010) in that time period. Darksouls are fun, but it is just.....boring after a while.
So when the gameplay is barely improved over the years and titles, it just gets boring pretty fast.
The reason Piranha Bytes became irrelevant was because of Gothic 3 being a collossal failure.
Risen was okay but not good enough to remedy the damage done by G3 and they haven't released a good game since then.
But current Piranha Bytes has nothing to do with old Piranha Bytes as all the talented studio members left long ago.
@@TheHarkonnenScum the g3 fail happened bcs of Jowood trying to do everything to make the game more "populist" they made the world more colorful, deleted the natural borders etc. If not the interference of the publishers the game would be good and harsh as the Old ones, but still even as bad piranha tried their best and make a game that has some balls
@@angquangnguyenthac2833 Exactly. First two games were masterpiece in many aspects ahead of their time with huge potential, but you can't just try to make same game for years. Gothic 3 was a needed experiment but it sacrificed some core design aspects which made Gothic special, coupled with rushed development and bad publisher and we've got complete failure. Especially funny how at the same time Oblivion released which is by far the worst TES (other than first one which is too old), to a great success. Bethesda went to become huge but ultimately overrated studio with bland vanilla games with great modding potential and PB stayed small studio. Risen 1 was solid, but only that, just solid, nothing special. PB desperately needed some hit like Witcher 3.
Old Piranha Bytes crew is brilliant. Until the dawn of Gothic 3. It was a failure
The great thing about Gothic 2 is that even after my 10th playthrough I found things I hadn't seen before.
It's really silly, but I've never climbed up the portal temple in Jharkendar. A couple years ago I did it the first time and never knew why I haven't ever done that.
There's so much to explore in the world, because everything seems interesting. Unlike many other games with an overly big but empty landscape.
@@Xerkrosis 3 days ago I literally first time thought of climbing this temple, I do not know why it took me 8 years though...
Spectral Lore... Now that's a good choice of avatar.
@@GryffinTV music too :D
Indeed! I 've been playing Gothic series for more than 15 years and last year I started watching a youtuber named Morgannin who is posting playthroughs of Gothic 2 expansion and he taught me so many new things I didn't know!
I like how the orc axe quest has at least 2 other possibilities that you didn't tell. You can buy the axe from a mercenary or you can go hunting with a hunter and accidentally find an orc. Absolutely genius! My favorite game of all time!
Exactly. Just skim through the comments and you'll find that at least 5 people came up with their totally unique ways of solving that quest. And it's just one out of many... blew my mind!
Just lure the orc towards the city gate and watch the guards kill him.
@@vondralbra5147 and wasting the xp? You must be insane!
@@bobbobson110 why? if you can still hit him when the orcs on low HP and get the xp... man its so weird to talk about a 17 year old games quest :D huge companies like ubisoft or any other never managed to do that... atleast to me anyway.... but cdproject, larian, obsidian and some others thankfuly exist to make good rpgs
If you talk to the crossbow teacher after getting the quest he tells you that he killed an orc outside the city wall, but hasnt looted him yet.
That is I think the easiest way, but not the easiest to find :)
"Khorinis", now that's a name I haven't heard in a long time :'(
I STILL make references to the Gothic games every now and again!
U BITCH :'"""""""""""""""(
@@jamesedwardsiii8532 Show me your goods
*Sigh* "A new day, and nothing has changed."
They used to make games like this... then they took an arrow to the knee.
3 days ago I was searching for a good single player open world RPG that is like the Elder Scrolls series but not the Elder Scrolls. Every time I fancied playing an open world RPG it was always either Morrowind, Oblivion or Skyrim. And I have spent hours upon hours on all 3 of these games milking them for all their worth. I knew about the Gothic series but never gave it a try because I always thought it was a mediocre Elder Scrolls clone. So I finally gave it a try starting with Gothic 2 because I read it's better for newbies to the series. After finishing Chapter 1 yesterday all I have to say is "FML I WAS PLAYING THE WRONG SERIES ALL ALONG!". This game is simply put the PERFECT open world RPG! It just shows quality in every aspect of it. Just like you describe in your video. Even the combat system which for many is clunky (including me when I started out) after getting used to it makes complete sense and it's great fun. I started the game expecting nothing and ended up playing 12 hours straight. Last time I was so immersed in an RPG it was back in the days of vanilla WOW. It reminded me of it in many aspects.
It's a shame Piranha Bytes lost touch with what made the first two games so great.
I'd recommend playing Gothic 1 as well.
Actually it'd probably be better if you had started with 1 all along.
Gothic 3 is worse but it has an intersting faction system that will remind you of Fallout New Vegas
@@unholy1988 gothic 3 was not too bad, but 4.. now that was some real trash.
@@olenraks idk what u r talking about. there is no gothic 4. never happened.
@@karuzo4116 haha yes lets make like it " never happened"
Very well analysis. You missed one thing: **climbing mechanincs**.
It allowed you to traverse almost any terrain or obstacles, and reach secrets - which were plenty and worth to explore.
It is like skill-based combat which you mentioned: with enough ingenuity you can reach restricted areas. High risk, high reward.
It's SO much better to climb difficult terrain to get to the secret cliff with precious stat-increasing plant on it, than just go by foot. Or steal equipment which you are supposed to pay for. Or even loot a dragon horde without killing the dragon! THAT is THE open-world experience. Exploration in its best, and adds a lot to replayability.
This mechanic was obviously not a deliberate design desision, but a coincidence; but it meshed seamlessly with other open-world features. And know what? Developers found that and integrated such area trespassing into the game logic; at some point Gothic II was patched to react correctly to player appearing in many places he is not supposed to be yet.
You're right, that was a feature that would have complemented this video very well. Especially with the optional "acrobatics" perk that granted you a longer jump, making secret places and sometimes alternative routes accessible.
I'll pin the comment for others to read, thanks for the addition!
Something Durmin pointed out in his Gothic review that I hadn't realized, the controls are pretty much a 1:1 lift from Tomb Raider, climbing included.
my favorite game of all tile can you tell me a game similar to this ?
And dont forget to mention the awesome gothic 1+2 community from all over the world! (Well, more like europe / east) :D
The climbing was great. When i first played the gothic 2 and came back from the colony i stumbled across the searching mages and they were faaaaaar to strong for me. I could only do at most 10% dmg had no scrolls left and so on. And thats cause i sneaked mostly through the colony and didnt level up properly. So instead of going back and leveling up i simply searched a long time a way over the mountains (that wasnt suposed to be there but cause of the non existence world borders possible). Continued the story line and was able to get stronger, buy new scrolls and so on. That was a very good experience that a game allows you to make mistakes or be simply too weak but give you different waysw to solve the situation then just grew stronger and level up. In most of my first playthrough i was way too weak:D every monster was too strong but it was still possible to continue.
I play Gothic 1&2 almost every year at least once, since they released years ago. It always feels kinda like home booting them up. Always gives you this warm feeling, or maybe I am just crazy. Hell, I was a lil kid playing them for the first time and I completely fell in love with them, after killing my first scavenger.
I really miss this kind of world and lore building these days. Characters, sounds, music everything fits perfectly together. It makes me really sad, that they don't make games like Gothic anymore, literally.
It's difficult to make games like Gothic because you have to literally create a massive fantasy world with missions and a solid plot, and this takes a lot of time, passion and work. Many producers of games today are simply lazy and take care only of money. And I hate them, look Ubisoft what has done with Assassin's Creed :(
Ps: I was a little boy too when i play the first Gothic i will always love this game
:) love these games ! I still play them and my kids wants to play too ! Just starded gt 2 again .
Absolutely agree, especially with your last sentence
What could have happened to the industry? I am pretty sure it's not about nostalgia goggles at all. If a game like Gothic, with soul and such a small but lovely world ould come out, I would notice it.
Damn AAA, they are like work-of-art-sexdolls - beautiful, aesthetic, but dull and with no personalities, - compared to the real pretty girls - the old games.
the bigger the company, the smaller the risks they are willing to take. just look at the early bioware games and their almost revolutionary take on character development in video games and compare them to the dumbed down, blockbuster-action like movie plots they produce now.
But can you blame them?
No, sadly.
Because there are investors and publishers who run market analysis and have to reach a certain number of sales in order for the game to be a success. A triple A title simply cannot be a failure anymore.
And therefore massmarket appeal comes first if you have to sustain a company that has a couple of hundreds of employees.
Thats not saying i dont enjoy triple A games like skyrim or fallout 4, its just the spirit that a gothic 1 and 2 had that i miss in the modern day games.
I have a lot of hope in Elex since PB made my favorite RPG Series, but the doubt can't be denied :(
s1yc3r you should try risen 1, seems identical but with a bit updated graphics
I still remember meeting that orc in the cave for the first time and it scaring the crap out of me. It was howling and running towards me faster than I could run and chopping me down faster than I could blink. I have some really fond memories of these games.
Thanks for another fantastic video!
I let him chase me into the city and I was amazed to discover that Lothar, the paladin in the entrance actually yelled "Orc!!!" and pull out some magic rune to take him down, rather than taking his sword like he did with other creatures, it just goes to show the level of work that was put on the game
That is exactly what my brother and I did. This is like the most easiest way to find the orc's wapen.
I didn't even know lothar did that, thanks for sharing!!
If Bosper gave you his quest you can just go to Bartok (i think it is his name) and ask him for hunting together. He will kill the shadowbeast and the orc in 1vs1 and you get the xp as well.
If Bosper gave you his quest you can just go to Bartok (i think it is his name) and ask him for hunting together. He will kill the shadowbeast and the orc in 1vs1 and you get the xp as well.
Morrowind was my first open world game, so it has a special place in my heart. Years later I discovered Gothic 1 and 2 through GOG and I found I actually preferred this rarely mentioned (in the US at least) German series because of one feature: atmosphere. And damn did they nail it! The NPC behavior and reactions to the player, the music, the lighting, the attention to detail. Amazing games!
The quest for Harad is even more complex. You can tell him that defeating an orc is too hard and he'll tell you to kill bandits near Akil's farm.
Or you can go to hunt with Bartok and try his luck🤣
@ToolaRoola He can really help with his bow but only if you kill all the blood flies and wolves before taking him with you.
Or you can buy it from Cipher
Seems i have an interesting experience on how i got the Orc weapon...
I also wanted apprentice with the Blacksmith and went searching for the Orc weapon!
As i was looking for the Orc out side of the city walls, i spotted something in the grass, it looked like a huge stone at first.
When i came closer, it wasn't the stone, it was the Shadow Beast...it turned towards me, jumped and killed me!
I was like WTF...
So i loaded the savegame and went looking for the Orc and managed to find him...did not last for long, he quickly killed me i had no chanse!
Loaded again and found the Orc again, only this time i ran like crazy and Orc was right behind me swinging his axe and growling...
I kept running towards the Shadow Beast (the damn thing was sleeping in the grass again) i just ran past him and kept runing...
Now i heard Orc and Shadow Beast, both growling behind me, i was so scared and kept running like Forest Gump until the growling was more distant.
I turned around and nobody was behind me...
I saw the Orc in the distance, he was running trough the forest, Shadow Beast was chasing him :D
I went to se were they went, after a minute i saw Shadow Beast slowly walking behind some trees and i found the orc dead in the grass (killed by the Shadow Beast) so i took his axe and gave it to the Blacksmith!
Best RPG game i ever Played!
Amazing. I couldn't describe Gothic better in a nutshell if I had a gun to my head!
By the way, great video and commentary...right now im watching your Hideo Kojima video (The Art of Meaningful Game Mechanics)
Real shame there are no more games like Gothic!
Thank you. :)
And yeah, the game is one-of-a-kind.
aaaaaaaaaaaahahahahaahahah brilliant
Hahah.
You sir, should be a story teller :D
The great thing about Gothic was that it was part an action RPG and part an adventure game. The quests you got were often small puzzles which you could solve by listening to people, knowing your environments and thinking out of the box. Most recent open-world games lack those qualities because the developers don't think of including features from adventure games. Even games where investigation and exploration would work very well, like the crime scene investigation in Batman Arkham or Witcher 3, tend to hold the player by the hand or give him very clear choices of what he can do. There's no mystery, everything is highlighted, notified and categorized, which makes the whole experience feel way more artificial. You always feel like playing a game with set rules, not experiencing an adventure.
The game that best captured a similar feeling of mystery, danger and reward as Gothic is Dark Souls. Its way of careful exploration, environmental storytelling and making the player work for his victory feels very similar.
good point. the dark souls comparison i mean. gothic has been one of my childhood favourites. being a german and the game being really popular back then because its one of the only high quality german games I grew up with it. disliking most rpgs after it because they just didnt deliver this kind of inmersion. dark souls did explorationwise.
but i think witcher 3 did narrativewise. if i could just merge these 2 i would basically jusr have gothic with up to date graphics.
nice one!!! Gothic and Dark Souls are my favorites games of all time.
***** That's why it surprises me there aren't more new RPGs refusing to hold your hand. Those issues with navigation and objectives were a problem 10-20 years ago, but not today when you can find an online guide in a matter of seconds without quitting the game. Games like Minecraft and Dark Souls expect players to give each other hints and look for help online, yet mainstream RPGs only get more and more streamlined and casual.
well said!
+mattchester its because companies want as many people as possible buying their game. they make it so that 5 year old kids can play 16+ games without thinking it's hard. some of the reason i like morrowind is exactly because you are not being handheld, you have a minimap and a world map but no quest marker or caves/dungeons marked on the world map. so when i was doing a quest for the mages guild where i had to find a mage in a mushroom house i had to read where is had to go and navigate there with the instructions i had gotten. the only quest log is a journal.
There's no better game than Gothic.
When you play the game, you'll understand.
2:13 NOT A SANDBOX
3:56 NATURAL PROGRESSION BORDERS
6:38 TACTICAL COMBAT
7:19 ENEMIES STAY DOWN!
9:10 KHORINIS IS ALIVE
10:05 ENVIROMENTAL STORYTELLING
13:10 THE THREE FACTIONS
14:30 REPLAYABILITY
15:14 CONTINUITY
I'm sold. Getting this game now. Thank you sir. The video was amazing :)
Awesome!!
I have the (classic) trilogy on gog.com for quite some time now. Have to play them.
Enjoy them, I completely love the Gothic series.
Be sure to get the latest version of Gothic 3 with all the community patches.
@@czarmanedead After a year he hasn't seen sun up yet. Let's give him another year to get back to real life.
I wonder, now, 2 years later. Have you really tried it and enjoyed it? Because I never recommend this game anymore, clunky controlls, bad graphics and a steep learning curve. I still absolutely adore it, but I somehow doubt that many people still can get into it, since it is so outdated
I wish elex can live up to its developer's name, I'm really nostalgic about the Gothic glory
days
Don't expect much...
:'(
ELEX will probably be amazing, the hell are you guys talking about? Risen 3 was a great return-to-form after the weird Risen 2.
Yeah, Risen 3 was pretty solid. Also, after revisiting Risen 2, it was not a bad game at all. It's different and doesn't feel like a PB game but it was still a decent game.
I have big hopes in ELEX and I hope that they go back to appropriate quest descriptions instead of using markers on a map. I'd also love to see collecting maps again (like in gothic 1, 2 and risen 1) where you had maps as items and have to collect them in order to have one, not have a full world map from the very beginning. (I know Risen 2 didn't do that but technically just one treasure map gave you the entire island map so it was pretty dull)
Diablo: I agree we can not say that elex is a bad game. who knows maybe it will be a revelation or a bust... we cant say it. All I know that I liked Risen 1 and Risen 3, they are not masterpieces but are games that only obsidian and pb can do. The hardcore.
I remember Gothic, it was great. Too bad many game developers don't learn from previous masterpieces.
Or they try to replicate it but fail to do even that. Sequels of masterpieces like these still need to expand and improve, but core design philosophy has to remain the same. That's the exact problem of Piranha Bytes (other than having bad publishers). They experimented with Gothic 3 but sacrificed many core aspects while stuff like Risen 1 were solid but not innovating enough to make impact.
The first goblin made me almost not discover this game, I had to reload so many times that I nearly uninstalled it. When I finally won that fight I felt like I'd smitten a giant. I'd been baptised and ready to enjoy the rest of the game.
haha same here man
Lol the one just as you get out Xardas's tower and you turn left in the hole? That mf fcked me up good lmao
I remember the lurker on G2. After I killed it I joked to myself, did I just beat the final boss?
Oh, I remember endless battles between fans of TES and Gothic in Russia...
It's still a pretty big deal though.
why not both? xD
Yeah, both are fun and I played them when they came out.
@Melanie L the plot wasnt that 1:1... if it was i would have cared about skyrims main plot :D
gothic 1,2 and to a certain extent 3 were masterpieces (easily the best RPGs ive ever played) but sadly they couldnt repeat the same success ... but i disagree with you on bethesda... bethesdas morrowind oblivion and even skyrim are great too but in different ways since they are vastly different from gothic series... they arent better but ive enjoyed them too
also with the "let the community finish it" is partly true to gothics devs too (especialy when i look at gothic 3... ive tried to play through it many times but ALWAYS got stuck on the main quests because of bugs and some side quests too )
Gothic combat > Morrowind combat
Gothic NPCs > Morrowind NPCs
Gothic was my entrance in the wonderfull world of rpg , and i still love it :)
Blue Boy same here
Hi , i ´v got the HD Mod , its so awesome ! Gratings from Korinhis :)
TBH it didn't get any better than this.
Minor spoiler in this comment!
One of my favorite moments in the first Gothic is an early quest, where you are led out of the Old Camp and then ambushed. If it's your first time playing, they probably beat you up. As you lie there with 1 hp left, you realize that these guys are criminals and not everyone has your best interest in mind - even the quest givers. It's not just out in the open world that enemies lurk, and you can't know them by the color of their name tag.
- This incredible moment really sold the believability of the world for me. It's a society of criminals, and it feels like it.
what I like about the quest you're talking about is that it's a completely optional sidequest... in 99% of all rpgs and obviously action adventures etc. the "bad guys" always ambush or trick you in a main story related situation, in other words: you're forced into the ambush no matter what so if you replay the game you're forced to sit through the same situation again...
in this exact situation in gothic you now have the advantage of knowledge so you can prepare for the ambush or avoid it all along
you can preemptively strike your ambushers and kill them before this event or just train up before the encounter etc.
OR you can absolutely get destroyed because you still have starting equipment and low level forcing you to avoid the situation and run away
in a scripted main story event you're always either somewhat prepared to actually win the fight or it's intended that you can't win... you don't get to decide much of the circumstances...
so this single situation offers more "value" than a lot of other games... also there were consequences to certain decisions in both gothic 1 and 2, nothing game breaking but you could miss out on a lot if you pissed the wrong dude
@@brohvakiindova4452 Yeah, this is what "role playing game" meant to the developers, I've heard people cathegorise Gothic as immersive Sims.
@@ZenoDovahkiin Immersive sim games are some of the best and Gothic certainly has many elements of that genre. RPGs nowadays are almost exclusively thought of as open world sandbox games. There's nothing wrong with open world games but they most often sacrifice worldbuilding and become this set of disconnected quests and locations to where you blindly follow map marker instead of making you immerse with the location and complete your objective in one of your preferred ways.
yes, probably the most memorable side quest in G1
after so many years, I still remember every spot shown in this video...!
I don't think there's any other RPG with as memorable map as Gothic 1 and 2. Not only is it memorable visually but it serves narrative and gameplay purpose. My perfect RPG would have map like that, only bigger, with city being huge and realistically sized (something more like Novigrad from Witcher 3), farms and villages larger, woodland areas and mountains larger, but core placement of locations exactly the same.
Anyone tried killing the orc by letting him chase you into the city?, I did it once and Lothar yelled "orc" and pulled out some magic rune to take him down, rather than his sword like he did when some other creature came in, this just goes to show how much detail this game actually had
That's a new one. Even after all this years and countless playthroughs, there is something else to learn about this game.
@@maxmustermann1455 yes I did that in my first playthrough. Lured him to the city gate and used fireball to get the last hit for XP.
Wow, I actually didn't know you could solve the smith's quest like that. I always went out hunting with the guy in the bow shop and got the orc weapon that way, from when he kills the orc. Fantastic!
Same! I let him kill it and looted the weapon before him.
You can also lure the Orc towards the city guards (it's tricky and you need to keep luring him over and over while avoiding the wolf attacks). The guards are strong enough to kill him without dying.
You could buy a weapon from mercenary, get it from hunting with more experienced guide, find it in cave near the city or man up and try to take on the orc yourself. I remember you could even say to blacksmith that orc is way out of your league. Smith actually agrees and instead you can go kill bandits who are pain for weapon's merchant. However merchant won't pay you for it, because his reward would be a good word sent to the smith. If you found orc weapon and helped merchant Separately, then you would get your payment.
@@bashirsidani7598 Same here. I also let Bartok do the killing, Just that I am abit more evil. I also lured the Shadow Beast and all the Goblin Skeletons to him and after he finished all of them off, I knock him down and took his sword, gold and bow and oblivon him. hehehe
@@5mwa that's my boy haha
This is the single best gamer ever made! I've been hooked since I was 14 and now im 33 and still playing.
I remember there was a button for looking behind you while running away and how terryfiyng it looked when the creature you are running from was right behind you because its face would be really big on the screen.
For anyone wondering, its Num 0
@@kordianisko or R
One of the best moments in gothic 2 was to returning to the country of gothic 1 a few years later and get into the old castle trow the broken wall.
Yup Gothic was and still is the best open world RPG
one addition: when enemies get respawned, there ARE also cannonfodder enemies added in again. i like that. makes you feel your advancement. in other games today it's often: why level up if the enemies get more powerful the same way. never feels different, you feel as powerful in the end as at the beginning.
You can still get killed if you make mistakes even with the best gear and weapons.
Natural progression borders reminded me of the 1999 action adventure game Outcast. You can technically access most of Adelpha from the get-go, but you will be quickly killed unless you acquire better gear and weaken the enemy forces first. These happen gradually as you progress in the story.
Gothic is the most unique game ever. Nothing compares to this experience
Gothic 2 my all time favorite RPG. Nothing could ever give me a feeling like gothic knew to deliver. This game... One of the things a german can be proud of :D
Wir hatten zudem auch die geile synchro mit Gänsehaut Garantie.
i feel the same way. i can easily overlook the little 'misunderstandings' we all had with the germans in the 1930s and 40s, becuase i feel they redeemed themselves by releasing these amazing games.
@@turkwillingston218 hahaha gothic even overcomes wars and hatred. love it!
THQ Barcelona, please find this video and take notes!
thats my biggest gripe with elder scrolls and fallout games - scaled leveling its so annoying because it essentially renders the gameplay experience to be the same from beginning to end - everything is always balanced to the point that there is no risk and no reward
Great video man. Love first two Gothics too. Return to the Valley of Mines in Gothic II is one the most awesome moments I ever experienced in a game, true nostalgia...
Great, now I want to replay it Gothic 1 and 2...
played g1 like 4 months ago, now g2 lvl 21 mercenary 2handed and crossbow. bro do it, its so fucking epic!! xD
Honestly first time I have heard of it. Graphics look good for the age
Gothic 1 and 2 (plus addon) ruined other rpgs for me. I can't seem to immerse in any other rpg because I compare them too much to Gothic and in the end I abandon and start a new Gothic playthrough, be it 1 or 2. I managed to go through G3 and Risen series though.
Same here Pal.
Even old school RPG's that doesn't treat players like morons, don't have that "golden middle" point, and just overwhelms you with tons of texts, where you can't figure out what part of the text is important to read, and what not. Instead of just letting you know, what you need to know, and making you decide if you want to read further (like books in Gothic).
The world of Gothic is just waaay more immersive then any RPG, I ever played, even including Might and Magic 6,7,8 series that I love so much.
Morrowind with plenty of mods can scratch that itch for me. To a lesser extend, witcher with mods works too. There are also many Gothic Mods that add new stories and worlds.
Risen 1 is pretty good so far.
Glad everyone still loves this. Here are my favorite Exploits:
Gothic 1:
-Smithing will make you rich
-Kharim too tough for you? go to the old mine, beat down the templar at the trader (since he's a different faction, ppl wont attack you), steal his weapon and spend a bunch LP till you can carry it, Kharim should be down in 3 hits
-transform into a bloodfly to scale enormously high walls or even pass through the barrier
-transform into scavenger to get longer jumps (works for Gothic 2 too)
-transform into meatbug will get you through the locked gate at the old camp early when it gets locked (you wont be able to kill gomez though)
Gothic 2:
-buy a transform into Dragon-Snapper Scroll and clear most of the map in chapter 1 (be careful, you cant save while transformed)
-Firerain- Scrolls are OP but limited, use them wisely
-trolls are extremely slow, as long as you stay behind them you can kill them with any weapon
-Iceblock-Scrolls will help with tough meele matchups
have fun.
Most of that, except the smithing duplication glitch, I would consider not an exploit but simply one of several options for approaching certain things. Which is what made Gothic so great - there often wasn't just the one obvious way to get somewhere or fulfil a task, but many ways.
got to agree with @Heroesflorian most of what you said aren't really exploits
an exploit would be in gothic 2 as a dragon hunter you can sell shadowbeast (english name?) horns to buster, beat him down, steal them and repeat for infinite money and exp.
or the popular speedrun exploit where you cast ice block on a trader and if the ice block damage over time actually kills the trader you can loot the whole trade inventory including every item you already sold to them...
just two examples out of the top of my head
for the kharim advice I would rather beat down the inn keeper in the new camp for his 1H axe that's pretty good... or you can avoid high level enemies and get the sword from the top of the mountain keep
one thing I hated about gothic 1 was that literally all the best weapons are owned by NPCs which means you can get them way too easy and way too early
also playing a mage you could still easily master a weapon of your choice and get 100+ strengths as well as all spells and plentiful magicka
@@brohvakiindova4452 I think one could also buy a meatbug transformation scroll, enter the castle at nighttime and empty the armoury there (chests and wall-hanging gear) for some pretty strong weapons.
@@Heroesflorian yeah as always with gothic there are plenty of options to get good gear very early on
I'd say in gothic 1 it's even easier than in gothic 2 notr because it's way harder to meet the strength/dex requirements for good weapons early on in the second game with addon and the high end weapons require close to 200 str/dex respectively so they don't give you that much of an edge
@@brohvakiindova4452 yep
I bought Gothic 2 Gold Edition thanks to this video ! :D Downloading now 8)
+Alan Randsom I highly recommend you to beat Gothic 1 first. It's an absolute must have, especially for the story
+Alan Randsom You totally have to try gothic 1 first. Don't get scared of the controls and don't be afraid of looking on a walkthrough in both games because they are really hard ;)
+̗ ̘ ̙ ̜ ̝ ̞ ̟ ̠ ̤ ̥ ̦ ̩ ̪ ̫ ̬ ̭ ̮ ̯ ̰ ̱ ̲ ͉kek ̎ ̄ ̅ ̿ ̑ ̆ ̐ ͒ ͗ ͑ ̇ ̈ ̊ ͂ ̓ ̈́ ͊ ͋ ͌ ̃ ̂ gothic 2 night of the raven and people say dark souls his hard
yeah you really should try gothic 1 first, that experience returning in gothic 2 and re-discovering the valley of mines you once explored is priceless
This game made my childhood!
I'll always remember my first playthrough of Gothic in the early 2000's. Pretty early in the game, I left the old camp through the back gate and turned right. Someone sat there and warned me that I am entering Orc Territory, so I left. But I just wanted to know what was behind that mountain, so I returned not much later and was immediatly chased down by an Orc partrol. Eventually I managed to outrun them by jumping into a river. In that river was a sunken tower, so I dived inside. In the tower where lots of Zombies and Skeletons who instantly killed me, so I decided that my adventure here was over and returned. When I left the tower I looked to the sky and saw the magic barrier engulfed in lighning, with big reflections of skullfaces. I was so afraid that I wouldn't return there until the end of the game because, without knowing, I had actually found a dungeon you where only supposed to enter right at the end. Returning there and just killing all the Zombies was a very special moment.
Man, such a great game. Is there an easy way to play it on Windows 7?
I love how people are sharing so many different personal, totally individual stories about their experiences.
Yes, you can buy it either on Steam or gog.com
(I'd recommend the latter)
I still have my old CD, but last time I played it, it didn't really work well with Windows 7. Are there any compatibility mods or was it just my system and I should try again?
SystemPak + PlayerKit. With them, it even works on Win10.
When I saw those forest Goblins I literally went to GOG and bought this game.
hahaha with me it was similiar. I bought the game when I saw those dinosaur chickens they look so ridiculous yet cute I had to get this.
As an indie developer who wishes to push gaming as a human frontier, I thank you for this video!
Nostalgia hit me hard with this video.
Gothic is the best game ever made imo, nothing comes even close to it. Great video analyzing why it's great, agree 100%
mustang19ms I think the witcher 3 is better. I was also in extreme denial when I first thought about that, I thought nothing could come close to my dear gothic but I eventually accepted it. They are in many ways similar but also extremely different. It's hard for me to explain but you should play the witcher 3, it is the best game ever made, and I've been playing since SNES era, gothic 1 and 2 are right next to to it in my top 10 of all time.
NOOOOOOOOOO! I want to continue to live in denial!
Just kidding, I will play Witcher 3 this christmas, I heard many people compare it to gothic, although I am not sure if Witcher will be good enough to beat the nostalgia in me, we'll see :)
Playing it right now, will let you know what I think :)
mustang19ms what about risen1?
Herpa, it's pretty good, but it doesn't have the atmosphere or the story, it didn't pull me in that much.
btw +Hauke I did finish Witcher 3, with the Mirror guy DLC (Blood & wine still not), it's a very very nice game, but I see no comparison between it and Gothic, it's not nostalgia talking, but it really didn't get me that involved.
The story is nice, but it's one which seems extremely influenced by game of thrones which I don't like, but it was still interesting. Although, the main story line was full of grind.
Overall it's a beautiful game with some extremely beautiful scenery, good variation of monsters and quests, but it lacks the magic in my opinion
Games like Gothic and Risen were the first of a kind as an open world RPGs, and it inspired later on a lot of other developers to create similar games started with Skyrim or the whicher and others, but still it was unforgettable experience, here i am being nostalgic about it in 2019.
Virgin Skyrim:
- Player can leave intro with Level 100 stealth in 30 minutes
- Cheating is "culture"
- Difficulty can be adjusted on the fly, challenge is a choice
- NPCs repeat an animation from 8am-8pm, then go to bed
- Level 10 character can gain access to "legendary" artifacts by doing chores
- Half of all locations get marked on the map before the player even visits them
- Player is pampered by the story despite not being extraordinary in any way
- Simultaneously, NPCs are condescending and rude to a legendary folk hero with unrivalled power
- No difference between factions except ending of sideplot
- Garbage combat amounts to holding block and using overpowered abilities acquired in the main storyline
- Arbitrary invisible boundaries
- Huge, boring map
- Costs $50 and has monetised mods
Chad Gothic:
- Makes player a man; is the parent they never had
- Arrogance and foolishness are punished
- NPCs trick the player and make them feel like an ignorant child
- Difficulty is in the player's mind
- NPCs have unscripted interactions and behave normally
- Only way to make progress is to accept you are a weakling
- Player goes from rags to riches through dedication and humility
- NPCs respect players who are worthy of respect
- Sidefactions have separate converging plots
- Combat is alienating but becomes natural and dynamic over time
- Boundaries are challenges that the player can overcome
- Small map full of content
- Costs some loose change and has a dedicated community and developers
Man this was EXACTLY what I was thinking about lately: It's so much cooler having NPCS describing the way than just having a questmarker. Also visually handmade maps are so much more atmospheric than a minimap
Ragnar, your videos are amazing! I love all the hard work you put into them and YES I love Morrowind as well :)
+Big Will Thank you! And yes - Morrowind was like a second home. I will definitely talk about that game in great length at some point in the future :)
Looking forward to it mate :)
+Big Will Morrowind is a good example of an immersive open world game, by immersive I mean that it envelops the player.
G1: 4 times
G2+Addon: 6 times
G3: 1 time
G4: never touched that S***.
G4 is not gothic. The game you are talking about is Arcania which is somewhat of a gothic story of some sort. You should give G3 a shot with the community mod its actually not that bad (definitely not even close to G2 levels but still better than most games)
@Elx barbosa Risen 1 is the closest game to Gothic I have ever played.
I would go as far as saying its on par quality wise in most aspects.
Risen 2 is a steaming pile of shit which main focus was to be optimized for consoles. Dumbed down both mechanically and narratively.
I (dumb as I was) was excited for Arcania, bought it, played it and didn't enjoy it. It is basically the gothic formula (mechanics and such) but it is one big ass linear game. No option to go somewhere different, no reason to go back, only one quest after another to go forward.
If you guys like immersives games like gothic 1 and 2, you should try Vampire The Masquerade Bloodlines. Althought it is not an open world but filled hubs, its unique atmosphere, storytelling, npcs dialogues, relationship between them, progression, makes you feel inside the game. It is almost as you are a real vampire.
As a fellow Gothic (1 & 2) fan, I'm impressed by the clarity of your words to describe why the saga it's an amazing experience in comparison with many other watered-down 3rd person rpgs of that era and onwards. Subbed!
Thanks for putting together what I love about Gothic and what I miss in modern games.
I don't think it is "modern games" problem only. The two gothics are unique games in their own fashion. I don't recall any other games so good to me - before or after.
Make sure to check out the Skyrim total conversion mod called Enderal (with unique map etc.) which will release in English shortly. On sureai net homepage. It has A LOT of things done really well, by this German modding team. (5 years in development)
+TheSchwarzKater, Thanks a lot for that reference! I definitely will be waiting for english version of Enderal (German language is unfortunately out of my mind range yet), but for now started playing Nehrim.
And as far as I got, it is awesome! It really have some gothic's benefits, changes/fixes dozen of things I hate in Oblivion as well as in Skyrim (like levelled monsters, soulless world, skill-based levelling, boring and unpleasant combat and overall sandoxness) and tells intriguing story.
I would say, Nehrim definitely worth trying for any Gothic's fan. Hope Enderal would be the same class game.
One of the greatest and deppest analysis of one of the most beautiful (and, by now, often underrated) RPG game!
Now that i've heard THQ is working on a remake of Gothic 1 i really hope somebody important there knows about this video. This clearly points at everything that made Gothic 1 and 2 awesome and very unique open world games back then, despite all their flaws.
one of the most important open world element is how all the items are in fixed positions with just a few restricted by chapter progression, you can find or buy the best weapons in the game from the very beginning
Loved Gothic 1-2 and Risen 1. But i think their world is a different kind. It's much smaller then modern open-world games. It's as big as it needs to be. Openworld in gothic is more like a very big Dark souls level then a openworld game like Creed or GTA.
I like gothic style of limiting zones with strong enemies. Modern King's Bounty games on maximum difficulty is kinda like that - not spawning and not leveling enemies that force to seach each zone for more enemies and loot of your level of power.
I love that non-spawning system, because it makes each enemy as an event, this goblin is not the same then this goblin - it's another one. Of the same kind - but you need both to maximize your EXP. Not just grind infynite encounters.
+Ole Gerko well,gothic 2 plus the addon is a really huge game,that can definitly compete with modern games ,but is also much more detailed as u mentioned,heck it has storys and deatails behind almost every corner of its world^^
but the world feels huge tho. Even tho skyrim map was huge ....it felt very short and lonely.
Yeah skyrims world was boring, since evry dungeon was copypaste and those loading times, u had to load for a city and then for evry building each, evry part of gothic could manage the entire world without loading, except the dungeons for gameplay reasons... poor skyrim just doesnt has a chance, i liked fallout 4 a bit, but the gameplay and the items werent unique enough
Elder Scrolls have been going downhill ever since it peaked with Morrowind. Skyrim feels to bland and boring. Instant teleports, waypoints, enemy scaling, loot scaling, repetitive dungeons... just a total casualfication of what a RPG stands for... if you want a real RPG play Planescape Torment, Gothic or Morrowind... not Fallout 4 or Skyrim...
+Planetdune
Yup, It's no surprise that the mod combination like morrowloot + handplaced items +no-level-scaling mods + combat and skill overhaul in Skyrim is so popular. Skyrim forces you to constantly start over to get some enjoyment out of it because of it's gameplay system. These mods try to fix it somewhat.
Epic video man, I liked who you showed that most quests in Gothic need thinking and can be completed in different ways. As you also mentioned, gothic is very rewarding, like you swim and swim and swim for 4 minutes and suddently you find a secret beach or a secret island with vaast rewards, climb a huge moutnain ledge and find a secret cave. Try do that in Skyrim lol.
The game of my childhood
also there is one more way with this orc weapon, you can ask one hunter in town to go hunting togheter. so you get weapon from orc and also a lot of xp from hunting cuz everything he kills adds you some xp aswell (i dont remember name he is close to market place)
Gothic was great, i agree. I'll never forget my first sessions with it. Its been a while.
Thank you for bringing up my favourite game series and a symbol of my childhood up :D
I think it is worth mentioning that you are also able to get the orc weapon by going on a hunt with a seasoned hunter located in the city. You both exidently stumble uppon an Orc-Scout and with a little luck are able to kill it. The guy is then quite shocked and troubled afterwards because he did not expect to find an Orc so close to the city gates. That just shows the countless variants of solution to quests in Gothic.
I totally agree, I just finished Gothic 2,again ! Finding new stuff every time
you can also just go hunting with bartok and kill an orc with his help. not too hard!
Yeah there are different ways to solve the quest:
1. Asking the smith of something ore easy (obvious choice in the first playthrough).
2. Asking Bartok to go a hunt where you meet an orc scout that is easy to defeat.
3. Go raiding the Bandit camp near the eastern exit of the city where a orc axe is put on the caves door.
But there are many more secrets. Like the secret thives guild you should destroy but also can join and learn thieves abilities.
option 4. buy dragon snapper scroll and kill as many orcs as you like
Scar that's wrong, you get expierence when transformed.
Bolek Lolek he might mean hitpoints. You level up when you are transformed and get exp, but you dont get the level up hp bonus while transformed. So you are lacking permanent exp with every level you make
Nobody thought about simply luring the orc to the city? That's like the oldest Gothic trick. Anytime you need someone beaten/killed, provoke them and then let them run after you to some of your friends that will take care of the matter for you.
Best nostalgia vibe that I've received in Gothic II - was when I helped Diego to reach exit from the valley. The dialogue... was priceless :')
Oh man, I spent years THINKING this exact video in my mind, and now someone actually made it :D YES TO ALL OF IT. I just wanted to also add - sometimes worlds that are very huge might feel overwhelming for the player. The old camp was small, and it was good. The only thing I am unsure about is that when playing I was young and had a lot of time on my hands. Maybe now it wouldn't be that fun anymore.
Fuck yeah, Gothic! I loved the first two. They still have atmosphere.
Sooo many good memories with this game :) hah, good times. Here in Poland, Germany and Russia, it was absolute classic and 'must have' on every kid list. Those were the times when PC was a luxury, and so pack of friends gathered after the school in one house and enjoy the Gothic while chatting and eating snacks. For me, it was this interaction that placed Gothic series so close to my heart.
As a fan I played the trilogy in 4 languages, and I must say that the English version is the worst of all unfortunately. First is polish, then there's German and my nr.3 is Russian. It's a shame that English speaking community was not the target for producer.
I think the english language just cant transport this rough style of gothic. German Russian and Polish are just way better for this.
I think another problem is that Gothic 1&2 had some licence problems or something like that and it came out 2 years later in America. It already was outdated and noone cared about it.
But yes the synchro was very bad.
I also recommend you to watch the videos by DurminParadox.
He explained that pretty good.
I like the english version, was the first i tried and i feel attached to it
Exactly the same for me. I was like 10 when the game came out and I had 1/3 of my class gathered at my place after school just to watch me play. Good times.
Gothic man. Nothing less than a masterpiece of art. I must've played through both games at least 5 times. Thanks for the video
when you mentioned modern open worlds feeling like theme parks in the begginig it immediatelly made me think about the contrast between WoW and earlier MMOs, I think there are similar points to be made in those cases too.
What about Risen 1?
I think it captured Gothic's world feel.
Risen 1 was very good at the time. It felt like a modern Gothic. But it doesn't really hold up nowadays in my opinion.
It was waaay too short.
That was Risen 1 problem.
It felt like 1/3 of Gothic.
This reminds me a lot of dark souls 1, I always felt happy knowing there were enemy barriers in the world that I could go back and explore.
I always dream of a mix of dark souls combat and gothic type story telling. Anyway, great video!
+Ob1tus187 "I always dream of a mix of dark souls combat and gothic type story telling. Anyway, great video!"
That. I had that thought for a long long time, too.
+Ob1tus187 Actually Gothic 1 and 2 are on par with Dark Souls in terms of difficulty :) both Gothics are pretty difficult games
If I could make an RPG I would take inspiration from the Soulsborne games, the Gothic/Risen series, and the Drakengard/Nier series. It would be a small but packed open world(don't worry, there would be three open worlds in the game that are small but packed: the human world, the Fae realm, and the Eldritch Plains). Side quests would be "randomized"(the side quests are all set in stone, whether or not you get them is randomized. Also making NPCs hostile locks you out of their quests, joining certain factions also locks out side quests). There would be no HUD, and no mini map(you can by a map, but it would just be a map of the land that has no markers), or compass. You would have to visually assess the damage your character has taken. No Character Creation, but you can pick between two male and female characters. Picking one means that the other will be out in the world doing their own thing.
Gothic 1 & 2 are one of the best, hardcore RPG games ever made. Their world is alive and breathing and as dangerous as fuck. At first, you are incredibly weak, making it impossible to move on with simple quests at times. But the feel that you become more powerful as you level up is something only those two games made me truly feel. The original developers have the rights back so here's hoping the make a true Gothic game this time to wash a way the shitty taste that Gothic 4 left...
One of the best things was the way animals behaved. Sleeping at night, leaving the one guarding. Warning you with vocal threats and posturing as large as possible. Some attacking right off the bat. Some slowly crawling towards, threatening with audio cues.
Its still great to experience.
And in the Gothic 1 some monsters like snappers or orcdogs were sneaking up to you :D
@@ruster2230 holy fuck, I forgot about that. Goddamn shadowbeasts
I think it says it all that during most of your video I could immediately tell you which was Gothic 1 and 2 and which places you were showing even though I haven't played either in probably a decade now.
Gothic's world building is fantastic and, in my opinion, every open world game designer these days could learn a lot from it. It's just chock full of memorable moments and places and thanks to the love and care they poured into this when building the world, no place looks alike.
Now, we just need to have a company mix this design philosophy with updated graphics and Dark Souls combat. I won't hold my breath though.
kinda late reply... but which ones would that be? And dont u dar say skyrim ^^
Demandredalus I don't understand the question. Which would "what" be?
huh...I seem to have replied to the wrong comment.
It was something about games with much better combat than dark souls (allegedly).
Sorry for the mixup
Demandredalus oh no prob. Yeah, I still haven't found a game with more satisfying combat than DS/BB.
"Severance: Blade of Darkness" is worth trying just for the engaging melee combat, which was probably the primary focus in its development. It's from 2001. It gives a feeling of force and impact in every movement. There are combos specific to each weapon, hits can knock off-balance, shields break, enemies hit each other when too close, limbs and heads are cut off depending on where you hit, usually the final hit. And there is a good variety of fighting styles through four different classes, each preferring certain weapons.
Search youtube for "sargon nemrud" for a quick skilled fight with the knight.
The "PC Longplay [113]" on youtube shows a playthrough with the barbarian.
The fantasy story is bare-bones as far as I remember. But locations are atmospheric, shadow effects add to this.
There are spells, magic. The melee combat is the main attraction.
Exanima is an early-access game with very interactive combat and physics, but uses an overhead perspective.
It's funny that RagnarRox doesn't even mention the sequels to Gothic II...
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I didn't want to talk about the whole Gothic 3 kerfuffle, because the video was already long enough as is and it wouldn't have added anything to my 'love letter' - and after G3 there were no further add-ons or sequels. Nope. Nothing. *lalalalala*
Gothic 3 has actually a LOT of great ideas - but the fact that it was released WAY too early in development keeps us from ever knowing what the game would have become had Piranha just gotten enough time to finish it. I feel like it could have become something truly epic.
Gothic 3 now has become beautiful with mods (Quest Pack and Content Mod). It's a bigger Gothic 2.
Hey :)
You may be interested in the Gothic 3 Community Story Project. It's been in development for years by now and it looks realling promising. Maybe they'll even release it one day. g3csp.de/en/
PS: Lovely video, you pretty much summed up what I love about this game. :)
Is there a guide that teaches how to mod G3 in the best possible way? Kinda like STEP for Skyrim... I really would like to get into G3 with those mods, but as a non german speaker i'm having an hard time finding the best compromise when modding it.
It's not even "non-linear", it's multi-linear. It is nicely balanced; many open-world games lack focus. As you progress, things are more focused, more linear, until you complete it. So you have a million choices, then thousands, then hundreds, then a few, then completion of the game. It uses your excitement and curiosity to pull you in, and as you are pulled in it becomes more focused, which directs your energy into new and interesting things as you progress. Many open world games are kind of flat.
I also like that the game sticks with the decisions you make. There are many occasions where when you refuse an offer you get no second chance
I really love it to listen to someone, who loves Gothic (II) as much as I do!
"Natural Progression Borders"? More like "terrifying face-eating monsters", which enhabit 60% of the world.
Love the video. Not only because Gothic 2 is my favourite game of all time). When I got started with it in my 11 years, with my 16-bit console experience, I didn't even knew what is savesystem is. Started it for 4 times, before realising that I can save the progression. )
I think I was 8. I needed weeks to figure out how to pick up that stupid berry at the start of the game haha.
You mean in Gothic 1? That's because the control system is fucked. It was supposed to be played with keyboard only (in 2001, can you believe that...) and Mouse control was added as an afterthought. Left mouse button was basically just mapped to Control, that's why you still have to press forward at the same time to pick something up...
Yeah, it had something special going on. Still remeber the thrill of outsmarting beasts in the forest by luring them on to each other to clear the way, and seeing how fighting animation change with skill upgrade, or finding secret places with cool loot all over the world. By modern standarts it was pretty small, but it was so immersive.
The way gothic 2 utilizes Armor is also absolutely genius. Your armor is the most determining factor in fights. But you have to earn armor and can't buy or loot it. Receiving newer, better armor is usually connected to entering a new act or reaching a milestone in the story. This also makes for a very rewarding progression.
Yeah, a new piece of armor feels like a geniune achievement, a possession to hold in awe, true!
Well, SOME armour you can buy, technically. :P
Heavy guard armour, medium & heavy mercenary armour.
I just hope that lot of people will watch this video and find out that there are much better games than mainstream TES and AC. Thanks for this love letter, would send it too (also, you have awesome voice). Gothic rocks!
Thanks to reddit I stumbled onto this video and I'd like to say this is the best comprehensive look at the Gothic formula that I have seen this far.
Great video, commentary and summary of all the important components. Thank you for making this!
+Erinyes _ Thank you! Glad you enjoyed it :)
Best game of my Childhood even now its one of my all time favorites i realy wish someone would do a reforged version
One thing i really liked about gothic and i never seen in any other game was how animation were changing based on your skill level, so at the begining you would hold your single handed sword with both hands and swing it like a bat and at the end you would hold it gently in one hand and slash around with it like a badass. Besides immersion and looking cool it seved another purpose, you could judge the skill of your opponent just by looking at his stance, because it applied to NPCs as well
witcher 3 took a lot of ideas from old gothic games
+KonradGM True, but it also had way too much of the repetitive sandbox tasks Ragnar criticizes in the beginning.
Tasks that are completely irrelevant and you don't have to do them. And 'way too much' is quite the exaggeration.
Flskon TheMad It's not really required (though you might have a harder time leveling up and gathering loot), but it's still a pretty big part of the game that can easily take 40% of your play time. But I understand that with a world so huge, you can't make everything special and unique.
@@matman000000 Witcher III "repetitive tasks" What? O.o? Every single quest is hand-written. Did you even play it?
@@matman000000 But that is not true. Witcher III has no repetitive quests at all, every single quest comes with its own unique story, some sidequests feel like your doing the main plot. Man, people are so nostalgia-ridden and delusional.
subbed just for that amazing and detailed video!
There's a third way to get an Orc weapon: If you want to become the hunter's apprentice, he'll tell you that he previously had an apprentice who quit. You can find him in the city and convince him/pay him to go hunting with you. With him the pack of wolves become much easier and you'll have the pelts in no time. But you can also convince him to venture deeper into the forest, where you eventually run into an Orc. Kill him, take his weapon and you've not only acquired a weapon, but also killed an Orc.
So there are THREE ways to complete one quest and none of them are explicitely mentioned. In Skyrim or Fallout, you'd have three quest markers guiding you all the way, robbing you of all sense of accomplishment and discovery.
Yeah. I love that there are subtle hints, though. Like Ragnar has mentioned - you can talk to the guard on the city walls, and he'll mention the orc. Similarly, you can talk to one of the farmers (Vino, I think) at Lobart's farm, and he'll tell you about another orc in the forest near the farm (the one you go to hunt with the apprentice).
And I fully concur with your last point. It's not a hand-holding thing like today, where a game would've told you explicitly that there are 3 ways of getting the orc weapon, and which NPCs to talk to in order to learn where to get the weapon, and how. And while hints in Gothic were subtle enough that the player would mostly realise them in hindsight, it was all the sweeter to actually discover them after some sleughing, instead of being spoon-fed.
@@KubinWielki The difference between games like Gothic with actually well written quests and games like Skyrim with poorly written quests is that games like Gothic give you enough information via talking to NPCs and quest logs to naturally complete quests by finding your way around, whereas games like Skyrim don't give you enough information and rely on quest markers for you to have any chance of completing the quest at all. Turning quest markers off may solve the immersion problem, but only exacerbates the whole "Where the f*ck do I go?!" problem.
You can also convince Harad the quest is too hard and he will tell you to go kill bandits instead. Of course you have to figure which bandits he's talking about and actually fight them. Depending on which you think is easier to do you can go do this or that. Of course if you convince him to fight bandits you can't go back on that decision. So careful with your words in this game but also shows it throws you multiple ways to impress him. Honestly finding the orc weapon is the easiest.
I was 11 years old when Gothic 2 released and i will never forget the adventures i had with my friends, which are some of my fondest childhood memories. The first time we encountered an Orc and got absolutley REKT, the incredible city of Khorinis, the first time i put on the heavy paladin armor and i could go on for hours. Perfect game. Thank you Piranha Bytes :)
well, gotta play the Gothic games now.
I enjoyed Witcher 3's open world for the most part and finished it, but I had to disable the GPS
the problem with disabling everything is that the game is not made to play without questmarker or even the map. you would run around and not know what to do even by trying it.
best game i've ever seen. Gothic 2 , 1 and 3
The third gothic is the worst of them I think, Gothics 1 and 2 I finished both like 5 times each and still it´s fun and I´d like to play again, Gothic 3 was interesting for first time but today it seems to me like rubbish, for some reason
The World of G3 was way too big and empty so the whole atmosphere died bc of that.
I watch this video at least once every year. I finished Gothic 1 a few years ago and i had a blast. I strongly reccomend to anyome to try it. There is also an HD mod out there, it looks great and it is very easy to install. I downloaded Gothic 2 Gold Edition and i am gonna finish that also. I played it a few times but never finished it. But while playing Gothic 1, you really feel the progression of your char. It has such unique atmosphere that i didn’t find that in any other RPG game, except Witcher 1 and WoW Vanilla. Any rpg fan looking for a single player rpg that doesn’t hold your hand, to work for your reward and feel the satisfaction of accomplishment, play this.
I miss games like Baldur's Gate, where you get a quest from a non highlighted NPC talking about strange things he witnessed a little walk south of beregost.
Then you had to go explore. You had to find Beregost and then explore the area south of it until you found what was described. Exploration, the world itself, was gameplay.