How Arcane RESPECTS Fathers
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- čas přidán 12. 09. 2024
- Netflix's Arcane is incredible, as a show and as an example for how you respect parents (esp. fathers) in entertainment. What did you find most compelling about Arcane?
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#BadgerDad #Arcane #Netflix #Fatherhood
"Fathers don't need to be biological; they need to be there."
Very, very well said.
Thanks!
Its not about who you are born to but who you die for.
That's why there's a channel showcasing a "father" teaching others basic daily lives problems into which solves the problems of kids growing up without a father or without their father care's
Robot fathers incoming
Fathers ought to not be biological. #AdoptDontPop
One thing I appreciate is how Silco's paternal bond with Jinx doesn't change his role as the villain. It's an overused trope in all forms of media to have a person turn good due to parental instinct, a technique that is especially apparent in how often motherhood is used to redeem female villains. But when one of Silco's subordinates loses her child, he is completely unsympathetic to her loss. His ability to relate as a parent doesn't compel him to regret his actions just because they lead to the death of someone else's child. Which to me is a good example that a villain can have good traits without having to have redeemable traits.
excellent point, thanks for sharing
Exactly.
!!
Villain really only depends on who's perspective you see it from. Silco is arguably a hero to Zaun. His methods are absolutely cruel, but he is doing what he can, with the options available. The alternatives to Silco, the Chemlords - are interested in only Profit, where as Silco uses shimmer to fund his war-enterprise, while also perfecting the super-soldier aspect of the drug. He doesn't have many options to compete with Piltover's wealth, technology, and superior force. To contrast, Luke Skywalker is a Rebel (terrorist) in Star wars, but people cheer for him to beat the oppressive empire.
The story touches on moral ambiguity very well, and has a lot of grey areas, instead of black and white. Piltover is directly responsible for the undercity, and the rampant crime, drugs, and violence, that flooded the street, even before Silco takes power. There are many like myself, who actually feel Silco isn't a villain at all, but doing what he can with the hand he was dealt. He's certainly not a morally good person, but to call him a villain is a bit of a stretch.
If Piltover never oppressed the undercity, and actually treated them with respect - like they do their upper-citizens, then Silco and the rebellion(s) would never have happened in the first place.
Like most things in life, it's more complicated than just "Right" and "Wrong". Which is an aspect I greatly appreciate.
One of the hardest tropes to get right imo, a bad person, but a good character.
It's too easy to either just end up with a anti-hero that dabbled with evil, cartoonishly bad reasoning for their actions, or maybe a decent villain, but gets upstaged by the "hero" doing something even worse to stop them.
The scene at Vander's statue is such a masterpiece
It’s so well done, esp the spin to show Jinx is there
@@badgerdad6690 If you look closely you can see her hair sticking out prior to the spin
It definitely showcase the opposites of both Vander and Silcobin goals but they are similar in many ways and not different.
this show have more respect to father hood characters then naughty dog s last of us 2
@@badreedinedjellali1328 so so so true
As a woman raised by a single father (my mother abonded me) it makes me really happy to such a positibve portrayl of fathers in this show.
Glad to hear you had a positive father in your life, they need to make more shows like this!
My dad raised me entirely by himself too, and it drives me nuts how fathers are portrayed in most film and television. Save for a few examples, good fathers, and especially single fathers, might as well not exist as far as Hollywood is concerned.
internalized misogyny... REEEEEEEEEE
kidding of course. tho you should hate your father, thems the rules
@@daikhairai7194 what
@@lightfractals cuz thems the rules I don make em. Certainly don't agree with em but thems the rules.
The scene I point to most is Vander’s last stand. We see him after losing so much. 3 of his children are dead (or at least he thinks so) his “brother” is dead, murdered at the hands of his other “brother” who is ruining everything Vander hoped to maintain. He was beaten, bruised and is crushed under rubble after being in an explosion. He hangs his head in defeat and accepts whatever fate is coming to him.
Yet for all that emotional and physical pain, It only took hearing his daughter cry in pain to restore his will to live, to fight and to protect.
Truly the male fantasy: Get up, it’s not time to die yet. Someone still needs you.
It's a primal need, to be the protector and needed. Great point!
It's like the (can't think of the term) where parents are able to surpass their physical limitations to come to the aid of their child, i.e. lifting a car.
@@dolofonosesostrefis Exactly, he knows he will likely die but does it anyway
@@dolofonosesostrefis you're thinking of the term "Adrenaline rush". No, not the rogue ability from World of Warcraft.
What happens when adrenaline kicks in, in life-or-death situations like the one you mentioned, is that the body reacts in a very interesting way. It starts pumping blood away from places where it is not so needed, such as your stomach or other organs, and starts pumping blood rapidly to your muscles and your brain. The increased oxygen level from the increase in blood makes you think clearer and faster, while you react much more precisely, since your muscles are being supplied with more oxygen than usual.
@@Dalinos not quite, there's one that specifically happens to parents but can't be scientifically proven because it can't be replicated in a lab. I'll edit if I can find the term
Edit: Hysterical Strength
Wiki page: en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hysterical_strength
I _love_ how there are so many videos praising _completely different_ but equally complex elements of this show. It’s insane to me that these are first-time writers
That is crazy, can that really be? If yes, they have studied the greats and implemented accordingly.
@@badgerdad6690 you should check out some interviews they did where they explain their process, it’s really interesting
@@hexdanoff Bro
@@hexdanoff "plot kinda has to stay flexible but you have to know your central questions for your character arcs" is the Hallmark of every brilliant character-driven story. So many writers don't understand that. A character driven story should begin and end with its characters. You're going to understand who they are and how and why they're going to change, then map events, make them coincide with other arcs etc to create that change that you wanted in your character. You should never write an event then freestyle how it's going to impact your character. That's very dangerous and hard to get away with.
@@davepatois297 Yep. Writing on the fly without clearly thinking things out leaves massive plot holes and unintentional ret-cons. I like how nearly every choice the characters made led to a string of events with realistic consequences rather than being just contained in a small segment or area or have no effect at all.
as a father of a 2 year old daughter I enjoyed arcane so much.
it's brilliant!
RIP. She will be your undoing :D
That would make her an eggplant princess then
@UwU DahWholesome EVERYBODY WANTS TO BE MY ENEMYYYYYYYYYY!!!
@@minecraftweeeweeweeb8695 this is the only reply I like
One piece of dialogue that really hit for me was Vander talking to Vi about her influence over people who choose her as a role model/leader. My grandfather was the only person until this show I've ever heard that from. I do think it is a really important piece of advice many should learn and understand. "When people look up to you, you don't get to be selfish. You say run they run, you say swim, they dive in. You say start a fire; they show up with oil, but whatever happens; It's on, You." -Vander
This is the truth of responsibility. I oversee a team in my work life. I often get requests for more responsibility (and with it, more money/status) but when they find out they need to supervise others, they have no idea what that really means. Your Vander quote above is right on. Chasing leadership is not just a perks filled game, the responsibility comes with a stress not understood until they do it.
My little sister used to copycat whatever i did or say so whenever i would do something that would be too much for a kid her age but normal for mine she would usually get hurt and my mom would blame me for showing it to her and get angry at me. She would drill into me a very similar
speech on leadership and responsability Vander did to Vi. I understand it and it's a good thing to teach it but please refrain from repeating it multiple times to kids because it would lead to a guilty and hyper-responsabile mentality
@@areswalker5647 Yeah I could see going overboard with it being wrong, but that would also come down to context. Grilling responsibility into a kid's head over something they are not responsible for is wrong and would show that the person teaching leadership is too ignorant on the topic to be giving anyone any lessons. Now real things that are your responsibility, should be taught. Too many pass the blame or responsibility to another due to their own weakness or cowardice. It's perception, awareness, and common sense. It's mind blowing how many in our lives are not strong in those traits.
@@IAmOddGirl i understand what you mean i agree
Something that adds to your argument is that the most stable, rational and well adjust character is Caitlyn, the only character we see interact with both parents. And for what little we see of that dynamic, they balance each other out in their approach to parenting, giving Caitlyn enough room to make her own choices.
This is where a short video can only dig in so much, great point here!
''Caitlyn is the polar opposite of Vi, she is tall, she's rich and with breathing parents'' - Sarcastic Chorus, 2022
ekko has two parents too, but their poor working in sweat shops to send him to college, well in the game.
@@chandalir Ekko has both parents that's why he's also sane and well.
@@matheussanthiago9685 have you seen the finale? not for long :>
The parts where Vi leans against Vander and when Jinx does it to Silco are my favs. Tells you everything you need to know without a word
Exactly!
Not a father yet but I really learned a lot from the character of Vander.
Given how his biggest role is in arc 1 (just over 2 hours), it was amazing how many of his moments and lessons landed so well.
@@om-boi huh
@@om-boi how?
@@om-boi that's their decision, not an agenda's
@@om-boi It's none of your business.
Its amazing this show actually depicted men properly instead of strawmen for the daddy issues of the writters
Its so great to see positive depictions of men.
A rarity, and amazing how it didn't detract from the female characters of the show. If anything, the whole show was better for it. Shocking!
@@badgerdad6690
If you have to put one group down to make others look good then you're saying they are weak.
Also this mentality just leads to failure then success which Hollywood hilarious enough still doesn't understand.
Right!? I was so dissappointed when they did that to aang in legend of korra. It seemed like he would have been a great dad, but the they threw his character under the bus....
The sad reality is that many "deadbeat dads" are the result of wives who were awful people in the relationship and even more awful after it ended. So many women use their children as pawns to hurt the father, driving him away even further, then teaching his own children to hate him for leaving. Either that, or they got pregnant without him agreeing/knowing about it, then acting surprised that he didn't want kids. I've never understood the idea that it's normal for women to rationally opt out of an unexpected pregnancy, yet men are vilified for it.
@@derek96720 The thing is that half what you said is not fact. They are more single mums than dads in the world. Women usually take responsibility and raise the kid while the man leaves. Yes sometimes single mothers aren't good at mothering and they should be held accountable. Men should stop impregnating women they don't want to marry. The responsibility lies on both sexes. So how about don't just blame women?
As a father of two daughters some scenes are very haunting. I think Arcane has more emotional impact for fathers than it does for most other viewers.
I certainly felt that way
I concur
True
I've cried a few times watching this because becoming a dad changes you. I've had moments where I wanted to scream at my kid "how did you do this to me, how did you make me care so much about you!?" ( I never have)
I think Arcane can hit people hard more than just fathers who got kids. I watched Arcane with the viewpoint of the child. It reminded me of the things I lost and the things I never had. It showed me what could have been had my dad loved me unconditionally and not minded my issues as a child. I felt jealous at the end but also like I was grieving over something that I will never have. I still keep watching it now to really let myself feel. It's a really good show.
While on the surface Arcane is a story about two sisters. But the story is shock full of parent-child interaktions/stories. I've never seen so much in a series before! Vander with his four and Silco-Jinx are the obvious. Caitlyn with both her parents, though most interaction is with her mother. Then you have Mel and her mother, Jayce and his mother, Marcus and his daughter. The one that loses her son after Jayce/Vi action against the shimmer-factory. Even Sevika talks about her father and their interactions.
With every parent-child story you see how family molds the characters. Usually in most animations the parent is either dead, missing or someone who never understands the protagonist or believe in them or their stories or wants/needs. But here the interaction, lessons and talks has consequences and evolves the characters. The parent as a character is respected for their role, they are not made fun or mocked. In many ways you see the love of family in them. There's more respect for family and the different components of it in one season of Arcane than I have seen in seven seasons of other shows.
I could not believe how much they jam packed in 9 episodes. NINE! There are some shows with multiple seasons that can't deliver the same.
Childhood usually defines much a persons adult choices (and the life that results from it). The show really gets that esp. with the time skip allowing for the child and then teen/adult flip.
Silco lives out the conviction that victory comes through no compromise.
He starts the show refusing to compromise in his ambition to liberate Zaun. He ends the show refusing to compromise in his ambition to protect Jinx.
It is a great character arc, for a compellingly flawed character.
I am a sucker for stories that highlight the importance of father figures and positive masculine role models. It is the primary reason I recomend My Hero Academia to people, and it is my favorite part of Arcane.
Great video!!
Great point, what makes him human are his flaws. What makes him compelling is that he is human.
Glad you enjoyed!
It's nice to see someone who was able to see how Silco was handling a flawed and broken child as best he could, as opposed to the more common sentiment of how he manipulated and twisted Powder into Jinx. I think something that might not be too far off the mark is that it tears Silco apart every time he sees Jinx going through a mental breakdown, probably because he likely went through something similar after Vander betrayed and tried to kill him; he was able to move past that pain, Jinx hasn't yet. That's certainly the source of why he has so much patience towards Jinx, and why the times he expresses unbridled rage and anger is when he's failed to protect his daughter from that mental and emotional torment. I think with his dying words of how he thinks Jinx is perfect, might also be an acknowledgement by both of them that this is when she's able to let go of the past and the pain. Suppose will need season 2 to see if the past continues to haunt Jinx or not.
The show has massive scope of the story but only 9 episodes to tell it. A lot of the nuances have to be a bit 'read' into it. Great point that Jinx is a teenager - not only does she have to work with major trauma, but she's also at a very impressionable and malleable age. Brain isn't fully developed, decision making capabilities are more limited, it's a messy time for any teen and her background makes it even more challenging.
The fact that she ends up killing her root to 'stability' is only going to set her down a darker path. Season 2 is going to be interesting!
The way will handled jinx shooting him was actually amazing. I obviously dislike the guy a lot, but I respected that. That was the best way to handle that for Jinx's sake. In fact, his patience with Jinx throughout is really great. It's true that he was a genuine father. He was a messed up man, but he was a genuine father.
I think this show really hits home on the fact that most children don't need a perfect parent, but they do need one that loves them unconditionally. That's Silco to a tee.
Honest to god the scene I found most emotional/inspiring in Arcane was the bit in Vi's second fight with Sevika, when Vi's about to pass about and she envisions Vander sitting there at the bar he used to own telling her to pick herself back. Such a great touch and a nice counterpoint to Jinx's many scenes of the various voices in her head and how they manifest.
Amazing scene, she loses a tooth snd all, pretty impressive
Ximena, Jayce’s mother, is also a counterpoint to showcase that not all mothers wield great power and influence in this show, but can still be soft spoken and loving.
I feel like one of the more subtle things that made this show great was that all of the characters were flawed. No one was perfect, yet we could see their motivations. The show did an excellent job of humanizing its characters.
Agreed, it's in our flaws that we are human. Shows that make someone 'perfect' inherently are less interesting.
The fact that they manage to show a character as old and lived as long as Heimerdinger, as much as he has seen. Even he has room for growth.
@@Velocitist I think that, no matter if one lives eternally, there will never be perfection in people. There will always be room for improvement and there will always be morally ambiguous situations to deal with. An issue that can happen with having long or eternal lives compared to other peoples is that it can go to your head. You believe that because you have more experience in life that you know more or think you know better than "mere mortals" and lose touch with the reality they have to deal with. As Jayce told Heimerdinger, "Humans don't live for centuries!" Heimerdinger and his kind have all the time they want to plan things out and take their time. Humans don't.
@@kalinora3901 I see
Something I also absolutely adore that Arcane did: it showed these powerful, intimidating men taking in these vulnerable children. Media usually portrays women with this level of softness and heart, not men. Especially men like Vander. And especially not Silco.
But, they do show that these battle hardened, ruthless, scary men soften when they see scared, vulnerable children, and then take them under their wing. Even though it wouldn't have not just been easier to walk away, but easier in their daily lives not to have to have that level of responsibility. Children are a lot of work, and even though Silco is a horrible human being with warped morals, BOTH MEN turned out to be amazing fathers, and did an "amazing" job raising their daughters into what they think will keep them alive in the world.
Edit: I can see I didn't really convey what I meant with Silco.
Silco is a horrible, horrible human with warped values and morals, that kills people and tortures them without remorse. He miraculously loved Jinx regardless of this character trait, but, by standard definition of a "good father," he imparted what HE THINKS will keep Jinx alive and on top of the food chain. He never saw her madness as a weakness. Her madness made her unpredictable, intimidating, and sometimes terrifying. Every time she had a psychotic episode around Silco? He never batted an eye, or seemed surprised, even in that last scene with the four characters. But yes, by OUR standards of a good father? Silco is the worst father to ever try to father, lol! And yes, Silco fucked Jinx up something fierce, and the way he went about trying to get her to get over her trauma just made it worse. But, by *his* core values, by *his* morals, by *his* warped perspective view of the world, Silco raised his daughter the way he hope she would turn out. Which is why he told her she was perfect.
But, I digress on the matter. By normal standards, Silco was a horrible father that turned his daughter into a major unstable psycho, and Vander was an awesome father, that taught his daughter the weight of responsibility and raised her to not only *not* buckle under the weight, but to never give up and to keep getting back up onto your feet after you've knocked down.
Great comment, very true. Right before Vander and Silco take in their respective 'kids', the show emphasizes how scary they are from the POV of the children. That makes their choices to take them in and care for them even more powerful.
Silco wasn't really a good father, but he's a caring father
@@choppers9909 that's down to personal opinion
@@prufan how? He set zero boundaries for jinx which helped her become as chaotic as she is now, he also came up with the idea of jinx swimming in toxic waters like he did and we can't forget how saying "you're perfect" on your death bed to someone who needs a lot of help is a good way of making them not get any help on their own because it confirms their problems, making them seem like good thing.
But he is caring and trusting, you know, letting her stab him in the eye and how worried he got when jinx got hurt are both the greatest examples of this, there are more, but these are what I think are the best ones
He raised her through his values and beliefs like all parents do. His biggest values were that you must be willing to do anything and have no compromise to achieve your goals. He was also teaching her to accept and value herself, not to let the rest of the world determine how she viewed herself, and finally he told her not to cry and that she’s perfect because he didn’t want her to get even more fucked up in the head by blaming herself for his death like she has been with Milo, Clagger, and Vander.
Silco wasn't the father she needed. He was far too doting and didn't do enough to reel her in. But in the very end, he was the father she wanted. Someone who would love her unconditinally, despite of herself.
Yes YES! Fatherhood and Arcane. This guy gets it.
appreciate the comment!
Arcane is one of the few shows that I can remember watching which gets better the more I think about it. Great video btw.
Thank you, agreed, I will likely rewatch ahead of season 2 it's that good!
I think it’s AMAZING how perplexing Silco and Jinx’s relationship is. Weeks after finishing the series, I’m still putting it all together and drawing new conclusions. He CLEARLY loves her, but he’s so fundamentally screwed up that he ends up manipulating her in the process. My current thesis is that Jinx is actually a metaphor for Zaun itself. Silco loves them, would die for them, and goes to extreme lengths to encourage their power and development, but ultimately feeds into their instability. Also Silco “improves” them both by means of shimmer. God I love this show
Pretty much. Silco sees in Jinx what the chaos of Zaun should be. There's like a few theory vids on that and I love them. I could look them up again if you'd like.
You missed one parent: Jayce's mother. Interestingly, that's also potentially related to Jayce's personality. Of all the characters of the show, Jayce is the only one where I've heard multiple reviewers say they actively dislike the character, often hating him for his wishy-washyness, or general weakness of character. Mainly, that he's easily pushed to do what other people want him to do, and doesn't have a strong "backbone" to stand up to them.
I didn't think of it this way initially, but I do wonder how much that aspect of his personality stems from the lack of a father figure for him. His mother cares deeply for him, but she readily capitulates to the council, begging forgiveness, rather than stand up to them when Jayce is on trial. Sort of a polar opposite to Caitlyn's mom (with the irony of Caitlyn's family being the patrons for Jayce's work). Jayce's mom responds to confrontation by taking the blame and asking forgiveness. She has the personality of one who has grown up under the oppression of stronger people, and finds that that's the only way for her to survive. Meanwhile Jayce, while trying to find his own way in the world, has picked up a lot of his mother's mannerisms in dealing with confrontation. The one thing that made a difference for him was finding a dream he would fight for, yet even then, other people's opinions almost overwhelmed him.
Vander's presentation of the father's role is to set boundaries and rules, and force the child to learn how to deal with pressure and problems and things going wrong (such as shown by Vander's handling of Vi). His own actions reflect that belief system. Silco's presentation of the father's role was to encourage the child to pursue her dreams no matter what the cost - exactly as he had. Mel's mother took the path that looks like taking on the father role, but overcompensating into hypermasculinity. Caitlyn has both a mother and a father, though they behave in a sort of role-reversal manner, with the father providing tender care for Caitlyn's injuries, while her mother brought out the gun for Caitlyn's new girl(boy)friend.
This show takes so much care in its character relations, it's mind-boggling. Every few days I find a new way to look at how they developed the character dynamics, with how parallels were built between storylines, or how the relationships between the characters were framed. People have discussed Vander and Silco as father figures, but not as much about their actual philosophies of fatherhood, and how that gets mirrored and reflected in the other parental figures of the show. It's great to look at yet another side of this fantastic show.
Ahhh right. That's a fantastic point, and shows that I need to watch this show again as I definitely missed some of the smaller details. really appreciate this comment!
The more I hear about people hating on Jayce, the more I'm convinced Jayce invokes deeply personal insecurities within them.
He's by far the most relatable character in the series. He's your regular, almost template example of a youngster with big dreams, big ego, mighty naive and inexperienced with how the real world actually works, never being forced to experienced "real" pain, and who would puke if being witness to a dozen of people blown to pieces.
But since we just love imagining ourselves in horrible situations acting like big goddamn heroes a la "I'd have done it way better", seeing someone behaving as we *actually* would, invokes our contempt. Ironic, given that Jayce handles his dilemmas pretty well and learns quickly... unlike most of us would being thrown into the world of balancing politics, science and conscience.
@@Eponumon What you said here definitely makes sense regarding so many Jayce haters.
I wasn't sure how to word it myself, but it's very interesting how the one character who is the most generic in terms of physical and character traits with simple but good-hearted motivations is actually the most grounded - *to the point of striking nerves of some viewers.*
Jayce, simply a young dude with big dreams of helping the world and is constantly pulled to and fro between forces who would either use his talents and desires or squash it is too close to reality.
Jayce being unsure of himself but adapting anyway, making a lot of mistakes, saying things that he regrets, ego getting bloated and deflated, but at heart still a guy with dreams and just getting caught up in it is too close too reality.
Character types like Vi: all big-sisterly, badass, attractive, hardcore ...
Silco: cool, cunning, intimidating, stone-hearted but still a softie ... Jinx: genius, chaotic, adorkable etc. All these guys are types that we WISH we could be .... And maybe in a few ways we are but at the end of the day, the character we actually are is Jayce.
It's kind of sad that a looot of people would rather "puff up their chests" instead of just being self-aware regarding a TV SHOW of all things.
Why did you say girl(boy)friend? Like I agree with what your saying for the most part but vi is a woman. It’s incredibly important to the character that she’s a woman as well
@@WithouttheFluff The stereotyped scene of the dad bringing out the shotgun the first time he meets his daughter's boyfriend (often with the boyfriend being "not good enough", or underclass relative to the daughter's family), to put the Fear of Dad in him. Caitlyn's mom didn't bring out the gun for that purpose, but it's an obvious play on that trope, just with a bunch of genders swapped around.
Someone I think who should also be considered in the same light as the parents you spoke about is heimerdinger. While he doesn't have such a direct father figure role compared silco or Vander, his character and others show that he has had that relationship with many young people. Jayce even calls him the father of piltover. However unlike silco and vander where their public life is questionable while their parents is spot on, heimerdinger is more of an example of a bad parent with a great public persona.
Heimerdinger has long been what has inspired young peoples imagination and their want to do great things. But the moment they go into territories he's uncomfortable with, he shoots down their ideas with no ifs, ands, or buts. When jayce first told heimerdinger he was experiment with magic, he didn't sit down and listen to what jayce had to say. He quickly said "no". And when time and time again when jayce and Victor showed them their new tech, he shoots them down.
He never tries to fully explain why they must be more patient or take things into consideration. He expects them to listen to him because he's the boss. For example, When jayce and Victor first show him the hex gemstone, he tells them that their tech will be ready to be displayed in a decade. What he should have done was fully explain how these tools could be weapons, ask them how this could be prevented, and ask them if they really think this tech is ready for the world. He could still say that he thinks the tech will take around a decade to perfect, but follow it up with something motivating like "prove me wrong, boys!". Unfortunately he did not do any of this.
In the end, these shortcomings of his was his downfall. He did what no parent should ever do and basically threaten his children. When he saw the hex core, all of his past fears completely overcame him. When he said that they must destroy it, he was not speaking in the most reasonable mindset. He was fearing what could happen and his fight or flight response kicked in. He could not see that this was their lives work that he was talking about. And like all kids in that position, they lashed out and cut him off.
Heimerdingers isn't hopeless though. The moment he was kicked out of the council, the first thing he went to do was go and help people. And when he met ekko, he was completely in awe of what the youngling had to offer. Being outside of the surrounding that had always seen him as the boss will hopefully humble him and make him the better mentor that he needs to be
Exactly, he's an example of a non-biological parent, a mentor. He begins arrogant, closeminded, and dismissive, and even as a functional side character he is humbled and on a path of improvement (that scene with Eko stood out). For someone hundreds of years old and complacent in his role until the show begins, it felt true.
Honestly, Heimerdinger is probably the character I liked the least in the show. The dude really means well, don't get me wrong, but he's closed minded to a fault, convinced that he always has the right answer, and quite willing to look away from any problems that don't fit his world view. Him entering the undercity is actually a great example. Dude's been in charge of the city for what, 300 years? He founded the city! The undercity was created as it was on his watch! He never gave two thoughts about it until he lost his council position for letting it form that way and getting in the way of changing anything, and only THEN did he actually try taking a look at the place that he helped form! Don't get me wrong. Once he went there he was shocked and horrified. He helped Ekko get back home out of the kindness of his own heart. Actually using his immense influence to actually do something about what he saw? Perish the thought! That doesn't mean that Heimerdinger won't come to that decision later, and his character arc is completely redeemable, but right now he's just a closed minded, self righteous fool that just automatically thinks he's better than everyone else. ... It's a shame too, because even with all his flaws, the dude's got some real wisdom to him. He just needs to realize that in the city of progress he does not already have all the answers.
Modern entertainment has painted fathers as bumbling buffoons whose only claim to respect is that they are responsible for the child's existence... Arcane is really a breath of fresh air
I don't even think it's so recent, this has been going on for decades at this point. That a show like Arcane got through Netflix is amazing in 2021.
I don't think it's painted by modern entertainment but more of a reflection of society expectations to father and men in general. Absent father in raising children while deemed as bad is still permissable, not a surprise. A lot of series or film often have their male characters as a self insert or to make it relatable for male audience. Either a HARD cowboy character with little to no vulnerable side shown to fulfill society demand for men to be "men" or bare minimum "good guy" that made mistakes but still get the perfect girl at the end of the day. While motherhood is still often a sole identity for woman in entertainment and something demanded or deemed as "given" by society. There is a clear imbalance of expectations in parenthood for men and woman. It's a bad direction for everyone imo.
@@zenzenitha EXACTLY
@@zenzenitha THIS
Arcane is one rare gem that should be shown in classes on how to write a character, especially men. Showing them the complexity of men and how it add greatly to the story. I'm glad they did it and thank you for pointing this out.
Honestly I was interested in this video after seeing the title. It is so obvious the view our culture today has on feathers and men in general. Honestly I think that is why this show is so popular is because it gives importance to everyone and not just on group like most movies and shows are. The fact that they are able to create to very interesting father characters and have room for all the others is refreshing to see.
I'm glad, that's what I hoped for :) We need more shows like Arcane!
I think it’s important to acknowledge that it pays respect to the concept of fatherhood as well, that means showing the good and bad of it. With Silco, it shows even bad fathers can be loving. Make no mistake, Silco is a terrible father and that’s intentional, but he does care. Caring is just what you do as family, but being a father is about passing things on to your child, teaching them how to tackle the world, preparing them to live without you, beyond you, to “write their own stories”. That’s what Vander did with his kids and it’s what Silco goes on to do the opposite of with Powder.
Very well put!
Have to disagree on Silco being a bad father, he was a good one.
@@prufan Let me ask you this:
Disregard Arcane for a moment. If someone raised their adopted daughter to be a ruthless serial killer working as an enforcer in hard drug trade, did nothing to treat their severe mental illness, poisoned them against the rest of the world, left them with no social circle outside himself, encourages bad behaviors, gaslights them about their real family (who they were responsible for murdering in the first place and has no regrets about it), actively tried to separate them from a returning family member (again trying to murder them just to stop his daughter from meeting her), again gaslighting her, claiming her family doesn’t care about her when he knows he’s lying, claiming he’s the only one who cares about her and that everyone else is out to get her….
Pop quiz:
Is he a
A) Bad father
B) Shit father
C) Horrendous father
D) pretty tight actually
@@The_Story_Of_Us I would say Silco is not a good man. And he is not a good Father. But at least he has genuine love for his daughter. It’s more than most of us ever had. Maybe that’s why he’s a character that i find myself drawn to. Because me, just like many women, have never been called perfect by their fathers, have never been cared for and cherished and had someone believe in their abilities. You’re right, he’s not the best father. But what would have happened to Jinx if he hadn’t been there? Realistically.
@@The_Story_Of_Us The problem if that you are basing this argument on a concept of what being a father means from an morals perspective. You make the case that things he listed should have not been done as an argument of his bad fatherhood, alas one could argue thats what made him a good one. He took her in when he saw her to be betrayed in same manner than he was by Vander. He allowed Jinx to be herself contrary to trying to "fix her" like everyone else was; to him she was perfect. For him her actions were an headache at times but she was who she was and that is all that mattered to him. it was not a matter of gaslighting either as he sincerely deemed his views as factual. He did not know Vi or what her goals in relation to Jinx were. He did not know about their relationship anymore than what we could assume Jinx has told him but thats speculation at best. He did not know she was alive until the moment he went to gave her chase. That was priority number one, he did not even know Jinx's whereabouts cuz lets face it; she could be everywhere and nowhere at any moment. Every action Silco took was in effort to Jinx to be her own person in as good and as bad it may have been. Whatever the outcome, he loved her unconditionally and would have done anything for her. Now, returning to the morality? Was he a bad father? No. Was he a good person? No, he was horrible and terrible human being. But two arent mutually exclusive.
I am not yet a father nor am I close if I'm being honest but I always get emotional at Silco and jinx's last scene together I just picture-your father who only ever showed you love when everyone else looked away, killed by your hand and now you have nobody-and jinx will go mad without her father to reel her in anymore it just tears my heart.
Great point, that last 20 minutes was heartbreakingly tragic.
Well said. I watched Arcane with my son and we both loved it. Good fathers are so rare in entertainment. Ted Lasso and Superman & Lois are some of the only examples that come to mind.
It's an excellent show in so many ways, but this aspect is one I don't see many others noticing and it needs to be recognized.
When I tried to watch it with my father he wasn´t paying attention, browsing his phone and beeing dismissive about the story.
Im old enough so that I shouldn´t depend on my parents approval anymore...I just couldn´t help it. I though that maybe things might be diffrent this time.
I don´t know why I´m writing this...I just want to say that I am happy for the both of you for sharing hobbies. That is really nice.
@@knauhaurk Damn, that's a shame. It's comments like these that motivate me to make these videos.
@@knauhaurk you'll get over it man
you'll learn how to be indifferent to his indifference
even if it means being indifferent to all his positive qualities
aaaand I'm talking about my own daddy issues again
but it hurt less with time, that's all I'm saying
I'd stick with good parents.
When he’s trying to scold her, and she clearly isn’t paying attention, he never touches her to get her to listen, he never even taps her shoulder or grabs her arm, he instead chooses to snatch the pen, to bring her focus back to him without harming her
He personally understands how traumatic it is when a trusted person touches you with violence or aggression.
The real tragedy of it all is that both Vander and Silco were working for the same dream and both were undone by the same foil, having to choose between their ambition and their family. Vander gave up the rebellion for an uneasy peace and eventually, due to the actions of family, willingly attempted to give himself up to preserve that family and that peace. He, at least, had that option. Silco was in a far more impossible situation. He secured everything they had dreamt of but only in exchange for family. He was denied the opportunity to be sacrificed in place of Jinx. His tragedy is the lack of agency there. Zaun, or Jinx. You can't have both. And by the actions of family, like Vander, he met his end. Made and then unmade by the very thing that gave them a higher purpose.
Great comment!
I've heard some people claim that Silco only said what he said to Jinx in the end because he knew it would give her the final push necessary to fire "the weapon" at Piltover. I hate that interpretation of events, filtered as it is with a relentless cynicism, and refuse to see it that way. However, I think it needs to be said that while Silco may have turned into a loving father by the end of it all, he was nevertheless a terrible parent in terms of teaching Jinx how to work through her trauma to become a caring, compassionate young woman guided by a strong moral compass.
I agree with you there, from what I've seen, he genuinely loved Jinx, and was more of a doting dad that allowed whatever his daughter did (which is not good parenting) even when those things were actions he would have killed others for doing. Heck those home made cups and ashtrays on his desk by jinx solidified the point that he treated her very much like a daughter.
Also, pardon my english, it's not my native language. Have a great day.
Great comments, thank you both. They didn't give much background to Silco in terms of his own upbringing, but my guess was he didn't have great parents (or maybe none at all).
Jinx was traumatized badly, her 'father' and sister up in flames in one night, and the self-blame and guilt and anger over years is a complicated recipe to manage. Could anyone have done a much better job? It's why adoption of older children is a very tricky and flawed business, when damage is done so young it can break people beyond fixing.
o.o
@@badgerdad6690 @BadgerDad Still, is there anyone who believes that in Zaun they had access to therapy? Silco did what he could to give his daughter the tools she needed to survive and he succeeded, Jinx is a force of nature that is almost impossible to stop.
Yes he didn't do the best job to help with her traumas, but coming from a man who surely has his own (like abandonment) without any guidance and living in a totally cruel world (as we could see from the perspective of someone "normal" with Heimerdinger) i really couldn't say that Silco was a bad father.
I would argue that he himself wasn't the most ... Stable individual and found little to no care about mental health.
The guy's obviously crippled with PTSD and trust issues, and to him, the only thing that helped him was surviving and rising above all others. I think he just wanted his daughter to thrive in this world and give her the unconditionnal support he never had.
Of course, in the end it wasn't what Jinx needed, she needed therapy, and a stable environment. Except that both of those are nowhere to be found in Zaun.
However, considering that she always had some mental issues, the only thing keeping them at bay being her supporting family, and even then, it was easily snapped, you could easily consider that Vander did a poor job at raising Powder too.
The only time we see them actually interacting is at the bar scene, and they don't even speak. Vander obviously was more focused on Vi and the boys than her, and while it doesn't mean he didn't love Powder, it was easily noticeable that he didn't ... Get her. He could'vre taught her, like he taught Vi. About fighting, or even moral, or compassion like you mentionned, but he ... didn't. And it was of course comprehensible, considering that she was the least ... Prone to shenanigans of her siblings, but still. If Vander was an exemplary father and mentor to Vi, I don't think the same could be said for Powder, which is just to show that nobody in this show is actually perfect.
My parents weren't a couple when I was born and they always put my wellbeing first, ober whatever conflict they could have with each other.
When I lived with my mom, he would always pick me up from there and take me to school, to have that time with me. We do spend a lot of time together, I can talk to him about anything, I know he's always there for me.
So many dads are absent in a traditional family, but you can have quality time even with divorces, split custody, and other family models. Just put your kids first. That goes to all parents that are in conflict with each other. Behave like adults and remember your kids are the priority
Given such high divorce rates in Western countries today, this comment rings sadly more true than ever. Thanks for sharing your experience.
I love when fathers are a focus in a show, we have been getting a LOT of positive representation of femininity, motherhood, sisterhood etc, even when it comes to gay representation (as little as there is) the more in depth developed examples are lesbians. We need more healthy focus on masculinity too, I want to see fathers loving and caring for their children, I want to see brothers I want to see boyfriends in media
2 moments that i love, Vander saying "you kick their asses tho?" after scolding her, showing that Vander is not an asshole/distant dad, he is loving at the end. And Silco, he was going to kill/ threaten Powder, but he saw himself on her, a brother/sister betrayed by his/her family, and made him empathize for the first time in, probably, years.
I think what Arcane does the best is that it respects both mothers and fathers. I doesn't villainise neither and highlights the importance of having at least one strong parental figure in your life. It also doesn`t conform to the gender stereotypes of said parental roles. Fathers and mothers being nurturing and loving and also being strong and disciplinary. Usually you will have mothers and father only show either of these things but in fact you do need both but it is not necessarily tied to the gender of the parent.
I'm really glad someone is talking about this underappreciated aspect of the show and Silco himself! Just from a character standpoint, they showed that Silco was slowly becoming Vander. Prioritizing the safety of his family and his community over his ambitions. It makes you really believe that these two were once brothers and thick as thieves, just one matured whilst the other stayed behind. We get to see the end of the character arc of Silco in Vander I think. Or at least something very similar if Silco hadn't been killed.
Arcane was my biggest surprise in 2021, and as a dad how it represented fathers was incredible. I'm amazed how little I'd heard about this show, wonder how much the videogame associated stigma (along with the fact it's animated) has kept it from completely exploding. What did you think of Arcane?
It's a goddamn masterpiece.
@@supermonstars Preach it!
It was #1 everywhere except for the US. The US has a weird stigma about animation.
@@Ranshin077 My friend is a huge anime fan and said the same thing. Wild!
Also America has a much more competitive advertising market. Many other shows are competing for attention on Netflix, shows that in many other parts of the world have no weight. Whereas League of Legends is a world-wide brand.
I'm so happy to see someone acknowledging the brilliant representation of fatherhood in this show.
I'm not a father (yet ?) and I'm still young, but I work with children, and Vander hit me really hard. I just hope to be as good as he is one day, whether it be in my job or maybe if I have a familly one day. You genuinely understood what it take to be a good father, we can all see that you're a good one just in this video
Great way to learn about being a dad is working with children. I loved working with kids at camps when I was a teen, and I was lucky to have a brother 13 years younger than me. Your comment is a perfect example why seeing these positive role models like Vander can make a big impact on those watching, and why we need more media to do what Arcane does so well.
I very drawn to strong father/daughter relationships in media. I have always been closer to my dad than my mom. I don’t want to throw my mom under the bus or anything but she definitely failed as a parent. Her narcissism and alcoholism made things very difficult for my family but my dad is the one who held everything together. He stayed in essentially an emotionally abusive relationship with my mom until me and my siblings were old enough to take care of ourselves. My mom stopped drinking thankfully and my dad remarried. Me and my siblings are basically taking care of her now and although our relationship with our mom improved I don’t think any of us will ever forgive her fully. If it wasn’t for my dad we wouldn’t be the people we are today. I’m very grateful for what he sacrificed for us.
Another piece of media that emphasizes the importance of fatherhood is 2018's God of War. The heart of the story is Kratos learning how to be a father and treating Atreus as a son rather than a soldier. The evolution of the father-son dynamic throughout is really good and could make for a good video if you're up for it.
I greatly enjoyed this video and the positive depiction of fatherhood is one of the first things I picked up on when watching the series.
Thanks for the great comment - I played most of the God of War games, but not 2018's (though from the reviews I saw, that definitely intrigued me). I'll make a note to check it out, appreciate the recommendation
@@badgerdad6690 2018's God of War was awarded the "Game of the Year" award. It was a -stellar- game and I highly recommend it, especially for a dad. The cinematography is amazing, the graphics are insane and the facial expressions of the characters are so accurate and gorgeous. Without spoiling anything about the plot, here's the premise:
Mum, dad and son live in the forest. One day, mum dies. Dad and son build her burial fire together. Mum's last dying wish was for her ashes to be scattered from the highest mountain top in all the 9 realms. So, dad and son take the urn and go on a journey to find the tallest mountain peak and fulfill mum's dying wish.
@@Dalinos Just got ported to PC, awesome! I'll need to check it out at some point
don't forget mandalorian, the last of us, Logan,
heck modern media is a golden mine of weary single father figures with a broken psych, but the heart in the right place
What I love is that Arcane gave us examples of good, bad, and more neutral parenting from both the mothers and fathers of the series and really showed us how upbringing can impact how a child thinks and what choices they will make going into the world on their own. I'm a young father of 3 kids and seeing the struggle of parenting from so many angles was appreciated. The writers did a phenomenal job with this series and I can't wait for the next season.
Amazing job! Your video truly deserves more recognition! Thank you for doing Arcane and its amazing story writing justice, for a bit i had forgotten how good this show really is. We dont appreciate fathers enough in media anymore :/
Really appreciate the comment, I have a long list of other video topics on the docket, and will likely do more on Arcane in the future, it's a brilliant show.
If there is one thing I hope I can help change through my channel, it's the value of positive father figures in media. For those who haven't had (to see and learn) and for those who had (to help them further appreciate it).
that ending broke me.
silco and jinx's story broke me ngl
oh my goodness this show is elite!
This is a wonderful video and I love how you talk about how Arcane make its characters, male and female, very human and flawed individuals.
The "girl power" movement we've seen in media has its flaws like you've said. I think after the bechdal test, and other such ways to create strong female characters in media we've over corrected into this "girl power" showcase. But all I've really wanted, growing up as a young woman is girls who are realistic, in all types of roles and characterizations, that I can see myself in, or my sisters, mother's, etc. We deserve realistic representation of women, the good and the bad of us, just as much as men deserve realistic representations of themselves.
Arcane shows how painstakingly human each of its characters are. And how very morally grey everyone falls when trying to navigate the hardships of war and loss. It's masterful in its writing of characters and relationships, and I just can't wait for more!!
I love that you mention how a distant Mother can be just as damaging as a distant father.
Also, I have a wild theory based only on this video that Oriana and whoever this next champion in League of Legends is, they are both going to be creations of singed.
Also, also, okay. This might come off as weird, but @BadgerDad, this video really helped me realise how I need to reconect with all the parental figures in my life. So um... thank you.
Glad to hear it, I made this video with the idea if even one person takes something positive away it's worth.
Even Marcus is a good father even though his a corrupt cop.
I wonder about that - his corruption put his family at major risk. We see it got him promoted, probably money under the table. Yes, he provided a better life financially, but how much was for his own ego and financial gain? He knows how dangerous Silco is, and he not only a) hid Vi and lied to him but b) had a few chances to back off but chose not to.
Complex question, good job show :)
Very refreshing to see distant mothers/close fathers relationship dynamics as its so rarely explored. especially since all the dads are single and the moms (Mels father is hinted to have been in her life at some point and i'm betting Ambessa has at least one husband back home) have partners to balance them out at home.
I think it's also worth noting that people romanticize the father-daughter relationship of Jinx and Silco too much, though.
He's an enabler of all her most destructive tendencies, he turned her against her friends, lies to her, and at the end tries to kill Vi BECAUSE he knows Vi was not planning to harm her but was posed to "take her away from him".
Silco is the father Powder WANTED but not the one she NEEDED.
Fair point, a video under 15 minutes can't address all the nuances and yours is right on, there is so many layers. I'm going to have to make another video, this comment section has got ideas firing.
it's so rare to see silco being called out where it matters
what a breath of fresh air
What friends? She murdered all her friends with her reckless tinkering. Then she developed PTSD when Vi guilted her out for it, struck her, then left her alone. Silco at least recognized that she wasn't a normal person, psychologically. Yet he still loved and supported her, even trying to rein in her more destructive impulses. We see though that he's not very good at it, but that's not very surprising in the world they live in. A damaged parent can rarely raise an undamaged child. And considering that he views loyalty above all else, it makes sense that he'd view Jinx going away with the sister who abandoned her as a bad move. No one is making the case that he's a perfect or even a great father. But no one can make the case they he didn't act in Jinx's best interest as best as he himself knew how.
Arcane is also a wonderful example of why mother's are also needed, both vi and jinx's lack of love and compassion. Both parental figures are needed for a stable mind. Ying yang, balance, it's absolutely necessary.
Agreed!
They don't lack love and compassion because of not having a mom. They lack it because their parents were murdered and they both have PTSD and trust issues. Vander was doing a good job with them until he died though.
What I find interesting about Caitlyn's parents is the exchange of roles between her mother and father
I'm glad you made this. I see a lot of people have greatly appreciated the visibility and acknowledgement they deserve. From Arcane, and distilled by you. Thank you.
Excellent, best feedback I can hear. Thanks for the comment.
I think you really hit the nail on the head about arcane not putting one ahead of the other it doesn't praise fathers and shit on mothers or the other way around and it's true we need way more of that in media especially now. One of the most horrific things my mother in law ever said to me (knowing that I was abused at the hands of my mother and the only reason I got out is because my father stayed living close by after the divorce) "a father can be just anyone they are replaceable but you'll never replace a mother"...it's kinda sickening how often I come up on that kind of mentality.
One of the most important things that drew me to Arcane *(cough besides Silco cough)* was the bond between father and daughter. I'm tired seeing only the mother with the children *"because that's natural"* and the father being out of the picture or being a stereotypical idiot. Because like you said fathers matter and that made me cry. I'm very happy that they went with that route. Fathers are as important as mothers and that needs to be recognised.
Also I'm talking about the good fathers not the ones who abounded their children.
The interesting statistic is that fathers are more likely to abandon their children (usually because of the mother), and mothers are more likely to abuse their children (usually because of their own upbringing). People tend to thing of men as abusers, but that statistic completely falls apart in cases where the woman/mother has no fear of reprisal, such as with a weak man or a small child.
@@derek96720 the most abusive spouse relationships are also lesbians. If their both women the likelihood of bad background and no reprisal is double. Now it's not even a weak man in the way, but just another woman.
@@MALICEM12 Dude I looked it up. For gay women it's 1/4 are victims of domestic violence and 1/4 for gay men as well. I don't know about you, but 1/4 seems like a pretty low rate. As a gay woman I'm probably the safest inside a same sex relationship, what the fuck are you talking about.
Well said. Children need both mothers and fathers but as very few people are willing to say or believe... Father's matter.
If society acknowledged that fathers matter, then single mothers would actually have to admit that they can't "do it all on their own." It's a feminist fantasy that a single, hard-working mom can somehow be all a child needs to be and that fathers are just useless sperm suppliers.
You hit it on the head, just had this conversation the other day. Raising children is a very complex process. To much pressure it hurts, to little they get in trouble. It’s a tight rope we walk raising our children and you won’t know if you’ve done ok until years down the road. Great vid 👍
Fathers are important. I would know, I was raised by a single mum, and even she wished for a father figure for us.
6 years!!!! Totally worth it. The quality is absurd. The art is like nothing I’ve ever seen before, and the story... whoever belonged to the team must be proud as hell
I didnt even notice arcane was a female led show until right now. That shows alot about how they put this show together. Every female led media i have ever watched makes it blaitantly obvious that the mc is a woman a strong independant woman. But this show litereally has 4 mc females and i didnt even fucking notice
These are true strongly written female characters. Such strongly written their gender is the least obvious element of ther character
@@donaldriceiv2407 This is true of many women leads for decades in film/TV/Video games, the 'it's the current year' crowd tend to ignore them as it doesn't suite their narrative.
One of my favorite quotes from Silco: "Is there anything so undoing as a daughter?"
Second favorite arcane quote, right after Viktor’s: ‘In the pursuit of great, we failed to do good.’
@@NinjaMaster23145 thats another one of those quotes that just hit different in a great way.
It's very true that children need their parents, dad's too. This show showed me what my family could have been in various ways and I found a new topic to discuss with my therapist. The things I wished my family could have been. I see those small things in every parent/child relationship in the show. And the show also showed that even with a good steady parental figure, things can still go wrong or mess you up depending on your environment. It's beautiful and painful.
As someone without a father this show made my heart ache so much and showed me what i couldn’t have.
Arcane is proof some companies haven't completely sold out and some people still care about art.
Yo, this is an awesome video, thank you. I love Silco in Arcane, the more time passes the more I realize he is my favourite character. I used to think Jinx was my favourite, but I think Silco is definitely edging her out, but in the end they are a package and I love them both.
Glad you enjoyed it
please don't phrase it ''Silco is edging Jinx out''
com'on
I've yet to see a Father that's active and invested in their children's lives before 50. In my life and those around me.
Good Father's are rare and I'm pleased an example, even if it was animated, was portrayed well onscreen.
That's also to do with people waiting too long to have kids
Jason Spisak is one of the best voice actors in the game, and his performance as Silco proves it.
Great video on parenting and how it supposed to work. And congrats to you on being a father yourself.
Thank you, it's a challenge and a blessing.
@@badgerdad6690 it definitely is, just ask my dad 👨.
that coming from Archer is so ironic
The only problem I have with "children need both [motherhood and fatherhood]" is how it potencially disregards same-sex parents but I'm not willing to assume you mean that.
Someone on the internet not jumping to assumptions? I'm glad I was here to see it ;)
Given the significantly fewer numbers of same sex couples in the population, there isn't nearly the same kind of research or history showing the positive/negative implications with families set up that way. I'd rather discuss where I have more data and personal experience to work with, and avoid areas with less (though it would be quite interesting over time to see more research on same-sex parents and their childrens outcomes).
When it comes to same sex parents the data can still be used for instance of not having a father by having two mothers instead or vice versa. While I think that same sex parents can still be good parents there is still going to be something missing from not having a father or mother. And of course they can get those relationships from uncles, grandparents, or other family friends but the important events of both fathers and mother can not be overstated.
@@masonguthrie1257 I don't think there would necesarily be something missing. In Caitlin's family, the mother was the stricter, rule setter, (often seen as the dad's job) while the father was the caring, soft one (often seen as the mom's job). If they can switch roles, same sex parents could also choose what role they want to take, or do both. I guess if parents (same sex and regular) can have different roels, it raises the question of what happens when both parents are stricter or both are softer. Is it necessary to have both variations, and are there negatives to having the same parenting style from both parents? Also, can one parent have both styles, in order to compensate for being an only parent? I know these are a lot of questions, I don't expect you to answer them, just something that's on my mind. At the end of the day, I think what really matters is to have someone to love you and teach you how the world works, and as long as that's achieved, it doesn't matter what parenting method is used.
@@AdidTurreno I disagree because if it were just a case of having a softer or stricter parent then the data would not show that fathers are needed so much. Because even with a strict mother there is still something missing.
@@masonguthrie1257 its not the genders that are important, its the teamwork needed to create a balanced family
I also don't think father and mother figures need to come from their respective genders either. Some men have typically maternal traits and some women posses stereotypical paternal traits. To me, it's all about having those figures in your life.
I'd argue that, to a certain extent, they do. Because having father/mother figures of that gender sets children up very early on for how to form relationships with that sex. Daughters who grow up without fathers frequently develop the stereotypical "daddy issues," wherein they seek male validation in whatever form they can find it (usually sex appeal). The same is true of men who grew up without a reliable, loving mother figure in their lives. It's not enough to just have a dad who's maternal or a mother who's masculine.
True.
@@derek96720 I hate this authoritarian mindset that you're pushing right now.
@@etabiansosin I don't think you understand what that means. If you mean I'm speaking with authority, then yes to a certain extent I am. I learned this position from actual specialists in early childhood development, so I'm more inclined to believe them than CZcams commenters tossing out misrepresented statistics.
@@derek96720 Authoritarian by definition is favoring or enforcing strict obedience to authority, especially that of the government, at the expense of personal freedom. Don't you dare tell me that I don't know what that means.
This show is one show I can watch with longer eps, BUT this show I can watch all of it in one day. A good show for me is something that feels shorter than it is and something I can emotionally attached myself to, ep 3 had my heart break and sm emotions through that episode. This show is literally perfect in every way
I wished it was longer - would it have needed it? No. But 9 episodes was not enough, can't wait for season 2.
surprisingly well narrated for a smaller channel, and best script on the topic of arcane- ya earned a sub for life!
never really thought of arcane as "parenting: the show" but the dualities you've pointed just make it so clear.
keep fighting that good fight, sir o7
I've had a bunch of topics built up but with life so busy hadn't gotten around to trying a channel. Trying now, thanks for the support!
Like you said, another reason why Arcane was so good is they didn't try to push anything political from our world into it like most shows and movies always due, it just breaks the immersion. But this never once broke immersion, it felt real, not politicized.
HONESTLY PARENTS HAVE A MAJOR ROLE IN THIS SERIES
The complexity, humanity, flaws and virtues of parenting depicted in Arcane are high on my list as to why this show is a masterpiece.
Another aspect I think would be worth exploring are the relationships between siblings.
If it has to do with Arcane, I can never get bored of it and all of it's discussions. Well...until Season 2 comes out.
Then there will be more!
i never actually was sad about a villain death and let's be honest Silco was evil as hell, but his love for Jinx was real and he even sacrificed his dream for her and even though she killed him he didn't felt betrayed and instead of hate or getting angry at her he encourages her, it was heartbreaking
Arcane isn't a story about sisters, it's a story about daughters.
Both? Both.
It's interesting that most of the men in the show are, in their own ways, struggling with forms of fatherhood. Silco is trying to be a father to both Jinx and his new nation of Zaun. Viktor, Jayce, and Heimerdinger are trying to be "fathers" to their nation, bringing in new technology to better the lives of those beneath them, then using wise restraint to know how far to go with it. Vander had the same struggle as Silco.
I totally agree.
I come from a generation where a father's involvement was supposed to be almost purely financial.
And it fcked me up.
Whenever I would complain to friends about my dad being absent to friends they would point out how he paid for my studies (in europe (belgium) university costs 900€ per year...not 20k like in USA) and bought me a motorcycle at 20 (so he wouldn't pay for a student dorm, which is much more expensive).
Money is good but the only moments I felt close to him were when we would do something together...not when he would pay for my uni...
Father figures need to be *involved* , and paying for school is not involvement.
Arcane has inspired me to tell my own stories with humanity & no shallow agendas.
vander talked to vi not to powder when she needed him (or it wasnt shown) giving her the same feeling of being an outcast the others (vi &co) gave her
Dude… this video is amazing. I’m glad you bring up about father figures because we no longer have enough of them. It’s one of the reasons why this show is amazing because it doesn’t bring down anyone for their gender but shows everyone is human and flawed. Everyone matters and you have my mad respect for making this.
While i agree with this the "NEED" a mother AND father is slightly erasing same sex/gender nonconforming couples
My only gripe
Agreed. I believe children need two parents. Having more than one guardian to look after them.
@@k.e2979 even then its not always necessary, but for sure beneficial
@@viral4983 nah man. You need both. Both ends of the spectrum means a balanced upbringing. Too much of 1 or too much of the other, or lack of 1 or lack of the other creates instability. Balance is key. Here's a famous example for ya from the second Harry Potter book/movie. When Ron & the twins take the flying car to go take Harry from the Dursleys, Mrs Weasly (the mum) is FURIOUS. She scolds them harshly, tells them how irresponsible they were, how their lives were in danger and all that jazz. Which, of course, they deserve fully. They took a massive risk and were extremely lucky it worked out (even though they were seen by muggles, putting the Statute of Secrecy in danger). Yet, what happens when they sit at the table? Mr Weasly (the dad) hears what they did, KNOWS his wife already scolded them, and excitedly asks them "How did she fly?", which then of course makes his wife look at him angrily.
Ya get my point? Without Mr Weasly asking them how the car flew, they would ONLY have their mothers treatment. With Mr Weasly present, the situation is much more balanced, cause at the end of the day, they're fucking teenagers with magical powers who have gone through 5 years of magical schooling already (the twins), so OF COURSE they can fly an enchanted car with 0 issues. Especially since they were both Quidditch players and had massive experience flying.
@@Dalinos youre using a BOOK as an example. Stop trying to say same sex couples cant raise a kid
You can disagree with it, but the psychological bases for having parents of both sexes being very important to early childhood development is well-established. Even if you grow up with two dads or two moms, you still need at least one parental-type figure of the opposite sex in order to form the basis for either your own personality or for the personality of your future romantic partners.
I actually really love how Vander much like Ned from Game of Thrones despite not lasting long in the series, still has presence and consequence because of him being gone.
You can tell the Undercity went to shit without his leadership.
Nice Frodo and Sam moment, there.
It's amazing how many creators here are talking about this show! Makes me feel happy for animation again :)
Two weeks after watching this show I was still thinking about it non stop. It’s had a big impact on me as a watcher that I kept finding myself thinking again and again about each character. It’s amazing.
This is so good, actually it makes so much sense. There was a National Geographic Documentary about the abscense of the father figure in certain characters, these characters were three dictators: Ghaddafi, Idi Amin and Stalin. They never had the father presence in their life, or their father died earlier, or beat them when they were young or died. They said that kids tend to walk in a darker path and they can become unstable ,just like these three dictators, without having a father in their growth which make sense to me because I also studied some cases like this at University and, also, met some friends who had problems because they didn't had a father.
Thank you for the great video and explanation.
Another mother model you could talk about is Jayce's mother. Especially in the scenes where she speaks to the council and after that to Jayce himself
Good point, I didn't want this too long (I didn't touch on Marcus either), but will keep in mind.
There is so much to be said about this series, and this is definetively one of the best videos discussing it
Fathers should be shown more love and credit
Im not usually a fan of animation series but this one OMG. Worth watching it all over again and again. This series was epic!
It's great that you talked about mother's in this video too.
thanks, I wasn't sure it would work but wanted to give it a shot
I admit. If she has that power, I'd let my daughter blow up half the world and slaughter the other half protecting her from it. Where I say for my girl, she's developing her actions have thought and certainty, where if I see her in a situation, I'll never doubt her actions into it and always believe her, its a tight rope and most other parents would put the sake of themselves over their children when it comes to the world. I have had the world against me and its only lonely when you love, otherwise its bearable but not livable. I do like how this was done and glad they aren't cookie cutting character tropes just for the attention. But then again, they may have done that BECAUSE everyone is using the Marvel approach of having a witty do or daring character(s) with troubled pasts but still united as a common use. What I would have liked to seen is more conflict with the sisters that was shown in the Music Video, WHICH would have explained their relationship better than "oh something's wrong with Jynx originally", because yes there will always be something off about someone but they don't go in the way of jynx from ONE bad situation with a father to cushion that blow, where an older sibling who hates their younger because of that feeling of a burden is unbearable, especially during the hardest of times. Its like having the only cupcake for desert at lunch while your siblings only get soup and a sandwich, where its not bad living, but it hits your gut as if the cupcake was poison for the guilt and the spite you get when you try to split the cupcake in 4. Trust me, it lingers being told you're useless during the hardest of times when you're young and you can't prove yourself for years, just to suddenly have this power you could have used but now is pointless since you're living good now. But instead, its "oh my sister abandoned me and my father lied, this will break me". Then again I am ok with that last scene and last twist for the series this season.
I absolutely loved Mel’s mother. Mainly because she still seemed to care about her family while being the “hyper masculine female”. Most media shows buff women end up just being men with vaginas but Mel’s mother was still a mother at the end of the day. That she is still a woman, a strong brutal uncaring murderous woman but still a woman and it’s amazing.
I loved that scene I pulled, where she was worried she was weakened because she cared too much about Mel's POV.
@@badgerdad6690 yes! This. My mama is the same way. She’s a kick boxer and has been since before I was born and if you look at her you’d never even guess she was a mama or that she was caring and compassionate for people. It’s always upset me that the only strong women we get are women like Illaoi and Zarya (league of legends and overwatch specifically) and I was so worried that Mel’s mother was going to be the same way when I saw how she looked and how she was acting in the beginning but riot did her right. I hope she some day becomes playable in league because she was IMO one of the most unique characters in Arcane just due to how riot portrayed her personality compared to her appearance.
me and my fiancée want to have children rather sooner than later (but we chose later cause Im still at uni) and I cant wait. I want to enable my future child to be great and do whatever they set their minds to it and when they succeed in whatever they do I wanna just say "I am proud of you."
6 years well spent, im prob in the minority in thinking that i don't mind riot taking another 6 for next season. I really hope they make season 2 perfect just like season one... & jinx :3
Excellent video, 100% accurate commentary. Subscribed and will be watching. Well done!
Thank you! More to come :)