They just compared a product to something that 1/3 of the cost (LE Johnson 1500), not even close to an "apples-to-apples" comparison. Need to do better if you're going to present product comparisons with integrity. LE Johnson's HD200 and HD400 products all use ball bearing rollers and have tracks that better carry the weight of larger solid core interior doors for the custom homes I work with and they have the soft-close option as well. And they'll still be less than Cavity Sliders. I sell both Cavity Sliders and LE Johnson, and Cavity Slider is only really needed when we get into moving 9' wide by 7' tall pocket doors (moving small walls). Cavity Sliders has a great product, strong and durable, but not needed for standard operations of a bathroom door. If you want to pay that much extra so that you can remove a pocket door without a wrench, go for it! I love Cavity Sliders, but most people don't need to pay that much extra when there's a great middle ground. I'm not an LE Johnson rep, I work at a custom home dealer supply. I just didn't like the comparison here of a really high end product to the lowest end product when there's a great middle ground.
Agreed. I've installed several pocket doors (one in my own house) and let me tell you, pocket doors in a bathroom are fantastic. The door I installed was a Johnson door, went up fast and easy and years later...zero problems. Save your money.
This book is Awesome! I love the Lean-To-Shed the most (page 98). The plan czcams.com/users/postUgkxe9yi0sulKgsp0VJJCIrLWWkvVqcU7LFR is to attach it to the back of my brick house. I also like how they walk you through the many different steps of construction, which is important for the less experienced like me.
I like to think these videos will help to make a better generation of builders. Kids who were interested in being a builder and learning the right way to do things.
Out of all the people I see doing this kind of work. I dont see any standard of quality. That goes for big national companies to the local "handyman". And the average joe doesnt know the difference between qualities so they keep calling the same people back. Its disgusting. No matter where I go i cant help but look at floors, tile, paint edges, or drywall corners, etc. And think how I would do it different or how bad it looks. Its a shame.
You are absolutely correct, it’s all about the material first and then the installer. I installed a 28” pocket-door for the first time, about a month ago and already noticing some flaws. I wished I would have found your video first. Thanks for posting, your work and content is absolutely great .
CS doors have been available in New Zealand for 20-30 years. They are a fantastic product and the market leader here. Their handles for pocket doors are equally as great, with really good templates to make for an easy install process.
Excellent video! My girlfriend works for one of the nation’s largest builders, and it just upsets me when that they don’t even use pocket doors....let alone quality hardware like this. I think most people would be willing to pay more if they understood what they are getting for their money. Thanks Matt!
thaitichi, benefits? You don’t have to consider the area that you need for traditional door to swing. It takes a lot of room. Plus, a pocket door just looks neat and tidy.
skliros, because builders use shit materials to work-with. Improve your materials and craftsmanship! See Europe. They’ve got it figured-out. America used to be the best. We are far far from it now.
You have just installed the best off the shelf pocket door hardware the world. This in not only a quality product but it's idiot proof to assemble and install. 20 minutes is typically what it takes to assemble the frame and hang it it the opening and another 15 to hang the door and adjust the soft close mechanism. Great company, great people.
Homeowner: I also specified and purchased the pull handle inserted in to the door. At the very beginning of this video is the hardware style. A push button to pop the handle out.. Two or three fingers can grasp the handle to pull the door open. My wife had arthritis. The most prevalent big-box style is a thin brass hook which hurts fingers. I intentionally paid big bucks. It is worth it.
Do you have the part number for the handle you're talking about? I'm considering installing a pocket door, and would like that hardware as well, it'll make things easier for my mom. Thanks for sharing.
It is refreshing to see a quality item such as the Cavity Slider door reviewed and more importantly, the reasons for using/installing a good product ONCE rather that a poor cheap product REPEATEDLY. Unfortunately homeowners often say "we saved a fortune by getting low cost pocket doors" in the early years, but soon complain about the cost of repair or replacement of the poor quality low cost pocket doors a few years later. The cheap product replacement labor costs alone far exceed the "cost savings" in the beginning. It is sad that for most people, a "DEAL" out weighs Quality in almost everything. Thank you for posting. My work as a renovator is almost 100% repairing or replacing failed low quality products and dealing with poor installation. Take care!
Man I love that soft open and close. Nothing beats a well installed pocket. My house was built in the early 70s with a well built pocket door that so far hasn’t needed any maintenance at least in the last 2 decades.
This is absolutely!!!!!!! Amazing I love the fact that you Pay attention to detail and the fact is that you love doing things the right way the first time and no cutting corners! You don’t turn a square into a circle.
My dad and I just built the frame for a 24 in. pocket door we're putting in an RV we're building. Even though we're not using a fancy aluminum frame like this - i love the idea of the foam at the back of the unit to soften the blow of the door as it goes back in. I'm definitely going to incorporate that idea into the door as we're still in the open frame portion of the build!
If I only have the budget for the Johnson pocket door hardware, I require my clients to get the soft-close add-on. The carriages that come with the soft close system have ball bearings
I love the soft close units, but, they don't seem to work real well with really heavy doors which we install alot. At least they hold the door tight to jamb and in pocket. Saves some ghosting issues
David Ceremony I have that system in my house and really like it. The soft open and close add to its functionality. Make sure to install both before drywall. I made the mistake of not installing the soft open first and you can’t get to it once the drywall is in. Had to pull the sheet down and add it in. My only complaint is the wobble side to side when moving. It might be worth it to set up glides on the inside of the frame some how.
I just finished an installation with the Johnson hardware. I really liked the ability to add plywood between their studs for blocking/support. Guessing I could probably do the same with cavity sliders, but I haven't looked to see if they have the specific clips available for that.
Johnson has some really high quality pocket door kits, just avoid their light weight kit rated for 150lbs doors. Granted my doors are all under 125lbs, but I still use their 400lbs kits because the rollers and tracks are so much nicer.
Very nice product. Building a house now and went to the website to spec out my needs. Price for a standard 3'0" 6'8" came out to $1,100. I"m afraid that's outside the budget! Wow... Wish I could justify the expense.
Awesome. Your videos are so helpful. We’re doing our first remodel starting this week and I’m learning about a ton of good products. I hate pocket doors but only know the cheaper ones from your video. I’m totally going to use this on our remodel!! Thank you!!
3:25 You misread the script: it was "if something fails on this 20 or 30 years down the road, you will still be able to buy and cheaply/easily replace this hardware"
These are nice pocket door frames and appreciate your channel. I looked at them before my purchase and decided to get something less expensive but still USA made and good quality. In a remodel, I'm using a 2x6 interior wall between MB and master bathroom 36"x80" door and decided with a pocket door to minimize a swing door being in the way of accessing either rooms. The final decision was with Johnson 2x6 Wall Framing 1560SC Series Soft-Close Pocket Door Frame, ball bearing rollers and metal frame.
I'm looking at doing same thing you did, except I'm using 2"x4" wall. I'll be installing a 36"x80" pocket door, building a master bedroom for my mom. How are you liking your door? Thanks for sharing.
So glad you did this vid now. I will be installing pocket doors in a couple months. Finding good hardware can be difficult - you saved me the trouble 👍
I build the pocket walls with 2x lumber turned sideways when possible. It only adds 1" and eliminates the wall shake when using the kits (also allows 2" nails and 1 1/4" screws). Angle braces (top & bottom) and pocket screws on the mid-wall bracing and you'll have a pretty strong wall. A kerfed board for a bottom track with a matching pin in the door bottom also helps the keep the door from scraping the walls and eliminates the exposed slot on the door slab. The heavy duty hardware is a must along with a soft close and a soft stop bumper. That system is pretty nice, but probably a bit more than most customers would agree to. Thanks for sharing.
Y'all need to add this to the Real Rebuild playlist! I was going through that whole 57 video list trying to find this as I am getting pocket doors in a remodel soon.
In the 1960s into the '90s there was a very good pocket door frame with heavy duty hardware including the hanger rolled system available to lumber and millwork dealers. My company sold well over 200 of them without a complaint. One of the things we recommended to our builder and architects was to use a 2 x 6 wall to install pocket door frames that way we didn't have worry about the drywallers missing the frame and having a drywall screw hit the opening for the door. On this system, I really like the heavy duty rollers and the guide at the bottom. I can see why this frame costs 3 times more. The soft close system looks great.
Was thinking of installing a pocket door in my remodel. Thanks to this video i now realize that i should avoid overly mechanized systems due to cost and longevity. Nothing beats a door and hinge !
I rented a Victorian place that had had pocket doors that had obviously fallen out at one point, and because the landlord was cheap they just didn’t bother to replace them, just leaving the empty cavities and a gaping doorway. I guess nobody maintained them. Maintenance is also important.
A earth magnet to catch the door open. I like to set the door glide back 1/2 and not expose the notch in the bottom of the door. Good product, I am familiar with Hafele. Thank you sir.
I have 4 original pocket doors in my house that was built in 1905. Attaching a piece of weather stripping to the back edge of the door works very well. I replaced the rollers in 1979 when I bought the house, and again in 2016 when I reconditioned the interior of the home. The most important parts of any installation : Who is doing it is #1, and the quality of materials being used is #2. The CS frame is awesome, but so is top choice select lumber. Also, if your going to use aluminum, why not spot weld instead of screw the parts in place.
As a now retired builder I always changed the wheels and track for a heavy duty high end replacement not the manufacturers version of heavy duty adds about ($100 aussie ) and less than five minutes in labour cost but worth every penny spent they glide redicoulsly smooth and will be trouble free
These internal cavity sliders, leak air like crazy down here in OZ, Matty. None of the houses down here have warm attic spaces. Some of them, when you blower door test @ 50Pa, they automatically close. Pretty neat home feature.
I bought a house 2.5 years ago, first house, in CA @ 29 years old. I have a pocket door for the master bathroom that rubs in the middle a bit. Thanks for this video and all the education you provide.
More than 20 years ago issues with pocket doors led me to build "boxes" for the pocket, using full panels of standard 3/4" OSB for each face, secured to cleats of various configurations on the top, bottom and vertical at the stud. Make sure dry-in is finished, and they never move. Warning: DO NOT use 1 1/4" drywall screws ( 1" ONLY!) as the tips will just poke through the back of the panel, and create havoc with the door, if the guides aren't perfect (or the door itself bows a bit). Advantage is the trim attachment: it is over wood, so finish gun works fine. For 2x6 walls, we build the frames around a standard track, usually with 1 5/8" metal studs. At the opening side, use a stud with a track wrapped over, to form a box section. Bomber. It is also possible to use LVL (might need 1 1/2" if the door itself is thick) or LSL as flat studs, in the thicker walls, and is well worth doing.
It's nice to read the comments and see all the builders who actually give a damn talking about showing this kind of stuff to customers and seeing if they are willing to pay for the quality. As much money as I spent with things I upgraded during my build (all on my own research, my builder never offered any sort of 'quality' advice, I now know he just doesn't care), I sure wish I had known about the pocket door hardware importance as I have 11 pockets doors with the basic crap frames. The doors themselves are nice and I picked really nice lock/pull hardware, but unfortunately 2 of the 11 have scraping issues.
Thanks for the great video. I am in the process of installing a pocket door to my son's house and now I know exactly what to get. I'll be purchasing a Cavity Sliders door! Great hardware.
@bobekfpj right out of the box with zero modifications though? The aluminum frame and not relying on the header is amazing to me. I have a pocket door that I am removing soon. Over time (1950s home) the header has shifted about 1/4 inch making the wall not as plumb as it once was. Now the door does not sit parallel in the pocket and rubs like mad. This would not have happened if it wasn’t tied into the header.
You'd still have a cheap (in quality and price) carriage and flimsy track. That said - if I install another builder-grade slider, I'm stealing that foam bumper idea and replacing the nylon stop button with a couple layers of neoprene.
@@jeffeverde1 I don't see the sponge lasting for more than a couple of years before it either rots or collapses due to the pressure of the door leaning on it. The trick is replacing it. I am from the school of simplicity and easy access and maybe using an off the self soft closing mechanism like this one is a better alternative? www.amazon.com/Universal-Cabinet-Soft-Close-Adapters-Unisoft/dp/B004SB9MPQ/ref=asc_df_B004SB9MPQ/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=216767797588&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=9883826414904246092&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9010955&hvtargid=pla-377617197744&psc=1
Will be hitting up BMC for these on our new build in Dallas - been worried about the pocket doors on the plans already - and now I'm actually excited instead!! Thanks for the video Matt!
After watching this video, I REALLY wanted this in my new house. $3200 for the frames for 4 doors was just a it too steep. I went for Johnson Hardware instead.
Often times around Boulder, we don’t use prebuilt frames at all, but instead build the frames ourselves out of left over gluelams or OSB and use Hafele hardware.
I built my own for a 6' wide double pocket door I put in a block wall between my original house and my 25x25 family room addition. I had to cut out a 12' section of block, Slot the last 2 columns of block on each side of the opening, epoxy in #5 rebar and pour them solid. I built a beam from (3) 2 x 12s 14' long to carry the trusses of the original house. With the 8" block and 7/8" and 1/2" drywall the wall is about 11" thick so I pretty much had to build my own frame to make it work out flush on both sides of the wall.
You can have that with supermarket doors. The sound could be on a chip. On the show, a stagehand was responsible for manually opening the door, using a rope on a pulley. The "whoosh" was added to the soundtrack later. In a couple of shows, you can hear the plywood door dragging on the studio floor. The sound editors missed fixing that.
Get out your check book. You'll need to have a custom door built to accommodate receiving high quality pocket door hardware. Even high end builder grade doors don't have enough solid material where it counts to install the hardware efficiently. Soft close/hard close, add $60 per door. A high functioning trouble free door is a custom build start to finish.
We had 8 ft tall, 4 ft wide (each) double pocket doors in an ancient house when I as a kid. They were over 110 years old and still moving smoothly. . When its done right, they won't have problems.
You're basically in the advertising business. I use heavy duty track and rollers and make the 1 3/4" doors run in a 2 x 6 wall with two by lumber on the flat each side. Very substantial.
perfect timing! going to install a pocket door in a hall doorway to a bathroom and bedroom that I rent out. this system will be perfect knowing it will withstand the renters.
Great installation. I would look into isolating the door to attenuate vibration that may get transmitted into the door. Vent fans, stereos, appliances, people walking, etc. can cause things to buzz annoyingly. I’d be interested in a solid or foam filled door, too.
The sound transmission via air movement at the necessarily unsealed edges, bottom & top will so dominate that the door acting as a speaker cone is basically irrelevant. Doors must be airtight to stop any appreciable amount of sound transmission, and most interior doors are limited by the air gap at the bottom ( assuming hard flooring, as opposed to a thick carpet the door can rub into). All residential pocket doors are great sound transmitters, very poor isolators.
Thank you Matt this is really good to know and we can show it to customers so they understand why to pay extra and what the difference really is. Great job. Yes we are subscribed and also like this video. Painters will also love it because they can remove the door and spay it in the garage instead to do it onsite. Could you look for a good quality extension level. We still be looking around for one which fit the budget but also is high quality. We found Stabila but cost like $300 and we found Empire for about $100 and a interesting fordable from Bosh for $150... Extruded aluminum is always very good to be used. Especially for Saw's as guides and stands but now as a Pocket good is really a nice strong feature. Especially in wet areas I think the aluminum will shine even more.
Great video. I bid on a job last week. While not a pocket door job, my work compared to others is like comparing CavitySlider to standard pocket door hardware. I was a couple of hundred more. I didn't get the gig. People don't care. They'd rather cheap out and complain later when having to repair it.
My "en suite" is 48x54 not counting the 30x30 shower bumpout. Perfect candidate for a pocket door. Even though I'd have to tear out the wall this looks like it would be worth every agonizing minute of the process.
Nice door, when we remodeled our old house in CA Pocket doors were not allowed for bedrooms or bathrooms. I believe the reason was if the fire got into the wall cavity it could disrupt the ability for the door to open properly. Paul
Wow, thanks for showing this...As a remodeling contractor, for even longer than you, :)...I've always HATED pocket doors...I try to avoid them at all cost, but; I like that cavity assembly...State of the art hardware...I found a place near me that carries them..
A guy I was working with on a super high end renovation was fitting architrave and ship lap on a pocket door wall and nailed the door multiple times! So embarrassing. Had to remove everything and re make the door. It’s a mistake that you only need to see once!
You should make a documentary on the Dutch pocket doors I install daily. One man installs 8 to 16 pocket door frames in a day, depending on the walls it’s gonna be installed in. Push2Go, Softclose/Soft opening systems, have a Ceiling hoist rail go through them. No bottom track needed, so it the door can be laminated on the bottom too.
Thank you for doing the research and all the hard to showcase these products to. By doing so, we are able to make an informed decision on what and how to build. God bless.
Wow timely video! I will be ordering a pocket door system this week, install in 3 weeks, definitely giving them a strong consideration, after all its my own house
What do you nail the trim into? Will nail gun nails 16/15ga penetrate the metal? Glue it onto the drywall? Use trim screws into the metal? What is cavity sliders recomendation? Thanks,
Pocket door problem! I have 4 pocket doors in my second floor with attic above. In hot weather I can smell the attic when I walk underneath the headers. Make sure you seal that header somehow!
I've been thinking about doing 4 retrofit cavity sliders. What a nightmare! Finding a builder to do this where I live during Covid. I really like the soft open/close idea.
I truly love your attention to details and how you explain things, you are just like Enez Yilmazire and am forever Grateful subscribing to your channel and his channel too. You guys are the best and shout out to Chikis Krulsawat and Danny Lush and Darren. Darren u are keeping it real. Shout out to Mattbangwood
Obviously too late for you, but in the future, you could use some magnets to prevent the bounce on the open/close if you don't have the soft close feature.
I suggest using MDO instead drywall to cover pocket door 'pockets': as is the MDO paints nicely, and this can be polished with a skim if plaster if needed. The plywood adds strength and resilience, and a nailing surface for hanging mirrors, or attaching cabinets.
"For a 'few' hundred bucks more..."upgrade. Matt didn't mention that builder grade doors don't have enough solid material on the sides to install high quality hardware. A custom door may be required. Soft close/soft open hardware is a $60 upgrade. With this system I would think $600-800 total cost is a realistic number.
I had clients buy really nice $300-400 Emtek hardware for $100-$150 doors with a veneer skin. It's not so much having solid material, it's the fact that 1 3/8" doors that are commonly used on interior doors and the Emtek hardware or Baldwin Hardware like Matt showed earlier in the video are 1" leaving you with just the skin of the door on either side. It's fine if the door was an actual solid hardwood door. It doesn't work for paint grade doors which is usually an MDF veneer over particle board or MDF core. I notched out a decent quality interior door that my millwork orders and considers paint grade...typical MDF core, smooth finish, etc. and the area that's notched out for a mortise style hardware feels like it's delaminating and bowing out. I keep it at the shop if any client ask for mortise style hardware. I've used Cavity Sliders before and they're top notch though if you just want good hardware and normal doors. It's worth it because it's literally the same install as a traditional frame you can get from the millworks like Matt showed. Ducasse has by far the best rollers and track though...by far. However, they don't sell the frame, just a track which is a pain to install in a standard 2x wall. Really made for double walls.
This comment is very relevant. Replace those foam buffers with something EVA or more robust. That open cell foam will turn to dust in less than 30 years. The rubber bumper on the cheaper pocket door will last much longer. There are foams that will not decay with time like soft, EVA. of closed cell foams that would be much better. Check out a cheap camping mattress at Walmart and cut a small chunk to replace that open cell foam and you will thank yourself in 10-15 years. The best $20 you'll spend for a $300 pocket door: Thermarest RidgeRest regular length mattress. Use the remaining portion for kneeling on when working or sitting on cold seats at your favorite football stadium!
Looks like great hardware. I use 2x2s or flat 2x4s to make a 2x6 wall with more durability. The next install, I'm going to try using unistrut with ball-bearing rollers to make my own sliding hardware.
They just compared a product to something that 1/3 of the cost (LE Johnson 1500), not even close to an "apples-to-apples" comparison. Need to do better if you're going to present product comparisons with integrity. LE Johnson's HD200 and HD400 products all use ball bearing rollers and have tracks that better carry the weight of larger solid core interior doors for the custom homes I work with and they have the soft-close option as well. And they'll still be less than Cavity Sliders. I sell both Cavity Sliders and LE Johnson, and Cavity Slider is only really needed when we get into moving 9' wide by 7' tall pocket doors (moving small walls). Cavity Sliders has a great product, strong and durable, but not needed for standard operations of a bathroom door. If you want to pay that much extra so that you can remove a pocket door without a wrench, go for it! I love Cavity Sliders, but most people don't need to pay that much extra when there's a great middle ground. I'm not an LE Johnson rep, I work at a custom home dealer supply. I just didn't like the comparison here of a really high end product to the lowest end product when there's a great middle ground.
3:40 he says they’re not even comparison.
The price difference where I buy my doors is much different, $109 for the Johnson 1500 and $1247 for the cavity slider.
Soft close option would be cool
Thank you. As someone who knows nothing about pocket doors, trying to decide where to spend the money on our renovations, this helps a lot!
Agreed. I've installed several pocket doors (one in my own house) and let me tell you, pocket doors in a bathroom are fantastic.
The door I installed was a Johnson door, went up fast and easy and years later...zero problems.
Save your money.
This book is Awesome! I love the Lean-To-Shed the most (page 98). The plan czcams.com/users/postUgkxe9yi0sulKgsp0VJJCIrLWWkvVqcU7LFR is to attach it to the back of my brick house. I also like how they walk you through the many different steps of construction, which is important for the less experienced like me.
I like to think these videos will help to make a better generation of builders. Kids who were interested in being a builder and learning the right way to do things.
Out of all the people I see doing this kind of work. I dont see any standard of quality. That goes for big national companies to the local "handyman". And the average joe doesnt know the difference between qualities so they keep calling the same people back. Its disgusting. No matter where I go i cant help but look at floors, tile, paint edges, or drywall corners, etc. And think how I would do it different or how bad it looks. Its a shame.
You are absolutely correct, it’s all about the material first and then the installer. I installed a 28” pocket-door for the first time, about a month ago and already noticing some flaws. I wished I would have found your video first. Thanks for posting, your work and content is absolutely great .
I am building my own home and had 6 pocket doors spec'ed. Now I can't unsee this video. Guess I will be installing these because I am a quality hound.
CS doors have been available in New Zealand for 20-30 years. They are a fantastic product and the market leader here. Their handles for pocket doors are equally as great, with really good templates to make for an easy install process.
Excellent video! My girlfriend works for one of the nation’s largest builders, and it just upsets me when that they don’t even use pocket doors....let alone quality hardware like this.
I think most people would be willing to pay more if they understood what they are getting for their money. Thanks Matt!
Because they are way more problematic than a traditional door. And they don't want callbacks.
What are the benefits of a pocket door over a standard door? Can they be locked too?
thaitichi, benefits? You don’t have to consider the area that you need for traditional door to swing. It takes a lot of room. Plus, a pocket door just looks neat and tidy.
skliros, because builders use shit materials to work-with. Improve your materials and craftsmanship! See Europe. They’ve got it figured-out. America used to be the best. We are far far from it now.
@@tjam4229 that's mostly because Americans want cheap and easy. They don't want to spend more for Quality. So that's what gets produced.
You have just installed the best off the shelf pocket door hardware the world. This in not only a quality product but it's idiot proof to assemble and install. 20 minutes is typically what it takes to assemble the frame and hang it it the opening and another 15 to hang the door and adjust the soft close mechanism. Great company, great people.
Thanks Scott!
What is important is Matt knows what a good job is. Many contractors just aren't this involved.
Homeowner: I also specified and purchased the pull handle inserted in to the door. At the very beginning of this video is the hardware style. A push button to pop the handle out.. Two or three fingers can grasp the handle to pull the door open. My wife had arthritis. The most prevalent big-box style is a thin brass hook which hurts fingers. I intentionally paid big bucks. It is worth it.
Do you have the part number for the handle you're talking about? I'm considering installing a pocket door, and would like that hardware as well, it'll make things easier for my mom. Thanks for sharing.
Kwikset makes a knob that is flat, has good sized handle, and locks. Less than 30 bucks.
It is refreshing to see a quality item such as the Cavity Slider door reviewed and more importantly, the reasons for using/installing a good product ONCE rather that a poor cheap product REPEATEDLY. Unfortunately homeowners often say "we saved a fortune by getting low cost pocket doors" in the early years, but soon complain about the cost of repair or replacement of the poor quality low cost pocket doors a few years later. The cheap product replacement labor costs alone far exceed the "cost savings" in the beginning. It is sad that for most people, a "DEAL" out weighs Quality in almost everything. Thank you for posting. My work as a renovator is almost 100% repairing or replacing failed low quality products and dealing with poor installation. Take care!
Man I love that soft open and close. Nothing beats a well installed pocket. My house was built in the early 70s with a well built pocket door that so far hasn’t needed any maintenance at least in the last 2 decades.
This setup would make me reconsider pocket doors.
This is absolutely!!!!!!! Amazing I love the fact that you Pay attention to detail and the fact is that you love doing things the right way the first time and no cutting corners! You don’t turn a square into a circle.
My dad and I just built the frame for a 24 in. pocket door we're putting in an RV we're building. Even though we're not using a fancy aluminum frame like this - i love the idea of the foam at the back of the unit to soften the blow of the door as it goes back in. I'm definitely going to incorporate that idea into the door as we're still in the open frame portion of the build!
YES!!! Perfect timing sir, just started a bathroom remodel and yesterday when I was working I wondered if you had a pocket door video.
Nice! Never heard of these in over 40 years in the biz. May need to spec. these on my next project.
If I only have the budget for the Johnson pocket door hardware, I require my clients to get the soft-close add-on. The carriages that come with the soft close system have ball bearings
I love the soft close units, but, they don't seem to work real well with really heavy doors which we install alot. At least they hold the door tight to jamb and in pocket. Saves some ghosting issues
David Ceremony I have that system in my house and really like it. The soft open and close add to its functionality. Make sure to install both before drywall. I made the mistake of not installing the soft open first and you can’t get to it once the drywall is in. Had to pull the sheet down and add it in.
My only complaint is the wobble side to side when moving. It might be worth it to set up glides on the inside of the frame some how.
I just finished an installation with the Johnson hardware. I really liked the ability to add plywood between their studs for blocking/support. Guessing I could probably do the same with cavity sliders, but I haven't looked to see if they have the specific clips available for that.
Johnson has some really high quality pocket door kits, just avoid their light weight kit rated for 150lbs doors. Granted my doors are all under 125lbs, but I still use their 400lbs kits because the rollers and tracks are so much nicer.
Very nice product. Building a house now and went to the website to spec out my needs. Price for a standard 3'0" 6'8" came out to $1,100. I"m afraid that's outside the budget! Wow... Wish I could justify the expense.
Thank you! Comparing products and talking long term maintenance issues is a HUGE help, especially for renovation newbies.
Awesome. Your videos are so helpful. We’re doing our first remodel starting this week and I’m learning about a ton of good products. I hate pocket doors but only know the cheaper ones from your video. I’m totally going to use this on our remodel!! Thank you!!
3:25 You misread the script: it was "if something fails on this 20 or 30 years down the road, you will still be able to buy and cheaply/easily replace this hardware"
lol
These are nice pocket door frames and appreciate your channel. I looked at them before my purchase and decided to get something less expensive but still USA made and good quality. In a remodel, I'm using a 2x6 interior wall between MB and master bathroom 36"x80" door and decided with a pocket door to minimize a swing door being in the way of accessing either rooms. The final decision was with Johnson 2x6 Wall Framing 1560SC Series Soft-Close Pocket Door Frame, ball bearing rollers and metal frame.
I'm looking at doing same thing you did, except I'm using 2"x4" wall. I'll be installing a 36"x80" pocket door, building a master bedroom for my mom. How are you liking your door? Thanks for sharing.
You’re welcome, frame Kit arriving today, I have the rough opening ready, we’ll see how the installation goes. It has to be plumb, level and square.
So glad you did this vid now. I will be installing pocket doors in a couple months. Finding good hardware can be difficult - you saved me the trouble 👍
I build the pocket walls with 2x lumber turned sideways when possible. It only adds 1" and eliminates the wall shake when using the kits (also allows 2" nails and 1 1/4" screws). Angle braces (top & bottom) and pocket screws on the mid-wall bracing and you'll have a pretty strong wall. A kerfed board for a bottom track with a matching pin in the door bottom also helps the keep the door from scraping the walls and eliminates the exposed slot on the door slab. The heavy duty hardware is a must along with a soft close and a soft stop bumper. That system is pretty nice, but probably a bit more than most customers would agree to. Thanks for sharing.
Y'all need to add this to the Real Rebuild playlist! I was going through that whole 57 video list trying to find this as I am getting pocket doors in a remodel soon.
In the 1960s into the '90s there was a very good pocket door frame with heavy duty hardware including the hanger rolled system available to lumber and millwork dealers. My company sold well over 200 of them without a complaint. One of the things we recommended to our builder and architects was to use a 2 x 6 wall to install pocket door frames that way we didn't have worry about the drywallers missing the frame and having a drywall screw hit the opening for the door.
On this system, I really like the heavy duty rollers and the guide at the bottom. I can see why this frame costs 3 times more. The soft close system looks great.
I don't think the million cycle testing is excessive, I've told my kids a million times to CLOSE the DOOR!
that's because children have brain damage.
LMAO, man that's a horrible Dad joke and I love it!
Was thinking of installing a pocket door in my remodel. Thanks to this video i now realize that i should avoid overly mechanized systems due to cost and longevity. Nothing beats a door and hinge !
Unless there’s no space for the swing…
The pocket looks super reliable. I’ve worked on a lot of 1950-1960s homes that had so many issues with these doors. Nice product
I rented a Victorian place that had had pocket doors that had obviously fallen out at one point, and because the landlord was cheap they just didn’t bother to replace them, just leaving the empty cavities and a gaping doorway. I guess nobody maintained them. Maintenance is also important.
A earth magnet to catch the door open. I like to set the door glide back 1/2 and not expose the notch in the bottom of the door. Good product, I am familiar with Hafele. Thank you sir.
I have 4 original pocket doors in my house that was built in 1905. Attaching a piece of weather stripping to the back edge of the door works very well. I replaced the rollers in 1979 when I bought the house, and again in 2016 when I reconditioned the interior of the home. The most important parts of any installation : Who is doing it is #1, and the quality of materials being used is #2. The CS frame is awesome, but so is top choice select lumber. Also, if your going to use aluminum, why not spot weld instead of screw the parts in place.
Very interesting I always hated pocket doors due to the noise and wiggle etc. This looks like a good option.
As a now retired builder I always changed the wheels and track for a heavy duty high end replacement not the manufacturers version of heavy duty adds about ($100 aussie ) and less than five minutes in labour cost but worth every penny spent they glide redicoulsly smooth and will be trouble free
These internal cavity sliders, leak air like crazy down here in OZ, Matty. None of the houses down here have warm attic spaces. Some of them, when you blower door test @ 50Pa, they automatically close. Pretty neat home feature.
the good thing to see this clip is learning something but the CS pocket door cost raised after this show clip
Used Sliding glass patio doors can be turned into awesome pocket doors.
You put mirror tint on one side and wallpaper on the other.
I bought a house 2.5 years ago, first house, in CA @ 29 years old. I have a pocket door for the master bathroom that rubs in the middle a bit. Thanks for this video and all the education you provide.
Yes, I agree, spending more money to buy better quality material or products make the difference in time.
I love your commitment to quality! Need more builders like you in this country!
More than 20 years ago issues with pocket doors led me to build "boxes" for the pocket, using full panels of standard 3/4" OSB for each face, secured to cleats of various configurations on the top, bottom and vertical at the stud. Make sure dry-in is finished, and they never move. Warning: DO NOT use 1 1/4" drywall screws ( 1" ONLY!) as the tips will just poke through the back of the panel, and create havoc with the door, if the guides aren't perfect (or the door itself bows a bit). Advantage is the trim attachment: it is over wood, so finish gun works fine.
For 2x6 walls, we build the frames around a standard track, usually with 1 5/8" metal studs. At the opening side, use a stud with a track wrapped over, to form a box section. Bomber. It is also possible to use LVL (might need 1 1/2" if the door itself is thick) or LSL as flat studs, in the thicker walls, and is well worth doing.
It's nice to read the comments and see all the builders who actually give a damn talking about showing this kind of stuff to customers and seeing if they are willing to pay for the quality. As much money as I spent with things I upgraded during my build (all on my own research, my builder never offered any sort of 'quality' advice, I now know he just doesn't care), I sure wish I had known about the pocket door hardware importance as I have 11 pockets doors with the basic crap frames. The doors themselves are nice and I picked really nice lock/pull hardware, but unfortunately 2 of the 11 have scraping issues.
Thanks for the great video. I am in the process of installing a pocket door to my son's house and now I know exactly what to get. I'll be purchasing a Cavity Sliders door! Great hardware.
First you have to train framers to use levels and a tape measure
Ha ha ha
I've yet to encounter a square and level house....
Really like the comparison of these doors!
Not sure how I feel about the skinny jeans though.
@bobekfpj right out of the box with zero modifications though?
The aluminum frame and not relying on the header is amazing to me. I have a pocket door that I am removing soon. Over time (1950s home) the header has shifted about 1/4 inch making the wall not as plumb as it once was. Now the door does not sit parallel in the pocket and rubs like mad. This would not have happened if it wasn’t tied into the header.
Aka you're jealous you can't rock stylish jeans??😂😂😂
He looks good in those jeans. We all know he's a big guy and everything is, well, in proportion. Lots of women and gay men are in construction, too!
A couple of upgrades to the standard door like a padding in back and groove in the bottom would be fairly easy.
You'd still have a cheap (in quality and price) carriage and flimsy track. That said - if I install another builder-grade slider, I'm stealing that foam bumper idea and replacing the nylon stop button with a couple layers of neoprene.
@@jeffeverde1 I don't see the sponge lasting for more than a couple of years before it either rots or collapses due to the pressure of the door leaning on it. The trick is replacing it. I am from the school of simplicity and easy access and maybe using an off the self soft closing mechanism like this one is a better alternative?
www.amazon.com/Universal-Cabinet-Soft-Close-Adapters-Unisoft/dp/B004SB9MPQ/ref=asc_df_B004SB9MPQ/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=216767797588&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=9883826414904246092&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9010955&hvtargid=pla-377617197744&psc=1
Will be hitting up BMC for these on our new build in Dallas - been worried about the pocket doors on the plans already - and now I'm actually excited instead!! Thanks for the video Matt!
"Cavity Sliders" sounds like a nightmare dental product.
“Cavity Sliders, where we smoothly penetrate your opening”
either that or candy from white castle
My old prison name
Adult toys.
Hahaha touché
After watching this video, I REALLY wanted this in my new house. $3200 for the frames for 4 doors was just a it too steep. I went for Johnson Hardware instead.
What kit did you go with o the Jobnson? Happy with it?
Love the Johnson 1500sc kits. I have 4 in my house. Works great with 6 kids have both soft close and open. $169 for whole kits at HD.
@@TheCboogie509 sorry. Just saw this in my notifications. I went with the Johnson 1500 SC for both open and close. They work GREAT
Often times around Boulder, we don’t use prebuilt frames at all, but instead build the frames ourselves out of left over gluelams or OSB and use Hafele hardware.
I built my own for a 6' wide double pocket door I put in a block wall between my original house and my 25x25 family room addition. I had to cut out a 12' section of block, Slot the last 2 columns of block on each side of the opening, epoxy in #5 rebar and pour them solid.
I built a beam from (3) 2 x 12s 14' long to carry the trusses of the original house. With the 8" block and 7/8" and 1/2" drywall the wall is about 11" thick so I pretty much had to build my own frame to make it work out flush on both sides of the wall.
I want pocket doors like on Star Trek. Especially with the swishing noise. :)
You can have that with supermarket doors. The sound could be on a chip. On the show, a stagehand was responsible for manually opening the door, using a rope on a pulley. The "whoosh" was added to the soundtrack later. In a couple of shows, you can hear the plywood door dragging on the studio floor. The sound editors missed fixing that.
Star Trek.. exactly me too heheheheheh
if u find "Star Trek" doors.. let me know okk smiles
Yuuup!
Business idea!!! I like it!
I love pocket doors and I wanted to put them in my home design but the failure rate gave me pause. I think I found the solution.
Get out your check book. You'll need to have a custom door built to accommodate receiving high quality pocket door hardware. Even high end builder grade doors don't have enough solid material where it counts to install the hardware efficiently. Soft close/hard close, add $60 per door. A high functioning trouble free door is a custom build start to finish.
@@oltedders Rather than buying a custom door, I feel like I'll probably make one or modify a non-specialized door for the hardware
We had 8 ft tall, 4 ft wide (each) double pocket doors in an ancient house when I as a kid. They were over 110 years old and still moving smoothly.
.
When its done right, they won't have problems.
Yup, and those didn't have fancy aluminum track or high-tech roller bearings!
@@donabele1243 cast bronze casters with a 3" diameter!
I bought three of these after watching this video. Really happy I did,
Have installed too many of those cheap ones...never have been satisfied with the finish product. These look great!
You're basically in the advertising business. I use heavy duty track and rollers and make the 1 3/4" doors run in a 2 x 6 wall with two by lumber on the flat each side. Very substantial.
Brilliant how the trim pops off like that! I really wish my Hafele hardware had that.
perfect timing! going to install a pocket door in a hall doorway to a bathroom and bedroom that I rent out. this system will be perfect knowing it will withstand the renters.
Great installation. I would look into isolating the door to attenuate vibration that may get transmitted into the door. Vent fans, stereos, appliances, people walking, etc. can cause things to buzz annoyingly. I’d be interested in a solid or foam filled door, too.
The sound transmission via air movement at the necessarily unsealed edges, bottom & top will so dominate that the door acting as a speaker cone is basically irrelevant. Doors must be airtight to stop any appreciable amount of sound transmission, and most interior doors are limited by the air gap at the bottom ( assuming hard flooring, as opposed to a thick carpet the door can rub into). All residential pocket doors are great sound transmitters, very poor isolators.
Thank you Matt this is really good to know and we can show it to customers so they understand why to pay extra and what the difference really is. Great job. Yes we are subscribed and also like this video. Painters will also love it because they can remove the door and spay it in the garage instead to do it onsite. Could you look for a good quality extension level. We still be looking around for one which fit the budget but also is high quality. We found Stabila but cost like $300 and we found Empire for about $100 and a interesting fordable from Bosh for $150...
Extruded aluminum is always very good to be used. Especially for Saw's as guides and stands but now as a Pocket good is really a nice strong feature. Especially in wet areas I think the aluminum will shine even more.
Ask Kyle at RR Buildings about a good extension level: czcams.com/channels/WXEQsK3UiHszjwgGN5HUeQ.html
Great video. I bid on a job last week. While not a pocket door job, my work compared to others is like comparing CavitySlider to standard pocket door hardware. I was a couple of hundred more. I didn't get the gig. People don't care. They'd rather cheap out and complain later when having to repair it.
- EXCELLENT info ! ! ! Thanx for sharing. Nothing better than putting quality products in one's home.
My "en suite" is 48x54 not counting the 30x30 shower bumpout. Perfect candidate for a pocket door. Even though I'd have to tear out the wall this looks like it would be worth every agonizing minute of the process.
I’d love to see a video of how your guys did the dry wall and trim out for this pocket door…
Nice door, when we remodeled our old house in CA Pocket doors were not allowed for bedrooms or bathrooms. I believe the reason was if the fire got into the wall cavity it could disrupt the ability for the door to open properly.
Paul
i'm sold. definitely seems like a better, lasting solution for pocket doors
Wow, thanks for showing this...As a remodeling contractor, for even longer than you, :)...I've always HATED pocket doors...I try to avoid them at all cost, but; I like that cavity assembly...State of the art hardware...I found a place near me that carries them..
A guy I was working with on a super high end renovation was fitting architrave and ship lap on a pocket door wall and nailed the door multiple times! So embarrassing. Had to remove everything and re make the door. It’s a mistake that you only need to see once!
Excellent video. The cavity slider seems the way to go.
You should make a documentary on the Dutch pocket doors I install daily. One man installs 8 to 16 pocket door frames in a day, depending on the walls it’s gonna be installed in. Push2Go, Softclose/Soft opening systems, have a Ceiling hoist rail go through them. No bottom track needed, so it the door can be laminated on the bottom too.
Those are beautiful! If you want to come to West Texas and retro fit a couple of these into a 60s house, you’re more than welcome to! 😁
The most important thing he said was that the person doing the final door install was the same person who installed the track system.
Give Gilbert an extra beer for his efforts, he rocks!
Agreed! Love Gilbert!
Great video. I always appreciate what you do. It's the old "Cry Once" cliche' when it comes to doing things right. Thanks again.
Amazing. Here! Take my money!
Thank you for doing the research and all the hard to showcase these products to. By doing so, we are able to make an informed decision on what and how to build. God bless.
Wow timely video! I will be ordering a pocket door system this week, install in 3 weeks, definitely giving them a strong consideration, after all its my own house
Glad it was helpful! Good people at Cavity Slider. Wish you the best on your project. Matt
Wow! I never knew they made a high quality pocket door! Very nice option. Thanks for sharing this!
the Johnson brand is much nicer than the 'standard' one he showed
Fantastic video as usual. Very detailed, clear and the value explained. Well done and thank you.
AWESOME! Going to put these in my basement. Expensive, but SO worth it.
You said "heith" @1:20 lol. I've only noticed this phenomenon with only a few people in my life but it gets me every time! Awesome video, sir :)
What do you nail the trim into? Will nail gun nails 16/15ga penetrate the metal? Glue it onto the drywall? Use trim screws into the metal? What is cavity sliders recomendation?
Thanks,
Pocket door problem! I have 4 pocket doors in my second floor with attic above. In hot weather I can smell the attic when I walk underneath the headers. Make sure you seal that header somehow!
I loooove pocket doors! i have them in both my home.
I've been thinking about doing 4 retrofit cavity sliders. What a nightmare! Finding a builder to do this where I live during Covid. I really like the soft open/close idea.
I truly love your attention to details and how you explain things, you are just like Enez Yilmazire and am forever Grateful subscribing to your channel and his channel too. You guys are the best and shout out to Chikis Krulsawat and Danny Lush and Darren. Darren u are keeping it real. Shout out to Mattbangwood
This looks amazing! But what happens when that foam decides to crumble 😉
Obviously too late for you, but in the future, you could use some magnets to prevent the bounce on the open/close if you don't have the soft close feature.
Terrific! I'm sold.. now to go see if i can even get them.in Tucson...lol
This is a very good episode. We are bout to do a pocket door in the house.
I suggest using MDO instead drywall to cover pocket door 'pockets': as is the MDO paints nicely, and this can be polished with a skim if plaster if needed. The plywood adds strength and resilience, and a nailing surface for hanging mirrors, or attaching cabinets.
Thank you so much for this deep dive. I liked your older video but I knew there would be newer products out there! Thanks again!
Excellent presentation brother.
So if this a frame stage what about existing door that needs to be replaced ?
That sponge as a backstop is dubious -- what material are they using to prevent it from oxidizing and decaying over time?
Was thinking same thing. Maybe like memory foam mattresses? They last 20 plus years.
"For a 'few' hundred bucks more..."upgrade.
Matt didn't mention that builder grade doors don't have enough solid material on the sides to install high quality hardware. A custom door may be required.
Soft close/soft open hardware is a $60 upgrade. With this system I would think $600-800 total cost is a realistic number.
I had clients buy really nice $300-400 Emtek hardware for $100-$150 doors with a veneer skin. It's not so much having solid material, it's the fact that 1 3/8" doors that are commonly used on interior doors and the Emtek hardware or Baldwin Hardware like Matt showed earlier in the video are 1" leaving you with just the skin of the door on either side. It's fine if the door was an actual solid hardwood door. It doesn't work for paint grade doors which is usually an MDF veneer over particle board or MDF core. I notched out a decent quality interior door that my millwork orders and considers paint grade...typical MDF core, smooth finish, etc. and the area that's notched out for a mortise style hardware feels like it's delaminating and bowing out. I keep it at the shop if any client ask for mortise style hardware.
I've used Cavity Sliders before and they're top notch though if you just want good hardware and normal doors. It's worth it because it's literally the same install as a traditional frame you can get from the millworks like Matt showed. Ducasse has by far the best rollers and track though...by far. However, they don't sell the frame, just a track which is a pain to install in a standard 2x wall. Really made for double walls.
oh god, so deep in details which I'm looking for long...thx
me coming here to find a cheap way to install a pocket door: welp, I guess I'll just show myself out my non-pocket door
I'd definitely replace those foam pads with two leaf springs made of spring bronze. That foam is going to go gummy or crumble in about 30 years.
comeradecoyote lol. 30 years is a pretty good life span
Lol
Just staple a small furry animal for similar effect but may get stinky in a few weeks.
This comment is very relevant. Replace those foam buffers with something EVA or more robust. That open cell foam will turn to dust in less than 30 years. The rubber bumper on the cheaper pocket door will last much longer. There are foams that will not decay with time like soft, EVA. of closed cell foams that would be much better. Check out a cheap camping mattress at Walmart and cut a small chunk to replace that open cell foam and you will thank yourself in 10-15 years. The best $20 you'll spend for a $300 pocket door: Thermarest RidgeRest regular length mattress. Use the remaining portion for kneeling on when working or sitting on cold seats at your favorite football stadium!
Use this - they work great...Pocket Door EZ Closer
Looks like great hardware. I use 2x2s or flat 2x4s to make a 2x6 wall with more durability. The next install, I'm going to try using unistrut with ball-bearing rollers to make my own sliding hardware.