Building A Connection With A Troubled Horse
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- čas přidán 17. 07. 2020
- This is a session from a clinic in March, 2019.
Volley is a sensitive and athletic Warmblood/TB who is deeply troubled and confused. His answer to every hard question is flee. This video shows me working with him for the latter part of our first session together. I try to explain what I am doing and why.
I urge you to take time to understand the principles that are discussed. If something is unclear or confusing, replay any section over as many times as you wish to gain an understanding of the principles being applied.
I teach Good Horsemanship around the world helping people to understand the emotional and mental component of how horses operate to achieve both a willing partnership and bond and to maximize the performance potential of a horse.
Web Site: www.goodhorsemanship.com.au/in...
Facebook: pages/Good-Ho...
When you know how to teach your dance partner how to dance. Wonderful wonderful horsemanship.
That was a good one. Great timing and spot on with remarks on what he's doing and what you're doing. I also like that you preface it with that this isn't an example of what to do as a tutorial, but not that it isn't a good one to be a tutorial and maybe needs a few watch throughs to see it all
you honestly have made this simple. Caring for a horse has always been my dream and knowing the steps to do this has allowed me to feel more confident about getting one
Hi Ross, I am a relatively new follower of your work and I must say that I am a little surprised by the emotion you show towards Volley. By watching it, I felt tension in the air (coming from the horse of course, but also from you). Your voice and sometimes your words were quite "harsh", in contrary to your rather soft voice when you speak in general. I am not sure why you did this, I would have expected you to ask for the change of thought more gentle. But as I know you so far, there must be a reason for your behavior. Do you mind explaining? Btw: the effect you created is amazing! Thank you very much, Anna.
Hi Anna. I was expecting somebody would express the same views that you have. I don't know if there is much I can say to change what you feel about the video. But I will try to explain a few things about the video that you perhaps missed.
Firstly, there was no emotion on my part in anything I did. I am a firm believer in being emotionally neutral because emotions (good and bad ones) get in the way of ones judgement and timing. I suspect you feel I was emotional because at times I used "big" energy/pressure and sometimes had a loud voice. But these are no indicative of emotion. A better measure is to notice my feel and timing - particularly the timing of my releases of pressure and how smoothly I released pressure. This is hard to do well when emotions are high. But you should notice how "spot-on" my timing of these things were throughout the video. Please don't equate "big-ness" with any type of emotion. They alone tell you nothing. I'm sure you can act big when needed in some situations without being angry. It's a learned skill and every horse person needs to learn it. We should all be able to have a range of feel from almost imperceptible to "scary" big and back again with zero emotion attached.
Secondly, every time I asked Volley to do something my first ask was a small as possible. I suspect you missed the small/quiet/polite first ask several times and only saw the followup of being firm when Volley did not think to consider my first polite ask. Never ever do I ask a horse to do anything without first asking with a quiet "please could you...". For example, at one point I take a firm hold of the lead rope and Volley jumps back (it's one of the freeze frame moments I highlighted). My wife told me that most people would fail to see that I quietly asked Volley twice to not push into my hand before I took a firm hold. It seems clear to me, but I can see that some people could miss it.
I said in the intro of the video that people often miss the quiet communication, but see when it gets loud. If I was only loud with Volley I would never have gotten the response I did at the end where he listened to a whisper. In order for that to happen you must always ask with a whisper for the first ask and only increase the pressure/feel if there is no try or search in a horse.
I hope that explains the video a bit further. I would just add that the kindest form of training is to be clear. It is not always kind to use a small amount of pressure if it is not clear and motivate a horse to search. Cheers.
Thank you very much for your detailed explanation. Your answer is a great learning for me as I myself have problems with being clear but unemotional. As you said, it's something I still have to learn. Your book is already on my bedside table, ready to be read. Looking very much further to it. Thank you again for your time.
@@annahopfen7299 you are very welcome. I hope you find the book helpful.
I would have felt the same way as you Anna, as I see "similar" teaching methods used quite regularly. But Ross's is different, in his detachment (like he explained in his response). It isn't impressing fear, it's about impressing the seriousness of the situation on the horse so that they understand how imperative it is that they give and receive communication when they are being engaged.
I want to say something else though, and it's that Volley is uninterested and neglects Ross's attempts to speak with him. Volley is opinionated because of his experiences in the past, but that isn't an excuse to when he knows what he is being asked to do and he doesn't want to do it. His inaction and refusal to answer a question he knows the answer to is being met very reasonably IMO.
Consider it this way, if a child knows the answer to a question you're asking them, and they ignore you because they're playing video games, do you coo at them softly and say, "Sweety, now, I asked you a question and I know you're ignoring it, but honey, can you please answer me?" Or, do you cross your arms, hmph, and say, "Excuse me, I asked you a question?" That behavior is unacceptable in adults -- thus, it's unacceptable in children, and it's definitely unacceptable in the animals with whom we trust our lives.
Thanks Ross. That’s a really clear and useful video.
He became amazing! The later bit, I think he was getting bit by a fly. What a good boy! He just wanted to make you happy.
Hi Ross. This was amazing to look back on and see where we started from. Thank you!
Volley made a nice change - particularly over the 4 days. Thanks for letting me use the footage and I'm very glad you guys are getting along so much better. I hope we can work together again sometime in the future. Best regards, Ross
So beautiful! It makes my eyes tear up. I have an Icelander, he is only four which is the age we start training. He is also becoming so reactive. Took him for a walk, he saw cyklists, dogs running in a huge dog pen, cars passing (he jumped only the first time, after that nothing) he was so responsive to me because of similar groundwork as this (I react to the slightest negative change and the only drawback is ppl watching who have no idea how to read his language and think he is just being sweet, they will look at it woth annegative face, oh how I hate that), I feel that you are the same, reading the horse. Anyway on this walk it was amazing, this young one was like putty in my hands, we were almost like one for a while there and he is new in the area and never ever seen the area before. I even stopped a few times before giving any sort of preparation and he instantly stopped. He head always tilted slightly towards my direction, if not facing forward. The rope was like holding air. I almost cried of happiness. I did also stop and we looked at the dogs facing the same way. Then when I walked on he knew and did the same. I just cry watching this since you are confirming to me what I thought, my expectations are NOT too high. I kind of knew that bit ppl keep telling me he is so sensitive you need to take it slow. Yet he has grown more with one week with me than the months he was with a trainer. God bless you Ross. Am I right to guess Alice was your wife?
That's very good to hear. I am very glad you are finding a way to help your horse. Alice is a friend who is no longer with us.
@@RossJacobs thank you. Subscribed! (Okay, its so sweet of you to honour Alice in this way at the end of the video).
Smart horse and is probably why he has ended up here. Blood horses are not for novice unknowledgeable owners with slow and confusing cues. Excellent video and handler at work.
Remarkable.
Thank you for this example. Am currently working with a distracted horse who hesitates to give.e her mind. I fi d having her think about specific feet feeling , slow, helps her concentrate...to join me , and then me her. She is a warmblood mix. Smart, bored maybe, kind, herd bound. We've cone a long way in 3 weeks. Your video helps with communication and direction.
Just wonderful!
Perhaps you can explain the use of the phrases ‘ what’s your problem’ ‘that’ll do’ ‘slow down’ etc surely not necessary and unhelpful to volley?
Its not a crime to admit emotional involvement. You’re only human and doing your best
My narration is only for the benefit of the spectators watching at the clinic. It's meant to highlight changes they may not see. It bears no relation to my emotions. Just turn off the sound and watch again. Do my actions or energy or timing appear to be negatively effected by emotions? Watch the video without sound and if have good awareness and observational skills you'll see what I mean.
If none of your words bear any relation to your emotions, you are indeed unusual .
When I ask for a single step and I get 5 steps, I'm not sure if I should add pressure and correct the over reaction, or reset, or perhaps correct the extra movements sooner? I think with volley you added pressure to correct him when he moved a ton instead on one little step. Is that right?
When Volley would take extra steps it was because he was mentally leaving me. By increasing the pressure the goal was to bring his thought back to me and for me to become more important. That way he would listen more intently and I would become more important than the thing that drew his attention to disconnect. However, if your horse is taking extra steps because it does not understand or because it is fleeing from you, then you need to be more patient and only incrementally increase the pressure. It's a judgement call on what is causing the horse to leave. Good luck.
Would you do the same type of exercise with an intelligent, pushy, mouthy stallion? Would you change anything in this approach?
Without seeing the specific you have in mind I would say the principle would be pretty consistent. But the practice would likely vary a lot. I adjust different feel and pressure for different horses and even for the same horse moment to moment.
It's amazing that the horse understands English...lol Kidding. I'm missing your subtle cues. Quite a change at the end!
Who is Alice please somebody tell me
He said a friend who is no longer with them.
Genuine comment here....to the horse...how is this not just 'moving the feet'? Also why do you use your voice so muc? Is it or the benefit of the recording or do you think he understands your words? I'm properly interested in your answers....not trying to be clever :)
Firstly this was taken at a clinic so I do talking and verbalising what I am thinking so that people can understanding my intent, observations and thoughts. Secondly, every think I ask of the horse ends with change (or the beginning of a question) from the horse. Initially, there is a lot of driving and blocking to direct the thought of the horse. The feet are being driven but the intent is to release the pressure when the thought changes. The proof of this is at the end when you see how focused and quiet/relaxed the horse when I ask him a question. If the feet are being moved but without tapping into a change of thought nothing would be achieved and the horse would be just as animated at the end as it was at the beginning. I hope that is clear.
First you punish the horse to get away, then you punish it again because don't want to get close. Pathetic
There is not a single example of punishment in the entire clip. Punishment is pressure without clarity. The entire session was about clarity. At the start of the session the horse was charging me and showed aggression. I brought it clarity of following a feel to produce the calm, relaxed horse you saw at the end. Punishment was not involved.
It's another nice viedeo, but honestly, I do not see a difficult horse here...all of you make nice movies but nobody shows the problem and all the steps that should follow. You always show a horse that's been already half way through...
I say in the video that we only started shooting the 2nd part of the session. I was not expecting the trouble I found in this horse and so did not think to video the session. But when I began working with the horse and asked it a question, it was very aggressive and evasive - including lunging at me and rearing in close proximity and running back at high speed. But even though the video shows a horse doing none of those things, it is not hard to see the trouble the horse carries inside when its idea was interrupted. It was not a horse for 90 year old grandma, unless grandma rides broncs at the rodeo.
you have not worked out how to do this without anger ... you can be just as assertive without the deep emotion
No anger at all. I learned decades ago there is no place for emotion when working horses - neither anger nor joy. You mistake my words and tone with my emotions. I use words and tone to explain and help emphasize the importance of what I am observing and feeling from the horse to my students. I found a long time ago that people take in more when you are expressive and tune out easily when you are not.
@@RossJacobs up to you to analyse yourself
@@gilliandarling9239 if you doubt my word I suggest you watch the video again with the sound turned off. You'll notice my feel and timing are extremely precise and I can shift from being firm to being super quiet in the blink of an eye. That's almost impossible to do if human emotions are involved.
@@RossJacobs I think people tend to relate the words used plus the tone in which they are said as emotion. The use and tone of the words for the Benefit of your students auditing makes sense now, I didn't have any context on where the horse had come from or what work he had been exposed to context is important, great job. There is some fine details in there if a fellow is on the hunt for it
@@RossJacobs Good idea.
You *must* build focus and responsiveness from the ground before you even think about riding one like this. Find a good professional and work closely with them.
Thanks, Ross!
in no way is he listening to the horse...his communication is a D- at best.
Mhhh...in principle ok...the application no! Drilling is NOT giving any being confidence- obedience perhaps. This horse could have used a well deserved break after he did what you commanded ( you did not ask).
You are creating a obedient horse for sure, am very doubtfully this horse is comprehending WHY he is doing what he is doing.
Your voice is awfully body and commanding- demeaning at times.
I saw a few other videos from you and I liked them- but this video made me decide to NOT learn from you.
I think if you read the horse's body language you'll see the clarity I present helps him calm his emotional state considerably by the latter part of the clip. He does not shut down, stays alert, focused and develops relaxation and soft thoughts. Many people see big energy and cringe because it makes them uncomfortable. But how we feel is not important. The horse tells the story. If you had seen how dangerous and reactive the horse had been before I took the lead rope, you may have a different impression.