The Origin of Dragons in Middle Earth | The Lord of the Rings

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  • čas přidán 28. 06. 2024
  • What creatures did Melkor use to create the dragons of Middle-earth, the most famous of which is Smaug in The Hobbit? Since Melkor could not create a creature out of nothing, he had to use a creature as a basis for creating them. And what could this creature be?
    #middleearth #silmarillion #thehobbit #tolkien #lordoftheringslore #sauron
    Music: Scott Buckley @ScottBuckley
    Cover Art: Federico Ginabreda - www.artstation.com/artwork/qQ...
    I use many different sources for the visuals I incorporate. It's not always clear who created some of the works or many individuals share the same work under their own name. Therefore I only credit those I am certain about. If your work is in the video, please get in touch and I will gladly add your name to the list.
    Lisa Fricke - -www.artstation.com/lizzart_za...
    Guillem H. Pongiluppi - www.artstation.com/artwork/ba...
    Emy Art - www.artstation.com/emyart
    Rene Gross - www.artstation.com/roieco
    Alexis Facque - www.artstation.com/alexisfacque
    Fumeres Art - www.artstation.com/artwork/3o...
    Olya Chibrikova - www.artstation.com/artwork/58...
    Kelly Recco - www.artstation.com/merakline
    Joel Kilpatrick - www.artstation.com/artwork/Pwg3
    Ben Thijs - www.artstation.com/benthijs
    Leo Batic - www.artstation.com/leobatic
    Jacob Jones - www.artstation.com/rocketman399
    Emilio Mansilla García - www.artstation.com/emilio_man...
    keita okada - www.artstation.com/yuzuki
    00:00 Intro
    00:29 Why Melkor can't create from scratch
    02:59 Could they be Maiar?
    04:22 Possibilities
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Komentáře • 171

  • @keithtorgersen9664
    @keithtorgersen9664 Před měsícem +114

    There's another continent in the Eastern Sea that has never been elaborated on whatsoever. I have wondered if there are creatures there that Morgoth modeled dragons after.

    • @ondrejmrazek8209
      @ondrejmrazek8209 Před měsícem +3

      Was that continent a thing when the dragons were created?

    • @pumellhorne
      @pumellhorne Před měsícem +10

      ​@@ondrejmrazek8209It was. Morgoth's first battles with the Valar broke the original land mass apart. The eastern continent existed before the two Lamps were made. By the Third Age the maps show another continent in the south, known as the Dark Lands but I'm not sure if it was created later or discovered by the Numenoreans

  • @antonioortiz4544
    @antonioortiz4544 Před měsícem +40

    "Hey, can I change my name? Melkor just sounds too evil." "Sure, what do you want to change it to?" "Morgoth"

    • @mealroyale
      @mealroyale Před 29 dny +7

      Feanor changed it for him

    • @jesseparrish1993
      @jesseparrish1993 Před 19 dny +2

      "I'm thinking I don't want to be as evil as I used to be. "Lessgoth."

    • @JoeVanleuvan
      @JoeVanleuvan Před 18 dny +1

      ​@mealroyale it's sindiran and means "dark enemy"

    • @Delmania01
      @Delmania01 Před 14 dny +5

      Feanor named Melkor Morgoth after Melkor killed Feanor’s father and stole the Silmarils. It means “Black Foe of the World”.

  • @mhagain
    @mhagain Před měsícem +38

    You mentioned werewolves, and there is actually one case you missed, where Tolkien explicitly describes Morgoth creating a wolf-monster, outlines how he creates it, and very explicitly talks about an evil spirit entering it.
    "Then Morgoth recalled the doom of Huan, and he chose one from among the whelps of the race of Draugluin; and he fed him with his own hand upon living flesh, and put his power upon him. Swiftly the wolf grew, until he could creep into no den, but lay huge and hungry before the feet of Morgoth. There the fire and anguish of hell entered into him, and he became filled with a devouring spirit, tormented, terrible, and strong."
    Even though Tolkien doesn't say so, this must have been how dragons were also created.

    • @Kilthan2050
      @Kilthan2050 Před měsícem +8

      I just read this part to my daughter last night. She requested a second read through of the Hobbit, LOTR, and The Silmarillion.

    • @grayden4138
      @grayden4138 Před 23 dny +3

      I would agree with this. As Tolkien is famous for leaving things unexplained we can assume the original forms of the dragons will always be a mystery, but that Melkor found them, or at least Glaurung at the start, and corrupted it into the wyrm we know, and later bred the winged drakes from Ancalagon. Just as the great eagles were spirits of the air that aligned with Manwe, it's possible dragons were spirits of fire and/or ice, since those were Melkor's chief powers within Arda. Much in the way the Valar and Maiar are able to take various forms as they wish, and similar to Ungoliant taking the form of a spider, so too did the spirits of the dragons, also Maiar, likely take a form that reflected their corruption at the hands of Morgoth.

    • @SirMcAwesome
      @SirMcAwesome Před 4 dny

      Dragons are on a completely different level to werewolves though. Both in power and intelligence. Full grown dragons are calamities akin to a balrog, enough to make one of the mightiest dwarven kingdom abandon their city. Creating them would also take more you would think.

  • @And-ur6ol
    @And-ur6ol Před měsícem +33

    The first dragons (that is plural, because there were more than just Glaurung that were wingless, they just weren't named) were wingless. So I think it is safe to assume, that the origins are some kind of lizard, possibly a snake. Thou my money is on lizards.
    I think we can assume that Melkor got better at making creatures with time. Orcs and trolls were partial successful, but were also very flawed.
    The dragons were his masterpiece, and it was probably something he continued to refine till the end.
    But why make them? I don't think dragons were to mock eagles. I think they were meant to replace balrogs. Every time Melkor lost a balrog, it was a unrecoverable loss. So he needed something in equal strength. And so he made the dragons. To fill a need for those top-tier units in his army.

    • @danielkorladis7869
      @danielkorladis7869 Před měsícem +7

      Yeah, I think this is reasonable. Though mocking the eagles would have been a bonus. I agree that he probably wanted something of similar or near the destructive power of the balrogs that could be replaced, so that he could keep the balrogs back as commanders and not have to risk them in the front lines so often.

    • @And-ur6ol
      @And-ur6ol Před měsícem

      @@danielkorladis7869 If you played Rome Total War, or games like it, you know how much you start to avoid using your best veterans, as much as possible, because you don't wanna risk loosing your best, if you can avoid it :D

  • @skjold224
    @skjold224 Před měsícem +59

    Just want to add something you might have overlooked (or discarded):
    "Then arose Thorondor, King of Eagles, and he loved not Melko; for Melko had caught many of his kindred and chained them against sharp rocks to squeeze from them the magic words whereby he might learn to fly (for he dreamed of contending even against Manwë in the air); and when they would not tell he cut off their wings and sought to fashion therefrom a mighty pair for his use, but it availed not."

    • @drewfugiel2361
      @drewfugiel2361 Před měsícem +8

      I agree with this. The second hand person doesn’t know everything. Yes he would be clued in to a lot more than most in melkors army, but there are definitely secrets kept by melkor because he wouldn’t want anyone to be more powerful than him. It’s like learning how to build a nuke then telling that information to someone else. You wouldn’t

    • @middleearthtales
      @middleearthtales  Před měsícem +15

      Thank you very much for adding it. actually this quote is a proof that Melkor started experimenting on eagles. Although, as you know, the Lost Tales are the first prototype of Middle Earth. But it seems to support the eagles theory, don't you think?

    • @skjold224
      @skjold224 Před měsícem +10

      @@middleearthtales Maybe if " but it availed not" is only pointing to Melkor - Personally I think it points to the "the magic words". So I guess he didnt learn it from them. But there are other powerful creatues he could learn it from Swans ect.
      And about Lost Tales being the prototype then I always go by a few rules: Does it change in later writing? (in this case no) Does it contradict later writings? (Also no) - So the stance where we discard earlier writings only on the stance on that it is "old" is not a good argument :)

    • @GreatGreebo
      @GreatGreebo Před měsícem +2

      Very thought provoking….thank you.

  • @danielkorladis7869
    @danielkorladis7869 Před měsícem +25

    We also have later examples of powerful sorcerors (Sauron and Saruman) combining different life forms into new ones, most notably the Uruk-Hai which are a cross of orcs and humans. It's possible that the dragons were a combination of multiple ingredients rather than a corruption of just one. The early wingless dragons vs. the later flying ones may have been just Morgoth altering the ratios (adding more eagle most likely) in the formula to get more powerful servants.
    My best guess is that he combined fire spirits with corrupted large snakes and later perhaps added tortured great eagle into the mix to get them to fly.

    • @ericsmith1517
      @ericsmith1517 Před 29 dny +9

      so, creating evil abominations is like baking a cake. just add a pinch more eagle with a teaspoon of hate.

    • @tkbywatr
      @tkbywatr Před 19 dny +1

      @ericsmith 1517 ya pretty much

  • @maxblake5564
    @maxblake5564 Před měsícem +59

    My personal theory is that Melkor only created the fire drakes, and the cold drakes are the natural creatures that served as the template for fire drakes.

  • @vc1396
    @vc1396 Před měsícem +9

    I think there is always an expectation that melkor was trying to use a magical creature in his attempts to imitate creation and therefore overlook that he could have simply used a regular animal instead, perhaps a lizard or something
    Or he may have conjoined multiple different creatures, magical or not, afterwards adding evil spirits using his necromancy and later his own power to enhance them. We don't really know how long the process took but it seems to be at least a few hundred years, if not more so, and morgoth seemed to experiment quite often with nany different things. The dragons may have been a long term masterpiece in his eyes

    • @danielkorladis7869
      @danielkorladis7869 Před měsícem +2

      yeah they may have a little bit of all kinds of things involved in their creation.

  • @patsilverfang
    @patsilverfang Před 27 dny +6

    I’d rather hear a bad microphone audio than ai voices but the story is great

  • @johnnywalker157
    @johnnywalker157 Před 28 dny +3

    i think the nameless things are the best theory. So what if Sauron didnt know, do you think something as evil, twisted and self centered as Morgoth is going to be truthful about his creations. Which would make him sound more godlike to his followers, "Look at what i have created!" or "I just found this bigass worm thing and twisted it, pretty cool huh?" I go with nameless things.

  • @danielduncan6806
    @danielduncan6806 Před 18 dny +2

    I always just assumed all the evils of the land were created as a result of the discordant singing by Melkor when the world was being created.

  • @isaaco5679
    @isaaco5679 Před měsícem +5

    This feels like an AI generation. The voice is overused.

  • @sirguy6678
    @sirguy6678 Před 29 dny +3

    “Dragons is so stupid!” Yosemite Melkor

  • @StuartistStudio1964
    @StuartistStudio1964 Před měsícem +7

    You seem to have forgotten the Cold Drakes, which were wingless proto-dragons who did not breathe fire.

    • @SirShiv7
      @SirShiv7 Před měsícem

      Around 7:20 he mentions the first dragon being wingless.

  • @JosipL91
    @JosipL91 Před měsícem +6

    One of the new LotR games, Return to Moria touches on the origin of the blackwings, the mounts of the nazgul. It's final boss, a female dragon Narag-Shazon claims to have given birth to them during the third age. The actual canonicity of this statement remains vague as it does take place within a canon event of the reclamation of Moria, but also doesnt make any direct statements as to whether this is THE reclamation that the last Durin was/will get involved in or just Gimli doing his own thing before settling in the glimmering caves.

    • @SerenityGS
      @SerenityGS Před měsícem +2

      In return to Moria, your character is the last Durin.

  • @illyriosix7781
    @illyriosix7781 Před měsícem

    Just so beautifully wrought.

  • @AgustinTutubo
    @AgustinTutubo Před 24 dny +1

    But, for me, a huge misconception is that Yavanna couldn´t create life. She did created most of the living creatures in Middle Earth: Plants, Animals and Insects. That they didn´t posesed humanoid form is another thing. BUT SHE CREATED LIFE WITHOUT ERU ILUVATAR

  • @DraconimLt
    @DraconimLt Před měsícem +6

    He could've used the Fell Beasts or some type of large lizard as the template, powered them up with magic and infused one of the spirits making them far stronger, but done all this to mock the Eagles. 'Making a mockery of' does not mean 'creating it FROM the thing you are mocking' but as a bad/different COPY of it.

    • @danielkorladis7869
      @danielkorladis7869 Před měsícem

      Or very large serpents for the initial flightless dragons, given that Glaurung is described as "slithering."

    • @DraconimLt
      @DraconimLt Před měsícem +2

      @@danielkorladis7869 Glaurung had legs tho...

    • @jacobsykes3707
      @jacobsykes3707 Před 29 dny +1

      @@DraconimLtI’m sure you’ve seen it in nature documentaries, but most if not all snakes have vestigial leg bones. Funnily enough there could’ve been armless lizards running around at some point.

    • @DraconimLt
      @DraconimLt Před 29 dny +1

      @@jacobsykes3707 I know they have vestigal leg bones, I'm just saying if Morgoth made Glaurung with legs it'd be easier for him to start with a lizard than a snake, that's all.
      As for ''armless lizards running around at some point''
      1) 'Running' around, without legs? LOL.
      2) There still are. Slow-worms. Look em up.
      - Or did you mean with 2 legs but no arms?

  • @alexhulea2735
    @alexhulea2735 Před 12 dny

    Something else made at least Glaurung unique: he could use magic. He froze Turin in place, wiped and restored Nienor's memory, created mist.

  • @siemcaelers791
    @siemcaelers791 Před měsícem +7

    I like the fact you leave so much room to ponder in your videos.
    and dont bother if people say something about the ai stuff, its your channel, your choice

    • @middleearthtales
      @middleearthtales  Před měsícem +3

      When I make the videos I try to approach it as differently as possible from what's in the existing videos. Because there are so many great videos on youtube about middle earth. thank you

  • @Doubleojai
    @Doubleojai Před měsícem +10

    I really hope someone preferably (Peter Jackson) makes a movie based in the first age and the rise and fall of morgoth and his great empire. Would be very interesting to see on the big screen

    • @christian2809
      @christian2809 Před měsícem +2

      Unfortunately that would require movie rights to the silmarillion which are unobtainable AFAIK.

    • @brightlord-ov7cm
      @brightlord-ov7cm Před měsícem +2

      AFAIK means?

    • @christian2809
      @christian2809 Před měsícem

      @@brightlord-ov7cm as far as I know

    • @muhammadnoumanpanhwar7969
      @muhammadnoumanpanhwar7969 Před měsícem +2

      ​@@brightlord-ov7cm As Far As I Know, IIRC

    • @brightlord-ov7cm
      @brightlord-ov7cm Před měsícem +1

      @@muhammadnoumanpanhwar7969 ty, I didn't know what that meant and I had seen it here and there.

  • @VoidKami
    @VoidKami Před měsícem +4

    Fell beasts might be diminished dragons, or an attempt to recreate them by Sauron.

    • @theeffete3396
      @theeffete3396 Před měsícem +1

      The description of the fell beasts makes them seem like giant vultures, twisted and made more hideous by Sauron. Just as there are giant eagles, why couldn't there be giant vultures? Native to arid climate of Harad, of which Tolkien's writings scarely touch?
      I don't see any hints at all that they are related to dragons, and several that they are not.

    • @danielkorladis7869
      @danielkorladis7869 Před měsícem +2

      I think they're likely an attempt to get something similar by Sauron, but he was still in the process of experimentation at the time of the War of the Ring and had less magic to work with, explaining why they're quite a bit weaker and less intelligent.

  • @daniels7907
    @daniels7907 Před 26 dny +1

    The downside being that changing Eru's creation cost Melkor *permanent* loss of power. This is why, by the War of Wrath, he could no longer outclass the other Valar. Corrupting and altering the world and its creatures came at a heavy price for Melkor.

  • @7thsluglord363
    @7thsluglord363 Před 19 dny

    Im relatively certain that it is told that if a Maiar inhabits a physical form for long enough, and partakes of the world, they can no longer choose to take another form, and gain the ability to breed. Like if a Maiar chooses to become a great and powerful Orc, which was done, they eventually get stuck as that Orc and basically just become an Orc, breeding ability and all. So dragons very well good be Maiar if that is the case, stuck in the chosen form, becoming essentially a new species of creature.

  • @Soloong_Gaybowzer
    @Soloong_Gaybowzer Před měsícem +5

    My theory is that if the werewolves were lesser Maiar possessing the bodies of regular wolves, then it stands to reason that Dragons are when Greater Maiar possess the living bodies of large serpents or other reptiles. Glaurung did resemble a giant monitor lizard, after all.

  • @Enzo012
    @Enzo012 Před 16 dny

    Perhaps Melkor discovered that giant eagles had dinosaur heritage and decided he could definitely work with that? Though I don't think evolution is a thing in Middle Earth so I don't know if he could zap them with his equivalent of a devo gun from the Mario Brothers movie.

  • @EMTedroni
    @EMTedroni Před měsícem +1

    iirc, the Silmarillion says Eru placed the Eternal Flame in the heart of Ea to create in reality the vision made by the Ainur during their Great Music directed by Eru.
    The flame was an outward manifestation of Eru's creative power, and allowed the Ainur who lived in Ea to shape the world according to the vision of the Music.

  • @athenahitchin7738
    @athenahitchin7738 Před 29 dny +1

    My thougts always have been dragons are mockeries of eagles (or more aeral units to offset Manwae's eagles) where as foul beast of Sauron were the dragon kin that were domesticated.

  • @dandojambo1176
    @dandojambo1176 Před dnem

    The giant Eagles were definitely mixed or corrupted into dragons

  • @gerrimilner9448
    @gerrimilner9448 Před měsícem +1

    i think they had 4 very different grand parents. i think fire spirits are in there, though i remember ice dragons as a thing, but i may be wrong. melko had control over fire and ice at the start too. i think he had a choice of all the dinosaurs and i cant choose which ones it could be, but the eagles are possibly in there too, because of the mocking nature

  • @faithmacgregor340
    @faithmacgregor340 Před měsícem +2

    Why does it have to be a single beats for origin? Melkor could have taken lizards and snakes and made a worm, then later added eagles to get flight. Combine it all with some magic from Fire spirits and boom, Dragons.

    • @danielkorladis7869
      @danielkorladis7869 Před měsícem

      Yeah, I think this is the most likely origin. If in the 3rd age Saruman was able to combine orcs and humans to make Uruk-hai, I think it's reasonable that Morgoth would have been able to combine a bunch of things to make dragons, altering the ratios and adding ingredients to improve upon them over the years.

  • @user-or5ke5yn4w
    @user-or5ke5yn4w Před měsícem +2

    Maybe Sauron knew about Nameless things in general, especially those that dwelt in Angband. He may just not have known about which exactly of them lived under Misty Mountains.

    • @Vikingr4Jesus5919
      @Vikingr4Jesus5919 Před měsícem

      No, it's specifically stated even Sauron did not know of them.

    • @LordMortanius
      @LordMortanius Před měsícem +3

      @@Vikingr4Jesus5919 To be fair, that's just what Gandalf assumes of Sauron. It's not like he has an encyclopedia of 'things my old coworker may or may not know'.

    • @danielkorladis7869
      @danielkorladis7869 Před měsícem +1

      @@Vikingr4Jesus5919 Morgoth may also just not have told Sauron.

  • @sandrabonner8208
    @sandrabonner8208 Před 15 dny

    I've always wondered if the base materials for dragons and the the fell beasts might have been rare remnants of dinosaurs that somehow escaped the extinction episode, this being before the awakening of the first born.

  • @user-zq2vu4bs5x
    @user-zq2vu4bs5x Před měsícem +1

    A parallel: I love Resident Evil and my favorite character is Hunk; hardly anything is know about him. The dude's a badass. As much as I want to know about his backstory, the less I want to because it will take away from his mystery because that's what makes the character so great. That being said, I even thought the nameless things, which shouldn't be completely out of question. Maybe Tolkien knew but never wrote it or he never got to it and just speculated and debated with himself OR just left it out in the open for us to decide

    • @keithtorgersen9664
      @keithtorgersen9664 Před měsícem +1

      You're very much right about that, Tolkien is said to have deliberately put in nuggets of lore and then not elaborate upon them, calling them islands on the distant horizon full of mystery, of which if someone explored, they would lose their figurative enchantment.

  • @calebevans3690
    @calebevans3690 Před 7 dny

    I think its more likely that the Fellbeasts are a mockery of the Eagles in terms of size and anatomy

  • @hound3000
    @hound3000 Před 28 dny

    Is it possible that the discord caused by Melkor during the previous Music of the Ainur created the Glaurung? Maybe he found Glaurung the same way he found Ungoliant, but unlike Ungoliant, Glaurung was more controllable and Melkor ordered him to take the form of a dragon.

  • @BrolyPowerMaximum
    @BrolyPowerMaximum Před 22 dny

    Figure that the wyverns the 9 ride are perversions of the eagles considering the similar size.

  • @tslfrontman
    @tslfrontman Před 14 dny

    Cool comcept but the uncanny valley of the the AI voice is... Unsettling.

  • @benmoody5469
    @benmoody5469 Před měsícem +2

    Is there a filter on your voice mr narrator or are you AI

  • @Waster_War_Boss
    @Waster_War_Boss Před 6 dny

    My personal theory about dragons in middle earth is they are great serpents twisted by morgoth in a more the eagle and the viper style tale but that’s just my theory

  • @ianonymous3524
    @ianonymous3524 Před měsícem

    I would say that the fact that Sauron didn’t know about the nameless things is a point towards them having been part of the recipe for making dragons. Dragons were Melkors nuke and while Sauron worked for melkor he had his own will to power and his own agenda, thus I can see him hiding the means by which dragons were created from him. especially when one considers that these dragons were often basically dark lords in there own right. I can’t imagine smog being Sauron’s servant rather I think he would have seen himself as the dark lords equal.

  • @grapesofhypocrisy9842
    @grapesofhypocrisy9842 Před 23 dny

    Fellbeasts are in the new return to moria game and deal with some of this.

  • @rxg9er
    @rxg9er Před 14 dny +1

    Dragons are easily offended by being called "worm." I always assumed it was because they originated from worm-like creatures.

  • @JS-mh9uu
    @JS-mh9uu Před měsícem

    Something like a crocodile and Fire Spirits.

  • @dlseller
    @dlseller Před 14 dny

    2points:
    1. JRRT is not the final authority on the LOTR. He was constantly retconning the world to the point the even he didn’t know what was true.
    2. There’s a simpler explanation. The Ainulindalë is false. Melkor is Eru Illuvatar. The Valar overthrew him and he was pissed about it. I challenge anyone to read Silmarillion with that in mind. Once you see it you cannot unsee it.

  • @RazorFang18
    @RazorFang18 Před měsícem +4

    Personally I believe the Fell Beasts the Nazgul ride are the mockery of the Great Eagles. x'D They are bird-like with foul odors.

  • @someguy4131
    @someguy4131 Před měsícem

    "Hello adventurer! Can you find the hidden lore?"

  • @youcanttakemyDIGNITY
    @youcanttakemyDIGNITY Před měsícem +1

    Thank you Dragon 🙋💕💕💕

  • @nigeldepledge3790
    @nigeldepledge3790 Před měsícem

    Glaurung was not merely the first dragon. He was also called the Father of Dragons. This could, of course, be a metaphorical allusion to his position as the first dragon, but what if it's literal?
    What if Glaurung fathered all of Morgoth's other dragons, including Ancalagon the Black? That leaves us with two slightly lesser questions to answer : whence came Glaurung? and who or what were the mothers of the dragons?

    • @johnkeck
      @johnkeck Před měsícem

      I think we already know who the Mother of Dragons is. Lol

  • @dennismoon6693
    @dennismoon6693 Před měsícem

    It's been a while since I've read the Silmarillion, never mind the History of Middle Earth, but I vaguely recall that in the Last Battle at the end of the First Age the herald of Manwe was his son as well.

    • @jrpipik
      @jrpipik Před měsícem +1

      In early drafts Eonwe was the son of Manwe, but the idea of the children of the Valar disappeared in the 1950s.

  • @dixieflatline1189
    @dixieflatline1189 Před 28 dny

    Tolkiens dragons feel different to anything else. Their natural enemy was the eagles in the first age, but survived after Melkors defeat when even the balrogs went into hiding. They were also still a presence in the world in the 3rd age just like the eagles, but with the gold fever of a dwarf… Sauron didnt control them, so only Melkor could i imagine.
    The only other being powerful enough to simply ignore Sauron was Tom Bambidali - so what if Tom was not always alone, but from a lost race or others with equivalent power. In turn could they have been corrupted by Melkor and Tom is the last of his kind rather than the only one?

  • @kellygreenii
    @kellygreenii Před měsícem +2

    Morgoth can create. All sentient beings in ME can create. What only Iluvatar can create LIFE that has a free will (sentience) of its own. Iow a soul (Secret Fire/Flame Imperishable)
    This is seen in the Silmarillion when Aule in his haste to see the awakening of the Elves tries to create beings to teach. Aules work acted like puppets. The only did what he wanted..and only acted. Like the were alive when he was paying attention to them.
    Eru visited him. After realizing that this had come from a good place, Eru rewarded Aule by granting life to his creation….The dwarves.
    Melkor however could twist and corrupt…change…life that had already been created. So Melkor could take lizards and turn them into dragons. He had that kind of power. He resented that he couldn’t create life…or create a universe according to his own will and design.

  • @alanvatcher8374
    @alanvatcher8374 Před měsícem

    Fell beasts' may have been Sauron's best approximation of dragons.

  • @inotaishu1
    @inotaishu1 Před měsícem

    considering that Draugluin was the father of werewolves and possibly an ancestor of Charcharoth, I would say that Maiar can reproduce, at least if they are in a physical body. They just don't give rise to new Maiar that way.

  • @renarddubois940
    @renarddubois940 Před 17 dny

    I think Sauron was inspired by Loki and found a way to reproduce.. the werewolves and dragons are his offspring

  • @phill1777
    @phill1777 Před 18 dny

    I wonder if Rhun or Harad had Alligators?

  • @Tallacus
    @Tallacus Před měsícem

    Melkor took a gecko and fire spirit and smooshed them together

    • @johnkeck
      @johnkeck Před měsícem

      ... and saved a lot on fire insurance

  • @travisgould5423
    @travisgould5423 Před měsícem

    Well perhaps Melkor used man as a test subject to release as the old ones say the beast within.

  • @Dinovart
    @Dinovart Před měsícem

    It may be non-canon, but in shadow of war 2017 game it is stted that fire drakes are hybrids of fellbeasts and dragon. So, they could be fell-beats (wyvern) based, but this is late creation (Wb games), not original source material.

  • @AbstractStew
    @AbstractStew Před 10 dny

    Aren't there elves with a Maiar ancestor?
    Edit: Never mind. You mentioned it.

  • @cambuxton6835
    @cambuxton6835 Před 29 dny

    Molten lava and mythril perhaps?🤷‍♀️

  • @BrianSmith-ql5nj
    @BrianSmith-ql5nj Před 2 dny

    Fell beast.. cross of bat and snake.
    Dragons.. cross of fire wyrm and eagle.

  • @rduke325
    @rduke325 Před 18 dny +1

    You keep mentioning the dragons connection to fire. But not all dragons in Tolkien's work breathed fire......

  • @gandalf4751
    @gandalf4751 Před měsícem +1

    😍😍😍✅✅✅

  • @Wyrd92
    @Wyrd92 Před 14 dny

    He could have used gecko lizards for all know.

  • @paulinarapicka
    @paulinarapicka Před měsícem

    Creating a flightless dragon out of Great Eagles further mocks the Eagles- and adds one more opposite characteristic. Taking this under consideration, I think creating dragons out of the Great Eagles is more plausible than creating them from fallen beasts; as those are most probably only animals, plus still they are evil, so offending them would be impossible.

  • @eliasthienpont6330
    @eliasthienpont6330 Před měsícem

    🦁🦁🦁🦁🦁 THE LION WAS HERE 🦁🦁🦁🦁🦁 No. 1000

  • @voineamihail1890
    @voineamihail1890 Před měsícem

    ❤❤❤

  • @cambuxton6835
    @cambuxton6835 Před měsícem

    What are they made of? Fire.

  • @benbrown8258
    @benbrown8258 Před měsícem

    I would have imagined that Melkor took ravens or crows and twisted them in mockery of the great eagles of Manwe. Perhaps even snakes were fused with some of the dark maiar that joined him.

    • @danielkorladis7869
      @danielkorladis7869 Před měsícem

      I think snakes are a likely ingredient, especially for the early wingless dragons.

  • @StarWarsForge2010
    @StarWarsForge2010 Před 21 dnem

    I have a question I like this channel I love your guys' videos but I have to ask using artificial intelligence voice?

  • @viletreeve9120
    @viletreeve9120 Před měsícem +1

    Could they have been made from humans?

  • @nabeehazahir-vk7nn
    @nabeehazahir-vk7nn Před měsícem +2

    sauron created werewoles from melkors wolfs

    • @middleearthtales
      @middleearthtales  Před měsícem +4

      No, it was Melkor who created Draugluin the first of the werewolves, followed by Sauron.

    • @genXdoom72
      @genXdoom72 Před měsícem +4

      Sauron imprisoned evil spirits in wolves, we didn’t create werewolves

  • @Kilthan2050
    @Kilthan2050 Před měsícem

    Dinosaurs. The reference to the origin of the fell beasts implies pteranodons.
    I would imagine he did to dinosaurs what he did to charcaroth, twist and torment and mar and pour his own evil and malice into it. The Silmarillion says he spends his power to make such things, and they diminish him. I would guess he poured more of himself into the dragons than in any other corruption. IIRC, it is after the first appearance of Glaurung that Morgoth is wounded by Fingolfin, and that the wounds do not heal. Like with Sauron and the forging of the One Ring, Morgoth poured too much of himself into the dragons. Clever, cruel, greedy, powerful, and overthrown due to their arrogance and folly, truly their father’s sons.

  • @jasonsoto5273
    @jasonsoto5273 Před 10 dny

    I'm betting on the nameless things. For there always exists a grain of truth in old tales. Why are they called wyrms anyways, and why do they take such offense to it? I think their origin is etched, unreadable deep, but still etched onto every dragon.

  • @ujoel2
    @ujoel2 Před 15 dny

    Or maybe, just maybe, hear me out... Tolkien wanted dragons so he just wrote them in and didn't think more about it.

  • @verilyveronica8430
    @verilyveronica8430 Před 22 dny +1

    Simple.... A Dinosaur.

  • @closeurfacehole
    @closeurfacehole Před měsícem

    I know there’s no evidence to support this at all but I like the idea of dragons being somehow derived from the dwarves lust for gold. Morgoth could have spent a long time manipulating that specific trait and adapting it into a creature that embodies it. Kind of like how a dwarf becomes a dragon in God of War.

    • @MrFantocan
      @MrFantocan Před měsícem

      it is the other way around dwarves get their greedfor gold from dragons that's why they call it the dragon sickness

  • @user-vx9ch6rs1w
    @user-vx9ch6rs1w Před měsícem +1

    you are mistaken.
    They can create life from scratch, as an example yavanna created the Ent, the plants and animals, manwe the eagles, aule created instead mountains, the TREES.
    it was melkor and melkor alone that could not create anything that had life because of his rebellion during the music. Aule was reprimanded for creating the dwarves beacuse he created them BEFORE the sons of iluvatar awoken. And also the dwarves did not shift back to stone where did you read that, they cowered in fear at aule rising his hammer at them, showing free will

    • @jrpipik
      @jrpipik Před měsícem +1

      Originally, the Dwarves had no will but Aule's. They could do nothing without him. Iluvatar was aware that Aule had created the Dwarves in spite of his will and busted him. Aule repented of his hubris, so Iluvatar showed mercy on him and granted the Dwarves full sentience. So when Aule was going to destroy them, they showed fear, as you say, demonstrating their newly acquired free will. But the Dwarves were put into a deep sleep till after Elves and Men had arrived according to Iluvatar's plan.

    • @user-vx9ch6rs1w
      @user-vx9ch6rs1w Před měsícem

      @@jrpipik Eru gave the dwarves his blessing AFTER he ordered Aule to destroy them and not before.

    • @jrpipik
      @jrpipik Před měsícem

      @@user-vx9ch6rs1w Eru never orders Aule to destroy the Dwarves. Reread the chapter.

    • @user-vx9ch6rs1w
      @user-vx9ch6rs1w Před měsícem

      @@jrpipik yes you are right, he does it on his own. still, no blessing yet.

  • @ragnarlothbrok8001
    @ragnarlothbrok8001 Před měsícem

    The fell beasts were made by sauron

  • @user-rw2dq3vp9t
    @user-rw2dq3vp9t Před 28 dny

    i think sauron created werewolves, not morgoth

  • @Typhus-th6ud
    @Typhus-th6ud Před měsícem

    I always assumed rhe eagles

  • @frieza2013
    @frieza2013 Před měsícem

    I don't think mating exclusive to one Valor remember talking to the universe is base more intensely off the Bible and angels can indeed sirer children hints the Nephilim(Giants) so I'm sure a Valor and Maiar could to.
    Also Ungoliant herself was confirmed to be a spirit herself who chose to take the form of a spider probably a Maiar herself

  • @Zathaghil
    @Zathaghil Před měsícem +1

    The eagles idea is, excuse my honest brutality, utterly stupid. Saying that the intelligence part makes it more likely and instantly forgetting the malevolent spirit dragons had with ridiculously powerful abilities, and forgetting about merging things with spirits that quickly? Yeah, dumb. Foregoing in world explanations the real fact is, just like the gates of Moria, Tolkien done goofed. Forgotten the "not able to create life" bit (that wasn't there at the start but he added it because of his own religious beliefs) and simply made him create them. Forgoing that real life bit, ANY reptile, fused with strong evil spirits, molded and strengthened by Melkor's own hands and power is the answer.

  • @SMunro
    @SMunro Před 23 dny

    Ha cant create but he can alter. So dwarves corrupted by treasures? maybe the arkenstone of lonely mountain was not unique? The hearts of many mountains corrupting dwarf lords into dragons?

  • @nmv881
    @nmv881 Před 15 dny

    Video doesn't say alot and that's because....we don't know. There's no canon answer.

  • @Vikingr4Jesus5919
    @Vikingr4Jesus5919 Před měsícem +1

    The theory of fire spirits/fire Maiar embodying a warped creation of eagle is probably the step closest to what really would've taken place.
    I'd like to suggest that Morgoth also used bats. Sauron had a close ally, a female Vampire Bat Thuringwethil, and turned himself into a bat shape to escape Huan. It is not unthinkable that, bats and vampires being an existing creature in Tolkien's world, Morgoth combined the mighty bodies of the Eagles and parts of bats to create these dragonic bodies that then Maiar spirits inhabited.
    It explains their cunning (Maiar spirits are a lower but still angelic order), their physical appearance, and their dreadful potential.
    It's also important to note that in the Silmarillion it's explained how Morgoth only later realized his Orc armies unaided were no match for the Eldar armies. I reckon that was a subtle hint to state when Morgoth began considering the creation of Dragons, as it was during the Siege of Angband that Glaurung, albeit prematurely, charged forth. Why does this matter? Because by this time all other plot points - the creatures of the bats, Maiar spirits, Great Eagles, and Morgoth's ability to manipulate what exists - are already put in place.
    It remains a theory but is the best thing so far. Feel free to share your thoughts on my additional theory regarding the bats.

    • @JudoMateo
      @JudoMateo Před měsícem

      The first dragons of middle earth were flightless though.

  • @Leonykf
    @Leonykf Před 16 dny

    I believe illuvator created dragons, and melkor was strong enough to tamed them and bred them

  • @josephhopkins2851
    @josephhopkins2851 Před měsícem

    I'll like and subscribe but you have to call me Nighthawk.

  • @cgrimes34
    @cgrimes34 Před měsícem +4

    The fact that Sauron never learns about the nameless things does not rule out their possibility of being part of how dragons were created.
    That would assume that Sauron always knew anything Melkor knew. Which is rarely the case in stores where there is a hierarchy of villains. Sauron had his department, just as Gothmog had his. We also know that not all of Utumno was destroyed. Those untouched depths could be where Melkor started working on dragons and Sauron wouldn’t have been involved. Sauron certainly would have eventually known about Glaurung, but that doesn’t mean Sauron would know how Glaurung came to be.
    Melkor could have known of the nameless things and never told Sauron.

  • @eleksisjohnson9736
    @eleksisjohnson9736 Před 28 dny +3

    I dont see the point of a bunch of speculation that cant be resolved nor needs to be. Why do a deep dive on the origins of the dragons if the dragons had no written origins?? A glorified "what-if" scenario that doesnt answer any questions.

  • @edutainme7265
    @edutainme7265 Před měsícem

    No "I am Dragon"? Aw ...

    • @middleearthtales
      @middleearthtales  Před měsícem

      I thought it might be a little weird to say that the video I made about dragons 😀

  • @pierrechildress8875
    @pierrechildress8875 Před měsícem

    Hello Fello Kids. I, another fellow Kid, would like ti relate to u as a fellow human kid. Let's imagine a world where my totally normal human voice would relate to you, fellow kid, as human... (lightening bolt thunderstorm)

  • @user-pq5hq6rd2j
    @user-pq5hq6rd2j Před měsícem

    On his own? Don't.....

  • @erikhamann
    @erikhamann Před měsícem +2

    The eagles are maiar that chose the shape of giant birds.

    • @xhagast
      @xhagast Před 25 dny +1

      And Ungoliath had children. The Maiar could breed without Illuvatar having to get involved.

    • @robertmoog3
      @robertmoog3 Před 7 dny

      They are not Maia. They were created by Manwë

  • @Home_Rich
    @Home_Rich Před 19 dny +1

    AI voiceover and AI art should be punishable by death.

  • @rpghood7231
    @rpghood7231 Před měsícem

    I thought he used the nameless things to create the dragons, seems like a good combo with fire spirits. Explains why they like treasures like gold and gems.

  • @Ipsifendis
    @Ipsifendis Před 13 dny

    allied, not aligned.

  • @Red1Green2Blue3
    @Red1Green2Blue3 Před 13 dny

    The AI voice is somewhat distracting :(

  • @lokdog257
    @lokdog257 Před měsícem +4

    Boo another AI voice