Why don’t you get along with top shooters?
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- čas přidán 30. 06. 2024
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I was on some nationals supersquads pre 2010 and plenty of state/area level supersquads before and after that. This is all straight up 100% accurate. I liked a lot of these guys quite a bit, then the more time I spent around them the more shit I saw that felt slimy as fuck both on and off the range.
I just started shooting about a year ago and guys like you are super fascinating to me. I’m local to an early 00’s GM and he’s very knowledgeable but hesitant to really open up about the differences between now and then. He’s quite humble I guess. Do you shoot any more? If so, is it really any different in terms of average skill or ability? It’s hard for me to tell if practical shooting dying or growing.
@@joie0the standard of shooting has got a LOT higher both overall and the supersquad.
The politics has got to be a big part of the sport, pressuring ROs has always been a thing plus there's always going to be an issue of speed.
The top level will get passes that slower shooters may not because you can't see enough of the incident to be SURE that the foul/penalty being applied is legitimate.
Whereas someone who takes 6 seconds to do what that person did in 2.4 you have the time to spot it.
SOME of the top level EXPECT that sort of courtesy even when they get caught.
@@joie0 I got my gcard in 2005. The last year I was really active shooting some majors was 2018, since then I only shot a few locals and stopped going to uspsa matches entirely when Ben got banned from the sport. I always liked Ben and that shit really irritated me. It still does. I may shoot some matches this year without renewing my membership just because I miss it but nothing serious. As far as skill, there are significantly more good shooters now for sure, but I haven't seen anything that convinces me the top level is much higher if at all than it was 15 years ago. I think practical shooting is primed to grow as there are more people interested in learning how to use their equipment effectively than there ever has been, but the organization's bullshit is substantially curtailing the growth that should be happening.
@@jediknight1294 IF you have the perception that ANY RO would give an unfair advantage to ANY shooter, then NROI has failed miserably.
I was mentored by the best NROI certified people extant at the time. THE #2 thing ROs are taught behind SAFETY of everyone in their charge and on their range is "make the shooting experience as close to identical for EVERY shooter". And that is what we did.
This DID change. NROI, IMO, stopped properly backing staff, and lots of newer staff got lazy or poorly trained, I don't know, but started letting shooters mouth off, be disrespectful, etc.
This became a self-fulfilling prophetic downward spiral... at least for me. IF the shooter's are acting asses with the ROs then it is a SAFETY issue in addition to all of the other considerations.
I told Director, NROI (and anyone else I could get to listen) for YEARS before I finally gave up trying that IF they didn't bring the hammer down on the BS, that it would KILL the org....
Well, the ORG is on Life Support and it's ALL because of a loss of respect for rules and respect for authority.
EVERY shooter these days thinks they are somehow a special little snowflake.
ALL of you.... on both sides of the debacle that has become USPSA are acting like selfish CHILDREN.
Grow the heck up and put the org ahead of your own self-interests for a change.....
Hell, put ANYTHING in front of your own self-interests.... shoot, surprise us old-timers. Show us you have a conscience, good character, and a moral center that is non-wavering.
Same here. Guys past their prime spewing 3 straight days of mind games on younger guys with better skills. Etc
Without camaraderie and fun, the shooting sports are reduced to a game between manufacturers aimed at selling to us as much shooting gear and supplies as possible.
As the old Nascar saying win on Sunday sell on Monday or something like that.
Try golf then, no commercial interests there, it is all pure ;-)
That's why I love outlaw matches. It's all about having fun usually. And then weirdo larp matches like what inrange does. I went to a brutality match once and it was very fun. I think those guys are overrated in a lot of ways their fans are insufferable cucks but I generally think what they're doing is good for the "community" bc it also encourages people to get their fitness up
It’s called being disagreeable. My only problem with disagreeable people is when you are disagreeable to them they get butt hurt. That leads to resentment.
“That’s a double. I couldn’t have missed from that distance” said one of our local IDPA shooters. He quit the sport but we all use that quote to this day.
Funny. I have lots of doubles in practice. I think only once at a match. But it was obviously two hits.
I feel like I’ve said this a time or two. No offense but sometimes even I am surprised I could miss at that distance lol.
I had one of those yesterday with a carbine at an open target less than seven yards. I still can't believe I missed that shot. All As on every other target on that stage( also very unusual for me).
I saw a guy at the state match in Tulsa say that.
ON A SWINGER.
😂😂
I've noticed lately how rude people are on a gun forum that I belong to.
Too often, it's as if it's a bad thing to ask a question firearms related. "Don't be lazy, I'm not googling it for you," "don't ask people to hold your hand," "who's this, a bot?" And, on and on.
When guys get "touchy" or "angry," i see it as being sensitive, like a menopausal woman.
Guys need to learn to get over themselves.
''Google exists, bruh''
And where do those bozos think google gets its answers? That's right, relevant forums!
Time to either look for a different forum or start a thread that's more appropriate for your interests.
Sounds a lot like profesional bass fisherman
LOL, was at 3 gun nationals 2 years ago. I am an amateur not a pro. Asked some squad members on 1st stage about planning…silence and stares! Anyway, they witnessed how I actually shoot, 2nd stage onward they were all pretty kind and helpful when they realized I was not a threat. For me it’s a fun sport, for pro’s it’s serious. We differ greatly in this outlook.
Nice to hear an honest discussion of this taboo subject. Truth is that matches are egotistical shtshws. The bigger the match the bigger the shtshw. I've seen plenty of "Aholery" first hand.
Exact reason I have never partook in any shooting sport aside from the local cmp shoot that has like 4 ppl at it. Only comp shooters I have met are so fucking pretentious and presumptive.
Spot on, Ben. It's one of the saddest, most off putting things in the sport. I started shooting USPSA in the early 90s in Area 4- you know the crew- as a newly minted sheriff's deputy from a parish that has a poorly funded SO but was reasonably well equipped but without sufficient funding for much training. I was ok'ed to carry my pistol of choice- a box stock 90's Edition Springfield. Knowing that getting training provided above what I had already received in the POST academy I started shooting purely for the training value of putting myself under pressure. It turned into a blessing in many ways but I also witnessed precisely what you mention in this video. Some, not all, of the super squad guys were miserable wretches who I don't thinknreally enjoyed shooting generally nor firearms in particular. It was an ego thing and a job. I just enjoyed learning from a numbernof excellent shooters of that generation despite shooting my stock single stack- which was just terrifically reliable- out of my level III Safarlinad duty rig. Thanks for putting up thus vid.
The candor in this 13 minute video is off the charts .
Yep, Ben is a genuine dude. I really enjoy his videos as there is no BS and a lot of subtle humor.
A good example of "famous shooter pressure" is Leatham's late shot at the Bianchi cup. It was late--period. I was standing 50 feet away over his right shoulder. He took off his hat and threw it in disgust. After much discussion it was decided the shot was not late. He finished in a three way tie. If the shot was not allowed there was no drama of a three way tie.
Makes sense. I really appreciate your candor. It gives me, a new/novice shooter, confidence as I watch your training videos and go through your "Practical Shooting Training" book that I am on the right path. Your ability to be self aware is your super power. Thanks for showing the way.
Oh man....some of the things I saw in twenty plus years of shooting action pistol matches. Being in Az you certainly get a chance to see a lot of top tier competitors along the way. I won't give specifics but Ben is spot on about the "Supersquad" level of shooters, just ridiculous how most of them act. I only shoot hit factor matches now with buddies for fun because we are getting older and move slower than these young kids LOL. I have no sponsorship or deals with anybody but I will say this....for me the best person I knew during my competitive phase and still to this day is Angus Hobdell. We haven't been face to face in years now, but I know a lot of people myself included owe him a great deal for his kindness and generosity. Great vid Ben.
Agree, Angus is one of the "realest" guys out there. Way back in 2008-9 we had mutual friends, so I trained with him several times. As a B class shooter I was sucking up as much knowledge as I could from the GM's. He gave me some great tips and was an excellent instructor. Hilarious story teller too.
When I was new to uspsa I started with my g17 then quickly got into cz75. I was local to mesa so I went into cz custom to order up an accu shadow and talked to Angus for like 45 minutes. Very kind and chill man.
Doesn’t matter if they are a top shooter, cop, doctor, school teacher…etc, they are just people and some people are assholes.
Yeah no shit, Sherlock.
The fact you felt like making this comment is evidence of the problem.
@@shebby2525 found another one lol
It’s per capita. Like race and crime. Disproportionately represented. Maybe it’s for a reason.
Some people? HWG is the one
@@BlackDogOriginalsee somalia, detroit, memphis, baltimore, or anywhere else for why they get arrested
Staccato sponsorship for Ben
With an olight
I hope Ben returns to the competition world with staccato and pit viper sponsorships
Olight wouldn't really find a ton of traction with the Staccato audience or with Ben and his viewers.@@bradleyudziela7572
And Remington oil in aerosol cans. So he can just spray the entire gun after each stage.
As a business: sponsoring shooters has never generated ROI for the company.
The only way it’s actually productive is if they generate social media content that encourages sales to a broader audience.
Advertising to the same few hundred to few thousand people that attend the matches the shooter goes to has limited sales potential.
The Humble Marksman did an interview with someone who relayed a story about a top shooter looking for a potential new sponsor, I believe it was Max Michelle. Shooter was I'm like so & so I've won all of these titles. Perspective sponsor asked what the Shooter's social media followers were. When the shooter said not very much, the sponsor pointed to whoever was in their booth signing autographs and was like she has a million followers or something & the person wasn't even a high level shooter. Just some social media influencer. It's all about get views and traffic to the company's products.
@@Just1Guy1000100% different sport but small too. In Jiu Jitsu companies do not care what you have won. They want to see what you can generate for them. It’s not uncommon in our community to see guys who are not that great make a waaaay better living than some world level guys. All because they don’t understand business and how a strong sponsorship relationship works
It's why Jerry has done so well over the years and Taran, they are both very very good at self promotion.
Excellent video.
Enjoyed this
Good discussion, thank you for the info.
Morning tea is the best
😂😂😂😂
Thanks for a peek behind the curtain Ben!!!
People I like shooting with are the ones who prioritize having a good time and just doing a little bit better than their last run. People I hate shooting with are pretentious, sticklers for obscure rules that have nothing to do with safety or fair competition (really just flexing on how well they know the rule book) and are generally just draining to be around. My squad yesterday had 3 or 4 of these 2nd types on it and they just dragged the whole squad down with their negativity, nitpicking and posturing. It was such a contrast to the squad ahead of us that were all very positive, cheering each other on and obviously just having a good time. I made note of the names of the three most insufferable ones and will definitely change squads if I see their names again.
I'm positive and support people but I'm neurotic about the rulebook, I'm an ex pro athlete in a different field so for me rules are live and die because I'm so used to being in an enviroment where rules inconsistencies are the thing that can destroy an event.
I don't apologise for that but I'm not a cock about it.
Classifies not being right annoys the shit out of me because of that. The only way to measure yourself against the rest is the classifiers so when a club puts targets 2 foot closer or a foot to the left is to me a huge deal.
Given that the only value USPSA has to me (vs shooting outlaw matches and not paying fees to a national org) and the range buying more steel and more kit. Is the classifiers.
@@jediknight1294In what sport are the rules more important than fair play & honest competition?
@@jediknight1294 that’s a good perspective and I can definitely appreciate where you’re coming from. In my case, the rule sticklers seemed to be using them selectively as a means of intimidation and asserting their dominance rather than trying to ensure a consistent baseline for accurate evaluation against objective standards. The really ironic part was that the most obnoxious one in the group was only classified as a “C” shooter despite being an RO and claiming all sorts of expertise (at least two of the others were classified as “M” and had the skill to back up their bluster but “Mr. C” was definitely suffering from some “little man syndrome”).
@@nbonner75 I saw that attitude more in IDPA tbh but I K ow what you mean it's just annother tool to be superior for them.
@@jediknight1294 my favorite squad to shoot with at our local club is the retirees that do the stage setup on Fridays before the match. They’ve all been shooting competition for more than 20 years and most are running Open division or Revolver. The lowest classed shooter in the group is an “A” with the others all “M” or “G”. All they do between runs is chain smoke and complain about the cost of their cancer medications. None of them can bend over to pick up the steel targets and carry specially made hooks for that purpose. But when the timer beeps, you’ve never seen old people move that fast!
This is one of the most informative videos I have watched from you, especially from the organized competition side of things. I really appreciate the solid content you are producing.
Your honesty is refreshing. Thank you
I’ve watched a few of your videos; however this is the one that sold me on being a subscriber. Keep doing what you’re doing.
Thanks appreciate the transparency and insight
Great video
"Why don't you get along with top shooters?"
I don't know, maybe because Tony C. thought being SF in a prior life cleared him to be able to alter his scorecard after matches to get his GM status.
Moral of the story: Don't meet your heroes I guess 😂😂😂
This is why I follow Ben. Truth bombs! Thanks for making this video! Now I know what to gun for when i go for that sponsorship, and hopefully remember what to say no to 😂
The best was when you called out the shoot fast pills and headphone/neural training thing that a few top shooters were schilling super hard😅
Shoot fast pills? Lol what?
Totally agree, I've been in other similar situations in other areas of life with the equivalent of supersquad people, and same characteristics are on fully display. Sadly we have lost sportsman like or gentlemanly conduct at high levels of competition.
I have NORI several matches and been challenged to fight. Life threat, and called abusive names, I had to resign for a year. Some of the second class shooters are even worse. Your challenges and feelings are right on in many ways
Is it me or are the amateurs far more invested in it and ego like dude you are winning B class at a sectional not teh Olympics
@jediknight1294 personally I like the overlay calls at level 1's. Cmon dude let's not waste our time if you get the D hit it will make the difference between 5th and 6th C class
🍿
I was an ro for a level 2 match last year that had a few nationals winners and when the super squad was at my stage it happened to be their turn when lunch was over. when i knew they were next i was very curious to see how they would act. the lower guys that were in the squad were definitely not pleasant and wanted to shoot before lunch time was over. but the top three were extremely nice and one of them actually yelled at the others to help reset the stage. this issue is one reason why i have heard that people become an ro only work a few matches and stop. yes there are perks like free match fees and comped hotels but it's not worth the stress.
Very interesting and makes total sense. Keep them coming. We need a solid diet of honest opinion in this sleazy world.
Based af! 👌💯
Being really good at something =/= Being able to teach that something well
Probably because they are competitive and abrasive.
Plenty of competitive people are not abrasive, but put the 2 together and it's a bad mix.
Let's face facts. USPSA/ IPSC is just a game, and like any other game, it draws " A " type personalities. These folks are hyper-competitive, they take themselves very seriously, and start drinking the Kool-Aid with gusto. Money and ego has ruined every sport it touches, this one is no different. There are few that can come away unscathed.
Ive been blessed with pretty really cool and helpful shooters. Ive seen a few of the spandex wearing, competition crawlers. I chalk them up to about the same as Tactical Timmys. I like to slam dunk on them once in awhile but other than that, ill keep my distance.
ya gotta love Ben Steoger no BS just facts like it or leave it, with the skills and trophies to prove he knows what he's talking about
I have been shooting primarily ICORE for the last 10-15 years or so and my experience has been just the opposite. I've been fortunate to shoot on the super squads in ICORE many times (not because I'm super) and I have found most of the top shooters in this sport are very down to earth. Many times I have asked a GM why they shot an array or a stage a certain way and they didn't hesitate to explain their thought process. It has made the matches very enjoyable.
Believe it or not the higher you go in the class the more drama.. 😂
100% accurate
Seen the top tier guys do that a few times. Then watched that mentality come down to the local matches in the last couple years. And being an RO got to the point where there wasn't any enjoyment at a local match so I stopped going. Between more and more people not being willing to help RO or do the tablet to arguing every single call I had enough.
I heard a statement by a top level shooter. He said the super squad is really more about being able to film it for advertising and promotion, not competitive equity. It is hard for shooting USA to cover nationals without the super squad because they would need to follow many squads around to capture the top shooters. All about promo.
I haven't been at this that long but I've seen enough shenanigans by top shooters to make me not follow any. I've seen a top world sponsored shooter get a private day before walk of the stages after the range closed and regular shooters were turned away. Happened right in front of me. We've all seen another top world sponsored shooter, shoot a sister sport, get DQ'd by a well known reason. Argue and get call reversed. Then said org changed the rules to omit rule months later. I've seen yet another top world sponsored shooter get questionable practice runs at nearly identical setups that other people would never get, he won division by in that match by the way. I hope they hang up the trophies they win so they can bask in the glory they created. E.A.D.
I'm GenX and when I was mid adolescent in the mid 1980s we were really into BMX. There was a vacant 1.5 acre lot in the neighborhood, no idea who owned it but it was our neighborhood so being dumbass kids we just assumed it was a common public area and we built a seriously badass full BMX track with starting gates and everything. Couldn't do that now, someone would lose their shit due to liability and insurance. We had a guy in the neighborhood that was legit legit. He was a Skyway guy, really high end frame and rims back then. He got sponsored by Huffy which was a shit BMX company but he took it. Really held him back because he just couldn't get into the equipment but the sponsorship was way too inviting. Figure it's kind of like that with competitive shooters. His interest in the entire sport totally waned, the company treated him like crap, the people over him weren't really very nice to him and they absolutely did not provide him with what he needed to succeed from a travel, expenses, etc.
There’s only a few guys making a living as sponsored pro shooters . It’s their job to promote the companies and be very competitive. Not a shock . It’s just an obvious reality. Dudes at nowhere matches get all hissy and their jobs aren’t on the line . I’ve been lucky enough to train with some of these guys and they were great . They did their jobs and there’s no BS when it comes to the straight up training cause they love shooting . I’m totally for calling out the bros that market their training but don’t have the trophies to back it up - it’s cool not to get along with everyone personally but professionally the super squad guys earned their place thru hard work and deserve whatever they can get from those accomplishments. Same goes for Ben - could care less if he pisses folks off - I’d train with him cause he’s got the hardware and that’s all that matters to me
Sounds like work
Good video. Reminds me of the winner's speech at a Nascar race, "The blah, blah, blah, blah gun ran great"; then 20 minutes of pictures in a different sponsor's hat with the trophy.
Some people refer to it as having a touch of the 'tism or being on the spectrum 😂 hyper focus on one single thing (pistol shooting in this case) and a lack of social prowess
Reminds me of what happened IDPA nationals by a top shooter not too long ago
ooooo do tell.....
Well...what happened I'm curious...please elaborate
Yeah what happened?
Blue ballin us
jj getting DQ'd, then raising hell to get it reversed
So...the "Super Squad" is kind of like "The Clash of the Ego Titans".
The "Super Squad" handle infers a sponsorship from Geissele Automatics. 😂
my worst experiences are when competitors tries to get the RO in they're way so they can demand a reshoot, i wish they had like a backup stage so it wasn't so beneficial to get a reshoot, running the course twice is a huge advantage.
I find most people I’ve run across in the sport to be nice. Of course there’s always a “hall monitor” though. The guy that can’t just chill out and have fun. Barking orders at everyone and quoting the rule book for no reason.
Agreed.
The biggest issue seems to be that too many people forget they are playing a game.
Yep you just described a lot of professional sports and a lot of professional athletes. Similar deal across mediums.
Is Ben the Holden Caulfield of guns?
So Tanfoglio is 100% good to go?
I shoot sandlot IDPA , we have a lot of fun. No one ever wins a Cadillac. It’s not sanctioned, scores don’t really affect your standing. All the safety rules are enforced- but it’s about learning and fun. It’s only the level I care about. I’ll never be a top level shooter- couldn’t care less.
Just like the record companies. They offer the deal, give u the money for recording and promotion. Great put the product out and your job is to tour and make people by your shit, and if u don’t cut it, the label will drop u and u have to pay all the money and gear back and usually from what I’ve seen the company will sue u.
I’ve seen a top guy argue a dq and get it reversed. He AD inside 10’ and when the RM came up here argued that it should be measured from the rear fault not from where j he actually fired it from.
👍
As far as sponsorship deals pro shooters are so far down the ladder, Tiger Woods accepting a 6 figure deal with Nike to play their new clubs was huge, balancing the money with his place in the game? He obviously made it work.
You think it sucks being on the super squad? Imagine just being a regular dude stuck on the squad behind them. At least there are no mirrors in the bays or you'd never get them to move on.
With this sport being a mixture of pros/amateurs/hobbyists, you are always gonna have people shooting for different reasons.
I am thankful that in this sport I can stand there and watch a top pro shoot, and maybe even squad with them. As a hobbyist, I always try to respect that this sport means a lot more to some people and that their hard work and resulting proficiency lends a LOT more weight to their opinions than mine.
At any rate, the vast majority of top shooters I have had the pleasure of meeting or shooting with have been real cool and super generous with their knowledge.
Based on my observations over many, many years, what you just said was a LIE. I suspect it is STILL a LIE.
@@ClayAutery Huh?
@@davereloader8837 said, "Imagine just being a regular dude stuck on the squad behind them. At least there are no mirrors in the bays or you'd never get them to move on."
The "Supersquads" that I ran over many years were CONSISTENTLY the most efficient and helpful shooters on the whole range. Sometimes a "prima dona" (or don) would come along thinking they were too important to help.... Generally, the other SS members would square that away pronto.
But what you said was an absolute LIE by my observations. And I suspect that I have had much more observation time than you on so-called "supersquads".
Don't like shooting behind the supersquad? Suck less; shoot better; be ON the supersquad.
@@j.r.autery1062 It was a JJ Racaza joke bro. If you were JJ wouldn't you stare at yourself in a mirror? Lighten up. Practically my whole post was a glowing review of top shooters and how super cool they are. If you are a top shooter I'll make an exception for you though, champ.
@j.r.autery1062 you seem like the exact type of person Ben was ragging on, minus the elite level shooting 😂
Kinda like the healthcare work environment. I get it
Max and Sig?
This makes sense as the dynamic is true for any professional sports. Ever watch a Premier League Soccer match?
Pro golfers get paid millions and have more integrity than top USPSA shooters. What does that say about the kind of people we have in this sport?
That’s not a fact. Are you cnn?
Golfers have 100+ years of competition history, knowing they are semi-athletes. Action shooting is where non athletes try to be 3-sport All American tier, in their minds.
Gun guys are usually really beta. The more tacticool the sport they're in, the more beta.
Lots of sports are like this at the top. I have had my issues in another sport
It happens in every sport and I can't stand it. I had a few sponsors, including a bigger named kayak company that wanted me to push their new kayak. It was complete garbage and I couldn't. I'd never take a sponsor again. I'd rather pay out of pocket and be free to tell someone not to buy garbage. It feels gross not being able to tell someone the truth.
so you're implying JJ Racaza doesnt actually like beretta?
Who the hell does? They are fine for service but why would you ever buy one for comp?
Pretty sure there is no love lost between Ben and JJ. Look at some of the products JJ has been sponsored by. I suspect more than a few of these comments direct JJ’s way.
@@glefos3917 damn bro, its almost as if Nils was also forced to shoot Canik....
2 of them are both very good at shooting and shilling
@@ryanaulia4840Canik is actually not a bad gun though. I don’t like them because they’re ugly but they shoot well.
Not as nice as walthers, the guns they copy.. lmao
No reason to buy Canik. @swiftaudi
We should foster a culture of aggressively bullying people to attempt to cheat and are the type to ask for perfect doubles all the time. Make them quit.
Turning your hobby into a job is always a disaster.
What about when somebody breaks the 180 then arbitrates and gets the stage thrown out! A stage I did well on !
2009 Nats. In Vegas.
A- holery 😂
13:00 yeesh fuck that I wouldn’t even be around those people
The gate keeping is pretty spectacular too. In a video here on CZcams, Nils posted a vid about the recent production 15. He asked for comments and so I did. I said, Prod and CO should be same with 15rd limit and weight limits. Not only did he disagree with me, but everyone else that said something similar. The truth is, CO is 90% LO. I could have interpreted his statements wrong but I don’t think so. After watching this video, now I recognize that I was advocating for putting his new rival-s in LO vs CO.
CO? LO?
@@overbuiltlimited carry optics which is supposed to be a production(out of the box) gun with a red dot. And limited optics which is supposed to be a mildly modified or customized gun.
@@joie0 Thanks
I have been saying since LO was first announced that LO is what CO was trying to be and have always said that CO should just be production optics. I agree 100% with what you said.
@@GRS9790 not to shift the topic here. Most will say LO is dumb and I don’t think so. I actually think CO is the issue. The spirit of the name is about carry guns. That’s what it should be. P365, s&w shield, Glock 43x and so on. Even Sig is trying to bring USPSA/IPSC to the carry gun world. I digress.
Some people are hard core competitors. Whatever competition they do, they are there to win. Frustration can bring out the worst when things aren't going well. If you get lunch with them afterwards you will probably find out they relax and are a good dude.
Super squad is several pro athletes competing for one title. Of course most don't get along.
The masses are asses
So jj racaza for sure lol. Max michel and nils most likely.
Ben this is why I love you. While I disagree with some of your comments towards other instructors and their methods of teaching, I respect that you’re so honest and blunt, and I prefer that over some pompous ahole know it all shill that is just in it for the money.
I suppose you could title this "top drivers", "top ball players", etc. People suck. Especially the competitive ones, and the millions that approach everything as a team sport. As long as their team wins, anything goes. If you're a salesman, you'll be forced to lie on occasion. Perhaps daily. It's not really a topic worthy of discussion. It's the way it is, always has been, and always will be.
I think he’s dose well with top shooters . Unless people are referring to tu Lam or Mike glover than yeah I wouldn’t either .
Neither Tu Lam or Mike Glover are "top shooters" lol. I'm pretty sure they don't even shoot competition.
I see a dood that's a B class shooter pull these antics. So annoying and everyone knows. Keep doing you Ben,
Self funding! Is there another way?
This sport is tough and is very clickie for sure….and it’s true about just putting a persona and a lot of jealousy also goes on in uspsa I would say….
"Clique" not "click".
@@thoselog gracias 🙏🏼
I used to shoot USPSA. And when I did we had one of those super squad guys that was part of the club and shot the local matches. Yeah, he was a jerk. Like a total A-hole. People would say his first name, and then he's an A-hole. Pretend his name was Bob. Whenever somebody would refer to him it was always, "Bob, he's an a-hole." Anyone seen Bob, the a-hole? How did Bob, he's an A hole do on the stage. He toned down his attitude the last couple years and I see him at GSSF matches and he's all shilled out.
just don't ruin my image of Jerry. lol
Then don’t ask around.
I haven't heard anything bad about Jerry, but I have heard that his daughter Lena is a piece of work. A dude who refused to identify himself, but who seemed to strongly imply that he was her ex-husband, posted on reddit that his former wife was pretty abusive during the relationship and that he was happy to have her out of his life. Who knows if it's true, but I can't take Lena seriously anymore.
@@Seseous You need to not be talking about shit you have no idea about. Gossip will get you in trouble.
I do mainly self-defense training, practice and shooting. I shoot with the mindset of self-defense and not competition. A very good friend of mine tried to get me to shoot at local competitions for fun and to try to challenge myself more. I went to a local competition with him one weekend as a spectator just to check it out. Now, these weren’t high level shooters by any means or anyone that’s well-known in the “gun industry“. In fact, I don’t think there was a single sponsored shooter competing that weekend. And after witnessing the childish fits that many of these entitled guys were throwing and watching the schoolyard bullying attempts and backstabbing talk that was going on, no thank you! I have better things to do with my time and in my training than to listen to a bunch of whining, entitled Karen’s pissing and moaning their way through a competition to try to win. And for what? A plastic trophy or a piece of paper that says that they won that insignificant competition? No thanks! I prefer to hang around with people with a more practical, real world mindset of training and not guys that have refused to grow up since high school.
+1
Why would I pay for that kind of experience
It's unfortunate you had that type of experience. I haven't gone to an official USPSA match but local small scale indoor matches in Houston have been nothing but a pleasure. Most of the people are super friendly and willing to help out the new guys.
Your friend was trying to do you a favor to go and actually shoot a match. You focused on the wrong thing.
Same experience and they would not stop asking about my background.
@@wongkeebs4327 awesome! I wish I had that experience at the competition. Maybe it was a one off and I may try to attend another one to see if it’s any different. I agree that many shooters and instructors are friendly and helpful. I have run into a lot of very helpful shooters and instructors during self-defense training and classes. I just think that a lot of these guys that want to compete, in my area anyway, are much better in their own minds than they actually are in real life. And their ego makes them extremely unpleasant to be around. I may try again though someday.
I can’t imagine how painful it would be to be around Ben if you had a fragile ego, sensitive feelings and were habitually dishonest. 😂
Those people know not to engage. I’ve seen it first hand.
Interesting, i interacted with a few sponsored shooters at matches and got the impression they were fake but i didn't know it went that deep. Makes sense to me they have that corporate demeanor, i have to be that way at work. You have to be politically correct and courteous while also doing shitbag things sometimes to make sale, quota or whatever. It is a job to them.
how many gun companies has tilley been sponsored by?
every time he gets a new gun sponsor, they are the best, obviously he is a whore pimping whoever pays him, I would never buy or use anything based off of a sponsored shooter.
I have seen RMs give away hits based on who the shooter was, more often than not the RM will bend in favor of a sponsored shooter.
Look at what happened with JJ at his 1st IDPA Nationals, he DQd they put him back in and had some very suspicious edits so he would win, when you shoot for the Sponsor of the match, you are going to win, no matter what.
I’ve enjoyed the camaraderie of our sport and often say I’ve met way more assholes on golf courses. However, I really only concentrate on improving my own game…I’m my toughest critic. Competition makes us better though…’As iron sharpens iron, men sharpen each other’…even the occasional sociopath can drive improvement.
So if the value of a sponsorship in most cases is minimal and they are cheating in some cases, what is the motivation? A bigger pile of nothing? Awesome. Frankly I have no idea who you are but these videos are entertaining.
Lots of A type personalities all aiming to be number 1 ? Yeah lots of abrasions!
Bc most people are douchebags.
I keep hearing that Ben is apparently an asshole, and Im always surprised. Ive listened to you since you were on Ballistic Radio back 2016-2017 and never once heard him be that way. 😆🤷♂️
Of course people dont like you, all you teach is 'stay target focused and shoot faster!' 😂
...and it works....
your mic is really quiet and the commercials come on SUPER FUCKING LOUD bro.