Why Fyendal's Spring Tunic is Going to be Banned - Steelfur Speaks - FAB TCG
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- čas přidán 23. 08. 2024
- In this latest episode of Steelfur Speaks, we give you the main piece of evidence that indicates a ban is in the works for Fyendal's Spring Tunic. Disagree? Tell me why in the comments.
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There has been a trend for 2.0 of Legendary chest pieces being created en masse for all sorts of classes. I think LSS is trying to give more options that will flesh out when we have more cards that synchronize with those chest pieces as the game evolves. All in all, feels like a short term situation that we won't view the same in a few years.
I understand your logic behind Flamescale, but I feel like it's the perfect "answer" to FST.
Flamescale is an in-class L chest, makes resources, and blocks.
I understand that maybe it isn't "as valueable" in terms of resources, but I think it is in that perfect range of something filling the role of FST while being uniquely different. If Trench was closer to Flamescale, I would be THRILLED.
Trench is incredible in riptide, who’s a very slept on and often miss played hero. Some of the lines trench enables are insane, especially with códex of frailty. I think so much of this game has yet to be really unlocked
Opinion?? If Tunic gets banned, do you think financial value of the card drops due to the banning or does it stay we're it's at due to it being so iconic?🤔
In the short term yes. In the long term living legend gets established as the legacy format and has some decent tournaments/prizes and tunic maintains value as a playable and a collectible from the early game.
The printing of crown of providence leads me to believe LSS does not have plans in the short term to ban tunic. If this was their plan, the lesson learned from tunic would be to limit the power on generic equipment to increase diversity of load outs. Given they have printed a card that is so so obliquely powerful and widely sees play, I do not believe they have the opinion that tunics existence is problematic.
I’m not saying whether that is right or wrong of LSS, I think it’s uncontroversial to say tunic is prohibitively expensive for too many people.
Side note: a format where generic legendary equipment is banned would be cool to see.
That is somewhat fair, though it feels like head pieces is already more contested than chest
Heh this came up in my feed - FST reprinted in Bright Lights os only reason for me to buy
One can Hope not. It's the card that launched a thousand pummel decks
Funnily I'd count that as one of the strongest reasons to get rid of it.
@@gorganiangranola pummel is a good card to have. And potentially better to threaten. IMO it gives an onhit that must be respected to classes that may not have a lot of them and thus no reason to block. I think the periodic reduction of one card cost can allow players to come back.
NOOOOO.
I just pulled one this week out of a history pack 1 box.
It’s okay. It’s not going to get banned soon. Just Eventually.
The eventually part is what's getting me.
If I had to guess, I'd also think they're waiting for living legend format to be a thing, and that's the place where they expect tunic to still be played. They've stated multiple times that they want cards to keep value, and the value of tunic would tank if it became illegal in the only formats.
Exactly. They are just lining it up to soften the impact. Hey you can still play it in LL. Hey you have all these alternatives.
I feel like trench missed to mark. It only really sees play as AB1 or in riptide to let him salvage an arsenal that's blocked up with a trap.
I don’t think it will be banned, I think they will either try and print better chest equipment that is more class or hero specific, or they will slowly reprint more copies of it to lower the cost slowly over time. Just my take.
I think they will give better chests for classes but the power creep isn’t happening yet. The issue is that as long as tunic holds points over a class chest and wins events people will want those points.
@@SteelfurSpeaks agreed. Unless they do more in the next couple sets to try and correct, without over correcting, tunic will just continue to set at 200+ or higher. For being so highly playable as far as being generic and the massive upside it brings it’s hard not to see it as something that won’t go away and will continue to be a thorn in the side of players that want to be competitive without breaking the bank
If tunic is banned, i would expect meta relevant chest pieces to skyrocket.
So you might not spend 200 for a generic, but you'll spend 200 across 2-3 heroes.
Idk tunics perfectly fine, just too expensive.
There have been a lot more printings, more are Majestic and not everyone plays each class.
I can not see why this needs to be banned. Lots of decks and classes are successful without it. My understanding is it isn’t to be reprinted. Tunic is also a key piece every class can use but again doesn’t necessarily need. What would be accomplished by banning this card.
LSS already said they will never ban a legendary, they stated as such a few months ago regarding crown of seeds.
I remember them saying they were really reluctant to. Do you have a quote for them saying they would never?
Not to argue that it should or shouldn't be banned, but I think you have a logical fallacy in that you make the statement "if LSS is going to ban Tunic, they won't power creep it", which may be true, but then you incorrectly assume the logical converse is also true, i.e "if they don't power creep Tunic, they're going to ban it." There could be many other causes for why they haven't power crept Tunic, for example keeping the power level of the meta in check or keeping the value high for collectors, which would contradict the idea of them banning it.
I don’t know if I would call it a logical fallacy. It’s just a one possible conclusion of the evidence provided. I mean I have a philosophy degree and honestly. It’s not that deep. It’s just a conclusion based on evidence. It doesn’t require any leap of logic at all.
They might not ban tunic for the reasons you laid out. But keeping a card value high for collectors at the detriment of the competitive scene doesn’t really sound like a good idea.
Sorry, logical fallacy might be the wrong phrase but an error in logical equivalence. The original statement (if p, then q) of "if they're going to ban, then no power creep" makes total sense (why would they ban a card if nobody uses it because there's more powerful versions), so let's say that's true. That also means the contrapositive (if not q, then not p) is true: "if they power creep, they're not going to ban." However, it doesn't make the converse true (if q, then p). The next thing that's mentioned is the inverse (if not p, then not q) of the original statement, "if no ban, they will power creep," as if it logically follows the original statement being true, but the inverse isn't true unless also proven true, and based on what I said earlier, there may be other reasons why they don't want to power creep Tunic. The inverse is logically linked to the converse, which is what the video is based on, i.e. "if there's evidence that they aren't power creeping, then they're going to ban Tunic." You didn't provide reasoning for why either the inverse or the converse was true, so even though you showed that they're not power creeping Tunic, it doesn't prove that they're going to ban Tunic.
Spring tunic is overrated, never needed one for my dromai/fai (flamescale), vis/briar (ironweave), benji (vest), bravo (tectonic), dori/boltyn/kassai (courage), and best of all kano's robe, I could kill opposing hero even before their first action card resolves when I go first, spring tunic cant do that, only the robe
IF YOU CANT WIN IN LESS THAN 9 TURNS YOU BUILT YOUR DECK WRONG!
So two things, firstly, part of my point in the video is that the process of giving alternatives to tunic has already started, the options you listed are some of those. Remember that tunic is a set 1 card, everything that has come since is a reaction to that.
Secondly, given that most major tournaments are not won in 9 turns, and oldhim won the most recent after a 2 hour grindfest top 4. I would ask you yo come join us at the CC table, its fun up here.
I like how you go about this but I think you overestimate them.
James has had a pretty unsatisfying view on CNC prices in an interview once and Bryan also called prices for tournament staples arbitrary if you're that deep into the hobby.
They might reprint them (and they urgently should) but I think they will be content with a price high enough for people to rightfully whine about.
I don’t know that I do. I think they are super in tune with all of the things happening in the game. Everything is a decision. I’m just trying to predict it
No tunic reprint. It's in History Packs. Crown of Providence reprint though...
No one opens enough history packs to meet market demand, and it’s one of so few legendaries that it’s hard to open. Rest of the set isn’t worth enough. It could have a reprint and still hold. Value.
It's been in at least 3 sets I think, and I keep trying and can't get one, or my damn mask of momentum, almost anything good and I'm 5 boxes in probably 6 or 7 after random boosters too...got boxes of the first both sets even and my Arc box was worth like 20 bucks and my WtR wasn't awesome either.....ughhh
You sir, must have studied at the oxford school of spicey thumbnail school. 👌
Or just like canva
I massively disagree that tunic is getting banned. The flexibility of tunic and the exact design of it is something that is woven into the fabric of the game, and I think LSS would rather print it into the ground so that is accessible rather than ban it. The fact that you can hit so many resource break points with it, that almost no other card can replicate without being a functional reprint of tunic or is a strictly better version. You can argue that you can just ban it and have every class have an alternative, but the function of the chest piece will change so much that a lot of decks will simply cease to exist in their current form and function, and I would argue that is worse for the game than having one $250-300 piece that you only need one of and you can switch between most decks
I would argue that tunic makes hitting those resource break points too easy. It enables things to be smooth where there should be some friction. You shouldn’t just be able to play a 4 cost card with 1 pitch every 3 turns. That breaks a fundamental cost analysis of the game and limits the design space hard
@Steelfur does it mean that the game is broken if literally every deck has access to it? And a handful of decks as you mentioned have cards that are better in one way or another. I think a better solution is just to make more cards that are situationally better than tunic but are not strictly better, like husk or like a fixed bloodsheath skeleta, if it was blade break rather than temper or something
@@jacewilliamson4698 the issue with that approach is that tunic is always there. Competitive players and games come down to the wire; and if there are a few points to be gained between say playing a tunic or playing something else. Competitive players will want the tunic. That means that there is effectively a money gate in there between serious competitive players and others.