Overall, I enjoyed the episode...BUT I could've done without Tyland negotiating with the Triarchy. I mean, it's an odd choice to show us THAT, but we only got ONE scene with Jace & Cregan Stark and NO scenes of Jace negotiating with Lady Jeyne Arryn.
@@joeschmo4646 and you know what’s the worst part about daemon tripping the whole time? The entire point was to knock down his ego a peg and convince himself that he should support his wife, but they throw all that out the window just to make him of a vision that tells him he has to. He doesn’t bring himself to, his god damn vision does. The whole tripping balls thing was all for nothing
@@joeschmo4646 Three eps spread out would have been enough, with some minor time-skips- & two of the visions/ trips were completely unnecessary, imo; the one with his mother was a shark-jump moment- & the last one with Viserys, too on the nose -- I'm all for him having introspection & renewed purpose, but they went overboard with it - & that's only _one_ issue with this season...
Rhaenyra’s arc this season was frustrating. They ended season 1 with her looking like she was going to wreak havoc. Then she spent the first three episodes of season 2 tiptoeing around trying to prevent the war that was already happening. The show acts like this is a good thing, and rather that her advisors are in the wrong for trying to get her to act. Stupid. Then when she finally acts, she falls right into a trap and gets her best fighter and dragon killed. When she’s rightfully called out on it, she smacks the guy. Jace secures the Freys, and via them a realistic way to bring the Northmen south. Then it’s he who comes up with the idea for other dragon riders which, although initially a failure, causes Seasmoke to go find Adam and starts in motion the dragon seeds. Then, Daemon comes around to Rhaenarya only because Alys Rivers conspires to make it so. On all fronts, Rhaenarya practically fails into success, which is frustrating. All this time we have Mysaria telling her how great she is. I’m pretty sure Mysaria, as a character, exists to the writers to tell us all how great Rhaenarya is, since she’s literally done nothing great so far. How about SHOW us she’s great, instead of tell us? Then they altered Alicent’s character to pure evil by changing her from someone who cared deeply for her family (even though she’s a terrible mother) into someone who betrays her entire family in order to be free of her own guilt and consequences. Feels a lot like this was done to make Rhaenarya look good and virtuous by comparison. The writers are CLEARLY on team Black, which is unfortunate.
This! I feel like the whole prophecy thing is also a cheap way of making Rhaenyra look good. She’s not taking the throne because she wants power, she’s doing it because of a vague destiny she know nothing about. This way when she does go to war and ultimately kills many innocents it will be justified because it’s all part of some bigger picture. This is just lame writing. In the books both teams clawed for power only to bare that it wasn’t worth it in the end, which would have been much better and more human than team green bad team black good type bs
She decided to save her family at the cost of Aegon's head rather than seeing her entire family getting burnt to ashes. Wow! So bad writing. Definitely on the same level as Jaime's!
@@rajveerdholan8291 dude killing Aegon and have Rhaenyra in King's Landing will not end the conflict nor spare her entire family from death... you get it, right?
corlys... the sea snake.... has never set sail on screen over two seasons. The one time he did it was off screen and he almost died lmao. He was named hand and immediately left dragonstone to chill with the blockade. He just gets yelled at by his kids all season 😂
@@baron6588 first of all I said we haven't seen him sail on screen... which is Still true... and second learn how to count maybe cuz over the course of two seasons.... means all of season one... and all of season two
They'd best give us the battle of the gullet, the battle on the honey wine, the fish feed, Rotty the ruin and his winter wolves vs criston cole, the battle of tumbleton and end it off with The God's Eye in season 3.
@@KingSlayer_. I would guess that they either open with battle of the gullet or its mid season finale and season finale is Daemon vs Aemond above God's Eye
GoT writing syndrome: Step 1) Write show as a faithful retelling of GRRM work. It's massively successful and everybody loves it. Step 2) Let the success go to your head and start thinking you arw a better writer than GRRM. Step 3) Start changing things from the source material for no reason. Cut characters, merge plot lines, etc. Step 4) Show goes to crap. Rinse and repeat.
Bruh if they actually did cut Nettles....i was waiting for her to show up this entire season. But it seems like her character is merged with Rhaena for some reason..
@@Bob-ed8hc likely the writer/actor strike. Either way it was HBO's decision and not the show runners. They said a few times in BTS interviews that it wasn't "their choice" which sucks because I agree, as an episode 8 of 10 this episode is awesome but it falls short as a finale. I was reading that apparently the cut to 8 episodes caused some script rewrites as well.
I'm glad you call it for what it was, cringe. So many watchers found it funny and I'm left like ??? It was super weird. And pointless. Also, I felt Abigail's acting was subpar, though maybe it's because I know her outside of House of the Dragon. But I also knew Olivia (who she was and her work, I mean) before HOT D and she blew me away. So I feel like Abigail's lack of acting skills is just her own lack of experience.
I didn’t find it cringy. It wasn’t as important but it definitely wasn’t cringy. I love watching someone as pompous and bratty as Tyland be completely out of his element
@@dreamday988 I ship them so I wanted the same. Even if I didn't how do the two most powerful people in the world have no interactions? Oh wait nvm this is good writing I forgot lol
Season 1 ended with a Rhaenyra death stare Season 2 started with Rhaenyra hugging trees and wanting peace to protect "ze peepol"" I don't care if the season ended before the fall of King's Landing, I just wanted the characters to be consistent and INTERESTING. Rhaenyra was so f*cking boring this season
Sara Hess constantly thinking she knows better than GRRM, first in 1x09 (Rhaenys murdering hundreds without consequence instead of Sunfyre and Dreamfyre flying above KL), then in 2x08 (Alicent!!!! selling out her family, the ones she fought for the most) is getting on my nerves. Did she forget she wrote Alicent stepping in front of Meleys for Aegon?? Hess can't even stay consistent within the few episodes she actually wrote. Nonsensical development.
You know she isn’t the ONLY writer, right? It’s a team of people deciding major plot beats and decisions and THEN she takes one of the episodes over. Also - she isn’t the freaking show runner. If there’s a major issue, that’s on Ryan Condal to fix
Sara Hess has proven herself a menace. I gave her the benefit of the doubt in Season 1 because of the overall quality of the show, but a lot of stuff she has said in interviews is concerning, and the two silliest episodes of the show are hers (Season 1 Episode 9 and Season 2 Episode 8).
Ti Mikkel had writing credits for many of these episodes. She's also the keeper of the lore and researcher. If you were to blame anyone for straying too far from lore, why not start with Mikkel?
We had to suffer through 6 episodes of Daemon just hanging out at Harrenhal, and despite all the supposed introspection, he had NO character development. They crammed all of his "development" into a single scene where he sees the future, which is an unbelievably lazy way to change a character.
Yep and it goes against the character and the supposed development he went through if they had him bend the knee then see the vision then it would be better
It felt like episode 4 was the true finale, and the last 4 episodes were just a preview for Season 3. The last 4 episodes were just all build-up. Also, too many shows/movies are getting too comfortable with the "come back for more next season" sequel bait set ups.
@@SilverShadowwHonestly if they switched things around slightly and switched endings her scaring off Aemond and having the dragons roar behind her would have been a sick finale ending.
There is no tension or stakes in this conflict, I feel nothing. Everything is "oooh noo, oopsie theres a war now! Oh no, I really didn't want this. I don't want to do anything. Oh shucks."
YES. Alicent and Rhaenyra keep having the same damn conversations. This makes it seem a lesbian rage soap opera rather than a character driven show. There seems to be almost no logical development with the characters. It seems rushed, like the budget is dictating more than we realize
Yeah I really don't care what happens now. The characters are so inconsistent that none of their conflicts are compelling. On top of that, I never read Fire and Blood, and I have enjoyed experiencing the show while being ignorant of the major events that are to come. But the a**hole writers just straight up told me in this episode that Rhaenyra wins and Aemond dies. How can there be any tension now? Why did they throw in visions of the future and spoil their own story?!?!
"Clearly" you just want cool action scenes and dragons! There is no way you want these characters to actually develop that isn't linearly! - Literally every fucking gaslighting shill for this season
Absolutely whats the point of making you characters "good" and making bad or stupid choices from air Is a Fanfic to this point, the characters should move Accord to them beliefs not the writers ones
That's exactly what they twisted the dance into, peaceful women vs evil war men. Girls clearly good, boys clearly evil. I'd give GRRM props if he just pulled the rights of this show under HBO after this shit show
I mean the side without the women is the explicitly misogynistic side that rejects Rhaenyra because she's a woman. You really figured a lot of women would be keen to support the side that wants to ensure they never hold power?
I really don’t understand why they’re so hell bent on constantly referencing the most atrociously underwhelming storyline from game of thrones with Aegon’s Dream & the White Walkers. Like even if it wasn’t awfully wrapped up in season 8, there’s nothing this show could do to have any impact on what has already happened in a show that’s already finished airing years ago
Especially since we all know it's completely meaningless to this show because it's not going to occur for the next 160 years. So characters being motivated by something we know is meaningless is just terrible.
It's about how Targaryens use this prophecy to justify war and their actions and the down fall that prophecys and not understanding them bring . They litterally see themselves as blond reborn Jesus and the main characters . That shapes their characters and I feel its an important theme in the show. So I would say it's a way to characterize the characters. What will really happen is not that important
I kinda like the idea that the song of ice and fire was used as some sort of motivation for Targaryen monarchs to unite the realm by passing this prophecy from generation to generation. But since the events of dance of dragons, none of the later kings heard the prophecy and it became kinda lost in time. That's why when the white walker actually arrived, no one was prepared and the realm was divided and in war with itself. What I'm not that into however is using that as a mean to get Daemon back with Rhaenyra. The show did a solid job at giving him a little character arc with all the hallucinations in Harrenhaal and turning him into a somewhat more decent person. That whole part with the visions at the end was kinda pointless.
@@andreeab3116 While I don’t disagree with you, it’s cheap to use that as a way to cushion up your protagonist. It just makes Rhaenyra more boring by painting her as the “chosen one”.
This is 100% a "higher up" decision. The idea is to retroactively connect the shows with a unifying storyline, like a "Marvel cinematic universe" but for Westeros. They saw the popularity of GoT, and now they have like 5 spinoffs in the works or approaching completion. Like it or not, they are definitely trying to make GoT a "cinematic universe," with multiple movies and shows all connecting together, and get a piece of the Marvel pie.
Written by the third writer who wrote later seasons of GOT by the way D&Ds protege Ryan Condol people need to wake the fuck up and realise whatever this guy touches is fucking diabolical. He became the main show runner this season and look what happened…
As a finale, yes it was disappointing. I think they cut 2 episodes due to budgetary reasons. They were supposed to show the battle of the Gullet in episode 9. I hope WB give them more budget for S3.
but in the world, we must defend our own.” - alicent hightower 1x06 “If Rhaenyra comes into power your very life could be forfeit Aemond as well”-Alicent. Alicent killing her whole family is evil
@akchanneltv4084 I think they really needed to show us Alicent feeling desperate instead of just abandoning everything and letting her kids die. Like give us a scene where she tried to petition Aegon to get up and take back power but he tells her off like BADLY. Which sees her rejected by everybody except Halaena, and Aegon is clinging to Larys more.
I hate that Aemond burned Sharp Point and they gave it barely any screen time or importance. He went from morally questionable and conflicted to just straight up irredeemable and we're supposed to believe that's what we should expect to happen. Earlier this season, his lover told him "When princes lose their temper, it's the smallfolk who suffer." Where's his guilt? Why did he have no problem burning thousands for nothing? He didn't want to kill Luke and Aegon was abusive towards him. This feels like a massive change in character and it only compounds on the problem of the show sidelining Aemond's development in favor for filler.
It doesn't seem at all out of character, the lover who was trying to warn him that small folks suffer is also the first person he dropped when his ego is threatened by his brother's bullying That is a fragile ego that would lead to him burning an entire town just because his Authority was questioned, considering we had seen him call the small Council just a few episodes prior because they were questioning his authority
The conversation between Alicent and Rhaenira would have been much better if they hadn't met in episode 3. It is ludicrous how they kept going back and fort to each other during the whole season.
Idk, I think it sucked regardless. Alicent selling out her kids and then you have Rhaenyra acting like she would escape with Alicent if it wasn't for her responsibilities. The whole conversation somehow ignores that each side killed sons and grandsons. Alicent straight up forgets her grandson died.
How is it ludicrious? If small folk can get to Dragonstone, then why can't Alicent? If Herlinda?? can sneak into King's Landing then why can't Rhaenyra.
@@BhBc8f8because they’re high royalty. Whose going to notice some random travellers, but ones a queen dowager and the other a queen. Not exactly nobodies. Stop praising garbage writing.
@@okaysxo If people in 2021 didn't recognize Taylor swift with a hat on then there's absolutely no way people in medieval times would recognize Rheanyra in a septa's outfit.
@@SNAKERAKES she was a great and strong character because of the season 1, not because of the books, so i guess it makes sense to question why she had this weird (and weak ?) story arc in season 2.
@metasua it's kind of funny because after S1 people were complaining about the attention shown to alicent as in the books she's not really a major player. Yet in season 2 when she's shown to not have that much power people than complain that she does nothing. That was literally the whole point...she goes from being the queen to just being some forgotten woman who's able to free herself from the entire game . Character arc doesn't mean - weak character becomes incredibly strong.. Sometimes it's the opposite.
@@willbaker6532The problem is not her inactivity, the problem is logic. Selling her children to the butcher like that requires more than that seen. Hell She never even mentioned how a son for a son had already been done.
@@TheCandyHole You mean Aegon, the guy who never wanted to be king and had his arm twisted into it by his mother who was completely mistaken about Viserys’s intentions, who got roasted by his own brother in battle, lamed and traumatized. That guy? He’s honestly less evil than Daemon.
I cannot believe people are saying this is a good episode in a vacuum, when it has managed to put the nail in the coffin of Alicent's and Rhaenyra's characters. They took two powerful, cunning, ruthless and strong-willed matriarchs and turned them into whiny, meek cardboard cutouts of their former selves. Ironically, the showriters end up proving the misogyny of the rest male characters right: Alicent abandons her sons and father and sells out her family to the enemy because apparently she just loves Rhaenyra so much. Aemond was 100% correct in removing her from the council because "she harbours love for the enemy". Rhaenyra continues to sit around and complain that no one takes her seriously when all she does is sit around and ask people "wHat wOuLD yOu hAvE mE Do". Her council is 100% correct in doubting her ability to lead, her inaction has already cost them enough. The writers seem to be completely allergic to allowing women to do anything morally reprehensible, prefering in turn to make them boring and completely uninteresting.
I see that Allicents chose is motivated by the fact that loving her children (other than Helaena or Dearon) has proven to be self-destructive. They are past the point in life where they will heed her advice, and will make their own reckless and misguided choices without thought of Allicent. Therefore, she now knows the realm is better off in the hands of Rhaenyra, but is no use to the Blacks. So she leaves, takes Helaena and hopes to never be seen again. Is that so crazy of a move for Allicent? It’s definitely drastic but I dont see it as uninteresting nor SUPER out of character.
Also Rhaenyra has 6 dragons now, it's not like Alicent changed her mind on a whim, she's pleading mercy to Rhaenyra and the price is Aegon, who obviously has to die. It baffles me how people see what they want to see even if it makes them hate the show.
Hilarious that you have the nerve to bring up misogyny when the actions of two sluts decide the fate of the entire realm. You've got viserys level of cope good sir
@@jadonskatoff4726 Maybe if Alicent actually tried to love and care her sons rather than just mould them into rulers badley they wouldn't ignore her at every turn. Alicent knows it's her fault Aemond and Aegon turned out the way they did, yet completely betrays them.
@@jadonskatoff4726 First off she is consenting to killing Daeron as well all male members have to die so she is fine with killing all her children to save 1 but fine you can make the argument that's the best she has, except it isnt! Helaena has a dragon she can just jump on it with Alicent and jahera and fuck off to Essos there is no need for this plot to consent to the death of her family if all she wants to save herself and her daughter. The writers put it clearly in interviews that this is about Alicent chosing Rhaenyra chosing her over the patriarchy and in this case over her own family, there is no other way to see this as a monstrous betrayal. In this season we saw how Alicent's actions have destroyed her son Aegon completely, he didnt want to be King he didnt want this war she forced it upon and it destroyed him, he lsot his dragon, his body, his son and before all that he was completelly alone he had no support from her or anybody of her family or any real friends that werent superficial kissasses, Larys is probably the most support he ever had in his entire life and now after Alicent does all that she selling him like a bag of rice, to save herself no less, she doesnt even once tries to give her life for his which is a complete 180 for the ending of season 1, this is character assassination if I ever saw one and a completely monstrous thing to do and the writers are framing it as a redemption for Alicent, "She is finally free now" its abhorent and they want us to clap for it.
Another incident of Hollywood portraying action scenes unrealisticly for cheap shock value. The way they showed Sunfyre and Aegon crashing left little to no room for assuming that one of them is still alive.
Sunfyre's death, Corlys's entire war and rescue by Alyn, the destruction of an entire town by an angry Aemond, and more important plot points that I'm forgetting all happened off screen.
They might have killed him actually. Will be cheaper and easier for them to film the show since their main excuse for fucks up, lack of budget and about 2 years of waiting for us between seasons are dragons. And by killing him they will have 1 less dragon to spend the budget money on in the future seasons
@@Freyja386 They literally can't cause Rhaenyra's death was told to us in GOT that Sunfyre killed her and ate her. Her son watched it. It's why he has such a fear and hatred of dragons.
@TheRibottoStudios I do agree, but (this is what I thought when I originally heard it, and hadn't read blood and fire) Joffrey just says "fed to her brothers dragon" which can just be vhagar. I hope they keep it as sunfyre, but they could change it, although it would be worse.
@@balsasjekloca9308 "I have seen the ending of HotD Season 3 : Rhaenyra, Alicent, and Mysaria in a threesome. Seven help us all." - White Walker, traumatized
The show aims to depict its female characters as strong and independent, it actually strips them of their agency by avoiding showing them in a negative light. It’s like if “Game of Thrones” had made Cersei innocent and shifted all her villainous actions to Jaime, Joffrey, and Tywin. Alicent might be less evil now, but this also makes her a lesser character.
Helaena now being an astral-projecting greenseer, who can apparently see events as they happen - as opposed to in metaphor - was certainly a change And the "son for a son" line was wild. Made no sense in context
Just few episodes ago alicent was caressing aegon's cheek and saying 'I'm sorry', last season she pushed aegon behind her when faced with meleys and now suddenly she's okay with rhaenyra killing her son? Rhaenyra won't stop at killing aegon, she'll kill aemond and daeron too since they are the next male pretenders. Is alicent okay with them dying too? Wtf is this character assassination?!
the problem with HOTD (like GOT unfortunately) is pacing, the first season had THREE time jumps and the second season almost had nothing of significance besides blood and cheese.
Not only did they completely ruin the scene, made Cole and Alicent more responsible for it than Daemon and Rhaenyra, but now they're completely ignoring it happened. Rhaenyra still wants a son for a son after she was so "opposed" to it in the beginning lol
He was one of the main reasons why GOT was great. He had different creative writing and I’d say his was better. He was great for WTF moments and great epic battles and suspense. What we got was terrible in many ways. Writing, pacing, no sex scenes, weak couple minute battles, no shocking scenes or cliff hangers etc
I watched Alicent sell out all of her children. Not even Cersei did this. What happened to the character who fought for her family? What happened to the character who would charge at Rae with a dagger when her kids were threatened? What is this character anymore? I mean this honestly felt to me like Jamie saying he never cared for the innocent and I absolutely disdain this creative choice. I don’t care about the writers fanfic I care about Georges material and this BS isn’t suggested by anything in fire and blood. FML this wasn’t it chief.
Ok so because Cersei didn't sell out her kids, Alicent shouldn't? They've shown throughout the entire season how alicent has been regretting how she raised her sons, and feeling guilty for their actions. Maybe actually watch the show before commenting
She saw that her sons were monsters and didn't deserve fighting for. She realized Haelena and her daughter were the only innocents worth saving, and that their lives were more than worth the death of her two sons. She might also be trying to protect Daeron, who's described as kind and good as well. I think the show actually did her character a great favor, cause she's just a selfish, evil cunt in the book.
@@folklorian4368 She never wanted her kids to begin with, they also show how reluctant and how much she doesn’t want to do it. She still loves her children but one is becoming a monster, and the other is a drunk and crippled mess, and she is the kind of character to sacrifice her children for the good of the realm, as that’s all she raised to know by Otto. Otto severely cucked her at being a good mom, that’s not a writing flaw, it’s a character flaw.
I see people discuss the possibility of 2 last episodes being cut due to the limited budget. Possibly, that could lead to some shuffling in the script - but still, whatever they had to do - this script had so many flaws, that it's very doubtful it would be better with 2 more episodes. The story was dragged for 8 episodes, characters haven't been flashed out enough, dialogues in a great majority were simply boring. They just screwed that up massively.
So... You think it is a redeeming factor of Alicent to promise to murder her own child, whom she has neglected his entire life, disowned, and forced on to the throne he didn't even want- only to completely destroy him emotionally when he asks for her guidance? Yea- Alicent truly is a beacon of virtue.
Alicent - "To be honest I never cared about my family" Daemon - "I dun wan it and she's ma queen" Game of thrones season 7/8 vibes from this finale and season.
That is not at all how alicents dialogue came across for me, she has shown that she has no motherly love for aegon and is terrified of aemond throughout this season so it’s not a complete U-turn like most are saying
@@bedeyoung4843Considering her other two soms, and the fact that Dearon is inevitably joining the war, AND the fact that Allicent has only ever made things worse by making choices that protect her sons, If I were allicent I’d stay far away from that kid instead of watch him turn into the bloodthirsty monster that his older brother is. Irrational maybe, but safe.
While I enjoy your commentary, I really do wish you were more blunt and completely honest. It feels like you're walking on eggshells sometimes. We want to see brutal honesty
It's kinda funny how he's ruthlessly picked apart season 6-8 of GOT (and rightly so), but seems to turn a blind eye to much of the blatantly shitty writing of HOTD, which imo has reached the same levels of garbage as those later seasons of GOT.
@@louwilliams2499 Yup. It's like he thinks he needs to use kind words just because he's gotten bigger. The writing is abysmal, hot garbage, you know it, I know it, we all know it. We waited 2 years for this crap, call it out.
It seems like the writers are scared to give Rhaenyra any urgency and make any decisive action because it might make her look bad. She has basically become Viserys this season and was just hoping the war would just go away. I wish they would make her character more like Dany where even though she makes mistakes she believes in herself and pushes ahead with pure will to get the throne
Dude they are even showing signs that the universe wants Rhaenyra to be queen. In season 1, the forest scene with Cole where she encounters the deer or whatever. Then in season 2, Daemon's vision. There's no team green or team black. It's just true queen and devotees vs bunch of evil men.
The thing is it's fine if they want Rhaenyra to be like Viserys. But when Viserys was messing up the show let you know but with Rhaenyra they pretend that it's virtuous. Not to mention there is no consistency with her. In the finale she talks about how she will set dragons on Oldtown and Lannisport and then later talks about not wanting to hurt thousands of innocents. This while she is starving a city and sacrificed a ton of people to get dragonriders. Like it's so contradictory. And don't even get me started on Alicent.
A few things that could have made the season way better (SPOILER warning): 1. Spend more time with Jace traveling the Vale and the North securing alliances. The whole thing was condensed down to one scene right at the start and then he barely did anything. I know this would remove the emotional scene in episode one but I think this can be sacrificed and you can still have an emotional scene with him getting the message. Given that his character will die early in season 3 he was way too insignificant in season 2. 2. Reduce the Daemon scenes. While I agree that they are necessary for his character development 5-6 episodes of visions to finally come to a conclusion are too much. Since there are only 8 episodes it would have been better if he concluded his arc by episode 6 or 7 instead of in the finale. That way the finale episode has enough time to deliver something memorable. 3. Don’t show the alliance with the triarchy being brokered. Given they will attack the ship with Rhaenyra‘s children on the way to Pentos it would have had more shock value if the season would have ended with the ship appearing to be safe and suddenly being attacked. Then the season could have ended with the action setpiece of the first (and last) flight of Stormcloud delivering Aegon to safety setting up the Gullet early next season. Think it would have also been cool if we would have seen Otto with the triarchy hinting at the fact that he secretly brokered the deal (as he suggested to do in the book). With him being the reason Viserys got abducted, Stormcloud died and Jace died in battle his death after the sack of Kings Landing would be much better. 4. Introduce Daeron properly. Show the Hightower army and their leaders. And show us Daeron as a character in a few scenes. Then end the season with the Battle at Honeywine (you don’t even have to show the battle, just a short scene of Daeron saving the day and getting knighted for it to end the season and establish him as a player).
No no Daeron doesnt Matter is because of the Cast Same (i Hope) with the 3 Blackwoods they all are kids, so season 3 or they Will GROW Up before they film Now i was thinking better scenes : Daemon talking with every Riverlords not just 1 Bracken so you get PROGRESS EVEN WITH THE DREAM SCENES Rhaenyra introducing the Black Council we never NEVER GET THE CHARACTERS AND THEY ARE EQUAL IMPORTANT has the Green Council (2 or 3 die) Jeyne introducing her backstory to Rhaena so she gets the idea of having her OWN Destiny by riding a dragón, i want to remember the lady of Vale fought his family for the power and we NEVER SEE Rhaena having her OWN opinion only she walking around leaving her nephews i think, more like cousins ? One SCENE ONE GODDAMN scene showing the Winter wolves saying goodbye to them families and explaining the "Winter tradition" of saving food by dying a glorious Death. Would explain why they are olds to the audience and being more sympathetic to the Starks and Blacks lets say But no they wanted to show the smallfolk suffering and not the smallfolk watching the War as "good" in a viking way And they want more Alicent or Mysaria scenes . . . What a Joke
@@unc54 it's a good scene wtf. You're just unable to separate the disappointment of the missing climax, what's bad about that scene is the grand maister smuggling alicent without any problems
I find it hilarious that, after the disastrous season 2 finale, the people who made this show are assigning some blame to the writer's strike. Really?! For the last year, all I've been hearing is that HoTD was shielded from the effects of the writer's strike because it was a UK production. So which is it?! Sometimes it feels like we, the audience, are living in this show: _we're_ the smallfolk and the showrunners are the great houses deceiving, disrespecting, and manipulating us. 😂
I found myself feeling empty after the episode, and felt that something's were kinda rushed in this episode. I adore Asoiaf so hopefully season 3 will put the pedal to the metal.
Yeah I'm thinking at this point that I'm done with watching new episodes as they come out. Maybe if I get bored in a few years I'll revisit it with the luxury of being able to skip scenes or entire episodes. It still hurts though. It has been a lot worse than I thought it would be.
@@rjdub8455 it does, he means at least it got bad early so he can quit early and not be so invested in the show then watch so many good season after good season to be a bit close to the end and start to turn bad that is makes the whole thing feel pointless anymore. I LOVE Game of thrones, but cos of season 8 and that Horrible final episode I find it hard to want to re-watch it all again. I would rather stop at season 7 tbh.
I feel like the pacing was bad. The tywin stuff just felt misplaced. The sheepstealer search just felt horrible placing wise. Alicent just pops up on dragonstone. Its the pacing that was so bad. That was part of the problem of this season
I find it funny how you totally bashed Got season 5-8 but hardly acknowledge any flaw of Hotd. The dialogues of Hotd has been average specially in season 2 it's very ordinary. They are keeping up with the main plot of the story but changing the small events that lead to the major events. Which is creating plot holes. The characters are weak, Greens get hardly any screen time. Aemond only got 12 minutes of screen time in whole season 2. And they butchered Alicent's charecter this season. She was the one who forcefully made Aegon King and now Aegon is the villain and she's ready to leave him? She once almost took a kid's eye for her son and now she doesn't care if he lives. And why'd she tell Rhaenyra about her relation with Cole? I can point out many weak writing and plot holes it would take an hour to write all of them.
My main problem with the show is within the black allies. The greens are much more faceted and have different perspectives on war, so their meetings are often explosive and interesting. However, with blacks, writers seem to fear to mess around. Most of the characters don't have any entity ad they seem to be scared to mess Rhaenyra's character. Girl, it would have been much more interested, and equitative, if we have had both good and evil on both sides. The conflict should have escalated far from Alicent's a Rhaenyra's hands, and have them in a final scene, together, and watching how the war now is inevitable.
I’ve been trying so hard to avoid spoilers from social media only for Helaena to drop a massive one😂 that sucked and I hope they find a creative way to make Aemonds death happen besides him just getting wrecked at the gods eye like she was saying
Also, Daemon's vision of the future showed Rhaenyra on the Iron Throne. The writers just straight up told us what is going to happen. This is fan fiction level writing.
yea, there's no sugar coating it. they fd up this season was such a filler that they have to cram everything together in the last 2 seasons cause it ends on season 4. there are a lot of important battles to tell this story and there's just no way they'll get the budget for all of them in just 2 seasons
@@johanwestin3030it’s completely out of character for Alicent both from S1 characterization and book Alicent. She is really going to sacrifice her entire family so she can go have margaritas in Essos after pushing her son onto the throne???
Use your f**** brain. Look at them. Alicent is not a monster but they are and she can't deny it any longer. The only logical thing she can do now is save her last child that can be saved and that she loves, Helaena. A show like this is honestly wasted on idiots like you.
@@Casboof Do you know what character developement means? She literally explained it herself and you7 dumbassed still dont get it. She always acted on duty and family, thats why she put Aegon on the throne. Now she's realizing that it was all for nothing and him and Aemond are beyond saving. What else can she do now other than make amends and try to spare Helaena and herself? I'm convinced you people are genuinely dumb.
I agree. I feel like 8 episodes was too much for that poor writing. Thank God we didn't have 10 episodes or we'll have Alicent and Rhaenyra run away together to Essos and live happily ever after 😂
yes, but Alicent also forgot that, even with Aegon gone, there are still Aemond and Daeron: what does she think Rhaenyra or Daemon will do? Spare their life? not unlike, since they are Aegon's heirs now. So who cares if they got killed, unless King's Landing and Haelaena and Jaehaera are safe? What a sh*t plot.
So wehn he was complaining was rhat fir clicks aswell????. Is it a lose lose situation where if he moans its for clicks but if he praises it its also for clicks? @@Luna-ii4mx
Hard disagree with the statement that this feels like Alicent Hightower's redemption arc. It was her who pushed Aegon onto the throne. He never wanted to be King, he even tried to flee from that responsibility at the end of Season 1, and since being forced to the throne, has only tried to do right by people and be a well liked King. Is he a good King? Of course not, he's a young lad with a boyish sense of humour and had no true connection with his father, who didn't bother teaching him how to be a good King. So for Alicent, knowing all of this, to simply agree to throw Aegon to the wolves in a 'Son for a son' demand from Rhaenyra while completely disregarding that Aegon and Helaena have already suffered the death of a son is unforgivable. She knows that it was Aemond and Vhaegar who killed Lucerys, and Aemond who's essentially gone rogue and completely unhinged with his power. If she'd agreed to offer Aemond as recompense for his crimes but permit Aegon to flee into exile with her, I'd have probably understood it. Though this is just Alicent foisting all responsibility onto Aegon, then shirking all blame and pinning everything on him, even though it was forced upon him by her. He's her sacrificial lamb so that she can run away and be free. She's probably one of the most evil and self-serving characters within the narrative at this point.
Fun fact: if the season had ten episodes, we would've seen the fall of King's Landing to the Blacks, and a ton more of conflicts. If the season had some major battle occuring, it would be way more redeemable in my eyes, since right now season two exists solely for the buildup to season three. Very disappointing season, with filler scenes here and there, that could've been replaced with something more engaging. Example: how come that Gwayne Hightower knows about Ser Criston and Alicent? How is this knowledge? I think a scene where a scandal broke out would've been way better than seeing the 681325125th scene of Daemon dreaming at Harrenhal. Just my two cents.
@@wraygun1481 I believe Gwayne pieced things together. He may have been suspicious because of the way the two shared looks or something, but he freaks out when he sees Criston sniffing (?) the favour Alicent gave him
I think gwanye was able to put the pieces together he see stares down alicent and cristan before the war and sees him receive that cloth and now hes all lovey dovey with the cloth in that scene
I got the vibe immedeatly when I saw the first scene with Tyland that we weren't getting a fight this episode. Because they wouldn't waste time in a climactic battle episode with that kind of scene. However, in a climactic "Building to the war the whole season has been building towards"-episode, I think it works. After that I was able to enjoy the gathering of armies, affirmations of loyalty and character scenes in the episode. Overall I really liked the episode but I have an issue with how the episode was marketed. The whole season has been building to the battle for King's landing, and the previews really made it seem like that battle was here. I feel kind of "blue balled" by this like I believe many others do too. Really good episode but I do believe one more episode in this season would have been great, because there really isn't much closure in this finale.
It’s insane how much goodwill was brought back via season 1 just for this… it’s not season 8 of GOT bad by any means but it’s in line with season 7 I personally feel.
This. It's season 7 of GOT all over again. No, the season wasn't completely awful, matter of fact, it had some very great and important moments in it, that fully align with the source material. But anything else was pretty much shallow Hollywood fan fiction writing.
The show itself has always been disappointing. The lack of "characters", people being REALLY stupid, people not being fleshed out and/or just being under developed, not knowing who to actually root for, no tension or stakes, and, for season 2, poor pacing and scenes that should've been earlier in the show. I really want to like this show... I do... but it is just hard to... Also, why a Whitewalker? ALSO also, Otto was imprisoned!?
otto is obv imprisoned because aemond doesnt want him to come back to court. just dont watch season 3 pls if you lack the patience or actual understanding 👍
Bro you are stupid you are calling this guy stupid for not knowing ameond imprisoned which he didn't do actually it was most likely that council guy who got killed by Cole family who imprisoned him @@d5nilo0o
@d5nilo0o cool what is great is that the director themself didn't even know where Otto was because the writers didn't tell the director or the actors and she states "I want to know where he is too." AND "They don't tell us, they don't tell any of us! They don't tell the actors, either. I don't think it's fair." Also I am pretty sure Otto was just goin back home, but nah he is behind bars. What is great with that is SHOW him getting arrested. It's simple.👍
@@coopernut yeah for dumb people like you they might have to explain fucking everything so yall can complain about nothing happening even more. the show isnt as close to as shit as yall dumbfucks are making it out to be :D just dont watch season 3 but no u claim to hate it but u will keep watching like everyone will
@@califailure1082I have, and what that guy said is true. Tyland is completely hollow character on the show. We know pretty much nothing about him. Not showing the side characters is a big flaw of HotD.
Sara Hess, one of the writers, has said that the cut from 10 to 8 was not their choice. It also seems that the cut was announced AFTER the writing for the season had finished. So it seems quite possible that the season had already been written as a 10 episode season before the 8 episodes cut was announced (because HBO executives wanted to save money). There seem to have been slight rewrites, but they couldn't rewrite the whole thing. I think that's why we ended up with such an underwhelming finale, because it wasn't meant to be the finale originally. Beyond that, I'd say this season is at about the same level as season 5 of "Game of Thrones." I found it mostly enjoyable, but it has some significant issues as well. Although its issues are different from the ones season 5 of GoT had. In this case the issues were more that some character arcs were kind of muddled or inconsistent, it had some significant pacing issues and it had some really questionable moments (like Rhaenyra being able to get into King's Landing). To be fair, as a book reader, I have to say that the writers had a difficult job. In season 1 they focused heavily on Rhaenyra and Alicent, but in the book around this time Rhaenyra and Alicent have almost nothing to do. So the writers had to somehow give them stuff to do, but without allowing them to greatly affect the course of events (since that would then cause the show to no longer be a proper adaptation). Not an easy job.
5:16 yes was Zaslav putting the knife in Ryan Condal's neck. Zaslav is literally making cut after cut of budgets projects doing this with his major tv show is so dumb because HOTD is the most viewed tv show on HBO since GOT
@@jensen5160 not all episodes was bad, the problem with season 2 was less 2 episodes, and only one was bad episode 3. For me was a solid 7/10 season. Season 1 is 8;5/10
Just the video I was looking forward to, this was SUCH a disappointing finale, not because of the lack of action scenes or the plot moving forward but the fact that how STUPID Alicent and Rhaneyra and all the characters are in the end. I can't BELIEVE Alicent is like yeap I am selling out my sons to you Rhaneyra, do whatever you want, even though you got my grandson killed and my son Aegon the King is almost dead but screw my children. WHY the teleportation from Season 7/8 of Game of thrones back? We saw Rhanerya go to kings landing like it was nothing and then Alicent shows up at Dragon Stone just like that LOL I thought these women HATED each other? At the end of season 01 we saw there was no going back and now these two women are confused and ready to sell out their children to maintain "peace". Daemon's character was the most disappointing this season, the references to white walkers and Game of Thrones in general completely ruin his character.
Let’s not forget that Alicent was the one dragging Aegon kicking and screaming to his own coronation. He would have fled to Essos if not for her and Otto trying to find him last season. The fact that she is trying to wash her hands of the guilt and put the blame all on her sons is annoying and kind of makes her an even bigger hypocrite/villain than the writers were probably intending.
Um bruh are you forgetting King's Landing and Dragonstone are neighbors?? Other travel takes a while but they're literally side by side. Idk why people are forgetting this very simple fact, look at a map of Westeros.
@jarrettmaynard6306 dragon stone and kings landing are NOT neighbors. Dragonstone is literally on the other side of the bay from kings landing and also there's literally a fucking blockade of kings landing going on right now so how tf did she get past it? And why'd they just let her speak to Rhaenyra without arresting her first like they did Mysaria?
And honestly they just leave Rhaena like that wander off into the mountains? lmfao like that's ABSURD. WHY would a royal simply wander off into the mountains ALONE and expect to catch a dragon? like what? just the weather alone is insanely dangerous
Oh stop coping. This episode fucking sucked. They tested us with Last of Us by saying the first episode was longer. It was received positively. So they cut the season by another episode. This entire season for the most part was trash. The character development- I’m sorry, no Daeron? What the FUCK was Daemon doing for so many episodes at Harrenhal. There were opportunities to focus on other characters. We could have definitely gotten more develop Cregan. Also completely skipping that scene with Aemond you know what fuck it. We didn’t even get the first battle of tumbleton, and how terrible the sacking was. Disappointing and I see why GRRM was disappointed as well
My only issue was they ended Season 1 with a call to war and this season had some war but felt like fourplay. I don't have any issues with the season finale but it was just building up to next season. Are we waiting another 2 years for the next season? ugh
Am I the only one who thinks Sheepstealer looks terrible? The design is significantly worse than the standards set by the rest of the dragons. Face is barely recognizable and blurry, feels like a rush job.
They could make it better in 3 steps. 1) Alicent organizes an official mid-way no-dragons diplomatic talk with Rhaenyra. No silly crawling around King's Landing. There, you get the Alicent and Rhaenyra talk, resulting in Alicent being desperate. 2) No Daemon's vision, but just understanding of the hard role the ruler has to play. Actively doing the decision of yielding before Rhaenyra. Not because he knows the outcome but because he sees it as the right thing. 3) Rhaenyra and Daemon planning to attack King's Landing without Alicent's crawling around Dragonstone. Daemon actually being useful telling Rhaenyra about hordes of gold cloaks that are loyal to him. Easy as that. On top of that, even more tragic of a story. No need to assassinate Alicent and Daemon
It's very obvious that the writers are firmly on team Rhaenyra. They have written Alicent badly and recently they have dropped all pretence of her being a character, with her own goals and motivation. The whole reason Alicent helps start the dance is to save her children, knowing Rhaenyra will put them to death. Now she sells out her entire family, not because it makes sense but because the writers hate her. They see Rhaenyra as a strong feminist and Alicent as an enabler of patriarchy. So instead of a story of 2 sides of the same family fighting with complex motivations we have patriarchy vs feminism.
The idea that a princess tasked with serving the remaining children of a queen at war can just run off on an adventure is just...ahhhhhhhh it's so terrible
“What major battle should we show in the finale to finish with a bang?”
“I have 4 words for you; Tyland Lannister mud wrestling”.
Crazy how much screen time they wasted introducing a complete meme of a character.
Overall, I enjoyed the episode...BUT I could've done without Tyland negotiating with the Triarchy. I mean, it's an odd choice to show us THAT, but we only got ONE scene with Jace & Cregan Stark and NO scenes of Jace negotiating with Lady Jeyne Arryn.
Transgender mud wrestling was a surprise…
@@zazzrazzamatazz9970?
The serious negotiations were interesting, then it descended into Pirates of the Caribbean 😅
Daemon: Rhaenyra, I saw the future.
Rhaenyra: Really?
Daemon: Daenerys must be warned to not forget about the Iron Fleet and Euron forces
@@hc.117 😂😂😂
lmaooooo
You made me actually laugh out loud!
😂
😂
showing Tyland mud wrestle with a pirate captain on screen and yet the destruction of sharp point offscreen is diabolical
lesbian cuck mud wrestler pirate lol
Ones way cheaper than the other
@@willbaker6532 One’s way cooler than the other…
@@willbaker6532 show a story, dont tell it
@@jadonskatoff4726 Well if only HBO didn’t have massive budget cuts it might have been possible…
Season 1: Massive time jumps because there's so much story to tell
Season 2: Massive filler and reduced episodes since there's little story to tell
There’s still plenty of story they could have pulled from the books to fill shit in instead of having Daemon trip balls for like 5 episodes in a row
@@joeschmo4646 and you know what’s the worst part about daemon tripping the whole time? The entire point was to knock down his ego a peg and convince himself that he should support his wife, but they throw all that out the window just to make him of a vision that tells him he has to. He doesn’t bring himself to, his god damn vision does. The whole tripping balls thing was all for nothing
@@Chadius_Thundercock Exactly. Daemon had no character development whatsoever until seeing the future.
@@joeschmo4646
Three eps spread out would have been enough, with some minor time-skips- & two of the visions/ trips were completely unnecessary, imo; the one with his mother was a shark-jump moment- & the last one with Viserys, too on the nose -- I'm all for him having introspection & renewed purpose, but they went overboard with it - & that's only _one_ issue with this season...
And the f'd up part is, there is actually so much story to tell in season 2, but they just want to stretch out for profit reasons.
Rhaenyra’s arc this season was frustrating. They ended season 1 with her looking like she was going to wreak havoc. Then she spent the first three episodes of season 2 tiptoeing around trying to prevent the war that was already happening. The show acts like this is a good thing, and rather that her advisors are in the wrong for trying to get her to act. Stupid.
Then when she finally acts, she falls right into a trap and gets her best fighter and dragon killed. When she’s rightfully called out on it, she smacks the guy.
Jace secures the Freys, and via them a realistic way to bring the Northmen south. Then it’s he who comes up with the idea for other dragon riders which, although initially a failure, causes Seasmoke to go find Adam and starts in motion the dragon seeds.
Then, Daemon comes around to Rhaenarya only because Alys Rivers conspires to make it so. On all fronts, Rhaenarya practically fails into success, which is frustrating.
All this time we have Mysaria telling her how great she is. I’m pretty sure Mysaria, as a character, exists to the writers to tell us all how great Rhaenarya is, since she’s literally done nothing great so far. How about SHOW us she’s great, instead of tell us?
Then they altered Alicent’s character to pure evil by changing her from someone who cared deeply for her family (even though she’s a terrible mother) into someone who betrays her entire family in order to be free of her own guilt and consequences. Feels a lot like this was done to make Rhaenarya look good and virtuous by comparison.
The writers are CLEARLY on team Black, which is unfortunate.
I so hope for a season 3 heel turn
This! I feel like the whole prophecy thing is also a cheap way of making Rhaenyra look good. She’s not taking the throne because she wants power, she’s doing it because of a vague destiny she know nothing about. This way when she does go to war and ultimately kills many innocents it will be justified because it’s all part of some bigger picture. This is just lame writing. In the books both teams clawed for power only to bare that it wasn’t worth it in the end, which would have been much better and more human than team green bad team black good type bs
I hate writers that want to turn a morally grey story into their own fanfic
@@patrycjazak9753 It's exactly to make her look good!
Can't agree more.
Alicent : " To be fair I never really cared for them. My children and otherwise."
👏
She decided to save her family at the cost of Aegon's head rather than seeing her entire family getting burnt to ashes. Wow! So bad writing. Definitely on the same level as Jaime's!
@@rajveerdholan8291 What about Daeron ? She's gonna sacrifice him too to save her family?
@@rajveerdholan8291 Will Aemond and Daeron vanish in a puff of smoke when Aegon supposedly dies? If not what's your point?
@@rajveerdholan8291 dude killing Aegon and have Rhaenyra in King's Landing will not end the conflict nor spare her entire family from death... you get it, right?
corlys... the sea snake.... has never set sail on screen over two seasons. The one time he did it was off screen and he almost died lmao. He was named hand and immediately left dragonstone to chill with the blockade. He just gets yelled at by his kids all season 😂
He keeps spawning in that shipyard to have the same NPC dialogue.
😭😭😭😭😭@@Hero_Of_Old
@@Hero_Of_OldEvery Velaryon sailor Corlys initiates dialogue with: “Thank you kind sir.”
Uh, his last scene was literally him setting sail, and over two seasons? Season three ain’t out yet lol.
@@baron6588 first of all I said we haven't seen him sail on screen... which is Still true... and second learn how to count maybe cuz over the course of two seasons.... means all of season one... and all of season two
They hyped up a whole season of war and instead spent the entire season talking about war and tripping on shrooms instead
Exactly. Season 1 last scene: oh shit, war's here.
Season 2 last scene: war's here. We swear.
They'd best give us the battle of the gullet, the battle on the honey wine, the fish feed, Rotty the ruin and his winter wolves vs criston cole, the battle of tumbleton and end it off with The God's Eye in season 3.
Do you want GoT s1-4 or s7-8, but yeah there could have been little bit more action
@@KingSlayer_. I would guess that they either open with battle of the gullet or its mid season finale and season finale is Daemon vs Aemond above God's Eye
Can you blame them? I fuck with mushrooms hard
00:03 Jacaerys Velaryon, prince of Mewmaxxing
Genuinely all he did was mew other than talk to short ass bridge mfs
The prince of Sigmastone and heir to the Skibidi Throne
Rizzler of the Seven Gyatts and Fanum of the Tax
I laughed harder than I should
@@thechangamire3495 there’s so much wrong with you kids nowadays it’s sad Af
GoT writing syndrome:
Step 1) Write show as a faithful retelling of GRRM work. It's massively successful and everybody loves it.
Step 2) Let the success go to your head and start thinking you arw a better writer than GRRM.
Step 3) Start changing things from the source material for no reason. Cut characters, merge plot lines, etc.
Step 4) Show goes to crap.
Rinse and repeat.
Bruh if they actually did cut Nettles....i was waiting for her to show up this entire season. But it seems like her character is merged with Rhaena for some reason..
Step 5) be hated by almost all fans of the show and those who read the books and don’t understand why 😂
GRRM is literally overseeing everything in HOTD.
@@grantwilliams2650he’s not tho. Bro just gave the OK. 😅
@@edd4131 He’s the co-creator and executive producer of HOTD… so, like I said, he’s overseeing this show.
This would have been fine as an episode 8 of 10. But as a finale, it fell short. Cutting this season down to 8 episodes was stupid
It was objectively impossible due to the budget cuts
@@SCUDGEj0ckey why tf is it getting budget cuts its like the most popular series in the world
@@Bob-ed8hc likely the writer/actor strike. Either way it was HBO's decision and not the show runners. They said a few times in BTS interviews that it wasn't "their choice" which sucks because I agree, as an episode 8 of 10 this episode is awesome but it falls short as a finale. I was reading that apparently the cut to 8 episodes caused some script rewrites as well.
It is a terribly written story no matter how many episodes are in the season.
@@lairofmedi3421writers are overpaid. Them striking is a slap in the face to people who have to work actual Jobs
I feel like the cringy mud wrestling scenes got more screen time than Aemond's entire character this season.
Crucial scenes friend. Much like Tyrion arranging chairs in the series finale of GoT. The symbolism is undeniable
I was hoping for more interaction between Aemond and Helaena but oh well..mud wrestling it is.............
I'm glad you call it for what it was, cringe.
So many watchers found it funny and I'm left like ???
It was super weird. And pointless.
Also, I felt Abigail's acting was subpar, though maybe it's because I know her outside of House of the Dragon.
But I also knew Olivia (who she was and her work, I mean) before HOT D and she blew me away. So I feel like Abigail's lack of acting skills is just her own lack of experience.
I didn’t find it cringy. It wasn’t as important but it definitely wasn’t cringy. I love watching someone as pompous and bratty as Tyland be completely out of his element
@@dreamday988 I ship them so I wanted the same. Even if I didn't how do the two most powerful people in the world have no interactions? Oh wait nvm this is good writing I forgot lol
Season 1 ended with a Rhaenyra death stare
Season 2 started with Rhaenyra hugging trees and wanting peace to protect "ze peepol""
I don't care if the season ended before the fall of King's Landing, I just wanted the characters to be consistent and INTERESTING.
Rhaenyra was so f*cking boring this season
Stop bitching
Dont watch
Your life will be better
Problem solved
S1 Finale Stare = I'm so going to pout and do nothing
She changed her attitude a dozen times in season 2 for no reason. Terrible, terrible writing.
If short season was to be, then episode 7 was the good spot to ending it.
It also ends with Rhaenyra staring out menacingly.
@@ultimateshipper8997Hahaha.
Sara Hess constantly thinking she knows better than GRRM, first in 1x09 (Rhaenys murdering hundreds without consequence instead of Sunfyre and Dreamfyre flying above KL), then in 2x08 (Alicent!!!! selling out her family, the ones she fought for the most) is getting on my nerves. Did she forget she wrote Alicent stepping in front of Meleys for Aegon?? Hess can't even stay consistent within the few episodes she actually wrote. Nonsensical development.
You know she isn’t the ONLY writer, right? It’s a team of people deciding major plot beats and decisions and THEN she takes one of the episodes over. Also - she isn’t the freaking show runner. If there’s a major issue, that’s on Ryan Condal to fix
@@herefortheshrimp1469 She is the one credited for the episodes I have most of my issues with. This isn't coming from nowhere.
@@herefortheshrimp1469 the main writers are hess and condal.
Sara Hess has proven herself a menace. I gave her the benefit of the doubt in Season 1 because of the overall quality of the show, but a lot of stuff she has said in interviews is concerning, and the two silliest episodes of the show are hers (Season 1 Episode 9 and Season 2 Episode 8).
Ti Mikkel had writing credits for many of these episodes. She's also the keeper of the lore and researcher. If you were to blame anyone for straying too far from lore, why not start with Mikkel?
We had to suffer through 6 episodes of Daemon just hanging out at Harrenhal, and despite all the supposed introspection, he had NO character development. They crammed all of his "development" into a single scene where he sees the future, which is an unbelievably lazy way to change a character.
Yep and it goes against the character and the supposed development he went through if they had him bend the knee then see the vision then it would be better
Conveniently, the night just before rynhaera arrives too 😂.
It felt like episode 4 was the true finale, and the last 4 episodes were just a preview for Season 3. The last 4 episodes were just all build-up. Also, too many shows/movies are getting too comfortable with the "come back for more next season" sequel bait set ups.
Build up episodes without build up... Aemond randomly burning thousands? Rhaenyra sending her allies to do the same? Did I miss episodes???
Actually episode 7 felt more like a finale aswell
@@SilverShadowwHonestly if they switched things around slightly and switched endings her scaring off Aemond and having the dragons roar behind her would have been a sick finale ending.
@@BrotherGilbert69 thats what Im saying smh, what a letdown
@@SilverShadoww yes they should have made that episode as a finale because it had some satisfactory ending
There is no tension or stakes in this conflict, I feel nothing. Everything is "oooh noo, oopsie theres a war now! Oh no, I really didn't want this. I don't want to do anything. Oh shucks."
YES. Alicent and Rhaenyra keep having the same damn conversations. This makes it seem a lesbian rage soap opera rather than a character driven show. There seems to be almost no logical development with the characters. It seems rushed, like the budget is dictating more than we realize
Remember chud women are anti war peaceful doves and all men are dumb stupid war hawks
Yeah I really don't care what happens now. The characters are so inconsistent that none of their conflicts are compelling.
On top of that, I never read Fire and Blood, and I have enjoyed experiencing the show while being ignorant of the major events that are to come. But the a**hole writers just straight up told me in this episode that Rhaenyra wins and Aemond dies. How can there be any tension now? Why did they throw in visions of the future and spoil their own story?!?!
@@nunliski I'd suggest to just read the book and forget about this shit show
"Clearly" you just want cool action scenes and dragons! There is no way you want these characters to actually develop that isn't linearly!
- Literally every fucking gaslighting shill for this season
Alicent sold out her sons, Helaena cheers for son's murderer... It seems the writers want all the women to be on Rhaenyra's side lol.
Absolutely whats the point of making you characters "good" and making bad or stupid choices from air
Is a Fanfic to this point, the characters should move Accord to them beliefs not the writers ones
That's exactly what they twisted the dance into, peaceful women vs evil war men. Girls clearly good, boys clearly evil.
I'd give GRRM props if he just pulled the rights of this show under HBO after this shit show
I mean the side without the women is the explicitly misogynistic side that rejects Rhaenyra because she's a woman. You really figured a lot of women would be keen to support the side that wants to ensure they never hold power?
Season 3 is definitely going to have Rhaenyra, Alicent and Mysaria become a throuple
I didn't see her cheer for daemon. After all she knows rhaenrya isn't the one that killed her Child
I really don’t understand why they’re so hell bent on constantly referencing the most atrociously underwhelming storyline from game of thrones with Aegon’s Dream & the White Walkers.
Like even if it wasn’t awfully wrapped up in season 8, there’s nothing this show could do to have any impact on what has already happened in a show that’s already finished airing years ago
Especially since we all know it's completely meaningless to this show because it's not going to occur for the next 160 years. So characters being motivated by something we know is meaningless is just terrible.
It's about how Targaryens use this prophecy to justify war and their actions and the down fall that prophecys and not understanding them bring .
They litterally see themselves as blond reborn Jesus and the main characters . That shapes their characters and I feel its an important theme in the show.
So I would say it's a way to characterize the characters. What will really happen is not that important
I kinda like the idea that the song of ice and fire was used as some sort of motivation for Targaryen monarchs to unite the realm by passing this prophecy from generation to generation. But since the events of dance of dragons, none of the later kings heard the prophecy and it became kinda lost in time. That's why when the white walker actually arrived, no one was prepared and the realm was divided and in war with itself.
What I'm not that into however is using that as a mean to get Daemon back with Rhaenyra. The show did a solid job at giving him a little character arc with all the hallucinations in Harrenhaal and turning him into a somewhat more decent person. That whole part with the visions at the end was kinda pointless.
@@andreeab3116 While I don’t disagree with you, it’s cheap to use that as a way to cushion up your protagonist. It just makes Rhaenyra more boring by painting her as the “chosen one”.
This is 100% a "higher up" decision. The idea is to retroactively connect the shows with a unifying storyline, like a "Marvel cinematic universe" but for Westeros. They saw the popularity of GoT, and now they have like 5 spinoffs in the works or approaching completion. Like it or not, they are definitely trying to make GoT a "cinematic universe," with multiple movies and shows all connecting together, and get a piece of the Marvel pie.
Jon Snow in GOT: “You are mawh Qwueen”
Rhaenyra in HOTD: “What would you have me do?”
😂😂😂
Written by the third writer who wrote later seasons of GOT by the way D&Ds protege Ryan Condol people need to wake the fuck up and realise whatever this guy touches is fucking diabolical. He became the main show runner this season and look what happened…
Rhaena just abandons her post as the guardian of Rhaenyra's children to find a dragon for her own?
What a dick.
Some Vale knights are in big trouble for losing her
Biggest waste of time ever 😂 and we didn’t even get to see her ride it
As a finale, yes it was disappointing. I think they cut 2 episodes due to budgetary reasons. They were supposed to show the battle of the Gullet in episode 9. I hope WB give them more budget for S3.
hopefully they extend Season 3 to 12 episodes. But i dont think so.
I highly doubt it. They’ll cut the budget again.
I hope they fire all the current writers and producers. The show's surely going downhill right now.
zaslav is a son of b he is cutting budget from a lot of tv shows and movies
@@YOQUE2xgpxTRiu not their fault. the season was cut short
but in the world, we must defend our own.” - alicent hightower 1x06 “If Rhaenyra comes into power your very life could be forfeit Aemond as well”-Alicent. Alicent killing her whole family is evil
@@dre5714 I don't think Alicent is keen on defending him anymore, and rightfully so.
She forced Aegon to take the throne. He tried to run away but they made him King. Then, she chooses to sacrifice him, and for what??
@@lemurking6896 Aemond is my boy. If Alicent won't defend him, I will lol.
The writers made me despise Alicent even more than any other character in this show... Not only that she is evil, she is also boring.
@akchanneltv4084 I think they really needed to show us Alicent feeling desperate instead of just abandoning everything and letting her kids die. Like give us a scene where she tried to petition Aegon to get up and take back power but he tells her off like BADLY. Which sees her rejected by everybody except Halaena, and Aegon is clinging to Larys more.
I hate that Aemond burned Sharp Point and they gave it barely any screen time or importance. He went from morally questionable and conflicted to just straight up irredeemable and we're supposed to believe that's what we should expect to happen. Earlier this season, his lover told him "When princes lose their temper, it's the smallfolk who suffer."
Where's his guilt? Why did he have no problem burning thousands for nothing? He didn't want to kill Luke and Aegon was abusive towards him. This feels like a massive change in character and it only compounds on the problem of the show sidelining Aemond's development in favor for filler.
It doesn't seem at all out of character, the lover who was trying to warn him that small folks suffer is also the first person he dropped when his ego is threatened by his brother's bullying
That is a fragile ego that would lead to him burning an entire town just because his Authority was questioned, considering we had seen him call the small Council just a few episodes prior because they were questioning his authority
@@thomaswillard6267 It's a monumental leap from "fragile ego" to "murdering thousands of civilians"
Yeah really weird how they just made him switch overnight like that. It’s obvious the writers are trying to make a “Good girls vs Evil men” plot
The conversation between Alicent and Rhaenira would have been much better if they hadn't met in episode 3. It is ludicrous how they kept going back and fort to each other during the whole season.
Completely contrived and illogical scenes that added nothing. Almost as bad as the meme captain they introduced.
Idk, I think it sucked regardless. Alicent selling out her kids and then you have Rhaenyra acting like she would escape with Alicent if it wasn't for her responsibilities. The whole conversation somehow ignores that each side killed sons and grandsons. Alicent straight up forgets her grandson died.
How is it ludicrious? If small folk can get to Dragonstone, then why can't Alicent? If Herlinda?? can sneak into King's Landing then why can't Rhaenyra.
@@BhBc8f8because they’re high royalty. Whose going to notice some random travellers, but ones a queen dowager and the other a queen. Not exactly nobodies. Stop praising garbage writing.
@@okaysxo If people in 2021 didn't recognize Taylor swift with a hat on then there's absolutely no way people in medieval times would recognize Rheanyra in a septa's outfit.
Alicent Hightower's character is now ruined beyond repair.. and that's one of the main reasons of this season's weakness
In what way not like in the books she was a great character
@@SNAKERAKES she at least had a clear motivation and drive to achieve it
@@SNAKERAKES she was a great and strong character because of the season 1, not because of the books, so i guess it makes sense to question why she had this weird (and weak ?) story arc in season 2.
@metasua it's kind of funny because after S1 people were complaining about the attention shown to alicent as in the books she's not really a major player. Yet in season 2 when she's shown to not have that much power people than complain that she does nothing.
That was literally the whole point...she goes from being the queen to just being some forgotten woman who's able to free herself from the entire game .
Character arc doesn't mean - weak character becomes incredibly strong..
Sometimes it's the opposite.
@@willbaker6532The problem is not her inactivity, the problem is logic. Selling her children to the butcher like that requires more than that seen. Hell She never even mentioned how a son for a son had already been done.
Alicent selling out her entire family is one of the worst character assassinations I’ve seen
Not her entire family, just the evil men 🙄
@@TheCandyHolehey man she has to find a way to smash the patriarchy! #girlboss #cringe
@@TheCandyHole You mean Aegon, the guy who never wanted to be king and had his arm twisted into it by his mother who was completely mistaken about Viserys’s intentions, who got roasted by his own brother in battle, lamed and traumatized. That guy?
He’s honestly less evil than Daemon.
Yeah, she sold out her only decent son too. All so she herself could be free of guilt and consequence.
@@dereka5017 She seems pretty free of guilt as is. The writers don't even realize that she comes across as a sociopath.
I cannot believe people are saying this is a good episode in a vacuum, when it has managed to put the nail in the coffin of Alicent's and Rhaenyra's characters. They took two powerful, cunning, ruthless and strong-willed matriarchs and turned them into whiny, meek cardboard cutouts of their former selves.
Ironically, the showriters end up proving the misogyny of the rest male characters right:
Alicent abandons her sons and father and sells out her family to the enemy because apparently she just loves Rhaenyra so much. Aemond was 100% correct in removing her from the council because "she harbours love for the enemy".
Rhaenyra continues to sit around and complain that no one takes her seriously when all she does is sit around and ask people "wHat wOuLD yOu hAvE mE Do". Her council is 100% correct in doubting her ability to lead, her inaction has already cost them enough.
The writers seem to be completely allergic to allowing women to do anything morally reprehensible, prefering in turn to make them boring and completely uninteresting.
I see that Allicents chose is motivated by the fact that loving her children (other than Helaena or Dearon) has proven to be self-destructive. They are past the point in life where they will heed her advice, and will make their own reckless and misguided choices without thought of Allicent. Therefore, she now knows the realm is better off in the hands of Rhaenyra, but is no use to the Blacks. So she leaves, takes Helaena and hopes to never be seen again.
Is that so crazy of a move for Allicent? It’s definitely drastic but I dont see it as uninteresting nor SUPER out of character.
Also Rhaenyra has 6 dragons now, it's not like Alicent changed her mind on a whim, she's pleading mercy to Rhaenyra and the price is Aegon, who obviously has to die.
It baffles me how people see what they want to see even if it makes them hate the show.
Hilarious that you have the nerve to bring up misogyny when the actions of two sluts decide the fate of the entire realm. You've got viserys level of cope good sir
@@jadonskatoff4726 Maybe if Alicent actually tried to love and care her sons rather than just mould them into rulers badley they wouldn't ignore her at every turn. Alicent knows it's her fault Aemond and Aegon turned out the way they did, yet completely betrays them.
@@jadonskatoff4726 First off she is consenting to killing Daeron as well all male members have to die so she is fine with killing all her children to save 1 but fine you can make the argument that's the best she has, except it isnt! Helaena has a dragon she can just jump on it with Alicent and jahera and fuck off to Essos there is no need for this plot to consent to the death of her family if all she wants to save herself and her daughter. The writers put it clearly in interviews that this is about Alicent chosing Rhaenyra chosing her over the patriarchy and in this case over her own family, there is no other way to see this as a monstrous betrayal.
In this season we saw how Alicent's actions have destroyed her son Aegon completely, he didnt want to be King he didnt want this war she forced it upon and it destroyed him, he lsot his dragon, his body, his son and before all that he was completelly alone he had no support from her or anybody of her family or any real friends that werent superficial kissasses, Larys is probably the most support he ever had in his entire life and now after Alicent does all that she selling him like a bag of rice, to save herself no less, she doesnt even once tries to give her life for his which is a complete 180 for the ending of season 1, this is character assassination if I ever saw one and a completely monstrous thing to do and the writers are framing it as a redemption for Alicent, "She is finally free now" its abhorent and they want us to clap for it.
Sunfyre being "dead" is 100% a bait & switch. If he's actually dead, this has massive ramifications for the story later.
Another incident of Hollywood portraying action scenes unrealisticly for cheap shock value. The way they showed Sunfyre and Aegon crashing left little to no room for assuming that one of them is still alive.
There’s no way they killed off Sunfyre off screen, I imagined Aemond just told him that
Sunfyre's death, Corlys's entire war and rescue by Alyn, the destruction of an entire town by an angry Aemond, and more important plot points that I'm forgetting all happened off screen.
If Sunfyre is really dead, they should cancel this show already
They might have killed him actually. Will be cheaper and easier for them to film the show since their main excuse for fucks up, lack of budget and about 2 years of waiting for us between seasons are dragons. And by killing him they will have 1 less dragon to spend the budget money on in the future seasons
@@Freyja386 They literally can't cause Rhaenyra's death was told to us in GOT that Sunfyre killed her and ate her. Her son watched it. It's why he has such a fear and hatred of dragons.
@TheRibottoStudios I do agree, but (this is what I thought when I originally heard it, and hadn't read blood and fire) Joffrey just says "fed to her brothers dragon" which can just be vhagar. I hope they keep it as sunfyre, but they could change it, although it would be worse.
That Walker looks like he has seen some stuff lmao😭😭
"I've seen things you humans cannot even imagine... Season 8,for starters"
@@ultimateshipper8997"Our king sleeps in the nude. I will never get the image of his... icicle out of my head."
@@balsasjekloca9308 "I have seen the ending of HotD Season 3 : Rhaenyra, Alicent, and Mysaria in a threesome. Seven help us all."
- White Walker, traumatized
He's going through it, LMAO 😂😂
@@ultimateshipper8997 You beat me to it, LOL.
The show aims to depict its female characters as strong and independent, it actually strips them of their agency by avoiding showing them in a negative light. It’s like if “Game of Thrones” had made Cersei innocent and shifted all her villainous actions to Jaime, Joffrey, and Tywin. Alicent might be less evil now, but this also makes her a lesser character.
It makes her incoherent
I hate it, makes them so tedious and flat as characters. Cersei was excellent because she was morally grey and extremely polarising.
Helaena now being an astral-projecting greenseer, who can apparently see events as they happen - as opposed to in metaphor - was certainly a change
And the "son for a son" line was wild. Made no sense in context
HOTD S2 E8 is the definition of blue balls
😂😂😂
Just few episodes ago alicent was caressing aegon's cheek and saying 'I'm sorry', last season she pushed aegon behind her when faced with meleys and now suddenly she's okay with rhaenyra killing her son? Rhaenyra won't stop at killing aegon, she'll kill aemond and daeron too since they are the next male pretenders. Is alicent okay with them dying too? Wtf is this character assassination?!
Aemond? he isn't in the conversation - he is a goner automatically
@@schlechtgut8349 it's still bad writing though
Agreed. If Rhaenyra is to secure her succession, then Daeron also must be killed. I guess the writers kinda forgot about this.
Sunfyre dying has to be cap I’m gonna be pissed if so
This is gonna age well
@@igneo8005 no don’t say that! Please god please NO NO NO WAIT WAIT WAIT WAIT!! 😭😭
The thumbnail is the face I make when the long night meant just your ordinary night shift.
the problem with HOTD (like GOT unfortunately) is pacing, the first season had THREE time jumps and the second season almost had nothing of significance besides blood and cheese.
rooks rest?
The decapitation of a child waa forgotten immidiately.
Not only did they completely ruin the scene, made Cole and Alicent more responsible for it than Daemon and Rhaenyra, but now they're completely ignoring it happened. Rhaenyra still wants a son for a son after she was so "opposed" to it in the beginning lol
@@hollywoodjhawk7682 Rooks rest was 5 minutes 🤣
Even blood and cheese was inconsequential. No one remembers that happened and Rhanerya still wants a son for a son
Alan’s rant at Corlys was so well acted. Alan’s actor is definitely going places
Miguel Sapochnik's absence was felt quite a bit this season, his departure clearly hurt the show, I'm surprised how little people talk about it.
He was one of the main reasons why GOT was great. He had different creative writing and I’d say his was better. He was great for WTF moments and great epic battles and suspense. What we got was terrible in many ways. Writing, pacing, no sex scenes, weak couple minute battles, no shocking scenes or cliff hangers etc
@@trevylangton22 no way you wanted to watch hotd for the sex scenes
I watched Alicent sell out all of her children. Not even Cersei did this. What happened to the character who fought for her family? What happened to the character who would charge at Rae with a dagger when her kids were threatened? What is this character anymore? I mean this honestly felt to me like Jamie saying he never cared for the innocent and I absolutely disdain this creative choice. I don’t care about the writers fanfic I care about Georges material and this BS isn’t suggested by anything in fire and blood. FML this wasn’t it chief.
Exactly my point.
Normies seem to be completely ignoring this.
Ok so because Cersei didn't sell out her kids, Alicent shouldn't? They've shown throughout the entire season how alicent has been regretting how she raised her sons, and feeling guilty for their actions.
Maybe actually watch the show before commenting
She saw that her sons were monsters and didn't deserve fighting for. She realized Haelena and her daughter were the only innocents worth saving, and that their lives were more than worth the death of her two sons. She might also be trying to protect Daeron, who's described as kind and good as well. I think the show actually did her character a great favor, cause she's just a selfish, evil cunt in the book.
@@folklorian4368
She never wanted her kids to begin with, they also show how reluctant and how much she doesn’t want to do it. She still loves her children but one is becoming a monster, and the other is a drunk and crippled mess, and she is the kind of character to sacrifice her children for the good of the realm, as that’s all she raised to know by Otto. Otto severely cucked her at being a good mom, that’s not a writing flaw, it’s a character flaw.
I don't care about IMDb ratings since "Beyond the Wall" is still standing at a 9/10 there
LOL
*Vomits uncontrollably *
GoT fandom was on peak copium during S7. All the ImdB ratings are high for those episodes even though they all suck.
ah yes, gendry of house iron marathon and ravens can teleport now.
@@hhattonaom9729 dragon airlines too
I see people discuss the possibility of 2 last episodes being cut due to the limited budget.
Possibly, that could lead to some shuffling in the script - but still, whatever they had to do - this script had so many flaws, that it's very doubtful it would be better with 2 more episodes.
The story was dragged for 8 episodes, characters haven't been flashed out enough, dialogues in a great majority were simply boring. They just screwed that up massively.
You are exactly right. The writing was horrific in dozens of ways that are not explained by budget cuts.
If anything this season needed fewer episodes.
So... You think it is a redeeming factor of Alicent to promise to murder her own child, whom she has neglected his entire life, disowned, and forced on to the throne he didn't even want- only to completely destroy him emotionally when he asks for her guidance? Yea- Alicent truly is a beacon of virtue.
That final montage made me cringe so hard, especially since it was so unearned.
The fucking slo-mo of Alicent, actually below marvel-tier slop
Alicent - "To be honest I never cared about my family"
Daemon - "I dun wan it and she's ma queen"
Game of thrones season 7/8 vibes from this finale and season.
to be honest i dont care about the people, innocent or otherwise
That is not at all how alicents dialogue came across for me, she has shown that she has no motherly love for aegon and is terrified of aemond throughout this season so it’s not a complete U-turn like most are saying
Although forgetting about daeron is pretty stupid, however she’s forgotten about him all series haha
Cope harder @@bedeyoung4843
@@bedeyoung4843Considering her other two soms, and the fact that Dearon is inevitably joining the war, AND the fact that Allicent has only ever made things worse by making choices that protect her sons, If I were allicent I’d stay far away from that kid instead of watch him turn into the bloodthirsty monster that his older brother is. Irrational maybe, but safe.
While I enjoy your commentary, I really do wish you were more blunt and completely honest. It feels like you're walking on eggshells sometimes. We want to see brutal honesty
agree.
Just because something doesn’t fit your perspective of delivery doesn’t mean it’s lacking honesty or transparency
Or maybe he doesnt hate it as much as youd like...
It's kinda funny how he's ruthlessly picked apart season 6-8 of GOT (and rightly so), but seems to turn a blind eye to much of the blatantly shitty writing of HOTD, which imo has reached the same levels of garbage as those later seasons of GOT.
@@louwilliams2499 Yup. It's like he thinks he needs to use kind words just because he's gotten bigger. The writing is abysmal, hot garbage, you know it, I know it, we all know it. We waited 2 years for this crap, call it out.
It seems like the writers are scared to give Rhaenyra any urgency and make any decisive action because it might make her look bad. She has basically become Viserys this season and was just hoping the war would just go away. I wish they would make her character more like Dany where even though she makes mistakes she believes in herself and pushes ahead with pure will to get the throne
They have ZERO balls into making Alicent and Rhaenyra Monsters
The series Will end with BOTH going to Essos to this point 😂
Dude they are even showing signs that the universe wants Rhaenyra to be queen. In season 1, the forest scene with Cole where she encounters the deer or whatever. Then in season 2, Daemon's vision. There's no team green or team black. It's just true queen and devotees vs bunch of evil men.
The thing is it's fine if they want Rhaenyra to be like Viserys. But when Viserys was messing up the show let you know but with Rhaenyra they pretend that it's virtuous. Not to mention there is no consistency with her. In the finale she talks about how she will set dragons on Oldtown and Lannisport and then later talks about not wanting to hurt thousands of innocents. This while she is starving a city and sacrificed a ton of people to get dragonriders. Like it's so contradictory.
And don't even get me started on Alicent.
@@unc54exactly and these are supposed to be RUTHLESS TARGARYENS WHAT THE FUCK!!!
That's the whole problem. Both Alicent and Rhaenyra should be more comparable to Cercei and Dany, If anything.
A few things that could have made the season way better (SPOILER warning):
1. Spend more time with Jace traveling the Vale and the North securing alliances. The whole thing was condensed down to one scene right at the start and then he barely did anything. I know this would remove the emotional scene in episode one but I think this can be sacrificed and you can still have an emotional scene with him getting the message. Given that his character will die early in season 3 he was way too insignificant in season 2.
2. Reduce the Daemon scenes. While I agree that they are necessary for his character development 5-6 episodes of visions to finally come to a conclusion are too much. Since there are only 8 episodes it would have been better if he concluded his arc by episode 6 or 7 instead of in the finale. That way the finale episode has enough time to deliver something memorable.
3. Don’t show the alliance with the triarchy being brokered. Given they will attack the ship with Rhaenyra‘s children on the way to Pentos it would have had more shock value if the season would have ended with the ship appearing to be safe and suddenly being attacked. Then the season could have ended with the action setpiece of the first (and last) flight of Stormcloud delivering Aegon to safety setting up the Gullet early next season. Think it would have also been cool if we would have seen Otto with the triarchy hinting at the fact that he secretly brokered the deal (as he suggested to do in the book). With him being the reason Viserys got abducted, Stormcloud died and Jace died in battle his death after the sack of Kings Landing would be much better.
4. Introduce Daeron properly. Show the Hightower army and their leaders. And show us Daeron as a character in a few scenes. Then end the season with the Battle at Honeywine (you don’t even have to show the battle, just a short scene of Daeron saving the day and getting knighted for it to end the season and establish him as a player).
No no Daeron doesnt Matter is because of the Cast
Same (i Hope) with the 3 Blackwoods they all are kids, so season 3 or they Will GROW Up before they film
Now i was thinking better scenes :
Daemon talking with every Riverlords
not just 1 Bracken so you get PROGRESS EVEN WITH THE DREAM SCENES
Rhaenyra introducing the Black Council we never NEVER GET THE CHARACTERS AND THEY ARE EQUAL IMPORTANT has the Green Council (2 or 3 die)
Jeyne introducing her backstory to Rhaena so she gets the idea of having her OWN Destiny by riding a dragón, i want to remember the lady of Vale fought his family for the power and we NEVER SEE Rhaena having her OWN opinion only she walking around leaving her nephews i think, more like cousins ?
One SCENE ONE GODDAMN scene showing the Winter wolves saying goodbye to them families and explaining the "Winter tradition" of saving food by dying a glorious Death. Would explain why they are olds to the audience and being more sympathetic to the Starks and Blacks lets say
But no they wanted to show the smallfolk suffering and not the smallfolk watching the War as "good" in a viking way
And they want more Alicent or Mysaria scenes . . . What a Joke
If only you were part of the writers team
You guys, we just have to accept that the magic of the first 4 seasons of game of thrones will never be seen on screen again.
It's a good 8th of 10 episodes but a bad 8 episodes finally
It's a terrible episode with terrible writing no matter the season length.
@nunliski bro the writing isn't that bad, it is a horrible finale since it really does feel like ep 8 of a 10 episode season
@@nunliskithere was no “bad” writing lmaoo u just hate it since it was the finale
It's not even a good episode. It has some good scenes but it also has the stupid Rhaenyra-Alicent scene that completely tanks it.
@@unc54 it's a good scene wtf. You're just unable to separate the disappointment of the missing climax, what's bad about that scene is the grand maister smuggling alicent without any problems
This season was pretty much just a filler until season 3 when shit goes down
That's what they said about season 1 as well tho
Assuming things finally kick off in season 3.
In other words, the show is very badly written.
Cope. I can't wait for them to butcher it and have season 8-2 electric boogaloo
@@nunliskiare you just gonna comment under every single comment thread cause you have nothing better to do w your life?
Killing Sunfyre off would make no sense.... Sunfyre being alive is extremely crucial for probably the most impactful scene of the entire Dance....
Alicent sorta forgot about Jaehaerys' death
I find it hilarious that, after the disastrous season 2 finale, the people who made this show are assigning some blame to the writer's strike. Really?! For the last year, all I've been hearing is that HoTD was shielded from the effects of the writer's strike because it was a UK production. So which is it?! Sometimes it feels like we, the audience, are living in this show: _we're_ the smallfolk and the showrunners are the great houses deceiving, disrespecting, and manipulating us. 😂
I found myself feeling empty after the episode, and felt that something's were kinda rushed in this episode. I adore Asoiaf so hopefully season 3 will put the pedal to the metal.
It will be bad unless they fire all the current writers and hire a whole new set of good ones.
"Instead of the two episodes, here is an ad for GoT, watch it while we make season 3" Max execs thinking they're geniuses.
betting you if it does people will complain it's too fast.
@@TheRibottoStudios 😂 most likely but hey can't keep everyone happy
At least it didn't take 5 seasons to suck, I can quit now and not feel absolutely betrayed like with GOT.
Yeah I'm thinking at this point that I'm done with watching new episodes as they come out. Maybe if I get bored in a few years I'll revisit it with the luxury of being able to skip scenes or entire episodes.
It still hurts though. It has been a lot worse than I thought it would be.
yes quit now.. see u back when season 3 starts XD
@@nunliskigod you guys complain about everything , its really not that bad, maybe the acoylyte or rings of power is mroe your style 💀💀
Your comment makes absolutely NO sense. Wtf
@@rjdub8455 it does, he means at least it got bad early so he can quit early and not be so invested in the show then watch so many good season after good season to be a bit close to the end and start to turn bad that is makes the whole thing feel pointless anymore. I LOVE Game of thrones, but cos of season 8 and that Horrible final episode I find it hard to want to re-watch it all again. I would rather stop at season 7 tbh.
I feel like the pacing was bad. The tywin stuff just felt misplaced. The sheepstealer search just felt horrible placing wise. Alicent just pops up on dragonstone. Its the pacing that was so bad. That was part of the problem of this season
Stepstones = Tyrion walking, gaping, staring and arranging chairs
I find it funny how you totally bashed Got season 5-8 but hardly acknowledge any flaw of Hotd. The dialogues of Hotd has been average specially in season 2 it's very ordinary. They are keeping up with the main plot of the story but changing the small events that lead to the major
events. Which is creating plot holes. The characters are weak, Greens get hardly any screen time. Aemond only got 12 minutes of screen time in whole season 2. And they butchered Alicent's charecter this season. She was the one who forcefully made Aegon King and now Aegon is the villain and she's ready to leave him? She once almost took a kid's eye for her son and now she doesn't care if he lives. And why'd she tell Rhaenyra about her relation with Cole? I can point out many weak writing and plot holes it would take an hour to write all of them.
My main problem with the show is within the black allies. The greens are much more faceted and have different perspectives on war, so their meetings are often explosive and interesting. However, with blacks, writers seem to fear to mess around. Most of the characters don't have any entity ad they seem to be scared to mess Rhaenyra's character. Girl, it would have been much more interested, and equitative, if we have had both good and evil on both sides. The conflict should have escalated far from Alicent's a Rhaenyra's hands, and have them in a final scene, together, and watching how the war now is inevitable.
Yeah instead of “rhaenyra good and Greens bad”. It’s so boring
I’ve been trying so hard to avoid spoilers from social media only for Helaena to drop a massive one😂 that sucked and I hope they find a creative way to make Aemonds death happen besides him just getting wrecked at the gods eye like she was saying
At least he will have a glorious death. No Targaryen could ask for something more spectacular than what Aemond has in store. #Aemonddidnothingwrong
That scene was so fucking stupid goly shit
Also, Daemon's vision of the future showed Rhaenyra on the Iron Throne. The writers just straight up told us what is going to happen. This is fan fiction level writing.
It's such bad writing to have your own characters spoil other's deaths like that 😂 At least make it more cryptic
Joffrey spoils the ending of the whole show in season 2 of GoT. It is a prequel after all
was sick of seeing daemon get haunted for 8 episodes by some random hex witch
No. We need Daemons Haunted House Adventures spin-off -show now.
It’s not a random hex witch it’s Helaena. Pay attention.
They prefer the term „Hex Girl“
@@grantwilliams2650Who tf is Halaena?
yea, there's no sugar coating it. they fd up this season was such a filler that they have to cram everything together in the last 2 seasons cause it ends on season 4. there are a lot of important battles to tell this story and there's just no way they'll get the budget for all of them in just 2 seasons
They’ll probably just off screen a lot of battles or remove it entirely
Man imagine thinking anything about Alicent sacrificing her son makes sense, unsubbed
I could see how killing aegon in his state could be like a mercy kill, but considering Daeron, they just messed that up
@@johanwestin3030it’s completely out of character for Alicent both from S1 characterization and book Alicent. She is really going to sacrifice her entire family so she can go have margaritas in Essos after pushing her son onto the throne???
Bro’s riding the writers so badly
Use your f**** brain. Look at them. Alicent is not a monster but they are and she can't deny it any longer. The only logical thing she can do now is save her last child that can be saved and that she loves, Helaena. A show like this is honestly wasted on idiots like you.
@@Casboof Do you know what character developement means? She literally explained it herself and you7 dumbassed still dont get it. She always acted on duty and family, thats why she put Aegon on the throne. Now she's realizing that it was all for nothing and him and Aemond are beyond saving. What else can she do now other than make amends and try to spare Helaena and herself? I'm convinced you people are genuinely dumb.
I agree, i was really looking forward to Dany saying “liar liar pants on fire” to Daemon
Trump Hump?
Nah, I don't care anymore, good luck with everything.
See ya 😂
These 8 eps can easily be combined into 3 eps, and nothing of value would be lost.
I agree. I feel like 8 episodes was too much for that poor writing. Thank God we didn't have 10 episodes or we'll have Alicent and Rhaenyra run away together to Essos and live happily ever after 😂
Jamie had a character Circle not an Arch. Correct yourself
The whole episode was an insult to the audience
Dont forget Condal said in the Behind the Episode that Sharp Point is the seat for House Massey, when it isnt… im worried.
Good episode, horrible season finale considering we are getting edged for 2 years before we get to see the battle that was brewing
Yeah this should’ve been episode 5 or 6, it was good until they assassinated Alicient.
“Edged” 😂😂😂
yes, but Alicent also forgot that, even with Aegon gone, there are still Aemond and Daeron: what does she think Rhaenyra or Daemon will do? Spare their life? not unlike, since they are Aegon's heirs now. So who cares if they got killed, unless King's Landing and Haelaena and Jaehaera are safe?
What a sh*t plot.
Thumbnail: Disappointing.
Video: it wasn't that bad... If you squint real hard... U know, it was good. In fact I love stuff about it.
Ok....
True, his compliment shilling makes me nauseas, guess he just want clicks
So wehn he was complaining was rhat fir clicks aswell????. Is it a lose lose situation where if he moans its for clicks but if he praises it its also for clicks? @@Luna-ii4mx
😂😂😂😂 damn true
Hard disagree with the statement that this feels like Alicent Hightower's redemption arc. It was her who pushed Aegon onto the throne. He never wanted to be King, he even tried to flee from that responsibility at the end of Season 1, and since being forced to the throne, has only tried to do right by people and be a well liked King. Is he a good King? Of course not, he's a young lad with a boyish sense of humour and had no true connection with his father, who didn't bother teaching him how to be a good King.
So for Alicent, knowing all of this, to simply agree to throw Aegon to the wolves in a 'Son for a son' demand from Rhaenyra while completely disregarding that Aegon and Helaena have already suffered the death of a son is unforgivable. She knows that it was Aemond and Vhaegar who killed Lucerys, and Aemond who's essentially gone rogue and completely unhinged with his power. If she'd agreed to offer Aemond as recompense for his crimes but permit Aegon to flee into exile with her, I'd have probably understood it.
Though this is just Alicent foisting all responsibility onto Aegon, then shirking all blame and pinning everything on him, even though it was forced upon him by her. He's her sacrificial lamb so that she can run away and be free. She's probably one of the most evil and self-serving characters within the narrative at this point.
fact
Fun fact: if the season had ten episodes, we would've seen the fall of King's Landing to the Blacks, and a ton more of conflicts. If the season had some major battle occuring, it would be way more redeemable in my eyes, since right now season two exists solely for the buildup to season three. Very disappointing season, with filler scenes here and there, that could've been replaced with something more engaging.
Example: how come that Gwayne Hightower knows about Ser Criston and Alicent? How is this knowledge? I think a scene where a scandal broke out would've been way better than seeing the 681325125th scene of Daemon dreaming at Harrenhal. Just my two cents.
@@wraygun1481 I believe Gwayne pieced things together. He may have been suspicious because of the way the two shared looks or something, but he freaks out when he sees Criston sniffing (?) the favour Alicent gave him
He did see Alicent give Cole her favor, and this wasn't during a tourney.
You really think another two episodes can redeem this? Dude, Alicent and Daemon’s characters have been really unfortunately done this season.
I think gwanye was able to put the pieces together he see stares down alicent and cristan before the war and sees him receive that cloth and now hes all lovey dovey with the cloth in that scene
I'd forgive it if these seasons didn't take 2 years. Little annoyed to know that all my favorite shows won't finish till I'm 30.
hyping it up and then dropping the ball
hmmm where have i seen this before?
I got the vibe immedeatly when I saw the first scene with Tyland that we weren't getting a fight this episode. Because they wouldn't waste time in a climactic battle episode with that kind of scene. However, in a climactic "Building to the war the whole season has been building towards"-episode, I think it works. After that I was able to enjoy the gathering of armies, affirmations of loyalty and character scenes in the episode. Overall I really liked the episode but I have an issue with how the episode was marketed. The whole season has been building to the battle for King's landing, and the previews really made it seem like that battle was here. I feel kind of "blue balled" by this like I believe many others do too. Really good episode but I do believe one more episode in this season would have been great, because there really isn't much closure in this finale.
With all due respect, you should never be a writer. "Really good episode" oof
I swear every time they cut to Lannister and the triarchy I grunted and cursed under my breath
It’s insane how much goodwill was brought back via season 1 just for this… it’s not season 8 of GOT bad by any means but it’s in line with season 7 I personally feel.
This. It's season 7 of GOT all over again. No, the season wasn't completely awful, matter of fact, it had some very great and important moments in it, that fully align with the source material. But anything else was pretty much shallow Hollywood fan fiction writing.
The show itself has always been disappointing. The lack of "characters", people being REALLY stupid, people not being fleshed out and/or just being under developed, not knowing who to actually root for, no tension or stakes, and, for season 2, poor pacing and scenes that should've been earlier in the show.
I really want to like this show... I do... but it is just hard to...
Also, why a Whitewalker?
ALSO also, Otto was imprisoned!?
It’s like intermittently good, even great at times. But overall is absolutely not consistently good or great
otto is obv imprisoned because aemond doesnt want him to come back to court. just dont watch season 3 pls if you lack the patience or actual understanding 👍
Bro you are stupid you are calling this guy stupid for not knowing ameond imprisoned which he didn't do actually it was most likely that council guy who got killed by Cole family who imprisoned him @@d5nilo0o
@d5nilo0o cool what is great is that the director themself didn't even know where Otto was because the writers didn't tell the director or the actors and she states "I want to know where he is too." AND "They don't tell us, they don't tell any of us! They don't tell the actors, either. I don't think it's fair."
Also I am pretty sure Otto was just goin back home, but nah he is behind bars. What is great with that is SHOW him getting arrested. It's simple.👍
@@coopernut yeah for dumb people like you they might have to explain fucking everything so yall can complain about nothing happening even more. the show isnt as close to as shit as yall dumbfucks are making it out to be :D just dont watch season 3 but no u claim to hate it but u will keep watching like everyone will
"Since this episode has A LACK OF ACTION" literally fight in shit 😭
The only reason I can think of to why they showed that whole Tyland Lannister crap is that he’s gonna become a big player in season 3
Obviously he is a good actor and . . . His brother is not very important
He's a completely hollow character. There is nothing going on there.
@nunliski, you haven't read the book?
@@califailure1082I have, and what that guy said is true.
Tyland is completely hollow character on the show. We know pretty much nothing about him.
Not showing the side characters is a big flaw of HotD.
No, it was all about the Trans CZcamsr playing the female pirate. It's basically another meaningless Ed Sheeran cameo.
Sara Hess, one of the writers, has said that the cut from 10 to 8 was not their choice. It also seems that the cut was announced AFTER the writing for the season had finished. So it seems quite possible that the season had already been written as a 10 episode season before the 8 episodes cut was announced (because HBO executives wanted to save money). There seem to have been slight rewrites, but they couldn't rewrite the whole thing. I think that's why we ended up with such an underwhelming finale, because it wasn't meant to be the finale originally.
Beyond that, I'd say this season is at about the same level as season 5 of "Game of Thrones." I found it mostly enjoyable, but it has some significant issues as well. Although its issues are different from the ones season 5 of GoT had.
In this case the issues were more that some character arcs were kind of muddled or inconsistent, it had some significant pacing issues and it had some really questionable moments (like Rhaenyra being able to get into King's Landing).
To be fair, as a book reader, I have to say that the writers had a difficult job. In season 1 they focused heavily on Rhaenyra and Alicent, but in the book around this time Rhaenyra and Alicent have almost nothing to do. So the writers had to somehow give them stuff to do, but without allowing them to greatly affect the course of events (since that would then cause the show to no longer be a proper adaptation). Not an easy job.
Thought we wouldn’t notice what you were trying to do at 9:55 😂😂
5:16 yes was Zaslav putting the knife in Ryan Condal's neck. Zaslav is literally making cut after cut of budgets projects doing this with his major tv show is so dumb because HOTD is the most viewed tv show on HBO since GOT
The writing is well below par who gives a shit about budget
@@jensen5160 the writing is not that bad you are overreacting and yes budget is important for a large scale war
@@MarcosSantos-dj6lk When the writing breaks immersion I'd say it's bad writing. Budget is the least of HotDs problems
@@jensen5160 not all episodes was bad, the problem with season 2 was less 2 episodes, and only one was bad episode 3. For me was a solid 7/10 season. Season 1 is 8;5/10
HotD's writers are doing a very good job of ensuring that future ASOIAF shows get low ratings.
I gave up after episode 6
Just the video I was looking forward to, this was SUCH a disappointing finale, not because of the lack of action scenes or the plot moving forward but the fact that how STUPID Alicent and Rhaneyra and all the characters are in the end.
I can't BELIEVE Alicent is like yeap I am selling out my sons to you Rhaneyra, do whatever you want, even though you got my grandson killed and my son Aegon the King is almost dead but screw my children.
WHY the teleportation from Season 7/8 of Game of thrones back? We saw Rhanerya go to kings landing like it was nothing and then Alicent shows up at Dragon Stone just like that LOL
I thought these women HATED each other? At the end of season 01 we saw there was no going back and now these two women are confused and ready to sell out their children to maintain "peace".
Daemon's character was the most disappointing this season, the references to white walkers and Game of Thrones in general completely ruin his character.
Let’s not forget that Alicent was the one dragging Aegon kicking and screaming to his own coronation. He would have fled to Essos if not for her and Otto trying to find him last season. The fact that she is trying to wash her hands of the guilt and put the blame all on her sons is annoying and kind of makes her an even bigger hypocrite/villain than the writers were probably intending.
Um bruh are you forgetting King's Landing and Dragonstone are neighbors?? Other travel takes a while but they're literally side by side. Idk why people are forgetting this very simple fact, look at a map of Westeros.
Kings landing and Dragon Stone are super close to eachoter it's not teleportation at all.
I think he meant to say Harrenhall not KL. And Harrenhall and Dragonstone aren't exactly neighbours, so yeah, teleportation is back
@jarrettmaynard6306 dragon stone and kings landing are NOT neighbors. Dragonstone is literally on the other side of the bay from kings landing and also there's literally a fucking blockade of kings landing going on right now so how tf did she get past it? And why'd they just let her speak to Rhaenyra without arresting her first like they did Mysaria?
God they left us with the biggest blue balls in history
Dam…
And honestly they just leave Rhaena like that wander off into the mountains? lmfao like that's ABSURD. WHY would a royal simply wander off into the mountains ALONE and expect to catch a dragon? like what? just the weather alone is insanely dangerous
Oh stop coping. This episode fucking sucked. They tested us with Last of Us by saying the first episode was longer. It was received positively. So they cut the season by another episode.
This entire season for the most part was trash. The character development- I’m sorry, no Daeron? What the FUCK was Daemon doing for so many episodes at Harrenhal. There were opportunities to focus on other characters. We could have definitely gotten more develop Cregan. Also completely skipping that scene with Aemond you know what fuck it.
We didn’t even get the first battle of tumbleton, and how terrible the sacking was. Disappointing and I see why GRRM was disappointed as well
My only issue was they ended Season 1 with a call to war and this season had some war but felt like fourplay. I don't have any issues with the season finale but it was just building up to next season. Are we waiting another 2 years for the next season? ugh
You sold out and praised this pos show all throughout the season, what were you smoking between the last season of got and now?
How is Helaena being a greenseer make sense? She should be a distraught mother who sentenced her son to death and be wrecked with grief plus guilt.
house of the dragon should've done 10 episodes instead of 8, it makes no sense why any series that needs 10 episodes cut it down to 8
4:17 The orange flickering in her crown makes Rhaenyra look like a highway maintenance vehicle with flashing warning beacons.
Am I the only one who thinks Sheepstealer looks terrible?
The design is significantly worse than the standards set by the rest of the dragons. Face is barely recognizable and blurry, feels like a rush job.
He also appeared way smaller then he should
Agreed he looks weird and should be twice the size. Really bad quality and I dont understand why the spines on his wings are so extremely curved
They could make it better in 3 steps.
1) Alicent organizes an official mid-way no-dragons diplomatic talk with Rhaenyra. No silly crawling around King's Landing. There, you get the Alicent and Rhaenyra talk, resulting in Alicent being desperate.
2) No Daemon's vision, but just understanding of the hard role the ruler has to play. Actively doing the decision of yielding before Rhaenyra. Not because he knows the outcome but because he sees it as the right thing.
3) Rhaenyra and Daemon planning to attack King's Landing without Alicent's crawling around Dragonstone. Daemon actually being useful telling Rhaenyra about hordes of gold cloaks that are loyal to him.
Easy as that. On top of that, even more tragic of a story. No need to assassinate Alicent and Daemon
It's very obvious that the writers are firmly on team Rhaenyra. They have written Alicent badly and recently they have dropped all pretence of her being a character, with her own goals and motivation. The whole reason Alicent helps start the dance is to save her children, knowing Rhaenyra will put them to death. Now she sells out her entire family, not because it makes sense but because the writers hate her. They see Rhaenyra as a strong feminist and Alicent as an enabler of patriarchy. So instead of a story of 2 sides of the same family fighting with complex motivations we have patriarchy vs feminism.
The idea that a princess tasked with serving the remaining children of a queen at war can just run off on an adventure is just...ahhhhhhhh it's so terrible
Good season but a Disappointing one too... expected more