Locksmithing 101 | Re-keying locks? Don't make this mistake!
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- čas přidán 7. 06. 2024
- In this locksmithing 101 video, we expose a common locksmithing mistake! When rekeying commercial locks, it's easy to miss this step. PJ starts with re-keying a Rim cylinder the wrong way. Can you catch the step he missed?
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![[70] How to Rekey Mortise Cylinders](/img/n.gif)
I always check for master pins even in residential. Some builders use contractor keyed locks that contain master pins. On older homes it may have been a rental at some time that was masterkeyed. Never hurts to check every lock, every time. I find it doesn't take much time and I find master pins in locks where you would never expect them. #lockboss
I'm planning to master-pin my house... So, yeah. :)
(The house is technically a duplex, and while I'm currently just using it as a big house, I want to have keys that only open one unit or the other, in addition to a master key for everything, so... yeah, that's the plan. :) )
You missed checking the bottom pin to top pin sizing for each pin cell or chamber. When rekeying cylinders like Sargent and Schlage you must consider Pin Stack Height to prevent spring compression. If you replace a low bitting or smaller pin with a longer or deeper one without replacing the top pin the spring may crush when you insert your change key and may even trap the key. The performance of the cylinder may suffer due to "Key Insertion Pressure". If you apply the same considerations when replacing larger bottom pins with smaller you would have less spring pressure, etc. The CLK pin kit chart shown in the video shows the correct size top pins for each bottom pin. Be sure to check it out and use it when needed. Make another video explaining this and keep up these amazing and well constructed Five Star educational videos! You're a winner PJ!
Made this exact mistake before. Luckily I was able to get the key out and once I dumped the top pins, I realized my mistake.
I have never in life rekeyed anything, I watched this one time and understood the entire process. There is a guy here that is charging people to do this as if anyone has time to mail their locks to this guy and wait for it to come back. He also makes it seem like you must replace the wagers which you don’t. Thank you my man you are awesome
That tool will come greatly in handy thanks!
Man I've got to get one of those! That would have saved sooo much time.
I use the HPC TPIN-2 Top Pin Loader after letting all the drivers and springs fly out by just pulling out the plug without a follower (check to make sure all springs are out)-- Load up the HPC Top Pin Loader with new springs & proper size drivers. Then I know I've loaded new springs with the proper length drivers. A fast way to load springs & drivers (as long as you are aware to use the correct drivers in relation to the key pins / key bitting). A bit of a pain, but works for me
ALSO the Keedex "EZ LOAD" is a great tool for doing chambers one at a time -- simple & fast.
I like the Pro Lock LT. 370 , didn't know about this tool.
Thanks
I use the master pin follower for every lock I re-key....without fail for the reasons you stated in the video.
Got to keep a lookout for the rare master pin that exceeds .100" though.
cj, great video! i actually use same version of prolok follower.
it makes it so much easier. like how you showed everybody the correct way of using!
Thanks Jerry -PJ
I just bought the master key followed. The follower should have been made with a ramp on the top front so it can be removed out the back of the lock cylinder without trapping the longer top pins after the master pins are removed. Sometimes it can’t be rotated to remove the follower from the lock cylinder. Try it. Jim
With that Pro-Lok follower, be careful of the engraving on the low area. I ran into the top pins binding in the engraving and had a heck of a time getting it to release them.
That's was a awesome tool the lck. I'm trying to get those pins out but don't have the best tool. Thank You for sharing and showing.
Andre C.
Thanks for that valuable Info. I have to get that tool Vaughn BK Locks
Very nice tool!
I tend to drop all top pins out for any commercial building rekey. I can check for master pins, check correct length top pins and that the springs are still good. Also provides a chance for me to upsell the client to spool or security pins for future pick resistance
Shaweet!!-PJ
I have this master pin follower it's nice and all, but just don't trust it. I find it faster to just dump the cylinder on a pinning mat then to check the chambers individually. It also gives you better look at the springs and wear on the top pins in older locks. Also you can check the uper chambers for wear.
Good point - PJ
Agreed
I don't usually have time to dump every lock!!!!
Not only for the cross keying scenario, but sometimes the key itself won't release. Which is a tell tale sign that a larger master pin is in the cylinder that the follow through tube didn't get.
Definitely have to get that
Shove the tweezers in three deep drop the masters and repeat on the rear of cylinder. Favorite plug follower is what learned on HPC hollow brass follower. Still using the same plug follower from 1998 and on my 4 shim.
Impressive!!! -PJ
I have a need for one for sure.
Good job 👍👍
I just bought one. New to this but getting very interested in doing the master locking. Great info. #lockboss
Awesome!-PJ
Love the right tool
Brilliant bro! I won’t do this, but handy to ask my locksmith if he’s checking for those on my house. Idk if it’s standard practice to use master pins on a house, but nice to know!
It is not. You may come across "contractor keys" which function on a similar principle but only for one use. (There is a small pocket which holds the function physically after the first use). This is wildly uncommon to be utilized in my experience.
very good job
Yeah try that with an F series, the top pins come out too regardless of the special follower. ON the plus side, I like the technique with the tweezers. Surprisingly I never thought of that although I might try it with a screwdriver instead.
Keedex master pin follower is my favorite.
Nice job
Nice tool..
That was helpingful
What do you when it comes to using the follower for master pins and there spool pins ? Usually the spool pins 2 or 3 get caught and have to start a whole new Rekeying of lock including spring and top pins ... any suggestions 🤔
I use the Pro-lok follower every time!
Definitely not checking for top pins, ALWAYS check, even if the customer tells you it's NOT masterkeyed....
Also, because you said "assuming it's a large office building job", but even if it's just a multi door residential... another thing I'd like to bring up... label the cylinders... (I use sharpie on the back) that way everything goes back where it was... A lot of times, especially if you're dealing with older or "well used but still functional" hardware, doors that have settled, etc... putting the exact cylinder back in the exact same locks can save some time.... It's one of those things that "IN THEORY" shouldn't make a difference, but you add a few years of heavy use, and even if the cylinder's still good, it can be a time saver.
Yep, I learned the hard way on rekeying a movie theater, by myself, years ago. On larger jobs, ALWAYS MARK and put the same cylinders back on the doors/locks they came from. Some of the KIK cylinders were modified and I hadn't noticed. Took me an extra 30-45 min. to find out where they were supposed to go. #LessonLearned
Haven't tried teasers yet had trouble with the other but now watching video I think I'll be ok with it. #Lockboss
I just do it manually, but I do have a Keedex follower that is quite nice for demastering.
Yes it is!
Great video. I never got into it this deep. I didn't know about those master pins. I never ran into them before. Is it storefront locks that have that?
So what are they for anyway?
Thanks 👍
All locks can have master pins in them. Master pins are used for master keying (more than 1 key fits the lock)
you will see them in any lock on anything: business, house, rental, small, large etc etc. Always check for master pins
I check every cylinder being re-keyed for top pins, master, and springs. Have had new locks missing springs and or top pins. Also can check for to short or worn springs and stuck top pins. Takes like 3-5 seconds to check everything.
Always check for master pins #BOSS LOCK
How long has this tool been around? Will this model work on Schlage "C" cylinders?
Large Commercial bldg., I put all pins in order in a pin tray and try to call the bldg owner to ask if this still needs to be on the master. If yes I can usually decode for the master, some owners have keying charts to obtain a new change key bitting. If charts are not available you can look at other keys, possibly in a key cabinet to see what key cuts have been used and what other cuts can be used without interchange, THAT'S THE RIGHT WAY !
#lockboss.great info
I’ve had that follower. But a few years ago switched to the Keedex. Seems smoother for me
Thanks for sharing! -PJ
That is good video I have ru into this myself I wish I known about this video before I did the Job
Glad it's helpful-PJ
If I suspect master pins, I just let the guts spill on the table. After this, I clean the cylinder, which it often needs, and put each spring and driver back in with tweezers. I have found a lot of messed up springs doing it this way, and feel better about having a fully clean, inspected, and lubricated mechanism before it goes back to work for my tenants.
Nice
If I suspect masters I check a few positions and then dump everything as soon as I find anything. Works everytime.
Can a 6-pin key fit into a 5-pin cylinder. if that's what's provided in a rekey kit?
After awhile I just started dumping everything out. Top pins and springs just to check everything out. Did this when master keying a building. Don't want any extra master pins slipping in there.
I like that tool so much I bought one from you #Lockboss
I have the master pin follower, purchase it from CLK Supplies 👍😎🤠🇺🇸
I never would’ve thought about the master pins. Do you have to worry about the springs when you it back together? Awesome video!! #lockboss
Typically not unless something does not feel right-PJ
@@clksupplies do you have any tips on rekeying a lock or padlock with a crimped core?
I like to use the special tool for the master pins
seem work 🎉🎉🎉
great tool b ut what about adding security pins #lockboss
I definitely need to order extra parts. I always tend to lose parts but luckily I tend to hoard old locks that I have something to figure it out but would be nice to have organized parts #lockboss
I was going too say you didn't check the top lol .😎
I have/use the keedex master follower but prolok looks to be of high quality also...#lockboss
As I’m getting into Lock Smithing I was doing it the hard way stumbled across this video and it was a no brainer ordered it in and not going back to the old way unless I absolutely have to🤘👍🏻😜 I love me so new tools #lockboss
Yes! Such simple tools are game changers! -PJ
I always check all my locks that I rekey for the master pins and check condition of the pins. #lockboss
True #Lockboss style! 🙌-PJ
I'd like to have that tool
Going to have to get one asap. #lockboss
🙌-PJ
Hello from servicepro1 Ottawa Ontario Canada
I do a building that had master system. I bought a special follower to chec for left in masters#lockbox!
YES! Love it #Lockboss-PJ
From my experience, I found its always best to check top pins manually. Yes this would be a time saver IF the lock hasn't been rekeyed by an idiot that put too small of top pins in. But in locks with constant use, you can also check easier for spring fatigue. Just a matter of preference, I suppose.
Considering that the shortest top pin in the Schlage cores we use is .165" and the recess area of the follower is .100", we've never had any issue losing top pins. The only potential problem is with master pins #7-9, all of which are longer than .100", but we have only a few cores that require a #8 master pin. Fair point about the springs though.
I have never found a spring fatigued LOL! I have found springs that get sucked into the pin chamber when the top pin is missing and it gets into the pin chambers everywhere. I think "pin fatigue" is a way for Big Spring industry to sell springs.
Master Pin Follower for sure; but; as you probably did at some point….learning to use “tweezers” a d do other way can be important, but having a Master Pin Follower is definitely easier as saves so much time👍🏻
I use the Po Lock
I've had issues trying to spin it back when security pins are present
Hi Chris, I will have to put some security pins in and try it! Do you find the problem with Spool, Serrated, or both? -PJ
@@clksupplies I've only tried it with spool pins never tried it with serrated as I'm usually rekeying Schlage OEM locks that have come with the spool pins already in them
But honestly if I'm re-keying a lock that has been on a building for quite a while I usually put new Springs and top pins in any way since I'm already out there
@@chriswalter2971 Yeah, I dump all chambers and when I'm finished I'll know exactly what's in there. But I use the Keedex EZ loader: www.clksupplies.com/products/keedex-ez-load-quick-drive-spring-loading-tool
I had the same problem
I'm just a "commoner", but am researching rekeying new tenant locks on a private house I own. What is a "master pin"???
It’s a set of pins that ride on top of the normal pins, allowing the lock to also be opened by a second, “master” key, usually controlled by the landlord and/or superintendents. CLK has some stuff on master key setups that you can watch. Good luck! ✊🤓💜 czcams.com/video/sdSlkxDmjjw/video.html
@@serversurfer6169- Thanks!
I know my question may not be on subject, but I am trying to understand why a key for an apartment entrance comes out in any position. Does not have to be returned to the lock position to remove key.
For keys to operate, they physically move pins to a shear line that allows the plug to rotate. The pins have to be able to move past the shear line as the teeth pass underneath (when the key is inserted or removed) until the pins eventually settle into the appropriate notch. If the pins have nowhere to go (i.e. the plug is turned and they're hitting the inside of the housing), the key becomes locked in place. So there are only two ways for that to happen:
1. The key is flat and all the bottom pins are the same length (like a setup key with all #9 pins, or a key blank with all #0 pins).
2. There are no pins are all. If that's the case, then anything that can fit into the keyway can unlock the door. Have you tried locking and unlocking with a screwdriver?
If the cylinder has spool pins it is almost always a rebuild. PJ design a new follower that fixes that and make that $$.
William, Now we're talkin! haha- PJ
I use mine all the time #lockboss
What's the name of this tool please?
not only that, yo! don't forget to check the height of the driver pins to make sure you don't collapse the springs, and to be the most pick resistant that a standard cylinder can be (without factoring in spool drivers, etc...) or else, why would original brand manufacturers do that which i outlined above ? there must be something they know that is not mentioned in your videos...
Sorry for my ignorance, but how do you determine best top pin size? I have noticed there are different sizes. Why would one go with a larger or smaller one and in which situation would you go with one or other?
Pro lock
Does this kind of lock not have a c-clip either? That's what I thought the mistake was at first lol!
Mortise and Rim Cylinders typically use the screw on cap! -PJ
Help I inserted the wrong pin and now it won't turn.
I was thinking it was the master pin. #LB
Nice!-PJ
I got the follower that dumps them out. #lockboss
I was more concerned that you didn't screw the tail piece back on.
what if you don't have the key? can you rekey it
Yes-PJ
You can use a shim, but the core must be out first. If you mean if door is locked and closed you must pick the lock open or somehow have access to inside part of door to remove the core. Then pick or shim the core in order to turn the cylinder so you can remove it so you can rekey it
Forgot to check masters
You missed the door!!
Why not open the back side?
No sure what you mean -PJ
what happen if you rekey and forget about the master pin
Other keys could fit the lock-PJ
Not really after watching the video i came up with a sequence to rekey a core and i didn't remove those master pins and tried multiple keys didn't open the door. Just master key that i reeked. But pj could be right
Just reload the top..
How do you not blink dude? How?
Lol talent -PJ
Why would you just take them out, aren't they there for the fire dept to have a copy?????? Or the property manager or someone???
If you rekey a lock, and don't know the master pins are in there, you make it so they don't work anymore.
I find it easier to use the tweezers. If the lock is worn no master is needed I sometimes use bottom pins point down. As top pins. Also
Works if the change key and master
Are to close. In other word less the .030
Jim, thanks for sharing! -PJ
Is it me or did this guy not blink his eyes thruout the whole video!! Or most of the video??
Typically when doing CoRu locks they are hot, and this is it.
Using the tool is better.
WHY ARENT YOU BLINKING
Forgot to?
@@clksupplies FAIR ENOUGH FANTASTIC PRODUCT THOUGH. IVE HAD IT FOR MONTHS AND HAVE USED IT JUST ON PAR WITH MY REGULAR FOLLOWER
Awesome!-PJ
You didn't shim it
It's "2021" and realtors are no longer allowed to say "Master" bedroom as it's not politically correct. What the heck are we now going to call the "Master" pins in a lock?
Primary pins! That simple!
@@001roodynahh master pins are good
I still say master bedroom
What's so not politically correct about it
@@NikoBellaKhouf2it comes from slavery
I use mine all the time #lockboss