Are Magicians Getting Lazy? | Magic Viewpoint
Vložit
- čas přidán 27. 08. 2024
- Destructive Criticism Is Harming Magic | Magic Viewpoint
TO CHECK OUT THE NUMBER ONE MAGIC STREAMING PLATFORM PLEASE VISIT
www.thenetrix.com
Check out the latest Craig Petty products below! 👇👇👇
www.magictv.org
Destructive Criticism Is Harming Magic | Magic Viewpoint
Welcome back to Magic TV. This Friday, Craig talks about Magicians and if they are getting lazy? From releases to rehearsing, the amount of work put into a lot of magic seems to be lacking recently. Is this a trend being seen elsewhere by magicians?
👇👇👇
Magic Lives! - Everyday At 6PM! 👇👇👇
Every day Craig performs amazing well-known tricks that are famous across the magicians world!
• Magic Live - Daily Clo...
5 X 5 Magic! - Mondays At 9PM! 👇👇👇
Every week Craig Petty talks about 5 totally random topics and only has 5 minutes to get his point across!
• 5 x 5 Magic - Every Mo...
Talk Magic! - Tuesdays & Saturdays At 9PM! 👇👇👇
Every Tuesday on Magic TV we present Talk Magic. This is where Craig Petty will interview a different magician!
• Talk Magic - Tuesday a...
Craig & Ryland's Magic Reviews! - Wednesdays At 5PM! 👇👇👇
Check out all our review shows starring Craig Petty and his young son Ryland Petty. They review the latest magic products and give excellent feedback!
• Craig & Ryland's Magic...
Magic Stuff! - Thursdays At 9PM! 👇👇👇
Each episode of Magic Stuff is about a totally different subject but they all have something in common: they are about close up magic!
• Magic Stuff - Thursday...
Review Show Revisited - Fridays at 9PM! 👇👇👇
The Review Show Revisited looks back at some of the reviews Craig & Ryland have done on Magic TV. You get to see a live performance of the routine and even a commentary track over the top.
• Review Shows Revisited
Honest Trailers! - Saturdays At 12PM! 👇👇👇
Every week we upload an Honest Trailer for a magic product. These are what magic trailers should be like if they were 100% honest!
• Honest Trailers - Satu...
Q&A Sessions With Craig! - Sundays At 12PM! 👇👇👇
Craig Petty answers any questions that have been asked on the CZcams Channel over the course of the previous week. If you have any magic related questions at all, let us know and Craig will answer them!
• Q & A Session - Sunday...
Review Show Special! - Sundays At 9PM! 👇👇👇
Craig takes a deep dive into specific products & creators of magic and reviews several of their creations. We even have special guests join on occasions as well!
• Review Show Special - ...
Follow Magic TV on our Facebook & Instagram for future magic updates!
Facebook - / magictvwithcraigpetty
Instagram - / magictv_craigpetty
#CraigPetty #Ellusionist #MagicTV
Good point Craig: “not being able to after weeks of practice.” As a former lead guitarist there are songs that I just couldn’t master. I’ve heard from a befriended neurologist that this is neurological, you can approach it but never get proficient or excellent on it. But it can also be because of poor technique or lack of basic knowledge. When Steve Vai in his master class gave me two pointers my playing ability went from a 7 to an instant 8.5.
But in magic I religiously practiced the push through false shuffle.
I’m one of the few magicians I see that can do it because it takes a lot of time to get it right.
But when you get it, it’s in there for life. I haven’t performed magic in a serious setting for almost 13 years but that false push through riffle shuffle is engrained and I can do it even though I hadn’t used it in years.
Actually one time during a games evening I shuffled cards and put them in the center (those colleagues knew I was a performing mentalist and (magic) special effects artist), so I said: “sorry let me check I think I may have false shuffled them. And indeed the last game end were still nicely in order. It was just auto pilot. I wasn’t allowed to shuffle anymore that evening 😂
When working in magic shops, I used to love showing an ambitious card routine with a regular deck THEN show the same effects with a Svengali Deck. 😮
Different methods,
same reactions. ✔️
To give some anecdotal evidence to the contrary, I'm a young magician and I only do sleight of hand, especially the gambling side of things (riffle shuffle work, false dealing etc), and I have a friend in his 60s who only does self working stuff, not even a pinky break. My magic education baseline comes from the 50s, royal road and expert card technique.
I agree! Bob Cassidy used to say the easy way is actually the hard way. I think part of the problem is that there are a group of creators that are not performers. I used to be magicians made their money through performing. Then they came out with a book. Now, there are people, that in my perception, only have the goal to sell magic, not perform. So they have to appeal to the largest audience.
I am the complete opposite, I am a ‘tight’ magician and can’t bring myself to pay dealer prices for something I can replicate with sleight-of-hand anyway and I dismiss immediately any card trick that doesn’t use a regular deck. My current lecture is all sleight-of-hand with all items coming from hardware stores, eBay, craft shops, antique fayres… I spend hours on magic most days and, thanks to the notable exception of Cube 52 (54?), I am now addicted to cube magic.
I have bought tricks that require skills that are still outside my abilities. I put some aside for awhile, but I don't abandon them or give up.
One trick I decided to master, I practiced months before performing it.
It was worth it. And, without contradiction, time is a limited resource.
I started with Card College and Expert coin magic, no gaffs, no self working tricks. After many years, mastering sleight of hand, adding gaffs and self working tricks took me to the next level. If you only want to do self working material you just hit the ceiling way too soon.
who here has bought Mnemonica to learn a mem deck but only to have the book sit on their shelf because it is too much work? I was one of those people, in fact I sold my first copy only to buy it again. 10 years sitting on my bookshelf, I finally learned it. I would say, I was just a procrastinator.
As a hobbyist, I have limited time to practice sleight of hand. Therefore I tend to focus on utility moves that can be used in lots of tricks. I'd rather be able to do a really smooth shuttle pass instead of practicing a dozen sleights and mastering none of them.
To be honest, I like putting the work in especially where other people are not willing to because it’s too technically difficult. Additionally, the laziness that you’re describing could be from there being more total laymen magicians not less willing to put the work in. We had a similar problem in Freemasonry in decades where we were more popular with the general public.
I think you hit the nail on the head, in regard to people who only use gimmicks sacrificing flow. Gimmicks can be great tools that allow you to create miracles in cleaner and more magical ways (sometimes) but it’s important to know slight of hand to move gimmicks in and out of play, flow between tricks and routines, and SoH is especially useful when it comes to impromptu magic or jazzing.
I could speculate and say that people just want instant gratification these days due to the world around us being optimized for it through social medial and such. Why practice a difficult sleight of hand trick for days/weeks/months until you perfect it when you can just use a gimmick that does it for you with little to no practice?
The magicians who really put in the work and master the sleight of hand will always be the better magicians at the end of the day, in my opinion.
Oh one thing that I don’t like about the magic community - and that goes for old and young. Is to literally copy a routine up to even the patter! If I want to see the original I put on a dvd or go to the investors show. Take those methods and concepts and make them your own. Write your own latter, come up with your own premise. You can still do the Titanic life and death test, but make it contemporary or bring it into another fictional story with your own photos.
I performed Cross Roads a lot but instead of using those cards and doing the patter on selling your soul and the cross roads I made it into a gambling cheating poem. After 13 years I can still remember it.
1, 2, 3 cards I hold.
But I’m a cheater, I’ve been told.
There four or probably even more.
But all you’ll ever see is 1,2,3
Etc etc.
You make it your own but that takes time and effort. A lot of performers just instantly want the accolades. But you must ask yourself what accolades are those? It’s basically the work of another you shamelessly copy and not even reinterpret or even add or substract to it. Making it uniquely your own interpretation.
Which made me bored with the magic scene.
Don’t get me wrong, for kids and starters it’s great, it’s like covering a song. It hones your skills but when you get proficient, let go and make your own effects using the principles there are or even create your own to achieve an effect.
The latter is really hard but so full filling. It’s basically being an engineer solving problems - nothing gives more satisfaction than solving a problem.
Craig, WOW!!! So much to unpack in this video and I do applaud you for asking a difficult, hard yet important question. I think that the answer is very unique and subjective to each one of us that engage in magic. We get out of magic (and any other activity that we engage in) as much as we put in and we all get into magic for very different reasons, at very different stages of life (I got into magic at 50) and for all very different reasons. I think that part of the answer is driven by: what do you want to get out of magic? For me is entertainment and fun with friends and family and if I can do an effect (well performed of course) with a gimmick or two and be entertaining, then I don’t see a problem with it. here’s an example: you mention in the video that you have a hard time doing Dary’ls hotshot cut (I can’t even begin it! 🤦♂️). Would you really forego a trick that requires a move/moment that looks like it if you could use a gimmick? I think that performance and presentation are more important than method because either way (sleight of hand or gimmick) our art, in order to be truly impactful must be completely invisible. Yes gimmicks can make life a lot easier but you still have to practice and figure out a way to use the gimmick in an invisible and effective matter. Now if you are a purist and really enjoy nuckle buster moves the go ahead and use pure sleight of hand. The other point that I’d like to call attention to is: how much are magic creators contributing to this “laziness” by advertising “easy to do” “no skills/practice required” “open the box and be ready to perform in 3’ minutes” tricks? I think this is a very important conversation to have if we want to keep magic evolving in a healthy manner but probably YT is not the right platform for this conversation. Happy to engage! All the best and thank you for all you do for our community! Happy 2024!
Great points! Thank you for sharing.
So I'm an outlier because, when I came back to magic a bit over a year ago, I decided to specifically focus on coin magic and difficult sleights because that's what would satisfy my various needs (I'm a fidgeter and need something to do with my hands often, so why not use that as practice?). That said, I have given up material because of difficulty, though not in the way you might expect. At this point, I have a pretty good understanding of what I gravitate towards in terms of sleights and demands of a trick, and so sometimes I'll come across something that's above my current difficulty level, and is difficult in a way that I'm just not interested in diving into and so I skip it. Memdeck work is a good example: it's something I don't do, that would take a lot of upfront time to learn, and while I could put in the time if I wanted to, right now I'm not interested enough in the results of that labor for the labor to be worth it. That will probably change for me in the future, but that's where I'm at right now.
I wouldn't be surprised if this is part of the issue when it comes to people who only do gimmicked stuff. There's so many ways to be a magician, and people will gravitate towards different things. Some folks wanna be sleight of hand master, some want to be gimmick builders, some just want moments of magic to highlight themselves and their personality. There is difficulty inherent to all those avenues, and if someone has a sense of which one they enjoy working on, I can understand why they wouldn't try working on others. And for newer magicians who don't know themselves that well, I can also see a validity behind a fear of commitment, a feeling of lost time working on something only to find you don't enjoy the path you made. Is that fear accurate? Maybe not, but it's understandable.
All that said, I'm not worried about this issue. There will always be the people wanting the easiest solution. There will also always be people wanting to do the hard stuff. There will always be people in every camp and specialty, because we're all different and we all grow in our own ways. And as our methods become more and more accessible and learnable, no matter how many self-workers we see, we're only gonna see more of the kids whose technique and performance far surpasses their teachers.
Again, I'm not someone who really fits the category, so I might be talking out of my ass. But those are the thoughts I have.
I learned more card and coin sleights than I will ever actually use in actual performance. The reason is just passion for magic like yourself Craig. Having said that I LOVE using gimmicks especially ones that can achieve really impossible effects and help you end clean. I don't think that a coin unique vanish under a glass with a swirl can be beaten by any sleight of hand. It's just so impossible, hands off and it's examinable at the end. From the audience point of view they will see this as more amazing than any false transfer because of the fairness.
There is also an element of magic snobbery from our end. Why should a newbie be able to come along and blow people away with an ID for example and not put the time into learning a DL. Yes I understand, it's hard to not feel an injustice about that. With no practice anyone can illicit the same reactions than someone who's learned all the knuckle busting moves. How is that fair?
This is akin to music in where all the best songs and most memorable riffs are simple and require little skill to perform. The final effect is all that matters. Reminds me of when Coldplay said arctic monkeys were just a bunch of teenagers who couldn't play their instruments. But none of it matters because the effect on the audience is all that matters.
Having applied all that logic, it's still never gonna sit right with me if a magician doesn't learn sleight of hand. It's a right of passage in my opinion.
Awesome question, and an excellent, nuanced take!
My own 2 cents are below, but here's a TL;DR--we as a society have become encouraged to be lazy, but at the same time see (and crave) the intrinsic value and potential for popularity that becoming a real performer can give, regardless of the methodology of the effect.
I feel like the reason we feel that the generalization, "magicians are becoming lazier" is true is due to a number of factors.
1) People in general (not just magicians) are getting more and more used to consuming things and seeking low level comfort rather than taking risks and producing things. Taking any trick (self working or not) and working on it so that you produce the best effect that you can do is hard and pulls us away from the consumption and comfort, so the fact that it's easier to take and perform a self-working trick at a slightly higher baseline with no extra effort is appealing.
2) Magic is on an upswing in popularity, so the people fastest able to take advantage of it (short term media folks and casual in-person magicians alike) get a lot of attention, which attracts people interested in the "influence" rather than the magic/artistry behind it. This encourages creators--big and small names alike--to create tricks that follow this trend (in conjunction with point 1, these tricks will also sell more and perform better with minimal effort from the consumer-magician)
3) Getting into magic solo (see the above point) is really hard, and the free tutorials you get for even basic sleights are very hit or miss, making the tutorials on "amazing, 'magician-fooling', self-working tricks" hit the algorithm better, making more interested folks aware of it.
The thing that helps balance this are also a combination of factors:
A) In a world with so much consumption, being able to do tricks that don't ~look~ like the tricks revealed on social media will hit harder. I've found that when folks assume it's "a double lift" or "a pass," I can then routine a trick that uses those effects without them noticing them, even though they have a general knowledge. In fact, you can use their general knowledge to fool them harder, as long as you don't have sloppy mechanics.
The folks innovating are the ones that will always be leading the curve, rather than starting late an hitting diminishing returns.
B) Interest in magic can connect people to their local magic scene, whether it's an IBM circle or just a group of like-minded friends. Communities of magicians will always have a core of traditionalists who both will advocate for the harder, sleight-based ways AND be able to show newer magicians how and why impromptu tricks with borrowable, examinable decks (for example) are a valuable tool.
C) Well performed artistic expression (from paintings to theater to magic) is everlasting, as art seems as baked into us as the laziness described in point 1 is. This means that if people people are performing the same trick, the one who's a better performer will rise above, all other things equal.
With all of those factors together, I think that encouraging local magic scenes, being welcoming (and not gate-keeping) new members (even if they are just chasing a fad and not necessarily in it for the long haul), and emphasizing the artistry of magic: the story-telling, performance, sequencing, and all the other factors that go beyond just the patter and following the method (self working or knuckle-busting) is how to proceed, rather than the making judgement calls on the laziness or not of the people involved!
This is something we discussed when you interviewed me, Craig, the situation has only gotten worse. :D
I'm an amateur magician and think I have more dexterity than many professionals. I started with coins and still love practicing new things! I think that the market is sometimes simply flooded with all kinds of rubbish!!
Hi mate. When I first started learning magic (38 years ago) I had no props at all, so had to rely on sleight of hand. I had no idea where to get magic props from. I studied for 5 years, looking for books in Libraries, second hand shops etc, before I showed anyone anything. I am still learning to this day. I still am totally obsessed.
Happy to go through Hot Shot Cut anytime with you pal. 😊
Hi Craig I’ve been a magician for 20 years now or just over when I started tricks were in plastic bags with written instructions so you had to put the effort in to read and re read how to perform the trick. I think it’s far too easy now with video tutorials and the amount of tricks coming out I’m not saying video tutorials are a bad thing they’re not. But it’s like with anything not just magic you get out what you put in. A friend of mine is relatively new to magic and I’ve tried to help him but he just keeps on buying more magic and as you said not bothering to learn the tricks correctly. The magic suppliers just hype up the new releases as they are there to make money at the end of the day. I believe there are just to many releases these days so the new magicians get swept up in this oh got to have the latest tricks and I suppose in their minds new tricks are better than the old ones which in most cases isn’t the case. I do some amazing self working tricks which most of are 20 years old or maybe more but to make them look smooth the practice still has to put in and the performance is crucial. There are tricks where I’ve had to spend a lot of time with to make them look smooth and convincing. I think the bottom line is you have to put the effort in as it makes you a better magician and gives you more understanding of the art. I think when you perform a trick you should know it inside out and spend the time really learning it so it becomes almost automatic when you perform it. I truly believe that the amount of new tricks on the market is a big contributing factor to magicians not learning and fully understanding the tricks they already have. Just my opinion learn a trick so you know it back to front and inside out and you feel completely comfortable performing it. 👍👍😀😀😀😀😀
I'm definitely guilty of buying an "awesome" trick and I give up on it because I "can't" get it. Quantum Deck is one which has fallen victim to it. I love it, I just lose the simple mathematical focus when performing it. On my own, I get it every time. I have a ton of effects that I gave up on. I'm slowly going through them and re-looking at each one to see if it's the effect or if it's just me getting discouraged and giving up. Great video dude. Cheers!
I have a couple of thoughts on this. First, I think it depends on what is in vogue at the time. Fifteen years ago, at least from my perspective, the popular thing in magic was dvds/downloads from places like Dan and Dave - no gimmicks, just incredibly knacky moves that took a ton of practice. Everything was marketed as "visual". Now, it seems like the popular thing is the latest one-trick gimmick that Penguin or Murphy's puts out. If somebody is just getting into magic now, they think that is what magic is. They buy the trick, practice it for a couple of days, make a video for TikTok just in time for the next trick to be released. In another ten years, maybe pure sleight of hand will be back in fashion.
Second, I think it's what the magician wants to get out of it. If they are happy doing short videos on social media, or their primary concern is being able to perform new tricks for people on a frequent basis, then they have no issue with the "gimmick of the week" style of magic and that's fine for them. I am a hobbyist that enjoys learning and practicing sleight of hand. I like performing for people, but that is secondary for me. I learn 99% of my magic from books and the only gimmicks I use are the occasional double backer/facer or a coin shell. My satisfaction comes from learning and mastering sleights, then seeing them go unnoticed by spectators. I don't buy single tricks from Penguin/Murphy's because I wouldn't personally get any satisfaction from it.
Maybe I'm just rambling, but that's my "magic viewpoint", I guess.
Oh, for sure I'm lazy!!! I've been in magic for only 4-5 years, and I don't have skills, experience or even book collection that some of my peers have who have been in magic for more than 20 years. So if a new trick is outside my skill set - off to a bottom drawer it goes ;)
For example, I don't do coin tricks, and I'm yet to perform cups & balls or linking rings.
But here's a real life example: I really wanted to perform "Trip to Cancun" by George Iglesias, and it requires a card control and a palm. I was finally brave enough to use palm I've learned from Brent Braun on the FPS wallet project, and I use a gimmick I learned about from Richard Osterlind's trick to control a card. Side steals and passes are not for me... yet...
Craig: your discussion did not recognize that coins, like cigarettes in the past, are increasingly less relevant to people and not a part of their lives. There is good cigarette magic that requires sleight of hand and practice, but no one does it anymore. Would you call a magician lazy because they are not spending time practicing cigarette sleight of hand?
Another fact you did not mention, and thus may not have considered, is the sheer scope of magic available, specifically excellent and entertaining self working magic. As just one example, Dan Harlan's Tarbell series for Penguin Magic has 101 lectures that are several hours each. Of the ones I have seen so far, they require no or maybe just an occasional sleight. A magician can not perform even a small part of just the excellent self working magic. So not learning sleight-heavy magic is understandable, not lazy.
Magicians aren't lazy. People in general are lazy. And Magic is blowing up in a way due to advertising and exposure and ease of entry, and there's more people getting into it than ever before. However, a lot of those people aren't getting into magic because they like magic. They're getting into magic because they like being the center of attention and getting big reactions, and Magic can do that.
And so they simply take the easiest route to get that response they want without any other thought put into it.
Ice age leave these people alone, and let them put on the boring show they want to do.
In the past week, I saw four different magicians perform in four different shows. Three of them opened with ambitious card and then did the Amvertie die, and then the linking rings.
Their shows were nearly interchangeable. And while the people there enjoyed themselves, they had all also never seen magic before in person, and if they see a second magician do the same act again, they're not going to see a third.
But this is the same with every other art form and hobby and interest.
Magic isn't unique with this problem.
About tutorials, my opinion is that after you watch the tutorial, you should have no more questions that you want to ask. If you're left with questions, the tutorial wasn't complete. Outside of that, the people who are bothered by difficulty just need to shut up and practice. The only accommodation I would give them, is that I do think it's good for the difficulty rating to be listed as part of the advertising.
Outside of that, I don't have much thought for those people. I don't think there are any lazier than the people who take a photo of something and then put that photo on a board and then paint over the photo instead of just painting on a blank canvas. For the people who call themselves writers, but exclusively take other people's characters and other people's stories on people's plots and simply make minor tweaks to them and then call in their story.
People who like writing, will write. And people who like painting, will paint. And people who actually like magic, will do magic.
Is it annoying when people who don't actually like magic call themselves magicians and tell people how much they like magic when they really just like being the center of attention? Yes.
By the end of the day this isn't a modern young people problem, or a magician problem.
The very best sleight of hand magicians are also incredible performers. Think of iconic names from the past like Paul Daniels, Dai Vernon, Ricky Jay, or current sleight of hand experts like Markobi, Erik Tait, David Williamson or the great Juan Tamariz. Nobody should tell me they are bad performers just because they're using difficult sleights!
IMHO realised magic tricks to me are like airfix kits I love the feeling of ironing out issues such as angles and ballsy moves or if it's an older trick and the printed instructions are not as clear, I love the feeling of gratification when I figure out my own way to perform the effect. An example of a. effect was Vernon Thimbles this took me quite a while I got frustrated that I could not get it down easy but the pay off when I finally got it was huge. After this I was looking for my next "airfix" buzz so cylinder and coins it was I'm still working on the ending to make it cleaner as I believe magicians have never learnt everything as we are always students of our craft. Did I mention I love the process of learning an effect 😊
On the surface, at least, it's not just complaining about difficulty; it's anything that presents an obstacle for many these days. I could not imagine someone like Ryan Plunkett, for example, picking up an effect and then complaining about it for either reason. He strikes me as the type of magician who will take any trick fit for purpose and either learn it or customize it and make it better. I dare not put myself on the same level as Ryan, but he comes from the school of magic I follow.
Angelo Carbon's On Edge is a perfect example of this. While others are posting negative reviews after they got theirs, what was Ryan doing with his after he got a pre-release? I believe it took him three months to perfect, and now he is making his own.
This is a quote from an actual review of On Edge: "It also uses a technique that I deplore... It's just not that 'magical'..."
Then why in the hell did they even bother to buy it in the first place? It's easy enough to read between the lines. I think you'd agree, Craig.
There seems to be a lot of this going on; the question is how much of it is quantifiable. Fortunately, the magicians in my circle have dispositions more like Ryan, but if we believe even a small sample of what we see on social media, this condescending behavior is not uncommon.
On the other hand, I think you have to be faithful to your style of performance. For example, I don't do flourishes anymore; I don't even practice them. But does that make me lazy? No, because it will not add to my performance. On the other hand, memorized deck work and learning the classic pass fit my style of magic like a glove. So, I have learned them, and I think that is really where the rubber hits the road. I don't know if I would call it lazy if I had not mastered them, and just because I feel they make my performance more magical. I am pretty sure someone who does a better job at acting and scripting magic could bury me with a Mental Photography and Mirage Deck.
I suppose it all comes down to how balanced and faithful we are to ourselves; only the magician can know if they are selling themselves short.
There is a quote by Prot from the movie KPAX that keeps it real for me. "Every being in the universe knows right from wrong..."
If you sell yourself short and you sell magic creators who release magic in good faith short, there is more to it than just being lazy, in my opinion.
When I read the title, I was worried Craig knew how many hours I played video games this week ;) Personally I would not enjoy doing magic without the sleight of hand. I love practicing magic as much as I love performing it. I have quit on some cardistry I wanted to learn. It is hard to justify putting the hours into some of the flourishes and what not when I will never use it in my magic. I do really enjoy it though.
I think more people need to take that first step of doing a practiced sleight in front of real live spectators. When you get away with that skillful deception in front of real unknowing spectators, it is a unique rush that a gaff or self-working trick can't give you. I think many think they have to stay locked up practicing for years before ever getting that rush, but it aint true. You get an incentive to practice from feeling that rush. Go out there and perform sleights!
I don't think I'm the type Craig is referring to. I am almost more interested in a magic product/trick if it gives me something to practice.
Craig, I’m new to magic, a real beginner. I’ve bought a lot of tricks over the last 10 months. As a beginner I love the ‘self working’ stuff especially tricks with multiple outs. I have Petty Cash which I love. I also have Monsters and right up my street is the routine with the post-its & sharpie to build a story where you’re one ahead.
I then moved onto ‘harder’ tricks and that’s where I’ve fallen down. My confidence and enthusiasm has taken a bash. I wouldn’t say I’m lazy but I’d say I’m naive and not well informed. Let me explain.
I’ve bought a few tricks that have put me off. Two tricks I’ve bought require the Elmsley count. I’ve watched numerous people on CZcams and the tutorials that came with the tricks but for some reason I just can’t get this to look convincing so I gave up. I probably practiced for an hour a day for a week.
My question to you is, did I give up too soon? How long should it take for a beginner to perfect an Elmsley count? None of the tutorials mention this. In fact, one trick I bought recently, Squint, you are part of the tutorial video and make the Elmsley count look easy, probably way too easy. Not once does it mention how much practice this move should take so I became frustrated with my lack of progress and the trick has gone to the bottom drawer.
I also purchased the Nightshade Project before Christmas and was excited when I got the tutorials. I loved the fact its called a “project”. I thought it would help me as a beginner in coin magic. However, I soon realised that a fair bit of sleight of hand is required. You do a good job in the tutorials of explaining how these sleights are achieved but I was left feeling a little left out as a beginner because the basics of coin sleight ‘practice’ wasn’t explained to me. What I mean is that I didn’t know how to practice and how much practice I need to do. Does that make sense?
I actually wrote to Alakazam asking for some support but didn’t hear back. I know they were very busy on the run up to Christmas so it may just have been missed, I’m not having a dig at them. I therefore took it upon myself to see if I could help myself and I bought Bobos book on coin magic. Oh boy! That blew my mind but didn’t really help me answer the question of how often and how long to practice. I then bought your coin magic academies 1 & 2 to help fill the gap in my knowledge of practicing coin sleights. I wish I had just bought no. 1 because I haven’t got past the first section where you discuss the three or four basic sleights. I now know that I need to spend weeks or months just holding a coin in palm before I can proceed. The ‘penny finally dropped’! I need to practice A LOT and until I can be comfortable with the basic sleights. How long will that take? Who knows?!
Given my experience as a beginner, to answer your question on whether new magicians are lazy, I can only speak for myself and say no I’m not lazy. What I am though is naive. I never appreciated how much time and effort is needed to perfect moves and sleights but given the lack of discussion on how to practice and how much time to dedicate to practicing and how long these basics will take an absolute beginner, it is no surprise that some magicians will give up through a perceived lack of progress just because we beginners have nothing to benchmark ourselves against when practicing and IMHO, magicians and magic companies selling tricks don’t always say that as a beginner you ain’t going to be able to do a particular trick right out of the box.
Maybe I’ve jumped into the deep end of magic too soon? Maybe I’ve missed a few beginner steps? It hasn’t put me off entirely, only made me more motivated and more aware that I need to make time to practice before some of these great tricks are within my grasp.
I’d appreciate any feedback you may have to help beginners on their journey, particularly with coin magic and more specifically with your awesome Nightshade Project. Thanks for your dedication to the magic community Craig, even if I can’t do most of what you do, I love watching and dreaming of being able to do an Elmsley count and just maybe one trick from your new Nightshade Project.
I learned the Elmsley count from Card College. It has been years, so I don't remember how long it took me to learn, but I do remember how I practiced it. Learn the Jordan count as well. When you practice those two counts with four cards, one sets up the other. The Elmsley count hides the third card and at the end of the count, the hidden card is in the fourth position. The Jordan count hides the fourth card and it ends up in the third position. So practice while doing something like watching TV and do the Elmsley then the Jordan then the Elmsley then the Jordan...start really slow and don't set a time line for yourself. If it takes six months, don't worry about it. If you find yourself getting frustrated, put the cards down and try again the next day. After a while, it will come to you. Remember, with false counts, speed isn't as important as a consistent rhythm and make sure that your hands look the same whether you're taking a single card or multiple cards. I found that it looked different for me, so I trained myself to make my single card take look like the double card take.
I use Elmsley counts all the time, so it's a worthwhile tool to spend the time on. Also, once you get good at the Elmsley and Jordan counts, other false counts will be much easier and quicker to learn.
One of the things you can do is search for alternatives to the move. I suck at the Elmsley Count, so i always use the much easier Veeser Count, which accomplishes the same thing.
If a trick calls for a pass to control a card, you dont have to use a pass. Use a side steal, or double undercut for example. If a sleight is too difficult or gives you trouble, theres almost always one or two different sleights that do the same thing.
Hey man. You have some great points. The reason I don’t mention or many don’t mention how long leaning a sleight will be is because every single person is different. Some can take months, some days. Some can never learn it and give up. It can be easy to give up. You need to find a practice regimen that works for you. Really nobody can tell you what that is.
I’ve learned myself that I had to figure that out by myself. There are some things I pick up on very quickly then there are other things I still struggle with. As a creator, someone who is teaching a sleight on a product video, all you can really do is teach how to do it. You can’t really say how long. If I were to say that I would or said the Elmsley will take you anywhere from 1 day to 2-3 months to learn.
Here’s a little bit of a tip. You should make practicing fun. For me practicing is something I never allow myself to get frustrated with. If I’m starting to get frustrated I back off from the move. I’m working on. The next thing I would say is let things settle in your brain for a few days. Meaning practice something. Then stop practicing for a couple days and then go back to it you’ll be shocked at how quickly this will help you learn anything not even just Magic.
The final tip, and I think the most important bring whatever it is out into public, into the wild in front of a live audience, and you will get good quick.
Almost forgot one last important tip. And I hope this stuff helps because it’s what I did when I was learning and still do because we are all always learning and getting better anyway don’t just depend on one tutorial to learn how to do a sleight. Go down the rabbit hole so to speak and learn from many different sources. There are two reasons for this the first one. Maybe somebody has a teaching style that better suits you. The second being a lot of these moves are done with small changes and sometimes those small changes are what makes the difference. Anyone here will tell you that sometimes moving your finger down by a millimeter can make a change for you on a move you’ve been struggling with.
If anyone ever says this is how long something should take I wouldn’t listen to it. Also, our hands are different so it may look different in your hands and you might have to readjust for that.
That’s my two cents. I hope it helps in someway.
@@chrisjamesmagic8396Thank you, yes that feedback really helps put the whole art of practice into perspective for me.
Great video, Craig, with so many valuable observations and questions. I have concentrated on cards for decades but now proudly own your brilliant Apparition, Mirage Extreme and Nightshade sets. They enable to do many amazing things that would otherwise be beyond me at present. However that doesn't mean I'm not still working on Danny Goldsmith's Optical program. There remain days when I despair of ever getting it up to performance standard but watching him repeatedly perform the same beautiful and utterly magical coin vanish continues to inspire me.
Oh heck yes lazy, that is a bad thing if they want to earn money to do it. However, lazy means to me that the put little effort into practicing the tricks. As for gimmicks vs sleight of hand is not how I equate whether they are lazy. Like myself I have a disability the limits the sleights I can do, so having a gimmick is more suited for me.
Here is a future video idea. Putting a close up set together that flows.
Are magicians lazy because they do self working tricks and not willing to put the time in to learn sleight of hand. No because I spend my time learning how to use the gimmicks in self working tricks properly which does take sometime. Many gimmicks that I use you must learn how to perform with them correctly. To give an example Demi Deck by Angelo Carbone is a very easy trick to perform but even Angelo Carbone says do not perform it until you practice, practice, practice!! I perform Losander's floating table which I have been doing for many years. On the instructional video, Losander makes a point about how you must practice it to make the table float without a wobble. Do I need to learn a double lift or be able to do a French drop to be a good magician? The answer is "No". I have been learning and performing magic for about 50 years and yes I do many of the standard sleights because I love the art of magic. Is it necessary? NO! What is important is that your audience is entertained and they don't care how much time you put in to learn a sleight that they should not see anyway!
Interesting topic, sometimes the video tutorials are too quick, not explained properly and for the customer that's game over. These tricks need to be explained slowly, with decent camera angles, close up, not from across the room, and in the dark, and "shown" too fast...
I have stopped trying to learn a mem deck many times, but it took my months to get a decent pass down.
We use to just tell each other that such and such effect is knacky. This meant it required an idiosyncratic knack but once you had that it was all good. This verses something that will just take thousands of repeat drills. Knacky is fine and always worth taking a stab at. The latter is only worthwhile if the final effect is either extremely entertaining or very versatile. Now it seems it’s a turn off in review/sales to say it will require a knack let alone a true pile of practice.
a lot of magician cant bothered to look for the moves/slights i any good sources
It's all about entertainment. Tommy copper was the perfect example, his routine was about getting magic wrong but incredibly funny and one of the best entertainmenters ever
Beautiful video 🎉. I know exactly what you mean. For me, I definitely want to learn more on any sleight. However, I sometimes am lacking the time to practice hard enough. Not being a professional I annotate dependent on my magical capabilities and my family and hopefully soon again my full time job just does not always allow me to give the practice needed. However, I have created a list in my mind of techniques which I will go and learn as soon as I find the time.
the worst thing I see is when magicians see the method and go like “I don’t think this would work for real audiences, I’m not gonna do it” like did you NOT see the performances? The trailer? There’s people who react to the trick because *IT WORKED*
Also Inverto review? 👀
Regarding Matt. Although I love seeing you put him through the ringer (I literally can’t stop laughing listening to you two, lol), but I think about what people put into slights and it’s no wonder why Matt is hesitant. When I’d learn a new slights I would spend hours practicing them over and over, for weeks (years legitimately) in order to get it looking good, and feeling completely natural. Learning and perfecting slights takes a crap load of focussed time, which due to the gargantuous learning curve he gets subjected to, he just hasn’t time to do currently. Once he sees the light at the end of bear pit, it might be good to give him the time to hit the basic slights hard, like we all should do. Great video, and Cheers.
IDK...Maybe maybe creators are gravitating more towards gimmick based tricks/effects because they think they will bring more people into magic, but at the same time going them a dis-service.
Xays rise! I struggle with that
Magicians have become lazy yes if you say guys doing tricks are magicians... my nephew plays a guitar but that does not make him a rockstar. Be awesome if magic was going in a great direction but unfortunately, too many clowns posing as magicians and dragging the craft into the gutter where is doesn't belong
Personally I love the process of learning, I find the instant gratification of easy stuff a bit of a turn off. Bring on the hard stuff, nothing easy is ever really worth learning :)
Magicians are lazy? The real question who is a Magician? Paid or unpaid amateur or working pro? To be good at anything you need some amount of passion and magic no different for sure. Problem with magic today is there is a tonne of garbage out there and the magicians on youtube and tv are weak and forgettable. Hate to say this but it's true. The only close up magicians specials that are worthy of tv in the last 30 years are Derren Brown and Paul Zenon simply because they understand what qualifies as good magic and fear entertainment.
I practice sleights but I find gimmicks that can dothe heavy lifting for me is welcomed. Seems more impossible also. Self working I can focus on presentation. But learning sleights is important. So both for me.🎉 Great question ❓❤
Hey Craig
sometimes it is so much more cleaner and more fooling than slight of hand
Personally I think sleight of hand is where it’s at, if you consider the top magicians in the world like David Blaine, dynamo, asi wind, and many others, they are always carrying regular decks on them so they can astonish with something ordinary, I think adding self working tricks r good depending on the situation like the invisible deck for instance, a great opening to a act, but I think sleight of hand should dominate more then self working tricks. Also I think people r just looking for the “best” card trick, or gimmicked trick, but they get it and it feels like a let down when it’s pure sleight of hand.
I definitely do this. I have several tricks in my drawer that I bought, learnt the method and put it in the 'i will learn this in the future' drawer.r
I feel personally attacked by this video. I think I need to practise more. 😅