I think it's time Williams drop Logan Sargeant...
VloĆŸit
- Äas pĆidĂĄn 6. 05. 2024
- Head to squarespace.com/tommof1 to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain using code "tommof1".
I've given Logan plenty of leeway, plenty of benefit of doubt. But now, after 27 race starts, I think my patience with him is done. He's not the right driver for Williams any longer. But the question is, who is?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
TOMMO'S RACING GOODS:
tommosracinggoods.com
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Tommo's Race Chinwag Podcast:
- Spotify: spoti.fi/3SE4UTk
- Apple Podcasts: apple.co/3kAOChn
- Google Podcasts: bit.ly/3IYcIen
- Anchor.fm: anchor.fm/tommos-race-chinwag
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Socials:
đ€ Twitter: / twommof1
đ· Instagram: / tommccluskey_
đ» Website: tommccluskey.co.uk
đŹ Twitch: / tommolive
đ©ł TikTok: / tommoontiktok
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Business enquiries: me@tommccluskey.co.uk
Copyright Disclaimer: Under Section 107 of the Copyright Act 1976, allowance is made for "fair use" for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, and research. Fair use is a use permitted by copyright statute that might otherwise be infringing. There are certain scenes from the Formula 1 calendar where race footage is used. All those rights are property of FOM. Other photos and news elements are used solely for the purpose of assisting the original content illuminate a more in depth story.
#TommoF1 - Sport
To my mind, breaking the under 18 rule should be reserved for if a 17 year old wins F2 and has nowhere left to go in the feeder series, so why keep him out of F1 just because of his age.
Antonelli hasnât won or won in F3 or F2 yet, itâs just not justifiable to not tell him to wait until next season
Good argument. Agreed if he was to win F2 and be forced out of a seat it would be logical to consider an exemption.
Good point. Kimi hasn't been great in F2 either
Theo Pourchaire raging at the moment how nobody cared about him that much after winning f2 with 18 year of age. He had a way better season with 17 year sad how he gets completely ignored because he didn't win f3 a season where Piastri won it.
Kimi is doing mediocre in F2 right now funnily enough. I dont get jt haha
@@ehrlichgesagt863 If Pourchaire is angry, just imagine how Frederick Vesti feels. Vesti is in the Mercedes Driver academy, he is the current reserve driver for Mercedes, in theory if anyone should have a seat given to them from Mercedes it is the guy who finished 2nd in F2 last year. Instead Toto Wolff has completely ignored him in favour of some bloke from F4.
"Valtteri this is James, come drive for me in 2025"
"This is Valtteri Bottas... No thanks :) "
That should be the announcement.
"Goatifi this is James, come drive for me in 2025"
đđđ
Returning back to the team where he begun :)
Sargent's junior career was better than most seem to think. It just makes his struggles in f1 look worse imo. I wouldnt be suprised to see him in indycar someday.
Maybe endurance like De Vries, Logan was quick in his short ELMS stint
He's definitely got skill, just can't show it in the current shitbox williams has. Another category might be the best bet.
@@bigsmooshflopdong33 Similar to Mick i would say. He's killing it in WEC currently.
He was rushed into F1. He finished 5th in his first season and to be moved up that quickly was a mistake. Had he finished in the Top 3 that season the call-up would've been justified, but not after finishing 5th.
@@Warrioruk yeah definitely. he didnât make it to f1 without showing he has some indubitable potential. But being bumped up that quickly and early - especially into a car as bad & unpredictable as the Williams - just demolished any chance of using that potential to the fullest. Heâs taken a huge hit to his trust & belief in himself and sadly in f1 going down that rabbit hole often means youâre gonna be out of that seat very quickly. Just like you guys have said, I think another series like IndyCar or WEC is the only good decision for him as of now. Get back his mojo & hopefully show the skill that he definitely has on a different stage where he maybe can establish himself.
Btw youâre effin profile pic almost made me psychotic thinking there was a hair on my ipadđđđ
If Antonelli is brought in, it's just the same mistake that was made with Sargeant
that's facts
Antonelli in that Williams would be a disaster ngl
I'm not sure Mercedes would be too upset if he's only writing of Williams cars, but yeah, it'd be a disaster for Williams.
i think he just needs more time, poor guy is swearing at himself and saying how dumb he is, he just needs a hug and some motivation people sell him short, he has talent he just needs to extract it
For real everybody hates on him, I think his confidence is low right now he just needs some motivation
I personally think he needs a new team! It feels like Daniel in McLaren all over again.
Logan was brought into F1 too early, he needed another year in F2, 2023 was a tough year for him but he had a few decent results, this year I think he has definitely shown a step up, running well in Bahrain until his steering wheel died and he was told to not overtake Albon in Jeddah, in Australia he was not racing but not by his own fault, in Japan going well until the team lost the pitstop battle and in China got done dirty by a stupid penalty, and in Miami he was right behind Alex in pace the whole weekend, being 0.036s slower than alex a lap, except for Logan being P10 ahead of Alex in the sprint, people dont recognise when he does decent, just when something goes wrong.
Yeah I feel having your team give your car to your teammate and being basically booed out of the fucking sport by fans isn't exactly the best way to start of your first real season in f1 after having your first season be in a car so unstable even a pretty good driver like albon felt it was unpredictable. He probably just lacks the confidence to go for overtakes since a crash just adds to the narrative that he's a crasher. He isnt goat or wdc material but he deserved better than what he got last and this season so far.
The thing is though is that his "decent" is always essentially "oh he wasnt as shit this time". Not once has he on merit beaten his teammate who, while good, is not exactly Alonso or Max
â@@jediporg1245I think people expect way too much from him, having 1.5 days to get used to an unpredictable car for 2023 in testing is so difficult for a rookie, he was rushed into F1 too early so I think it's fair to say 2023 is a learning year and for so far in 2024 he has shown improvement but hasnt had a real good opportunity to show it except for when got to in the Miami sprint and got P10
He was never good enough to be given a shot in F1
@@RLLuke Yeah Bahrain had the steering wheel incident, Saudi was Magnusson reviving the truli train, Australia was the worst thing Williams could do for morale honestly like actually feel that was the worst possible call they made, Japan had the pit stop issue even before the crash and now Miami had magnusson again. He got p10 in the sprint ahead of albon and outqualified him for the race which i feel not enough people are discussing.
Forced to give up his car thanks to his teammate crashing, then given the rebuilt car and not his own back. We may be seeing the end of his F1 career, but I hope he stays in racing in Indycar or another top series. He definitely doesn't deserve to be alongside other "worse drivers in f1" like Mazepin or Latifi
Or, Stroll perhaps?
@@talk2thoran Stroll has still had great performances though. Latifi and Mazepin got nowhere close to podiums or even top 5's
@@justinburley8659 Latifi and Mazepin never had cars able to do that. Mazepin, for his one season, had a car that was by far the worst on the grid, that the team openly said they weren't going to develop all year. Latifi mostly went around in a shitbox that was one of the worst cars on the grid.
Stroll, in 2020, had the 2nd best car, and has had pretty decent cars for most of his career.
@@doghat1619 Heâs still a much better driver than those two. Not even in the same category
@@doghat1619 3rd best car
Why are people still talking about this.
James he said publicly on multiple platforms they are not looking to give Antonelli a drive mid season⊠this is a prime example of whatâs wrong with f1 media
People complain about Drugovich not getting an F1 seat after winning his 3rd F2 season, but now the 2 drivers most people bring up to be the next F1 drivers from F2 are currently in 9th and 19th.
my thoughts exactly. I think if Williams really want Logan out by midseason, they should just give the seat to Drugovich, Pourchaire or even Vesti. If it works out, you found a great number 2 for next year for dirty cheap. Worst case scenario and they can't even drive straight, you can hire a Bottas or whoever for next year. They got nothing to lose from giving a chance to one of them really. (I know they are reserves for other teams but I'm sure they must have some sort of clause for a situation like this)
At least bearman is shown to complete an entire race with limited practice on one of more stressful and physically challenging tracks
this season.
Itâs insane how its not F2 winners that theyre going for.
@ethansinnott9306 Now put him in a Williams, Sauber, or Haas in the same scenario and see what happens.
De vries also won his F2 championship in his 3rd season. F1 teams will never give seats to drivers like Drugo simply because he achieved what he did so late in his junior career.
Logan is not to blame for Kmag's stupidity. Every driver on this grid has had incidents with Mag which have led them to learn how to drive against him. Its not different for Logan. This incident should not be the nail in the coffin. It should have been everything that came before
It does always make me giggle when people get handed the kmag experience.
The car is total garbage, but the delta between Albon and Logan does not seem as great as it was last year. I think it looks bad for Williams to blame Logan for poor performance when their star driver isnât really doing any better. I donât think Logan can be blamed for K-Mag practicing his pit maneuver technique on him in Miami
Albons been pretty shit this season too, so when compared to last season, Sarge has done so much better
The Car is Shit. Resulting in Albon being Shit.
Like polishing a turd
The car lost the one thing it had going for it- top speed. In Monza 2022, even De Vries was able to score points because the car was really fast in a straight line. The 24 car doesnât even have that silver lining anymore, itâs just bad.
Albon's been fine. He has a few p11's and and a p12 in arguably the worst car on the grid.
some cars close talent gaps between drivers when they're slow but easier to take to the limit
Antonelli is dangerously becoming the most overhyped and overrated driver in any of the Formula series.
Everyone thinks he's gonna be a Verstappen sensation but I feel he's gonna have so much to live up to when he finally gets to F1 and that's PRESSURE đ¶
The question is also what the hell happened to the Williams car? Last year they were fighting with RB for 7th now theyâre fighting with sauber for 9th. Thatâs a really huge step down
They changed their car from a straight line speed monster, which can get you points but you'll never seriously compete with just that.
Theyve sacrificed that for a more balanced car, which will take time to understand.
I whole heartedly disagree with that kmag crash analysis. The rules state that the axels have to be level to have the right to enough space, he didn't have that. Everyone has said there is zero reason for kmag to try to overtake in that part of the corner and for Logan to expect him there. We didnt see anything close to that in that corner the whole weekend. That's why kmag got the penalty, that was the right decision. For last season, he's shown that he can keep up to Alex with some more time, despite always being behind on upgrades, that's why he's still here. But with this season, I think its wrong to put much blame on him so far. Steering wheel in Bahrain, car stripped away in Australia, pit team in Japan, penalty in China, and now kmag in Miami; also using a messed up chassis since Australia. That's something in almost every race that's screwed him over, out of his control. Even with that he's closed the gap to Alex even more. I think its really unfair to say he has so much potential, but than say the he is the once that's letting himself down. Williams haven't done him any favors this season and all you can do is feel bad for him, you can see how its affected his mood.
Couldn't agree more. This whole video was a pretty rare tommo L
Nah I disagree, a driver at his level needs to be aware of surroundings and adjust quickly. Every other duel through this corners the drivers worked well with each other while competing. There is a reason why these types of errors, some forced and mostly unforced, keep happening to him.
@@vikashchandra9917 Every other battle did not go all the way through turn three like this, when a driver realized there wasn't space going into 3, they backed out. Kmag was clearly able to see there wasn't space and didn't back off, and when contact was made, he was straddling the curb. He's the one who should have awareness of his surroundings. This is only now the third time since Logan started that he's had major contact with another driver and this wasn't his fault, incidents with other drivers don't happen to him as often as you think.
@@resistive11 awareness is on both. Yes, kmag wasnât great competitor through the corner (and his whole weekend is proof). But that doesnât exonerate Logan. Other drivers would have avoided that as race is long and not a corner ownership fight. He just isnât at the level of top tier drivers who somehow get these situations right and survive to fight in a long race. You may be his fan, thatâs ok, this is just my constructive criticism on him.
â@@vikashchandra9917Ok but no other driver attempted a move at that turn all weekend, and for good reason. Kevin was way too impatient. He was already on fresh mediums while Logan was on old hards, he could have easily passed him in the straight following that corner or waited for the DRS zone to pass. However, he decided to try and overtake in a sketchy place and ruined both of their races
I'm no Sargeant fan, but this latest wreck was all on K Mag imo. He could've bailed out and tried again later, but that hasn't been his MO recently - dude's been a menace and I used to like his aggressiveness. Having said all that it's definitely time for someone else to get that seat along side Albon.
That Williams is as unfair to Logan as the Haas was to Shumacher
Not at all, then? Schumacher didn't do much better than Mazepin and was shown up badly by Magnussen, after KMag had sat out for a year. Time to take off the rose tinted glasses. Alonso was able to show his class in a Minardi, Russell performed straight away at Williams, plenty of others have started in a poor car and done well. If you're good enough, you'll show it. If you're Mick or Logan you'll be well off the pace and stick it in the wall.
â @@spikyone79stop the Alonso glazing he didnât do shit in minardi
He got beaten by tarso marques
@@ChristosTzoannis There's "completely wrong" and then there's the staggering stupidity that you've shown in your comment. Alonso didn't "get beaten by Tarso Marques". Marques outqualified him once, when Alonso was forced to use the spare car at late notice. Otherwise Alonso was often 1.0-1.5 seconds faster in quali, and Marques was the only one of them to DNQ thanks to the 107% rule (Silverstone, 1.7 seconds slower than Alonso's time). They both had appalling reliability, and Marques never finished ahead of Alonso in races. They each finished on zero points in the championship, and Marques was only placed ahead of Alonso in the championship thanks to finishing 9th, which was effectively last, in two races where Alonso's car had a mechanical DNF.
How unfair can you be to a vastly underperforming driver?
Putting Antonelli in F1 right now would be the quickest way to torpedo his career. He's proven enough to leapfrog F3, but jumping almost directly from Formula Regional to F1 is just too much of a step for ANYONE to make. The junior categories aren't only for proving your worth, they're also for learning, and let's not forget building your physical endurance to be able to handle the entire race distance at those G-forces.
That was not a racing incident. You can't just stick your front wheel in there at the apex of such a high speed corner. Magnussen has 100% of the blame there and the stewards were great this weekend as a whole, IMO.
Exactly. The rules state that both cars' wheels have to be completely side by side to warrant space being given, but Magnussen was only half way alongside, and at a corner where no one attempted a move, and for good reason
As a whole? They didn't even penalize Oscar for pushing Sainz off the track.
nah, they forgot sir Hammys divebomb
Logan has been improving his pace and much closer to Albon compared to last year, he deserve more time to develop and at least see out this season.
Yea I mean look at what happened to Tsunoda
â@@natewagstaff2516Exactly. Tsunoda hasn't been brilliant until his 3rd season.
F1 is no more like that. Two years to show improvements is too long. I mean bearman did well in one single outing. Logan just isnât a top tier talent, and thatâs ok. Not everyone is insanely talented. There are many others who can step in and do a good job, and really at this point just not crashing is doing better than Logan.
â@@vikashchandra9917 I disagree. You can't treat everyone the same. Sure you have to perform, but some drivers can take a bit longer to develop and that's ok. Tsunoda is driving brilliantly right now and we wouldn't have that if he had been dropped after his first season or mid way through his second
@@smokeybandit9760 you can disagree, I have no issues. Just saying that f1 is a cut throat business and no one has patience to give drivers 2-3 years to develop. Thatâs just how it is. I can be a great car designer if someone gave me 15 years, but no one is gonna do that. Tsunoda, Norris all had flashes of brilliance re-affirming the faith of team bosses to give more time. I am sorry but Logan has given 0 flashes of any brilliance. He is 28-0 in qualifying with his team mate, like not even a fluke do get over the duck.
After Loganâs best weekend too đđ
If neither driver is performing in the car is a driver swap really necessary?
Sargeantâs pace is very well hidden, if he was so good heâd be capable of beating Albon. Personally I donât rate Albon as high as most do, after all heâs only faced Latifi & Sargeant in Williams.
Who in their right mind would expect an overtake through the esses of S1??? You RUIN your momentum overtaking there, in every circumstance. MOST of Loganâs DNFs are reliability issues or inconceivably unfortunate circumstances to have so frequently. This year the car doesnât have a wow factor like their straight line speed of years past, itâs just a bad this time. Even Alex hasnât put in any notable performances, he just has the experience to pull more out of the car. Loganâs pace has been steadily increasingly. Logan is not a qualifier at all and anybody who disagrees with that doesnât watch the broadcasts, but his race pace is getting there.
Logan hasnt done badly this season, probably the worst car on the grid (and not a speed line demon anymore), Albon hasnt really done better
Its kinda insane to me how Daniel is giving the excuse/time to "he still go it" while Logan being a rookie on worst circunstances (chassis/spare parts, worst car, etc) should at least get this full season
Also putting 17y old on this position wouldnt be any better than Logan, one of the biggest issues Logan has/had is how fast fowarded he was from F2 in the first place
Big fax
Imo heâs closer to albon then stroll is to Alonso half the time.
@@nollienick1121 Stroll's outqualified Alonso on at least a few occasions this year. That the same for Logan?
@@ErickMcNerney the gap between them is way bigger
Logan isnât a rookieâŠ
I have to disagree - and I think the stewards were more confident than saying KMag was "mostly at fault," because they used the words "wholly at fault." I understand you can argue if he was alongside but to me it clearly seemed like he was too eager and according to the rules he made a movie without having the right to do so.
I am a Williams fan, so maybe biased, but I support Williams and not its drivers so I want the best for the team. I certainly don't think Sargeant has done enough to get resigned at the end of this season, but his pace has improved since last year and he's been closer to Alex. I certainly don't think that's deserving of being removed 1/4th of the way through the season and replaced with a 17 year old that hasn't proven himself in F2 yet. Whether he tested well alone on track or not, it doesn't mean that he can compete against drivers at the highest level and he hasn't proven that he can in F2. If he doesn't shape up at the end of the season, I would much rather see O'Sullivan or Colapinto than have Williams act has an incubator for Mercedes drivers
Based on the rules, Kmag was wholly at fault. Tommoâs argument stems from his dislike of the driving alongside rule, rather than the actual rules themselves.
Its hard to really give Logan the boot.
Prior to Kevin yeeting him into the wall, he was keeping pace with Albon.
Had Kevin not hit logan, where is a chance he would either finish behind Albon, or even finishing ahead if Albon's lock-up was anything to go by.
I'd say we let Logan run the entire season and see if he is worthy for F1 or Indycar.
Stop with Antonelli fr. Get Drugovich in like he won the F2 title for a reason.
Drugovich will replace Stroll, not Sargeant. The one who can replace Sargeant is Daniyl Kvyat, why they should ignore him just because he's Russian? Well, he was shit in Red Bull 2016, but at least he tried to save his career.
@@IGG2002 Stroll will only leave when his dad gives up on the project. We still have a solid 5 or 6 years of Stroll ahead of us.
3rd year f2 champion just like Theo pourchire đđđđ
@@xxkiy.burkexxCompletely wiped the field that year though, as opposed to Pourchaire who only won 1 race in his winning year.
@@cereal.exe574 I get what you mean.
Maybe I'm a softy, but I would employ a great sports psychologist and invest serious time into Logan's mental health, especially over summer break. The man is a broken mess. You can hear it in his radio messages. I think if he was in the right headspace, he wouldn't be performing so poorly. I don't think it's a skill deficit. And if I was James Vowles I would shut the đ€Ź up about meritocracy, because if he really believed in that he would have resigned. Williams looked laughable in Australia, and they continue to look bad. They are a shadow of their former self, and Vowles must take responsibility for that.
I agree with what you say about Logan but you do understand that vowles is doing what he must so that Williams can catch up with the rest of the grid right. They've been designing their cars using excel for god's sake
@seanonraet8327 Nah, I get it, they're cash-strapped and severely behind. But then James must choose his words carefully. His words are effectively calling Logan out, which comes across as hypocritical given how the team operates. I'm not saying he should resign, I'm saying he shouldn't call Williams a meritocracy.
Would be interesting to see what Logan could do in the McLaren, and what Piastri could do in the Williams
Logan hasn't always helped himself but there's so many factors swirling around him that you can't put this year's run purely down to him. Toto's panic of missing another Verstappen is pushing Logan into a 2020 Albon situation and dropping him midway through the season for whoever isn't the way to go, especially if it's Antonelli
Verstappen is always Red Bull academy driver, if he joined Toto Wolff, he couldn't have even race in Formula 1.
@@IGG2002 Toto/Mercedes had a chance to siugn Max on the early days but they missed and RB did it instead, around 10y later Toto is regretting it and now Antoneli looks like the "next verstappen" hence Toto is trying to push him into a seat so early
Bullshit. This narrative about Logan needing to go is bullshit. When his race doesn't get fucked by contact with another driver he's close in pace to Albon, typically within .2 sec. Yes he has some wild moments but he was brought into F1 too early. Even Max was crash prone when he started and Max was driving a much more compliant car. Even Albon has his moments in the Williams and Albon has experience dealing with a tricky car (he described the Red Bull as having your mouse sensitivity set to the Max).
Logan deserves to finish out this season. He stepped up from F2 before he was ready for Williams, he let Alex use his car after Alex fucked up by crashing and Williams fucked up by not having a spare chassis. Williams acknowledges that their car will be shit while they revamp internally, Logan is with them through the shit times, he deserves to finish the season.
Dont' compare Sergeant with Max.
That's criminal!
Max crashed but he was insanely quick and demonstrated other worldly skill.
Sergeant is just sh1t.
@@procatprocat9647 Hes not, he has the makings of a solid midfield #2 and deserves his seat.
I didn't compare Sargent to max's page just that rookies crash, a lot, and then they get better and crash less.
Not to mention several of his DNFs are not down to his skill.
KMAG took him out in Miami.
His steering wheel took him out in Bahrain (I think it was that race)
And he was on for a good result in Qatar last year but the heat took him out, and I won't fault him for that because even experienced drivers were damn near dead at the end, and James did the right thing having him retire rather than aim for a good but non points position and pass out and crash
Preach! đ
Its come out that you need the same dispensation for him to run an FP1 so it might not be a full replacement but test him in the current car.
Every race we just assume he's gonna have some sort of an incident
heâs literally become the next latifi
@@glazeddonut4383genuinely think itâs worse, Latifi had some stretches where he wasnât terrible and even beat his teammate. Logan just hasnât shown anything at all
@@user-qj6cf2fe8i agreed even as an american i'd admit 'underwhelming' is an understatement
Hes like a latifi that can't get penalised as much because the FIA wants the murican mula.
Every race that we need a safety car and he's still in the race I am like: "ok Logan it's your time!"b
So out of the 8 DNFs only 3 were his fault which is probably still not great but itâs no where near as bad as it looks. Thereâs no way he deserves to lose a seat, especially not before the end of the season as he has 100% improved compared to last year but all the bad luck heâs had but everyone ignores is bound to wreck his confidence. Steering wheel breaking in Bahrain, unable to race in Australia, terrible pit stop in Japan costing him multiple places and assassinated in Miami, and thatâs just off the top of my head, couldâve been more in Jeddah and China. I think heâs done well this year and has even been only Williams in the top 10, albeit a sprint but still impressive.
that's not counting his crashes during practice and quali
If I were in charge of Williams, I'd keep Sargeant for the rest of the season. I think it's about 50/50 between him learning and the team letting him down to favor Albon. Give him a pace and qualifying differential as a goal- if he meets them by end of season and can maintain those, then there's a contract going forwards. If he can't, then he didn't meet the mark, replace him with another driver, preferably one who already has a super license and is out of F2, such as Drugovich.
Antonelli hasn't even had a full season in f2 yet, let alone win it. I wonder how would vesti and pourchaire react to this if kimi had an underwhelming season in f2 and still got the williams seat.
What is tommo on about here? Logan has made great improvements in a still shit Williams.
A Perfect "Silver Line" Opportunity Idea:
Logan Sargeant gets a phone from Michael Andretti... Tells him this, "I have a Offer for you can't Refuse"... A Driver-Seat for Andretti/Cadillac Racing?!
I think Herta is a better fit though
@@tianxiangchen8668 - True, but Andretti/Cadillac needs a Second Driver.
@@X-Warrior.8719 tbh they would probably lean on Kirkwood a little bit more. Kirkwood's only 2 yrs older than Sargeant and is getting better in Indy
@@tianxiangchen8668 - Maybe...
@@tianxiangchen8668 - Maybe.
I think Williams just a mess no driver is fixing that team I honestly think if I'm in charge of Williams my 1st move is actually selling to ada globe
Except for Oscar, no rookie hasnât had much of chance lately. The way things are going, very few rookies will last more than a year in F1. The lack of testing could be the problem. Oscar has been the rare exception in that his pace was been close to Lando from also the word go and only has had one minor crash in practice, full stop.
Cause he was in a decent car post austria, didn't really have any major unforced accidents, and had a year of practice with Alpine in 2022. He's had the most testing a modern rookie can. He was much more prepared than most rookies nowadays are
@@jediporg1245 Good point. Lewis is an exceptional driver, but he had tons of practice in the F1 before his rookie season started. Oscar is also a phenomenal driver and had tons of practice in an older F1 car, but he still had to learn tyre management under the new downforce rules. The new rookies are not getting this opportunity nowadays.
Charles, Lando and Oscar are all possible future world champions. Oscar is very analytical and is learning a lot from Lando, a standout driver. In turn, Oscar is pushing Lando to do better. Alex Albon is not a possible future F1 driver; Logan Sargeant is learning a mid-tier team in an underperforming car. How can a rookie learn quickly in this situation?
I strongly believe that Vowles never wanted Sargeant in the team. He wasn't impressed with him when he did some tests for Mercedes. Why would this have changed?
But when he got the role of Williams TP, former TP Jost Capito had already pretty much signed Sargeant for the seat. Vowles just had to go along with it.
The only reason they re-signed him for 2024 was because it would look bad to drop their first academy driver after just a year, especially when Williams themselves said that they put him in F1 early hoping that a year in F1 would be a better learning experience than another year in F2. However it looks like Logan hasn't improved at all, his best performance is still arguably Q1 in Saudi Arabia last year.
Vowles talks a lot about performance and data driven decisions, and I just get the feeling that he has zero confidence in Logan ever improving, but that he can't sack him just yet. But he is for sure not getting the 2025 seat.
At the End I'd he would be French and Theo Pourchaire would have been American we wouldnt even know his name flowing around in f2 midfield
itâs time for Williams to drop Williams. Logan has the pace
Williams have struggled in the development race so far this season. They are struggling to get Alex into the points, never mind Logan (Who has had bad luck so far this season in Bahrain, Australia, and Miami). So getting a new driver in to replace Sargent shouldn't be the focus. I also believe Logan has shown signs of improvement this season. Williams should give Logan more races to prove his worth in F1, whilst improving the car to be able to score points. By that time, Albon and Sargent could be enjoying some points scoring races and there would be no need to get rid of Logan. Or Albon could be scoring points whilst Sargent lags behind, but only then should they start to seriously consider removing Logan from Williams.
I'm at the point where I never want to see a rookie going to a backmarker team again. Unless it's an obvious pay driver
I dunno⊠the car looks like crap this year. What does it gain Williams to drop him in the middle of the season? First off, they shouldn't have signed him for this year if they don't believe in him enough to not give his car to Alex in Australia. Second, who are you going to put in that car and score points?
This Antonelli child wouldn't be so hyped if he wasn't named after The Iceman
He just finished P10 in the sprint, ahead of Albon. And if it weren't for K Mag he probably would have finished ahead of Albon in the race as well.
Heâs done better than Mick, and people cry about bringing him back. shrug
Williams taking his chassis for Alex when Albon crashed was mentally the nail in his coffin, I believe. Itâs hard to mentally recover from.
Another thingâŠLoganâs contact in MiamiâŠKevin was on some bullshit the entire weekend to feed Hulk points positions (20 secs of penalties in earlier sessions? haha) . You and I could have put that Haas upside of Logan in that corner complex. The reason Kevin was at fault to me, and I give Logan a break, is he couldnât have made that move stick due to his car positioning anyways with how front limited everyone was. The exit in a complex like that IS the entry line for the next apex. Kevin not only couldnât make that move stick in any meaningful way, HE should have known Logan was already committed and canât see where Kevinâs axle is at by that point in corners that come that quickly and are that tight. The fact Kevin was approaching two more straights in the following sectors (plus slip and DRS) makes that move completely senseless.
Itâs hard to even care to hear about Antonelli (just yet). Drugovich is at home polishing his F2 title shaking his head, probably. Another prospect nobody is mentioning as much as Kimi and they should is McLarenâs junior driver Ugo (currently P2 I think in British F3). Only 17, crazy talent, athleticism, maturity, and heâs even an American driver with full support of Zak. I see him making an impact on the sport far before Antonelli just based off McLarenâs development progress.
Mick was bloody awful and the fanboys still haven't processed that.
@@Fiasco3 Mick took a long time to get comfortable in junior categories, too, before he found success. Thereâs just not that level of patience in F1, and him and his fatherâs fans are delusional about that.
Guys what the heck are you talking about. Mick at least has shown some pace while logibear is... And mick had 1 year in F1 bc the first year he was far off and had mazespin as a teammate. The second year he lost on points to magnussen, with a engine failure in canada (were running 7th) he would've been on it. And quali-duel was won by kmag only by 4. And this was bc off the tough start to the year where he like 5-1 mick in quali.
Tsunoda neede 3 years until he has shown some potential and he crashed quite some times and wasn't the easiest character. So i don't see why mick shouldn't return.
@@joe_87Couldâve helped if his dad wasnât a vegetable, didnât have the pressure of his last name, and if he had a TP who supported him like Vowles has with a mediocre Sergeant. Otherwise Mick wasnât garbage, but definitely not great by any means.
Mick was very unlucky considering he joined haas when he did. If Ferrari had put him in Alfa Romeo I reckon he would still be in f1
you need to wait for at least summer shutdown to make any proper conclusions for this season. the Williams is rubbish this season and has been leapfroged by multiple cars and has partially held on to its straight line dominance. I see potential there. Similar to Yuki, one season in F2 isn't enough for most drivers if they didn't win the title, with only Lando and Alex in recent memory who smashed it in their first season, but were already marked as very special. Also, considering that Sargeant spent an extra year in F3 due to money problems before Williams signed him also probably hurt his development. Logan hasn't shown as much raw pace as Yuki did in his first season but I think we are making too many conclusions and should wait him out. alex hasn't completely smashed Logan at this point last year so shows development.
Oscar Piastri is the real sensation here, he won F2 in his rookie year and had the 2022 as Alpines test mule which helped alot to just get in the grips with F1
Giving Alex Loganâs car in Australia killed Loganâs confidence. Williams are complicit in Loganâs struggles
Latest crash was in my opinion KMags fault, he had the speed, should have waited to pass. The Williams seems to have stood still this season, even Albon hasnât been pulling out performances this season in the race
Idk I think it was a mistake for antonelli to skip F3
I hardly think Williams has a reason to drop him this early in the season like a lot of people want because what is their reason? Heâs finishing 17th instead of 13th or 14th like Albon is? If Alex was consistently in or near the points, Iâd understand. But theyâre worse than Sauber right now and Logan has at least been near Alex in the races. Itâs not like Alex is lighting up the timesheets either.
I couldnât agree more. Having watched him in F2 Kimi does not look ready. Based on his performances in F2 Iâve thought that he potentially shouldnât have skipped F3. Let alone jump in an F1 car.
Kim Antonelli needs time and Williams need a reliable driver
Yeah, Kimi Antonelli just looks so mid, *and he has no sponsors AT ALL*
they also need a car thats not complete pile of s----.
I really hate all the stupid swapping drivers out halfway through a season (not even halfway) I saw an article where they were speculating that Ricciardo would be swapped out for Lawson despite having arguably two really good races. Swapping someone out halfway through the season is bad for everyone. Bad for the new driver because they don't get much time to adjust to the car. Bad for the old driver because at literally any moment in the season or any little mistake you make you could just be out of a drive. Imagine what that does to someone. That kind of pressure. Especially the entire F1 media is just chomping at the bit to kick sargeant to the curb. (personally I think alot of the hate he has recieved is solely because he is american) Which is just silly because kimi antonelli is driving a f2 car that is significantly more similar to the current era of f1 cars which logan never got a change to drive. I think if you swap kimi in now you will do the same thing to him that you did to logan. You will destroy his confidence and put him in way too soon. Logan had so much promise going into f1 but rushing him in has done nothing but damage. And also all the fans screaming at him all the time hasn't helped either. I mean all the commments about his crashes and crap when Albon has done more damage to the cars than he has. He was running very well in Japan and with a good pit stop could have been in Yuki's posistion in that race. Williams gave him a bad pitstop. If they kick him out for not getting any points after all that I'd be extremely disappointed in Williams and the sport.
I feel like the title is a bit harsh to Sargent. In Miami he was near to points in the sprint, and near to Albon in the race. The only reason K Mag was close to Sargent is that K Mag pitted under VSC conditions, whereas Sargent had already pitted. The incident might be something where he is only just starting to cut his teeth.
I feel like he had started to improve in Miami.
1:06 i fundamentally disagree, any sane f1 driver wouldn't go for that gap. and certainly i would assume a driver with so much experience like Magnussen would know to back out. i put 110% of the blame on Magnussen. And hey, Logan hasn't been delivering over all but like cmon. He just beat Albon in the sprint quali and beat him in the sprint finishing in p10. Then qualified around the same place as Albon and was running right next to Albon until he got punted out of the race by Magnussen.
So he had a fantastic sprint race and only DNF'ed because of Magnussen while albon finished last anyways and THIS is the race you decide he isn't good enough? that just doesn't make sense to me. I have no problem with the sentiment that he should be replaced, that can certainly be argued for. But this race being the breaking point is mad.
And on that note i think you should give him a bit more slack (though i know you've given him plenty) but like, it's not easy to go into F1 as a rookie in one of the worst teams on the grid and williams seems to only have gotten worse. He's driving a shit car for a shit team. Like in Japan where he lost 5 positions due to a bad pit stop. I know he eventually made a mistake as well but his race was already ruined, perhaps that had an effect on his driving. And even then he didn't crash or anything, he got the car out of the gravel. It's not like albon has been doing any good this year either. Albon destroyed the car which resulted in Logan, who already has little experience, missing a race. And just this weekend Albon was beaten by logan in sprint quali and the sprint itself and then as i stated albon finished last anyway. And albon has been in F1 for many years even driving for a top team in red bull. When he makes this many mistakes i'm actually impressed that Logan isn't doing anything worse with only one season in williams and now being in an even shittier car.
And the above mentioned arguments lead into this next one. 6:55 Albon capitalised off oportunities ot get great points like what 5 or 6 times maybe? I don't think it's fair of you to expect Logan as a rookie in such a shit car should've capitalised in these situations as well. And again, why is this coming up now? 2023 is in the past, he got another year and we should focus on what is happening right now. Which again is why i think it's so weird this is coming now when he hasn't really done that much worse than Albon this season and in the most recent race weekend he was as good if not better because of the sprint. And as the famous saying goes, you areo nly as good as your last race so why is this suddenly coming now?
8:58 and here you are imo misinterpreting the dispensation thing. Vowles has made it very clear they aren't planning on switching out Logan and heavily alluded to the fact that a dispensation was only made in order to maybe do an FP1 session. Now you might say why not just wait with the FP1 sessions, why get dispensation to do it so early? Who knows. Haas isn't dropping anyone mid season but they are allegedly giving Bearman SIX FP1 sessions. In any case i think Vowles has made everything around this very clear and i have no reason to think he isn't being honestđ€·đœââ even in the interview you showed it seems pretty clear there won't be a switch until 2025.
So in summary, i totally see arguments for Logan being replaced but not mid season. And i don't get why all this talk is coming after Miami when that was over all a pretty good weekend for him.
So by this metric Riccardo needs to leave?
Logan was and is being brought into a horrible time at Williams. You can argue that Albon is getting better performances, but that was in 2023, this year Logan has the highest placement that the team has recieved (p10 in the Miami Sprint), he is far below Alex in the repair costs, and has shown better pace compared to albon than in 2023. I think it is highly unfair to drop him currently, he has not gotten a lot of time to prove himself THIS year.
[Race 1: Steering wheel failure]
[Race 3: Ablon crashed his own car and got Logans in return]
[Race 4: driving a repaired chassis that is heavier]
[Race 5: Got team orders before the race that he will not be racing for points, instead be driving for data to help in the next race] [Race 6: Magnussen yoinked him off track]
I do not recall anything in Jeddah that is why it is not listed
What he has shown this year is insanely strong.
Jeddah was the KMag train (and also team orders to not overtake Albon/hold position which didnt really matter anyways)
đ your entire comment is wrong
tommo btw about the kmag/sargeant incident in miami - i think they deemed it on kevin because that part of the track has literally zero grip, even on the sim. if logan goes any tighter there he spins, 100% (ive done it my fair share of times). lwk i think pen for kmag was the right call with how the track works, magnussen would have known about low grip there, and if its logans corner, its magnussens responsibility.
james vowles calls bottas saying "VALTTERI IT'S JAMES" :d
Tommo starting to show just how biased he truly is
Loganâs weekend was good, he beat Alex in the sprint and itâs shame he didnât get a point, kmag took him out in the main race and wasnât his fault, most things that have happened to him this season hasnât been his fault
"Schumacher had his time" 2 seasons one of which was in a tractor
its Joever for Sargeant
Vowles has gotten exposed this year. Giving Albon Logan's chassis completely changed my view on him.
Sargeant don't get much support from the team overall. Never liked Vowles because he has a history of not being fair to the second driver.
@@erikahuxley 'valteri it's James' couldn't agree more
If Albon was scoring points I'd be more inclined to agree, but currently no matter who goes into that car points arent close. Just keep Logan in and use.his feedback
I would love Newy to go to Williams and take Checo with him. A driver who he knows and has worked with, same for Albon. Both quite likeable get on with the job drivers. I think he could have Williams in the upper mid field in 3 years. It would be a more wholesome ending to reconnect with Williams and get the old team back to its heights. Just my dream perhaps đ
I think Jack Doohan should be a shout for the Williams seat. Yes he is a young driver but he is extremely reliable
Its hard to say if he's f1 material based on his performances, because the Williams is a shitbox this year and its only saving grace (the straight line speed) has completely gone. The car is just bad now. Williams as a team is an admin nightmare, its gonna take a good amount of time to un-ruin that team, Vowles has his work cut out for him at that team, its hard to believe a team in the top tier of worldwide motorsport operates like that
We should bring also Alex Palou to the conversation. He makes sense as a driver and makes sense comercially. Given he is not American but quite popular for American Motorsport fans
From an outside perspective, getting a pair of rookies (Stroll and Sirotkin) seemed to be what set Williams down their path of being a perennial wheelie bin on fire. It certainly correlated, though I know they had technical and leadership issues too. That team desperately needs experienced drivers who can develop a car. .
No point replacing him mid season. Let the kid race. I think his mistakes are overblown and we're quick to forget how young he is. I havent seen much from Albon at all this year, either, so put the speculation to bed and support both drivers.
Speaking of yuki, he scored on debut. Unlike most rookies and especially sargent and the reason why he's the only rookie from that year still im f1
Yuki had a very fast Alpha Tauri on debut, which was generally faster than Alpine and on par with Mclaren and sometimes with Ferrari in 2021..Gasly scored over 100 pts that year, so naturally the car was more than capable to get points... This year, Albon hasn't opened his account, so on what basis are we saying to kick Sargeant out?
He is better than some of the other recent rookies we've had. Looking at you, Latifi and Mazepin.
Latifi scored points on merit few times. He's above other two.
I really wanted Logan to make it.. However, every team is operating under a $135 Million spending cap, and you simply can't afford to write off cars. As far as a replacement it will come down to which driver can bring sponsorship with him that will in turn be shaered with the team.
Interesting comments about Newey. going to Williams.
I am so tired of hearing about Kimi Antonelli
I think Zhou will somehow end up in Williams. Just a gut feeling. Think about it, a driver that rarely crashes, decent speed (compare to a strong one lap driver in Bottas), with one of the best financial backing out of any driver, especially after the Shanghai GP. Isnt he just the perfect fit for Williams second seat at this stage?
I usually agree with you assessments but i think you are wrong on the Magnussen - sargeant incident. It was 100% Kevin's fault. The new regs state that you need to be FULLY alongside and kevin was a third alonside.
Now i think that Logan should not have been pronoted and should have been fired without a tought last season. But this season he is closer to Albon, no doubt.
Should he be fired mid season. Maybe, of they bring in Pourchaire, mick, Schwartzmann. Not for Antonelli gove the boy time
Williams trying to decide who the next driver to be slow enough to get punted off by Magnussen is.
are you dumb? kmag was racing. F1 is a racing series, not a drive around after each other series
What are you talking. Bro in Melbourne he couldnt drive in japan he had a extrem bad pitstop and a wrong chassie miami he got crashed out and it wasnt logan, kevin shoulfve backed out
A mid-season reshuffle of Bottas to Williams, Hulk to Sauber & Bearman to Haas would make a lot of sense but would be a contractual headache.
They should try Mick Schumacher, Vesti or give Nyck De Vries an other shot
I still remeber that in only his 2th quali sension in 2023 saudi he had the pace for Q2 but drove over the painted line after pit entry. I though then that he had promancing pace, but it has almost been all down hill from that point
Bad call, Sargeant had a very good sprint race and the gap between him and Albon this year, when they've let him race, has been much closer. The car is crap.
He was gifted that p10 in the sprint, Lewis practically wrapped it up for him, put a bow on top and handed it to him personally
This honestly goes back to the problem of what is the point of Formula 2. Logan finished 4th in his F2 season yet he got into F1 ahead of the three people above him. Nikita Mazepin got into F1 after finishing 5th in F2, over the person who finished 2nd. None of the top 3 from F2 in 2023 have been allowed into F1. And now we have Mercedes and Williams trying to promote a guy (Antonelli) from Formula 4 who is currently in his first F2 season after skipping Formula 3 entirely, and trying to completely bypass the feeder system.
The FIA on principle need to reform the FIA Super License points system given how so many F2 champions have failed to find their way onto the grid in favour of drivers who just weren't ready. As for Mercedes, they need to be told directly that Kimi Antonelli is not allowed to basically skip both F3 and F2 to Formula 1, because Toto Wolff has no respect for the rules.
And f2 cars arenât close to the level of f1 so itâs a whole different car and a new learning process.
Ofc you will have great talents but not everyone is a generational talent.
Where is that cap from? @Tommo
Hot take but I think Logan does better than Perez in the second Red Bull seat. I think Albon makes him look a lot worse then he actually is
the poor guy didn't have any help to shine this yearâŠ
Thereâs a Segway LTT would be proud of
I don't think dropping him now makes any sense, it hasn't been two years and he still needs more time to be properly evaluated. Saying that the incident wasn't magnussen's fault is also a crazy take
They should have signed Drugovich at the end of last season if they always planned to treat Sargeant this bad anyways, all this negativety is going to take even more of a toll on the team
No
All the conversation is about LS but that Williams is a shitbox the last couple season. Period
Kimi and Mick were both doing laps at Silverstone today. I saw them both myself. Mick was setting the benchmark for comparison on Kimi's runs.
As an American it was exciting to see him join F1 I thought he had a decent F2 career needed to stay maybe 1 more season but I think it's just hard for younger Talent to stick around not enough seats. F1 needs 12 Teams.
Man... I really wonder how he'd do in a better car.
Last year's car was already hard to drive and even Albon is struggling with the new one.
Yeah I feel people forget the circumstance of Sargent's F1 debut. Going from no ground effect F2 cars to ground effect F1 with basically no prep in a very unpredictable car and then having your confidence destroyed by fans definitely affected him.
@@jediporg1245sounds like his problem, Oscar is doing great.
Can't wait around all day for him to potentially improve, F1 isn't work experience.
@@BigPundo Piastri was in a car that didnt shunt itself into a wall without a warning, wasn't bullied by the fans and didn't have to deal with the team fucking him over. Piastri got a really good hand honestly he's been in a front running car, he had more prep than most rookies do as alpine spent all of 22 prepping him fro 23 and he has a supportive team and a fanbase. Sargent was in an unpredictable car, had no prep, was shat on by everyone and is being sidelines by the team. Its honestly very interesting how opposing their circumstance have been and how that has affected their career trajectories.
Nah sorry but when people Like Theo or a Bottas potentially don't have a seat it's ridiculous to give him even 1 more race really. He need to go and if you can't get Theo in or atleast bottas at the End of the Season you are absolutely giving up on the project
@@ehrlichgesagt863 Pourchaire isn't even a merc or williams academy driver Stroll is far more deserving of being booted from the grid, dude is hogging up a very competitive car seat. Ik this one is controversial but even Riccardo. He had one good sprint and everyone's forgotten how consistently better Yuki had been doing this whole season.
With Merc being nowhere near even troubling the podium, I donât see any reason why they shouldnât put him straight in Merc for â25.
Going to Williams would just be a setback with having to re-learn a team when he does eventually go to merc