Willys CJ3A Project MORE BAD PARTS, ANGRY RANT!!!
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- čas přidán 3. 01. 2018
- More problems on the CJ3A project due to poor quality parts. Excuse my long winded video about bad parts, just trying to help people not make the same mistakes.
- Jak na to + styl
I'm a millwright, with a heavy background in machining and personally would be ashamed of producing or selling a part that was sub-standard in anyway. People are changing now and gap is widening just like the middleclass is disappearing. It's either you are a surgeon or you're on welfare. You either are making a computer circuit board, or you can't tie your shoes in the morning. Some people spend their lifetime acquiring the knowledge and tools to do the work they do, and some want to pour coffee for a living and demand over 30,000 dollars a year to do it. I don't know what the answer is, but just walk away for now and don't let their problems be yours. Keep your videos coming, and maybe if some peoples brains aren't too taxed by flipping burgers all day for 15 bucks an hour, they may watch your videos and learn something. God knows they didn't learn anything at home or in school.
Perfectly stated. Again, good to know there are other people out there who understand what I am saying. Many thanks.
Brian
15 bucks an hour? $9.00 here
I have been following for a couple months but went back and watched previous videos. I REALLY HOPE you continue with these builds and various old items of the past you restore or use. Don't let all the ppl that don't understand the skill and process get to you. Trust me, the skill you are sharing is well taken in and appreciated. Thank You
Comments such as yours keep me going. Like I said to many other people I will show my personal projects that are getting done correctly and no longer show the problems that occur on a restoration this is run only by a customer who is only concerned with the bottom line.
Please keep up the informative vids. Really enjoy seeing all the great work you do and your mad metal skills. As you said....sometimes you just have to walk away from a project for a bit, reset your sanity and enthusiasm, then return to pick it up with fresh hands and eyes. Thanks for all your sharing!
I will be on the project again next week. Thanks for watching and don't worry more videos on the way.
Just wanted to say: I’ve got a CJ2A who’s engine I just pulled. I’m new to this, and have a lot of work ahead of me, but I’ve been watching your videos and I’ve learned SO MUCH. Thank you so much, keep up the hard work, and I’ll probably be contacting you for advice and some purchases. Thanks so much!
I've been making repair parts for cars since I've had a car on the road nothing as skilled as this your doing a great job that is 1st class it is great to watch the progress and a great comintary that's easy to follow I'm looking forward to watching the rest I've found on CZcams all the best regards mark
Hope you don't give up on the Willys Jeeps, hang in there brother. I understand the frustration with customers and I appreciate where you're coming from. I've learned quite a bit from watching your videos working with sheet metal, I believe you're an artist!
Don't worry I am going to keep restoring these old Willys vehicles. Probably will only show my own projects though as they are the only ones that will get done correctly.
For the record, I've never restored anything, but I can tell by watching and listening you are a craftsman who knows what he's talking about. You comments are totally understandable. You seem to be a man who is passionate about doing things the right way. When someone tries to cheapen out and expect you to make it right that's very frustrating. There are still people in the world who have a great amount of respect for people who do things correctly. For what it's worth I love watching what you do. I'll continue watching, learning, and enjoying your videos.
Jim
Forgot to say I enjoy watching your videos and learn so much for them. Please keep making Willy's videos
The willys videos coming will be of my own projects. That way I don't have to worry about time or if it is being done right. My own projects always get done perfectly so I will show parts of those as time allows.
Ive been doing this kind of work for 30+ years. In that time almost every repoduction or performance part has needed modification or repair to make the part fit and work correctly. This annoys me, especially when I see the same parts, year after year with the same faults. Why do they not pay attention to customer feedback and correct the mistakes? These days I view repro parts differently. I just assume they will all need cut up and repaired before use. Its a balance, what is less work? Repairing the original panel, repairing the repro panel or making a new panel? As you are finding out, the customer is often the problem as he will believe the parts sales people and not the skilled man doing the work. Youre quite correct about doctors etc. It's a strange attitude, a person goes to college for a few years and he's respected and paid well. A man spends a lifetime learning the skills in the real world but he isn't valued because there's no bit of paper to hang on the wall. I get this at work all the time, a kid straight out of university will get instant respect because they have a degree, despite the fact that they have no common sense and couldn't put a nut on a bolt.
I have been at this trade for 30 years now as well. In the beginning things and people were much different. Now, I still deal with bad parts but also bad customers who have no idea how flat sheets of steel are transformed in to a complete body tub. Also, it is much easier to work for someone who also works with their hands, they seem to know what it takes as far as time and talent. Every time I work for a doctor, lawyer, dentist, or some other white collar person things go bad. They all feel that their worth is more than yours. It is great to know that there are others dealing with the same problems I am and in 2018 I am going to make many changes to the way I do my restoration work. Thanks for taking the time to comment, it is appreciated.
Brian
metalshaper hey Brian. I just found this video. Amen to this comment. I work in healthcare now but I grew up mechanical and machine shop experience pretty much until 15 years ago or so. I see this every freakin day. People that never or have hardly ever worked with their hands to try to make something from raw materials looking down their damned noses at everybody else. They seem to think we are just here to serve them. Well enough of my rant. I really enjoy your channel. It's obvious your are an artist and craftsman at what you do. Thanks for sharing your knowledge. I always learn something.
Brian. Stupidity is a growth industry. People just do not understand craftsmanship or knowledge anymore, but through the negatives, the positives appear. You will find a way my man. I think you need to pause and realise what you started out with in that Jeep - and all the other stuff you do. If I pulled that exact same tub outside your shop and said I had done all that top quality work but had these same problems, you would look at the standard of the rest of the fabrication and laugh me out of there. Man, just stop a minute and LOOK AT WHAT YOU HAVE ACHIEVED!! Don't let a tiny problem like that slow down a man like you. Keep on pushing. Get it done. You are the man...
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I will get thru it, just showing people what is out there for parts so they don't get in trouble. Trouble with this project is I always have someone worried about the time I spend making things right. Hard to have everything, meaning a perfect restoration for little cost.
You are 100% correct, and I am surrounded by the massive growth of the industry!!!
Just wanted to let you know that I have been enjoying your videos. Got me wanting to do a full restore on one of my old Jeep's. Thanks
Thanks for the comment, hope you get one of your old Willys out for restoration soon. Keep me posted if you ever get started.
Brian
I hear ya' Brian. I renovated a 1945 Jeep and some of the panels and parts I got were terrible. On one hand I needed them because I am a beginner fabricator. On the other hand, when you pay good money for a part, you expect it to fit. Best of luck on the project. I need you to be strong and continue to produce videos. I'm learning a lot here. That wrecker is pretty cool. I've not seen one like that before. Truly unique.
I am going to keep working on my personal projects so I can show you how to do things correctly. This 3A project is going down the wrong path so I may not show much on it any longer.
I am glad that this video was posted. A restoration was begun 3 years ago on an M38A1 using sheet metal mostly from the same place you mention for the floor of your 3A. It also had a problem with that forward brace (hat channel). The 38A1 doesn't have one but the new one did. The guy who was doing the fitting/welding had the tub off and I had the chassis. When the tub arrived it didn't fit because of interference between that brace and the machine gun mount that was part of the frame. The brace had to be cut out to straddle the mount. How can you miss that fact? I spent a lot of money on crap that was only (maybe) 60% correct. I could rant about a hundred different aftermarket parts for the two Willys' that we are working on. The best route is to get NOS whenever possible. It's good to know that there are others out there with problems like mine.
Please keep up the Jeep videos. They are by far the best instructional videos on Jeep restoration on CZcams.
Thanks Joe, keep watching more coming soon.
Love your videos! Please keep up the good work and hang in there!
Thanks for watching. More to come.
keep up the videos, I'm hoping to get a driver/project 2 or 3a in a year or two and learning a lot watching all these videos, plus they're just entertaining.
Glad you like the videos and are learning. Keep track of the parts that are bad on this project so you don't make the same mistakes.
Hang in there brother. You do awesome work. If anyone can get through it it's you. Tomorrows another day! I'm just finishing up a '56 Willys pickup for myself. It was my third Willys restoration project. The problems I encountered made me want to cry or maybe ring someones neck. For what it's worth, I feel your pain.
Some days just make you want quit. I have hundreds of projects that have rolled thru my doors, but times and people are changing.
I feel for you. That's why I don't work on other peoples stuff anymore. I appreciate your videos I have learned a lot from them. Being that I am new to the world of old jeeps I hope that you keep making the viedos and showing us who can use the information that you have for these fine vehicles.
I will keep making videos of my own projects so keep watching for those.
Brian
Brian- Absolutely love your videos and drive to perfection. I am always learning something when I watch them. By trade, I own a HVAC business, and have spent my last 20 years being the best at it I can be. To be the best you can be at something is hard work. Saying screw it, good enough is the easy, sloppy road. I really appreciate what you work and drive towards in the quality of work you do. The knowledge is not easily gained nor does it come cheap and is a large commitment. Thanks for sharing your knowledge. The sheet metal work we do is largely square ducting and transitions, some radius stuff. In our shop we've bought some equipment for sheet metal fabrication-mainly different apron and finger brakes, but also some stuff unique to our industry like a pittsburgh machine, and slitter. But what I'm trying to say is its an expensive investment. Some times people don't understand that. Looks like you have a nice assortment of tools and machines, do an awesome job doing it right and taking pride in your work-keep your head up and find the right clients who appreciate what you do. I've really enjoyed watching you fix my other passion-flatfender jeeps, and some military vehicles. Really cool-keep up the good work!
great to hear from viewers like you who understand the investment it takes to get jobs done. I am taking a bit of a break from youtube for a while but may come back someday with more videos.
@@metalshaperJeep Sad to hear about your break. Hopefully its just temporary. Yes I walk through my shop and the investment we have for basic sheet metal tools is substantial. For just basic tools. Watching your videos I can see a large investment, not just in money, but time. That's really what is being lost is the expertise, something that takes a lot of experience to build. They say when Bantam built the first prototype, a hand full of engineers, and fabricators locked themselves into the plant and didn't quit till they didn't just had a design they had a completed vehicle. Do we possess that kind of savvy to do it now-as a whole? I truly can appreciate your talents-working in a sheet metal trade on a totally different plane, your skilled at what you do. I marvel at your machines and the assortment you have-its like watching Bob Vila work wood where you think he can't possibly have the tool and boom he walks over to the next machine. I have a rolling radius I would like you opinion on how to fabricate-it tampers as it goes down the length of metal. I thought at first about building a custom nose bar for my brake to build the radius(Ive seen some chicago literature talking about radius'ed nose bars), but not sure that is the best solution. At any rate-keep up the good work. Thanks for your videos-Ben
Don't get discouraged take one problem at a time and before long it will be done and out of your hair. I just started watching your videos and am currently rebuilding a 1979 f150 and have had alot of rust repair I have really just used patch panels but not all of them are made so I have figured out how to make them myself and videos like yours help with that and I appreciate it
Thanks for watching, and glad my videos are helping you along with your restoration. Glad to have this project out of the shop along with the customer who has no idea what restoration involves or costs.
The devil truly is in the details and I am amazed at your perseverance in all things. I really appreciate your rant in the most respectful way. The cold short days never help either. I know you will keep the "plow in the ground" and come out with a great finish. Nothing we do ever comes out perfect but the goal is always to do. Some of us know how difficult real work is and I think about all the projects you have in the wings and am amazed and inspired by your ethic. Here's wishing you and yours a wonder fulfilling 2018!
Thanks Karl, you always have a good grasp on what I am saying and doing. Rest assured the rest of the projects will come out much, much, better than this one because I am doing them for myself and don't mind spending the time it takes to do things correctly. I will concentrate on more of the good things than the bad, but want to show people where things can go wrong on their projects . Thanks so much for watching and understanding.
I truly enjoy your channel. Callout those vendors with substandard parts. Companies should stand behind their work.
Thanks for watching. Bad floor and front quarter panels from Classic industries. Bad floor pans, bad bow pockets, misc. bad parts from Walck's.
metalshaper walcks even states on some parts it's not a 100% repo. You have to modify it some.
Keep up the vids people dont mind you venting occasionally> Your channel is really taking off I think! The New project looks awesome
thanks, much appreciated.
Subscribed. Love your work and attitude
Brian, the thing I can never understand is that the makers of these "incorrect" parts never seem to take on board the feedback that we give them, even when you send photos and explanations they just say "we never get complaints from our other customers" the only way that can be true is if the customers are heavily modifying the bad parts to make them fit, it is really frustrating to come up again this misfits, (the panels and the companies), and the only way to stay sane is to walk away and get stuck into another project, setting the present project even further back, this is far worst in the winter when you are pinned down by the weather, but at least the better weather is on it's way, dealing with customers is always difficult as by the very nature of things they do not always understand what is involved. Good Luck on this one ! Chris B.
Chris, it is refreshing to know that there are other people out there who understand what I am saying. Poor parts are everywhere, most companies only sell parts and have no idea how to install them or what is involved in restoration work. Problem on this project is that the customer didn't want to spend the money to have me make the correct parts, so we are stuck with horrible reproductions. Future videos will be of my own personal projects where I can show the correct way to restore a vehicle, not how to cut corners or save money.
Brian
I had the same experience with a set of top bows a bought this year there wasn't a single component that didn't need to be majorly reworked. I told the seller and he asked me to take photos so I went through every part and labelled photos with the problems. He gave me a full refund but I still need a set of bows, so I'll have to rework every component to get them to work. I bought a rear floor from JD Jaun and so far so good, the dealer I bought it from travels to the Philippines to work with them to try and get the parts right. But he tells me the company has new upper management and the focus has changed to chase the dollars. They don't get it if you sell bad parts your business is not sustainable, it's only a matter of time before people stop buying your products. I love these old jeeps but restoring one in Australia is difficult it would have been a ton easier for me to restore an army jeep as cj's are rare here. Keep up the good work you have inspired me to make my own simple part's for my 3a. Can't wait for the next project.
KifferSeam: Your experience with the seller was far from normal, he must be a very decent person, the problem with any manufacturing enterprise is that you can make up prototypes for ever, but I find that if a part fits onto a typical vehicle that it is made for, you are on the right track, the thing I find annoying is when the sellers of these ill fitting parts come back and say "no one else has complained", the point about complaining to the seller is to get a feedback to the manufacturer, which does not seem to happen, when I make and sell parts I welcome feedback, that is the only way you can improve on your product, and keep the customer happy, far better than him going around to all his mates telling them your part are no good. I hope you do have a go at making your parts, and do not get despondent when they look like a fail at first, most times the part looks like a fail at some point in its build, that is the huge benefit of Brian's videos, it give inspiration to have a go, and when you have made the part, it will give you a great deal o satisfaction, even if it does look like a cock up to begin with! Good luck with your project !
Brian,
I understand the pain and frustration with the restoration of this vehicle, but I hope you will continue updates.
The presentation of the problems you face, I believe, passes on a lot of knowledge about the restoration process. For me, I don't have the skills you have. Yes, I could spend a lot more time, dealing with my mistakes and the correction of them, but I'm do not plan to do much in the way of metal work or paint.
I only have my small garage to work in and I only plan to do this one 1947 CJ-2A. I should be removing my tub this weekend after I get the steering out. I feel confident in my ability to do the mechanical and electrical type work, with the help of your videos, but the body work and paint for the big stuff is just to much expense in terms of time, learning and investment in the proper tools.
The body of my vehicle is totally shot, all rusted out. My plan is to buy one of the MD Juan Master Kits and work with a local body shop to correct the dings, drill the holes and to finish and mount the body. My thought is that if I buy the total package I'm less likely to run into misfits. I'm interested in your opinion on what I can expect from this approach. I do plan to put a top on it...
Thanks!
Michael
The body kits are terrible. Lots of stuff does not fit. The primer on them is terrible so you will need to completely sandblast or strip everything down to clean metal. Windshields never fit the cowl correctly. Body floor is not stamped correctly so you will need to put large body mounts on the frame to clear the transmission/transfer case. I can go on but you get the picture. I have put many of them on and they will eventually fit, but it does take a bit of work to make it right. Keep me posted on your progress.
Brian
After reading through the comments--I wouldn't have anything new to add. I was aware of the poor quality of aftermarket parts from friends that have went through it. It is also reflected on the Willys forums. You are on the right path--get through this, and hold firm on future projects.
A Burma Wrecker!!!! I just knew for sure you had it wrong and it was a bomb truck!! Data Plates don't lie!! What a find!!! I am truly looking forward to seeing you work through this project and the others you have in the works!!
the burma wrecker was a good find. More on that coming as soon as it gets here. Good history on it, remarkable condition, and I believe one of the only ones left in existence with the original wrecker boom still intact. Still has the marquette badge on it. I have a bomb service truck almost finished so this will make a nice addition.
Brian
Great job, Brian. You are the best, I ck everyday for New videos, keep them coming
More videos coming. Most will be of my own Willys projects though as I am tired of just showing problems on this 3a project. My own projects get done correctly and I can show different ways of doing things for my viewers. Hang in there more stuff coming.
Thanks for sharing your knowledge.
Keep your head up brother and just keep rolling stay warm be safe and hope to see that project roll on 😀
More to come, hang in there.
Brian
Ive been negotiating with a customer similar to this. He has raised too many red flags, including demanding a price cap on each part of the job, on a 50 year old truck. Seeing this video has helped me to decide, he either pays my full rate, or takes it elsewhere.
Thank you
I am at the point in my life where I would rather be unemployed than work on projects where the customer is always demanding cheap prices, and poor craftsmanship. As auto restorers we need to have customers pay the bill or take their project to another shop. Stick to it, less aggravation will do a lot towards your general well being. Thanks for watching.
I started out as a carpenter myself, and it was great for a while, then the economy went bad and I moved full time into restoration work. Now that industry is also attracting all the worst customers just like carpentry.
Price your work as you see it's valued, if you book enough work to stay busy fine, if not then re-evaluate and figure out how to get enough work to stay busy, either by reducing your price or finding work you didn't have before. Most good tradesmen I run across usually has more work than they know what to do with. It seems the more price sensitive a customer is the harder it is to make them happy and even if you do a great job for them they'll still gripe about it and that makes it harder to network your way into jobs they're poison stay away.
I am always busy, that isn't the problem, but price sensitive customers are always around. I hear what you are saying about them being poison, how true it is. I have been at this for 30 years now and for most of that time there were great customers and no problems with money. In this changing world people are different and are looking to get much more work done than they are willing to pay for. I think it is a sign of the times. More and more craftsmen like myself are getting out of the business, and when we are gone there is not another generation to take our place.
Tough way to start 2018, good reality check into the the "inside baseball" of client/customer relations. Some projects just get tagged with problems and they fight you to the bitter end. Glad I watched to the end because was gonna tell you to sleep it off. Cheers.
the problem is the world is changing and I am keeping my old ways of doing things right. I probably should have not taken this project in the shop as I had a feeling there was going to be lots of time in it. More to follow.
Technology yes, is changing, the world and pretty much people aren't. You have a great inventory of serious tools/tooling don't ever lose the old ways. Doing it all yourself is quite a load and takes a toll. Quite frankly, I'm amazed at your work and video output..
Thanks Alger C. , I am trying to stay focused on projects and get them finished. Viewers like you that watch and comment are what keep me going. Hang in there, things will get better.
Great vid. Sorry to hear about the floor.
Where would you suggest someone buy engine parts? I have a CJ2A and I need a few parts for the engine. Most importantly a cylinder head and carb.
Your work is awesome.
Wouldnt call this a restoration, I'd call it new construction. What of the original is still used on this build as far as the body?
Thanks for the videos. I understand your frustration. Chill out.
I am a bit more relaxed now, thanks for understanding.
Hi Brian I enjoy your videos very much. From what I have seen on several of your videos concerning poor after market sheet metal parts it sounds like a tremendous business opportunity for you to start-up a small scale production operation and fill the much needed niche. You already have the equipment and skills get some working partners in to make the parts while you can attend to your personal projects.
I feel your pain.....I had many problems with reproduction parts when restoring my '45 MB. Most of the parts were junk and I either had to fix them or find good original parts instead.
I also understand your frustration with what you're able to charge for the work. While working in machine shops (mostly building molds) it was a constant problem with customers complaining about hourly cost and we were barely able to charge $40/hr shop rate. Never mind we had about $2 million worth of equipment in the shop.....yet they had no problem paying $80/hr at the local car dealer where the shop just provides a place to work, and the mechanic brings all the tools.
My suggestion would be that if you take on more restorations for customers that you lay it on the line how YOU are willing to do the work, otherwise you won't take the job. The other option might be to just buy Jeeps, restore them how you want, and then sell the completed vehicle. I've known a few body men that would only work that way because of the same customer problems you're having. Don't let a bad customer sour you on the business. With your talent I hate to see you give it up, but you have to keep yourself sane.
Thanks for the comment. Most white collar workers have no respect for us blue collar folks who build and create things every day. I have a huge investment in machinery and spent a lifetime learning my trade, but my customer sees no value in that and always wants to spend less and get more. I have a lot of personal projects in the works right now and will continue to film them and put out videos. This project will get done with less quality than usual so I am no longer going to film this particular project. Great to have another person that understands what I am saying, thanks for your support.
Brian
I just want to add a few comments.
First, although the parts are substandard, you have the talent to make them work, but that adds more time to the build, so its better if you would have just made them yourself from the start. That said, if all you have to work with is the after market crap, like many of us, then its great you possess the no how to correct it and pass the info on to us, as you have been so selfless in doing. By the looks of the other comments, I can say for many, that we appreciate and are grateful for the guidance big time! Clearly the real frustration is with your customer forcing you to produce a substandard product that is against everything you have spent many years crafting, including knowledge and tooling. Take some time to breath and find ways to continue this as a teaching moment, bringing me to my other point, i want to thank you for the rant! Keep it real Brian because that is what reaches people.
All the best and I am watching all the time for your new videos.
Keep going !
this project is going the wrong direction due to cost issues. That is why I am going to show how to do things correctly on my own projects where time and cost are the major concerns. Hang in there and keep watching, better videos coming.
Dave Underwood stated the problem accurately and precisely. These skills being demonstrated are the best way of doing a restoration and methods of really saving money. Quality and knowledge rides supreme over shortcuts of just trying to save money without not really understanding. I under your frustration but you are needed tooo come fro pass knowledge and understanding to us others who understand what you are going through. Other work outside Jeep is a possible but one has to be careful in selecting a paying customer. You appear to have always provided trust with experience to your customers along with the in-depth knowledge and skills. I do understand the frustration but also see you love for the Jeep and a proper restoration; add a questionable parts supply; add to customers not understanding the restoration process; add to customer attitude of always being right; add to ?????; etc. Leads to an attitude of why put up with the problems.
I for one do understand which is why I am here trying to gain practical knowledge, information, and understanding in the Jeep restoration process. You have given it to me in so many different ways. I have restored other cars and vehicles but I have never seen nor gained so much practical knowledge and skills as I have in following your threads. The desire to restore a Jeep is one of the last skill sets I want to do because of health and age; your info on the Jeep projects has given me the desire to keep pushing the items of health and age away into some future part and to keep going to learn, restore, drive, etc. I may not ever give my CJ5 a restoration but I can say at least I saved it from the "junkyard" and have spent my time learning the true and correct way of considering all the aspects of Jeep Restoration.
Sorry, I do get long winded!
Cheer up and don't give up. You know as well as all your followers you are really great at what you do. I restore WC Dodge projects I know your pain. Thanks for your great information and videos.
thanks for your positive comment. I will get things fixed up and show the results. After that I will probably just show my own projects where I don't have someone breathing down my neck about time or cost.
Thank you for your dedication to restoring historic Jeeps. On a side note I think you might be feeling the winter time blues, take some vitamin D3 and cause the sun is being hidden by the clouds and your probably not getting enough sun, God Bless.
I spend plenty of time in the sun every day and love the winter time so no blues here. The only thing that bugs me is my customers!!!
I feel for you Mate,,don’t let it get you down your doing a great job,,thanks for your input,, regards Frank
Thanks Frank, good to hear from you again. Hope all is well and you are having a great new year.
Brian
Ok if I need a new floor where should I get it from?
I've gone through the same situations that you are experiencing. The big problem is becoming personal friends with your customer and then when demands are made it becomes very difficult to say NO. You need to learn to shift the decision making about pricing to someone else (wife or accountant or anyone besides yourself) so you can say 'I'm sorry but they tell me I can't do it for that price'. This will leave your relationship on a pretty good level and take much of the stress off of you.
I think just about everybody in the restoration business has gone thru the same thing. In a nutshell customers want much more than they are willing to pay for . I don't need any more friends, they are always the ones to try and take advantage of you . Thanks for the comment, much appreciated.
sending positive thoughts your way!!
Many thanks, viewers like you are appreciated.
What you are saying is why I only restore Willy's for myself. I'm the customer and the person that is restoring the project.
I am moving in that direction also. Some of the finest Willys in the world have passed thru my doors, but I can see a definite change in people these days. Future videos will feature my own projects.
Do you make body parts for sale? Or would it all need customisation.
Dude, haters gonna hate. Your a professional. Hold your head high. Your shit fits. Theirs doesn't. I lack the skills and machinery to build these types of parts. Wish there were guys like you selling good parts.
Everyone needs to rant from time to time. We're here to listen. There are a bunch of us that look up to you, not just for your skills, but also for your knowledge. I hope you're able to sort things out with the 3a. I have no doubt you will.
Thanks for hanging in there with me. More to follow, thanks for watching.
I had a heck of a hard time with my cj2a inner windshield frame from the Philippines. Hopefully the customer can live with the pockets where they are, maybe he won't use a half top. I was wondering what you use for air hoses on cj2a air cleaners. The ones I bought are thin and crappy. Thanks for your vids, I understand some your frustration, not having your talents I have kind of stalled out on my old Willys. Like you said sometimes you have to give it a break. I'm going to try and get it going again in the spring.
The windshield frames from the Philippines never fit., no matter what the combination. Repro on original tub, repro on repro tub, etc...... They are all bad and take a lot of work to make right.
the CJ3A customer wants to run a half top so the floor needs to be fixed I guess. I have sourced a nice hose for the CJ2A air cleaner. I will check to see if I still have any left in stock.
Brian
And brother I can't wait to see that wrecker should be awesome once in a lifetime project 👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
Hi Bryan, 2 years later I saw this video, what happened with the floor if the jeep? Thanks for all your videos, you are a great master.
Customer stopped paying and the project was thrown out of the shop.
After 20+ years in the UK restoring and building '60s Race Minis I had to stop doing it commercially. I have been through exactly the same thing time and time again with customers starting out ok and then ending up expecting far more than is ever expected from professional craftspeople like ourselves. I went from a large workshop full of projects awaiting the go ahead to a tiny workshop with my own projects done on my own terms. Best thing is, when I have completed a project I have the upper hand now and can command a fair price for my work. The biggest difference is I have spent more time with my family this holidays.
Looks like after 30 years I am going to take the same path as you. Hard to find good customers these days who understand what it takes to restore a vehicle. thanks for the comment.
I see the tools you have and know what they cost ...Thats what some people dont see..You are good at what you do..........
thanks for watching and taking the time to comment. I have dedicated my life to this trade but the way the world is today has me wondering about my decision. Hopefully I can find better things to do in 2018!!
Hey Brian, my m38 windshield is really similar to this, a lot of holes, don't run her in the winter but at 60 wow do these holes sing a song
I would be very frustrated too, I believe you will make it as good as you can.
I will show the completed fix when done. Until then will show videos of my own projects .
You are the professor, thanks for sharing your knowledge.
thanks for the comment, you are much appreciated !!
Maybe you should make and sell those parts, your a craftsman ,alot of us noobs don't have 20 or 30k to have a shop restore it for us but we can change panels at least , and what I've been seeing in those replacement tubs is a turn off rather cheap and in accurate, I'd rather go though the extra effort to fix a original tub than buying a imported tub, plus that what should be the fun part, to improve and make your project the best you can.btw thanks for the vids!
Billy: we bought a tub manufactured in a certain former U.S. possession. My partner started to try to move our original takeoff parts to the unit only to find that: 1. The mounting holes didn't match and 2. weldnuts were METRIC!
Every Jeep owner needs to watch this video so they understand the issues of aftermarket parts
I found an old Jeep in a old junk yard. The only thing that’s missing is the grill. The farmer says that is a 1947.the motor and and the rest of it’s there. How do I tell what model it is
I know all too well about trying to make out of spec parts work on a project. My 65 MGB was in need of metalwork, and when given the choice between British made (on the original dies) sheetmetal, and stuff made in the far east, I initially tried the cheaper option. I was able to make floor panels work, but after that experience I went with the genuine articles available from England.
Most aftermarket parts are terrible. On my own projects I make perfect reproduction parts every time, but on customer projects there are not many that want to pay for the correct parts. It always comes down to cost over quality. Glad you found the right parts for your project, it makes a big difference in the final appearance of the restoration.
Still got my b g t new in 73 my aunt even did the upholstery she the seats in the factory from oxford England
This happens when you pause a video; If I heard correctly the under floor support is miss located (or is it?). The floor pan was built wrong, with the cups miss located (bad Q.C.). The hoop support(s) wasn't built right (design wrong, manufacturing wrong and/or bad Q.C.). :-(
Just had a thought: At the rate Jeeps were being built during WWII, maybe the hoop supports always needed shimming (very doubtful with your experience)? ;-)
I had a concept (the simplest of many) of a Jeep Scrambler with a regular roof (metal or cloth) and roll bar but the remaining space behind the top (rear seat) would be a storage box (custom fit) with a slightly angled lid, mounted just below the rear window. ;-)
Just about every aftermarket part used on this vehicle was made wrong..... floor, bow pockets, front floors, etc... Most companies making parts have no idea what they are doing. The parts made by jeep parts suppliers are very bad also. They just have no idea what they are doing when it comes to fabrication work.
So, you're looking for a new challenge? We've got one. A 1958 Dodge Sweptside, that has major rust problems in the back fenders. This is the truck with the station wagon fenders, I'm sure that you know about these. We have not started to restore this truck yet. Would you be willing to build us new rear fenders? I'd say about 80% of the original fenders could be used as a pattern. These fenders do unbolt completely from inner box, but we'd be willing to drop the whole truck off also. Let me what you think. I think that it would be a fun, and challenging project. There would be no time frame either. This truck has been like this for over thirty years, a few more won't hurt anything. Remarkably, the rest of the truck is rust free.
I would love to see what the fenders look like. You can contact me directly at metalshaper@comcast.net
Thanks! I'll contact you through your email.
I agree with you completely on every point that you made, including the 30 year olds who live in their mother's basements and are experts on everything. British bike restorations was a second career when I took an early retirement. Last year I got so sick of it I retired again and now only do my own projects. Life is too short to deal with tightfisted, ungrateful idiots.
Glad to find another person who understands what I am saying. This is the last project I am going to do for someone who is more concerned with the cost rather than the quality of the restoration. As I said in other comments, the world and people are changing and I am staying the same putting out quality restorations. Nobody seems to appreciate the work I do any longer so I am going to continue filming my personal restorations and not the crappy work on customers projects that they want me to do. Thanks for watching and understanding.
Brian
Been in the metal working trade (self employed) for 35 years. I'm used to this type of shitty situation, and it stresses everybody out. A lot of times, the people that can best afford it, are the cheapest and most demanding.
Maybe it's not so simple, but I would be inclined to call the customer, have him come take
a look at the crappy parts that don't fit right, then tell him "I'm sorry, but they don't fit correctly, I can't use them" and then simply ask him "Now what"? Then give him the option to go find parts that fit better, or agree that you modify them at additional cost to him. Stand by your level of quality, and gently but firmly explain to him that 'quality costs time and money, and you are committed to giving him the best quality job possible. It's tough to argue with a guy that has your best interest in mind...A little psychology can go a long way with people (sometimes).
Other than that, worst case (sometimes best decision) is get paid for what you've done at this point (before it leaves your shop) and move on.
All good advice. I would love to put this entire project in a box and ship it back to where it came from. But, I will see it thru to the end and struggle with the best quality/cheapest price mentality on this one. Won't let a customer tell me what to do next time. There are plenty of shops that do crappy work and I think he would have been happier at one of those shops instead of mine. Live and learn I guess.
Unsolicited suggestion:
Would you consider making small batches of parts the way you want and the way they should be made?
IMO that would "solve" issues on both sides of the fence and, based on comments to this and previous videos, could solve similar problems for other restorations/restorers as well.
Obviously you would be opening yourself up to an entire different series of headaches...to make it even more complicated and add to the headaches, I could envision your supervising and instructing a couple of apprentices in the arts/sciences that you know and then, as a learning tool on an ongoing basis, they could begin taking over the making of said parts.
Cost wise such parts may not be feasible (I am meaning the cost completed parts would need to be sold at) BUT, as you point out, in many/most/all cases correct parts at a greater cost one time ends up being far less than repeated corrections or having to buy the same part multiple times.
I have been making the correct parts for many years and sometimes often cheaper than the junk parts that come in from overseas. There are only a very few people who want to do things correctly and most people will always choose a cheaper part rather than having to wait to have the correct one built for just a few dollars more. In 2018 I am going to try to offer a few classes on metalshaping and see how it goes. A few guys are interested and it will allow them to build quality parts with their own hands.
Basically I can not educate the entire Willys community, if someone wants to do a correct restoration they know to come to my shop and have it done. Situations like this one the customer wants a perfect restoration but does not understand the costs involved to do it.
I have too many projects of my own to worry about all the tire kickers out there and the people who may or may not want quality parts. At the very least i am putting out videos showing people the junk parts out there so they can avoid them.
Brian
i feel your pain ...all you can do is learn to read people and know when to refuse a job ,when they use the word cheaper i walk away
I guess reading people is my biggest problem. Should have known not to take this project in, but it is here and I will work thru to finish it.
Brian; Can you cut the cups and bar out as one piece and rotate 180 degrees and then weld it back on, and tell the client that is all you can do unless he wants you to build it from scratch.
I am taking a break from the project right now but will show the fix when I am done.
Feel your pain. I hate junk parts that folks bring me that saved them $2.02 because the stuff I wanted to use was to costly.
Thanks for the comment, I knew there were other restorers out there who are going thru the same thing. When people leave me alone and let me do my job projects go much smoother and faster. At least this is enough of a kick in the ass to get me searching for other vehicles to restore and higher end sheetmetal parts to fabricate. Thanks for watching.
Cant wait to see the wrecker Jeep !
you can see the wrecker jeep here:
czcams.com/video/J_xOzrMTCCQ/video.html
Amen to thousands of spent hours and cost on some projects, and sleepless nights too!!
I can't bring myself to jump into a restoration. I have one fellow who is willing to do one and I have seen one he has done. The car he did was great and the man who had it done wanted to save money and put the bumpers, lights, trim, rubber goods and interior in. When he did it wasn't up to the work the restorer did. When I saw the before and after pictures and found out what he charged I really realized if you can't afford to let the man do the project don't start it.
Sounds like you understand what I am saying. The customer I have on this project is doing some of the work himself like you stated in your comment. Got the steering wheel back and it was a bad job, and won't match the quality of restoration I am doing. Waiting on other parts to come back. This project has made me want to start restoring other vehicles and move away from the jeep world.
Brian
Brian I’m gonna teach you a new word today. That word is “no”.
hi i am no where near you skill level but I know about trying to save a buck is it possible and acceptable to cut out the 2 recess out move them to correct placement using what come,s out bit of metal finishing and you will save you,r time his money i get a lot of pleasure plus training looking forward to more
I will show the fix when it is done. I was going to cut out the floor recesses but where they need to go is right over a crossmember that is also in the wrong place.
First, let me say that I've very impressed with your work and with your knowledge. You do work at a high level of quality; a quality that should permit you to lay down the law with your customers. YOU source the parts, YOU do the work and THEY write the checks. If they can't abide that, they should go somewhere else. Having your work space tied up with a project that cannot move forward owing to the customer's desire to cut corners and pinch pennies COSTS YOU TIME AND MONEY. Shops are not charitable institutions. Take control of your shop, Metalshaper. If you don't control your shop, you shouldn't be complaining.
This project started out strong and slowly went downhill. Normally this project would have been shipped back to the customer a long time ago and a new project in its place. I am trying to finish this one as I have known this customer for many years. Hard to say if it will get finished or not at this point but I am trying.
People just dont understand when you have a specialty type business the costs involved and time required to do things is insane. I professionally train horses as a business and build jeeps for fun but my customers with horses just don't understand the time and the cost to even have my business. They think I'm expensive but after you add up all the bills you dont make much. Same goes for all your equipment and machinery and wear and tear. I know many entrepreneurs get to the point on their business if they are really good it either costs this much to do the job or move on.
Sounds like you have a real good grasp on the whole situation. People that just go to work and collect a paycheck at the end of the week have no idea how the real world works, and what it takes to make ends meet. Thanks for being one of the people that understand.
Ok great I have a 51 that I would like to get on the road not looking for a full resto just the basics to get her running she was sitting around not used since 94
you can reach me directly at metalshaper@comcast.net
Brian
No shortage of critics out there..but there is a shortage of QC going on..inspect before you ship!! dont mess with people!!
Bryan just thinking cut and weld a square tube on the Bow to fit the bracket . Hole saw the bed Fab a new hole pocket close the one in error . Fab a connection end on the Bow .So it's not original!.
I was going to move the bed pockets back, but they put a piece of hat channel right under the area that the bow pockets need to be. I will get the brackets shimmed out so the bow fits, just need to work on getting the pockets in the right area so the footman loop is below the floor.
I had the same issues with my stang restoration. Didnt matter if it where Chineese or USA made. I wanted my original doors and fenders repaired instead the body man supposedly scrapped them. I need a body for a brass era car. I doubt I can afford someone to build it if I can find a person can do it correctly. lookn to do it myself.
Where is your shop at
connecticut
Look Like you could use square tube with flat bottom on it I don't know
Brian .......mixing and matching parts is more often than not a problem.(as you know so well)
The replacement part may be correct but be patterned after another variant.......the parts may all fit the makers parts, if you buy his whole body (looks good from across the street)........Some of these guys should look up the definition of reproduction or make hand grenades instead, where close does count........... Your customer needs to verify the accuracy of these parts he wants you to use or better yet let you have at it ........I have experienced the same problems..........I like to get it right the first time.........it takes at least twice as long ,if not longer, to rework, , and never comes out as well..........If you want a artist to do your work, come back when he is done. An artist does not require supervision.
Good to hear from you again, sounds like you have a good grasp on what I am saying. This is the last project I am doing for someone who is more concerned about the cost rather than the quality of the restoration. I will keep going on my personal projects and show them along the way. No more videos of this restoration that has gone bad.
Brian
The wrecker looks like a good project
Yes, it should be a great project. Very rare version of the GTB burma jeep. Very few in existence so hopefully a lot of the rare parts are still on it. Will show better views of it when it arrives.
You have to ask: What is craftsmanship? What is business? Is one's work his art fueled by passion? Is one's work his business fueled by need? Make it to sell or to feed your passion. At some point you have to separate the two or go crazy.
You have to spend money to save money. And sometimes that's going to cost you more than you thought you would ever spend.
A GTBB?
Hello Bill. I will do a complete walk around once the burma wrecker gets here. As you know the weather is not cooperating so well right now so it may be delayed a bit.
If the first questions a customer asks how much, and how long a job will a job take you know they are going to be trouble!
if you go the right source there is quality out there, I have purchased several quality reproduction parts for a 43 GPW. But there is junk on the market that is for sure
I normally build every part myself and they are perfect reproductions. Having built many complete body tubs, I have patterns for just about every part. Problem on this project was it was cheaper to buy the junk parts than have me make them. customer chose price over quality and is paying for it now.
A old guy I used to work with had a saying.....
There's 2 ways of doing things....
The right way
And any old f***'en way
A great saying, now all I need to do is make a giant sign and hang it on the door into the shop!!
There's 2 ways of doing things:
Right or Again
Buy cheap, buy twice. Whether it be tools or parts, cheap will always come back to bite you, and usually when it will cost you the most!
Is the hat channel in the right spot?
Cheap parts cost more in the long run when you have to rework the parts. People need to realize if you want it right its not usually cheap.
You are exactly correct with your comment. Trouble is most people think they can buy cheap parts and have excellent quality. That never works but everybody always tries.
metalshaper I deal with it alot. Production parts are always cheaper then one or two offs and getting people to understand that is a bitch. I love it when people ask if you can make something and show you a picture of one for sale somewhere and you ask is there something you want changed about it and they are no I just dont want to pay that much. Then you get to break the news that you cant build it for what china sells it for. Keep up the videos dont get roo discourage just have another beer.
My company manufactures aftermarket auto parts..we inspect 100% everything before it goes out..people think were perfect..not really we just 100% inspect!! Dont mess with good people like this he just want to do a good job..WORD
Maybe do your own projects and make repo parts from original sample keep going
I have been making perfect reproduction parts for many years now, and even price them cheaper than the crap that comes in from overseas. Most people, even when given the chance for good parts always go with the junk. I just don't understand it. A few dollars saved up front can lead to many dollars spent to fix the problems.
Poor quality parts are so infuriating!
Poor quality parts are a real pain to work with. Some customers choose to buy poor quality parts to save money, then wind up costing themselves much more than doing it correctly from the beginning.
Quality always cost more going in...saves money at the end.
Yes, I just wish more people knew that. A little more up front saves a lot in the end.
Where are you located?
Contact info please. Thanks!
you can contact me anytime at metalshaper@comcast.net
I am located in Connecticut.
Brian
Brian, save a penny and it costs a pound to fix
Time for you to gear up an start producing parts.
It reminds me of a sign that I'm sure many have seen along the way.
LABOR RATE.....
$10 an Hour
If you watch .....$15
If you help........$20
Here is a formula for charging......
If he is a lawyer, charge him by his labor rate
If is is a working stiff charge him his hourly rate etc.
Should work out in the end
Fair is fair
I have been making parts for many years. Problem is some parts are more expensive to make than buy, for instance a rear floor. The rule on this project was if it is cheaper to buy than make, that is the way to go. Now look at the problems we have. Poor decisions on a restoration.