comparison shot between neo and tormach shown for 2 seconds from 5 feet away, no closeups. seriously? i would have liked to see the surface of those parts in detail.
To be honest I discard the marketing of these 2 machines COMPLETELY and got great value out of the Fusion360 work. Tormach seems to be pushing marketing these days with Titan also featuring their products heavily. I believe a good product will sell itself.
@@EasyFold007 Agreed, but thats how machine markets work after all. There are zillions of machine manufacturers out there. From mechanics or price point alone, no brand seem to really have a competitive advantage. Software/control, tool management and integration of automation solutions seem to be the biggest driver now. Tbh, it is a nightmare "getting to know the market" to make an informed decision.
Great video on machining hemispheres! Thanks for taking the time to explore the various strategies. Some constructive criticism: The shots of the finished pieces have a lot of 'wasted space' in the frame. Get closer (with a macro lens if necessary) and fill the frame with the relevant subject. You did a really good job keeping the lighting etc consistent between all the final shots though.
This was more of a demonstration of optimal tool paths and surface finishes for spherical surfaces. Machining an actual sphere would be too far outside the scope of this video, and would be better for a demonstration of multi-operation processes and advanced work holding techniques, then 4 axis or 5 axis for more efficient operations.
@@SRG216 After a bit of looking, it seems to boil down to preferential/accepted usage. Both originally meant the same thing. “Hemi” is Greek for “half” while “semi' is Latin for the same thing. So pick your fav and use it? Nowadays “semi” tends to be used more to indicate “partial” or “part of”, like a semi-truck. My .01c on it. If anyone has better/alternate please feel free to correct me.
Nice discussion in the vid; sadly no closeups of surface finish, in a vid about surface finish. I know you gotta have a scope in the shop 😈. Closeups please 😀.
no doubt the sfm never goes to zero, the cutting edge is more consistent as well. find a ball tool that has as free cutting geometry near the tip as most of the edge. you wont get that dull look near the top using a corner radius end mill
I'm just getting into CAM. I'm using one CNC. There is a lot it can do and it can become difficult sometimes. I work on a Hurco vertical Mill 3-axis. One problem is if the code is very long and a cutter breaks it is almost impossible to find the line to restart from. I'm sure I'll get there in the end.
Great comparison methods! 👍 although I see you gave yourself a vertical section between the spheres and the floor to allow for the use of a ball nose endmill.... How would you approach it when you need to use a small corner radius endmill? (Genuinely curious for a similar video but not ball nose as I have that situation alot but never the time to experiment with surfaces finishes)
I just was thinking about this after watching My Mechanics' video on the restoration of an ancient ratcheting screwdriver. It had a spherical detent ball, and he had to make a new one and I was surprised at the method he used. It seemed very difficult, and old-school lathe style vs this.
I’ve gotten really good results doing this with a bullnose endmill with a .06 radius. Seems like it has a more consistent surface footage as it is going down the part.
Hmm. It doesn't make much difference if you machine the top of the sphere from the top or the bottom, you will still end up with zero surface speed at the centre of the tool. The solution is to use a radius / bull nose end mill. That way, you have a guaranteed minimum surface speed.
I know this video is about the tool-paths, but is there any videos showing how to draw the sphere. I'm really new to Fusion and am struggling to learn on my own. Any help is really appreciated. Thanks.
Because the smaller unit is called „mil“ and measures a thousandth of an inch. Therefore thirty-thousandth. Greetings from Germany, having to Donnerstag these stupid calculations all the time too. Screw imperial, literally means having to use metric 😂
Not familiar w Datron (way out of our price point). So you used a higher spindle speed, a machine with more rigidity and a more precise collet system. On the Tormach, are you using Tormach BT30s? Have you considered a comparison of other mfg BT30s? What about heat shrink BT30s on the Tormach (ala Maritool)? Would be really great to see (Closeup!) surface finish comparisons 😀 when the Tormach is pushed a bit w aftermarket kit. PS. A side of micro-milling (1/16” and smaller) on compound surfaces In the rotary would be fantastic! Closeup! 👹
More than 20 years ago Surfcam would let you specify a scallop height. That way larger steps on the vertical and closer as it transitions to the flat. Free 3D printing software can do the same thing with layers. Fusion really does not have that option?
Kind of was expecting a sphere, not a half-sphere. I was more interested in how you'd do "op 2" on a tormach. This was a nice comparison of the toolpaths but one the surface comparison was from too far away and to quick.
@@qqqqqqqq1407 We use coated roughing tools in aluminum to squeeze out that last bit of speed. They also seem to last a little longer for that application where your depth of cut is 1.5 x the diameter of the tool or greater. I believe it's due to the superior chip evacuation from the lower friction coefficient between the cutter and the material. Granted we are micro milling, our "big" roughing tool is a .062" bull end mill with a .005 radius. We push it to over 40 ipm at 2x depth of cut everyday. It will last a couple of years like that if we're careful.
I still see faceted faces ... should I lower the tolerance factor? i use 0.01mm Or the problem is the machine ( I have a VF2 without high speed machining feature )
@@RBravo82 I don't use g187 I use setting 191 in medium and setting 85 in 0.025inch if I used setting 191 in finish, the machine stutter is too much without high speed machining
They are sponsored by Tormach. They should not bash their sponsor machine, specially comparing with a much more expensive one. A close UP would do Tormach no good.
hi, bacteria breeds on the tramp oil and book and crannies, ours is a redox system which is a system incorporating multimedia metals and once the coolant passes through it the bacteria and fungi are 100% eliminated and the killing process just goes on forever, you just have to add good water for topping up and concentrates to maintain the concentration, if not inconvenient send me your email address I would send you the details of the system.
Ok I tried one of your newer videos thinking maybe your older video youtube recommended might have just been where you guys hadn't found your grove. Unfortunately I was wrong , you are producing boring technical how to videos for the classroom.. no personality.. good luck to ya.. not for me.. I come to be entertained while learning something.. 😂
Well, aside from the point that there might be valid reasons to do it, these guys just prefer mills. :-) Personally I wouldn't want to turn that egg crate with the six hemispheres on a lathe.
I think this is less about a sphere and more about 3d surfacing... A sphere is just a very simple, easy and comparable geometry to use that encompasses all angles through all axis. Think less about how to make a sphere and more about how to make a mold, something with alot of cavities, peaks, draft angles and "ergonomic" features. A lathe wouldnt help you there, but there's surfacing strategies will
comparison shot between neo and tormach shown for 2 seconds from 5 feet away, no closeups. seriously? i would have liked to see the surface of those parts in detail.
they pretty much never properly show the end product. they need a macro lens and a turn table or something
To be honest I discard the marketing of these 2 machines COMPLETELY and got great value out of the Fusion360 work. Tormach seems to be pushing marketing these days with Titan also featuring their products heavily. I believe a good product will sell itself.
@@EasyFold007 Agreed, but thats how machine markets work after all. There are zillions of machine manufacturers out there. From mechanics or price point alone, no brand seem to really have a competitive advantage. Software/control, tool management and integration of automation solutions seem to be the biggest driver now. Tbh, it is a nightmare "getting to know the market" to make an informed decision.
Next: 3 things:
1. Milling the other half of the spheres.
2. Closer close-ups. As in, fills-the-whole-screen close-ups.
3. Shooting it all in 4K.
You gotta zoom in on those parts man
Great video on machining hemispheres! Thanks for taking the time to explore the various strategies. Some constructive criticism: The shots of the finished pieces have a lot of 'wasted space' in the frame. Get closer (with a macro lens if necessary) and fill the frame with the relevant subject. You did a really good job keeping the lighting etc consistent between all the final shots though.
I know it is a minor point, but those are HEMIspheres, not spheres.
Not minor :)
This was more of a demonstration of optimal tool paths and surface finishes for spherical surfaces. Machining an actual sphere would be too far outside the scope of this video, and would be better for a demonstration of multi-operation processes and advanced work holding techniques, then 4 axis or 5 axis for more efficient operations.
I was making popcorn and looking forward to the flip, part holding discussion and parting, bummer. Oh well, at least I have the popcorn.
If half a circle is a semicircle, why isn't half a sphere a semisphere?
@@SRG216 After a bit of looking, it seems to boil down to preferential/accepted usage. Both originally meant the same thing. “Hemi” is Greek for “half” while “semi' is Latin for the same thing. So pick your fav and use it? Nowadays “semi” tends to be used more to indicate “partial” or “part of”, like a semi-truck. My .01c on it. If anyone has better/alternate please feel free to correct me.
Can't see much of a difference from 20 feet away. What about an actual surface roughness measurement?
The quality of this content is at such a high level, im amazed that this is free.
Nice discussion in the vid; sadly no closeups of surface finish, in a vid about surface finish. I know you gotta have a scope in the shop 😈. Closeups please 😀.
I find that using a bull nose endmill does a better job of these style of tool paths.
no doubt the sfm never goes to zero, the cutting edge is more consistent as well. find a ball tool that has as free cutting geometry near the tip as most of the edge. you wont get that dull look near the top using a corner radius end mill
Maybe do close ups for the last comparison...
Awesome, I learned a lot in this video, Great Job as usual, Team NYC CNC. Thank you for your time and contribution.
This is actually, EXTREMELY helpful! Thanks guys!
I'm just getting into CAM. I'm using one CNC. There is a lot it can do and it can become difficult sometimes.
I work on a Hurco vertical Mill 3-axis.
One problem is if the code is very long and a cutter breaks it is almost impossible to find the line to restart from. I'm sure I'll get there in the end.
Just learning Fusion CAM so great video to compare strategies.
What kind of accuracy and repeatability are you guys getting out of the MX?
Great comparison methods! 👍 although I see you gave yourself a vertical section between the spheres and the floor to allow for the use of a ball nose endmill....
How would you approach it when you need to use a small corner radius endmill?
(Genuinely curious for a similar video but not ball nose as I have that situation alot but never the time to experiment with surfaces finishes)
I'm wondering why Flow wasn't part of this test? I've found it does really well on curvature, especially on large faces.
I just was thinking about this after watching My Mechanics' video on the restoration of an ancient ratcheting screwdriver. It had a spherical detent ball, and he had to make a new one and I was surprised at the method he used. It seemed very difficult, and old-school lathe style vs this.
That part really caught me by surprise when he did it, results were awesome though.
that final comparison shot? you could do it from moon?
Would be interesting to see the difference from a 5 axis continuous simultaneous tool path
Seconded! I imagine being able to use the side of the cutter throughout would help a lot.
I’ve gotten really good results doing this with a bullnose endmill with a .06 radius. Seems like it has a more consistent surface footage as it is going down the part.
In the beginning you say you want to have smoothing selected - what is an example of a time you wouldn’t want engaged?
Hmm. It doesn't make much difference if you machine the top of the sphere from the top or the bottom, you will still end up with zero surface speed at the centre of the tool. The solution is to use a radius / bull nose end mill. That way, you have a guaranteed minimum surface speed.
Why can’t fusion do constant scallop size step over
What about the other half
Use a Datron single flute ball and then you will really see an improvement in surface finish. Also spin it at 45+K if you have the correct spindle.
Can you please share your "Manual NC Force Tool Change" code?
Datron’s are great but when they breakdown, which they always do, you’re going to need to remortgage
I know this video is about the tool-paths, but is there any videos showing how to draw the sphere. I'm really new to Fusion and am struggling to learn on my own. Any help is really appreciated. Thanks.
The easiest way would probably be to draw a circle or arc and then rotate (revolve I think is the command) it to get your sphere/hemisphere
Nice.... like always!!
1rst Comment!!
@@arkas99123 2nd
Aww man, was so excited when the Neo was in the title (looking to pick one up if I can), but then all Tormach :(
Would be amazing to see that machine on the Aquaceras build
@@aaalbert Damn straight! Although everybody might kill me if I take that long hahaha
16:00
What material?
I do wish that you guys would show us how to draft this part first so we could follow along better.I do appreciate that you post these videos tho.....
Question from a metric user. Why is 0.03" pronounced as thirty-thousands ans not as three-hundreds??
Because the smaller unit is called „mil“ and measures a thousandth of an inch. Therefore thirty-thousandth. Greetings from Germany, having to Donnerstag these stupid calculations all the time too. Screw imperial, literally means having to use metric 😂
pro tip is to use lathe
Not familiar w Datron (way out of our price point). So you used a higher spindle speed, a machine with more rigidity and a more precise collet system. On the Tormach, are you using Tormach BT30s? Have you considered a comparison of other mfg BT30s? What about heat shrink BT30s on the Tormach (ala Maritool)? Would be really great to see (Closeup!) surface finish comparisons 😀 when the Tormach is pushed a bit w aftermarket kit.
PS. A side of micro-milling (1/16” and smaller) on compound surfaces In the rotary would be fantastic! Closeup! 👹
More than 20 years ago Surfcam would let you specify a scallop height. That way larger steps on the vertical and closer as it transitions to the flat. Free 3D printing software can do the same thing with layers. Fusion really does not have that option?
Cant the finished Sphere kept more far apart from Camera?...
Kind of was expecting a sphere, not a half-sphere. I was more interested in how you'd do "op 2" on a tormach. This was a nice comparison of the toolpaths but one the surface comparison was from too far away and to quick.
Probably a custom holder like what you see Eggs come in. Possibly superglued in or similar. Heat the part up after so the glue releases.
I would have just used a uncoated ball mill as it is sharper
I was thinking the same thing. I'm a mold maker, coated tools are a no no if you're chasing surface finish.
@@dudemcgee256 we never use coated tools because the cost is not justified and the surface finishes are better without them. Only for aluminum though
@@qqqqqqqq1407 We use coated roughing tools in aluminum to squeeze out that last bit of speed. They also seem to last a little longer for that application where your depth of cut is 1.5 x the diameter of the tool or greater. I believe it's due to the superior chip evacuation from the lower friction coefficient between the cutter and the material. Granted we are micro milling, our "big" roughing tool is a .062" bull end mill with a .005 radius. We push it to over 40 ipm at 2x depth of cut everyday. It will last a couple of years like that if we're careful.
@@dudemcgee256 yea we don't have a "roughing" endmill in aluminum we rough and finish with the same endmill. Square edge 3 fl uncoated
datron how much?
I still see faceted faces ... should I lower the tolerance factor? i use 0.01mm
Or the problem is the machine ( I have a VF2 without high speed machining feature )
Are you using
Smoothing?
@@RBravo82 yes... And i still see faceted faces
Are almost imperceptible to the touch, but can be seen
Lovotti VW SpeedCraft it will do no harm tightening the tolerances then, definitely worth a try.
In the code you’ve output do you see a G187?
@@RBravo82 I don't use g187
I use setting 191 in medium and setting 85 in 0.025inch
if I used setting 191 in finish, the machine stutter is too much without high speed machining
Lovotti VW SpeedCraft maybe give it a shot, 187 p1 will loosen up the tolerance but possibly smooth out the facets?
I want to work in a wire cut technician in America.
Please use FLOW
Are we finally going to see the Datron making chips?
Can we get John back to narrate the videos?
Hemi sphere
I kept waiting to see how you made a sphere.... :(
Isn't that milling a dome?
That simulation looks real rough..
It's a shame that all of the hobby users are getting squeezed out of Fusion. New changes are really going to cripple it.
They are sponsored by Tormach. They should not bash their sponsor machine, specially comparing with a much more expensive one. A close UP would do Tormach no good.
hi, bacteria breeds on the tramp oil and book and crannies, ours is a redox system which is a system incorporating multimedia metals and once the coolant passes through it the bacteria and fungi are 100% eliminated and the killing process just goes on forever, you just have to add good water for topping up and concentrates to maintain the concentration, if not inconvenient send me your email address I would send you the details of the system.
Hemisphere
Ok I tried one of your newer videos thinking maybe your older video youtube recommended might have just been where you guys hadn't found your grove. Unfortunately I was wrong , you are producing boring technical how to videos for the classroom.. no personality.. good luck to ya.. not for me.. I come to be entertained while learning something.. 😂
Why wouldn't you just turn the sphere with a cnc lathe...
Well, aside from the point that there might be valid reasons to do it, these guys just prefer mills. :-)
Personally I wouldn't want to turn that egg crate with the six hemispheres on a lathe.
I think this is less about a sphere and more about 3d surfacing...
A sphere is just a very simple, easy and comparable geometry to use that encompasses all angles through all axis.
Think less about how to make a sphere and more about how to make a mold, something with alot of cavities, peaks, draft angles and "ergonomic" features. A lathe wouldnt help you there, but there's surfacing strategies will
Not the point of the video Nick!