The Power of Priority (and The Stack) | The Command Zone 267 | Magic: the Gathering EDH
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Show Notes:
On today’s episode we’re diving deep on a complex and often misunderstood topic: The Stack and Player Priority. We’ve got L2 Judge Danny Simard in studio to help us explain how these rules intricacies work in multiplayer and, more importantly, how understanding this stuff can help you make better strategic decisions about what moves to make and when.
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What we talked about on THE END STEP:
Roller Derby:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roller_...
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Find our guest online:
Danny Simard:
Twitter: @dannysimsmusic
Twitch.tv/ruthbaderginsbird
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Follow us on Twitter!
@CommandCast
@JoshLeeKwai
@jfwong
Email us:
commandzonecast@gmail.com
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Huge thanks to Geoffrey Palmer for providing some of his amazing Living Cards animations for our videos. Follow him here:
/ livingcardsmtg
/ @livingcardsmtg816
Check out our sister podcast - The Masters of Modern:
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Commander/EDH Official Rules, Banlist, Forums, and more:
mtgcommander.net/rules.php - Hry
3:03 The Stack
17:31 What Does/Doesn't Use The Stack
18:01 Stuff That Uses The Stack
22:45 Stuff That Doesn't Use The Stack
33:00 The Parts Of A Turn
33:30 Beginning Phase
*** 34:10 - 35:20 Important information to know ***
35:29 Untap Step:
37:39 Upkeep Step:
40:59 The Draw Step:
44:41 Precombat Main Phase:
45:11 Combat Phase:
59:22 Postcombat Main Phase:
59:39 The End Step:
1:02:04 The Clean-Up Phase:
1:05:59 Final Thought:
orgazmo686971 liking and commenting to help keep this at the top of the comments
Your the hero we need, not the one we deserve.
You deserve a shout out!
Doing the lords work
31:57 Josh Hard-casting arclight phoenix
I played in a 5 player match where two players were playing Aristocrats and someone had Erebos out. Living death with everyone having full boards. After 10 minutes of math, it turns out everyone died twice. Magic is the best
Are you sure? Wouldn't the player later in the turn sequence be able to kill the first aristocrats player, removing their abilities from he stack?
Would a player losing take all of their triggers off the stack? There were two people left after the first 30 damage. We’re not nearly experts in the field
Regirex Anyone losing empties the stack completely.
Not Your Average Nothing welp my whole playgroup is stupid
Wait the whole stack? Even stuff the other players did to each other?
Regirex I misspoke. Just that player's stuff goes away.
Danny was a judge for a bit at our LGS in London - Dark Sphere - and I can't speak highly enough of him.
Even at weekly FNM he would kick draft off in a way that carefully and successfully included both long standing and brand new players with rules introductions and the like.
He'd take time to explain in game rules questions in a succinct and clear way that left you feeling like you understood the rules better, rather than just officiating a ruling on a game state.
Very pleased to see him getting recognition here.
Hey thanks, Luke! It's really awesome to hear your words, honestly. I appreciate it!
oh ...
i spent the whole episode thinking "i`ve already seen that dude somewhere"
Nice! I was visiting London from Cape Town and played FNM Commander at Dark Sphere in Waterloo. I felt bad because the meta wasn't too hectic there, and I brought two gross decks.
Nobody:
Blue player: In response...
Kozilek player: Discard to counter your spell...
Even better Kozilek: Draw 7
@@williamalaska9315 Even better Kozilek: Annihilator I get what you sac and you have to sac your board.
In response to that comment...
Most accurate use of that meme ever
This video is definitely going to be mandatory for a few people in my play group...
My bf said the same thing, but I told him there's nothing stopping them from looking up this information the same way you or I did. The problem is THOSE people don't care enough.
Yup!
YUP
@@Juliett-A Time to find new friends to play with lol
Me too
I had the thought last night "I really need to learn how priority works." You guys keep it up!
Learning goes on the stack
There's someone in my playgroup that was a judge, and he's also named Dan/Danny, so apparently that criteria is real.
HA!
Thank you very much for the information, this should be required viewing.
Unfortunately now I'm a little angry as I think about a game recently that I lost - solely because none of us at the table truly understood the stack. Knowledge is power.
This is why I am a Patron, because of quality content and topics such as this. Thanks Josh and Jimmy, always look forward to your videos
Dude gave his Atraxa double strike with Duelist's Heritage for lethal on me. I activated Heliod's Spear after first strike damage to kill her and save myself. I was pretty proud of myself.
Nicely done sir
Fuck Atraxa lol
That heritage combo is built in the deck. So crazy.
My friend used the stack to his advantage in a commander game. He casted a board wipe and passed priority around the table. People responded by sacrificing their creatures and when priority was passed back to him he countered his own board wipe so all his creatures survived. Sneaky bastard!! Lol
One thing you guys didn't mention, it's very specific, is when an attacker is "an unblocked attacker."
It isn't unblocked until blockers have been declared.
This ruling comes up a lot in reference to ninjitsu.
Also you can use ninjitsu during the end of combat step to return ninjas you might want to keep safe from removal.
I also noticed that it kinda got glanced over but not really defined, and this is very specific so its probably not a big deal, is how trample and double strike or even granting double strike twice, react to creatures with first strike on their first strike step and then on their regular damage step.
@@kylejones5518 I was going to post an explanation, but I realized that the rule from the Comprehensive Rules explains this perfectly, so I'm just going to quote it:
"510.4. If at least one attacking or blocking creature has first strike (see rule 702.7) or double strike (see rule 702.4) as the combat damage step begins, the only creatures that assign combat damage in that step are those with first strike or double strike. After that step, instead of proceeding to the end of combat step, the phase gets a second combat damage step. The only creatures that assign combat damage in that step are the remaining attackers and blockers that had neither first strike nor double strike as the first combat damage step began, as well as the remaining attackers and blockers that currently have double strike. After that step, the phase proceeds to the end of combat step."
Dear Jimmy and Josh, when are we going to see more of Extra Turns? You started out with two great episodes, have you cancelled the show?
Otherwise, great show! You guys do an awesome work!
Please it would be cool for them to bring it back. Maybe like MTGMUDDSTAH. That would be so cool
jesse selman they film it when they have some time left when finishing filming game knights. Previous Extra Turns could only be filmed because they had guests who were familiar with the game knights process. Next episode is featuring LoadingReadyRun, who have been on the show before, but I think it is unlikely they filmed Extra Turns because they filmed a podcast.
@@themaddhadder4826 Or maybe WITH Mtgmuddstah. On Game Knights. That would be an awesome guest.
I have seen on previous videos that they are still down an editor, and so may have a backlog, and I'm sure extra turns is the lowest priority for them.
A cool instant that reversed the order of the current stack when it resolved would be so bonkers.
And AWESOME!!!!
Can anything in magic be considered game breaking or OP anymore? LOL
Isn't that an Un card?
And then make a card that can skip parts of the stack, to make it Turing complete
make stack a queue lmao nice idea
We broke the game one night;
-Player A activates Living Death, Living Death goes on the stack.
-Player B, in response, flashes in Dualcaster Mage Targeting Living Death, putting a Copy of Living death on the stack.
-Copy of Living death resolves; creatures in play are sacrificed while creatures in graveyards are put into play simultaneously
-As a result; Player C's Dualcaster mage that was in the graveyard comes into play and triggers, copying Living Death, the only spell still on the stack and therefore, the only valid target.
-New Copy of Living death resolves, same result as before except it's Player B's Dualcaster mage that returns to play to copy Living Death again.
-Because Dualcaster Mage's ability is not a "may" ability we were stuck in a infinite, never ending loop that locked the game from ever proceeding forward and were forced to simply end the game xD
Congratulations you did it. You broke it😂
An infinite loop that can't be stopped by any player would end the game as a draw
@@fredrikhenriksson1508 Yup, we ended the game in a draw and had a few laughs because it was a completely unexpected outcome.
but, but, i have a blood artist... GG, (happened to me a while back, it was weird)
You only need 1 mage in grave and 1 on board in a 1v1 to break the game
also, watching lab maniacs episodes is a great way of learning how to play with the stack properly
and to be bored to death. cEDH's meta is SO stagnant and boring.
Nah, there's like 5 new cards in WAR that MIGHT see play in SOME decks. It's quite the shake up! Seriously though, I play and consume some cEDH, and enjoy it for what it is.
Lrac Seroom it is just a different way to play. There’s something fun about sitting around a table of people holding nukes and trying to see who can get theirs off successfully first
@@mikegibb5082 I understand it perfectly and I find it boring. Is that difficult for you to understand or something? It's practically a solved meta, the decks change very little not just over time, but deck to deck. If you think "First turn. Underground Sea. Mystic Remora. Mana Crypt. Pass turn" is interesting gameplay. Great. You're wrong, but great.
@@lracseroom8286 If you think that casting big creatures, big spells and taking to win the game is a fun game, great. You're wrong, but great.
Thanks for the episode. While I really enjoyed it, there are two things I wish you had covered: What is needed to put a spell/ability on the stack? Why does the order of blockers matter?
Regarding the first question, I have seen it come up in a game where there were two copies of Sheoldred on the battlefield under different players' control. While it sucked for the remaining players, their upkeeps were simple. For either of the two players with a Sheoldred, they had to first target a creature already in their graveyard with their Sheoldred's triggered ability to put that ability on the stack. Then they had to resolve the triggered ability of their opponents Sheoldred and sacrifice a creature. Finally the creature they targeted earlier is reanimated. It is worth noting that they must sacrifice a creature before the reanimation resolved and the reanimated creature had to have already been in the graveyard, meaning they were unable to reanimate the creature they just sacrificed to their opponents Sheoldred with their Sheoldred.
Regarding the second question, I wish you had discussed that the attacking creature must deal "lethal" damage to the creature ordered as the first blocker before it can deal any remaining damage to the second blocker. For example. let's say you attack me with a 4/4 and I double block with a 3/3 and a 1/1. You then have to order blockers. If you order the 3/3 first, I can use the Dive Down in my hand to pump its toughness to 6. Your 4/4 still needs to assign lethal damage to the first blocker, which is now a 3/6, before assigning any to the second blocker. This means that my Dive Down effectively saved both of my creatures. Another reason to discuss that makes order of blockers matter is, if you don't want to deal any damage to one of the blockers, you can order that blocker second and assign all the damage to the first. In my previous example, what if my 1/1 was a Raptor Hatchling that would become a 3/3 with trample after you hit it? In that case (even without the Dive Down) it might be better for you to assign all or your 4/4's damage to the 3/3.
Overall, I still really appreciated seeing you guys make this episode. I just would have liked to see you discuss some of the ways declaring blockers can be relevant and the fact that targets must be declared as a spell or ability goes on the stack and still have at least one valid target present for resolution.
Thank you for this blocking damage explanation. I feel I've leveled up,especially when I don't want to kill one of their blockers.
@@liamw.1313 As Danny mentioned in the episode at 56:44, ordering blockers is a turn-based action that occurs at the beginning of the declare blockers step. All players then have the ability to cast spells and activate abilities before moving to the combat damage step. Josh does unfortunately muddle this slightly as he misspeaks, but if you pay attention to 57:15 you can see that ordering blockers is not part of the combat damage step. "You don't assign damage yet. You just choose blocker order"
Oops lol.
Thank you so much for explaining the blockers. I had that question after watching that part, and I'm really glad i found the answer in the comments, because i was unable to find it through googling...
This is my favorite episode in the history of Command Zone. Great guest.
My mom and uncle play commander with me and my friends sometimes and we have to explain the stack a fair bit. I shared this episode with them and they both said they understand it a lot better now. Great guest in Danny! Thanks for a helpful episode.
Great video!
At 10:10, In tournament REL it is assumed you are passing priority whenever you are adding something to the stack as a shortcut. So rather than just state that you cast bolt it would be better to say that you are casting bolt and keping priority, or announce keeping priority beforehand.
Now EDH is generally not under tournament REL but you risk getting into a gray area where people cast the bolt, and if no one counters it they then cast fork.
It is also relevant when activating something like Pestilence Demon. If you activate it five times it is generally interpreted as activating, having it resolve, then reactivate it. But you may want to put everything on the stack at once (playing around trickbind for example) and it is often unclear which one someone does and asking about it can give them information to make the "correct" play.
Therefore I prefer to explicity state when you are keeping priority.
Smart
We've had a joke in my playgroup lately where whenever something game-ending resolves one of us says "that triggers my Sadness" and we treat it like an actual ability asking if anyone has a response and then let it resolve afterwards XD
As an aspiring judge, this has been tremendously helpful. Thank you so much for this episode.
There was a time where there was a Hivemind and Possibiltiy Storm in play at the same time. We got a whiteboard and we wrote it out.
Adam Barkman. I have a deck that runs both, and I don't know which I want to resolve first.
bro, I had one game with like 8 people in it that had Hivemind, Possibility Storm, Eye of the Storm, and a Void Winnower on the field. Casting a spell took almost 5 minutes.
@@NotYourAverageNothing You don't get to choose which resolves first, I am fairly certain. Possibility Storm is a replacement effect, so that happens first.
FallenFromGlory Nah, I'm pretty sure they're both triggered abilities.
Really well put together, both the construction and deconstruction of how priority is given and used should help new and even some not so new players, to get a better grip on using the stack appropriately or optimally. Keep up the great work Jimmy&Josh
Stacks on stacks on stacks on stacks
On layers on stacks...
Stax?
I've been playing for years and I only recently realized that you could hold priority after casting something like a planeswalker and activate its ability before anyone got the chance to remove it.
So many people try to remove a planeswalker once it hits the field. No, you do not have priority. I didn't know it either until it came up on mtgo.
That's not "holding priority" correctly. The opponent DID have the chance to remove it as it was being cast while it was still a spell. They didn't, so the planeswalker resolves into a permanent. Now it is still the player's turn and they have priority, and can activate the ability of the planeswalker (which goes on the stack), and the opponent can NOW cast an instant or sorcery to attempt to remove the planeswalker in response.
@@dzspdref It’s ability would still resolve though which is the key difference. Lots of people think they can instantly use a direct damage spell or direct removal to kill a planesWalker before it can activate its loyalty abilities. They cannot.!
The stack! Finally, an episode on one of the things that I spent WAY TOO MUCH TIME looking into. I run a Riku of Two Reflections deck, and the stack doesn't get much more complicated than when Izzet and Simic playing together to copy both spells and activated abilities.
I have a Tawnos deck and possibly the worst way to net 1 mana. Basalt Monolith - tap it for 3 mana - use that mana to activate its ability to untap it - use Tawnos to copy that ability - allow the copy to resolve & untap Monolith - tap it for 3 mana - the original ability resolves untapping Monolith - tap it for 3 mana. Congrats, you've spent 5 mana to get 6 colorless!
This is such a useful episode to new players. It’s such an important part of the game.
Yo has Boruto fought Kawaki yet in the manga?
This was like eating veggies, man. Hard to get through. Glad I went through it. Thank you guys!
Love this episode! I think it might be THE most in-depth anyone on youtube has ever gone into the precise timings of everything that goes on in a turn of magic. While the rest of magic is pretty straight forward, I think this is where most of the complexities of magic tend to occur and new players get super confused. Probably worth sharing this with any playgroups people have, just as information or even as a refresher on these neat little tricks our game has that we tend to forget sometimes.
I have to say that this is one of your best videos! You have taken complex and admittedly BORING topics and managed to explain them fully and well whilst bringing enough charm to keep it interesting. I have played magic for YEARS and my playgroup (myself included) will greatly benefit from what you have done here. KUDOS!
This has been my favorite episode so far! Very insightful, thanks guys!
honestly, my play group has the stack and priority down pretty well. def appreciate the episode, just so i can double check and make sure and keep us honest... now, can you guys explain LAYERS!? that stuff haunts my nightmares
I just read an article on them, WHAT THE HECKERONI!!?!!?? I don’t understand anything anymore
THIS!
Seriously, my firstborn child for an easy way to figure out the layers system!
Honestly layers aren't that hard to figure out.
magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/layer-system-2009-11-05
Important episode! Many new players don't have the refined knowledge of priority. Listening to you three is a great excuse for anyone to gain a more thorough understanding of the stack!
So there is a super niche stack rules interaction that can occasionally come up in games that wasn't brought.
To put it simply, if a player has already passed priority and then realized after the fact that they could have had an impact (countering a game winning spell as an example) the other player with priority may tap a land to start a new round of priority giving you another chance to counter a spell or whatever is the target/threat.
This isn't usually a problem as casual players may let their group "go back in priority" so that a spell or effect may be countered. But if a player is being an hard-ass about rules interactions or one is playing in a more competitive scene/pod this is rather relevant.
Samuel Grim I’m confused as to why your opponent would be willing to let you capitalize on a missed opportunity
Most likely the best episode yet. Im glad Danny said at the beginning that MTGA was coded pretty much up to code when it comes to the stack so I was able to think about the game and realize the ways that it works online and it helped make all the connections I needed to learn this. Thanks so much guys!
Mirage Mirror has done weird things with my stacks before.
Yeah it's my playgroup's favourite card and I had to help them out break down a double response to a "destroy target artifact" ability. Was crazy but a few Internet rulings and surprisingly visualising the stack exactly like Arena helped A LOT.
It's very cool to see Danny warm up and especially get very excited and confident at the end talking about his hobby. He genuinely got me interested even though I never heard of that sport.
Also thanks for the great explanation, I'm excited to try out how this knowledge lets me and my playgroup's experience improve and alter.
An interesting thing that you can take advantage of in multiplayer edh is that the priority is passed in order of play and triggers on the stack are resolved in the opposite order. In other words, you can use the way you are seated around the table to your advantage!
A) If a player tries to Victimize Mikeaus + Triskelion (or do any other move trying to win the game / kill someone) and they are sitting to your left you can wait for all other players to announce whether they have an answer or not before deciding to spend your cards to answer it.
B) If you and another player both have a Mimic Vat you get to "dominate" their Vat if they are sitting on your right. On each turn that wasn't yours, you will have a chance to first resolve your vat and if you choose to exile the creature every single time their Vat never has anything to exile unless they kill something on your turn. (This works in a simular way with all "when this dies" triggers like Athreos, Grave Betreyal etc. - if it is your turn you are always at disadvantage as well as if you are sitting closer to the left from the person who currently is taking their turn)
You can also take advantage of play order if there is player who has a counterspell or a control deck. If they are sitting to your left you can wait until they are forced to use some answers during a turn of another person and then try to resolve your powerfull spell, since you get to act last before they untap.
As a person that has been playing for just about 9 months, I find your show as a wealth of knowledge. Not just for enjoyable game play, but also for learning the nuances of rules and also unique cards to add to my collection and decks. I would love to see an episode where you guys go over your collection, storage of said collection and how you come up with and find the cards that you talk about when discussing a certain subject in any given episode. Thank you and keep up the great content!!!
Would have loved to hear a judge explain the KCI combo.
That one's a doosie when it comes to how the stack works.
czcams.com/video/8olqGdtZuvg/video.html there ya go
Have you seen the inalla/wanderwine prophets combo? It’s ridiculous as well lol
@@brandonguthrie8122 I just mentioned that one here. Yes it very crazy
Craziest stack moment I've come across so far:
Two players left in game, player A & B.
Player A is active player, has Pyrohemia and Sower of Discord in play. Sower has named player B.
Player B has a stuffy doll in play.
No one present knew about how triggers stack Active Player/Non-active player, so the discussion about what actually happens when the Pyrohemia was active got very creative.
Afterwards I looked up APNAP, which was helped me sort out what should have happened. I won't describe it here, I'll leave that to anyone who's curious.
Definitely recommend reading about APNAP to any EDH player, the rule is very concise and helps sort out these tricky situations.
One of my greatest contributions to my friend's Omnath, Locus of Rage deck was looking into priority (we've mostly learned mtg empirically), which means that people now can't kill Omnath before a land is played ;)
I didn't look through all the comments, and I haven't finished the episode so I don't know if this will come up, but around the 40-44 minute mark they were talking about Sylvan Library being a replacement effect. It is not, it is a trigger on your draw step. The rulings on the card in Gatherer specify that.
my favourite use of the stack is having experimental frenzy and burning prophet in play:
1: spell A off the top
2: scry
3: spell B off the top
4: repeat 2 and 3
5: then resolve spells D,C,B,A
Super helpful video! I've been playing for almost 20 years, and I still learned some new stuff. Thanks a bunch, guys!
Thank you for this episode! I've been thinking about this a lot lately and this really clarifies some things for me.
Hmm, so it's good that the lifegain on Interplanar Beacon is a cast trigger. If it was an etb trigger, it would allow other players to kill the walker before you can use a loyalty ability.
Great in-depth episode, pretty much entirely correct. The one thing I think might have been stated in a misleading fashion is who gets priority after a spell is cast. The player who casts a spell/activates an ability gains priority immediately after casting/activating it (this is how one holds priority), but after the effects actually resolve, priority goes to the active player. These may have been mentioned correctly separately, but I didn't hear a direct comparison made between the two, so I thought I'd chip in.
I play storm in EDH...so I'm really used to having the stack and priority be a problem with be other players 😂😂😂
I kind of learned the stack and priority on my own while playing storm lol
Have you tried playing against stax? Playing a Grand Abolisher often means you can ignore the stack during your turn any time you're not maintaining priority.
@@cloaking111 there has actually never been a stax deck in my play group...my LGS just had the unspoken pleasantrie of not playing a dick deck
@@fimband3855 well i count storm decks/combo decks that take a long time to combo as dick decks too.
It is the reason i don't build a jhoira deck, yeah it is fun to go off, but it takes long and you may not get that many groups to play with, when you take 20+ minutes to actually do something while comboing
The stack is just a common thing for commander but such a necessary lesson! Great episode
One of the people in my playgroup cannot understand the stack to save his life and I don't get why.
@@jacobmonks3722 I find it's one of those things people pick it up fast or it takes forever. I find just giving them patience and trying to help them learn it helps a lot.
Thank you guys so much for this breakdown. I’ve been playing magic for a very long time and I still learned so much for this!!
Thanks Danny! Great job on the explanations! Josh and jimmy just turning to him after every thing they say, like when a stranger asks you something and you look up to dad :D
Idk why but Josh missing the paper throw and trying to play it cool since no one noticed had me dying😂😂
This was an awesome episode. Good job everyone! I've been playing the game for over a decade and still learned new things.
Appreciate this video greatly! Now I can rules lawyer my opponents properly.
around 43:00 when they started talking about Underrealm Lich, reminded me of a cool interaction I didn't even realize was in one of my decks. I had Underrealm Lich and Jin-Gitaxias on the field. So instead of drawing the 7 cards, each of those single cards was replaced with the Lich's ability. I ended up getting deep enough into my deck on that one turn to find all the pieces of my combo. Unfortunately I was at such a low life total by that point that it didn't really matter.
Wow! I play Gitrog in my Windgrace deck and had no idea I could keep drawing cards at the cleanup. I learned something!!
dakmor salvage.
and suddenly you draw/mill your deck, put a kozilek in to get your gy into your library and actually draw your entire library :)
If any triggers or any state-based actions occur during a cleanup step, everyone gets priority, then there's another cleanup step after that one. That could easily lead to infinite cleanup steps.
This is one of my favorite episodes. I're watched it like 4 or 5 times already. Really useful information
So first of all, thank god you guys are a thing. I needed this video. As a newish player with a generally good grasp of the game, I find intricate interactions is where I loose most games. It ties into sequencing my moves and understanding when and why I can do things. Thank you for making this video, much much much appreciated.
At 24:00 you discuss something interesting. So in my Atla Palani deck, I responded to Krosan Grip by saccing an Egg, then the triggered ability of Atla went on the stack, and I flipped into an Avacyn, which protected my Phyrexian Altar. Triggered abilities that are triggered by the mana ability can still go on the stack.
Thank you, the first video I've seen the explicitly states that yes you can add to the stack after it's started resolving
Great episode. Very much worth the watch. I would also you guys to go over layers but that is such a difficult topic that I couldn't blame you for not wanting to touch it
You should talked about how many players who know about it will cast their Vendillion Clique on their opponents draw step so they can also see the card that their opponent just drew, and potentially tuck it before they get to use it.
Excellent episode. Y'all are good teachers; I appreciate your precision!
Now we just need an episode on layering and how it interacts with the stack xD
Thanks for making this video guys! This is definitely a subject that it's easy think you know it all when you actually don't. I certainly learned a few things and will be sharing this video. Keep up the good work.
The Gitrog Monster end-step trick was pretty dope.
As a Scion of Ur Dragon player, it's understood within my playgroup how using his ability multiple times works, but is always a fun teachable-moment with others. :)
Keep making great content, you guys! Learned a LOT from this episode!
Damn it, Jimmy! Thanks to you I just washed my magic cards and shuffled my dishes!
A good exemple is Recurring nigthmare. You cast it, if it resolves, you then have priority. You can then use it, return it to your hand as a part of its cost, it then resolves. No one can disenchant it at any point.
This is probably one of the most helpful, if not the most helpful video they have put out
took some quick notes to summarize this. hopefully everything looks accurate.
ORDERING, PRIORITY, & OTHER DETAILS:
- triggered abilities always added to stack before spells cast or activated abilities used. player with priority determines the order of their own triggers then moves to the next player in turn order
- Items that use the stack:
- most spells
- triggered abilities(using word “when”, “whenever”, or “at”)
- non-mana-generating active abilities
- planeswalker loyalty abilities
- Items that don’t use the stack:
- mana-generating active abilities
- generating mana from lands
- playing land
- the “suspend mechanic” (but after suspend time elapses then it would go on stack as it’s being cast)
- triggered mana abilities(any triggered ability that would create mana, doesn’t have a target, & isn’t a planeswalker loyalty ability - i.e. auras & enchant lands)
- unmorphing (note: unmorphing can counter split second)
- current player can hold priority to play all spells until ready to pass priority to next player, if nothing else added to stack by other players it resolves
- priority always returns to player that is carrying out their turn currently(after anything added to stack or resolving from stack)
- any mana ability or suspend or play of land is instantaneous (doesn’t use stack)
- sorcery-speed only during your main phase and stack must be empty. also not during attack
- land played only during main phase. also not during attack
- costs paid(anything before colon) for activated abilities, or loyalty ability costs, happen instantaneously (can’t be responded to, only the activated ability can be responded to)
- turn-based actions can’t be responded to, then player continues with turn and has priority
- replacement effects have “instead” and can’t be responded to. they are completed then player continues with their turn
PHASES OF TURN:
Begin Turn
- Phasing occurs (items phase in or out if applicable)
Untap
- untapping occurs
Upkeep
- upkeep is paid
- untapping triggers occur - ex: “inspired mechanic”. (note: these are always pushed over from untap step & occur during upkeep step)
- upkeep turn-based actions occur (ex: “at beginning of upkeep” cards)
- upkeep triggers occur
- Priority Rotates starting with player who is carrying out their turn (triggers, activated abilities, instants, mana abilities, etc., but no sorcery speed items)
Draw
- draw occurs
- draw turn-based actions occur (ex: “at the beginning of your draw step” cards)
- draw triggers occur
- Priority Rotates starting with player who is carrying out their turn (triggers, activated abilities, instants, mana abilities, etc., but no sorcery speed items)
Main Phase
- Priority Rotates starting with player who is carrying out their turn (triggers, activated abilities, instants, mana abilities, if your turn also any other sorcery-speed spells & land)
Combat Phase
- generally want to play preventative spells in combat phase at the beginning (can only be responded to with instant-speed as compared to sorcery-speed that’s allowed in main phase)
- Priority Rotates starting with player who is carrying out their turn (triggers, activated abilities, instants, mana abilities, etc., no sorcery-speed)
(a) Declare attackers:
- attackers are declared
- Priority Rotates starting with player who is carrying out their turn (triggers, activated abilities, instants, mana abilities etc., no sorcery speed)
(b) Assign Blockers:
- opponent(s) assign blockers or declare no blockers
- attacking player assigns order of defending player’s blockers if multiple blockers are blocking one creature
- Priority Rotates starting with player who is carrying out their turn (triggers, activated abilities, instants, mana abilities, etc., no sorcery speed)
(c) Assign Damage:
- first strike combat damage is assigned
- Priority Rotates starting with player who is carrying out their turn (triggers, activated abilities, instants, mana abilities, etc., no sorcery speed)
- non-first-strike combat damage is assigned
- Priority Rotates starting with player who is carrying out their turn (triggers, activated abilities, instants, mana abilities, etc., no sorcery speed)
(d) End of Combat:
- attackers are still considered attackers and blockers are still considered blockers
- Priority Rotates starting with player who is carrying out their turn (triggers, activated abilities, instants, mana abilities, etc., no sorcery speed)
Second Main Phase
- Priority Rotates starting with player who is carrying out their turn (triggers, activated abilities, instants, mana abilities, if your turn also any other sorcery-speed spells & land)
End Step
- End step turn-based actions occur
- end step triggers occur
- (note: “at the beginning of the end step” cards need to be in play before end step starts for them to be triggered)
- Priority Rotates starting with player who is carrying out their turn (triggers, activated abilities, instants, mana abilities, etc., no sorcery speed)
Clean Up Step
- damage wears off of creatures
- effects that say until end of turn wear off
- discard down to max hand size
- triggers need to be resolved
- Priority Rotates only if a trigger is generated starting with player who is carrying out their turn (triggers, activated abilities, instants, mana abilities, etc., no sorcery speed)
This is so great comprehensive explanation... you rock.
I've had some "fun" times with the stack in the past playing an Izzet deck.
Niv-Mizzet, Parun, Melek, Izzet Paragon and Adeliz, Cinder Wind on the board. Use Brainstorm to put a Bolt and an Expansion//Explosion on the top of my library in that order. Play both with Melek and copy the lightning bolts with the E//E targeting several creatures. One of the bolts got countered with a Narset's Reversal and Adeliz triggered *Several* times along with Niv-Mizzet. We had to spend about 5 minutes figuring what the hell happened :)
The only thing that I had a problem with rules wise is priority, and you fixed it for me. Thanks guys! Ok, but I'll share something that happened to me. A wrath effect happened, and I was playing my Glissa commander deck. My Scrap Trawler was out along with a few other artifact creatures. As I know the rules, Scrap Trawler will trigger multiple times for each artifact that hits the graveyard. The artifacts are already in the graveyard when the triggers go on the stack. Someone who wasn't even in the game argued with me for 30 minutes that I have no legal targets for those triggers since I didn't have anything in the graveyard at the time they happened. I looked it up later, I know I was right now, but I was tired of arguing, so I let it go. What would be the best thing to do in those situations? If someone challenges your concept of how the rules work, should you try to prove them wrong, or let it go?
I've watched this video several times. It is so incredibly helpful.
Good topic guys. This stuff is real important for cedh if anyone is looking for that. This made me also think of shimmer zurs aetherflux win but that actually does not have to do with the stack. Maybe a good episode would be CEDH combos explained
One more thing that happens a lot throughout the turn is checking State Based Actions. These are the tiny moments just before any player gets priority that ask: "Does any creature have lethal damage?" or "Has a creature been reduced to 0 toughness or below?" or "Should a player lose the game due to having zero life / 10 poison counters?". The famous Legend Rule is one of these, as is a permanent being attached to an illegal target. If so, the game takes action, i.e. placing the creature in the graveyard, removing that player from the game, or do nothing in case no conditions are met or it got canceled out by something else (like Indestructible or Platinum Angel).
This is important to know about because as long as a single effect is happening, these things are totaly fine and don't get punished, unless they persist till just before the active player get priority (timing for that as you described).
The most common occurance I can think of for this is the defending player having a blocking creature dealing damage with lifelink. Even though they might be dealt enough damage by unblocked creatures to put their life total below 0, as long as that lifelink creature deals enough damage to raise it back up to above 0, they'll be fine.
Another example is the enters the battlefield trigger on all the living weapons. These creates a 0/0 creature token, and as part of the same effect attaches the equipment onto it. As a result of all the living weapon giving at least a +0/+1 bonus, next time State Based Actions are checked the token has a non-zero toughness and gets to stay in the game.
I was just researching about this, perfect content, congrats!!
Very good and informative episode! This is even helpful for a veteran player like me.
Craziest thing I've heard of is infinite turns with Inalla and Wanderwine Prophets. It involves the "abuse" of the "at the beginning of the next end step" part of Inalla's eminence ability causing the token to stay around until the end step of the following turn [your free turn]. Similar to the Gitrog monster you showed here.
It's a small thing but you didn't mention that a creature with double strike would also create that "first strike" step.
I like putting Etrata the Silencer's 2nd ability on the stack then responding to it and either phasing her out, unsummoning or flickering here so she won't shuffle into my commander deck.
Clash of King Jimmy?
It's about The Storm of Swords!!
Love the content, this information is so helpful to any level of Magic Player.
Finally! I’ve been asking for a video on the stack from you and the Prof for years!
Sensei Danny!! Great to see you on here dude. We miss you lots over here in Dark Sphere! Good news, I'm migrating to Sweden and taking my judge skills with me 😊😊😊
Tricky question: 4 players (A, B, C, and D)
A casts a spell.
B responds to A's casting with two additional spells.
D responds to B's casting with two additional spells.
C responds to D's casting with two additional spells.
Who has priority after the first spell resolves? Assuming the stack functions like it does in computing, C would. If A (the turn player) does, D never gets to interact with the stack between C's second and first spells resolving.
Philip McLane a gets priority, but then priority gets passed around, so d would in fact get to interact with c’s second spell before it resolves. After it resolves, the process repeats, with a passing, and d again getting priority before c’s first spell resolves. I think. Lol
C gets priority after putting the spell on the stack (rule 116.3c) and passes. The next player in turn order gets priority. C's spell doesn't resolve until everyone passes in succession.
Once it does, A gets priority (116.3b) by virtue of being the active player.
I remember when I started playing magic I thought you could cast instants on your untap step, as my teacher said, "you can cast instants at any time," making so all my instants are free. I learned I couldn't do that when I tried to play and never knew why until now :) keep on making videos!
A prefect example of priority... I played a deck with Ob Nixilis, The Fallen. Many times my opponent would try to Lightning Bolt him before i could play a Verdant Catacombs from my hand. But because my opponent let him resolve and i was the active player i got to play my verdant catacombs before he could do anything.
Great episode. Very informative. Two things, stuff like Chromatic Star and Chromatic Sphere are technically also mana abilities that can't be responded to, even though they also draw a card, so the player who cracks the Star/Sphere still has priority afterward.
Also, creature lands are similar to the crew situation. You must animate the creature land before you go to declare attackers if you want to swing with it. The same would be said for something with flash and haste. It must be on the battlefield before declare attacks if you want to attack with it.
One other thing that wasn't mentioned, which really isn't stack related, is that when an attacking creature is blocked it will deal no damage even if the blocking creature is destroyed before damage occurs, UNLESS the attacking creature has trample, in which case trample damage will spill over to the defending player.
neoepochx would the trample damage be the creatures full power or is the now missing blockers toughness still subtracted?
@@kaedenparten9126 It is the full power of damage.
@@Entropic_Alloy ok thx.
I love the stack. Also, I'm the kind of guy that will play Time Stop during someone's Upkeep...
Okay, in magical Christmas land.
@@Jonathan-qk5ed Not always lol
This podcast is always amazing
This is a helpful and informative video. I appreciate you making it!
Awesome video, thank you so much. I did not know that the Active Player always refers to the players' whos turn it. Example of my thought process: If the players are "1" "2" "3", "4", it's Player 1's turn, and priority makes past down to player 3. I thought when player 3 puts something on the stack that they were the active player at that moment in time, and therefore priority would then CONTINUE to pass in player order from player 3 then resolve when player 2 passed priority.
Good timing, I just had my headache last weekend.
My friends' "group hug" deck got both Hivemind and Eye of the Storm on the table at the same time, and then one of my other opponents played Aethergale. So we had to go through all the trouble of picking 42 total targets for 7 Aethergales, strategically bouncing already-chosen permanents to cause other Aethergales' to fizzle.
As far as I understand it, if player 3 puts something on the stack, then player 3 has priority (because they're able to put something on the stack at all, something you can only do when you have priority). Since priority has to be manually passed, player 3 can maintain priority, and when it is passed, it will continue in turn order.
However, when the thing on top of the stack _resolves_ (because everyone else passed priority as well), the active player (i.e., player 1) will receive priority. So if player 3 passes priority, and then 4, 1 and 2 do likewise, the top spell will resolve and player 1 will receive priority afterwards.
This is SUPER helpful! Very much needed, thank you.
Had a fun game where there was a Hive Mind on the battlefield. Someone cast Doomsday, and people filled their piles with cantrips to attempt milling out opponents before they went. Others went for combo pieces and everyone made an effort to win off of their Doomsday copy.
The giant whiteboard came out, the stack was drawn up, and the side of my hand got covered in marker dust as people responded consistently as the drain emptied out. No clue who won or how the game ended, and it is one of my favorite commander stories.
Small note, you actually get a chance to respond in combat but before attackers are declared. Combat is (generally speaking) these 5 steps and you can spells and activate abilities during any of them: Beginning of Combat Step. Declare Attackers Step. Declare Blockers Step. Combat Damage Step. End of Combat Step. You can even respond in between first strike and normal damage steps. Really helpful with cards like Umezawa's Jitte, Tragic Slip, or any other little tricks that you might want to sneak in between damage.
I think the first time I really learned what you are capable of doing with the stack and priority was when I learned the Scion of the Ur-Dragon kill combo. That's when I learned about activating things mid-stack and holding priority.
I learned that bit about the colon last week! saved me from a counter because exile was part of the cost!
Easily one of the best episodes you have done, the Stack is something most players only have a basic understanding or grasp of, breaking it down like this should definitely help some people out
47:30 technically "Move to Combat" is a shortcut for moving to mainphase to moving to attackers. You have to say "You are in combat" and or "Before you declare attackers" or they are still in their mainphase.