How Courtesans Shaped Bombay Cinema
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- čas přidán 28. 09. 2020
- How did courtesans shape Bombay cinema, and how has their depiction in cinema evolved with time? Dr. Ruth Vanita, gender and sexuality studies scholar, explains.
Listen to the full interview with Dr. Ruth Vanita here:
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Credits:
Featuring: Ruth Vanita
Edited by: Anahita Sachdev
Produced by: Shrishti Malhotra
Creative Supervisor: Karla Bookman
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My mother, she has learnt kathak, Bharatnatyam, and indian classical music from a very very young age, my grandparents really are into culture. Now it was her dream in her childhood to become a courtesan.
It's really so sweet like children don't know the social complications that come alongside, the negativities and stuff. She saw them as masters of the things she was learning, and she wanted to become one when she grew up. And tbh, still now, she wants to learn lucknow gharana from courtesans. I find it really sweet
What is she doing now?
I'm learning Bharatnatyam too
Actually back in the day, it used to be near impossible to become a courtesan if someone was from outside a courtesan (tawaif) family. For example, Gauhar Jaan had to be “adopted” by a pair of courtesans to be initiated as one, because she was not from a tawaif family. Tawaifnama details a lot of this.
I remember saying that to my father when I was kid after watching Rekha in Umrao Jaan. I just wanted to dance like her, need not to say that conversation didn’t go very well. 😅
My mother always tried to explain this concept to me but I never really understood what she meant when she said women like Umrahojaan were not prostitutes and people went to them to learn etiquette and poetry... How dillusional it was of me to think that I am more open minded than her.
What is the definition of a courtesan in Indian society? I don't get it
@@she_wizzdom4410 i think the definition changed during the course of time....
@@ayeshaahmad5204 what was the definition in Umraojaan's time?
@@she_wizzdom4410 i think the defination was a woman who has mastered in arts and performs in royal courts or mansions of her own
Another episode on 'Devolution of Indian cinema.'
This fall of women empowerment was hard to witness. If only things had gone up from there.
Yeah. The potryal of women in indian cinema, serials (daily soaps). Is clearly at fault and mostly for under 18s its porn as well☹️. (Sign)
@dreamer: Actually, it goes like this: any profession where women are more predominant will gradually be looked down upon, be it nurses, teachers, secretaries, beauticians...that is the work of patriarchy. Anything that threatens its existence will be made to look of less value. That pattern can be seen in the trajectory of the Bombay courtesans as well and is something we should be aware of and guard against.
@@sweetmelody2u That's so damn true! I have never thought of it this way but yes, women predominant professions are indeed looked down. There are so many movies were the secretary is a flirty, skimpily dressed, gold digger... the teacher is shown as just a hot babe in a saree that's always flying away to reveal more of her body... the nurse on night duty will be having an affair with the doctor...beauticians as drug dealers and pimps trapping girls who come to the salon...
@@Yukihanafye Also think of what comes to mind when we think of farmer suicides. Men. And then we refer to their bereaved wives as widows of the farmer. But fact is, the 'widows' are also very much farmers. And no one is looking towards that aspect.
Questions we should be asking/reports and documents should be recording: Why are there so many 'male farmer suicides'... What is the male:female ratio in farmer suicides... What is the reason for this. How are the rights of female farmers protected...
These will open up many complexities that are involved in agricultural land, the farming business, and women's access to their own agricultural property... As of now, she is working shoulder to shoulder alongside her husband but without the recognition that she is as much a farmer as him.
Well i am 15 and swadlee helped a lot and changed the way of looking at my world thnks Team Swaddle luv u
I m 14
@@aishichakraborty1881 isnt it just amzing to watch swaddle .
@@narendradubey2953 well i like it i m still learning
@@narendradubey2953 ❤️❤️❤️ love you brother ❤️❤️❤️
I am 16 and same here with me!! High Five!!!
The speaker, Professor Ruth Vanita is an eminant scholar on gender and sexuality studies and has done extensive work on courtesans in Bombay cinema. It's great to see Swaddle bringing such well-known people to speak ❤️
The Swaddle is doing a much better job then today's news channel in India. RESPECT.
I wish these were longer. At least 7 minutes. Not a drawn out 20 minute thing. I'd love hearing more about courtesans
These are some topics nobody notices
Omg! I just love all your videos. You always manage to come up with such unique content every time. 😊😊😊😊
Wow .. i really didn't knew about it
This needed to be a much longer video.
i dont get it,what is the major difference between a sex worker and a courtesan,because our generation hardly knows anything about courtesans or how their life was.
I'd say courtesans were more like entertainers, trained in art of singing, dancing and performing. They may or may not have an active sex life, nonetheless they were in charge of their own life. Sex workers are sometimes forced, but primarily for just the purpose of having sex with.
@@shreyasingh2471 They work as a sex worker to earn money. Not coz they want to have sex.
Apart from being talented and gifted, courtesans had freedom of choice.
Most of the "sex workers" don't. The reason isn't prostitution in itself, it's the human trafficking that happens.
Most of girls and women becoming victims of human trafficking are vulnerable and helpless.
On the other hand, courtesans had immense respect in kingdoms, until, the British government categorised them as "prostitutes" to get revenue by making their contribution to art, not only taxable, but also tainted with bad reputation.
@@_-KK-_ I never said they want to. I said they were sometimes forced to work as sex worker against their choice, prostitution. Apologies if it came off like I implied something else.
@@purvathakkar6338 I wasn't talking about courtesans. I was talking about sex workers. Sex worker's main goal is to earn money not coz they want to have sex. I saw a documentary about sex workers who are transgenders. It was difficult for them to get a decent job so they had no choice but to become a sex worker to earn money. In India, I know how it is, its totally a different thing.
courtesans are not prostitutes. they are dancers, singers, poets, authors, actresses and so much more.
The society that existed 100 years ago it was impossible for courtesans to not be prostitute like people. A century ago when kings or powerful men existed if they ordered they wanted to sleep with a woman of their choosing it was impossible to save one self. With women dancing regularly in front of men of low moral and high power whats the chance they never came across a man who wanted to sleep with them?
@Solmaz Dar Here are some comments on your statement
1) "Sleeping with a man doesn’t make one a prostitute"- yes as long as it is two sided and no financial benefits transferred either ways . If one is jumping into a profession knowing very well that sleeping with men is going to happen then they are doing it indirectly for the money they would earn from the profession. Then yes it is prostitution.
2)"A courtesan can be a prostitute aka provide a service that being of a sexual nature to a male or female in exchange for compensation. There is nothing wrong in that. "- No one is not calling it right or wrong. However she still will be a prostitute irrespective.
3) "The issue is male envy."- Why would it be of male envy. Ever heard of Gigolos? Man can do the same. So they do not need to envy. Even Gigolos are prostitutes.
4) "... would be called escorts and not prostitutes."- If one creates a synonym to make it look different it still would be called a prostitute. Most people who use the "escorts" are just using it with the meaning of prostitute.
It obviously serves a purpose in this world. So do recreational drugs.
@Solmaz Dar For point 1 not sure if you are a man or woman but if you are a man take my advice, or consult other men as you may please, if you regularly go for paid sex with a prostitute it is way..way more cheaper than having a wife. That coupled by the fact that you can have a variety of your choice makes it an irresistible financial deal. Do not marry just for sex. It is a financially bad deal. Yes if you are marrying for the benefits beyond sex and totally understand it then by all means go ahead.
If you are a woman and think that marriage is just about sex then I would suggest you do not marry. It would not work out. The sizzle of sex between couples die out in at most a few years and if sex is the ONLY basis for marriage it would end then. Marriage is more than sex irrespective of what you believe it is for.
@Solmaz Dar Tell me one thing if it is "Most people stay together because of the monetary benefits, forced children, fears, insecurity, and so on." Why would men feel sad and cry when they loose their partner? It would be simple to just re-marry and satisfy all the material needs. Or probably even purchase these services?
@Solmaz Dar So you are saying "It’s change and attachment to a finite life force that causes such sentiment.". That means they should feel equally sad when they leave their friends or office colleagues?
Our society consider everything basis on their own thoughts and mindset. We justify so so quickly who stands in front of Us. Immense love to Swaddle.
How can someone be so true!
When I first started learning Bharathanatyam, I dreamed about what it would be like to be a courtesan and I liked the idea. In most cases, they were not sex workers. They were embodiments of culture and celebration. In the southern part of India, they were taught to Devdasis and they went on to popularize the dance form.
Devdasis too had their fair bit of sexual duties in many cases. Its not entirely black and white.
@@jonron3805 That is why I said "in most cases"
Kudos to your content
It is a path breaking channel...non conforming to the social rules and portraying beautifully the loopholes of the socially constructed ideas.
I really find your content amazing-bcoz there's this reference to Hindi cinema and the parallels in our own lives and society! Keep this up🤘🤘
Thanks you, guys, for this channel. 😊
Ur contents are so great!! Always!!❤
Do more over thinking videos, they are life changing
But there are other channels for that! This isn't their content!
Consistently making amazing content!👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
So interesting! Thanks Swaddle
Swaddle is giving us the content that we actually want and describes true meaning of women power🤘🏻 in right way👍🏼!!
Just google Courtesan in hindi and the results are so heartbreaking. According to Google courtesan means vashya, randi, prostitute. Not someone who's mastered the art of various dance forms, is strong and independent. Whereas back in those days during 70's or 80's they were literal meaning of women empowerment
This channel is making nation's best videos ...
Pls keep doin it.
Wow. What a powerful content.
You guys are doing great 👍😻
Amazing thought provoking content!
You know Sarat Chandra Chattopadhyay? We all know about Devdas and how courtesans were looked at then. Do u believe his writings or Swaddle?
I discovered swaddle at 15 now I am 17 my perspective too has widely changed
My grandmother told me about this that but I couldn't find any facts online or in books. She just told me that Nagris mother was a courtesan very popular in Calcutta.
I love this channel.
I accidentally found this channel and have beinge watching all these videos
This is the best accident ever for me. 😁
You should make solution based video on N-E India's discrimination.
I love SWADDLE ❤
This happens even today.
Whats the name of the background sound track?
👍
Ruth Vanita's voice reminds me of Maya Angelou
What suddenly boosted the use of What's App ?
WhatsApp used to be a paid app. Used to cost around 4.99$ around 2011 2012. Later Facebook saw it's raising popularity in USA UK and Facebook bought WhatsApp. Facebook made it free to use. Made it's user interface very easy. Hence it became popular here
@@Ash-dj5ph Thank you so much for explaining me.
So there used to be art, and they reduced it to their life standards...
What's a courtesan?
A person who entertains guests in her darbar using traditional dance forms poetry music. Well she can also portray important messages. More like a one person theatre with background dancers and singers and musicians, but with a very small audience. They were also keepers of the Indian dance forms and teachers
@@shalakaparate NO. Courtesan refers to a woman attached to a royal court, who is beautiful, talented and trained to attract and please men.
*Note: For those people who come here to bully me for this definition. This isn't mine, but defined by Encyclopedia. You may check yourself too.
@@MandiraGoswami ok
@Kanchan Sharma Kapoor First, read the definition in Encyclopedia and come back to talk.
Second, learn to debate. Knowledge isn't fact check, but ur patience to learn and recheck.
Lastly, don't be a hypocrite. On one side u r supporting courtesans to show ur support for women and then shame another woman who places facts. So don't blame Bollywood when u r a hypocrite too.
Now peace off🙏
Mandira Goswami oh my god! Sometimes words have contextual meanings. Sometimes words in different languages can not be translated to another exactly and the closest relative is ascribed to it. Since you know how to debate and can use the dictionary so I am guessing you have common sense and can gauge this easily on your own. Do you know the literal translation of devdasi to English would be? Also just like the female performers who were labeled ‘courtesans’ by the British for want of a better word, there were also male performers in these courts...like tansen. What were these men called? Were they also just beautiful men in courts present to please and attract men (or women maybe?)
& still some people even in modern era calls female dancers as 'nachaniya'
Aaj bhi log singers aur dancers ko prostitute hi samajhte hai.
For example:in Aashiqui 1 Rahul Roy was a bar singer
Bt no one misbehaved or harrassed bt in Aashiqui 2 two men molested shraddha kapoor because she is a bar singer??🤔🤔
Swaddle please make a video about #JusticeForManishaValmiki
👍🙏
#videoidea Please make a video on history of Victim blaming.
Well its devdasi pratha so it's kind of sad people want to say something good...
Swaddle make a video what is the prime reason behind raising cases of rapes in our country! & Is there any impact of strict punishment like death sentence etc! Please take psychiatrist opinion on the mind of rapist
Concerts are modernized version of courtesans but people really took the latter wrong especially in older times. They weren't prostitutes; much like performers.
what is the difference between a courtesan and a hetaira ?
Watching Swaddle makes you think that BOllywood is the center of the universe
My baba didn't allow me to take professional lessons of dance because of these kinda thaughts...... 😑
First
First 😂
I don't think woman related to entertainment industry and virginity goes side by side...
I read comments down below on having sex for Money and having sex with choice ..
I don't understand difference between a part time sex worker and women having casual sex🙄
Sexual freedom is okay when you really like someone deeply bt it's nothing more than prostitution when you change partners as clothes and you are too easy to get on bed.. It's totally a western thing and they still in primary stages of learning about civilization...
This comment is so funny I can't