Are Ray Dalio's Principles the Secret to His Success?
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- čas přidán 6. 11. 2023
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Since founding Bridgewater nearly 50 years ago, Ray Dalio has become one of the world’s richest investors. He is widely credited with having predicted and profited from both the 1987 crash and the 2008 financial crisis. He is the founder of the world’s largest hedge fund and is one of the most successful businessmen alive, yet he professes to be seeking something more meaningful than just money or business success.
According to Dalio, his main interest, over the last twenty years is to lead others toward “meaningful lives” and “meaningful relationships” through the application of his principles. He has written a number of books and given a Ted Talk on this topic.
Rob Copeland is a journalist at the New York Times and was previously the longtime hedge fund beat reporter at The Wall Street Journal. In his new book “The Fund” he smashes through some of the mystique built up around Ray Dalio in recent years. He argues that very little of Dalio’s success is due to his widely promoted “Principles” and can be better explained by his ability to befriend influential people and impress them with his broad knowledge of the world, his skill at getting good publicity, and his early investment success.
Rob interviewed hundreds of Bridgewater employees in order to write this unauthorized biography that shows Ray Dalio in a very different light.
Dalio declined to be interviewed for the book and has threatened a lawsuit against Rob and his publisher. In today's video I interview Rob to hear his account of life at Bridgewater and whether he believes Ray Dalio’s principles are worth following.
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Such a great speaker even a communist can listen😅
I love this newsletter!
Will Patrick ever do a stock analysis if it was paid for? Not as a CZcams vid. Just to the person who paid for it.
Almost 1M subs, but still criminally under subbed
The website is not loading at this time. I was going to subscribe to the newsletter to read your piece tomorrow. Please accept my gratitude if you’re aware of any other way to get that to me. I will try to sign up again in an hour or so, but if the site is still down, hook me up, Patty B.
I worked for Bridgewater in 2013-2014.
Attrition rate was around 30-40% a year.
60-80% of time was spent on rating and open examination of other people’s actions and behavior.
Everyone was forced to memorize principles and their numbers.
This sounds like a cult wtf, and also very toxic very high schools drama like
I will hate to work at such company.
His secret to success is the 2 & 20% fees, he basically runs a closet index fund calling it pure alpha when in reality, his returns are parallel to the markets rather than orthogonal like Ren Tech.
@@5678plm His returns with his Pure Alpha fund do not parallell the stock market though. It is way, way less volatile (in both directions). Of course it doesn't move like an index fund - it is made mostly of bonds and has gold as a sizable portion too.
Maybe not to this degree, but you'd be surprised how common this is. "Good" corporate or business culture and practice is predatory and counter productive, so long as mystique is created and maintained. Self congratulatory. If this sort of behavior wasn't so lucrative and rewarded with leadership and prestige, we'd be allowed to call them monsters. In previous eras it was feudal lords and kings, today it's corporates and business suits, tomorrow they will be invasive hostile aliens on other planets.
39:44 I was awfully confused about all this financial talk on my favourite rap channel, but finally we're getting to the point.
😂
😅😅
It’s amazing how a guy makes a ton of money and then suddenly he’s a genius we need to listen to about all sorts of things. Dalio was good at making money…doesn’t mean he’s good at anything else. The self importance people of wealth ascribe to themselves is amazing.
This was beautifully said by Tevye in the musical 'Fiddler on the Roof' in one of the songs entitled 'If I were a rich man'. Where he sort of say that if you're rich, people will think that you're also wise and they'll kind of agree to everything you say. "Yes, Rebbe Tevye." 😂
Dalio built an extremely successful company from an apartment room.
I don't think many people are qualified to say what he isn't qualified at.
Yep - actors and actresses even worse. Btw, it's "importance" not "self-importance" as you've used it...
YOU NAILED IT, steverznick!
@@jj4791 of course plenty of people are qualified to say what he isn't qualified at. he's got expertise in one field, that doesn't mean he has expertise in other fields. we see this with many people who attain success in one field and somehow feel like that gives them expertise in other fields.
Unintentional poetry at 1:00:36 "The asset management industry is a great place to be/
When you're the asset manager collecting the fee." (The meter's a little off, but that's what editing is for.)
Silliness aside, I am so glad that Patrick is able to get people for these long-form interviews.
Who said it was unintentional? -Rob Copeland
Fascinating video Patrick. I was not at all convinced by Dalio's principles for a changing global order. But, I didn't see this one coming.
Can't believe I found my favourite finance CZcamsr here :D
ofc you weren't you're a narrow minded white chauvinist. rays morning shit has more value than your entire bloodline. lmao.
because you need to research?
I mean, its not a coincidence that he is also a fan of China when his company is pretty much a mini communism assuming what has been discussed in this video is true or mostly true.
The argument that ex-employees will always have a bias in an interview about their former boss, can be easily answered: If they independently give the same specific descriptions of certain behaviours, it's unlikely they are all making up the same thing. Or to stay in the ex-wife comparison: If one man's 5 ex-wives tell you independent of each other, that their former husband used to eat his boogers, it's probably true.
Once is an accident
Two is a coincidence
Three is a pattern
Where there is smoke there is fire
Ray Dalio's Principles: Where the only constant principle is that he constantly has principles!
Those are my principles, and if you don't like them... well, I have others.
Unprincipled principles!
😂
I loved how he went on and on about meritocracy and then made his kids board members. No nepotism there I'm sure.
His principles always seemed like “water is wet, don’t touch it to stay dry” type stuff to me
Yes, some trite self-help guru content as a marketing campaign for himself. Crafting his own public persona as a means of front-running any criticism of his flawed ego.
insightful. All 3 years old learn it the hard way.
most of them sound like good ideas but have no indication of how to apply them to your life. its like "collaboration is better, work as a team rather than on your own" which sounds like a good idea, but idk..
On a very different note.
You know what's the most impressive quality of Rob - he is true professional journalist / interviewer - he doesn't interrupt, he does listen, he shares his carefully well thought point. Rare skill in today's journalism - way too many hype journalist who wouldn't even let to speak their counterpart.
Absolutely spot on! Excellent comment. 👍🏻
We desperately need more people like Rob.
Thank you! It helps that Patrick actually 1) reads the book 2) is calmly asking questions and listening to the answers. I can't tell you how rare that is. -Rob Copeland
@@RobCopeland-qw5qr oh, we certainly love and appreciate Patrick and know his best (that's why we're on his channel :) ).
It's just... I've seen recently so many interviews (and I'm not talking just about amateurs: streamers / youtubers), but also headline media (TV / professional agencies) where journalist doesn't let the guest to speak their mind (even doing that to a quite snr and respectful guests)- breaking up, jumping the subject, substituting the message, multitude of manipulative techniques - I'm pretty sure you know the stories like that in mass.
So it was really a pleasure to see an adult conversation of two interesting people (I probably would call this an interview in it's pure form since it was interesting to hear a points of view of both of you).
Respectfully, Denis.
I noticed that as well. You can really appreciate it when the video cuts back to him from Patrick. You just feel the fact that he has been actively listening the entire time.
Dalio's principles predicted his own rise and fall. Truly inspirational.
It’s interesting how having great wealth probably makes it mostly possible to be able to tell any story you want about yourself and your creations without anyone daring to contradict you for fear of being sued.
It's a running theme among shady characters. From crypto scammers to hedge funds, they fight similarly
Golden rule. He who has the gold makes the rules. Has always been that way. And the winner writes history. His-story.
@@PopeyeSailor-wz7ewno, writers write history. "History is written by the victors" is a classic example of a belief that's popular because it sounds correct and makes it simpler for people to analyze things. In reality, a lot of important works of history were written by writers who hated the victors.
@@arglebargle5531 I think both is true. For example, imho the mainstream German history is clearly written by the victors. And the other side of the story not only comes from the victims, which are indoctrinated to hate themselves, no, it is also coming from some British and American historians. The mainstream history about slavery on the other hand is written by the victims. Not that what they say would be wrong, they just not tell the missing parts of the whole story themselves were involved in.
Whatever the "mainstream-history" wants you to believe, should be doubted, if you care about truth.
@@arglebargle5531appreciate your comment
This guy has definitely had training on what he can say to mitigate the likely future attacks. This’ll be one of the first actual paper books I’ve bought in a long time!
You can really feel how measured his responses are! Makes Dalio appear all the more threatening and villainous.
Being a journalist at both NYT and WSJ means he isn't stupid.
@@garrettkim2429 and it cannot be, that him putting himself in the victim seat is meant to create just this type of sensation among people. Journalists do this all the time, always taking the victim role whenever things don't align with their own world view or whenever they feel that they can gain from it.
@@teachermichael6927 Many would argue the complete opposite.
Taking a deep dive into a narcissist and psychopathic personality?
I talked to MANY former Bridgewater Associates, and it is ALWAYS negative from a variety of roles . . since the 1990s. Be skeptical of Ray’s Principles.
Your author interviews are awesome. The one with Zeke Faux was so entertaining and made me buy the book!
Zeke was great. He and I have a very similar sense of humor.
appreciate your work!@@PBoyle cheers.
I’ve always harbored skepticism towards his ideas about cyclical patterns. While you require patterns to forecast future events, they tend not to hold up well on a historical scale. The only true constant is human nature.
So, not being a finance guy I first head about Ray, not in the context of him being a mega successfull trader, but just some guy that had some principles on a podcast.
I immediately thought "this guy is selling me something I don't want to buy". I guess I was right about that.
Most of the principles themselves are good. However the main issue is is claims about them and how he actually makes use of them in the workplace.
Ex hedge fund guy here. This is so funny to hear because my mentor/ex boss told me a decade ago he thought the whole principles/systematic thing is just a cover and it was all just Ray D using his connections and traditional macro analysis
My biggest respect for journalists like this. Thank you both!
Thank you, I appreciate it, please throw me an Amazon/Goodreads review lol -Rob Copeland
I always thought there is something off-key about Ray Dalio. Never took him seriously. Glad to see some critique out there.
A case of "fooled by randomness"? The author has skin in the game, he is risking litigation to get the book out there. I like people who have skin in the game, these people are heroes.
That's a pretty good book. Through I doubt it is all random. Dude sounds like a massive con man. And con artists are usually more successful at pulling cons in this era.... -cough-ivealist-cough-
@@lovisericachii4503 As @Pboyle also made a video, we live in the age of fraud, from FTX and beyond.
"Everyone is watching video tapes of who didn’t wash their hands at the bathroom and no real work is being done." 😂👏👏
These principles are the runing gag of each bigger company. Every 3 to 5 years a new CEO comes in and proclaims his new guiding principles for the company that are equal in content to the old principles, and both vague in their wording and nothing better than common sense.
And employees roll their eyes when a new wave of principles is distributed and end of the year they fill in their company survey with "yes, the guiding principles are meaningful for my work."
And in reality nobody gives a f&^*£ about the principles.
OBVIOUSLY!
I really enjoyed Dalio’s Priciples book. “Deal with what is, not what should be” is a good one to live by.
Having said that, as with any hedge fund I believe their success is based on being fed insider information from people in power. 😀
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
This comment is top tier haha
Not original though. Machiavelli said it 500 years ago in The Prince.
That is terrible advice, basically saying "stay where you are and never try improving."
i could've said that to you when i was 5. There is a chance you said that to yourself when you were 5, you just forgot.
Well done Patrick, I just bought the book the Fund. I read most of Dalio books, except for Principles because it did smell wrong. Billionairs are not made by following good virtue principles, but rather in reverse.
Spot on, Principles is just so Ray can look like a "one of the nice billionaires". Just like Bill Gates and his foundation.
I fail to comprehend either of your logic.
Dalio didn't just make himself rich. He grew a successful fund managing money for investors but primarily for large corporate retirement funds that resulted in millions of people saving and retiring richer than they would have otherwise. The fact he returned a profit for millions of Americans instead of an enormous, suicide inducing loss in 2008 is evidence he knows what he is doing.
Bill Gates, along with Steve Jobs and their partners revolutionized computer software and the way humans interact with it. How is it evil to invent something useful and sell it fora low enough price that its installed on every computer that actually functions, and can be afforded by everyone? If a guy makes PCs viable for the entire planet, how is that evil?
This breaks my heart because I used to do accounting homework while listening to Ray interviews or books at night haha. Good old college days.
I'm 1/2 way through the audiobook...Dalio comes across as the financial markets version of L Ron Hubbard. Amazing how much different a person can be portrayed via the traditional media vs. a legitimate, dispassionate, non-spin reportage.
To be Balanced : Ray had to tone it down when it comes to his unvarnished admiration for Putin, which had always shocked me, considering the fact that Ray owes everything to his having been born in a free, democratic society. In his podcast with Lex Fridman Ray lies about not having met Xi - he's met him multiple times on various occasions.
An excellent interview, Patrick. This channel is going from strength to strength!
Hey patrick, just wanted to say I really really enjoy these book highlights and interviews you are doing. Would love to see more in the future!
The best book has to be ‘The Oxford Book Of Aphorisms,’ because all of the principles of life are in there without having been written by Ray Dalio.
I didn't want this to end. Two enquiring minds challenging each other's ideas. I can think of no better person to do this interview than Patrick.
I loved it, too. I like interviews with Patrick, regardless of whether he’s the one asking or answering the questions.
Having engaged with this, must thank Pat for introducing us to this young man, and his research; together, you allow us to find our own truth that has something enduring in it. Quality work, Chaps.
Ray dalio. Young man 😂
@@xyzmediaandentertainment8313talking about the journalist ….
Bad bot comment.
@@xyzmediaandentertainment8313he's talking about the author
@@xyzmediaandentertainment8313He was on about the Journalist!?!
I bought the book. Power to this guy, he’s measuring every word. Thanks for this interview!
I used to work at Bridgewater out of college, and I respect Ray's intelligence and he's a genuinely insightful person. However, there is a definite narcissistic side to him where he can get very angry and try to humiliate other employees for no appropriate reason. Everybody is forced to have opinions on other people they barely know and it wastes a lot of time. Getting "dot bombed" by people who barely know anything about you or your work is a real thing. If you don't fully buy into that stuff you'll probably lose interest. And a lot of people are pushed based on how Dalio likes them and not on some "meritocratic" criteria. Overall, Ray has his strengths and weaknesses, flaws, and insecurities like every other person.
IGNORE THE LAWSUITS! People have FREEDOM OF SPEECH to say ANYTHING they want outside of Ray Dalio's property (company website, house).
All these FAKE "capitalists" and "anticommunists" who NEVER EVER did ANY USEFUL WORK IN THEIR LIVES,
who do NOTHING but move MONEY (representing OTHER people's hard labor) around,
go running to the GOVERNMENT to go bail them out and help them out and try to sue people for what they say or do on their OWN property. F this Ray Dalio piece of shit. Anyone "sued" by Dalio for what they say has the right to IGNORE THE LAWSUITS! People have FREEDOM OF SPEECH to say ANYTHING they want outside of Ray Dalio's property (company website, house).
I approve this comment. And what did this jorno build?
@@matsten Copeland's book will be catnip for people who don't like Ray. Any celebrity there's a market for that. It's like confirmation bias where some people are very partisan about something/someone and totally calcified about it.
so how u think about his prediction on China？
Institutional investors putting money with founders that they like and believe in is the most insightful quote from this interview.
Very true
Don't mean to say it will work out!?!
All I know is when I went to bridgewater somebody in the stairwell started giving me a lecture for not swiping in and saying he would like "write me up" and I was like "ok whatever I don't even work here bro.. im just here for an interview good luck with that" then he walked off defeated
Every "self-made" person of incredible wealth leaves their connections and inherent advantages out of their origin story.
I've appreciated the high quality interviews you've had recently, Patrick.
"Does Ray rap at all?" That's the dry wit I come to Patrick for.
Glad Patrick asked question about rap music. I was worried for a while this was a channel about finance.
Wonderful interview. I watched it two months ago, bought the book which I just finished, then watched it again. Hope that you do a follow-up with Rob regarding his experience since the book was published.
Only 10 minutes into video and can already tell it's my favorite out of all your excellent content Patrick, bravo...
I am glad my number #1 channel for rap news finally got back to it's roots (39:45). I was very confused about all this investment talk lately, I have to say!
Listening to Ray many times on YT I never knew just what to think about him because his investment advice isn't revolutionary. This interview really helped explain the man I've been listening to. Thanks.
Wow what an amazing interview! Very thoughtful, through and intriguing
The insights that Rob shares at the end of the video are so powerful. Many people go their whole lives not realizing them. Steve Jobs realized them on his death bed. I bought the book in the first 10 minutes of this video and am so glad I stayed to watch the whole video. You both are truly awesome, stay that way!
The last few minutes seemed to have been very honest unlike many interviews...
You may think the golf caddie origin is quite innocent, but I think it really hurts Ray's pride. The modern image of a successful man is someone who is a leader, not a servant. And using the role of a servant to get closer to rich people in order to get more economic opportunities makes you sound closer to a con artist than a captain of industry.
Of course the truth is that humans do this all the time, at all levels of society. But as with many other social standards, the standard for a Captain of Industry is set at an unrealistic level. People who want to play that game for their own ego therefore must manufacture their own biographies, purging negative stories from their public image, not unlike aspiring supermodels eliminating calories in pursuit of their own high standards.
Only in Shallowland.
Thanks Patrick! Always excellent content! I will definitely read this book!
You're really good at this Patrick. It's always entertaining and informative.
This was a great interview. Thank you Rob for your contribution and effort with this book.
Thank you. This rollout has been just a dream come true. Patrick was early on this...he filmed this interview before a single review etc was out. It's such a cool community you guys have here. -Rob Copeland
Thank goodness for good journalism like this, purchased! I bought and read Principles, can't wait to read this!
One of the best interviews and back and forth thoughtful exchanges of ideas I have seen anytime and any where. Hear hear. Well done. A great credit to both of you.
So glad Patrick has returned to his roots of Rap news to provide us this information about P Diddy
Looking forward to reading the book. Ordered it in response to interview. Thank you...
Love these conversations!
Two (2) Ray Dalio books for sale $1.00 with free delivery…slightly used with Hubris content.
Thanks Patrick & Rob. Can’t wait for delivery of The Fund.
Great video. I only learned about Ray four years ago when i started learning about investing. I saw him as a benevolent force in a shark infested water of hedge fund investing ie Steve Cohen. So it was quite enlightening to see that Ray is bit like a shark in dolphin’s outfit. Thanks for this. And I will surely buy the book.
The fact that Ray is doing this means I need to read your book. Obviously some truth.
I loved this interview. Really been enjoying recent episodes where you speak to authors. I'm sure I'll enjoy this book as much as the Zeke's
Patrick. I loved your stories, insight, and humor, and now, you have my respect. Huge respect. Thank you.
My main takeaway from this video is that Ray is a victim of his own ego. The way he thinks and acts are not too surprising for someone in his line of work who has been consistently successful and convinces themselves they have the magic touch.
Really enjoyed listening to this Patrick! The guy you had on seems like a legend
Very compelling and valuable interview.
Fascinating interview and insight! You got great interview skills, Patrick. And a great guest!
Damn! Ray Dalio seems like such a genuine, thoughtful guy. I thought he was the rare example of a decent person who became enormously wealthy.
Great interview. Fascinating.
Fascinating listen. Thank you gentlemen.
Fascinating, thank you.
I just requested the book from my local library. There's 2 folks ahead of me, but I can't wait to read it!
Thanks for this. Long live free speech/journalism.Always thought it was odd when Dalio portrayed himself as a professor of history of economics with oversimplified theses.
Excellent discussion. Thank you
Love your channel Patrick. This one of your best videos. I really like the format of interviewing people. You're very good at it.
Another great video! I'm really liking the "interview series" btw!
PS that bit about if he was doing any rapping was hilarious FYI 😂
Thank you for this. I thought that Dalio’s book, Principles, was a fairly bland collection of obvious truisms pretending to be visionary revelations. Meanwhile he showed a tragic/autistic level of disregard for the role of human frailty. His vision of the well functioning organization seems to be a place where people behave like meat-computers.
I kept thinking that he must suffer from the problem of thinking that what makes him different (being inconsiderate of other people’s feelings) is the same thing that made him successful. I also kept thinking that the inside of his organization must be a mess since he himself narrates two attempts to step away from the business where he was forced to come back and retake control.
I look forward to reading this new book.
Well-said. My thoughts precisely
As the autistic father of an autistic son - worth bearing in mind that most autistic people are intensely sensitive to justice and fairness and actually hate when people are hurt. Autistic people do not ‘disregard human frailty’ except in Hollywood.
I completely agree about the book being just bland and uninsightful. I was surprised to see people lauding it so much.
Successful entrepreneurs are much more likely to be inconsiderate people. Being extremely agreeable is at variance with meeting performance metrics that do not pertain to agreeability, and having a unique vision sometimes means telling people who do not share that vision to buzz off. I am not saying the traits of successful entrepreneurs are desirable or that Steve Jobs is someone to model our lives around. Being successful is only the same as being likable if you penalize yourself for causing conflict, hurt feelings, and stress in others. Stressing people out may be unethical, because it hurts people's health. Not doing so sometimes hurts business performance.
@@stevengreidinger8295 There is a difference between not being highly agreeable and being an a$$hole. The fallacy of the Steve Jobs example is that everyone who is both successful and an a$$hole points to Steve Jobs and assumes a cause and effect relationship like this:
Being an a$$hole is what made me successful.
I propose the relationship is more often in the other direction
Being successful allows me to be an a$$hole.
The thing is, once people are successful, nobody challenges their BS because their success puts them in a position of power. Is it usually possibly to tell people "No" without being an ass? Probably.
Excellent interview. Best finance channel on youtube. Kyla Scanlon gets a shoutout too but her thing is less focused on finance, you're both great.
Awesome content and subject that will never be addressed by mainstream media. Thanks Patrick. This is one of the smartest and most underrated channels on CZcams. Kudos to Rob Copeland for being a great financial journalist and writer, and the perspective of more important is the balance of life. I don't envy of these super rich that lost their perspective in life and only and obsessed with one thing that is making the most of money.
Fantastic interview with insightful questions and back and forth, enjoyed every minute!
Read the excerpt from the book in the Times this past Sunday. Witty and extremely interesting, looking forward to reading the whole book
Second really good book Ive found from your channel, thanks!
Absolutely amazing work. Thanks so much for this. I bought Principals because I thought the CZcams animations were really great, but the context really needs to be there.
Love watching the premiere because everyone is so talkative. Do you have a scheduled release date?
Release date for what? The book. It's already out.
@@mirzaahmed6589no I mean for when he drops the video premieres.😊
Ray's prediction on china is not looking so great, most likely the reason he stepped down from his position.
That's what happens when you base your prediction on bad history
Prophets are always sound intelligent until it doesn't happen.
I like the idea of a suit and huge headphones
Bad call, but silly to think that's the reason he would step down
I suspect he has such a roses view on China because he wants to stir up exit liquidity on his investments.
Thanks Patrick for this very interesting interview.
Love this interview, definitely getting the book!
Just bought Rob’s book on Audible !
A lot of the divergent perspectives on Ray Dalios success reminded me on the book "fooled by randomness" (a wallstreet classic). Has anyone read it? Ps. Patrick, if you do a review on it, I will reward you with one pound of cheddar!
One of my faves. Taleb doesn’t need milk toast ‘principles’. He thinks for himself.
What a beautiful interview!
Thank you Patrick, for a sneak peak under Bridgwater's blanket, and how things actually look like.
Isn't he the guy who said cash is trash? When was that said, either way, cash has been pretty good to me in a money market fund over the last couple of years 👍
Very nice interview. It's pretty clear that Rob has talked to at least a few people in St Louis, who wrote a whole lot of the baseball card system. If there were no NDAs, someone could write a book just on the implementation decisions, and their implications.
The what?
Another great interview, just ordered the book!
Great interview from one of the greats
I watched Ray's video on "changing world order" and also read part of the book. What I found incredibly weird was that he was very much fine with, and perhaps even joyous, about the ccp surpassing the US and the West.
you fucking clown. it's all about work ethic. Americans are mostly fat fucking slobs.
U are the man
Great podcast interview! Very much needed...
thanks for this Patrick, watched the full video and signed up for your newsletter
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Great content btw❤
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