Dyno Results of the Fully built Ecotec with every ZZP bolt on!
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- čas přidán 6. 09. 2024
- We visit our friend at Fonse Performance to get the SS on his Mustang Dyno. Time to see what this thing can make!
Follow me on Instagram: / supr_sl0
Many thanks to:
Mark Innacone and Pete Costa
Fonse Jr. at Fonse Performance
Ryan D, Matt M, and Tyler V at ZZPerformance - www.zzperformance.com
#zzperformance #turboHHR #HHRSS #ecotecnation
450x.75?! Why would you expect a 25% power loss from the crank on a FWD CAR?!
exactly from what I've been taught and seen work 95% of the time, is 16% loss for fwd or mid engine rwd vehicles, and 18-20% loss on most rwd vehicles, unless it's a short wheelbase short driveshaft rwd car, then its 16-18% again, he's more likely cranking out just over 400 hp, more like 405 hp but definitely not 450 hp.
Because that’s about what you loose. You need to add in all the accessories as well as the transmission and differential. You won’t loose as much with an electric fan and a manual transmission. But the loss is still noticeable.
Got 1 w/ 2.2 and I just bought a ss with 2.0 5 speed for the swap.My HHR has a winch on the front with a Jeep Jack on the hood and it's lifted up 12in with 30 in Hankook all terrains. I can't wait for my 2.0 Turbo 5 speed to be in it. I'll start posting on here as soon as I get a decent camera to do so stay looking for it. Holler
Looks like zzp didnt want you to hit the 400hp like there hatch sonic... Great video
Should have bought a sonic...
Great video brother. I don’t see many people doing anything with the HHR SS. I have an 08 but the engine overheated so I ordered a replacement from ZZP. The new engine is crazy! It came with almost everything pre installed. My plan is to get the new engine in so I have a daily driver while I build another ZZP 2.0. Then I plan to convert my HHR SS to RWD with a 5 speed and rear end and suspension from a Sky Redline. I’m sure my HHR SS will be under the knife for a while but I’m pretty sure I can pull off the build. I’m surprised this is not something more people would want to do. I have only seen it mentioned 1 time online. Anyway thank you for the awesome video and I look forward to seeing your road beast on the track. Stay safe brother
Appreciate it, George! Which motor did you go with?
Sounds like you got quite the project on your hand - love to see how the RWD conversion turns out. Only know of 1 other person who's doing the same with a sky redline.
@@SuprSl0 I’m in the process of installing an LDK engine I ordered from ZZP. I was pretty surprised by how complete the engine was when it arrived. It’s been slow going because I completely forgot to order a new turbo, flywheel, clutch and a bunch of seals and gaskets. I got all the big stuff just waiting on the small stuff now.
Most definitely, converting the HHR SS to RWD is going to be some work. I’m getting all my measurements now as well as building a jig for the engine and RWD transmission. This way I can still drive my car while I’m building it. I enjoy driving my HHR SS more then my 68 Plymouth. Just don’t tell any Mopar guys. I do believe they will confiscate your car for that and kick you out of the Mopar fan club. I will be posting my progress as I go.
Any way you could get me any information of the person you know that’s doing a similar build? I would very much appreciate seeing how it’s done while I’m still in my planning phase. Thank you again for you video.
Those are solid numbers at the wheels. You definitely have more restraint than I, seeing as there's more boost to be had. I'd love to see the E85 numbers.
It was more of an error on our part than restraint, we thought 2.5 turns was max! Matt at ZZP confirmed after that we weren't even close.
Thanks for checking the video out!
Sounds amazing they are some serious numbers I'm sure it's gonna fly.
Many thanks, Joseph. None of it matters until we see what it does in the 1/4.
Thanks for checking the video out!
Now that's impressive on what's been done to that 2 liter 339 at the wheels on a save tune of the engine. I'm sure it'll turn in some wild quarter mile times once on the track. Myself own a '09 HHR SS panel 2 liter automatic.
It actually didn't, but that's okay - working on correcting that!
I made 358whp on my ko4
I'm sure of it - the final pull was the same amount of boost a k04 can make, and if you were on a dynojet you're gonna get a higher reading.
Thanks for checking out the vid!
Same here mustang dyno got 350whp on stock turbo........ I will kill my same to make those numbers after all that money & time lol sorry boss but true
@@SuprSl0 oh and I'm talking about whp not HP lol my friend has same turbo as you with stock engine made 490 (WHP)
I believe it. There’s a reason I never mentioned being done with the build or tune...
Awesome numbers Nick! Great video too! I’m surely inspired to get mine going!
Looking forward to the track video
Now you have the look and power to match!
Appreciate it, Thomas.
Thanks for checking out the vid! Good luck with your build
Who's 6.0 is making 339whp on cammed and long tubes? I'd be pissed lol. We just dynoed a 6.0 vette here long tubes, baby cam, intake and exhaust and made 410 on 93 shell
Nice build! Fonse mentioned that's the power a 6.0 would make on his mustang dyno with those mods.
@@SuprSl0 lmao your tuner is lying to your face. I have a ls2 gto (which probably has the largest drive train loss in lower than any other rwd gm car) and with long tubes and a mild cam I’m making 395 to the wheels. You guys also figured that car has a 25% drive train loss to the wheels, but how? It’s fwd lmao everything is within 2 feet of the wheels
@@stoneschweitzer7738 I could see it happening, but id agree about being upset or disappointed. My 00 T/A LS1 made 378whp with a big cam and my 04 GTO made 391whp at ZZP. Though my numbers may be lower on a mustang dyno.
@@MrButtons252 nah I’m not disappointed, I’m saying there’s no way his car is making the power his tuner is claiming. His tuner is lying to him and my car is living proof he is either clueless or lying just because it’s on CZcams. My numbers were also on a mustang dyno.
@@MrButtons252 even the original dude said how that 6.0 vette made 410 at the wheels. Tuners straight lying and acting like his car is making “6.0 power”. It’s a stupid comparison that makes no sense, but almost 380whp in a trans am was probably a lot of fun and would beat a lot of cars considering they are kinda light
(Liked) Great video. Good edit. Love the car and really impressed with the power. Look forward to seeing more videos. Keep up the great work!!
Many thanks Landon!
I see the whp climbing, but it doesn't sound right for some reason. It's as if the engine hits a plateu and the rpms don't climb... But they don't red line either.
I was thinking the same
We were commanding 3rd gear in HPTuners with every pull. Very minor adjustments made in tune, and numbers increased towards the end by turning up with the boost controller. This is why you got the same plateu/RPM readings without red lining.
Thanks for checking out the video!
@@SuprSl0 I'm just getting into tuning do these little things are good to know.
Understandable. If you're auto you can command a gear in HPTuners so the car doesn't shift. 4th gear is overdrive for the auto HHR, so we commanded 3rd to stay in the power band. This is great for dyno tuning, or if you're at the track.
Great Video ! I own a 2008 Lt 2.4 liter with 3rd window panel from factory. 164k miles and still in good shape.
Nice - I've always loved the AA5 body. Funny, the week after I bought this SS, a fully loaded 5 speed AA5 came up for sale nearby with only 6k miles.
Solid #’s, man! Thanks for the video.... Keep up the good work!
Many thanks RT! Happy to hear you enjoyed the video.
339whp, same as a 6.0 with a cam and bolt- ons? Ummmmm, you drunk?
Dude I've seen this car on 70 before, neart Hagerstown. I love your build
Appreciate it, but I haven’t been down that area in quite some time. There’s another HHR owner I think lives down there - he has a giant “spoolbus 2.0” sticker on the back
Also hopefully there isn't a vicious turn in the exhaust back by the rear tire. I did 2.5 in all the way back. Also got open air filter sucking in all that hot air the iat's must be high
Exhaust is 3" all the way back - ZZP downpipe, 3" tubing from trubendz that's identical to stock.
As for the warm air, any aftermarket air intake is a similar setup - that's what the intercooler is for 😉
Appreciate ya checking out the vid!
thats it? you can literally make those numbers reliably with stock motor and stock turbo....
Yep - looks like it
@@SuprSl0 at what psi?
@@NewGunzSociety 22psi
@@SuprSl0 dude get someone else to tune... 22-25 on a ko4 makes those numbers with a stock motor....
NewGunzSociety that’s true! I Haven’t put mine on a Dyno yet, but I’ve been at 25 PSI with all bolt ons! Charge pipes inter cooler and catless downpipe being remotely tuned by rpm Motorsport
I'm going to end up hitting you up for advice. Bought a 08 Lnf November of 08. My first internet purchase. Put it in a 84 Fiero, which was my Daily. It came, complete, on a pallet. Im trying to get all the systems hooked up correctly, but I have a head injury, so it makes it hard to search for info. I have all good high performance stuff on this car. Willwood, morose, fkexilite, custom 3 core brass radiator, for weight in the front end. Qa1 and koni 12 way rears. After market tube suspension. I'm going with ZZP stage one sensors ect. Also have air over water w Bosch pump. Need someone who knows where the small lines go.
Sweet! Just be careful, some 08 LNFs develop a porous block overtime. Sounds like a fun little project
Wow seeing that had an auto is insane. I cannot believe the transmission survived that. Get a Saab 6 speed in there with zzp and you’ll probably see 350-380
I might be super late but that 25 percent drivetrain loss is not accurate without transaxles. HP Tuners shows me making 401hp at the crank and I make 370 at the wheels. This is stock turbo on 110 octane and not on a mustang dyno.
Great work, not to many people use the T45e trans.I have an LNF in a Fiero with the T45e. Will always be faster than a stick car because of not being able to power shift the stick transmissions. The one mistake I see that you have made was you never closed the hood and made a pull. It may surprise you.
Many thanks! We’re hoping the trans can hold up, but only time will tell.
Thanks for the tip with the hood - definitely will try it next time!
Well like I said the trans is the only worry. I have looked for builders that wanted to improve the trans. But what you always get, a T45e, that piece of junk. Mine has been good so far, but then I have not pounded on very much yet. I know one thing for sure do not shift into OD at WOT or hold it wide open in OD. It will slip the clutches instantly , but it won't if you have the converted locked up.
time to bring it to tail of the dragon to hang with the other boys now :)
I know - it would be such a blast!
The trans can take the launch control just fine.
The turbo has a hard time spooling at the bottom end
Did you have to tear apart the engine to add any of these modifications?
That’s a good build and respectable numbers.
I wouldn’t compare it to a 6.0 though.
Although you may make “similar power numbers” to a cammed, headers, tune 6.0 if you were to race a 6.0 powered car of similar weight there would be no comparison. The torque of the 6.0 would be overwhelming and with the same hp he would just stay pulled past you.
You're absolutely right - if you don't have the torque, you're not going anywhere. Appreciate you checking out the vid!
Where did you get the projector headlights? I have searched countless hours looking for a set.
Custom built them - you can get all the parts to do it yourself from the retrofitsource - www.theretrofitsource.com
ZZP rocks
Build wouldn't be possible without them!
A stage one tune i ebelive got you to like 310 hp pretty sure that was just a flash you should be making over 5
I wonder how compatible zzp parts are on a Saab 2.0T ecotec motor
Believe the 2.0 Saab is an LHU? Either way, I know they have some parts - hit them up, or browse their Ecotec category!
I want my hhr like this one. :-)
So i could do this to my 06 Pontiac g6 ecotec ?need a parts list i cant find any mods no matter how hard i look .
You should. ZZP should have a ton of options for you!
Yes you can!
no, that’s a le5 not a lnf. moddable but will take 2x the price to make that hp
Nice numbers! I also recently got a 2010 auto. Any chance i can see how your tune is setup please? I'm also in pa in the amish country. I see you're in pa and from your other vids visited the pagoda
Appreciate it! Unfortunately I won’t share my ZZP tune from this video.
If you’re looking to tune I’d recommend reading the hp tuners forums - there’s an entire subsection on the Ecotec! Plenty of knowledgeable people there to help you get started, but they’re not gonna share their tunes - just provide insight on what to adjust. Do your research, see what works and adjust what doesn’t. If you’re not comfortable doing that, then I recommend you pay someone to do it. There’s a reason why I paid ZZP for a base and Fonse to adjust on his dyno.
I wanna swap my 97 saturn sc2 with a supercharged ecotec. What do you think?
Go for it!
What are all the bolt ones done to it?
LDK engine
Wiseco 86mm pistons
ZZP 4340 connecting rods
ARP Stud Kit
Opel injectors
LT1 Fuel Pump
ZZP LDK stage 2 Cams
Supertech 94# dual springs and retainers
ATI Super Damper
TTR intake manifold
Custom made high flow air intake
ZZP intercooler and charge pipes
TTR engine mount
TTR trans mounts
14.5” Brembo front brakes w/ stainless lines
BorgWarner s257sxe turbo
Halmman Pro Manual Boost Controller
Tial 50mm BOV
Tial 44mm MVR Wastegate
MAF relocate to lower charge pipe
3 bar map sensors
Custom 3” exhaust setup w/ Borla ProXS muffler and intercooled tip
TTR rear sway bar
B&M Transcooler
2 Mishimoto Catch Cans
JMF Vacuum Distribution Block
After this video and a test n tune with, car is now tuned by James Rakes to improve performance
What zzp bolt ons did you put. Im thinking of going through them for my stuff on my ion redline
00:41 mark has the performance mod list, but here's a list of just the bolt ons:
Opel Injectors
ATI Super Damper
TTR Intake Manifold
LT1 Fuel Pump
Custom made air intake
ZZP Intercooler and charge pipes
TiAL 50MM BOV
TiAL MVR Wastegate
ZZP 3" downpipe
TTR Engine Mount
TTR trans mounts
3 bar map sensors
MAF relocated to lower charge pipe
TTR rear sway bar
Love those halo headlights. Where did you find them
They're custom built using parts from the Retrofit Source
I like the exhaust I have the HAHN full race
Nice! This was made using a ZZP downpipe, 3” tubing from true bendz, and a borla muffler/intercooled tip. czcams.com/video/qcMb-gAjO3A/video.html
👍
It's the lnf turbo upgrade or the s257 that comes alone?
Basically the LNF turbo upgrade kit, but with a MVR actuator. Also FBO, opels, ATI dampter, etc.
by your math my truck has 20-25hp more then it's stock factory rating. my truck stock an many just like it dyno at 310-315 whp stock. your math means my truck doesn't have 395 hp it has 415-420 hp. I like it lol but it's wrong. good rule of thumb is 16% powertrain loss if it's fwd 20% if it's rwd unless it's mid engine then it's around 16% also. the difference is your car only has about 404-405 hp not 450 hp bud.
Did you install the stage 2 cam also? That's my next bolt on and wanted to know gains
Sure did! Appreciate you checking out the vid
Cams aren't bolt on buddy
let me know when you make it to the track ..id love to see this vs #jukebait
Hopefully soon - waiting for the local tracks to open up AND nice weather!
Whats your mpg? V8 horsepower with half the displacement in a 4 cyl do you still get 4 cyl mpg?
I am getting 25 mpg in my wifes 2008 saturn vue with a 2.4l ecotec n/a
Not really sure nor am I concerned about MPG - this isn’t a daily.
Lol 25% drivetrain loss what is it running a power glide with a Ford 9 inch ? Get realistic it's a FWD car with a small efficient transmission 10-15% loss max. I know in your head you want a big hp number but it's all bench racing at that point . It put down 350whp or whatever it was and that's the end of the story . Still a pretty strong running car .
Close - a 4t45e brick from GM. Appreciate the kind words, and hopefully we’re back at it this season!
Stock up on them automatic transmissions
Sorry, but a 20 year old lq4 with a small cam and headers on a proper tune and the correct supporting mods (injectors, fuel pump, etc.) would lay down right around 400 to the wheels on in a Silverado through a much bigger trans and rear axle (read: larger power train losses).
Additionally, more efficient is also a dead nuts lie. Your AFRs would tell you that right off that bat. Your AFRs reflect you BSFC, which will be more efficient NA than boosted every single time.
I love the ecotec and the LSJs and LNFs, but they ain't no LS. Boosted with all that work you did, you'd get freight trained by a 6.0 with a small cam and headers in a car that weighs 500lbs more.
Impressive numbers, I'd love to replicate them. But it still doesn't even compete with a gen 2 LT1, let alone a 6.0 LS.
And add 1 more to the you ain't got no 25% drivetrain loss. My 6 speed T56 rwd Gen 4 Camaro only loses a out 15% through the driver train, I'd give that HHR the same losses if Auto and 12% if Manual. Remember, the higher the horsepower at the crank the lower the percentage loss through the drive train (although the actual lost power does still increase).
The commentary on this video is why riders have a bad name. Name brand tuners are spewing utter crap on an otherwise very impressive result. Ugh.
What are you using to tune? Like software and ecm
HPTuners with the stock ECM
@SuprSl0 this was the answer I have scoured the the web for for two days. Cool. Im doing a saturn aura. 2.4 six spd auto. Wanna go as cheap as possible, winter beater project.
how do you like the automatic in this car? I'm trying to decide between auto and stick.
I don't mind it. A lot of enthusiast are switching to stick since you can push the trans a bit more. I like the auto since 1) still can cruise with the family and the wife can drive it if she wants 2) Auto is ideal for drag racing and 3) One of the original HHR owners who frequently drag raced his car was auto and had no issues.
This car is starting to pop up more frequently - keep an eye out, take your time, and you'll find the right one!
@@SuprSl0 from what i hear these autos are pretty durable. im in the market for one and see that most are auto, the one i drove wasn't impressive but i know that can be changed easily in the tune. I have an ion redline with i stick that i like, but this isnt quite the same type of car. decisions, decisions. thanks for response
They are durable for sure. If you go on some of the HHR SS owner Facebook pages you’ll hear otherwise - lot of people blew up their trans, but again some post doing 100 ft burnouts so...yeah.
3 bar map sensors and the GM stage 1 tune really wakes the car up. Very easy to do, and I’m sure that GM stage 1 tune is on the hp tuners forums.
There’s also a fellow enthusiast, Shane Hatfield, who does a wicked trans tune. I have it, and Ed Walls (who is killing the autocross game) has it. We’re both autos.
Good luck with your search!
Supr_Sl0 Yeah I’m iffy on the auto I’ve owned 3 of these cars and two autos. I was stock turbo, long block, and trans with just the e47 tune from zzp made 297 hp on the dyno. After one year on the strip with slicks it was done. Dint use the stall or slicks and you’ll be fine. I think I killed it because I didn’t use a trans cooler. Installing one assp
Seems like they're dickn around you should have hit 400 off the bat if not more. I have the same vehicle in silver a 2010
First time ever on a dyno - definitely a learning experience for sure
10-15% not 25 for fwd
What ECU did you use to tune?
The OEM that came with the car - tuning with HPTuners
I love this video....I need to get more hp out of my malibu which has the same engine
Thanks for checking out the vid! What year is your malibu?
Did you have a bigger cam
It has ZZP’s stage 2 LHU cams
@@SuprSl0 yes
I've got what you have but not a stock cam. Never dumped mine but seeing your SS gives me an idea what I've got
Is that the 2.4?
2.0 turbo - now LDK
Seems like a waste of money kool car but it’s making essentially the same power as my fully bolt on LSJ ion redline supercharged but it sounds great.
How much did the build cost you
Probably adds up to my right kidney and a 20% off Khol's coupon.
Cost of the mods total??
Probably adds up to my right kidney and a 20% off Khol's coupon.
What year ??? Is it auto?
It’s a 2010 auto
Zoom zoom parts
Could use a few more...
Thanks for checking out the vid!
330whp?? people are doing more than that stock turbo. my cobalt is super similar, except i’ve got a zfr7163 and i made 430 whp. find yourself a new tuner man, that’s things capable of doing double what it’s making now
trent judy is the best in the buisness, guarantee he can get you over 600whp. and that setup can handle well over 600whp, zzp has one at 900whp
Totally did. Be sure to check out the other videos on the channel to see the progress.
What injectors and fuel pump are you using? You should be making more than that at 22 PSI..... on an s257 you should be making more steam than that... and why only run it out to 22 PSI? Turn that bich up
Opels and LT1 fuel pump. You're absolutely right, we should have turned up much more.
Appreciate you checking out the vid!
I hate when people start trying to say that it’s XXX number to the crank. What really matters is how much you can put to the wheels. And dude saying the 450 HP is the same as a 6.0 with cams AND headers, no just stop dude. Stfu you’re drunk
You dont know what your doing at all on that dyne
You should reach out to Fonse performance and let him know.
You need water meth
Not a fan of zzp
I have nothing but love for ZZP - sorry to hear you're not a fan.