Understanding the fascinating Supreme Court order & debate among judges on Sabarimala | ep 316
Vložit
- čas přidán 24. 08. 2024
- Correction: At 5:17, it's outside instead of otuside. Error is regretted.
The SC in a 3-2 order referred the Sabarimala review petitions to a 7-Judge bench, and listed for it 7 questions with great bearing on the future of secular India. But the two dissenting judges make a persuasive case too. @ShekharGupta with episode 316 of #CutTheClutter
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Connect with ThePrint
» Subscribe to ThePrint : bit.ly/Subscrib...
» Like us on Facebook: / theprintindia
» Tweet us on Twitter: / theprintindia
» Follow us on Instagram: / theprintindia
» Find us on LinkedIn : / theprint
» Subscribe to ThePrint on Telegram: t.me/ThePrintI...
We count on good people to pay for good journalism. Please subscribe to ThePrint here: theprint.in/subscribe/ This includes the link for subscription from overseas too.
hence a uniform civil code!One ring to rule them all!
Amen
How will uniform civicode rule this? Do you even get what civil means?
@@Abhi-tb5ww that "civil" in UCC doesn't mean it won't regulate social behaviour. It's a civil code vs criminal code with IPC for criminal acts.
Neil the word is civil .....
Wonderful analysis. No one should dictate to Swami Ayyapan. Justice Indu Malhotra is sensible. Activists who have no attacment to the deity or Sabarimala just want to prove a point.
@@reconquistahinduism346
Nehru is great culprit he had harmed India more than britishers.
Today govt fighting for what nehru legacy.
Starting fm art 370, UCC, fundamental rt, problem for neigbouring country, economics and rattu totta children, brain washed indians and so on, modernity with biased version imposed upon us.
Today even indian r happy with wrong fact but it should b included in syllabus
Indu malhotra said the culture needs to be protected...had those Been protected she wouldn't be allowed to go out her home let alone be judge...
Aravind KN that is not what Justice Indu Malhotra said. You need to read her judgement.
Idiot, you didn't listen to what Shekhar Gupta explained about the judgement ?
@@naveensharma6882 hey!!why blame Nehru for this....??
My Point:: Either leave interfering into religious believes or Make each and every religion Rational by interfering their believes.
2nd one coz all religions are getting way too out of control😂😂😂
Both ways are wrong.
Tomorrow people will start coming to your house and sleep next to your women and when you complain they will put a petition in court that your showing discrimination that your women are not treating all men equal and court try to make your belief rational and let everyone interfere in your family and sleep with your women. you can enjoy your madness better when served to you.
The people who complain are not devotees of Ayyappa. they don't belong to that faith but want to demolish it for their vested interests.Understand there is a border on how much you can interfere and on what accounts. if you don't follow tradition put by the god who asked you to pray that god?
there is only one god is a fools claim.There are many gods is the real truth. humanity is one humans are many and differ in many ways. Divinity is one but there are man gods and different in many ways, human dies and born in to a different human being . many Gods also has many avatars and that particular avatar is unique and rituals of devotion may be different and power of that divine is forever.
My intent is not to hurt you but want you understand the threats that Hindus are facing . we all may not take part in the fight against those vested interest evils but least we should show support to those who are fighting against those evil people and show solidarity.
@@siva9941 Absurd point, How can any one sleep without her consent? You know what, In coming years all religions will be almost same.
@@ajitkumarsingh9076 hmm consent.but the point you expressed is opposite to that.you should have consent of god to change his said tradition and enter into his temple .
In coming years all religions will be same ? wow! if pity your ignorance and oversimplification of your understanding of what religion is .by the way who is the god of that same religion?
@ashutosh kumar tradition apni jagah hota hai bhai but every culture evolves. Otherwise if Raja Ram Mohan Roy had followed this argument we would still live in a world where womens' lives ended when their husbands died. Anyways at the end of the day both sides are stupid. One side so hell bent on getting into that temple just to prove a point. And the other side so hell bent on keeping women out instead of focusing on actual spirituality or reflecting on philosophy & texts in the name of "tradition". The day this country's people actually start reading the Gita and other texts is when all this stupidity in the name of hindutva will end.
Just a minor point - Shiroor Math is in Udupi, Karnataka and not Tamil Nadu.
The deity does not 'have to be kept away from fertile women' but the deity as a brahmachari has taken a vow to not have a social association with the age group of 'fertile women' and this wish has to be respected.
If thats the case then why are women of all ages are allowed in ayyapa temple other than sabarimala?
Before election in 2018 supreme court was also thinking thinking that modi govt is gonna go,but that's not the case .Only modi govt has ensured that supereme court is taking it's biased dicision back.
Abe sharam kar three institution never ever question because of their impartiality.
1. SC 2 DEFENCE 3 EC
Give respect to them, man.
All world wants them , jeoulies of them.
Thanks who sacrifice for that
Sharam kar
Jo hy us par garv kar jo nahi usko pa
What about the economy ?
Make a video on JNU, what kind of courses it offers and what contribution it has made for the Nation im recent past. Thanks.
Let me present an answer which is easy to digest for a Bhakth brain.
1) Abhijit Banerjee
2) Nirmala Sitaraman
3) S. Jaishankar
4) Amitabh Kant
5) Jyotindra Nath Dixit
6) Ajit Kumar Seth
7) Prakash Karat
8) Sitaram Yechaury
9) Thomas Isaac
10) Talat Ahmed
11) Amitabh Rajan
12) Palagummi Sainath
13) Abhay Kumar
And the list goes on.
These are people from Politicians to Bureaucrat to Diplomats to Scientists and Professors. They represent a wide spectrum of political ideologies from the so called Right to the so called Left.
If you still need a video to understand the contribution of this great university, I feel sorry for your ignorance and advice you to watch a little less of Zee News and Republic TV. 🙂
@@TheJoseph0123456789 That was very prejudicial of you to term him a "Bhakt", nowhere in his comment has he shown Bhakt tendencies, nowhere in his comment has he expressed any anti JNU sentiments, you just couldn't help yourself after looking at the comment, this was low hanging fruit you just needed to take a bite out of, if you would've taken his comments at face value you could've taught him something, but no, you chose to be a keyboard warrior and slay him, that's what's wrong with Liberals, this holier than thou, look at my masters degree attitude, we need to stop this one-up manship games and educate our fellow citizens not insult them.....!!
@@sunnybarua6028 : Yes. Agreed. I could have avoided being presumptuous (I think that's what you meant ) and could have avoided labelling him as Bhakt. But by your standards, should you be labelling me as a liberal when i have just shared a list of alumni from a university. 🤔
Everybody is a keyboard warrior including you and me. 🙂
@@TheJoseph0123456789 No I meant prejudiced, you don't like Right Wingers, own that shit, don't play dictionary with me, and fuck yes you're liberal, this verbal gymnastics that you're doing won't work, you haven't said anything that says you're a centrist, if it walks like a duck & quacks like a duck, it's a fucking duck, & there's absolutely no need to get one's knickers in a twist after being branded a Liberal, I'm sure one could be called worse........!!
@@sunnybarua6028 A few fucks and ducks don't make a sound argument bro. If you are so convinced that I don't like Right wingers, I could very well argue that you despise Liberals. To paraphrase the enlightened soul who choses to teach others instead of one-up manship, own that shit-you despise liberals.
Never preach something that you can't practise. 🙂
The dissenting judges in Sabrimala are wrong as Hinduism is not a homogeneous religion. Supreme court can't force Hindus to behave in a similar manner when there are different practices and customs. You can't equate Ayappa devotees and Shaivaite devotees. Court has to recognize things for what they are and not push down "all religions and people are equal" to Hindus when they are not.
This is actually a huge verdict. Bigger than ram mandir. Ram mandir was always a title dispute while this case will change the face of india and bring back the lost glory.
Swamiye Sharanam Aiyappa 🙏🙏
Seems Constitution's several clauses contradict each other which leaves a lot open to individual interpretation
this ambiguity allows lawyers to interpret clauses to benefit their clients and make a lot of money. indian constitution is a lawyer's paradise.
Written by lawyers for lawyers , vauge by design to allow for flexibility to based on the times.
100crore population, if everyone comes, mujhe bhi kuch karna hai. What a hell India will become.
Shekhar, please put out the capitalist perspective on subsidized education
@@goggrom1545 Countries you are talking about which have subsidised education also have the income tax to the tune of about 50% also they don't have a population of 1.3 billion so everything in indian context will differ from countries you are trying to compare with.
He didn't have guts
@@Prynksngh also it is the governments that are subsidizing not the institutions..except in minority colleges...and not rest of the students...
Hardworking students and their parents who subsidize the so called poor students who instead of trying to complete their education as soon as possible and try to get job and give back to the society and their family would rather just continue mooching on the hardwork of others doing multiple phd's or deliberately failing to continue enjoying the freebies..
@@reconquistahinduism346 says an upper caste hindu ..haha
@@goggrom1545 well that is one way to look at it too :D
Sir have always seen u in a kurta, the shirt suits you well too !!
He looks smart..! Somehow i dunno how, but he looks very intelligent. Indeed, he actually is but looks support him.
@@reconquistahinduism346 it happens, he's no God. By this method u cant watch anything. Predictions can go wrong. But thing is all other CTC are worth it
@@reconquistahinduism346 go to sleep. You are a blind religious douchebag. Especially if you vote BJP just for the religion.
Gootley
Sir, if Muslim men can have up to 4 wives why Muslim women not allowed to have up to 4 husbands ? Is it not a violation of right to equality ?
Legal restrictions of women began only with a court order in 1991. Before that it depended on the influence of the devotee.
Exactly, the entry should be on the discretion of the devotee itself and it becomes complicated when the civil law is not able encompass all the nooks and crannies of India and hence it's been referred to a 7 judge bench
The word Hindu should be clearly defined. It is an umbrella term referring to Indians who practice Indian culture and ethos that was born and evolved in India before Abrahamic religions too over India.
@Edmund there are many cultures in India. That's why I said "people practicing cultures that are evolved in India (geographic boundary).
@Edmund islam says there were 124 thousand "teachers from adam to mohammed...so i think the hindu gods were teachers of the divine supreme being...
Kudos, Mr Gupta for an excellent analysis! You have rightly said that it is the nature of manifestation of the Deity in the temple at Sabarimala as a Naishtik brahmachari that has led to this restriction on women of menstruating age entering the temple . Girls below 10 years of age and women above 50 years are allowed. At all other Ayyappa temples in India, women are freely allowed. Only this temple has the restriction in accordance with the legends associated with the Deity here.It is not gender discrimination as the leftist illiberal lobby is crying hoarse.
Once a devotee undertakes the pilgrimage and wears the Tulsimala, he is expected to observe austerities like shunning non vegetarian food and sex, leading a simple and pious life etc,The women in his household also live in accordance with the austerities required-- in other words, a sattvik life.
The devotee wears black and, grows a beard etc signifying his status, he will pray at Ayyappa temple daily if possible, he will generally not eat outside food etc and other ladies also give due respect and behave appropriately with Ayyappans( as they are now called ). When persons sacrifice things that are dear to them , albeit for limited time - maximum 41 days - for having a darshan of Lord Ayyappa at this shrine, it fortifies their belief in the Deity , who is himself a brahmachari and is believed to be very powerful and grants the wishes of devotees.
It is this compact between Deity and Devotee , reinforced by the austerities( particularly brahmacharya), that the symbolism of menstruating age women visiting the temple , weakens. Do the Khamkhwahs have the right to destroy an age old tradition? Should the SC plunge enthusiastically into this venture ( as some judges seem to be itching to do ), cheered on by ' Liberal' fundamentalists ,when millions of Hindu women who believe in Lord Ayyappa, have no problem?
No active harm to women, health or public morality is caused After all they are free to go to any other Ayyappa temple at any time, except when menstruating, which is the case for all temples all over India. There is a concerted manufacturing of a sense of deprivation of women's rights by the leftist lobby who are not believers at all.
The devotees who undertake this pilgrimage do constitute a denomination, though for a limited period, bound as they are by common practices and observances, quite distinct from practices elsewhere and at other times. Is there any bar on a limited period differentiation?
It's was relief when you said Ayyappan devotees unlike NDTV, Wire, Scroll, Huffington Post which referred them as Sabarimala protestors. Such poor choice of journalism. It ranks prejudice against the truth. Thanks for balanced viewed.
Shekhar Sir .Cut The Clutter Is Becoming New Syllabi For Nation Aspiring Beaurcrats Diplomats Cops An For New Politicians.
This is a very interesting debate which will have everybody taking extreme sides. Its emotional too, because, if Sabarimala is to be taken along with other (Muslim) cases of equality, the harbingers of Hinduism will have a difficult point to contest. Can we leave women from visiting temples and then suggest that Muslim women should be treated equally under the law?
This is totally stupid, state and the SC should stay out of the Religions.... Otherwise it's not really secularism, is it? 😑😑
yes, that's what happens in usa. but then state should also stop funding/supporting religions pilgrimages/practices. People won't like that.
@@ajsujit people would love it, especially when the government gives up the control over Hindu temples.
@@PseudoProphet but what about Hajj subsidy and other pilgrimages? And aren't religious institutions already autonomous? They are run by trusts. What more control do they want?
Taxpayer money shouldn't be spent on religion.
@@ajsujit nope they're not, government takes the money away from countless temples around the country.
@@PseudoProphet I need to learn more. I thought they were exempt from taxes.
When you are referring to any articles or old videos please mention the links in the description.
This episode must get included in grow the clutter....I didnt get much of it
If a faith violates basic humanity like gender equality, as it happens in Christianity and Islam, the faith must be challenged. But does Sabarimala violate gender equality? Are there other Ayappan temples that allow all genders? The answer is yes. Are there temples and festivals that restrict or even bar participation or entry of men? The answer is again yes. But why? Because such temples or festivals invoke some feminine aspects not conducive for biological males. So, is respecting biological differences gender inequality? If yes, then men should be allowed to use women's toilet and vice versa.
In my opinion, Sabarimala case was not correctly argued. Let us consider a few things :
1. There are temples where feminine dimensions are invoked. In such temples entry of biological males is restricted. Males are not supposed to enter the sanctum of Bhairavi Temples.
2. Aghama of Sabarimala is said to be not conducive for women of reproductive age. However, such ill effects depend upon several factors including the physical state (like time of menstrual cycle), length of exposure to such Aghamas and so on. So, although not conducive, still one can argue that women can still enter.
3. However, the most important point that was omitted during argument in SC was the aim of building this temple. There are 6 Ayappan temples and only the Ayappan temple of Sabarimala restricts entry of women of reproductive age. Here the deity is a Naistika Brahmachari (eternal Brahmachari). Ayappan does not care about women. Then why is the house rule restricting entry of women of reproductive age? It is because Ayappan teaches his devotees Brahmacharya. Men are under powerful control of male hormones. Our forefathers knew that it is extremely powerful as it ensures continuum of the species. However, for a good society, a good control over male hormones is also needed. That allows men to experience the subtle. So, through 41 days of rituals, the men practice a better control over sex hormones and Ayappan wants it to be without any distraction. It is to be appreciated here that all men don't possess equal control over sexuality, but Sabarimala tries to help all. So, the house rule is there to allow men that space for their own enhancement as well as for a better society. So, this is not about gender discrimination as 99% of the temples allow both genders while 1% of the temples restrict either the entry of men or women in accordance with specific purposes.
4. Menstruation is not the issue as we all recognize that we are born because our mothers have / had menstrual cycles. So, menstruation is worshipped in Kamakhya temple of Assam. Hindus do not shun from recognizing that we have a body and that body has biological needs. But we also understand that it should be at the periphery and should not be our front end. That makes the difference between human and other animals. we search for deeper dimensions of life. That is why in many temples the outside walls have erotic sculptures. You see and acknowledge it as a peripheral issue and rise beyond it and enter the temple to search for deeper dimensions. That is why, there are no erotic sculptures inside.
The court verdict is a reversal of earlier verdict!!!
initially it was 4-1 verdict in favour women's entry. Now it is 3-2 in favour of reviewing the earlier verdict in favour women's entry. This time it went beyond that to include practices by other religions.
Religion and faith is a private matter and should not be part of court work to interpret in different ways based on each judges outlook. In ayodhya judgement court had made a remark that the court should keep away from matter of faith and religion.Tommorrow court may have to sit (for decades) to ascertain God is a reality or myth. Each judge has his own view and the case can go on forever. A western educated judge try to interpret according to western concept and create more confusion without thinking their verdicts impact on millions of devoutees and local factors. Also interpretation of law is subjective and inconclusive leading to more reviews at the expense of tax payers money.
For information there are temples where men cannot enter. Also almost all ayyappa temple allow both men and women. In sabarimala, the case is different because the form of deity. Why waste time when lakhs of other serious matter are pending with court.
Also there a hidden agenda to built an airport in the forest land, adjacent to sabarimala, belonging to government but illegally occupied by Christian missionary, who wants the airport for their religious convenience; to make airport vaiable you need to have more ayyappa devoutees; hence allow women devoutee entry to temple and increase the air traffic. Somethings have crooked motives and need to look into and judge carefully
You are right. Acres and acres of forest land has caught the eyes of businessmen, missionaries who want to destroy the forest and make mo ey out of it.
at last one issue that matter to south india is decluttered 🙌
Anybody who brings disrepute or tries to bring disrepute to the supreme court either from inside or outside should be tried for treason. As the Apex court is one of the institution of India which is unsullied and universally trusted. Also cheers to BR Ambedkar, his wisdom is far-reaching and it will take many more generations to fully understand his work. He is one of the rishis of Bharat.
Sir.... I don’t envy the SC judges jobs, love our country..... as u said it’s fascinating
rafal big issue ....only spoke couple of minutes ....why ..... khangressi chacha bura maan jaenge na...haha
I think differentiating between immoral and privacy of faith is a greater challenge. On the one hand, there are many religious practices which are a private affair of every community but at the same time, they also need to see those practices are not allowing immoral or illegal acts. If allowing or banning of a certain gender or age group has any particular reason than it's better there should be a dialogue and discussion from the respective experts. In the case of Hindu worship places, in general, no outright ban is practised but there certain exceptional cases which require discussion. Court orders may not be the ultimate resolve since this is a domain of faith a private practice in an exceptional scenario which may not be classified as totally immoral.
Article 25(b) and Article 14 is ensuring discrimination based caste, religion not about gender.
Shiroor mutt is in Udipi, Karnataka not in Tamil Nadu... Equality subject to respecting individual personal liberty is always of prime priority against anything including religion...
Wow Shekhar Gupta had to really work so hard on Sabarimala issue and talk so excessively to find his 30 seconds to give a passing mention to Rafale judgement....and he also looked so gloomy to discuss Rafale issue because Rahul Gandhi and his cronies got a boot !!
I had a doubt , if they had a dissenting view in the Sabarimala review petition , doesn't constitutionality of triple talaq come into question , not that i personally support any practise. But if that law comes into question wouldn't the same locus standi come into the equation?
My understanding is that triple talak , meaning talak pronounced thrice at once is not recognised in quran or hadiths. So, even Islamic countries don't have this practice. Islam being book based, it was straight forward to over rule triple talak. This in no way deprives the right to talak following the laid process which logically mandates period between each talak to explore possibility of reconciliation.
Moreover, marriage and divorce in modern view falls under civil and not religious rights, no matter it is referred in religious texts.
As such triple talak is not comparable with Sabarimala facts, because sabarimala is about one of the myriads of diverse worship practices and matter of faith.
@@ganeshav2768 hi Ganesh , thanks for taking the time out to reply to my comment, much appreciated. But then i somewhere feel it can also be regressive, as in take for example, if sati was prevalent now , or female genital mutilation which is prevalent now, would that be okie to be sanctioned under locus standi or saying that prevailing religious beliefs support it. My fear being it might lead to something like blasphemy law in Pakistan , which is horrendous but is readily accepted by the people there.
My point not being about religion but about beliefs across religions , which are not based in logic , so how can we entrust those beliefs to be absolute. There is a reason public morality isn't a good thing which is why our justice system has banned the jury model which is present in u.s, due to the personal bias and non objectivity towards facts which can make it look like a kangaroo court. Public morality isn't a norm for a reason and i feel it has served us well till now.
Highly recommended for the upsc aspirants.....😊😊
They are better off at RSTV
Why hindu temple control by secular govt art 26 say temple should control by devotee.
One factual error. Shiroor mutt is not in Tamil Nadu. It is one among Asta mutt's of Udupi.
Three faces Ravan had as he grew up: : 1) spiritual attainment till he got absolute spirituality , 2) penance till he got to be a god like powers 3) Arrogance of power. What if I worship one of three, who is supreme court to determine my beliefs? Same with Swamy Ayyappa a celibate god of Sabarimala. It's my nonviolent faith which is curtailed.
A mountain out of a mole hill has been made out of an ordinary revision petition , and referred to a 6 bench Constitutional Bench ! Pure Escapism .
Have a question in 2024...was the sabrimala case(along with other similar cases) reviewed by a larger SC bench and what was the outcome?
ThePrint, since Sekhar Sir is referring to Episode 208 in the video above, you can very well add a link to that episode in the description. Makes it easier for newbies here like me to find it and also ThePrint gets more views somewhat.
I'm an atheist but i felt bad as young girl that I'm not allowed in Sabarimala. Women don't go around seducing deities. We've enough dignity to not do that.
The relationship between man and god has always been on a one to one basis. When a man is on a sinking ship, his prayer is Lord, God save me. He doesn't say; leader or holy man of my religion, pray to our God to save me.
It has been my observance that to most of our revered holy men and leaders in all religion, it is more a business and the control they have over people .
SC should allow women to enter everywhere, public in nature, be it temple or mosque.
If i dont agree with you i would not force you to accept me i would only prove that you are making a mistake... Anything else is untenable
@@i0am0fast I respect your view but i don't agree.
True devotee won't go in sabrimala but if someone wants to prove their case i don't think the deity will have any problem.
@hello world thats why, in my first comment I had written, anywhere, public in nature.
I just realized, Anupam kher can anyday pass as you : )
Until he opens his mouth. Kher can't pass such learned opinions!
@@discoguru8363 Han mera matlab just looks se tha
Supreme court should also include the case of Naagaa Sadhus walking naked in kumbh mela. They should not be allowed to walk naked in public.
Religion needs devotees, not devotees needing religion...
They did not reverse the order. They have just decided to review it!
Reverse the order in thr sense that, it will be handed over to a larger bench of judges
Agree with your view in Rafale that, SC was Right in distancing himself when it was an ongoing 'executive process' and why to interfere, otherwise they sarcastically call it as 'judicial activism'.😜
But if SC genuinely not wanted to interfere, they would have kept this case pending till the " Executive Process" gets complete.
Why SC was in hurry "BEFORE ELECTIONS" to give BJP a clean chit, when process was Still going on.
Does temple come under definition of state under article 12?
Article 14 says that state cannot discriminate any one based on their sex, religion . ........
I don't understand how a "temple" which is not funded by govt comes under definition of state.
As a matter of fact it shouldn't but the executive through legislation has controlled the major part of administration and finances. The matter of faith/belief of Ayypan devotees has been codified under the statute, court merely struck down the clauses in the law it deemed archaic.
Sadly, judicial mortality cannot be equivalent and substitute to Dharmic morality.
Very good analysis 👌 Thanks.
It would be very helpful if you could provide link to Judgements/Articles/Links so that people can read in detail
I dont believe anyone on Sabarimala case other than Sai Deepak .. I dont think anyone has done some much of research like him
Supreme Court of India is rightly India's Dharma Chakra. These are very important questions which are being discussed, which impact humanity, very far reaching.
Matter of disputes should be closed after the highest court of the country is has given its ruling. Media should only explain the implication to inform the public. Criticism of Supreme court judgement in media or in public should be considered contempt of court.
On a serious, since Hindu Gods are a manifestation of human attributes and hence more than 10 million Gods under the vedic system. Shouldn't temples be allowed to represent different facets of the deity. For example theirs a Hanuman Mandir in Maharashtra where women are not allowed into the inner sanctum of the temple, this is just a representaiton of the fact that Lord Hanuam is a brahmachari and not a discremination against women.
Apparently the court hasnt cut the clutter yet ! Its simple keep religious practises' controls which are not disturbing the general masses , with the religious heads or community think tanks.
There is a story in which Ayappa says, the year no newcomer goes to Ayappa Temple, that year Ayappa will marry Malikapuram. To pacify believers we should explore this option.
actually the verdict is showing the confusion only .
I personally think that Court can not change the denomination of a deity. If lord Ayappa is brahmachari, then menstruating women should not go there. And if a people does not believe in the denomination of deity then how he/she can be devotee of that deity? If some women do not believe in brahmacharya of lord Ayappa then how she can be Ayappa devotee? I am raising only questions as I am a Bengali Hindu, so know nothing about lord Ayappa.
We indians waste a lot of time on unnecessary and useless things. A waste of energy , time and resources. This amounts to an inefficient society. Unless this ends, and you people leave it , we will always be divided and ruled.
Mr. Gupta,
Being a seasoned and a senior journalist, it was a crime for you not to have mentioned about the sting Rahul Gandhi got in the Rafale verdict. Rafael verdict found just a minutes'mention as it didn't go on your expected lines.
Imagine how you people would have gone overboard had it gone against the government.
I have been watching your programme on a regular basis. My request and expectation from your ilk like you is to maintain neutrality.
A court never pronounces on natural justice(in the Biblical sense), let alone morality. It's business is only legality and confined to and constrained by legality alone. People are often disillusioned of it's deliberations,because we expect too much. It sometimes stick its neck out to interpret fine points of constitution, but that too is done within the precepts of legal framework. The honourable judges do not derive their wisdom from Manu Samhita bt from the law books.How often one hears things like,- a case dismissed on technical grounds ?
The only lens you need and the only lens that's missing is individual rights. If a private religious body wants to be bigoted then it has that right. Women don't have the right to go to a temple if that owner doesn't want it even if the owner is a misogynist.
That's what rights mean. Of course, enlightened people should boycott the temple. But if you really are enlightened you shouldn't be religious and instead go by reason.
In this country, the government is forcing to open Puri temple to non Hindus. But no non Parsi can enter agiary. Would J Nariman throw open agiary to non Parsis.
Temples are not public places, but the abodes of Deity and all hindus firmly rooted in culture instinctively understand and respect the rules of each temple. Sabarimala traditionally has not prohibited other religions or castes. Infact, all of the devotees are treated equally. In religious matters hindus don't discriminate by gender. Infact there are exclusive worship rituals where men can't take part. Likewise, there are rituals where girl child and married ladies are offered pooja too to invoke divine blessings. The problem with hindus not rooted to culture and educated per western norms, which most of our judges and academics are , is they have no knowledge or perspective of hindu religious practices, nor the humility to understand and learn before giving their views. The fundamental right to religion in our constitution has unique importance to our country where religion is woven into people's lives for millennia.
Its not about making relegion rational but truly equal
clarification from Parsi woman - the right of Parsi women married to non Parsis to enter and offer worship at agyaris and atash behrams as well as the right to be placed in the tower of silence after death
Do you guys keep an archive?
U mean to say secularism is ment for all except one community.
It is unjust
rights should be equal to all whether minority, majority except when it disturb social order.
Court has to take drastic step all r equal, no more gender bias whether it s mosque or mandir, no more sacrifices, no more religious teaching upto the age of 18, all religion r equal no minority or majority religion.
After this we will call ourself s a true secular otherwise all will compare with other religion practises and file court csse and same to be check with RTE act
Dear Shekar. This is not Shabri mala but SABARI MALAI. Mala means garland, malai means hill. Sabari malai means Sabari, the Lord Aiyappa’s hill abode. When you pronounce foreign names you take great pains to pronounce correctly even adding “Hope I am pronouncing correctly “” why can’t u do the same while pronouncing South Indian names??
When Govt jobs state SC/ ST n such & put a age limit on published jobs isnt that discrinination & against the Constitution?
Konsi duniya ki English h Bhai.. Aur kya age limit publish krayega
Please read the constitution... Or its bare act...
Nehruvian brainwashed
@Shekhar Sir...Please make a video on decluttering Naxal Problem in India like the one u made on Naga Problem....
India needs a Uniform Civil Code.
One Nation One Law, no Hindu Law No Muslim.
How was the reading on a judgment of the Gandhi family Chor hai???
Good explanation..but I must say, the same SC has failed to convince many of us with its judgement on Ayodhya and Rafale. Still as a citizen, we have to agree .
Regarding Rafael SC gave no clarity on Justice Joseph what he said about Rafael and what needs to be done by CBI as follow up. SC judges cannot ignore what has been said by the other judge even if they are not in majority and specially so if the majority judges are not commenting anything on previous direction by the fellow judge on the bench. Your comments are in a very limited context of Rafael judgement and justifies Anil bhai as the beneficiary and you may have taken stand not to question the govt. God speed India.
Aiyyapans or people following sabarimala may not be separate section of the religion but the tradition of sabarimala itself is different in nature. Applying gender perspective here will be totally flawed. Moreover judiciary cannot interfere in religion.
प्रिय शेखर सर, कृपया कट द क्लटर हिंदी में भी अधिक से अधिक किया करें। ताकि में अपने मित्र गणों को भी आपका हिंदी कट द क्लटर फारवर्ड कर सकूं।
I am free to practice my religion,and so are you.But,keep it in your mind and your house,not out in the streets.That is demeaning your religion.
"Busy body" is a condescending and derogatory word for "concerned citizen". By that dumbing down convoluted concept all journalists as indeed all the commentators, from"my dear sir" to ÿours truly" in this rubrick are busybody. What about the concept of vox populi (also known as vox deo) in a free country ?
Hindi is a election planning not a religion while SC st Buddhist sikh jain are not Hindus according to sanathan drama while obc are back ward class
I agree with you with respect to Rafale
Best show for in depth analysis...
Disappointed that you couldn't have s separate declutter for Pappu Liar
Honesty and shekhar gupta?
denomination is different from Sampradhaya
what do you think about sabarimala
Essential religious practice test itself shows the colonial nature of our system where we are using tests which were formed from colonial & Abrahamic perspectives for dealing with Indian people's diverse practices. There is a need to accept the different core claims of religions to look at their nature & acknowledge the indigenous nature of Indic religions by equating Indic practices {Indigenous & religious} we have already harmed flattened the surface which was once filled with regional diverse practices & now saviors of religion are using this identity crisis to gain support among masses.
Be like Indian kings, most of them used to patronage all sides Sramanas as well as Brahmins but used to keep final authority of being the judge. No matter what kind of law one creates it will always end up hypocritical.
The practices of any religion should be challengeable by every individual if they show enough understanding of source material i.e. from beliefs & religions it is emanating from & can prove that the practice is socially harmful e.g. Loudspeaker usage in religious programs.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So basically all judges agreed that Hindus should only be seen as a monolith & their regional diversities need not be acknowledged. If this is the case then why people who oppose 'Shuddi' or Hindu conversion by right wing only blame them of ending the Indian diversity as they are equally to be blamed for it by this logic & it makes them hypocritical.
If we are talking about 'equality' then lets define everything that it entails because life is always unequal for every one including those who keep saying everyone is equal & by doing that they not only miss the diversities but also overlook the 'Anektavaad' or multiple perspective view as well as keep creating new blind spots regarding human lives in the name of equality.
As i have already explained 'Essential practice test' itself comes from Abrahamic perspective & thus new ways must be devised to deal with regional harmful practices but this old test needs to be either updated or replaced with a test that takes into considerations Indic beliefs & their arguments. For e.g. Raja Ram Mohan Roy used hindu religious scriptures to argued for ban of Sati so rather than moving out of conservative belief he argued & subverted the consensus by using supposedly conservative sources of inquiry.
I am not asking people to go back to past when i am asking them to engage with Indic traditions, for e.g. Here is how Raja Ram presented his case against Sati by using Hindu texts -
www.indiaofthepast.org/contribute-memories/read-contributions/major-events-pre-1950/346-the-argument-against-sati
The premise of the Sabrimala case is simply wrong and it should be thrown out by the court on account of it's stupidity.
If a person is not devotee then why do they want to enter the temple? Just to mark their territory like a wild animal?
And if they are a devotee then it's a given that they would respect the wishes of the deity and would enter only according to the temple rules.
It's a clear case of wanting to cause trouble and harm to the Hindu community.
No decluttering done,lot of words spent,it didn't clear the air,like in my opinion,the present Sabarimala verdict,last year also when the chief justice was going to retire,a day or two before the judgement came, coincidentally madala also began, giving the executive hell of time,some review petitions filed,but that's is also have no clarity in this verdict, it has made the situation more intriguing, whether the earlier verdict stands,or is it stayed,or whether it will be decided along with other contentious issues,and the mandala is starting, BJP and congress has already declared they are going to make hell fire, precisely the executive is put in a conundrum, look at other verdicts, ayodhya very clear, Rafael very clear, contempt case against Rahul Gandhi very clear, one fails to understand the logic,may due to my legal ignorance,but you also didn't declutter it,unweaved it
SG wearing a shirt today
If constitution can't protect dharma then change it,,,,
Any harm to lord ayappas celibacy and all of kerala will burn.....
how is this keralas fault? this whining women wanting to enter that temple ...this poison pill came from bjp minds
So many sexes 😂
i thnk its 'sects' !
Reconquista: Hinduism bhai who do you think controls major temples in shirdi, siddhivinayak, etc
Reconquista: Hinduism there’s a lot of stupid shit going on in our country but NO ONE hates hindus. There may be disagreement and conflict but this self pity has to stop.
Been a fan of this show since episode 1 and your analysis really is impactful and engaging. Thanks a lot.
Sheakher not in kurta
Is rehana Fathima Hindu?
Nah, she is 'kattar' leftist.
Media will be conveniently silent on such matters
@@balajidasappajigovindaraju8486 I'm talking about constitutional definition of hindus
Anyway get out of that ancient definition,sindh & sindhu both r in Pakistan & Pakistan is constitutionally islamic state
Though her name is Muslims, the Muslim clerics rejected her as a Muslim. If you just check her videos on you tube, u will know that her only faith is Sex and perversion
She is the friend(not sure what kind) of Bineesh kodiyeri, the son of communist minister Kodiyeri Balakrishnan. That y she was the first who was pushed by communists to go to Shabarimala, but in vain
👍👍🙏
If the deity is incapable of protecting himself from females, how can he protect the scores of his devotees, Sir?
Yes ur right, if god afraid of women than why not namaz, why not POP, calipha etc.
Be secular be inclusive include all.
Why sacrifices, why praising by prayer, why roza, varta, circumcision.
Be modern
May be bcoz of change of clothes
5:16 spelling of outside is wrong
Thanks
@@amritpalsingh3293 Yes. Always . ;-)