TheMainManSWE is Wrong About Nina
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- čas přidán 7. 09. 2024
- Opinions on the internet? Hot damn.
Mainman's videos:
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Nina Okizeme video:
• Tekken 7 Nina Okizeme ...
Original "Stop Nina Spam" video
• Video
If I'm missing something lemme know.
Songs used:
Monday Mitten Masher Remix by Urbanboy732:
• Somebody's Gettin' F#c...
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/ @biggsby8368
K.K Slider - Cruisin:
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Hey TMM fans! Just wanted to say thanks for stopping by, but please be nice to each other in the comments. I don't care if it's directed at me, but try to avoid toxicity towards each other.
One question, why is he being harmful to the fightning community.
@@ignitron2710 He perpetuates a bad mindset towards new players drawn into his fan-base by labeling certain characters as cheap and unfair. This is not a winning or sportsman (esportsman?) like attitude and shouldn't be condoned.
Upvoted for the honest attempt at keeping the comments clean, but I can't help like your video was practically designed to rile people up, especially fans of TMM.
I mean, you can't all, but outright call TMM AND HIS FANS "filthy casuals", "scrubs", and so on and then be surprised if people in the comments are notably upset with how unnecessarily aggressive you came off regarding a pretty non-important issue all things considered.
That being said, did you watch TMM's reply to your video? I'm curious to know what your thoughts are on his response.
@@A_Bad_Person a character that's super effective at low mid rank but really underperforming at high levels is a cheap character. Katarina is a good example.
@@A_Bad_Person also he mentioned on stream that they need to lower the "cheapness" of Nina (her simple but highly effective on low/mid ranks rushdown gameplay) but make it more effective at high level. if they find a way to do that. I guarantee you Nina will be more acceptable in the community.
The moment he tried to compare Nina 3,4 with Bryan's taunt jet upper i knew he had no idea of what he was talking about
tbh his entire vid is just hastily generalizing every point tmm makes
for example at 0:34 tmm says nina has easy moves that are hard to counter. bminus retorts that every character has stuff like that. not really a counterargument
" i am not trying to flame main man " then proceeds to talk in a passive aggressive manner about how dumb he think's his logic is . and the only like he gave in the comment section is to " here comes the mainman fanbois " yeah you totally argue like an adult sir
Is that sarcasm i smell 😋
@@YfanTheNial I only smell the truth
He did tho lmao how did he not argue like an adult you're mainman fanboy
@@sinfulSeif yup, i must be, no shadow of a doubt
@@thekintheb621 he talked in this manner because main man started doing so and he wasn't passive agressive it's just his logic is very dumb and he has the right to mock it like I have to right to do so with you :)
Deadass missed the whole point.
"Harmful for the FGC"
*proceeds to attack, belittle and insult a group of players for 10 minutes in the most demeaning manner possible*
Next video you make should focus on having a solid point instead of basing your entire video on trying to discredit someone you clearly don't like
You're the harmful aspect of the FGC. 99% of what you said was uneducated, incredibly biased and in no way helpful in fanning the fires of a healthy discussion
"If you don't like that kind of design, don't play FG"
While that is true he didn't have to say that... I feel like there is a nicer way but now it feels like he is the one being harmful to the community.
@@datfacepriceless3442 gatekeeping is harmful to every community. Especially when nobodys decide to take the role on themselves.
@@Kenlac92 so why is everyone here gatekeeping who can give opinions? yall are hypocrites.
*Calls ppl scrub*
Also him: We shouldn't encourage ppl to talk down players bodying them
Lololololol
"Main man is harmful because he gives new players mindset about cheapness and difficulty" while simultaneously calling people scrubs
RIDICULOUSLY EASY TO COUNTER
He was talking about his argument .
Lmao
I see the TMM's point is flying way over your head.
Maybe he doesnt have head at all, means no brain. Thats why he made this video
6:06 "Because Nina does it in a super telegraphed string that almost nobody uses after, like, red ranks, it somehow bad game design?"
Man, they spam that shit on TGP like there is no tomorrow and they often don't even care much that you can react to them lmao. I'm not saying that it's bad design, I'm saying they use it after red ranks just fine.
Also, I think the point TMM was making in his videos is that Nina isn't hard and not that it is bad game design.
And tekken players thought mishima mains were elitist crybabies...
Only scrubs think that.
That 'harmful to the community' claim is baaaaaaad juju. Speaks volumes about this channel.
Well, this channel has gone nowhere since. Sooo....yeah! Bad juju indeed my friend.
0:45 "Yeah sure they're easy to do but difficult to deal with when applied correctly".
With Nina it's not like with other characters.
With Nina you don't have to apply them "correctly" you just rotate these strings:
u/f+4,3,4; d+4,1; d+4,1,d/b cancel into spam; d+2,3; d+3,4,3; d+3,2; f+1+2; u/f+2,1; d/f+3,4,4; d/f+3,4,3+4; 1,2,SS~1~f+1; d/f+1,2,SS~1~f+1 randomly after you blocked a minus on block move, and if it hit, you continue to rotate them(you just do it braindead randomly, no need to think at all). And unless your opponent knows exactly how to counter them, it's very easy to play. Most people don't know how to counter it, so it's very easy to play Nina on all levels but highest ones. And if you see that opponent trained some of your braindead strings like d/f+3,4,4 and reacts to your last hit, you stop using that specific version of that string and you switch to another version of it, in this case d/f+3,4,3+4. Oh, did he train it long enough so he can react to both of these d/f+3,4,4 and d/f+3,4,3+4? Just switch to any other of 8 versions of strings from d/f+3 lmao.
And TMM demonstrates all this very nicely here on this stream: www.twitch.tv/videos/428692094
It isn't the case with most chars(they can't just randomly rotate bullshit and win), there are exceptions like Hwoarang and Asuka, but I don't consider them hard in any way on all levels but highest either.
Unless you labbed the fuck out of chars like Asuka, Hwoarang and Nina, you're done. Just done. And it takes a few working days to lab and train needed strings to a level at which you can react to them and are able to properly act on it in matches: duck, sidestep, whatever. And don't give me "it's the same for every character" bullshit. I played Hwoarang and labbed the fuck out of both Asuka and Nina. It takes 3 times less time to lab someone like Kazuya and it's much-much easier to punish Kazuya. No, I don't play Kazuya, I play Dragunov. No, I'm not TMM sub neither on CZcams nor Twitch, I just show Kazuya as an example. And I'm not his fanboy, he just clearly demonstrated how easy Nina is by picking her up and destroying people in high ranks.
More ppl should see this comment
The god has spoken
Sure, let's talk about those strings.
D/F+3 Follows are all high. Duck and punish. You can notice this mid-match. There is no mixup there, ducking and punishing is fundamental Tekken.
Same with D+2, 3.
F1+2,U/F2,1 are unsafe, do nothing and you're golden.
The animations look nothing alike, so you should be good.
D+4,1 can be low crushed, low parried, or duck and punished. Strangely enough, D4, 1 Cancel is -13. Big window to interrupt, if you dont want to r isk anything, just dick punch any time you see d4, then you don't have to deal with anything.
You don't have to lab DF/3 to notice everything she does afterwards is high.
The other strings are decent strings, but I'll further elaborate in my next video.
Although, why do you need to lab Asuka? What? To chicken?
@@A_Bad_Person"D/F+3 Follows are all high. Duck and punish. You can notice this mid-match."
No, you cannot notice it mid match unless they spam that one string with no variations or unless you trained it for many hours. These D/F+3 strings have 10+ variations and to be able to react to them in time(when there are 100 other strings Nina has) in a match, you have to be playing on a level closer to the professional level you see on these streams. Very small amount of people(less than 1% of players) do that.
And as I said previously, if as a Nina player you notice that a player properly reacts to one of your spammy strings, like d/f+3, you just stop using it and you use others, and sometimes, very rarely, you throw this one out to keep them trying to react to it and make them focus on it when you spam every other string you have.
There is no effort in switching spam.
@@A_Bad_Person "Same with D+2, 3."
No, you need to train this one, too. You won't react to it in matches unless you trained it in practice mode. It's the same for her whole movelist.
And until you do that, anyone can pick Nina like TMM did and rotate strings, and you'll lose to them.
Yikes, you say that string is very reactable and show us by countering it in practice. I guess you're just a god, huh?
@marqy Jr Keep in mind the first string connected entirely.. It was only after the first one hit that the AK reacted with the proper defense.
@marqy Jr Someone else countered it and who knows if mainman was spamming it or not. I'm talking about the guy claiming that it's easy.
@marqy Jr TMM was trolling with Nina lol. he doesn't care about his Nina rank he was literally just spamming it over and over again as a joke - do you really think a Tekken God Prime player would do that 'seriously.'
Also keep in mind he was an EXTREMELY high rank with Nina despite playing like that as well.
@Paalaxus B dude... he was in Rujin rank with Nina and used the same high low string 4 or 5 times in a row despite being low parried four times. He's clearly taking the piss. He literally even says "I'm trolling" in the full video, but okay.
@Paalaxus B yep I would say everyone has done that at least once lol, he's human. I mean people RQ all the time in LoL and Dota. But to be fair that was during his TTT2 days, he's much less salty now. seems like you've got it out for him
All this nice editing for nothin 🤦🏾♂️
Clearly don’t know what the hell ur talking about.
Not related, but its funny how he is liking the comments that dont argue with him... "like minded subs"
Unfortunately, there aren't many counter arguments beyond "You're a moron" "Your rank is too low to have an opinion" "You missed the point". I'm okay with discussion, which is why I'm re-reading comments, but they aren't well constructed for the most part.
@@A_Bad_Person Oh no, there are alot of constructive counter arguments here, you just chose to ignore them.
@@A_Bad_Person just stop being an ignorant bigot
B.Minus bro what?? There is so many counter arguments you either don’t “see” or lost to and stopped replying because they shut you up. Please stop kidding yourself
@@bruhbruh5672 point to one.
Definitly not a bad video overall, but you are so far away of TMM's point. And those free insults are not welcome !
Preach
Stop complaining go lab
@@roshanjurampathy8993 No one is complaining here, go away.
Roshan JURA found the Nina player
you guys are the one far away from this dude's point.
As a casual player i can't agree with you. Nice vid btw but those insults tainted it.
Orange rank "pro": the video
in this video. we pretend mix ups and different string variations dont exist at certain points of the video to disingenuously bend an argument
You didn't pay attention to what he said at all, did you?
B.minus: *looks at full roster* “are these all the same character”
After seeing tmms response video, bro u got completely crushed, really should have thought about ur arguments better
Yeah, I double this
Legit said his points because you didn’t understand his point watch his video again and you might understand
Next time, less training mode footage of counters, more actual match counter footage.
I tried, actually. Not many online during my play sessions.
@@A_Bad_Person trash
@@A_Bad_Person boo hoo
@@bludika bruh you really came back after a year just to say that?
@@jacoblorah416 B.Minus dogshit 😭😭
You know what would help support your argument?
Show us clips of you performing counters/parries against Nina in some ranked matches.
Dat Ankle but he won’t 😂😂😂
There aren't many Nina players online while I play. Believe me, I tried. Also, does Mainman having it done to him not support the argument, or did you miss that part?
B.Minus I’m not talking about how he handles it. I’m talking about how you handle it yourself. I mean, if you’re active in the FGC, surely you could find a Nina main to run a set with for the purpose of supporting evidence for an argument.
If the strings aren’t that difficult to see coming, you should be able to deal with them no problem, right?
@@A_Bad_Person Play in asia! :P I see atleast one in a 10-game session
3:50 why are you making fun of this mans knowledge outside of Tekken dude? I don't see how this would help prove your point. He wasn't even blaming the game either, he said it was just saying how fast that move is. Stop putting words into his mouth saying that he's blaming the game for what Nina has.
Through context and implication we can diverge someone's opinion on something. By implying the character is easy to use in low level play, and downplaying the character's overall design at the game's intended level of play, we can say with some degree of certainty that the mainman believes this is something that should be changed, or is at least something that should be looked at in terms of game development.
@@A_Bad_Person First of all, it's sad that you are getting a lot of name-calling and hate even if I disagree with you. Hopefully, you see that TMM also doesn't want this and just wants a proper discussion.
Second of all, here's my opinion on this - TMM does want things happening in low ranks to be considered but it's not to the point where it's toxic and harmful to the Tekken community. I think he has a decent grasp on what makes Tekken beautiful and fun to play and does not want to see that go and that's why he didn't petition for a change for Nina but merely gave his opinion on the difficulty to win with Nina. His message was that when looking at difficulty of winning with a character, you shouldn't just look at how easy/hard it is for pro players to win with the character because that's 0.00001% or less of the player base and does not indicate the day to day reality for the majority of players. He was trying to make as objective a point as he can so that there weren't any conclusions regarding the balance of the game drawn from it.
Now here is the thing, Whether character difficulty should only be based on high-level play or comprehensively considering the entire player base was the main disagreement you guys had but you guys tiptoed around that and hence didn't really get anywhere while also leading to many people being toxic as bystanders.
It sucks that this was the last video you uploaded but take care of yourself. I know how frustrating it is when you have people attacking you while not listening to anything you have to say.
@@StarShadow9009 The reason Bminus considered TMM's opinion harmful to the community is because he went around and told every "scrub" that it's okay to be bad, and there should be no desire to improve. It is okay to be bad...... as long as you're trying to improve. But now, instead of improving against Nina, every "scrub" here, just blamed the character and forgot about it. Now "Nina Main" is an insult an entire year later, and it's Mainman's subs who did it.
Literally, harmful to the community. Word for word what B minus said.
@@wimblesbimbles8865 well no that's not the conclusion you naturally arrive at imo. When you are playing a fundamental character and you go up against a gimmicky character and lose really badly, yes you are going to feel bad but once you analyze everything you find out that if you get good at the game then your character becomes easier to win with. If that isn't motivation to get better then i don't know what is.
The nina main thing, that's just out of salt dude just ignore it. You and i both know that not all nina mains are braindead but let the salty people let out their frustrations.
@@StarShadow9009 Dude, you assholes bullied this guy off youtube. It doesn't matter what the fuck we know, that's a bullshit thing to do.
i mean:
for one, your rank is really low, somewhere around intermidiate to beginner level but your arguments are really elite level stuff so you probably couldnt even do that shit online against other nina players lol
and 2nd, just so you get the point finnaly, everything is okay-balanced but tekken has different chars and some of them are more noob and cheese friendly where blocking alone is not enough, which makes them harder to beat IN LOWER RANKS than others
I dare you to play my Nina and low parry my can opener if it's ridiculously easy to do it on reaction I'll even count the times it hits and the times you actually parry and well see what the final score is that sounds fair to me
Sure. do you play on steam?
@@Oathkeeperclash just saw this but yes I do what's your steam ill add you, maybe we can get some good games in I'm a little rusty but I play everyone pretty decently imo
challenge still open? lets go.
Dude compared Nina strings to Bryan Jet upper LOL I'm dead!
look dude, i agree with alot of the things you're saying but the issue i have with this video is that you seem to be missing his point entirely, you seem to have the impression that he wants nina changed or nerfed or something like that. all he's saying is that "she has abusable stuff so stop saying she's the hardest character in the game" when you seem to think what he's saying is "nina is too abusable and easy so we need to change her" which nobody is saying
The only reason he's talking about nina and not say hworang even though they're in the same boat (abusable at lower ranks but subpar and hard at higher ranks) is that people have her up on a pedastal as a super hard character which in high ranks and pro-level is completely true but even at lower ranks people talk like she's really hard
his goal is not to change her or the game only peoples opinions and responses surrounding it
Abusable stings lol, you can friggin launch her if you ducked them for a half bar of damage stop whining and go lab her for god sake all her strings have high in them.
@@alimollla7278 Man literally points out that the character is abuseable at lower ranks and you say "go lab", completely missing the point. Either you're a salty Nina fanboy or you're really good at impressions.
@@Weapon0fCho1ce She's a rushdown character that has to be in your face and apply pressure to win complaining that beginners find her strings are impossible to counter will accomplish what exactly ? encourage victim mentality lol
@Orca except she is , if you want to play her effectively ,there is a reason she is not popular despite what people claim about her being cheap and easy and that deep down they know she has a big learning curve if you wanna use her effectively ss1 cancels ,evil mist ,Hayashida step and iws1 combos for wall carry
@@alimollla7278 Well, she's apparently easy and popular enough for you guys to pick her over someone like Lee. Saying a character has difficult moves to learn AT HIGH LEVEL doesn't change how easy the character is to pick up initially.
If you honestly think learning Nina is comparable to learning Lee, Bryan, or any other characters that requires YOU to learn your character more so than the opponent having to learn your character then that right there is the issue.
That's not to say the character should be outright dismissed in terms of execution. She's above average in execution, but stop acting like above average execution means "super hard character". Hell, TMM just made another video showing off how to scrub people out with Lei Wulong.
The keyword here is EXAGGERATION. Nina's learning curve is being exaggerated by Nina mains who must arguably know at this point that something is up with their character to be THIS defensive about it.
I don’t think he’s coming back guys
Ridiculously easy..... Man do you know how many promos ive been denied by just ONE Nina?
I swear you friggin elitists
Sounds like a you problem. Want advice tho?
@@A_Bad_Person first get to genbu, advices later
Drinking game: take a shot everytime this muppet contradicts himself
Either you hangout on twitter too often and are accustomed to arguing for the sake of arguing inside echo chambers without saying anything useful... or you're just plain dense.
I can respect you for at least not taking this down after seeing how bad the ratings are.
This video sounds professional, sadly you touched the wrong topic to cover
You can go ahead and uninstall Tekken now that TMM just hit emperor just by spamming those cheesy strings with Nina lmao
he's at tekken god with her now... xD
still not TGP with kazuya though. LOL
00:35 compares Taunt set ups to Nina’s +1 combos, I’ll be heading out now lmao
Only way I can see this getting settled is a first to 5 B.Minus(Kazuya) V Mainman(Nina) just to see the results of the knowledge of your own characters. 50/50s V Telegraphed mix ups
Exactly what I was thinking
"harmful to the FGC" yet you bash his community and him so are you any different? Man instead of seeking attention just do you its 2019 bro... its the internet... If someones opinions hurts you that bad then why are you on the internet? You clearly are a youtuber so you've had criticism before, I'm sure people have bashed your opinions, don't seek attention this way you make yourself known other ways man.. But this aint it g
I never claimed to be better than anyone. Just stated an opinion and took shots, it's what I felt like doing.
@@A_Bad_Person I'm not saying you said you was better but in reality man I can understand certain things but its just a video game character no reason to take it to extreme through a video
Good example of "do your research" kids
Bro, you have so much shit wrong in this video. Law has one junkyard, can be delayed. But that's it. Nina has 4 different junkyards with different ways to respond to each one with the ability to cancel some of them. Don't compare that shit to Leo 124, it's a measly 12 dmg and +3 on hit??? Like, that's worlds apart in defense to reward ratio. Mortal Kombat scrubs aren't welcome here, kid.
I cant help but notice that the first clip with AK and can opener proves Swe's point. The armor king did not do it on reaction or he would've parried the first one. He recognized it coming a SECOND time and reacted accordingly. As a Raijin..
Another point you make is about hellsweep. Yes. Total scrub killer just like can opener. But the difference is people for the most part have a general idea what to do against it. Whether they figure to step left(probably not) or just keep the pressure on(probably). If you're a low level kazuya, now you're left trying to figure it out. Pressuring someone isnt a "super specific counter". But reacting to the first hit to low parry the second or step the last is definitely a super specific counter. Thus making it way harder to counter. I can continue breaking down your points if youd like me to point out to you where all of your other faults are. You shouldve made this video from an objective view instead of a butthurt nina player view. It's okay to be butthurt. Happens to all of us. But dont let it dictate your arguments.
just keep playing nina man
This video whiffed and got Launch Punished.
B.Minus You're just wrong on so many levels it's unreal, and worst of all you're doing it in such a shady, dishonest way. Pretending you're a wholesome positive part of the community, while creating a video that somewhat aggressively attacks and insults TMM and his fan base. All while missing the point over and over, AND using contradictory arguments. You really need to get a grasp on logical thinking before you start trying to make fun of other players' opinions, especially when he seems to know a hell of a lot more than you do. Also going back on your vid statement, again implying you didn't mean to call TMM and his fans 'scrubs' (although technically by what you said you are kinda admitting you implied it), despite very blatantly doing so, so just grow a spine and own the fact that you did, don't be pathetic pretending you didn't.
All TMM was saying is that Nina has some combos which are very difficult for a a lot of players (low to mid tier players) to play against, as they allow easy pressure with a lot of variation while requiring very specific defence. THAT'S IT. NOT "No other character has cheap moves" or "Nina is so OP she's broken overall", just that one simple statement. You went off on tangents against these imagined arguments, and on the couple of times you were trying to argue against his actual point you failed by making a contradiction. If something is "ridiculously easy" to counter, that means you don't have to be a decent player to do it. So to later go on to say that Nina is easily countered by good players is a contradiction to that point. If you don't understand that a combo with high-low mix up, positive frame advantage on block, and that requires you to parry or sidestep counter midway through, is difficult to counter, then you're just simply an elitist who's totally out of touch with the average player experience and has no concept of game design.
If you do make another video, I hope it's an apology, for being so toxic (the only actual harmful thing here), accepting and taking on board what people are saying is so wrong with this. Anything else will just be a further embarrassment at this point.
You completely missed the whole point from the start of the video.
Clearly you did too. Because he didn't miss the point.
5:55
Nice Videos and there are some quite good arguments too, but you honestly gonna tell me that green ranks can‘t punish hellsweeps properly but expect those beginners to lowparry can opener on reaction and sidestep lunch some fast strings ..?
Damn everybody just doggin him in the comments
I mean he's trying to troll he deserves it
@@1KQ_ How so? I made a video about something I thought would spark interest. I find it interesting, and so does mainman.
@@A_Bad_Person You're a joke looking for attention.
@@1KQ_ That's just, like, your opinion man.
@@A_Bad_Person Yes, the right opinion
"Easy to counter" - "Telegraph" - "Compares mishimas/bryan with a simple string" - "Not actual player match counter play" wat
Bet this dude never even landed a PEWGFS
It took you 9 minutes to basically say "git gud, scrub".
As someone still new to playing T7 (still getting carried by Katirina), I couldn't tell you how hard or easy a character is, but what I can say is that I shouldn't be able to scrub people out with Kat and have a harder time winning with Asuka, a character I've played since T5. T7, like many other fighters, has an issue with character difficultly versus player reward.
Using BlazBlue as an example since I'm an anime player, Nine was one of the best characters in that game, but she was also easy as hell to play to the point I knew Orange Square Nine's that couldn't even block because they never needed to know how. There were other good characters like Arakune, Valk, etc., but those characters were actually difficult to learn as well as being strong. They weren't just mindless scrub killers that also happened to be ridiculously good.
TMM's overall point about Nina and any other character similar to her is that the opponent needs to do way more work just to stop you from spamming annoying ass strings all day. You say we shouldn't balance the game around low-level play because we'll get shit like SF5AE and I can say as an anime player that we're experiencing weaker games like BBTag for the sole purpose of making the games "accessible".
However, that's TMM's point right there. It isn't necessarily that Nina is overpowered or even particularly good. Similar to Noctis and even Lucky Chloe who, if I remember, is considered one of the worst characters in the game along with Gigas who was my first pick in T7 and has really easy combos and high damage, but bad overall tools, is that Nina's strings are so ri-goddamn-diculous at low to mid level play that Nina players can just get carried through the game, but unless you wanna be yet another dirty ass Nina player yourself, you need to do a lot of work just to beat her which is doable, but what is the Nina doing that's so hard?
Again, since I play Kat, I get to spam kicks all day and not even really know how the game works, but my opponents need to know all these counters while I just press buttons all day. That's not something you can do with Lee or even Bryan. Nina, Chloe, Kat...people who may very well be bad players can hide behind these characters that allow them to do things that other characters have to work way harder to achieve.
Now, that's not to say all Nina players are scrubs or anything. If anything, this Nina debate makes me more interested in trying to character out myself just to see how easy or hard she really is. I played Mai, Celica, Susanoo, Ragna, and a bunch of other easy mode characters in BBCF, but I also learned how to play Rachel, Carl, and Valk at an intermediate level which is why these gaps in difficulty between characters is so obvious to me and it really bugs me how people like yourself wanna down play this.
Like, considering the way you kinda passive-aggressively gab at TMM in this video, I'd wager part of the reason you even made this video is because you don't like being called out for maining a "scrubby" character. People would bitch about my Mai all the time in BBCF, but I didn't go around creating a narrative that she was actually technical just because she had SOME difficult stuff you don't even need to do against 90% of players.
The point I'm trying to make here is that more and more fighting games crank out these characters, regardless of quality, that essentially just carry people through game, especially online and to label a character that I think TMM has pretty effectively proven falls into this category as one of the hardest characters in the game and to have the audacity to just say he sucks at the game and that's the only reason he's pointing this out....is Lucky Chloe one of the hardest characters in the game too? I mean she sure is one of the worst ones so it must really take skill to beat people with Chloe, Gigas, and Kat because when you look at them at high level play, those characters pale in comparison to the likes of Kazuya and Bryan.
Sorry, my dude, but if anyone's opinion on fighting games is "harmful" here, it's the guy trying to justify why I should be able to scrub people out using stupid characters in a game I don't even play...
Sodium Overdrive This is completely unrelated, but what platform do you play Tekken/BlazBlue on? PS4?
@@somaoni8806 I play BBCF on PS3, but I have T7, BBTag, DBFZ, SC6, DOA6, and SF5 on PS4.
Sodium Overdrive Oh that’s cool! Would you like to play T7 sometime? I also play on PS4.
@@somaoni8806 I guess that's fine. I'm just not currently active online as much due to personal stuff but, it doesn't mean I'll never be on again. You can watch my DoA stream for my PSN name.
Sodium Overdrive Cool, I’ll add you, it’s the same as this for when you get on.
dude, dafuq are you talking about ? Ninas strings are as hard as taunt jet upper ??? dont be so pissed just because somebody is calling your character easy. Nina is an easy and cheap character. fact
Why are so defensive on Nina’s behalf? This video is so embarrassing.
TMM just reached emperor rank with nina by winning 89 games spamming 2 strings and is currently at a 68.4% winrate *(AS HIGH AS NOCTIS)* . How have you not deleted this video
As far as normal moves go, hellsweep is more complicated than any string in the game. Hellsweep requires a more complicated execution than simple strings that most characters rely on to begin pressure, including nina.
Hellsweep is easy as hell🤣
...Can opener is telegraphed...?
You're joking right? PLEASE tell me you're joking...I REALLY hope you're joking...
Easy to do "featuring taunt jet upper"
Easier to do "featuring law 124 into d13"
OH BOY I SEE WHERE THIS IS GOING
meh, the saddest thing is, TMM really wanted to argue with you in a fair way. And unfortunately, he brought a lot of attention to your channel. Yet, you take every possible opportunity to insult him / his fans all the time.
Im sorry, but have a dislike and I will ensure never to watch your content again.
k
I knew you'd say that about Kazuya. It's not a must for you to sidestep and block Kazuya mixup. If he does a second wavedash every time, they eat a counter hit. And how fast the second or third wavedash is highly technical and requires great execution if you don't want to get punished for using a -10 on block high launcher because you missed one frame while trying to "mix" your opponent up with 7 different motion inputs. Strings is not the same as wave pressure! Period.
Every character is cheesy, even Lee. Pointless argument smh.
I would agree. Though judging by the comments, I'd say the argument is far from pointless.
Every character has the same amount of cheese? What are you smoking?
@@Fluttershy763 it's a matter of who you face frequently online.
I face Paul, Bryan, Nina, King, Hwoarang quite frequently, so I adapt to the match up quickly even with different opponents.
Now let's take Bob for example, I face him once in a blue moon, he has multiple strings, hellsweeps etc. If the Bob player is decent than I would most likely loose.
I understand that I'm at a disadvantage as soon as I see the VS screen and I've to play extra careful.
If I loose than I've to accept the fact that I've not faced enough Bob's online to make counter strategy.
Now imagine if I send a friend request to this Bob player and scream at him that he's a scrub and he's using a cheesy no brain character and insult him.
Does that make any sense? May be the other guy just likes Bob like how I like my own character. Just because I don't have the enough match up knowledgeable doesn't mean I've to insult his character choice.
I also agree every char has some degree of knowledge u MUST have. But does it vary? Yes. Simply put labing against that bob is going to be significantly easier then labing against a geese due to the fact that geese has more strings, better mix ups and better pressure. Yes ultimatly u have to play thr game to win but lets not act like all characters tools are made equal. Does that make geese player a scrub? No but we can all agree that you must have high level MU knowledge not to get abused. Vs bob not so much he has fewer strings with less(waaaaay less) safer options also nina imo is still top 5 in difficulty tho but i ain't gone act like I'm not a cheesy guy
@@bridge6605 I just took Bob as an example but as you said some characters are just better at doing certain things.
Like the Mishima's all have overall better punishment and better frames.
5:22. It is not one move that requires a high level of defense. It is a plethora of strings! Yes, Strings! You can chose not to finish, most with good recovery, or cancels. But Nina players never need to learn their mixups since they just loss quit you all the time. "oh he sidestepped my string and launch punished me. He must've labbed the shit out of Nina, I should quit while I'm ahead." while in contrast, all other character need you to think whether finishing my ONE junkyard is s good idea or not. There's nothing to compare when Nina players use have enough strings to pick from AND still have tools to not get punished and play safe.
Lmao you really thought you did something with this vid. Imagine being an orange rank and lecturing a 10+ year tekken vet on game mechanics LUL.
I dream of a community that doesn't care about character difficulty and just plays a character because they, you know, like them
The issue with this, though, is that the justification for the existence of some moves and how good they are is their execution and difficulty of use. EWGF is arguably the best whiff punisher in the game, but it has a right to be since it comes out of an advanced movement option and requires precise timing. In the heat of battle, this is hard to do, but if you can, it's worth it. If there was a move that had the exact same properties but had the notation of d/f+2, the move would be seen as ridiculous. It's why macro-mishimas are infuriating to play against.
In closing, while I agree with you, I feel we should have more discussion about this kind of thing.
As a Nina main myself I can say that Nina really does have her chessy strings but its the HARDEST to pull the best out of her combos doing fluttering butterfly and such! But her other strings such as can opener or d3,4,3 are safe or plus in block. And they are hard to parry or sidestep. But nice video none the less. But I guess you did kinda miss the point. Lower rank levels don’t possess the skill to block nina’s d3,4,3 or can opener.
"Every character is the same" never lol-ed so much 😀😀
Might want to watch the video again with people who could comprehend, and maybe explain it to you later on and avoid making you look like a "SCRUB" in the end.
I love the editing of this vid! you just have to make sense on what you're saying when some guy makes fun of your character without sounding so butthurt the whole time LMAO
hey man, main man fan here i hope you get a chance to watch main mains reaction to your video is think i does a good amount to clarify his position and points that you bring up. regardless you made some damn good content here in terms of editing and your presentation was also really nice so i gave you a sub. I hope you make more tekken content we need more content creators.
TTM made a response video to this and really elaborates on his argument, whereas your video shows evidence that the Dunning-Kruger effect is in fact real...
TheMainMan has been the most helpful channel for years and will stay so. When u say he is somewhat disincentivizing players by critising the char they play, it only goes to show that u dont seem understand the passion he has cultivated for the game over the past two decades. I only hear TMM tell beginners to start playin charecters who require more execution and get better at the game, Nina is only going to get you so far.
*And for god's sake don't compare Nina's strings with hellsweeps*
Instead of insulting people and only caring your own opinion, you should try to understand their thoughts so you won't make a flawed argument. Doing this would lead you to a conclusion that both sides of the argument could agree or benefit from.
Damn I really wanted to give this video a chance but so many points just fly right past your head.
Imagine thinking it's easy to do bryan wall pressure
Mainman say he hates alisa now to make 3 hr explanation video on how wrong he is on the few seconds he hates on alisa
TMM cracked the code for nina to be easy and nina mains just becoming salty cuz they played her for their whole life and still cant play her right. Cry more please
"Opinions like his are harmful to the fight game community"... A minute later.... " If you don't like this kind of offense then don't play fighting games". That alone did me a bamboozled lol.
How can a single player group be so predictable as to not understand tmms point and getting salty at the same time
This video? It's Not Good. *explosion*
I have a tip on making your points more valid. Instead of countering them in practice mode, do it online with a high ranking Nina main.
Dude, you totally missed the point of what Tmm said about Nina's skill level. You should rewatch his videos about Nina.
Also, try to not be that innecesarily offensive towards people who are new to the game and are trying their best to improve. We all started being scrubs even you.
A Nina main crying, good shit, hope you quit fg, less ninas are less bullshit
It’s easier for you cause your a Nina main. I’m a Paul I’m and I can easily counter death death fist sure, but it’s a bullshit move compared to other players who don’t main Paul and that’s understandable why people hate it.
I don't main Nina. Deathfist isn't a bullshit move, it's unsafe if used recklessly. I think people hate it moreso because of the ragedrive and wallsplat mechanics.
B.Minus wait who is your main then? Cause everyone thinks your a Nina main rn
I'm a Fujin Gigas, give me advice please :)
Lmao I disagree.
this guy sounds like an emotionally damaged Seth Macfarlane
fuckin got 'em
Ok, now keep it down, will ya?
“Opinions like this are bad for the FGC”
179 likes
1,713 dislikes
Nah the only thing that was harmed was your channel especially when you stayed contradicting yourself😭😭😭
TheMainMan‘s made his opinion on many people calling Nina hard, and this guy talks about him crying about game design and balancing. You can really tell this guy just wants to flame TMM, and doesn’t care about his opinions but try’s to hide it with: „It’s not like I want to flame MainMan but...“ and after that proceeding to clearly flame him. He counters by : „But you play Kazuya, and Koreans don’t have a clear way to counter his 50/50.“ So do you say a green rank Kaz could beat someone like Knee with 50/50s?? That argument only talks about high level of Play, infact the absolute pinnacle. And also comparing mains is such a unbelievably childish way of Arguing. „Your clothes are ugly!“. „But your clothes are cheap!“. And why does everyone hate MainMan for Alt F4ing if he doesn’t want to play against a certain character? He Alt F4‘s before the match starts. The are people using autoblock and autothrowbreak that leave right before they lose against knee literally toying with them while their cheating.
The new jake paul but in tekken community
I think the crux was that this guy was going "Oh these strings are easy to counter lol just do this." and MainMan's point was "No they're fucking not, Nina's strings are difficult to counter, most players can't 'just do this'" and he's literally having to state the obvious to make that clear. The Nina main he's reacting to is probably extremely familiar with the character and forgets that most players have no idea about the tech he knows. And yeah I know that's 'just matchup knowledge' but a lot of matchup knowledge can be acquired just by playing against a character enough. The strings the Nina main counters are things you couldn't possibly learn without going out of your way to look up a tutorial, and then labbing it. Usually labbing it alone is good enough, and sometimes that's not even necessary. Point is it's not easy.
I think trying to shut down every single thing MainMan tried to point out didn't really help much to shut down his main point, there was a lot of "Oh yeah but this character has this too." with minimal example or an example that doesn't quite compare. But also some very good points.
Decently structured video you've got though; not bad/10.
HelLSwEeP iS eAsY. Yeah can you imagine if the hellsweep input would be d/b+4,1 or d+4,1 like an actual easy input? Not even comparable to Nina's d+3. Videos like these are *HArmFULL* *tO* *tHE* *CoMuNITy*
Hi, just came to say good quality on the video overall. I personally disagree but good luck!
How can you miss the point this bad. This guy must get WOOSHED 5 times a day.
Nina is an easy character to win with though.
I watched mainman video, his point was basically Nina is easy to win with due to spammable moves and hard to counter for low/mid ranks and hard to use to high rank, that's it
Hey man why don't I win as much as heihachi but with hworang I can spam d34 to beat a green rank aren't they suppose to be the same
He didn't move any goal post in his response, he elaborated on his statements that YOU oversimplified.
Bruh moment