"splitting the bill" discourse & transactional friendships | Internet Analysis
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- čas přidán 5. 07. 2024
- should we just split the bill?? // Check out Parade! yourparade.com/FERG25 & use code FERG25 to get 25% off, sitewide.
PATREON: / tiffanyferg
Full video episodes of Internet Analysis are available to watch/listen on SPOTIFY! Follow the show here: open.spotify.com/show/1lec8eA...
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TIME STAMPS:
0:00 - intro
1:17 - Bria Jones and the girl who owes her $240
3:26 - thanks, Parade!
5:16 - my audience survey results
8:43 - the payback dance
11:01 - shout out to the planners of the friend group!
12:12 - why does the payback dance feel so uncomfortable?
13:35 - Venmo makes friendship feel transactional
15:05 - how money transfer apps affect our friendships
17:55 - is it true that rich people are more stingy?
20:23 - our personal, deeply-rooted issues with money
23:07 - communication is key!!
25:08 - the wealth gap in friendships
26:20 - final thoughts!
RESOURCES & REFERENCES:
Thanks to Venmo, we now all know how cheap our friends are (by Teddy Wayne) - www.nytimes.com/2017/07/21/st...
The subtle, surprising way that payment apps may be affecting your relationships (by Julia Fawal) - ideas.ted.com/the-subtle-surp...
I feel like my friendships are becoming more transactional (by Shivani Dubey) - www.refinery29.com/en-gb/frie...
Pettiness in social exchange - psycnet.apa.org/record/2018-3...
Notes and Queries: "Why are poor people more generous than wealthy people?" - www.theguardian.com/notesandq...
As We Become Richer, Do We Become Stingier? (by Shankar Vedantam) - www.npr.org/2013/09/03/218627...
The wealth gap: how changing fortunes tear close friends apart (by Sirin Kale) - www.theguardian.com/lifeandst...
TIKTOKS:
Bria Jones - www.tiktok.com/@heybriajones?...
mananamariee - / mananamariee
Tiffany Ferguson (she/her), 27 years old. #internetanalysis #splittingthebill #money
Business Inquiries: tiffanyferguson@select.co
This episode was co-written by Sheriden Smith!
Captions / video transcription by: / slowxmoxpanda (She is looking for more caption work, so feel free to reach out to her on Twitter!)
FTC: This video is sponsored by Parade. Links with * are affiliate, meaning I am compensated monetarily if you join or make a purchase. - Krátké a kreslené filmy
should we get separate checks or just split the bill?? IT'S NEVER THAT SIMPLE... enjoy!
I wish we could always go Dutch and have separate bills so we pay the restaurant directly however we want. Unless there's a different previous agreement. Thankfully I live in The Netherlands for the past 6 years 😁
We usually check the prizes on the menu and calculate it beforehand, then add a couple euros if it was nice there. But I'm from Germany and tax is always included in the prize for the meal, so I guess it's easier
Separate checks . I am not sure why people don’t come prepared to pay for themselves
@JaxJenks I also live in Germany, and I've never been to a restaurant that doesn't do separate checks. It's the standard here.
Separate checks unless im with close friends and family. I would not pay for a friend of friend because I can’t trust that they will pay me back. I trust my close friends and family. Whenever I get lunch with my aunt either one of us will just pay the whole bill. But I wouldn’t do that with a stranger aka a friend of a friend.
"dO yOuExPeCt HeR tO PaY yOU tHe NeXt DaY?"
Yes ma'am, yes I do. If she didn't have the money why did she order that food at the restaurant?
I can't believe those ppl were actually attacking her... worms for brains
@@Feliciatanktopthe guy blaming HER and calling HER greedy and stuff for putting her card down literally has room temperature iq
Yup, and from what I remember with the original situation she had reached out and never got a response. Like if it were me yes I'd love it the next day,but bare minimum communicate with me if it's going to take longer! Like as long as I know it's coming I'll be cool with it
Right! When he said all that I was like.... do people not know that restaurants don't do lay-by? You order, eat and pay for the food then and there, what are you talking about
@@rebeccadodd1394 I think he was getting at the fact that if friend of friend paid by credit card, she could pay that balance off over time instead of having to venmo the full amount immediately to bria
It's weird how a big part of the conversation is about: "don't lend your money / how to lend money" but then we don't even touch on the: "don't ORDER 240 dollars worth of food if you can't afford it" problem in the first example.
Honestly, makes me wonder if some people have a conscience.
I can't imagine footing the bill in my financial situation, and I can't even imagine ordering or asking for that much money if I'm not prepared to pay it back. Makes me wonder if they just leave the house expecting to eat for free.
If a friend offered to pay for the meal at no cost I would at least have some restraint because anything over 100 is just evil atp,
@@marzh1073there are literally people who don't clinically so like... no they don't sometimes. Other people are just opportunistic.
The guy who argued that the tiktoker took the girl's ability to pay in installments or earn points was such a clown. If someone needs to pay for their dinner in installments, they clearly couldn't afford it to begin with!
Exactly! Even on a date, I always make sure I have the money to cover what I order, just in case. Or I like to treat others. But I'd NEVER expect someone to pay for an overpriced coffee
@@marzh1073the person wasn't even her friend either, her friend invited her. I think they knew she was going to pay and took advantage, not expecting to pay it back.
I remember one time my ex had me buy him a $200 fragrance at Sephora, so that he could use my discount during a sale. This was very early on in the relationship, and I expected he would pay me back promptly. It took weeks of me pestering him to get the money back, because he allegedly didn't have it at the time of purchase. Why people think it's appropriate to spend money they don't have, at the expense of others, is beyond me. Being financially abused became a theme in that relationship.
That is such a bold move, like I cannot imagine getting someone to buy me a non-necessity that’s $200 and then being like “oh, I don’t have the $200” that’s wild, but a lot of people are like that
@@brittnay279 The irony is that he was living at home rent free, not paying any bills. I on the other hand had an apartment, gas, groceries, student loans, and other adult expenses to pay for. Meanwhile he was blowing all his money on 420, toys, and escorts. I finally left him when I found out about the latter. Happy that I'm now with someome much more responsible and financially compatible.
Yes but this isn't that. She does not know that person amd she knew she had to pay back
I feel this sister
Seconded. If I wanted something but knew I didn’t have the money, I WOULD SAY THAT to the person lending me the money.
Another interesting thing is that for me - Italian - growing up I was always around people with different budgets. And in my friend group it was always a given that if someone said "I can't do both movie and a dinner this week" or "let's go to someone's house rather than out cause I don't have money right now", everyone would just accommodate that person. Because you want to be together and where or doing what isn't necessarily the point. And if someone wanted to try something more expensive they would say it in advance so that people could schedule and save the money for it.
same for me in Brazil! I'm used to my friends giving cheaper suggestions for dinner and drinks whenever someone can't afford to really spend money that month, and I'd hate to be in an environment where people are embarrassed or pressured to hide their financial situation from their friends
The key is communication, never make assumptions and always communicate exactly what you can or can't do based on your own budget.
@lrock48 I agree. But I guess it's also a cultural thing. I've noticed in some places talking about money and what you can afford is more taboo than in others. But it 100% shouldn't be imo
Rule #1, don’t go out if you can’t afford it. Rule #2 pay your friends back promptly and accurately. (Optional) Rule #3 if someone rejects an outing due to rule #1, I’d you able step in to help or suggest a more adorable option.
I do #3 a lot. It’s optional, but I found being generous is a much happier and more satisfying way to live life.
The thing about #3 too is that it is freely given. If someone is dishonest and just doesn’t pay you back, that’s theft and it’s theft that you maybe can’t afford.
@snowwonder9814 See, I agree with you. Except that in my culture in most cases rule #1 would be if someone can't afford it, we - as in everyone in the group - don't go.
And of course there are exceptions, like if someone wants to try a specific restaurant or go to a concert.
But I also feel like Italian friends culture specifically is not so much about doing things or going places as much as it is about being together. Most hangouts happen at someone's house or in a public main square where you just sit over coffee for hours or walk the main street while chatting together. Which I know is also possible because there are public spaces in the first place that allow for free gatherings. I realise in most of the US for example when you go out with friends you're going somewhere to do something. And it has a cost. Which people can be literally priced out of leaving the house to an extent. This is a reality I find difficult to even imagine.
But number 2 and 3 are super important. If we're splitting the bill, we're splitting the money immediately, and if I choose to offer you something, it's a gift.
The fact that people (even people in the comments) are saying Bria is wrong for being upset she didn’t get paid back after 6 WEEKS is concerning lol
IKR 240 DOLLARS is an INSANE amount to just say she is in the wrong. I blame the concept of credit.
Totally agree.
I don't understand how someone can make the choice to order $240 of stuff and then not be prepared to pay it.
Like even if she couldn't pay it all at once, communicate that and pay it back over time.
There’s 1-3 pay periods in that time span so that person could have paid her back. Me personally, i feel weird reminding someone they owe me money so i just eat the cost but $240?!?
But also, you have to be terrible with money if you are ordering $240 worth of food on credit, If I'm broke I wouldn't go out to eat at an expensive restaurant and make a stranger pay for it. @@ispeakewok
They're all the type of people who keep "forgetting" to pay you back.
I always use the bernie "i am once again asking" meme to remind people to pay me back for stuff, it works like a charm and avoids any awkwardness
Hahahaha omg I love that
That’s brilliant!
Literally same lmao
I'd love this because I'm forgetful af so it would be hilarious to me
Ok that’s epic ahahah
Hey Tiffany! A friend of mine told me about this video and the fact that you referenced my transactional friendships article on it and I just wanted to say I'm truly so honoured by the mention! I've never been referenced like this before (to my knowledge) and it genuinely made my day. Your videos are amazing. Thank you again! Hope you have a lovely day
Boost for the academic! Thanks!
Congratulations. It feels great and I am happy for you.
+
Yaaaay! 🎉
@@picahudsoniaunflocked5426 ahhh not a problem at all! thank you for the love :)
My friends and I are pretty loose when it comes to smaller things like a coffee (less than 10 bucks basically), and the expectation is that it’ll balance each other out eventually. I don’t mind paying for my best friend’s coffee or groceries for the dinner we’re cooking together because I know she would do the same. I would personally never put down 240 dollars for someone who’s not even my personal friend, but the disrespect of her then not even sending the money immediately is so embarrassing.
Yes, I’m similar with my friends. Things like drive thrus, where it’s a hassle to split, we’d just take turns covering. No exact tracking and there are a few folks who probably tended to cover a bit less but these things are not worth the “pettiness” described in the video.
Also, seriously, if you like your friends and have the means to, shouldn’t you want to pay for their coffee every now and then? With the petty folks you have to wonder if they even like the people they spend time with!
One college roommate and I had the same go-to order at a place and I’d often pick her up food from it when she was feeling antisocial/lazy and she’d just buy mine the next time we went together. Way easier than venmoing and allowed us to build trust.
Those two people who argued against Bria sound like the exact people you never want to go out with 😂
Yeah way to call out your red flags lol
the guy said "pay in multiple payments" umm what restaurant is accepting klarna?? 😭😭 is this an american thing?
No. If I cover my friends, I expect them to pay me back either the next day or their next pay check.
@@PrettyLittleChanellthat’s more the bank thing than restaurant. If you have the option to pay in installments, the bank guves the whole amount to the entity providing the service, then takes out smaller amounts from your bank account each period of installment, usually plus interest
But the dude was just BSing… If she wanted to use her credit why not offer to pay and have everyone else pay her back? Simple as that.
Because she’s a sneaky thief and assumes others are too, that’s why
This is literally stealing and people are debating it like it’s nothing
yeah but who the hell pays for $240 worth of stuff if they cannot afford to pay it then and there.
I live in Germany and here it is the norm to split the bill and pay only for what you have consumed. it is not awkward or strange and the waiters make it so easy. we also tip separately.
I was searching for this comment cause I was thinking the same
same in korea, and we don't have tip so it's much easier😂 and sometimes one of us just pay for it and say 'you buy next time'
same in the UK, waiter brings the card machine to the table and you tell them what you're paying for. As long as its 0 at the end, they don't mind
Canada has the same culture around tipping as the US, but debit/credit card readers are brought to the table and bills are split based on who ordered what.
The idea of handing over your banking card to someone else to handle would make me so uncomfortable.
Same in the Netherlands! Dutchies are notorious for sending requests for the smallest things 😂
The desi culture part really hit me because I realized that I never ask for Venmo requests whenever I cover the bill. I just think “I like my friends a lot and money isn’t an issue so why don’t I treat my friends”
same lmao. I’m Palestinian and it’s against our norms to do this stuff
i do the same, my family grew up poor and so it’s very nice to be able to go “yes i will pay, no you do not have to pay me back” but i also refuse to let my friends pay for me without arguing with them lmfao
Thats not desi culture. I am desi and i love my friends. You're just rich.
Thank GOD I am Mediterranean, here we fight over the bill and all our friendships are built on mutual debts. If a friend ever pulls out Venmo in front of me and starts keeping tabs of everything, I would be so offended I'm not even kidding..
Yesss!! Like "are you my friend or not?"
Word ima be more like this and like my middle eastern family , ima get my homies food and not expect it back to be honest
Fr, why even bother having friends if you’re going to be that much of a stingy weirdo about it
Yes!!!!
@@enigmatics69Even here in Nigeria too. There was a time my friend was short on cash and I paid for her lunch for a week never asked her to pay me back next time I was in need she did the same for me.
will never forget the one time my friend asked if I wanted something to eat and I said I didn’t have enough money to get something and she said “did I ask if you had money?” was a really funny and sweet moment
THIS!!! My best friend & I are like that. I’m saving up for a car rn and sometime I can’t so I won’t bring it up. Then he’ll hit me with the “I got it” or “no worries”. That being said, i never just rack up anything!! If he gets me when I’m on a rough time you know damn well I’m getting him next time. One of our fave things is going to the movies so if I buy the tickets he’s got the snacks & vice versa. Love him❤
My goal in life is getting to the point of stability in which I can stick to my policy of paying for people if I invite them somewhere. My friends won’t let me, but with a friend in a similar situation to you? Yeah I wanna spend time with you and go out to eat, so just let me treat you, you dork (endearing)
I always say this to my friends ❤ I got it from my parents they always said, “I offered you if you wanted to grab a bite to eat, I didn’t ask if you had money for it”
My best friend and I also always say, “if I’m eating, you eating with me”
My friends are the same! Lmao my male friends practically scold me if I take out my wallet lol. If you're taking others out to eat then you should pay :)) No one stacks up bills on anyone, and its all cool
I say things like this whenever I go out with my sister and younger cousins
I love them so much and it warms my heart whenever their faces light up after realizing they can get that thing they want but their parents never get them because it goes out of their budget
Imagine the feeling when I went to the friend’s apt who owes me $700 having all the name brand skin care and makeup I thought I couldn’t afford.
I broke up with my long term best friend, we were literally like sisters, because they couldn't pay me $300 back but had all these expensive designer cloths. Plus they accidentally said that they pay for their boyfriend's rent, so I realized they lied to me to get the money.
(Possibility) at some point can you not consider that theft? Thats a large ass amount of money*
@@Rosette404that would be a perfectly viable case in small claims court
Pay for their boyfriends rent?! Dude
This! I have experienced this multiple times too!
As someone who grew up in Morocco I always saw adults fight to pay the paycheck, they always applied the " the one that invites pays" as its usually a celebration of an event in the life of the person so they want to treat others, so I found this video and the difference of mentalities and cultures very interesting
yes im pakistani and it's like that too for us aswell! its because we come from very community based cultures. western cultures are very individualistic, they put themselves before other people as they have forgotten the absolute necessity of maintaining relationships in your life for your happiness and wellbeing.
in morocco or pakistan if they see someone alone they will try to include them but in the west they just mock you for it, it honestly sucks. its so hard to make friends in the west but its really easy to talk to someone in our culture because we are so friendly.
we get criticized because we are traditional and ngos are spending millions of dollars for us to take off our hijabs and leave our husbands. but if you ask me the west is a very broken society but they cannot or will not go against the idea of liberalism being the cause of rising mental health issues and suicide rates, that is like blasphemy to them.
As someone that lives in Germany I also think is because people here see each other very rare. So invading people you don't see very often there's a small chance you would see your money.
Same in Brazil
Americans and Canadians are selfish people, what can be said?
@@Muniba.Kashifvery true
When I was in high school there was this one group of girls that would always stick together. Literally every insta post, every party, every coffee date was done together, so apparently they were very close. So when they were planning their sophomore year summer break vacation, most of the group wanted to go to greece, but one of them said her parents couldn't afford it and asked whether they could go somewhere else. Know what they did? The entire group simply WENT WITHOUT HER while she was left to stay home by herself for the entire summer. All super wealthy kids, too who could have easily helped her with the money or at least picked a different destination. I remember how shocked me and my friends were because we couldn't even imagine doing something so inconsiderate to one another. I hear she's distanced herself from those friendships now, so good for her.
But yeah, I feel like the only people who lack empathy in financial situations are the ones who have had the privilege of never experiencing financial hardship themselves.
It probably wasn’t their money to use to help her but their parents. That situation is very hard because you don’t want to change something for one person but also to just leave her😬. Usually these things don’t even get to this stage because in my experience rich people will get sick of your “broke problems” and simply hangout with people who can also afford to do the things they do
I don’t think it’s that weird as long as you aren’t only doing things that exclude them. I’ve had friends we wanted to play video games with who didn’t want to pay $5 for the game. We offered to just buy the game, but he didn’t want to take other ppls’ money.
It's actually smart to tell the waitress/waiter AHEAD OF TIME that you are splitting the bill, so they can just make the separate bills right off the bat.
This is the other thing about dining out in Europe that makes it easier to split the bill, is that you have to ask for it so you can ask them to split it first! Versus in the US they have already prepared the bill and just bring it over, so splitting it is asking them to make the bill for you again essentially
yep!
yes but with large groups it can still be a pain
The POS has you put things on different seats so that 1) someone else can drop off the food and know where it goes (seat 1 is your immediate left and then counter clockwise) and 2) when splitting the check, you just combine seats, "split item between all seats," etc. Some servers put it all on seat 1 and then cause themselves a huge issue later.
Crazy how many people have not worked in a restaurant and assume they haven't figured out this basic stuff. There is a system - if your server can't split the bill without asking who had what, they're just poorly trained. No excuse. Even if they had to look at their pad, ffs, how can you not know.
It makes me crazy as someone who was a server and would never have done this to guests.
@@dirtyprancing5930 I haven't even worked at a restaurant this is normal. I didn't realize so many people were so awkward about it.
I just don’t understand how someone could not immediately pay back their friend, or at least say “I’ll pay u back tomorrow morning” or whatever. I would feel terrible, and I do every time my beautiful friends are like “dw about it” so we’re on a perpetual “treating each other” cycle if we don’t pay for our own things
I actually agree with this. I don’t understand the concept- I would just pay it back that night. If they were able to split the check, they would’ve paid it then, so for what reason do they not pay them back then? My friend group understands that we are all on a budget, lol. So unless it’s discussed before going out that it’s someone’s treat, we fully expect to split the bill, and pay for ourselves, or pay the person fronting the bill that night.
I actually have the opposite problem. Sometimes my friend will pay and I WANT TO PAY and then they insist and don’t LET me pay them because I ask, “Hey, how can I pay you back?” (Because they are always changing banks/accounts and I can’t assume their last payment method will be the same one). But they don’t LET ME pay them back sometimes, but they also won’t say something to release me from feeling like I owe them by saying something like, “It’s my treat!” It’s sooooo annoying!
Agree I send the money straightaway
right!? one time I messed up and had to wait until payday (like 3-4 days) to pay my friend for my $15 meal. I was SO embarrassed and paid them back first thing Friday morning. I can’t imagine waiting WEEKS to pay someone back
It's nice in the general sense but sometimes being the friend that gets gifted something expensive can put them in an awkward position if they don't know how they are going to pay back a large amount..
In high school I went with a group to a restraunt..I didn’t have any money so I didn’t order. I had a friend offer to buy me food over and over and over again. I repeatedly said no I’m fine, but when she continued to insist, I said okay thank you and got some pancakes.
Then after the fact she told me how much I owed her??? Like, don’t offer to pay for me and then expect me to pay back. Also I didn’t have a job and neither did she…was literal parental money and after I didn’t pay her back she literally asked my mom for the money 😂
I have no problem paying someone back or covering for someone, but this was wild
Not exactly restaurant bill-splitting, but I once had a roommate who refused to pay me back for the last 2 months of the electric/water bill and and when I venmo-requested her for it SHE BLOCKED ME ON VENMO! I didn't even know you could do that
People who don’t drink often get totally screwed by “let’s just split it”. Bro, I’m not paying $37 for a burger and a coke.
I think it’s funny that guy friends never have this problem, we are so used to paying for everything in dating, that when it comes to going to dinner with your friends we just pay for ourselves. Lol, feminism & its consequences…
@@dragonkingsports Guys are bums all the time. Look at the top comment
@@dragonkingsports Yeah, so this isn't feminism's fault.
FR!!!! I do drink but not often and at most I'll have 1 or 2, I am not about to pay for Greg's 6th margarita😂
Agreed. Drinks are like 1/2 the bill.
I don’t drink so splitting the bill “evenly” always drives me up a wall. How even it is when I get to pick up the slack on y’all’s 20$ a pop drinking tab.
Same! I also don't eat meat so when they say 'Oh, it'll even out over time" that's never going to be true.
I agree. It's a discount for those that have the habit of spending big while it hurts people who live on a budget. I also don't like to split even. I think everybody should be responsible for what they order.
Same! And it is never the person who only had 1 drink who suggests splitting😂
I am always honest and say I don't feel it is fair to split evenly and people usually understand but just didn't think about it
As someone who only occasionally drinks, I always appreciate the drinkers who noticed that not everyone was drinking & recognized the impact.
@@laulau194 are you me?? I don't drink and don't eat meat, last time my friends wanted to go to a nice tapas bar/restaurant, I went and at the end of the night I was told it was 40€ per person when I didn't eat most of the dishes and didn't drink anything other than water...
I think conversation is so funny because it’s the reason I (along with the whole friend group) stopped associating with one person in particular.
She’s also from a rich family in OC, some of us were on food stamps at the time. We threw a Friendsgiving together, I organized it and suggested we all bring our own dish. Within the same message, I suggested we only split the cost for the meat (since it was the most expensive).Day of, she gets upset that we are not splitting the cost to make each dish. No one said no to it in my initial message, so most of us were on the same page about only splitting cost for the meat. Her argument was that no one ever said yes to splitting, and was upset over having to pay for the two dishes she’s bringing. One of which was her own idea to bring in the first place. 😭😭 She dead ass wanted to split the cost of making a green bean casserole y’all
All in all, she was passive aggressive the entire dinner making it awkward and obvious. She also wanted us to pay her for gas ( driving a Prius no less 💀) when we joined her on target runs. Even though she was the one who asks us to go with her for company. Her logic was “ you ended up getting items and my car helped you get to and from target ” thus we are using her gas. I’ve never had more drama in my entire life than the brief 2 years with her. Rich people are WILD.
Wow-- sounds like a lot of her mental energy was going towards what she's 'owed' rather than just existing in the world. I'm sure maintaining friendships wasn't/isn't her strong suit-- I hope she learns at some point that money isn't everything.
they are the most stingy and its weird
This is why they say not to date outside your tax bracket and same for friends, your experiences are different, you can't hang out most of the time, there's no point to being friends with someone like that.
@@kiraphobia222that's a ridiculous notion, many of my friends are in different tax brackets, it's the most normal thing in more collective societies
green been casserole :-)
When I went to college we discussed this as class discrimination. Because a group of friends wanting to hangout and they only ever go out to expensive restaurants or shopping, this makes it uncomfortable for lower class friends. It is important to learn how to make group events that are free or more affordable. We are only uncomfortable or ashamed to discuss finances with others because its simply capitalist ideology forced upon us.
No. How about you make friends who can afford to and like going to places you can afford and like to go. Just because people go to more expensive places doesn’t make them better people or friends.
Had a "friend" who'd insist on paying the whole bill when we'd go to a cheap place and used to look at me expectedly to get the bill whenever we went to an expensive place saying that she got the bill last time. Refused to acknowledge the flaw in this logic, saying it's okay we're sisters, it's not that deep. Ended up not going places with her anymore.
yea she was playing with you
@jessicah3782 also funny thing she ran around telling other people how "well off" her family was by telling them "anecdotes" about herself which were actually what I'd previously shared with her, she'd just replace my family in the story with hers. Like she actually used to spread stories about herself which weren't hers at all.
@@dimpy3442 she sounds jealous of your life, take this as a lesson for next time (as in, don't be telling people your financial background till they are well vetted and trusted)
@lana-jg4ho you're absolutely right! I had to learn this the hard way. I'm usually very reserved but opened up to her bc we were friends for about 5 years, and she started telling everyone we were "besties"...and I believed her. Now I'm scared to trust anyone again. (She ran a whole smear campaign in my college against me when I broke our friendship, it was this bill paying thing among several other stuff that broke my heart, like her trying to become "besties" with my then boyfriend, sharing my very private mental health struggles with other people behind my back, gaslighting me into thinking that I'm overreacting whenever I confronted her, etc). Now I never talk about myself with anyone.
she knew exactly what she was doing
There's an episode of Friends that I feel like has been so relevant in my life lately. The episode is about Rachel, Pheobe, and Joey feeling annoyed because Monica, Ross, and Chandler keep inviting thr group out to expensive outings that the other 3 can't afford.
I know Friends gets a lot of hate but it touches on that awkward period of life from like 24-30 in a way I don't really see other shows do.
Yes!!! I feel like a lot of the reasons people like to hate on Friends now is bc it’s popular to do lol, but there’s still a lot of love and nostalgia there
I love seinfeld for touching on the period of life after 30 lol. 90s sitcoms just hit the nail on the head sometimes
@@queenlegitimate5015 i guess but Seinfeld is all kinds of problematic so I wouldn't really compare the two
@@kekayowritesI mean I feel like it’s also things like the fact that they only had like two poc in 10 seasons and the, you know, homophobia.
@@amanday3103 absolutely! There are very valid criticisms, and as a queer person of color, I see them and don’t at all discredit them, but it also made me feel very not alone at many points in my life, so I have to find a balance. It’s a very nuanced topic for me.
i feel like with me and my friends being 90% service industry we have a different way of thinking when it comes to this. we actively look up if we can even split the bill beforehand and communicate that before we even sit down. that way at the end you don’t have someone being like “well i only had salad and a water” bc we knew we’d split it evenly. also we have no problem admitting when we’re broke 😂
if your friend only had a salad and water, why do you want them to foot a huge chunk of the bill?
I’m glad for the ability to pay back what I owe instantly bc with the mentality of “I’ll get it next time” I really don’t know if I will be able to get it next time. I’m a student on a tight budget basically living paycheck to paycheck with my bursaries and loans, so it’s more stress inducing to feel like I owe someone a “next time” rather than knowing exactly what I spent and owe
Yeah. When someone's budget is tight, they have to calculate almost by the penny.
Why in earth would u pay $240 for someone?? That's wild. Friends do not do this. $10-20 here and there is ok.
If you’re splitting a hotel room for example
I kept thinking how expensive was this bill she paid if just that girl's share was 240 like wtf
I’ve done it for hotel rooms and concerts but that’s as big as I’ll go.
I’d do that for a close friend’s birthday, but I’m also financially stable
I'm almost 30 years old and this has become way more common in my late 20s than my early 20s, idk
I think the problem is that people are eating out with "friends" that are acquaintances. Friends should be able to talk about money in this aspect. No one should ever order more than they can afford.
I just don't know where it's even confusing - if one person says "hey I'll put my card down to make it easy, y'all just venmo me tonight" it's not rocket science
@@nunyabusiness164what i usually do is just whatever they ordered rounded up then i cover what i ordered and tax/tip or swapped depending on whos got the money for it at the time
Yeah, my friends will e-transfer whoever foots the bill. Sometimes overestimating a little as a gesture
As an American about a decade younger than Tiffany, I would definitely expect everyone to pay their own individual tab if a group went out for a birthday. It’s interesting how fast these things change
I assume everyone is paying separately unless someone generously offers to cover the group - when my parents take me and my boyfriend out, they pay for all of us, etc.
I'm really confused by this comment because I feel like this has more to do with the fact that at your age you probably don't have much disposable income? Like if you were 40 and Tiffany was 50 that would be a different story
@krishnaanand180 I mean I make around the median salary where I live and I would not expect to be covering the birthday person. I'm maybe a couple years younger than Tiffany, but I do live in French Canada so it might be different because here we have the portable payment terminals that do the split payments here automatically. I have legitimately never been to a restaurant where we could not split the bill or have separate checks or split one item and then separate the rest out or whatever. The concept of individual personal debts is also something I only recently learned about people doing.
@@thatcherdonovan7305 sure but what I’m really confused about is a teenager who until recently wasn’t old enough to work trying to compare their lifestyle to adults who might have college degrees or more years of work experience, as if it is a cultural shift.
@@krishnaanand180I’m confused how being older means you aren’t expected to pay for what you ordered?
A very wealthy man once told me that "A person who doesn't pay back the money they owe you simply doesn't respect you"
And it's absolutely true.
That's not true. The research shows multiple attitudes + perspectives. If it seems true to you, fine, but this is an aphorism, not a fact.
That sure sounds like the reasonings of a rich person
Only losers don't think this is true. In all religion, debt is the most important thing you have to resolve before you die, and if you can't your children have to resolve them. Or else you will not end up in a good afterlife or not reincarnated in a good body.
Nowadays people are too cavalier with debts because the financial institution encourage people to be in debts.
I dont understand how you rack up $240 at a restaurant as one person. Did she have 8 premium drinks? Did she get a few extra meals to have as lunch for the next couple days? If the woman who owes the money cant afford to pay her back then how was she originally planning on paying for her meal? I think that as soon as the tiktoker offered to use her card to pay the whole tab the other woman chose to take advantage of it and avoid her to try to never pay her back.
My husband and I went to a very nice steak house where we live and it was only 190 this included wine and a very nice dessert for two people. This is a very famous steak house that isn't cheap what did this lady get to spend this much money on one freaking meal.
In major US cities, it's very possible to rack up $240 on a meal. I'm thinking Top Shelf drinks and/or premium wine 🍷
I once worked for an organization that put on an annual conference. Apparently my predecessor somehow put THOUSANDS of dollars on room service over the course of 5 days, and all of it was food - no alcohol. I legit don't know how she managed it, even at room-service prices.
Simple: She assumed her friend was footing the bill and ordered the most expensive things to take advantage of her "friend"
It's possible that the person who racked up the $240 bill would have used their own credit card to cover it because they didn't actually have any cash in their checking account. So when someone else used their card to pay for the table and (RIGHTFULLY) expected cash to be paid back to them, the $240 person still literally had no cash to send them, so they disappeared 😬
I'm NOT defending that they didn't pay back, but I've seen this happen before. The $240 person shouldn't have come to the dinner at all in the first place; they are clearly living way beyond their means!!
This is a weird issue to me. In Germany it's completly normal that everybody pays for themselves in a restaurant, even if its a date.
Yeah and your hyperindividual society is also struggling socially so...maybe there's a bit of correlation there.
same in finland and i've never even heard of a restaurant here that wouldnt split a groups bill because of a "policy"
@@lowwastehighmelaninwhy so bitter??
I would thrive in Germany 😭
@@lowwastehighmelanin As a foreigner who has spent considerable time in Germany and has a German partner I disagree on that gross exaggeration you've made. Germans on average are actually really easy to socialize with. Additionally, correlation does not equal causation. That's a very stable tenant of science.
As a Canadian I am always shocked when listening to Americans talk about their banking culture. The whole social aspect of a banking app feels like a fever dream to me!
This is wild. With my friend group when we all want to go out to korean bbq and bring ALL of our friends, some of which are very underprivileged, we just all pitch in to cover for them, with no expectation of receiving it back. In the end, we all end up doing so much for each other, we are all guys with different skill sets and we do work for each other for free because we just got each other like that. We’ve also been close friends since we were young so i might just have a rare bond with people that we all know will always be in our lives. We dont do acquaintances, you’re either in the circle or you’re not
Honestly i'm so lucky i've found a group of friends who have a similar policy of split the bill but if you can't come because you're struggling right now, don't worry about it, we got you. I hope that someday we don't have to worry about money every time we go hang out with friends.
Yeah same...ill pay for a friends lunch if it means we get to go have lunch together. Sometimes i think so many people are lonley because they are just awful people and would be terrible to have as a friend
Yes!!! It’s soo nice to have this and I’m so lucky for this too!!! It just feels like suck a sisterhood moment. Idk if I’ve paid more over time or less but I don’t care!!
Did you know you don't have to eat at a Restaurant to hang out with your friends?
Mindbreaking but you should give it a try.
@@CordeliaWagner Did you know that you could not be an ass for no reason on the internet?
Mind breaking, but you should give it a try.
@@CordeliaWagner no shit? what point r u tryna make
I grew up rather wealthy and with wealthy kids, like upper middle class, we all were obsessed with calculating exact amounts owed. I did the same until I was hanging out with kids from lower income families who all trusted each other to cover next time. I kept my internal tab in my head for a year, calculating cents owed, until I came to accept that it was all an investment in friendships. Did I meet people later who take advantage of generosity, yes. However I still think of it as a valuable lesson in understanding how I viewed my relationships to others.
This. We weren't wealthy, but we never had to budget. But it's always been the standard default that you pay for what you order. Sometimes someone would just pay the bill, but it's always done with an expectation that you're not going to get that money back. Most people do try to get the next one, but no one actually score keeps.
I have the same experience
I generally think so too, and depending on the situation I'll say like I pay this time you pay next time or something. but I have this one good friend where like she's kind of aware of this (I would never think she's taking advantage probably just clueless) and I it's either me paying for us both or splitting, so I'm not really willing to do that anymore
Completely understandable, friends are not atms or iou banks afterall. Perhaps discussing the issue of reciprocity in your relationship is possible? Maybe even see if there are other points in your relationship where you give more than they seem to contribute. Even if it isn’t equal is fine, but if there is a major disparity, that’s when something isn’t right. @@saskiakraft
Weird I also grew up upper middle class but I have the opposite experience, most of the people I hung out with were very chill about stuff, we usually split the bill if we didn’t specify beforehand “my treat”, but no one ever did it to the cent, and it was normal to even just all use cash when we were going out somewhere inexpensive.
Also it’s pretty common where I am that servers ask groups of four or so all around the same age if they are splitting the bill to start that way there’s no surprises.
Might be regionally different too, where I am it’s fairly low population density so everyone except the .1 % prep school kids were all in the same school and knew each other and hung out
I’ve seen a comment that says if someone doesn’t pay you what they owe, they simply do not respect you. That is the absolute truth.
I remember waiting 2 months for a friend of mine to pay back the $800 I lent them. I could have forgotten about it and moved on if I didn’t hear that she had always paid back her other friends what she’d owed them.
When I confronted her about it, she gaslit me into thinking I was a bad friend. After she paid me back, I blocked her. So unfortunate but oh well…
In our friend group we have a friend who puts his card down the most, then puts together an excel sheet for say a month or couple weeks of going out. He loves a credit point, we love him and appreciate his effort, so everybody’s happy!
What I’ve gathered from this, as someone who has never been in the situation is that everyone needs to learn to communicate immediately
what’s with people and “unspoken rules” and then getting mad when no one is a mind reader? That phrase is such a cope to me. It takes two seconds to be vocal, yet a majority of these scenarios aren’t. “Hey! I was wondering if I could treat you to a movie today if you’d like to see this with me?” “When we go to dinner, we only pay for what we order” “that’s not something I can afford at the moment, so ill skip out this time. Anything going on after I can participate in?” SO EASY
@@bucky7505People tend to say something & then they don't want to say it again. I've communicated before. I am a dog walker/rehabilitator. I don't make a lot of money as it is. I have a BFA in graphic design & I also have a post-grad science degree in animal management. I am highly skilled with dogs. I am also white passingish, but Māori. My friend is a lot, lot wealthier than I am. She is a nepo baby, she is married to a wealthy man, she is white & she is always paid more than I am. She has more expenses😂 but 😂😂um😂no children😂. I get taken for a ride a bit in terms of our friendship generally despite being so much poorer than her- I give her money for ballet tickets & never get to go, or money back, etc. BUT- I can't actually justify it in regard to the dogs anymore. I love her dogs- I love dogs- but they are a hand-full. The house is a hand-full. The area she lives in is a hand-full to even be in. And she underpays me by so much, if I actually tried to charge her a reasonable rate 😂😂... I really think that if she needs someone again it needs to be someone else- but I will just be busy- which will be true- but normally I make time... anyway. That's the point- people communicate, and then they leave.
Honestly, this lesson applies to almost everything in the current American culture. Just talk about it, people!
I used to be able to handle people’s bill and would usually say “You’ll pay me back later” but I recently noticed is no one ever remembers how much who owes what because we are usually always drinking and sometimes I needed that money back to pay bills so now I really only want to pay for my bill, I don’t like mixing money anymore. This economy.
I just take a pic of the bill and handle it the next morning if we're drinking
@@xuapril32then people have to remember what they got and sometimes that's a problem for them, i only pay for very close friends that i don't mind paying for (meaning I wouldn't be mad if they didn't return me the money)
uunrelated but your eyelashes are gorg
Ukrainian here. Here if you're having a birthday party, you are expected to pay for everything and everyone. Since you are the host, the "man of the house"😂 and the heart of the company. Everything should be as you choose it to be))
That's why it is considered rude to come to a party with empty hands (even if it is not a birthday). Like, the host put so much effort into this evening, you have to show, that you appreciate that 😊
that's so interesting....here in the US, I think it's much more common (unless the birthday girl or boy organized the party) for all the friends to chip in to cover the birthday person's meal
I always feel baffled when I see this bill problem in the US. I didn't even know this was an issue cause where I'm from you pay for what you eat. There are times that someone offers to treat everyone but that gets all cleared up before we even get to the restaurant so that yoy won't get confused if you're paying or not.
Please make a video of how expensive it is to attend people’s weddings and expectations of attending and expenses!
Ooo talk about different expectations of who's paying for what. Bachelorette/bachelor parties, getaway weddings, being a bridesmaid.... sooo many awkward financial situations
The destination wedding that you're in so you like "have to" attend and then also the bachelor/ette parties getting planned as a destination event 🥲 and then on top of that the bridal shower.
That would be a good one.
@@mandyhuey5810 it’s crazy the amount of money we have to spend and days we have to ask from work! The social pressure is to much and imagine multiple times a year!
im confused, i get getting to the wedding can be an expense but ive seen the elusive prom dress come out a second time to attend a wedding and its not uncommon to burrow an older relative's party dress or suit. all the bachelor/bachelorette parties ive heard of were hosted at a friends house where people just played board games, tried their hand at baking and ended the night with drinks and pizza. we got a bunch of female cousins and aunts day of, fixing eyeliner, trading necklaces and sharing expensive perfumes. my only expense as a bridesmaid was the gift, but i would have had to give one of those anyways as a guest. is, is this not the standard???
YESSS!!
I find the ease that I have with having friends that grew up poor like me is that we're super comfortable being upfront about how broke we are and picking restaurants based off of that.
Honestly yeah
Same! I know what I can afford & I plan accordingly!!
Yeah I’m not going to a restaurant I can’t afford in the first place
Ahh man, this is an ode to my child hood, growing up in Brooklyn. chicken wings with french fries. Lots of hot sauce and ketchup. Didn't matter who had enough or who didn't, we all ate because.....it cost like 10 bucks to feed all of us anyways. lol
As someone with ADHD I sometimes tell my friends straight up to remind me if I forget to pay them, also when their birthday is. To be clear I ALWAYS pay them back when asked and usually as soon as possible do I don’t forget, but I also know that given the chance I might just not think of it for three months. That goes both ways too, I would definitely forget if someone owes me money. Like I don’t need to be hounded, but genuinely if I forget something like that let me know, because I would rather deal with the moment of embarrassment than come across as someone who would cheat my friends or not care about their birthdays, or whatever it is. I’m can be ditzy but I’m not an asshole.
Thats what i do with my friend too if she pays ill be like hey im broke right now but I get paid on this day if i havent paid you back by then remind me
As someone with ADHD, it's not your friend's job to remind you. sent yourself a memo, or email or set an alarm; figure out ways that you can be responsible for yourself. Put their b/day in your calendar and set a notification.
This is such an interesting topic. My friends and i are all from low-average income families, and we always send each other money ASAP after somebody has put down their card. We don't even have to discuss it, it's assumed.
Same here, so I also pay back the money asap. I’m also from california like her so I didn’t get the whole “chill cali friend group”. I think there’s more factors to it like the one you pointed out.
I learned the, “Never loan money that you wouldn’t be okay losing” lesson the hard way 😭 Also, I am very forgetful sometimes so if someone sent me a reminder or Venmo request to pay them back I would really appreciate that! I think paying back by the next morning is appropriate :)
That's the normal way. I had someone who would passive aggressively text me if I sent reminders...for the damn rent.
same especially if its drinks someones bought me and i've been a bit lit i'll definitely forget lol. i've told my friends many times to send me a mobilepay request if we agreed i should pay back smth.
Plus it would be weird to do it immediately- that means getting your phone out at the table!!
I probably spent about $30 on a coworker at Starbucks and like while the the first drink was my treat, she’s never offered to pay me back despite me also grabbing her lunch one day. She even stopped at Starbucks before work last week and never asked if maybe I wanted something.
@@Mia_M Would've been nice of her to ask but have you asked her to pay you back?
In Brazil a lot of restaurants and bars have adopted a system with what we call comandas. It's basically a piece of plastic with a bar code they give each person (or couple/family if asked). When you order something they scan your comanda and create like an individual tab so when you are done they can just scan it again and have your total, no need for a time consuming process to split the bill. That's a method I like a lot, at least in my friend group of broke 20 somethings we never really do anything other than splitting
Interesting. In Norway we just order at the bar. Each person orders for themselves.
That is so convenient! I hope this is adopted in Portugal as well, it is a great idea.
I was at a market and only had my phone, a bakery vendor was cash or card only and my friend offered to pay for my muffin and I could venmo her back. As soon I got my muffin and we walked away I venmoed her immediately. It was only $4 but playing around with other peoples money is no joke
Love the nuances in this video
Quite insightful
"It is not worth it to put yourself into debt to try to keep up with your friends' lifestyles." More people need to know this
My best friend has more money than me so when I go out with her and her husband they usually pay the dinner bill, I BEG THEM to split the check but they never let me. Last time we went out I was with a bit more money so I paid the bill... usually when people understand each other's financial differences it's pretty smooth and easy imo, but when someone ASSUME you have money to pay the whole thing then it's not... nice. Now, If I'm with a GROUP of friends it goes unspoken that we are gonna SPLIT THE DAMN BILL.
This is what I do with my mom, I recently found out that she overspent a lot and is broke right now
We made her a budget, but I decided for myself that when I go out with her I pay so we can still have fun and she doesn't have to worry about putting away money for it, as I'm a bit better financially than her at the moment
Also it's a bit of a thank you to her for always taking me on trips and giving me money when I couldn't afford to pay bills (and taking care of me in general), our roles have reversed in a way
thats not my experience. then again maybe that says a lot abt the friendship 🥲
Absolutely, understanding financial differences is the perfect wording. I’m happy to always treat my friend to lunch. We talk openly about our finances (I know that’s taboo to some). The cost of a meal is a larger portion of her budget than it is mine, so it’s no big deal to cover it. But I know that she would never feel entitled about it and if I ever asked her to cover her share I’m sure she would. I think that’s just mutual respect and a good friendship 🤷🏻♀️ I’ll do that for friends but I’m with you 100%, if I don’t know someone or I’m in a group we are getting separate checks.
My aunt and uncle are the types who always just foot the bill. I’m always prepared to pay for my food or snacks (if it’s a road trip) or like tickets to places, but they’re quick to pull out their cards and wave yours off.
I prefer splitting the bill. I rarely go out. Maybe I wanted to splurge that day but my friend is not in a good situation financialy at the moment. Why put them in an awkward situation?
If I go out with someone more often it’s different. Usually one of us pays the bill with card and the other leaves a small tip cash (this is not the US, tips are voluntary). Then next time we rotate.
Few months back I was meeting a friend for like an hour but she had to eat a full meal while I just had a lemonade. It would be really weird to split the bill evenly when she spent ten times what I did
One thing that wasn’t touched on are those occasions where you think you’re being invited to somewhere and asked to pay for the experience *after* you did it and expected it to be free. I’ve had a few occasions when I was invited, payment was never discussed, and then got a random Venmo request for whatever the thing was. Way to make me feel like I was invited just to make everything cheaper for everyone else.
That’s the worst! Should always be discussed beforehand, IMO
No offence but if you knew everyone else needed to pay, why wouldn’t you expect to? What kind of experiences even are these? Like if I were going with a group of friends to the cinema, I would never expect everyone else to pay for me lol. Tho I get it’s totally unreasonable to invite someone to something expensive without even letting them know how much it will be.
from my experience, unless they explicitly say it's free, it never is
You mean like the assholes at work?😂 My department director organized and invited everyone to this gathering with food and drinks and usually when there's arrangements like these it's free because every dep in the company has an annual budget for these get together activities etc. so ofc we all took it for granted. Next day an email with the bill asking us to pay was sent lmao. Ppl didn't even order for themselves, the food had already been chosen. Not to mention not everybody ate and drank the same amount but the request was for everybody to pay equally. 💀
What type of experiences are you being invited to? I get it if you’re invited to a vacation with someone or something expecting not to pay them back is pretty reasonable but if you’re invited out to dinner or something it’s pretty standard that you pay your own way?
I remember the harsh transition from birthday parties as a kid to doing a birthday dinner with friends as a teen. I was so embarrassed the first time my friends and I went to a birthday dinner at a really upscale restaurant and we were expected to pay for our meals when we hadn't chosen the restaurant. I remember going to the bathroom to ask my parents to transfer me some money just to cover my portion of the bill. It was a big shift from when we all went out with someone's parent for a birthday and the parent covered the bill, and one that happened without any communication!
Wow. That’s horrible.
I don’t know maybe it’s because I grew up poor and in a position where it was rare that everyone could go out at once and be able to have a good time, but the transactional friendship feeling I get from “pay me back immediately” girlies makes me so.. uncomfortable. I really only go out with my best friend and that’s partially because we joke that we’ve been trading the same $50 back and forth for three years straight. She covers lunch, I cover dinner. I cover movie tickets, she covers snacks. I cover a concert ticket, she covers the hotel. That’s just how my family and I have always operated, and that’s how I prefer operating in friendships (unless it’s explicitly talked about beforehand).
That's how it should be. I'm Nigerian and there's times my friend is short on cash, I paid her lunch for a week and never asked her back and later when I was in need she did the same for me. One time we went shopping she bought a top for me another time I bought a dress for her. We never counted how much we spent on each other or tried to take advantage of each other
for me who also grew up poor i usually treat it as a "you cover for me next time/you cover the other part" etc etc unless its a large amount of money which then you need to pay back asap (ex, when i go out to eat with friends, we take turns paying the bill. but when one of my friends got her car towed after an accident, couldnt get the money to pay them while in the hospital so i did, she paid me back when she could) i dont understand the people who nickel and dime their friends for everything
@@ohboy-zi1yf yeah the nickel and diming stuff with your friends makes no sense to me. It feels almost rude unless it’s something you guys already agreed you would do!
As someone who, when I was a student, benefited from a lot of older friends and mentors buying me coffees and picking up the bill - I try to pay it back now that I have a real salary. If you’re making 30 times the amount of someone you are having a drink with, just pay the bloody bill.
No
same i also buy drinks for friends when i'm flush and theyre not, and they do the same for me. i think the key is to actually be friends with good people lol.
Absolutely not. If you can't afford to go, you shouldn't be going. I just graduated from graduate school and worked the entire time I was in the program on top of commuting etc., but no one ever picked up the bill for me or bought my coffee because it's understood that I can budget and know my limits. Frankly, there are a lot of free things to do and if a mentor wanted to meet at a coffee shop and I didn't want to/couldn't spend the $, then I'd just wait for the mentor to order and join them after they did so. As long as someone in the party is a patron (espec. in a group of 2), then why would that not be an option?
@@EyeGlassTrainofMindNo one said its not an option, it's just a nice thing to do every once in a whiIe. No has to pick up someone else's biII, but thats what makes them a kind and admirabIe person if they do end up doing that
Yeah if I'm in a financial place where I can do that, I'm gonna do it. It's nice and doesn't hurt anyone
My best friend and I used to cover each other all the time when it came to the small stuff. When we decided to move in together it became very one sided and I was paying EVERYTHING bills rent repairs all of it. There was one point where she was over 4 months behind on expenses. Now I’m really nervous about getting financially tied to anyone. It’s crazy how money can drive even the closest people apart.
Similar situation ruined a decade+ long friendship of mine. She couldn't cover all of her bills, even though I was covering groceries and driving her to work and back almost every day (20 minute+ drive one way). It got to a point where she started avoiding me because she knew it was causing me financial stress and she couldn't cover it. I had to kick her out and living without her was less stressful even though I was paying the full rent because at least I could plan and budget appropriately again. Got a different roommate a couple months later and it's never been an issue.
Disagree, it’s not money that drives people apart, is the lack of consideration
sounds like you didn't have a clear agreement and poor communication.
When I was a waitress at Waffle House, it was known with all the workers that the customers who could least afford it would generally tip much better than the wealthier ones. They'd even leave their last dollar and apologize profusely if they didn't feel it was enough.
I had a friend who comes from a way wealthier background than the rest of my group. We stopped hanging out with her because she was happy to accept our small generous gifts, but never willing to reciprocate. We would all bring things intended to share, but whenever she brings something she has to count out who had how much of what and charge accordingly. Definitely felt more like a transaction than a friendship. It felt really ridiculous too since she had so much more than the rest of us.
yeh theres two types of wealthy friends. Either the ones that will treat everyone to a meal and not ask for any money in return or those who are obsessed with retrieving every last penny/cent despite not struggling at all financially.
A lot of rich people are stingy af. And no, that's not how they keep their wealth.
It's how their family got wealthy - by taking from others and not paying their fair share
@@xtinkerbellax3 thank you, I get so tired of people saying that ridiculous bs about ‘well that’s why they’re rich’. Bro. That’s not how being rich works. I can be the stingiest mf on the planet but that’s not gonna magically turn my salary into a six figure one. 😂😂😂
I had many friends growing up way better off than me (because of their parents that is), and they were all very stingy. I don't agree at all with the tone of this video. Bria Jones is a big influencer she absolutely could just suck it up and let it go. We don't even know the full story either and she feels the need to blast this on tiktok. What the hell is wrong with people?
As a Canadian, the venmo social feed is wild to me - is that not a major invasion of privacy???
You can send money privately, too. Im always amazed by how many people I see choosing NOT to use it. They must think they’re stunting.
@@Ineverusemychannel ah okay that makes a little more sense! I can't imagine why you would want to broadcast that and also why anyone would want to scroll through and watch?
I keep my bills private but the social stuff is kinda fun because you can use emojis to label the payments. So it’s like another form of social media and no one sees the actual amounts.
@@RoKer13I run a snack bar for my building and the ideas people come up with when sending me 2-3 dollars is hilarious. 🦶📸 is one of the best
@@IneverusemychannelI can imagine alot of people don’t even realize it’s showing the feed to everyone on venmo.
When thinking or discussing this topic I always come back to the friends episode that aired about the friends being in different financial positions and splitting the bill evenly. The discussion in the episode is still hella relatable!
i always order the cheapest thing on the menu and get absolutely livid when group members, who order cocktails and extra side dishes, chimes in with the "let's split the bill"
as an autistic person all the unspoken social rules of stuff like this is hell to me. like how tf am i supposed to implicitly know how exactly to ask for payment or how to pay someone???? and the fact that i've literally had friendships fall apart because of petty dollar musical chairs that i didnt know the rules of...it's like who invented this i just want to talk
Don’t learn their rules… discover your preferences and state them. NTs go with the current, and there is nothing stopping you from being the one who sets it. They won’t be like “wait this is incorrect because ___” because they don’t have a consistent social logic system😅
Just start every sentence you ever speak with "I don’t hate you, I'm just autistic".
Problem solved! 😅 (sarcasm)
@@xant8344 I know this is a joke but I did that when dateing, if they are not cool with me being autistic then we might as well not date anyways. One of the things I told the ones I went on dates with was that I would be paying for my part of the meal at resturants because it stressed me out if I feelt I owed them something, and I didn't want that interfering with getting to know them. My dates did not mind.
I now have a shared account with my fiance so he always gets to take out the card when the two of us are out to eat. Mostly because his card is easyer to get than mine, that is in my wallet and lost in the mess in my bag. We also both enjoy pretending like he is treating me when we go out, like I am some spoiled prinsess 🤭🥰
@@crashtestbunny6649so true lmao
In Australia most restaurants have a QR code that each person can scan and pay separately through online banking. This system works super well when eating out with a big group! That being said, We don’t have added tax or have to tip 😊
Certain American restaurants also have this option.
@@northwoodslife8456yard house is like this I think, and small restaurants using the ToastTab system.
Yeah also as an Aussie I have no relation to this drama haha. We just pay separetely or its an exchange (I pay for dinner, friend pays for movie tickets and snacks).
Wow, that sounds really handy!
its never been weird and awkward for me -- either everybody pays for their part, or - if I know my friend isn't doing well and I'm good for it, I just pay for both of us. They'll get it next time. Not hard!
This is very interesting for me to think about as a Mediterranean studying in central-western Europe: in my home country, it is normal to take turns paying the bills, especially when you hang out with the other person often and “fighting for the bill” is quite common there. In my host country, however, bill-sharing is so embedded into the culture that even local bank apps have a built-in function to automatically split the bill and create a payment request to send to your friends. It was a major culture shock when I moved here.
I once had a friend who would host parties at her house and then charge everyone based on how many slices of pizza they ate and how many cups of soda they drank. It was ridiculous 🤦🏻♀️😂
My friend in college charged us for alcohol but it was always approximate! Like “Im tryna black out so here’s $20” or “Im extra broke rn so I’ll give you $5 next time”. Keeping tabs is crazyyy
She should of just made it a potluck then
@@andreacamp936 But potluck means no profit for that psychopath.
Wouldn't it make way more sense to just use the "everyone brings something" approacg?
What in the mr krabs is that?!!!!
Me, a financially insecure 35 year old woman who works from home, has literally no friends, and has avoided dating for over 5 years : I can't relate to any of this...but I'm going to watch anyway.
This hit a little too close to home, lol
Same
As a guy this is true. Although Im mostly a hermit due to the disgusting aroma that is people doing cringe things
Right here with you as a 32 y/o lady
Same but I’m married. If we go out it’s the same money 🤷♀️
The arrangement where the bill is covered in full by one friend, and that act is paid back by another friend "getting it the next time" also creates an important social bond. There is the trust that the friend will cover it, and an implicit communication that there will be another social even soon. You get to communicate trust, friendship, and generosity all at once, as well as ensure the friendships continue to grow by requiring additional social events in an attempt to balance out a friendship account that never will quite balance out. Paying out immediately is also cashing out of the friendship.
you can still create those bonds in other ways. for every social bond created by financial arrangements like this, ther eare 10 where it creates stress, undue burden, hard feelings and angst. appearances often belie true feelings
one interesting story that I wanna share is that my friends who are better off money-wise often tell me they can cover for me when we make plans, which ranges from a meal to a ticket to a concert because they always tell me that making memories is the top priority, money comes after. while I'm super thankful for them, I feel really uncomfortable (even when they tell me not to) when they also pay my part of the expenses and I tend to keep paying everything myself in the end anyway (oof student loan), I really dunno how to go about this haha it's complicated bc I really wanna join them doing fun things but I also don't wanna go further and further into debt and certainly not let my friends pay for me every time
So not too long ago I went to a birthday dinner with a friend and I did not know most of the other people there. There were around 10 people there. I am not currently financially stable and wasnt then either, so I planned my budget very carefully and only ordered a bit of food I could afford. I was offered extras from shared plates, but did not ask.
When the bill came it was a real headache. It was the ONLY restaurant I've been to that would not split the bill. Someone wanted to split the bill evenly and Venmo, but it was way more than I could afford and I did not order any alcohol or as much food as anyone else there. I had to be that guy who said, let's calculate the bill. Thankfully one of the other people was also in favor of that and after a long while the person paid the full bill and we all Venmo'd our individual costs.
I was super thankful and it felt right because yes, I did not have a ton of money and wish we'd gone to a cheaper restuarant(or that I'd been made more aware of the prices beforehand so I could decline to go, but that's partially on me and I still ordered cheap) but I was glad I only had to paid what I'd actually spent.
I’m so glad you stood your ground!!!!
I wish that people would be more sensitive to the financial situation of others in cases like this. Don’t make it awkward, everyone just pay for what they ordered.
@@ChannelCreatorIKR? Why are people so squirmish about it… I have a friend who is still in college and not working , i never let her pay the bill . With my other friends who work , we either split or rotate or each pays for their own, depends. Or for example one friend of mine is out of job for five months now, ofc I am not letting her pay! Or I’ll try to plan something that doesnt require spending money, though to be honest that’s really hard to find for a shorter meeting
I hate when people do this. I usually always have the cheapest bill. I don’t drink alcohol, have multiple food allergies and I’m a somewhat picky eater. Sometimes I’ll order a side of mashed potatoes and mac and cheese while everyone else has liquor, appetizers, entrees, and desserts, and they‘ll want to split the bill evenly. No way. I’m not subsidizing your meals.
15:15 yes I understand the sentiment that friendship shouldn’t be transactional but as a teen I was told to never go out if I didn’t have the money. I find it to be taking advantage of someone and very rude especially if the person isn’t struggling but they just want 4 rounds of tequila on ur dime.
your channel is one of my absolute favourites i've come across in ages. thank you for all the thoughtful content and for not sensationalising anything ❤
I was born and raised in a southern state, where my friends and I took turns covering each other. We did’t keep an exact tab nor did we count down to the specific dollar and cent. We just had a shared culture of providing for each other. When I moved to a northern state, it was a huge culture shock to be charged by my new friends to the exact cent, as in, owe me $5.82… not gonna lie, at it was difficult for me to not feel offended!
I feel this. It's mad weird to have the exact amount memorized, ESPECIALLY when the person keeping tabs is wealthier than you.
honestly depends on if my friends and I are doing well financially 😅 If I'm doing really well, I'm not gonna ask to be paid back for less than $20. If I know my friend is doing worse than me I offer to pay more. If I'm short on cash, I'll ask them to pay me back. It depends on how much you need that $5.
Honestly, in the situation where I have the "financial-planner friend" who goes through all the work of splitting the bill, sending out $ requests, putting THEIR card down . . . I'm gonna give them an extra couple bucks on my end for all that work.
My gf and I have had pretty bad financial troubles this year, if we haven’t been able to pay someone back due to change in finance, we do an act of service for them. A friend bought me Taco Bell and I didn’t have money, so I cleaned their living room! I feel bad if I don’t pay people back. I feel like I need to do something in return
I do this with my dad, to be honest. Whenever he fixes my car (which usually involves him buying whatever it takes, in addition to his labor), I pay him back by walking his dog/making him food/buying him beer/etc. He knows I'm trying to get my footing financially, so he's okay with things like that in exchange.
Same with one of my friends that I work with. If she picks me up coffee one day, I might grab a cool set of decorative lights for her office the next (or run interfence between her and our boss if she's running late to the office). Sometimes it isn't about the amount of money, it's about the thought and care for the person who lent it to you.
I love this concept tbh.
It's way better than to ghost the person.
And they know you really appreciate that they bought you the food or whatever else and the friendship enough, to give them an act of kindness.
Honestly will start doing this with friends with no money and say please just watch my dog for a few hours, and my friends love my dog so win win😂
That's a great way to be helpful for each other. It doesn't always have to be financial to prove that you support and respect each other and the help you give each other.
this is so heartwarming! it's a great model for society
What restaurant doesn’t allow separate checks that’s crazy? I’ve worked in the restaurant industry for years and never seen that. Only reason servers say that is because they’re too lazy to split the bill
this video was extremely interesting! the comment section too. so many of us are embarrassed talking about money, myself included, but talking about it like this helps us remove the stigma and make it less taboo. conversations about money are always awkward, but the communication eliminates any confusion or resentment that comes with avoiding the topic. thank you so much for making this!
Canada has the same tiping culture as the US AND we have tableside card readers. My husband is from the US and when he first came to Canada he was surpised they didnt take our card and instead asked us if we needed a machine. Hes used to it now and I was surpised that anyone would willingly allow a stranger to take their credit or debit card out of their sight for any amount of time.
we don't have tipping culture but i find letting someone take your card extremely weird and dangerous too. where i live we were taught since childhood that you don't ever let anyone take your card. especially if its out of your sight they could be copying the info off it.
I don’t have room for any more paranoia in my life lmao
Omfg wait it’s so normal in the US that I’ve never once thought about how sus it actually is!!!!
I'm from Spain and I also got nervous at the tought of someone leaving with my card 😬. I've traveled to quite a few countries in the EU and the server always brings the paying device to the table, so I think it's fair to say that us europeans are raised the same in that regard.
And the fact they CAN take away your card to make the payment, because IT NEEDS NO PASSWORD
It really sucks when friends have much more expensive standards of what a ''normal'' amount is to spend on a night out or for dinner. I often have to pretend I can't make it because it's embarrassing to admit I can't afford it. Great video as always!
I'm always upfront if i can't afford the restaurant. Either we pick a different place or i skip joining that day
@@OnewBiasedabsolutely. If you're not comfortable doing this with specific people I'd question how much trust there is that you're addressing actual friends
I’m not embarrassed but I know my limits & budget so if I can’t I will not go. I work a lot but I got bills & sometimes the time I’m asked to go is just not in my budget at that time. Luckily my friend group & I are amazing at this! We know hard times & are excellent at communication when it comes to this!!
I think with the birthday if you're inviting others out to celebrate your birthday it makes sense that you pay vs others inviting you out to celebrate your birthday.
I find this quite fascinating because here in Germany the waiter or waitress will just go around the table and ask you what your ordered and everyone will pay for their own thing. I've never seen this being an issue, so it's quite interesting to see how different it can be in other places
The two awkward bill-splitting situations I've been in were both weirdly when I was visiting southern California specifically, and with groups of people I didn't know well. First time, I was 19 and a student with very little money to throw about - a friend had flown me out to visit them as an insanely generous birthday gift. I ordered the cheapest item on the menu and a glass of tap water. Everybody else were professionals a couple years older than me who could afford to get cocktails and more expensive food. Then at the end - let's split the bill! I just put in the $10 for my vegetarian tostada without a word and let them sort out the rest. Second time, the friend I'd planned to see had to dip, so I was with three of his friends I'd never met before. I had two courses and no alcohol, the other guests each had three courses and shared a bottle of wine, and BOY HOWDY did they get shitty at me for... not wanting to pay for stuff I didn't consume? I'm not an exceptionally stingy person, either. I've often just paid for both when out with a friend with no expectation of reciprocating because I like them and it's nice to treat people sometimes when you're able. But in these cases, I ordered within my budget and apetite. We're not friends. I'm not paying for your malbec?
Being a vegetarian non-drinker in social settings outside of close friends really is a toss-up between social anxiety and getting ripped off by strangers. I don't mind paying a little extra out of good will (or a lot extra for a good friend, who will either return the favour someday or they might just not have money and they deserve good things too), but yeah sometimes I'll genuinely not get as much as I want to save money... and then be expected to cover for bottle of wine steak McGee over there. Don't take the piss.
What's interesting is the need to explain 'I'm not stingy', 'I barely know them'. The only explanation needed is it is my money and I worked really hard for and I have hard time letting them go without benefiting me. That's it. Your boundaries above what people may think of you.
My worst experience was when a group of like 10 of us who had been friends for 5 years pretty much was out shopping so everyone sort of got food they wanted. 2 friends decided to share a pizza and one of them insisted on paying the EXACT amount it would cost for half the pizza which sure fine. There was one slice left and neither wanted it so this other girl said she'll have it if they didn't but the girl insisted on her paying the exact amount for it (which btw was 87 pence so just over a dollar) which she couldn't do so the girl offered it to everyone else who all said no so she THREW IT AWAY! The shock on our faces as she did it so nonchalantly like dude you really care sm about the 87 pence you'd rather no one eat it like what??
Just say you only pay for your own stuff vefore you go out with people. 🙄
@@CordeliaWagnerwhy would people expect any different in the first place? y'all are crazy
I've actually stopped going out with one particular group of friends because they always go to meat-centric spots to eat (usually KBBQ) and I, as a vegetarian, usually just eat vegetables at these places. But they always insist on splitting the bill equally and so I always end up paying for their very expensive Wagyu beef when all I've had is a few veggies 😁 I don't wanna be that (only) person who doesn't want to even split so I don't go with them anymore. Really interesting topic - thanks Tiffany!
Reading through this comment section, it’s crazy how common this scenario is.
Honestly, all it takes is one person (that’s not you) who sees this and tells others that you shouldn’t pay that much, for me and my friends, when we know someone is vegan/vegetarian and because of that they cannot order whatever they want to, or when someone have financial difficulties, we usually either split the bills with their part included (most likely when our friends are without a job) so everyone helps paying their part, or they pay their part and we split the rest. It isn’t that hard
I'd feel extremely uncomfortable with splitting a bill if one person ate a noticeably cheaper meal like this. Like if I did that and another person suggested it I would actually stop them and say "no, Jenn didn't spend as much as us, she should just pay what she did eat".
For me your friends should spot this and bring it up by themselves, it shouldn't even be an issue for you. We do this mostly with friends who don't drink when we go out together, cause alcohol is expensive and if you don't drink, you shouldn't be responsible for the 2 bottles of wine we ordered
I think you should venmo someone immediately so you dont forget to send it and they don't have to feel bad for asking for it back
this was so interesting!! the only time i’m really down for splitting evenly is either when we all got similar things and it’s just easier (like you talked about), or if it’s a friends birthday often we will all split the bill evenly except for that friend
Had a friend call me selfish and mean for not having the Venmo app and trying to pay her back with cash. SMH. I was even giving her a $20 for a $17 bill so she was gaining money. 🤦🏻♀️
I HATE how card centric the US is!!! Feels like cash is so devalued
@@meghansullivan6812I don’t trust cash because it can be fake
@@meghansullivan6812honestly I know people who have never paid with cash ever
I feel like most people I know exclusively use cards to pay and yet we still accept cash without issue. You can deposit it if you really need to.
@@meghansullivan6812 yet there's such conflicting messaging, like some places are cash only and some places don't accept cash at all, and some places add extra fees if you pay with card so it's like ??? what am I supposed to carry with me
as a Greek person, I loved the little comment on the Greek birthday tradition!! I'm 19, so I've only had two birthday dinners where I've been an "adult" and have paid for both of them :) it's definitely the tradition
very similar in india! when i went out for my eighteenth birthday with my friends my parents called me to remind me that i would be picking up the bill - my friends had a lot to say on that so we did end up splitting and i covered the cake haha
Greek-heritage here too! I’ve grown up in Australia and all my non-Greek/ethnic friends are always so taken aback by me covering the cost of my celebrations in paying for their drinks/food. Whereas the tradition is opposite in other circles where everyone treats the person celebrating their birthday.
That's how it goes in Cyprus too! 😊
We have that tradition in Croatia as well! At least the most expensive drinks will be paid for by the person celebrating (in case they can't afford everything).
Reading all these comments is so fascinating to me! It's cool learning about the cultural norms like that
This instantly made me think of Friends. When Rachel, Phoebe, and Joey have to have the money talk with Ross, Chandler, and Monica
It's crazy because I have actually never experienced this with my friends. When my husband and I dated I would offer to pay but he also refused and paid. And with our friends we will always ask for separate checks or for my SIL bachelorette for example I did everything on my card and everyone immediately after venomed me what they owed. And with our super close friends sometimes we rotate 🤷🏼♀️ when my husband and I are doing good financially and we go out with our best friends we will offer to pay and the next time we hang out they will offer to pay. I've never encountered an awkward moment and perhaps it's because I'm surrounded by other mature people but I feel lucky because having seen videos of people flipping out over the bill or check splitting agh... so cringe.
I would looooove a video analysing drinking culture! How it feels hard to socialise in any other way as a young person, how (in the uk) in the evenings there is nowhere to go but the pub as cafes and libraries are closed, at least outside of the cities. How if you choose to not drink you end up isolating yourself, especially in university
'Oh you don't have to drink, you can just have a coke!' Thanks, person I just made up, love babysitting drunk people with my time off it's my favourite. How about YOU just ... not get drunk for one weekend? Nobody ever thinks to meet the non-drinkers halfway like they expect us to. Lots of people have religious or personal reasons beyond just preference - recovering alcoholics, Muslims, people with trauma around alcohol... not to mention that simply not wanting to drink should be a preference that's respected. I think the culture isn't quite as extreme in the US as it is here in the UK, though. So my US friends tell me - it's a college age kids thing, people don't go on the lash for 12 hours every Friday well into their 50s like they do here lol.
I would love such a video
Ever since me and my friend group were teenagers (14-15) our small group of three never held debts against each other unless it was explicitly asked to “borrow” money or to get us something specific from the store. We all just understand that we treat each other time to time and that sometimes we can be down on our finances. We also don’t expect to be paid for all the time. It’s a nice group dynamic that has grown gradually over our almost decade long friendship
Same. I don’t often break bread with people I don’t know or trust so maybe that’s why splitting a bill hasn’t ever been a problem for me.
if all those things are small amounts or all people are very wealthy those things are not a problem
This reminds me of my friend group as well! If a friend insisted to pay me back immediately, I'd usually say "no worries, I know where you live". They had covered for me in the past and I love to get a chance to show up for them, even if we're just talking about covering for a coffee or a drink. Because we trust each other that in the grand scheme of our friendship, it'll all even out :)
THAT BEING SAID, this video often talks about 600$ dinners, large parties, splitting bills with strangers etc - I mean going to a place that costs that kind of money without... bringing any money whatsoever... is baffling. Maybe I'm not in those situations often enough, but if I'm going out I always withdraw an amount of cash I'm comfortable spending?? idk
@@aleksandrawilkos1278 No, it's just a really tight group of friends... There's no financial barrier for that the ONLY requirement is communication and trust.
With restaurants so expensive, and the tipping inflation, I'm all for separate checks. I never was before, but if I received bad service or meal, I refuse to tip. If I'm out with one friend, I will pick up the check but anymore and well, it gets too expensive. I get the idea, "don't go out if you cant afford it" bit, but I didn't plan on purchasing lunch or dinner for 5 or 6 people.
When this first started, I didn't understand why splitting was such a chore but it turns out it's because I'm not from the USA! In Canada, it's so easy to split cheques at the table and we have "tap" point of service systems which make paying painlessly quick. We also have tip culture, and selecting tip in front of servers is never an issue or impolite. We're even able to split multiple different dishes between multiple people at whatever permutation we want, and it never slows the server or their payment system down.
I think we split checks too but I'm not sure why they went to a restaurant that expensive if they couldn't pay for it...
Thank you for shouting out planner friends! It's a thankless job, but someone has to do it 😂
As a sociology graduate I APPRECIATE the fact that you shared the metrics you used for the survey & the demographic background. It cancels biases. Nice video Tiff ❤
A lot of rich people are brought up being told that others will take advantage of them for their money, so they act hiper vigilant about making sure that doesn't happen.
The concept of splitting the bill evenly is just insane to me. Whenever I go out with my friends we split the bill based on what everyone ordered that should be the norm.
And yes it is absolutely fine to keep a tab of what you owe and what you are owed among your friends, if you can’t openly speak about this they aren’t you real friends.
Splitting the bill evenly is less hassle. If the bill is cheap enough that the difference between worked out and split evenly isn't worth the time to do so then it's just easier to split it evenly.
Of course that requires that everyone knows or expects that from the start as well as no one trying to take advantage(ordering extra expensive stuff because they know they'll only eat a portion of it's cost).
As long as that's all true then it works out fairly well as a convenience.
If the difference is worth the couple of minutes discussing who had what, or someone in the group wasn't expecting to split the bill, then it should be split individually(as that's pretty much the default expected approach).