Ardacon 2022 Assault on Helm's Deep List Review 650 Points
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- čas přidán 6. 09. 2024
- August 2023 FAQ: May now only re-roll 1s to hit and to scatter, rather than any value. this means hitting around 58% of the time rather than 75%, and a bit harder to get that 5 or 6 on the scatter to get a direct hit (with or without might). Whilst this will make things tougher, it may coax the enemy out of hiding and into a false sense of security. What do you think? Any experiences of the list after this FAQ dropping?
An in-depth review of how the Assault on Helm's Deep Legendary Legion works, with advice on list composition, playstyle, and in-game tips, following a pretty successful running at Ardacon 2022.
0:00 Introduction
1:12 List Composition
4:41 Deployment and troop types
8:08 General straegy and tactics
12:16 Countering enemy heroes
13:42 Leader/banner protection
15:55 Pitfalls
17:28 Advanced tricks and tips
22:03 Scenario focus
30:45 Conclusion
Hear about my domination defeat on An Unexpected Podcast!
• Ardacon Recap Part 4: ...
Just tried this list at the local game shop and it won games easily (4-0) against the nine, and 5-4) against Azog’s legion
Nice job! Glad it worked well! I just used it at 500 in a one day tournament and it did quite well there. I went with the Leader captain, crossbow captain and 2 ballistas, and 8/24 warriors with Crossbows. All that firepower concentrated against even smaller opposing armies is pretty scary at lower points too! I got 2 wins, 1 draw and 1 loss to the eventual runner up, so pretty happy with that, although there's still bits I can improve in my general play.
Great video, just getting into the army for a doubles event.
Domination - potentially could you move the two ballista’s over the two objective markers on your side and contest the middle? Guess much would depend on scenery/placement and losing shooting turn opportunities.
Well put together video with lots of food for thought.
If I remember correctly, mention was made of a similar build at Ardacon which finished higher up; a compare and contrast between those two would be interesting though might be down to matchups perhaps?
I did finish three ballista’s at the start of lockdown but have never tried them out. Much seems to be down to timing in some scenarios.
Hi pal, thanks for the comment! I think with Domination, because it is models within 3", there's not much to be gained by pushing the Ballistae on the markers, other than if it is pushed beyond one so it screens the whole 3" approach. I reckon with the 2 markers we get to place, one plan could be put each 6" from either deployment edge, so that whatever side we get our siege crew can deploy just behind one from the start.
I think this could also be a game to push the leader in more (max 1 VP for leader), and possibly more to gain/deny the opponent by having him contesting a marker.
The other list was "sitting pretty on 43" - a dangerous amount for an Uruk force! Which meant he had 39 warriors, and so 13/39 Crossbows to my 12/36. Same heroes; Leader (shield), 2nd captain (Crossbow). I suppose the extra numbers can help slightly, but my counter point would be a berserker with 2 attacks and a 6+ save can level the numbers over the course of a game by taking out more opponent models (and surviving 1/6 times that a normal warrior would have been removed from play). Add being able to tag terror causing enemies easier (c7 or 6 with Harbinger, vs C3 or 2 on a warrior), so I still think a few Berserkers would be good! Maybe 4 as they come in packs of 4 for people starting off.
Great video guide
I wasn't aware that ballistas are volley weapons, I suppose if your crossbowmen were all touching the front of the weapon you might not have to treat them as in the way, like you would putting archers in two ranks.
Hi, it's true line of sight in a straight line from the tip, so even though it doesn't arc over, if you get down and squint you can judge where it would go straight over your own guys, especially if the enemy are still quite far away.
@@sevenringsgaming2130 Is the line of sight not then taken from the veteran crewman?
@@joshoulton4501 one of the crew also needs line of sight to the target, but then you draw the shot from the tip of the bolt.
How would you say this Legion scales at different points levels?
Great breakdown and list. I'm planning on taking a version of this to a tournament provided I can get it painted on time. How would you upscale this list to 750?
Thanks! Funnily enough I just submitted a 750 point version last night for a tournament in January!
I have the 2 captains, one with shield, one with crossbow.
2 ballista teams, one with an extra crew member
13 crossbowmen (but you could do 12 as they come in packs of 4 nowadays)
12 pikemen
1 pike and banner
1 Shield man
1 demolition team with flaming brands for the 2 extra guys
6 Berserkers
Gives you 45 total, with 18 models per warband, lots of shooting, 2 ballistas, and the demo charge. Good courage as well. I played a practice game and won so looking forward to using a tournament!
Hey thanks for the list. I also went for a bomb because it was hard to fit a third warband. Got my first game with it tomorrow 😁
Played to the death against a last alliance list. Won 6-3. Was up against a blinding light elf archer/spears bunker, gilgalad and isuildur. Pretty tough for my first go I reckon but those ballista are just amazing
Newbie question. In fog of war you pick a assassin can that be the veteran crew member on the ballista ?? And if so does it could be the ballista kills your target?
Hi, sorry for the late reply. Yes, well in fog of war you pick one of your own models to protect. In Assassination you pick one of you models to be the assassin, and yes you can score points for taking out your target with the ballista if one of your Siege Veterans is the assassin, but only with the initial hit, not with the secondary effect.
Wouldn't your opponent just space their army out to blunt the ballistas? Did anyone do that at the tournament you went to?
Yes decent players who think about the scatter will put a model 3“ off to the side here and there to limit the damage. This is where re-rolling the scatter and using the Might to up a 5 roll to a 6 can hit a big target or a clump of models and cause the desired damage and make that plan of theirs less effective. If they split up too much they run the risk of losing the Combats against all the Fight 4 Strength 4 Uruk-Hai if you suddenly get in their face and catch them dallying about if you hit one part hard.
@@sevenringsgaming2130 You've got a lot of great tactical advice here. I'm playing a version of this list in a 600 point local league and had a blowout victory with it in the first game. It was "Divide and Conquer" against a Mordor list. Even with a lot of terrain, I had something to shoot with the ballistae every turn given their deployment at opposite ends of the board. A troll was dropped with a ballista on turn one and it was all downhill for them from there. I took the advice you gave in your video and moved most of one of the warbands into the middle while allowing my opponent to spend numerous turns getting to the ballista I left by itself. By the time he cleared it out and moved the handful of troops he had to the only available objective point of the three, it was a mop up job for a couple of berserkers and uruk-hai. The only thing they were left with at the end of the game was Gothmog. It's a tough list on that scenario. I'll be playing it in a maelstrom scenario this evening with an experienced opponent. Not sure it will go any better for me than it did for you lol.
@@strangersun7721 really good to hear the video was useful and that you had a great time with the list! Maelstrom can be a blessing or a curse! They can burn might to come on behind the ballistas. Deploy them on the 3/5 side before the game rather than 2/4 side, that way if they roll a 3 to come on first, they can't just spend 1 point to come on on the "4" side where they want AND behind the Ballistae. If you come on first come on with your Ballistae and leave a few models dotted along the board edge so they can't arrive there after you because of arriving into a control zone. Even if you do end up fighting around the Ballistae, use your siege veterans might to call Heroic moves then to save might on your captains.
@@sevenringsgaming2130 Great tips! I was mistaken and we ended up playing "To The Death", which you completely nailed in this video. It was against a tough elf list, but I'm not sure a low-model count elite army stands a chance against this Helm's Deep list on that scenario. He was broken while still 18-24 inches away from ballistas, then quartered just as one elf reached the line of uruks standing in front of one of the ballistas. To add insult to injury, a cheap uruk with no shield ended up winning the only combat in the game AND killing the lone elf. It's part of a competitive league, but this list is brutal in some match ups. I might not have friends at the end of it!
@@strangersun7721 that sounds brutal (for them!) and yep To the Death is a pretty ideal scenario for this list! If its a competitive league then keep on going with it, and I would say to people you are getting used to the list still if it feels too one sided (I've been there!). Definitely worth practicing now if you intend to enter a tournament with it, as pressing your advantage in close games is an important skill. Be interested to hear how it gets on in other pools / games!