Sydney's Rockdale To Brighton-Le-Sands Tramline
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- čas přidán 2. 06. 2024
- A shortish story about a short tramline built by man who is was also a tobacconist (owning Australia’s first cigarette making machine), a property developer, a coal mine owner, a licensee of a pub, a creator of pleasure grounds and swimming baths.
Videos on this channel are not meant to be 100% accurate historical records. Having said this, we try to ensure they are factually correct by using multiple sources from what we think are credible books, websites, blogs and articles. But we do make mistakes....
It's worth nothing that Sydney's original tramlines didn't use colours (or even route numbers) to denote lines - instead they used the 'termini' of each line as their names. In the route animations we have arbitrarily selected colours to differentiate the lines visually on the maps. - Auta a dopravní prostředky
Thanks for taking us back to our recent past. It’s amazing to compare the beautiful buildings of the 1800s to the characterless concrete blocks of today. 🥂👍
Marvelous to look back at these transport images of long ago, and maybe sometime we may see more of those wonderful Trolly Busses!
I grew up in the late 1960s a bit further south in The Shire (the 'Islands' suburb) BUT, I have very fond memories of our father taking us to the baths (5:10) at Brighton-Le-Sands in the late 1960s-70s. I distinctly know that art-deco entrance down to the baths and the viewing balcony to the right. It's been decades since I thought of that!
I also remember the 1960s 'Space Rocket Ship' at Kiama/Kyema(?) Park. I was 5 and climbed to the top. It was terrifying once I reached it and so began my fear of heights. My father had to climb up to help me down. I also remember 'Hashams' red roofed fast-food shop in the park to. It belonged to John(?) Hasham who was an actor in the TV show 'No 96' of the late 1960s-early 1970s. I don't know if they're both still around as I left in 1985 and haven't been back. I'm shocked/surprised by the 'development'. Our family would travel that route along Botany Bay at least twice a month to see our grandparents. Really fond memories.
Thank you Marty and Kudos to you. I'm both flummoxed and perplexed that you don't have more subscribers.
lol....@ 6:03 that 'Bungalow' house on the right is the same as my cousins house on Bay Street closer to the beach! It's gone now. How strange to see all the houses gone. Speaking of which, I've searched and searched for an Art Deco house that was painted a very light green colour on those trips to see our grandparents but I've had no luck. I think it may have been in Ramsgate. I do remember it had a small park In front of it and it faced Botany Bay on The Grand Parade from memory. It's sort of an 'ear-worm' for me. Annoying!
Great memories.. I also lived South Side in those days.. so remember that park / restaurant at Kyeemagh (yes I had to google the correct spelling as well :) )
re subscribers etc.. thanks for the encouragement... I have loved trams since I was a kid (when my mum took me to the old Loftus tram museum as a 3 year old) so I don't really care how many people enjoy the channel - just that people who are really interested in it do... . My main concern is I get the facts correct as I feel we are the last link to the actual generation that operated and rode on the trams.. so I take more time than most youtube peeps to ensure I get as much as I can the historical facts right...
Hashams is long gone, but the pointy topped building is still there, now seafood restaurant or something. That rocket ship slide was there in the late 90s, it was about 30 years old by then. I have a photo of my brother on that slide in 1968!
Thoroughly enjoyable presentation. Thank you so much.
What an amazing vid and finding out about Sydney’s early rail history. The man hours and effort that went into such development. If they only knew then the transformation and of course recognising today their contribution that has got the system to where it is today. What’s also amazing is reading the comments of subscribers who have lived in the area or still do sharing their stories of current and past times. I’m a kiwi but I love Sydney and the great rail system you have. It’s always a pleasure and privilege to have a neighbour with such an amazing history. Thanks for sharing. Cheers mate! Patrick 😊
Good show, thanks for your time and research. Best wishes.
Hello! So today I found myself in Rockdale, and vaguely remembered something special here. Went to your channel, and revisited this video posted over a year ago, and then went for a walk to see the alignment of the former tram line next to the station!
I also missed my 422 bus in the process, but another one showed up not long after anyway 🤣
Thanks for watching (twice). Yes knowing where the former tram line went does help explain some unusual street alignments / gutter heights. Cheers M
I grew up in Brighton Le Sands and used to catch the bus with my dad to Rockdale Library in the 2000s. Always saw pictures of old Rockdale and Brighton in books in the library and wondered why they got rid of them.
Hi Marty, thanks for another interesting video. I missed seeing this line completely, as I was born in 1952. i do remember riding trolley buses in the area during the 1950's. It is a pity that in 1937, when the Kogarah steam trams ceased running, that these electric trams didn't take over both Kogarah and Rockdale tram lines, rather than the trolley buses. Anyway, take care. Rob in Melbourne Australia.
Thanks Rob.. yes I am no real scholar in politics of the 1960s.. (having been born in the 1970s) but I can't help thinking if the Sydney trams (at least part of it) had lasted until the late 1960s we'd still have them today... Brisbane nearly made it, save for the Paddington fire...
Thanks for such an amazing trip down memory lane.. I couldn’t stop watching it.
I lived in the area for over 30 years n many of the visions n stories are very familiar to me. Great narration and by your efforts this interesting part of our local history will not be forgotten.
Glad you enjoyed it
As a child I remember the Trolley Buses, for they were so different to anything else I had seen and Rockdale was at that time still a very busy shopping centre.
Good on ya Marty. Great bit of history, something I never knew I would be interested in.
Funny that I am actually living in Rockdale and I travel to Brighton Le Sands almost daily by bus. To see the past of my home city is just amazing. I do get a sense of sentimentalism even it was way before my time, but I recognise some buildings or area that I pass everyday.
My real estate tip.. buy in the area now.. when the M6 is completed the whole coast there will become an even better place to live without all the traffic down the Grand Parade...
9:54 L/P Tram #154 at Loftus is done up to represent the *Newcastle* Tramway cars from 1923 to 1950, as Newcastle's entire fleet was supposed to be L/P-class trams. There were a couple of ring-ins though. I tried to find #154 as part of the Newcastle fleet but was unsuccessful. Now I know why. #154 was part of the until-now unheralded Rockdale to Brighton-Le-Sands fleet, as it turns out.
Glad I could shed some light on the subject, although I didn’t mention it in the video I found that there were three trams that ran on the line that have been preserved.
@neilforbes416 you know your trams
I lived in Brighton Le Sands around 2010. Back then, the former site of the tram sheds was just a vacant lot, used as a unofficial park by locals.
I really enjoyed this video, probably my favourite out of your whole series. Something romantic about this isolated line that served its community and a great insight into the bustling hub Rockdale was back in the day.
Also didn’t even know about the alignment of the former main railway connection until you pointed it out in the video, so thanks!
Thanks.. yes my family said the same (they only see it when everyone else does :) )... I took a bit more time on this one as there was as much history around the tram line as there was about the tram line.
It's amazing how everywhere there was a tram line is now massively congested. Rockdale and Brighton Le Sands suffers from this. The foreshore in particular is a magnet for people in their noisy suped-up cars.
Ha. there are noisy suped-up cars everywhere these days.. I live on the North Side now and we are not immune to them.. I worry that my son soon will be also responsible for one of them.... :)
Thank you for this. On the narrator, the accent is a hybrid of Aussie and English..... at least to my ears. I wonder when that started changing and we ended up with what we all recognise today.
Not just your ears Joseph...if you listen to the newsreels from the day such as Cinesound / Movietone that were very popular in cinemas you will hear a distinct Anglicisation in the speaking then. I would say the Ocker style came in soon after when a lot of the folk from the land came into the cities. It has changes much since with a much larger representation of migrants. The influences of movies like the Adventures of Barry McKenzie and They're a Wierd Mob were also pronounced.
And also I recall a great aunt who was a schoolteacher then and teachers of the time used to insist on kids pronouncing properly and even having elocution lessons was common pre WW2.
Fun observation. I have often entertained the family by doing a 1940s accent which is just holding your nose... so I think it is a bit of how the technology recorded sound back then.. way more treble than today...
I saw a doco once about the Aussie accent and how people in the media used to speak a more "English". It mentioned how Australia started embracing it's Aussie accent (from memory) in around the 70's and mentioned Bob Hawk being one of the first prominent people to speak in the Aussie Accent. It was a while ago I saw the doco so I might have some details wrong
@@Lea-bw9wj Thank you! It's crazy because it is so iconic, yet arguably so recent too....... for people of the right generation(s)..... cough cough
I grew up in Sans Souci. Long after the Trams were gone, but I've seen photos.
Hi Marty please do Concord the tracks used to appear on really hot days through the asphalt outside my place Crn Brewer and Frederick st Concord when i was a kid (I'm a 1965 model)
Thanks for the suggestion. Would be good to do a video on the Enfield system although I don’t know the area that well so I have to do a bit of research before I did one on that line.
@@backtracks.channel I would look forward to seeing one if there are good archived footage and pictures
I've only just discovered your channel and I'm very impressed, many thanks. I really hope you do episodes on the Kogarah to Sans Souci line and also the Sutherland to Cronulla line.
Thanks Paul. As I look for photos for the videos a lot of images from Kogarah to Sans Souci line and also the Sutherland to Cronulla line appear and I have been noting them. I like to personally film the current locations of the former lines so will need me to make a trip that way. I grew up in the St George area so know it well. Can't' promise anything but on my list!
@@backtracks.channel I live in the St George area these days and I grew up in the Sutherland Shire so know both areas extremely well hence my interest. Perhaps I can help with the filming. I only have an iPhone, nothing fancy but if you're interested let me know.
Found this very interesting, I was born in 1947 & lived in the Beverly Park area of Kogarah till 1996, I can remember seeing a tram on the line just before it disappeared, although it took several years for all the tram tracks to be removed along the Grand Parade, I remember the tracks went further south then the local swimming bathes, almost up to President AVE, I was informed by my Father that there was a plan & some track work to extend the line to connect with the existing steam tram line to Doll's Point/Sans Souci, so the steam tram from Kogarah could be removed, I suspect this line ran some where around the east side of Scarborough Park Chuter Ave, as I can remember seeing a piece of rail line & large blue metal (TRACK BALLAST) similar to that used on railway lines, in a area around Ramsgate Rd in the mid 1950's, is there any information regarding this, as I understand this plan was cancelled in the mid 1930's during the Depression & another plan to replace the steam tram from Kogarah with the trolley bus with an extension to Rockdale was adopted, If all of this is true its a story worth telling.
Thanks for the memories. I also grew up in the St George area, but alas was born many years after the last trams and trolley buses - although my parents who lived in the area vividly remember them as kids... I also was born after much of the remaining tram infrastructure had been removed.. (i have now filmed every remaining depot incase they are now demolished). yes from what I can see there was a plan at one stage to run the line south from President's Ave along what the map said then was Carruthers Drive - part of this is now park in front of today's Grand Parade - but some still remains and then turning West at Russell Ave to join up with the existing at the time Steam Tram lines..
@@backtracks.channel I some how had the impression the line turned into President Ave then turned left into a right of way heading towards Ramsgate RD, this impression was obtained from a film I screened late one Saturday night at the Hurstville Savoy in the 1970's it was a old nitrate 35mm film that was produced by Sydney Tramways, no sound track, just captions, it showed the extension of the Rockdale line to Doll's Point, of course viewing a film from the 1930's of an area still undeveloped at that time, to the way I remembered it as I grew up in the 1950's, may lead one to misinterpret the area twenty years later.
There is an area in north Liverpool (UK) named Brighton-le-Sands. Anyone know if there is any connection?
Thanks for the question I just tried to look it up but it’s hard to tell which came first. I did fin out that Thomas Saywell did call the area first New Brighton but then changed the name to stop it getting mixed up with the Brighton in the south of England.
That just makes me think that there must be a connection as there is an area in birken head just to the east of Liverpool calls new brighton
I assume you'll cover trolley buses at some point.
Thanks yes they are so cool eh... but so rare now.. I think I saw some in China and in Wellington a few years back.. But this is just a hobby for me (I have a day job) so it takes time and my #1 goal is to get the history / facts correct... so its take a bit of time (which I enjoy) to learn about it and then make the video... great if you send through anything you know to help... backtracks.channel@gmail.com. cheers M
@BackTracks.Channel , fair enough - in any case, some point can easily be several years away.
There are no left side of the road trolley buses left. There are some networks left in North America (Boston, San Francisco and Seattle are three that come to mind), and a heap in the former Soviet Union, but I cannot immediately think of many others.
Interesting video; I've wondered about what this line was like since seeing it on a map. I still have some questions though - how was the line operated? Did trams always cross at the crossing points at Rockdale and the passing loop? What was the frequency of the line?
Good question. Just reading up on it says for the last 15 years of the line (from 1934) during peak hours there was a tram every 10 minutes using three coupled tram operating the line. For this service both the Farr St Loop and Trafalgar Loop (the former terminus at Bay Street) were used. In off peak service reverted to 15 minute intervals with just two trams operating - sometimes as singles or during medium demand in coupled sets. Trams did often have to wait a few minutes for the tram coming in the opposite direction to arrive.
Born 59 🇦🇺 Cronulla. I dont remember any knowledge of trams
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