Swiss Railways' biggest train FAILURE! Is the Twindexx Express really so bad?
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- čas přidán 22. 07. 2023
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Today we are exploring the story of the Bombardier Twindexx Express train for SBB the Swiss railways. Known for their perfection these trains did not live up to expectations, following massive delays they are now in service and in this video we will explore if they really are so bad and what went wrong.
Train type: SBB RABe 502
Route: IR13 Zürich HB - Buchs - Chur
Train: IR13
Distance: 155 km
Journey time: 2h6m
Average speed: 74 km/h
Price: 24 CHF (CHECK FOR PASSES!!)
i rode this train twice, and the first time, I had a 30 minute delay while the train restarted multiple times. the ride was decent, though I would prefer the IC2000 / IC2020 which are very similar
The interior actually looks really spacious compared to what I've seen on other double-deck units!
I took this train last year & I find quite comfortable for it does. definitely not as bad as what others think
The best to do in these Twindexx ist to go to the onboard Restaurant. It's actually one of the nicer ones on Swiss IC trains. The train ride is still not quite as smooth as on other Swiss IR / IC trains, but SBB stresses the point that by now they are actually more reliable than most other models. So yes, they are a bit of a mixed blessing: Their advantages are level boarding, easy access via wide doors, high capacity, the good restaurant. Their disadvantages: more shaky, relatively small windows and average seating quality. They are definitely not the new flagship. There's no real flagship train with SBB, which in a way makes it rather typically Swiss, as nothing is really permitted to stand out...
The Giruno should be the flagship - I mean it’s literally from a Swiss company!
Did someone say "railway geek"? OK then. 8.09 - that's a Merseyrail Class 777, destined for Liverpool's DC network.
Active tilt on a bilevel seems like a challenge, so I'm not entirely surprised that it proved problematic. Without the active tilt, it seems to have no benefit over, say, a Stadler KISS trainset.
Sorry to the naj-sayers, but this Twindexx Express is a fantastic train design. It is the only double decker with an all walk-through upper deck providing a much better space utilization than other train sets of its kind with their annoying middle-decks at car ends.
The space is cleverly used for children playgrounds, flex zones and restaurants (in plural!) - apart from the seats, which could be more comfy - I agree.
Due to the superior staircase design and the full-car-length upper floor this train also is much brighter - it has more windows than, say, the KISS.
It's a pity that the WAKO-system didn't work as it should, but the space this system occupies at the bottom of the train might be used for even better passenger comfort in a future version of this innovative design :)
I finally got a chance to ride it this summer - around the date of the publication of the video - and it only amazed me even more. The children loved it too :)
Bombardier were one of the pioneers in tilting trains but did no-one there read any of the FIAT or JR Shikoku documentation about the importance of aligning the roll centre with the waistline of a standing passenger in order to minimise nausea?🙄
the issue is that you can't really align the roll center to the waistline if there are two floors
The complaints werent about nausea. Passengers and staff felt unconfortable because the train was shaking a lot with the tilting system enabled. The train still shakes more than other bilevel carriages I've riden in, so maybe the suspension overall isnt the best. But complaints have mostly subsided since the tilting system was disabled.
Enjoy your videos. I rode the Twindess Express trains when I was in Switzerland back in April from Lausanne to Bern and from Bern to Zurich. Fortunately, I was riding in 1st class since 2nd class on the first train was almost standing room only. While they are not the most comfortable trains in the world, I did not have a problem with them on the trips I took, but then again, I was riding in 1st class. However, with their one benefit permanently disabled, they have no advantage over the Stadler KISS trains, which would have probably been the better option in the long run.
The train seems to be rather quiet
great video! btw will you have a video on the stadler smile
I'd love to, but didn't get to try it on this trip unfortunately
Great video, my friend. I enjoy following your trip on Google Maps, pausing the video to look up where you are on the map. Hello from Australia :)
Thanks for watching! Greetings back to you from Copenhagen
Since they disabled the tilting feature (or the puk-o-matic as I like to call it) we‘re left with a pretty mediocre and cramped train. It‘s alright and gets you where you need to go but it just feels like a downgrade compared to the older generations of trains here in Switzerland.
What‘s especially poor is the play area for kids:
On the old trains the play area in the family carriage was really nice and offered a spacious play area for the kids in the middle with seating for the adults/parents at the front and rear of the carriage.
On the Twindexx the play area is much smaller and offers fewer attractions for the kids and the seats consist of a long bench on either side of the carriage without any proper tables. So the kids are running around right infront of your feet and stumbling onto people’s laps during play.
When my two kids were younger they always started crying from disappointment as soon as they realised we were on a Twindexx with the shite playground.
I guess that‘s what you get when trains are designed by people that have a nanny to take care of their kids and/or drive an expensive car instead of travelling with a family on their own trains… ;-)
I actually think these trains still recieve far to much stick.
The seats are not the best, but these days I feel truly greate train seats are next to inexistent anyways.
Otherwise the only thing I could criticise is maybe the a little rough ride when braking or on switches and the fact that the train lacks storagespace for luggage, but thats mainly an tradeof because of the two decks.
The biggest problem in my oppinion is the passive tilting system that does not work but would have been extremely important for reaching the connection stations in time. That is really what ruins this train a little. Otherwise I think the critic these trains recieve is far to much. They are really not that bad. The ride quality with the tilting on was abysmal, but now its deactivated, its fine and the train is relatively descent.
It just ruins the timetable concept and that is the main issue.
Yeah in terms on the onboard product it's OK but as you point out the whole issue with the timetabling just means it's never gonna be anything more than serviceable
This train has virtually no space for luggages (in particular for the large bags that can't be stored between seats). The space for the bicycles is forbidden for bags and there are not really many other options (yes, I have considered the space on the 1st floor above the stairs, good luck bringing the bags upstairs). That's bad considering that this train runs on the IC1 line with stops at Geneva airport and Zurich airport.
That is a good point, i did not notice that too much on my trip but that certainly is a problem!
Nicely presented video.
This train is much nicer than anything Amtrak is running in USA. Our Acela Express also had faulty problematic system that was disengaged soon after launch in 2000.
Seats on Amtrak are some of the widest and cushiest you can find on a train, so I don't agree with you entirely, but admittedly, the level of maintenance, reliability of the service, and frequency is a whole different thing.
Swiss trains are good, but not perfect! In 2001 the train WC in Basel was a bit dirty!😢
I rode this train Twice in March during my visit to Switzerland. Its a large train and impressive to look at, but indeed the interiors left alot to be desired. The seats have a cheap feel to them and were quite narrow along with the cabin being cramped in general(especially on the upper deck). The aesthetics of the seats and the plastic used did not really impress me. The lack of tilting ability definitely was something i was not aware of, would be interesting to know how much travel time could have been improved if the tilting technology was able to be used properly
I think the savings of time is in the few minutes area, but with the tight Swiss clockface schedule those minutes matters a lot!
i cant really give an decent opinion on the twindexx since when i used it it was after sleeping seated on a night train from vienna to bregenz, then took the EC from there to zürich, and finally the twindexx to Geneva. The problem was since i really didnt sleep well, i was exhausted by the time i got in the last train and for a while i couldnt find a seat. Also being an introvert myself i found it surprising that there were mostly only 4 seat bays facing eachother, which i respect in a regional train but raised my brows. Also a personal comment on the seats, i know that in switzerland people mostly do short trips on trains, for for those longer journeys i wouldve expected more comfortable seats, also when talking about the headrest and reclinability. In the end i wend up and down at least 6 times trying to find a seat in an overbooked train (i found in the upper deck) but it really felt like going throught a maze hahaha. About the experience in the upper deck, i dont experience any rattling out of the ordinary and would take it again. (maybe a flexible ticket so to avoid finding a seat haha)
The Swiss do like bays of 4, yes, and as that's the safest way to have the seats aligned with the windows (something really appreciated in Switzerland by locals and visitors alike), I can't really fault them for that. Luckily, the Swiss aren't the most social, so even with someone sitting in front of you, you shouldn't feel obliged to strike up a conversation.
It's not Swiss railways' mistake, It's Bombardier's fault.
I'm not surprised...
Was the ride quality smooth and quiet?
It was alright. Deffo better trains but nothing bad either
How do you fix your camera at the window?
I shot this video on my phone handheld
Thank you. Good video but I wanted to see food service car.
There is no dining car on the Interregio version of this train I'm afraid
Is this the same type of train they run as a fast non stopping service from Lausanne to Geneva?
indeed it is!
@@markusstudeli2997 I used to live near Lausanne and work there but had a girlfriend in Geneva so that fast train was a life saver. I found the train fine but could get packed at peak times
Yes just the slighly nicer variant with a restaurant car!
De tog er en national skændsel. Stadler-fabrikken ligger praktisk talt i min baghave lige uden for St. Gallen. Med respekt for Bombardier for deres gode produkter, var det en alvorlig fejl ikke at købe lokalt.
Great video, Simon! I personally hate those trains. For the kind of prices to travel in Switzerland the seats and overall comfort of these trains is just not good enough, especially compared to more modern rolling stock like the Giruno or Traverso.
It is actually written as Chur but pronounced as Koor
Will keep that in mind for the future
@@Simon-Andersen it really wasn’t meant at all as a criticism but a polite comment.
We got trudeaud
You were told before: Bombardier has screwed up.
This is a major industrial accident. 30 years with this train, which has zero comfort, since it is not stable, especially at switches.