We Need an Alternative / Counter Cultural Intellectual Elite to Defend Our Civilisation
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- čas přidán 28. 06. 2024
- Prof. Frank Furedi, Emeritus Professor of Sociology at the University of Kent and author of "100 Years of Identity Crisis: Culture War Over Socialization" is interviewed by Dr. Philip Kiszely for "The War On Our History - A Cultural Revolution", episode 8 of our #NCFHeresies documentary series. To watch the full Heresies episode please click here: • Heresies Ep. 8: The Wa...
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I am studying Sociology at university and I totally agree, I find myself countering almost all of the content that is taught being a mature student. I plan to continue educating the educated!
My wife studied Sociology as a Mature Student. I got involved in it as a foil and aid to her work. I now regard Sociology as a Non Subject and should be ceased in all education facilities. Puerile drivel, dreadful conclusions from poor evidence.
Careful. Don't do that in class. The woke lecturers will mark you down as a troublemaker. No degree for you.
I wish you all the luck in the world for your endeavour although you've no chance in succeeding, they're too far gone.
I studied Sociology at Brunel in the 80s. Back than it felt like a truly mind-opening subject. I have worked in universities ever since (as a librarian) ... and have watched their gradual intellectual demise and ideological takeover with increasing sadness and dismay. I quit earlier this year. Our universities are lost
@Barry E She might have been raped or sexually abused by some step dad or mum's boyfriend. She sounds like she was having difficulty dealing with it.
Well done Mr Furedi. Please keep up the good work. The country needs you. It certainly isn’t the free country we grew up in.
Well done son ! It never Fuckin ' was! Free! Free all Furedis tae the skies !
This conversation made my think of the Monty Python sketch “what have the Romans ever done for us?”
I always have time to listen to Mr. Furedi .
Rich and nuanced discussion that gives me hope!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I can remember precisely the moment when Frank Furedi forced me to give myself permission to think for myself. The whole room got bigger, I got bigger, my mind was what took control. I had no money - I was a student, but I felt more powerful than I had ever felt before.
Much appreciated Professor. Just got your books and begun to look into sociology after a lifetime of lecturing and teaching sciences always in the context of our history. Students loved it but many colleagues....???? to my approach to true unbiased education, where my students were encouraged to question. The subtle changing of science and history started to become apparent to me in the seventies. Now as an oldie, long retired, I feel we must raise our voices and push back against the destruction of our culture. Many of my former students tell me they also despair and feel insecure in their academic posts and elsewhere. Sad state of affairs indeed. Collectively we will prevail over tyranny.
Excellent post . 👋👋👋👍
That's a good point - if I read my own personal history backwards, I wouldn't now like the person I was 30 yrs ago - but that person got me here, valuing this podcast.
Well said!
Furedi is great .
This show introduced me to Prof. Furedi, and reading one of his books made me realize how brilliant he is. Thanks! Gold standard ethics.
Wonderful. I very much appreciate that Prof Furedi points out the problem of holding contemporary individuals, groups, and nations accountable for the "crimes" and misdeeds of their ancestors. I think it's also important to remember that this "rule" only applies to representatives of the majority culture in the West, and not to those whose ancestors lived in the Middle East, Africa, or various parts of Asia.
The Right since 1945 got trapped inside the Liberal paradigm. Politics has been Classical Liberalism v Progressive Liberalism.
We need much wider and deeper thinking on the Right. Understanding why conservatives never ever actually conserve is the key question of our time.
The Left is the Establishment today. They are the status quo and the ones fighting to conserve their established norms. In short, the Progressive Left no longer progresses but desiccates in the past and monolithically adheres to its own barren narrative. They are the de facto Conservatives of today.
@@reconcostarica2362 yes. We are the revolutionaries now.
@Radical Centrist God great comment.
I think a big part of the problem was the centre Right parties got completely captured by international finance. "Big Money" particularly in America pulled the Right into a pro Individualism, Consumerism Globalisation position.
"Understanding why conservatives never ever actually conserve is the key question of our time."
Because it pays not to? Immigrants, sex reassignment surgeries, sex work, and having a market with no morals are all quite lucrative. Meantime, what do they have to lose? It's not like people will do anything about it.
@Radical Centrist God Well said. It's a matter of defining principles then sticking to them.
Sociology: The study of people who don’t need to be studied by people who do.
Brilliant 👍
Absolutely
I will take that statement to the grave thank you
Excellent summary
A breath of fresh air...
It reminds me of The old movie, Invasion of the body snatchers. If you look even slightly out of synch, they all point at you and start squealing, it’s horrific, you only have 2 choices, RUN, or become one of them. How long will it be before being cancelled from your job becomes being cancelled from life itself.
I'm ready to join the counter-intelligentsia. Been ready for 20 years. Let's go. Where's the hiring office?
Gotta find some counter cultural oligarchs to fund think tanks and universities on the "Western friendly" side of the culture wars first. With enough money, you can change the world, for better or worse. But if you are heavily outspent, you will always be a marginalized voice.
Caricaturizing the past has always been a favoured weapon of those who want to take power, or justify the power they have already taken.
This is such an important series, always interesting to hear from Professor Furedi.
Briilant insights. Furedi is a treasure!
Thank you. That was very good.
Best dressed channel
Another excellent and edifying episode. Thank you.
The negative aspects of our collective past were committed by ancestors of our present day elites, with whom the vast majority of decent people never need to identify. I consider them a separate species almost.
Absolutely most of us are descended from poor hard working people. Nothing to be ashamed off, only admiration for for everything they battled through. Strange the generation that by comparison has everything tries to demonise these truly remarkable people.
Not necessarily. Most of the mass murders of the 19th and 20th century were committed by people claiming to represent the working class - though of course the fact is that class has historically had little to do with whether individuals were murderous or otherwise criminal.
you are right. theres another intelligent species present..but they are infiltrated throughout society. they look like dinosaurs but their chief characteristic is criminality.
I agree, historical context is vital. It is near impossible to study Vygotsky without an appreciation of his historio-context
So true! And, as an educator, I studied Vygotsky. And, through the lens of historical context, the more relevant his ideas become.
@@davidtop8989 Did you experience Vygotsky as an opposition to Piaget? Or do you think (as I do) that both can be appreciated and it’s not a dichotomous topic. I came across Vygotsky a little I’m my studies but he also features highly in a therapeutic approach called Cognitive Analytic Therapy. Primarily ZPD but also his theories on teaching/educating
@@markhenryramsey9132 As an educator, I've never believed that this was a dichotomous topic. I simply studied both Piaget and Vygotsky in my learning theories classes. Piaget's Stages of Cognitive Development pertains to when a student is ready to learn a particular concept whereas Vygotsky's four stages in the Zones of Proximal Development deals with how something is to be taught in a stage by stage method. These are two different tools designed to address two different issues. For example: for students in preoperational stages (Kinder-2nd Grade) I do not teach rhythm in the same manner as I do in grades 3-6, because of Piaget theory. However, regardless of grade level, I still use Vygotsky's zones of proximal development to introduce a new skill pertaining to beat and rhythm moving from assisted to unassisted performance stages and then hoping that the student will continue to internalize the new skill as it is applied in class.
Very interesting discussion. I fully agree with your analysis of our desperate situation in western culture.
Thanks
I'm looking forward to this - sounds very interesting....
I needed to hear this….much thanks! It’s quite staggering how uproar over just a few aspects of our past, though legitimate in the context of debate, have succeeded in erasing perhaps many thousands of noticeably good achievements from view entirely. The psychological damage being quite extreme as we fluctuate between self questioning and an onslaught of negative spin.
When i studied Law at Coventry in the early 1970s, there was a legend written over the toilet roll holders in the student lavatory. It said ...... "Sociology Degrees. Please Take One!" Things have only got worse since.
If you listen carefully you can hear the clanking sound of Prof Furedi being cancelled in the background
*_The 'Cogs' of wokeness are already in motion ..._*
Great comment. We'll take no notice. Some people are too culturally relevant to cancel.
Not only a fascinating discussion, but also a fine sartorial display. I love Dr. Kiszely's dapper dress sense!
I have a niece who has a degree in sociology...... took her 9 years to get it, all paid for by her family she never worked and still hasn't.
Woke: the empty shell of Christianity without belief. All the guilt and helping and caring without context, forgiveness, and purpose. Chesterton knew this poison well 100 years ago.
The recognition of guilt is universal. The ability to recognize and desire to deal with it is part of the religious impulse. The relief at knowing that God has permanently removed your guilt when you bind yourself to Him is the unique contribution of the christian gospel.
What a very wise intelligent man, it was a real pleasure listening to him. He should go on different tv channel's, so other people can hear his wise words, it would really make them feel better. God bless him🙏🙏
People need to read Spengler’s Decline of the West and Burnham’s Suicide of the West.
The question of how we got here was answered my these men a long time ago, be humble and read them. Then we can move forward trying to think of a remedy to the problem.
Good discussion. Thank you.
Thank you, very rich conversation. 👏👏👏👏👏
Agree! He put into words what I have been observing. So insightful. Thank you for sharing your thoughts with us. I had a very bad elementary teacher that set me back for 3+ years yet that experience also made me the strong person I am today. Adversity strengthens our will.
I realised something was off with 'the humanities' subjects as soon as I started college after high school. The first thing that I recall our Sociology lecturer covering was 'Sex and Gender', and the focus was on sex and gender being distinct from each other (totally ignoring the evidence from the rest of the animal kingdom that indicates our biological sex strongly influences our 'gender'). Humans seem determined to be at odds with their nature, and that's not a great idea.
Glad you realised something was off during your classes.
If I may, I'd like to correct your last sentance.
"There are certain humans that are determined to force others to be at odds with their nature, not only is this a bad idea, but a very dangerous one."
Isn’t the real difficulty with the absence of context the fact that history, as such, is not even a compulsory subject in British schools.
You really do get some brilliant, clear thinkers on New Culture Forum. Such a pity they are so outnumbered in the modern world.
I wish they'd have talked more about how to experiment creating New Institutions...
... What had its beginning in the Anglophone World in the 80s, is now a very strange reality everywhere in the West. That's precisely what is happening in Portugal, for example...
Japan too. The US deliberately exports its ideas, whether good or (as now) bad.
I agree with his views of how we judge the past through a filter of the present which skews our final judgment unfairly at times - people in the past behaved in the context of the circumstances of that specific time. However, there is a distinction to be made between wrongs driven by mistaken beliefs and perceptions on the one hand, and those driven by greed, corruption and a hunger for unquestioned power on the other. We can move beyond the former, learn from our mistakes without persecution. The latter is more difficult and maybe the best redemption would be to take steps, as a society, to keep powers in check and call them out on the vicious behavior that will one day be the savage history our descendants will be judged on and forced to redeem themselves from. We continue to be engaged in savagery but we are now more distant from it on a personal level because technology allows us to commit these acts from a distance - but the reality is we are equally culpable.
Well said. Part of the difficulty is having moderate self - interest without that very human characteristic of tending to extremes. 🤔
brilliant guest!
There are good sociologists like Kevin MacDonald
Did he write Culture of Critique?
Heather McDonald as well.
Sociology should be taken off the university curriculum definitely, to many students are taking this as an easy option ,
The problem lies much more with universities,not individual subjects.
Isn’t this Cultural Marxism, where one must be perfect to be good? Hence, eventually they will be attacking each other because constant class struggle will demand such? Read for example “Wild Swans: Three Daughters of China” by Jung Chang (the granddaughter). She had to change her name because it roughly sounded like “fading red” which insinuated weakness in the CCP and the Cultural Revolution. Also in Solzhenitsyn’s “Gulag Archipelago”, Solzhenitsyn wrote about when an agency was created to report “bad people,” it became an implacable, voracious beast that demanded daily victims, and hence people within the bureaucracy attacked each other to fill the quota.
To rule, a segment of the populace must be conscripted, by bribes or fear. It bears considering what kind of society might successfully resist.
I was under the impression criticism of the past was designed to show how enlightened and more civilised and tolerant we are now
The ability to dissociate and uproot people's anchoring points makes them malleable to the most predatory of ideologues
Thank you for this great interview.
What an excellent man, I couldn't agree with you more.
Excellent conversation and sentiments, thanks. cheers
The points being made are obviously true and more importantly relate to a selective interpretation of events.
eg slave societys have existed over many 1000's years but only the Western European involvement 200 years ago is emphasised.
Why those with political power have succumbed to the disastrous message being spread is more important and NEVER addressed !
Why is that ?
Woke offers two simple alternatives: submission or trouble.
Most people submit - from academia to govt.
Thank you both, Good Doctors. I love history - and its social environs - and would have lapped up any and all lectures should I have been fortunate enough to have ever been a student under either of your stewardship.
The issue is the education of history is presented through the lens of ideology... no 3 guesses as to what ideology we are referring to and their objectives...
All I know is that 25% of professors in sociology identify _themselves_ as adhering to an ideology that murdered many millions of innocent people in the 20th century.
Funny that they want to hold all the people who adhere to ideologies that did _not_ murder millions of innocents responsible for events that happened centuries ago.
Without the Industrial Revolution there would not have been any mills. The people benefitted greatly from working in mills. Before the mills they lived in abject poverty.
Exactly so, read "sapiens" yuvall noah harrari. It explains the true history of the human race. Then I realised how incredibly fortunate we are now.
its good that older academics are beginning to man the barricades against the ravenning savages from hell.
Blaming me for something my great, great grandfather did, seems pretty out of order to me. Just saying.
Who is blaming you. Don't be a victim
As far as I'm aware my great grandfather was great :-). And if he wasn't, I have nothing to feel shame for - he was his own person.
Nice bit of “bbc hands” from the interviewer!
"The past is a foreign country..............."
It’s an alluringly familiar foreign country.
Very interesting lecture.
There is a solution.
Irish politics was long cursed by the slogan "Remember 1689".
Defund the universities!
The weak are being pushed forward by chaos, and they want revenge...
I'm so pleased to have seen this, it's a brilliant explanation to what has gone wrong.(idiot AI on CZcams monitoring me)
Patriotic Alternative is the only option to protect and preserve our people and culture.
Laura Towler who has a channel on Odysee does great work.
Nice to see two well dressed gentlemen.
Why can't people like Frank furedi be in cabinet ??!!!!! He dismantles woke is 30 seconds flat,meanwhile the whole cabinet is hiding behind the sofa afraid of causing offence!!(ffs)
Whatever cabinet ministers say, the civil service continue with their woke world view.
Lived Experience is the same as standpoint epistemology. Imagine a piece of paper with the figure 6 written on it. Lie it on the floor at your feet. People facing you will read the 6 as a 9. Neither of you are wrong, and it depends on your viewpoint as to whether it is a 6 or 9.
This is 'lived experience', your perception of what is true is your truth.
Standpoint epistemology is an attempt to overthrow the idea of an objective materialist scientifically established reality.
This is Post Modernism, the argument they hold to when dismissing established material facts like 2+2=4.
The point Professor Furedi makes four minutes in, is why I prefer to refer to 'Woke' by its real, definitive, name of 'American Communism'. American undergraduates used to be comparatively dim, compared with their British equivalents: to the extent that they could perceive nothing wrong with Communism: nor that they were being indoctrinated into 'thinking like a Communist', whilst at 'college', by huge swathes of American Communist 'academics'. Naturally, those 'academics' added 'race' into the mix: so that when American Communism came to the UK, it shared all of the character traits of its original American form.
Defund Sociology as a subject; it has become way too woke and politically weaponised - no problem in studying sociological issues as part of another subject like Psychology or History though.
True.
Agreed
👍🏻
Is furedis book going to be available in audio form?
I challenged a Sociology professor in Glasgow university (previously amongst the top 20 in the entire world). The content was a 70 year old theory stipulating how the elite are required to keep balance and their monopolisation of our resources is for our own good. Once i raised a few facts, she told me literally to shut up, and my opinion was not relevant unless i was a peer (i pointed out i already have a degree), yet she told me that was as relevant 'as why i wear a stupid hat every day' - I had lost my dad not too long previous and i would hide my face with a hat. So yeah, i left. F*** them. I can self teach. I'd rather suffer those results than be silenced by any ideologue ever again whos only bearings in debate are personal slants and shut downs.
I reminded her that ideology was the tool of the Nazis to corrupt an entire nation - and that Nuremburg rulings firewalled against it's rise in the future and she would do well to learn history instead of impirical shite.
Name and shame. Don't be shy.
Did you challenge her during a lecture or in a smaller group meeting such as a tutorial?
If the former, perhaps it was mainly about saving face?
@@sirrathersplendid4825 Time and place is always a consideration. To ignore them is boorish, even if egalitarian.
Sat sociology classes for 9 months.I can honestly say I didn't learn anything apart from a few common sense concepts, dressed up in jargon.Its a non subject practiced by charlatans.
The problem is not the subject but the Marxist ideologues who control it. Rodney Stark's introductory text _Sociology_ is very good, although the subject still needs to be integrated into Darwinian thought, which all the social sciences (including economics) have been fiercely resisting for a century.
Sounds like bob Marley
Another name for advocacy research would be applied confirmation bias! Where the researcher is not looking for what they can learn from their research but are only interested in finding support for their belief and discount the research that disproves or poses a logical challenge to their belief!
When your mom rode a horse to school and your grandfather was still living in a log home with no electricity, you didn't need to really have too much history, you know life seems to have really sucked in the past
Yet kids were taught history then, and certainly no worse so than today. Even illiterate societies preserve stories about their past. That is a key difference between man and beast.
29:20 it's interest Frank is in favour of what's happening in Hungary. Outsiders tend to utterly misunderstand the stand Orban's moves against Marxist indoctrination in universities.
I'm proud to be scottish and british. The Woke Brigade are retro-fitting the values of today into history. That is not the right way to study history. Long live the british Commonwealth.
There is nothing wrong with sociology as a discipline, the fault lies with the liberalized academics teaching it.
those who live in the past die without future.
Sounds like a fortune cookie.
God has no future, no past
It seems weird to hear two intellectuals talking about what is basically just leg pulling and taking the p**s out of each other at work in this way. It's a bit sad too. I always used to say to colleagues, 'if you can't have a laugh at work what is the point of it?'
But Frank, we cannot back Nato. In any circumstance.
So many based Hungarians, and Eastern Europeans in general!
But there is hope as the woke are infantilized and enfeebled by this rigid orthodoxy and will be incapable of resisting any serious sustained attack should that ever happen...
Sociology's basic premise is all societies, all civilization's and all groups are equally valid.....just not true
Edward Said has a lot to answer for. The rise of the agressively hostile attitude to the cultural history of its host societies now almost the principal characteristic of large parts of academia, closely parallels the failure of other academics at the time to question some of his methods and conclusion because of racism; and the incremental conversion of antipathetic and plain wrong ideas into a widely taught and unchallengeable dogma. Academia is a hot mess. Everyone knows it but fears what the counter-revolution and reaction will be like. I suspect it will fade away as the students decide to go elsewhere.
Sociology was the only course in college that I dropped, the professor was a neurotic, hot mess.
A Hungarian genius 🇭🇺 💜
Yes, George Soros is Hungarian as well... 😂
Sheesh, I hope the "woman" academic from "Aberystwyth" was really a man from Bangor, o/w she's going to be sniffed out and cancelled. Amazing that we have to have these fears
problem you've got is that you're trying to deal with people who don't believe in truth in a rational way, which is impossible.
People are getting jobs on the basis of their political views. Ability and experience are no longer important. God forbid I ever get on a train whose driver is into really cancelling everyone aboard.
Paradoxically, Sociology is a valuable and important subject. But not when it's used as a stick to beat people with. Kids need education not Indoctrination.
As long as assets remain privately owned, ideology will swamp science and reason.
Looks like Mad Frankie Fraser's educated brother.