Ex-Post Office boss hits out at Tory government after accusations of lying
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- čas přidán 26. 02. 2024
- Henry Staunton brought receipts to the Business and Trade Committee this afternoon after Kemi Badenoch accused him of lying earlier this month.
The Business Secretary said that claims the Post Office was encouraged to delay payments to sub-postmasters affected by the Horizon scandal were lies in the House last week, but Mr Staunton arrived in Westminster today with evidence backing his claims.
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I would believe this bloke over Badenoch ANY day
they are both bad eggs but yeah I agree.
Do you believe his own CEO who called him a liar
@@terrysmith9362The ceo of the post office?
@@honved1 yes
Really? You've failed the IQ test. Both are not to be trusted.
Time & Reason are the two key issues that need examining.
He wrote his "filenote" back in early 2023 after a meeting so he had a record of what he was been asked to do whereas Badenoch & Mumby wrote their "letters" last week in response to fallout from the TV programme.
I've more faith that his recollections are nearer to the truth than theirs.
Badenoch fearful that she could lose her job, and negatively affect the tory party in the general election. So has to come back with something to save her skin. If it wasn't for the itv drama, all this would have been swept under the rug by the UK government.
That was the most damaging thing i gathered from this. His notes were from at the time of the conversation. The other parties notes were just written
yes I agree with you on the above the MP is the one not telling the truth.........
@@Jonathanbaker It turns out this badenoch is a serial liar. A compulsive liar, exposed quite a few times now by other groups. I try not to follow too much politics as all sides are compulsive lairs and will pandr to anybody and everybody to get their vote. So missd out on the salient details of this canada deal that badenoch was gloating about. Till the canadians went public and said ther was not such thing. In the thread where i read this the author mentioned a few more other cases where she was exposed as somebody who was quiteliberal with the truth. oh, yes. Badenoch stated that she was in touch with some LGBT+ group. Till they went public as well and said that no such thing happened.
Absolutely, there's a reason why contemporaneous notes are valid in court,like a police officers notebook.
And there's a reason why contemparaneous notes are a good idea when dealing with politicians.
no brainer he was told that
these people willingly gave our nation austerity and dint bat an eyelid... let that sink in.
Badenoch lied about the Canadian trade deal until the Canadian government called he a liar. She lied about working closely with LGBT groups until they called her a liar and said she never met them. She lied about Staunton saying he was making this up - a case of sour grapes for her sacking him -until he revealed the contemporaneous file note which forced her to change tack. So - do we believe the Mr Staunton or compulsive liar Badenoch ???
I would believe Henry Staunton. They made up their file notes last week in cahoots to sully his name. Awful. Whilst this is about post office masters and mistresses, the pressure he must be under by this besmirch must be immense
looks like a pattern to me
lets not forget even before her political 'career' took off she was caught hacking into a Labour MPs computer/email ... she is a dreadful, corrupt liar
agree her credibility has certainly been called into question by the other three circumstances...she does not like to be challenged on anything
@@CaptainFearless1 I think its called petulance.
Fijitsu must pay their share, not taxpayers yet again. This is blatant lying, corruption, bullying and singling out individuals to believe they were the only one. Absolutely shocking doesnt even cover a 'government ' doing this to their own people. What on earth is happening in this country???
Public vote and referendum on whether tax payers money should be used. Sick and tired of governments wasting tax payers money without public consultation.
I think Fijitsu should pay the most as it was their product that caused all the problems
The problem is whilst Fijitsu is far from blameless and must pay a share, this is a tortious conspiracy to which Post Office Limited owned solely by the Crown is liable. Tort liability is joint and several, meaning as a matter of law every defendant is liable to all the costs and it is for the defendants to settle the share amongst themselves or by separate court order. So using the number of 100k for simplicity, with a 50/50 fault distribution (which again is for simplicity it is ultimately for the court or statutory inquiry to determine the exact distribution) that doesn't mean that both are liable to 50k, it means that the Post Office and Fijitsu are jointly liable to the Sub-Postmaster in the amount of 100k, and the Sub-Postmaster may recover that judgment from both or either defendant shared between them however they like. If the Post Office pay 50k and Fijitsu fail to pay, the 50k is outstanding against both of them, if the Post Office then pay it, they may sue Fijitsu to recover that 50k but ultimately the Post Office didn't have a choice but to pay it until then. Fijitsu was not the only one, the Post Office knew but didn't want others to find out.
Fujitsu have said they are prepared to pay up, to be fair. Their representative seems to be the only one who has sat there and said yes we were at fault, this was a disaster and we will pay what the inquiry tells us to pay without argument.
@@suky1973 So you want a referendum on whether the Post Office should have to pay compensation? Because the Post Office is tax payer funded.
Hands up everyone who thinks Badenock is a liar ?🙋♂️🙋♂️🙋♀️🙋♂️🙋♂️🙋♀️🙋♀️🙋♂️🙋♀️
Thought so !
She is a Tory phone hacker.
I won't believe anything she says as far as I could gob.
👨👨👦👦🙋🏼🙋🏻♂️🙋🏾♂️🙋♂️🙋🏼🙋🏻♂️🙋🏾♂️🙋🏾♂️🙋♂️🙋♂️🙋🏾♂️🙋🏾♂️🙋🏻♂️🙋🏼🙋🏼🙋🏾♂️🙋♂️🙋♂️🙋🏾♂️🙋🏾♂️🙋🏻♂️🙋🏼🙋🏼🙋🏻♂️🙋🏾♂️🙋🏾♂️🙋♂️🙋♂️🙋🏾♂️🙋🏾♂️🙋🏻♂️🙋🏻♂️🙋🏼🙋🏿♂️🙋🏿♂️🙋🏿♂️🙋♂️🤮🙋🏼🙋🏻♂️🙋🏾♂️🙋♂️🙋🏿♂️
Me!
Me too
🙋
Ask Betfred what odds you'd get that the Tory minister is telling the truth.
I asked them earlier. They told me to make up my own odds with a minimum bet of £20 (which just about covers their paperwork costs)
My mate Darren,a bookies runner would say how has a nutter like you got the money to make bets with.
Are they lips moving? Then don’t believe a word they say
😂 Tory telling the truth!!!
Badenoch has a history of accusing anyone who disagrees or challenges her a liar
He should have Badenoch prosecuted for libel.
@donmac7780: I think you mean slander unless she's committed her lies about Staunton to writing. Yes, I agree with you 100%.
She'd probably be protected by parliamentary privilege
@@user-hd8fj2mb5p Yes, quite right.
@@andrewmark2783surely she would have to come out and apologize to the house at least
She can say more or less what she likes in the House, because of Parliamentary privilege. If she repeats outside what she said inside, Staunton could, and should, launch an action for defamation against her. Let's all sit back and see if she repeats what she said, without the protection the House of Commons gives her. Anyone taking bets?
Badenough has gone AWOL, has anyone seen her, where is she.
@@fuertewelly exactly my thoughts!
She’s on the gravy 🚂
She's nipped out to post a letter
Hopefully locked up along with the rest of her ilk!
She has gone back to the bottom of the barrel that she scraped from.
Kemi is a gigantic liar, an absolute pro
She is very bad at politics also, despite her arrogance and sneering at others
Stop calling it compensation, it's money owed to them, a refund. Compensation is what they will have to pay to COMPENSATE for all the distress caused by being wrongly accused of a crime they did not commit!
Precisely this is repayment of stolen money.
Not really. SOME of that money is money that needs to be refunded, but a lot of it IS compensation, that is why it is so much, and also why so few claims have been settled.
@@davidcolin6519listen to Mr Bates
Question
Did kemi badenoch sack Henry Staunton because she felt that he had gone rogue
Staunton evidence was explosive regarding Disfunctional relationships at the top of the post office
The govt are now in massive. Trouble
They should exclude the post office from any further involvement in this appalling scandal
The police must commence criminal investigation
And most importantly the sub postmasters must immediately receive full financial redress
Sunak must get a grip of this
Too many innocent people are suffering
Don't hold your breath waiting on Sunak doing anything about giving the little people money.
Good luck with that. Still waiting, I see.
Badenough is a liability to any government. In any normal time, she would be history, but this government has scraped the bottom of the barrel so often, the likes of Badenough are all that is left!
Seems like a honest man to me
But they have spent more on fighting these innocent people than the compensation would have cost
Yes, and Post Office Ltd are making the sub-postmasters jump through years of legal hoops to put in a claim. When the S-PMs think they've got their paperwork together, they're asked for more & more detail, some going back 20 years.
If I was a cynic, I'd say that there's ppl in authority (mostly politicians and civil servants) who are *STILL* trying to bury this shabby shambles in red tape, long grass and legalese. *PAY THE SPMs NOW.*
That is the irony here. By their criminally negligent behaviour, both The Post Office and Fujitsu have done infinitely more damage to their corporate brands than if they had admitted liability and mistakes at the time, and paid up. Culpable heads need to roll, and we need to campaign that both companies are censured and fined punatively. Fujitsu should lose opportunities to quote for any government contracts over the next five years.
@@silversurfer8278 Exactly. Watching Vennells the other day, once the darling of the business world with her OBE and accolades, I thought "has it been worth it?" Now, public shame and humiliation. Probably will never appear in public again until the courtroom beckons. And it could all have been avoided. So much suffering for so long. And the only people getting rich are the lawyers.
Unlike the Gov, he doesn’t delete his messages.
Also, unlike everyone at the enquiry, he knows his job.
We have money for wars, with nothing to do with us? But not for our own people who need compensation. These people have suffered
I certainly agree on your second point. However, on the money for wars, I would only add that money for Ukraine means not having to fight the Russians ourselves.
@@petergaskin1811 I believe that phrase is regarding the actions in the middle east where we are fighting, but the benefit of a country who are capable of defending their own country, and side note: crimes against humanity-again.
@@petergaskin1811 How would Russia ever invade us? Surely we'd just threaten use of Nuke's. The reason they could invade Ukraine is because they gave up their nuclear weapons to Russia in exchange for not being invaded. We all saw how that worked out..
And we can't house our homeless but everyone else's you only need to look who is mayor mps pm
Not looking after English people
Mumby is a classic example of what president Nixon use to call ‘little people in big jobs’….
Ditto every involved party in the Post Office. Stephen B's a jumped-up bouncer.
We're quoting Nixon now.....yo gods. Well, I guess this shower really are that bad!!!
typo: ye gods! 😡
I would believe anyone over Badenock any time any day. She has zero idea.
Post Office claims another scalp. Kemi Badenoch's career is over.
Let's hope so, just for starters, eh?
I know who I believe and it’s not a tory
The irony is Badenoch picked this fight for absolutely no reason, but liars just can't help themselves.
What's the probability of someone lying if say, one was a guy in industry and the other was a tory politician? Tricky one, not! 🤣
Seems like an honourable man....and also is not a Government minister.
A true rationalist. 👍
@@huwzebediahthomas9193 I find the two to be mutually exclusive these days. If you were able to look up "honourable conservative government minister" the entry should read "See: Oxymoron".
Seems like a totally dishonourable man and a liar. Happily he has dug himself a hole which is getting deeper all the time. Forensic examination of his contemporaneous note might well settle the argument.
This guy is answering the question he is asked novel considering most obfuscate waffle and deflect .
Exactly, no ums and ahs, answers the questions asked of him.
Unlike Johnson, Stergen, and Co.
Unlike Johnson*
The only time he 'tripped up' was when he mentioned 'poor government, governance' 😂
What! A tory politician telling lies? I've never heard of such a thing... no wait...!
We had VIP Fast Track for PPE. Tory mates were given Hundreds of Millions within weeks. Just saying.
Baroness Mone still moaning!
@@bigpants6121any normal pleb from down the road would have been banged up for months if you stole millions from the state....
banged up for months... waiting for a proper trial!!
The way to sort out this is to put them under oath and ask them the questions again. It’s amazing how the threat of perjury can affect a person’s recollections. Without that the he said she said will continue.
Thank God there's someone at last who knows and can tell the truth!
Braverman is as honest as the day is lo.... oh my, is that the time?
Carpe Diem. Particularly when up to your neck in the brown stuff!
🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂😄😉😉😉
Key thing for me is that he answered the question he was asked and with detail. No ummms and aaahs and pivots and trying to distract from the question being asked. Told them what he knew... Its not hard is it!!!
I would believe him over an mp any day of the week
Classic public sector. Making him look bad because he's called them out
It’s one “hell of a mess”. The government wants everything to slow down.
Where is the money then??????
Kemi is lying 😂😂
She is a liar. Why is she still in Government?
Because their all liars
'cause sunak has no balls
The first point of Bad- Enoch's response clearly states budget is above all- in other words don't spend too much.
SO,.....where is the liar badinock? anyone seen her?
She's in her burrow
or under her rock.
So let me get this straight, we’ve gone through this scandal, it’s evident that this has happened and they are owed compensation, and now we don’t want to give it them, or at least pause it for years
I belive Mr Staunton
It's rare and refreshing to see such a frank exchange of information at a Committee
who's telling the truth, the liar in government or the liar from the post office?? as Harry Hill says there's only one way to find out.....
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
Hang on he was only appointed after the cover up had been exposed. He is not on trial for the faults of his predecessors.
why is the gov (us) paying out the compo? should be any managers/CEO's pensions and fukitsu.
Yes yes yes. Of course it should. But it won't. All thick as thieves, Govt, PO managers and board. They should lose their homes too. Be made to sit outside supermarkets begging .
Henry Staunton made Chair of Post Office December 2022. You can't blame him for the obfuscation and delay of compensation, when clearly hamstrung by the Government.
The real culprits are The Government with their collusion with Fujitsu and the former Post Office Management at the time of the cover up,. The Government's very strong connection with Fujitsu is disturbing. Simon Blagden, who stepped down as non-executive director at Fujitsu UK in 2019, was made chair of the government agency responsible for delivering faster broadband and mobile coverage in 2022 which was three years after the court ruling! Blagden was appointed chair of Building Digital UK (BDUK) by then digital secretary Nadine Dorries, who praised his “wide breadth of experience” including 14 years working at Fujitsu. Blagden is being paid £80,000 for two days a week during his four-year term as chair, according to the government’s announcement. Since 2005, Blagden and companies he is closely associated with have donated £376,000 to the Conservatives. That's before you get on to Tory Minister, Gillian Keegan's husband's role within Fujitsu and other suspicious connections and lobbying.
Doesn't it get interesting when you delve into a number of Conservative MP's 'connections'?
It must be another reason why increasing numbers of the electorate have such a negative opinion of MP's generally.
Tory minister accuses PO manager of lying?
Pot! Kettle!! Utensil of Colour!’
Excellent responses from staunton.....100% reliable.
Kemi slinging the mud in the wrong direction...
Have thought for some time Read was the problem..
I believe him over her .
The Tory English Post Office is now BUST!!
Much of this happened under Labour. The Post Office executives are uncaring and corrupt. Even now they are witholding information.
@@markhorton8578PO only said that had problem well after 2010.
13 years of Tory rule and still people blame labor. What a joke
@@jakeblair4215 This started under labour, but it is not a political thing. It's greed and corruption among post office bosses chasing bonuses, instead of paying attention to their jobs.
Damages must be punitive even if it bankrupts the post office. But people must go to prison for this.
Badenoch is a liar , sounds perfectly qualified to be the next Tory leader
Money isn't tight. Money is money. People are tight. The treasury is tight. They are tight because the government doesn't tax the rich and are complicit in tax-avoidance. This won't change with Labour either. They've said as much.
When he said the replacement of the Horizon system was too expensive, it suggests that he is not making responsible for all their technical, organisational and management mistakes! They should be held jointly liable.
Fujitsu Japan saw these complete idiots coming.
I do wish everyone would stop referring to the money owed to sub-postmasters as "compensation". It largely isn't. It's repaying them for the money taken from then. On top of that they should also be given compensation. There's a clear distinction. And both should be paid from the Post Office funds. Paula Vennells and her co-conspirators then need to be prosecuted, then sent to prison and also made to pay back their bonuses etc
Aahhh... Sunak's government of "transparency" and "integrity" in full view. But a significant proportion of the English electorate will vote, _yet again,_ like compliant sheep, for this lot of grifters.
What a liar !
Not looking good for Kemi Badenoch.
Staunton is a consummate professional who provides compelling evidence and, most importantly, contemporaneous notes. Badenough is just a professional liar and Mumby her willing skivvy. What have they got to say now after Staunton has convincingly nailed their lies?
Of course BADenoch is a LIAR.
She's a tory, isn't she?
Why were horizon not made to pay..... why is it us once again???
There you go, in full colour. What are they, I said they are all these years. It’s in their cruel blood
It's the worst, now.
Someone please tell them, the British Empire is now long GONE!!!
I believe the gentleman - 200%…
One liar calling out another liar.
No compensation money for Postmasters, but billions for the forever war.
They are still trying to dodge the truth.
It takes one to know one LIARS INCORPORATED.
Not really.
Thank you for posting this discussion!😊
JAPAN PISSING THEMSELFS AT US.
Wouldn't be surprised if this heads to the courts for a slander case
Just wondering who is building the Horizen replacement. God forbid it's not Fugitsu again. . .
Probably one of our beloved prime minister's wife's dad's business which she just happens to have a few shares in
The Post Office are claiming they are building the replacement in house but I don't think they have the skills to do this. I think it might be worth sending them a Freedom of Information Request as they are not disclosing anything about the Horizon Replacement Project which is unusual and not very transparent. However it may be the case that the Government is planning to close the Post Office down and replace the whole thing with a new organisation, who knows?
It's being built in house which likely means it's actually being done by consultancy firms Accenture and CoForge. They did have a contract with IBM but they cancelled that contract after work had already started in another great waste of money.
You would have fewer budget concerns if you made the executives pay back the bonuses from the money they extorted from their employees
Someone give the coughing man a glass of water......😮😮😮
I do think Henry Staunton has nothing to gain by lying but the other person has a lot to gain by getting her lie to stick.
She needs to go
Never trust a tory
Pump the brakes on payouts we need to maximise room for tax cuts - those were his instructions more or less
Until the Bates programme the Government were happy to drag their heels ( 4% paid )The resulted uproar suddenly hit the government as to their liability financially and bearing in mind how little cash the government has would tend to suggest to me that wanted it slowed done.
Yes indeed. They can find limitless money for Ulez infrastructure, sending to Ukraine etc but couldn't give a dam about these poor postmasters. It's abhorrent. 😡
Horizon has the cash.
Watch Badenoch in the Commons and you quickly understand that her only tactic is to bully, point fingers and threaten those who stand up to her.
This is jus another example of her poor behaviour and tactics.
The Government's oversight of this affair from Cameron in coalition through to Sunak has been appalling , Starmer has also been useless
Who I hear who is now laughing the loudest, is Liam Byrne above here.
The Tories have been quoting him since May 2010. He's enjoying this, laughing very loud.
Badenoch is liar like all Tories!
Absolutely!!!
Here’s what will happen , the government will pay out as little as possible , the lawyers will get the biggest share , the post office will get a new computer system that will cost millions and still not work and the sub postmasters will be shafted yet again , by the way it will take years to do it .
It seems to me that Mr Staunton is an entirely reliable witness.
I think he’s muddying the waters
Believe him above badenoch or any other of those claiming hes a liar .
I know who i believe...without evidence.
Badenoch couldn't win an egg and spoon race
Politicians are never above lying.
For all he said why are people still waiting.......
Blame anyone...anything but themselves. They knew. THEY ALL KNEW !!!
The Justice System knew !!!
It's obviously true. Kemi ur finished
She is a lier
Absolute power corrupts absolutely.
May not be a liar but the whole debacle demonstrates clear unequivocal incompetence
Shocking how the people involved haven’t been arrested charged and remanded into custody.. these inquiries are a fkin joke
Both Sarah Munby and Henry Staunton could have been telling the truth. She told him that money was tight. He told her there were three levers, of which sub-postmaster compensation was one. She probably chose her words very carefully and said something to the effect that he must minimise expenditure, without being explicit about how to do it. She probably did not tell him to delay the compensation, but just left him with that clear impression.
That's the job of civil servants. Say everything and nothing 😂
It’s all good and well having enquiries but no Tory will end up in jail where they belong
Compensation should come from executives pension funds and reclaimed bonuses.