Jane Austen Week: Mansfield Park
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- čas přidán 7. 09. 2024
- In which I discuss Mansfield Park, my second favourite Jane Austen novel. Now I know it's not everybody's favourite, but let's not underestimate the true glory of Fanny Price and of the enchanting Crawfords.
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One of the interesting historical/cultural insights in the novel is the conversation about whether Fanny is "out" or not.
So weird, Mansfield Park literally fell off my bookshelf this morning!! Haha it's a sign!
+Boho Bookworm Must be! :)
It's the aliens. 👽 And the aliens are us! - Interstellar
Fall -- czcams.com/video/NQMACFhMgvs/video.html
It's the sign of a good writer that he/she doesn't use the same character as protagonist in every novel. I mean, Lizzie Bennet and Fanny Price are so different. Some really popular writers who excel in certain ways still fall short here: every protagonist has the same personality.
They're such great characters.
Wow I'm really happy to find someone who appreciate and love Mansfield Park as much as I do it!! It's my second fave of Jane Austen's novels. I don't know why people find it quite boring!! I will always defend this amazing book.
I only disagree with you about Henry Crawford, as a characer I like him, but I think he was very inconstant. I wasn't sure about his love for Fanny. I think he was like Willoughby, he loved Marianne, but he wasn't willing to keep a straight life.
I love Mansfield Park so much - it's such a brilliant novel. I find Henry Crawford very interesting, but I do find Willoughby very interesting too - men who have the potential to be better than they are and fail.
I totally agree with you! I know a lot of people who find this book quite boring and uninteresting, but I love it! Fanny is so different from all the other heroines, and very much relatable to me. Fantastic book! :)
+ElizabethAnneBooks Exactly! Glad to find you agree. I feel like even in the comments of this video there has been a lot of mixed opinions! I like that Fanny is different and I just think it's a fascinating book :)
I came to love, in reflection, that of all the very clever, witty lines in the book, Fanny had none of them. She noticed everything, had an opinion on everything, had a lot of self-doubt and Jane Austen did a beautiful job of entertaining us with those reminders. She was a lot more like Catherine Morland than Elizabeth Bennet.
It was those around her that all the brilliant lines. And that took away nothing from the story. On the contrary, it added to it. Even when she was more favored by Sir Thomas, she was all propriety
I'm so glad to find people who loved this underrated novel! I read it recently for Jane Austen July and loved it! Fanny is a stronger character than most people give her the credit for. I feel like most people just don't understand how great a power being morally correct is !
It's just such an amazing novel. I love it so much!
@@katiejlumsden yass!
I loved Henry Crawford. He was the reason I couldn’t put the book down once he realized he fell in love with Fanny.
Henry was the only one in the story who fell in love with someone based on observations of how that person acted with others.
I love Mansfield Park too
It's a wonderful book :)
I love the book! And the only adaptation worth anything is the 1983 version. I've never been able to finish the others. They all do every character an injustice, and alter them beyond recognition.
I felt the same way about Henry Crawford!! So sad!
He's such an interesting character.
I thought he was interesting too but it would have been very much against the moral of the story, plus I simply cannot believe that he would turn his life around which I think is showcased when he has frustration sex with Maria
If you like fanfiction then I recommend 'Everingham' on AO3. For me, it's the perfect alternate ending where Fanny and Henry end up together!
Ha I'll have to check that out!
Fanny’s situation is difficult since she has no power. No money, no status. She is forced to ALWAYS be polite. That takes inner strength!
I totally agree I was prepared to read a boring book because of the reviews I had read, and I found a great novel. Please no need to run , you are doing great and you defends your ideas cleverly . Congartiulation.Thanks for the video.
Have you seen the 1983 adaptation by the BBC? It's the closest to the book and Fanny (played by Silvestre le Touzel) is fairly accurate. It's my favourite version.
I have seen it. I do think it's the closest, but I still didn't love it. I found it a little slow? I think because Fanny is so internal, it's really hard to capture her on screen.
Mansfield Park is my absolute favorite as I can relate so much to sweet Fanny. My life is not exactly like Fanny's nor does it so struggling. However, my real life relatives are in many ways like those depicted in the book.
She is a wonderful character.
Mansfield Park is one of my favorites as well. I love Fanny Price and Edmond and so happy that they married! I disliked the Father of Edmond the most because he owned plantations in America and he was extremely brutal and wicked to black people! That was the worst part of this story. His oldest son was also one of my favorite characters because his father's treatment of black people caused him to be as disturbed as he was and angry with his father; that showed his humanity!
I did think your comment about how Mansfield Park explores issues of class, poverty, and 'belonging' very interesting, however, and whole-heartedly agree with you about the folly of reducing Fanny Price to another Elizabeth Bennet facsimile.
Great video... Thanks for sharing.
I still haven't read all Jane Austen's novel, but Mansfield Park is certainly one of my favorite novel... I've just finished reading it... and I really love Fanny Price or love her character... Far from being boring, she's one of the most alive and true character I've ever read. Jane Austen just plunge in the deepest of her soul, sharing with the reader her deepest aspiration of love, sharing... All that glitters is not gold... Some other characters seems to be more brilliant... Yet, in this superficial way... Fanny is brilliant as the nature, the Sun is... She sparks as stars... And force the surrounding, or at least the reader to think about excellency which is a path to brilliance, even though, some kind of brilliance are often hidden from the common understanding, aspiration, or feeling...
If interested, in my latest video, or the piece of music I improvised, is what I felt and translated about the novel...
Mansfield Park is such a great book! I'm glad to hear your appreciation for it.
I actually really love Mansfield Park and I didn't find it boring at all but I can never seem to get on board with Fanny Price! It has been a lot of years since I read it so my feelings might change on a re-read. I sympathize with her situation but I hated the fact that she picked Edmund, it did not make any sense to me. It is good that she has a strong moral compass though I think she is too strict and it doesn't allow for her character to develop as she never changes her mind on anything. I always love the scene in the movie The Jane Austen Book Club where they debate whether Fanny is a good heroine and I can definitely see both sides!
+ViennaWaitsBooks Hoorah, I'm glad to find someone else who loves Mansfield Park! Fanny is a certainly a complicated and divisive character, and while I love the book and love her, I'm not that fond of Edmund it's true. I often wonder at the end of the book if they'd actually be happy together, because yes Fanny got what he wanted, but I'm not sure his feelings for her equal hers for him. But one of the reasons why I like it is that it doesn't feel as grand romancy or as perfect happy ending as some of her other books. It's one you can think about a lot. I like that.
So I really, really didn't enjoy Mansfield Park. Edmund especially bugs me with falling for Mary Crawford but this video makes me want to give it another go. To your point about Fanny being too hard to portray on screen, do you think maybe it's that they haven't gotten a great actress to play her? To me she's quite similar to Anne Elliot and that has been done successfully... On a side note, I'm so enjoying your videos and love your discussions. I'd love to do a buddy read and I was wondering if you're at all interested in "The Vicar of Wakefield" by Oliver Goldsmith?
I love the Fanny played by Sylvestra le Touzel (in 1983?) czcams.com/video/1CYqi7AnM18/video.html
I actually really loved the Patricia Rozema directed film of Mansfield Park! I thought the moves she made, especially near the end of the film, were so intriguing, and really added to the depth and the complexity of the characters. I also loved all of the performances in it. Mansfield Park is my favorite Austen novel! It's so good. It's so good.
I enjoyed the film when I watched it before having read the book, but for me it's not a great adaptation of the book - Fanny in that film is entirely unrelated to Fanny in the book. It's a film I like if I separate it from the book - Johnny Lee Miller is brilliant, and it's good fun, though I love the book far much.
I love how you love it
Thanks :)
I'm half way through it now, lov'in it.
I know I am really late to the party, but I would like to recommend the webseries adaptation. As far as adaptations go, Mansfield Park hasn't been done justice to, as you phrase it yourself, but the webseries adaptation provides a fantastic mix into both Fanny's head and into the action.
I'll have to check it out - I hear such great things about it :)
Thank you for this very interesting review!
In 1972 BBC radio did a four hour broadcast of the book, which is better than any of the visual versions. Peter Egan was Henry Crawford, and the late Sara Coward (Caroline from the Archers) was Maria Bertram. I don't think it's been issued on CD.
Sounds really interesting!
I know this is an old video but I finished Mansfeild Park a few weeks ago and it is my favorite book by Austen, so far from what I did.
It is such a great book!
I kinda want to make this my next Austen novel now
+Knowledge Lost I think it would interest you - and it's just so great :)
I saw the 1999 movie and liked it so much that I picked up the novel, which is very different from the movie, and far from boring. It's complex, rich and thoughtful, a great novel. Loved your discussion of it.
Thanks!
Thank you for this video! I‘m reading Jane Austen since I was around 12 but Mansfield Park I just read in May 2020 because I always had Not the best feeling about it and I hated it. I thought about reading it again this year and your video really helped me to make it a yesfor a reread and maybe a bit more sensible read for all the topics. So thank you! Btw looking forward for your Book next year!
I think the best Mansfield Park adaptation is the vlog series "From Mansfield with Love" Having her do video letters to her brother lets us see her thoughts in a way that feels natural.
Yes I've seen that since this video and love it so much!
I wouldn't say that Henry Crowford is a complex character. He seems to me as a then playboy, not particularly disgusting, a bit charming and sophisticated, probably well-educated. Anyway, I can' t get my head around it why Edmund and his sisters are so infatuated with the Crowforfs ,🥴
Excellent commentary! I've read all of Austen's novels. Years ago I read Mansfield Park and remember having to push and shove and slog my way through it. I like how you described the novel - lots of Fanny's thoughts, lots of dialogue from other people and then Fanny's reaction to them....Fanny'not being gregarious nor witty and filled with snappy comebacks, etc, Someday I will reread it.
Thanks! Mansfield Park is such a wonderful novel.
I also wanted Fanny to fall in love with Henry Crawford. Both after reading the book and the Movie(1999). Though the movie has changed the character of Fanny .
Yeah, that film always annoys me for having really changed the character of Fanny!
@@katiejlumsden Let alone 2007 production - just horrid😦
I have a feeling we might we Mansfield Park in my personal book club next year... I'll be very pleased to do so!!
+Amanda Center (IntrovertX) I hope you enjoy it if you do :)
I read Mansfield Park last year and was first disappointed by the "weakness" of Fanny until I realised that she simply possesses a different kind of strength and then I geeked over it because I thought it was so cool for Austen to show that extremely introverted people can be very strong in various ways that are very underrated.
I then proceeded to watch an adaptation and was so disappointed when they overhauled Fanny to be physically strong and actually quite outgoing because yes, this is so not the point!
I just finished Mansfield Park tonight and I loved it! I also loved Henry, despite himself and despite myself, but was relieved when she finally chose as she did. Now I only have Sense and Sensibility to read. The order of my favorite Austen novels now stands thusly: 1. Persuasion 2. Pride and Prejudice 3. It's a tie between Mansfield Park and Emma and lastly, so far, is Northanger Abbey. I will check back in when I have read Sense and Sensibility. Love your videos.
Mansfield Park is amazing! I'm so glad you loved it.
@@katiejlumsden I'm already reading it again! Love it!!!
In my case, as I have aged my appreciation for different books have increased ( of Austen's) and others have decreased. When I much younger, Pride and Prejudice was in the forefront with Emma a close second. Now they are closer to the bottom- Yes, I know I love Mr. Darcy and Lizzy BUT I've moved on...- I now prefer Mansfield Park and Persuasion. There is more social commentary in MP, I particularly like when Fanny's mother mentions that she married for love and is cynical about her choice. The disparity between Fanny's upbringing and her richer relations shows the precarious social fabric in choices one makes. Persuasion to me is so wonderful in that Ann Elliot has another chance on love with Capt. Wentworth. It really speaks to that there is that special someone out there for everyone.
I adore Mansfield Park. While Pride and Prejudice is my favourite in terms of sheer enjoyment, Mansfield Park is probably her novel that I find the most interesting, for the reasons that you said. I love Persuasion too.
Books and Things, thanks for responding! I've been watching your video's, you are so insightful! I really liked your video on Austen regarding her choice not to marry. Do you write yourself?
My tastes have changed as I have aged but Emma is still my favourite. It's just so witty overall and doesn't rely purely on the heroine being 'sparkling' or an idealized romance. All the characters and fun and silly yet it's all very smart. But Pride and Prejudice is falling lower on the list while Mansfield Park and Persuasion have gone up. Though I always loved Mansfield. I actually needed a few reads to fall in love with Persuasion.
Coming really late into this discussion, but I only finished reading Mansfield Park yesterday. I already had the film adaption from 1999 and after reading I readily see the differences. But, checking IMDB, in the trivia section it actually says that the film's intro mentions that its based on the novel AND early journals and letters, so it would be a tad unfair to critique the film for not being entirely true to the novel. Because Fanny is so shy and contained in her manners, but not always so in her internal dialogue, the use of the letters and journals is dramaturgically clever in my opinion.
Before reading any of Austen's books, I found the 1995 BBC adaption of P&P to be the best. This summer I have read four of them, starting with P&P, but as books I'd put Persuasion at number one now, followed by Mansfield Park and S&S. I guess I have better read P&P again now, after having become acquainted with Austen's style. I still think the 1995 BBC adaption, as such, is still the best.
You've almost convinced me to eventually re-read Mansfield Park, almost certainly. It's my 6th favourite JA book (ie least favourite)
I do recommend it! It's a great, great book, and one that I loved so much more on a re-read.
I think the problem like to compare Mansfield Park to Pride and Prejudice or Emma when Fanny Price is so much different to Eliza Bennet or Emma Woodhouse. I feel it unfair to Fanny for others to compare her to those more popular characters. She is simply different and I love and appreciate her for that.
I love her too - such a great character.
Nothing about the slave trade? The whole estate is buit on this new money from the slave trade. Fanny was so eager to talk about the slave trade with Sir Thomas because she doesn't undertand the concept of enslavement. The whole family avoids discusing it and fanny is left with curiosity. While fanny is by definition enslaved to the Bertrams and Mrs. Norris, she is not enslaved socially to their norms; hence why she does not allow herself to be a comodity to Henry. Henrys only desire is to marry Fanny so he can do what all maried men are allowed to do.... Fanny is the way she is becasue shes white female slave and she doesnt even know it. Jane Austen wrote this book during the peak of the abolitionism movement in England.
Here I am in your comments three years after this was posted, lol.
I'm wondering if your feeling have remained the same on Henry Crawford as time has gone on. I do agree he's an interesting character and that he could be a better person if he tried, but I think he's far more interested in indulging himself than doing the right thing. Fanny is spot on when she says they would make each other miserable as husband and wife because, although it's possible for people to undergo change throughout their lives, it's very unusual for people to completely change they way they approach life. Henry is used to getting what he wants and living his life in the way that strokes his own ego. Then there's Fanny who essentially lives for others. It's a recipe for marital discord and I never heard anything from Henry to indicate that he wanted to change *himself* to win Fanny over. It was all about bringing her around to the idea of marrying him, when he's the one who would need to change to make a match between them work.
And then he proves his own moral bankruptcy with his actions at the end. I don't think he's a bad person, but he's a pampered little rich boy who's never been asked to think about anyone but himself. In my eyes, he was far more attracted to the potential glory and admiration he would receive for winning a wife as moral and good as Fanny than he ever was to Fanny herself.
Haha nice to have you here! So, I feel like Henry Crawford is one of those Austen characters I could make a whole video about. In a way he's my favourite Austen character - not one of the nicest, but one of the most interesting. I think he is the most redeemed of Austen's 'cad' characters - Wickham's pretty thoroughly evil, Willoughby has a moment of redemption/understanding but it's not enough, but Henry Crawford I think is more thoroughly explored. I find him such an interesting character because he /could/ have been a better man, because he wants to be - but like you said in your video, his actions end up showing him otherwise. The way I read it, he is in love with Fanny, but he's too obsessed with instant gratification, too vain, to be true to her when she rejected him. I really do think that marrying Fanny would have made him a better person, would have been a happy ending for him - but it wouldn't have been a happy ending for her, because she doesn't love him, doesn't even like or respect him, and knows herself too well to know she could change that. Personally I've never really liked Edmund that much as a hero, though I love Fanny as a heroine, and the ending between Fanny and Edmund is kind of down-played - the 'romantic' ending to the novel would be for Fanny and Henry Crawford to get together, but Austen purposefully chooses an ending that isn't true to novel convention but is true to her heroine - which I love! One of the things I love about Mansfield Park is that so many other Jane Austen novels are about character development, whereas Mansfield Park is kind of about the opposite - Fanny Price is herself from the start and remains herself, constant and steadfast and strong, not needing to go through an arc of character development because she's already as she should be from the start. Ah, such a good book!
@@katiejlumsden I would love to see a full video on Henry Crawford! Or just a discussion on all of Austen's mischievous supporting actors. If only we lived closer we could sit down and discuss this book over tea for what would probably turn into hours lol. Such an amazing book.
What Edmund finds attractive in Mary is understandable: she's charming. What Mary finds attractive in Edmund is more intriguing. He's everything that she doesn't seem to like: pious, not rich, serious, unironic, unambitious, chaste. Edmund may be a window into her alternative life, just a Fanny is Henry's: a life of honesty and dignity?
Thanks for this, I've got a research essay due this week and no time to read the whole book
I hope it helps...
I cannot agree with you about Henry Crawford but I do agree that there is no good film adaptation. The book is fantastic though I did get weary of Fanny's crying early on. She does have a strength of character that is manifested in her behavior particularly as she matures and then overtakes Edmund in terms of having good sense. SO much to like about the book and Fanny is a very complex character who grows on you through her trials.
They just never get it right in the adaptations!
I only disagree about Henry. I have met guys like him and I reacted to them exactly as Fanny has. And some of those types have tried to win me over. I was not the girl popular guys were attracted to so the attempts were clearly to gratify their own vanities. We're all approaching middle age and the few I still know haven't changed. Sad to say. He's fun to read about but the not-faithful 1999 adaptation says it correctly "[rakes] are more fun to read on the page than in real life". I would have tossed the book in the bin if Fanny had accepted him.
I do find him a fascinating character, though!
@@katiejlumsden definitely. He is probably one of the most real of Austen's "villains". He was never going to win Fanny over but you still sort of pity him as he almost reformed but he never really considered what chance was being offered to him. If he had really understood what it was about Fanny's goodness that appealed to him he could have found another principled girl to marry and be faithful to.
I finished it about a week ago. And I didn't like it that much. It wasn't bad, but it was kind of a slog for me. I admire Fanny but she's so blind to how she's been abused. I wish she would have had an awakening of how she'd be wronged by so many. Northanger Abbey is next and then I will have read her major novels. Then I'm starting back over again so I will read it again. Not sure how I will feel on round two of MP. I think no matter what, I disliked that after a whole novel of Fanny's thoughts and feelings, we get NO insight into how she felt when Edmund falls in love with her. Yes, I know she's happy but can we feel that with her??? But noooooo.... 😢 I agree I liked Henry Crawford. He was pretty awful, but soclose to getting it right once he felt real love, only to blow it all with Maria.
Just finished Mansfield Park. I didn't think it was as entertaining as P&P or as clever as Emma. There were parts I quite liked and parts that confused me. Putting on that play seemed like an awfully big deal, for instance.
I guess it's just to do with the morals of the time - I've always found the characters' theatricals very historically interesting.
Hello Mam, from which website i can get a good notes of Mansfield Park and I mean all the notes, Critical analysis,Summary and their characters.
I tried reading Mansfield Park a few years ago and never finished and I don't know why!!!! Maybe because it's quieter. I don't know. But this needs to be remedied.
+Emily Hornburg It is quieter, a bit less witty and quick than Austen's other novels. Like although it's my favourite, it's never a place I recommend people start with Jane Austen. But I do love it, and I do recommend it - I hope you like it if you get round to finishing it :)
I have to say, I don't think Edmund ever falls "in love" with Mary Crawford, more like "in lust". He is infatuated by her gregarious and fun-loving nature, but his attachment is never that profound, and he is attracted to an illusion, not the reality of who Mary Crawford is. He idealises her and views her as the model of the perfect woman, but he is blindsided by her manipulative and devious nature, and soon comes to appreciate the value of Fanny. I also don't think either Mariah or Julia fall in love with Henry Crawford at any point in the book.
I was disappointed that Fanny turned down Henry Crawford. Edmund is SO boring but she had worshipped him from her childhood as he was kind to her. But I feel that Henry would have changed for her. A shame.
I cannot agree that Henry Crawford is presented sympathetically by Austen. He's a seducer of women, particularly married women, with no concern that it might ruin the woman's reputation. But with Fanny he meets his opposition, and he becomes determined to break her. Jane Austen tricks her readers into thinking that Henry does truly fall for Fanny and is reforming himself in an effort to win Fanny over. And yet in the end, he cannot rise above his immoral inclinations and sleeps with Maria. Can you imagine that he would have been faithful to Fanny, if they had married? I think not.
1:16 A little bit beneath her? More like a lot, for that day and age.
Lol, as I said to my GF's PhD advisor recently...MP is my 6th favorite Austen novel...and watch out MP...History of England is on your tail(tale?, lol). I don't hate it or Fanny Price however. Well, I think 1983 is ok...'99 is not actually MP, and 2007....Billie Piper as Fanny?????????? Certainly the worse casting of a major Austen character that I know of. There is a better version of MP....and it stars Felicity Jones, Benedict Cumberbatch, David Tennant, and Amanda Root....and...it was.....on....the radio! UGH! I call that MP luck.
+rearadmiral doublezero I love Mansfield Park so much - I totally didn't know about that radio adaptation though - what a voice cast, I'll have to look it up :)
So I really, really didn't enjoy Mansfield Park. Edmund especially bugs me with falling for Mary Crawford but this video makes me want to give it another go. To your point about Fanny being too hard to portray on screen, do you think maybe it's that they haven't gotten a great actress to play her? To me she's quite similar to Anne Elliot and that has been done successfully... On a side note, I'm so enjoying your videos and love your discussions. I'd love to do a buddy read and I was wondering if you're at all interested in "The Vicar of Wakefield" by Oliver Goldsmith?
+Kate Howe I don't think it's as immediately enjoyable as some of her other books, and as I said I wasn't overly fond of it the first time I read it and now I absolutely love it and it's my second favourite - so it's maybe worth another try! :) And yes, I think they need an actress who can really portray Fanny, and an adaptation that doesn't shy away from presenting Fanny as she actually is in the book.
Also, absolutely yes, I'd love to do a buddy read! I need to read more 18th century literature and apparently I can get The Vicar of Wakefield free on kindle, so let's do it! :) Let me know when you want to start. Maybe January?
+Books and Things Agree with all the above. Yay!! It's a plan!
Great! :)
+Books and Things Do you have a Voxer or would you prefer email for communication?
No, I don't have Voxer. But goodreads is fine :) Are you on twitter?
Hello Mam, from which website i can get a good notes of Mansfield Park and I mean all the notes, Critical analysis,Summary and their characters.