MANDARIN & DUNGAN
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- čas přidán 1. 03. 2023
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Dungan is a Sinitic language spoken primarily in Kazakhstan and Kyrgyzstan by the Dungan people, an ethnic group related to the Hui people of China. Although it is derived from the Central Plains Mandarin of Gansu and Shaanxi, it is written in Cyrillic (or Xiao'erjing) and contains loanwords and archaisms not found in other modern varieties of Mandarin.
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as a native mandarin speaker, i think Dungan sounds to me like how Mandarin sounds to non-Mandarin speakers
sorry but mandarin sounds a lot harsher than dongguan to my foreign earssss :(((
As a non-Madarine speaker Mandarin sounds more harsher and thicker than Dungan.
As a non-mandarin speaker, I don't understand dungan equally
东干人讲的就是19世纪中期的陕西话。
As a Mandarin speaker born and raised in Shaanxi, Dungan language sounds like our local dialect in northern Shaanxi. I can totally understand what they said.
I find it interesting how Dungan is written in Cyrillic.
It's spoken in Kyrgyzstan and central Asia in general, so it makes sense as it was part of the USSR
Dungans living in former Soviet Union, mainly in Central Asian republics like my country Kazakhstan, ou neighbor countries Kyrgyzstan and Uzbekistan, use Cyrillic alphabet. There are ca. 60 000 Dungans in my country Kazakhstan and between 40 000 - 50 000 in Kyrgyzstan...
@@nurbolatbeketov8181 That’s pretty interesting.
The Dungan people are biologically the same as the Shaanxi and Gansu people in China. The Dungan language has two dialects, which are respectively the same as the Chinese Shaanxi Guanzhong dialect (belonging to the Central Plains Mandarin) and the Chinese eastern Gansu dialect (belonging to the Lanyin Mandarin). There are no Russian and Turkic loanwords.
Because the migration was urgent at that time, which led to the lack of dictionaries for the migrated population, Chinese characters were lost among this group of people. The loss of Chinese characters may also be due to the low average education level of this group and the lack of high-level intellectuals as well. From this Dungan text, it can be seen that the words and sentences are very colloquial, and there is no literary vocabulary and sentences at all, such as saying 箴言（zhēn yán）/格言（gé yán）(proverb) as 聪明话 (clever words).
Colloquialism in sentence making is same obvious. Here is what this Dungan text would look like written in Chinese characters (there are a few places where the reading and writing are slightly different), Those who can speak Mandarin can clearly feel that the sentences are very colloquial:
这是大卫的儿子的伊斯来由（以色列）国里的皇上苏马内（所罗门）的聪明话，苏马内（所罗门）把这些话给那些人给以哩，是想把聪明的教说知明白，想白（明白）有尔林（知识）的话，把礼仪带到，端路数，公道带实心学好。他想给不见的人们添些意见，给少年们添些知识带灵分，聪明人听见也得叫学呢，明白人把意见找着呢。
@@tata-ce7hu 看来汉字拼音化之后就是这个下场
To be linguistically precise, Mandarin in the title is "Standard Mandarin" which is beautified North Mandarin. Dungan's ancestor is Shaanxi/Gansu Mandarin (north west Mandarin). They are all Mandarins which literally means Official Language used by the government officials. I can pretty much understand Dungan (except its loan words) because I am from north west China.
this is the best explanation of mandarin that I've ever seen online
Well, this is something brand new.
Dunggan is a variety of mixture of Lanyin Mandarin and Zhongyuan Mandarin (Dentral Plain Mandarin). Yes, they are all Mandarin, but different varieties. Dunggan has three tones and no checked tone
Here is what this Dungan text would look like written in Chinese characters (there are a few places where the reading and writing are slightly different in this video), Those who can speak Mandarin can clearly feel that the sentences are very colloquial:
这是大卫的儿子的伊斯来由（以色列）国里的皇上苏马内（所罗门）的聪明话，苏马内（所罗门）把这些话给那些人给以哩，是想把聪明的教说知明白，想白（明白）有尔林（知识）的话，把礼仪带到，端路数，公道带实心学好。他想给不尖（不机灵）的人们添些意见，给少年们添些知识带灵分，聪明人听见也得叫学呢，明白人把意见找着呢。这么价把口歌带比方，把聪明人的话，带他们的猜话，要知明白呢。
Thanks for your very helpful transliteration
It should be 不奸 instead of 不见
找着呢 instead of 造着呢. In Dungan, they sometimes replace zh with z.
@@Qiyunwu Thanks for your support.
@@robinchen2754 Thanks you. In "找着/造着", I consider "找着" is more likely to be true, and it is more in accordance with English and Mandarin sample text. And I watched a Dungan oral song video before, and "找" was indeed pronounced as зо (Pinyin: zuo), here is the video link: czcams.com/video/lqsJNPWsy-0/video.html
In "不奸/不见", I reckon "不见" is more likely to be true, there is no mention of treachery in the English and Mandarin sample text as well.
我现在能够想象到
古代文言文使用者
听现代人讲话是什么感觉了
东干语：这么价把口歌带比方，把聪明人的话带他们的猜话，要知明白呢。
现代汉语：使人明白箴言和譬喻，懂得智慧人的言词和谜语。
其实东干语就是完全不受现代汉语语法和词汇影响的陕甘方言，而且他们的报纸上的字就是这样子写的，只不过写的是俄语字母（拼音）
Very interesting. Thank you so much.
This sounds exactly like the dialect in my hometown 😮😮😮and how my grandpa spoke
Dungans living in former Soviet Union, mainly in Central Asian republics like my country Kazakhstan, ou neighbor countries Kyrgyzstan and Uzbekistan, use Cyrillic alphabet. There are ca. 60 000 Dungans in my country Kazakhstan and between 40 000 - 50 000 in Kyrgyzstan...
Dungan is a simple way to learn Mandarin without Hanzi.
Well, _a_ form of Mandarin..
Nice video 😍💪😍
Basically, if you want to learn Mandarin without learning the characters, just learn Dungan.
Lol, you beat me to it.
Can we get a comparison video between hualong hui and dungan.
That music in the background
Many Chinese people said Cantonese Hokkien Shanghainese Hakka ...etc they're 'dialects' of Chinese because they're used the same character as Mandarin....Look, Dungan is a real dialect of Mandarin, but it's used Cyrillic alphabet ! So what? So Dungan is a different language? No. thus writing system can't prove anything !
yes but cantonese and hakka are still are classified as sinitic language. Have you heard a tibetan singing a cantonese song character to character without changing the lyrics?
the interesting part is even Madarin and Dungan are similar, but for myself(Taiwanese Mandarin speaker and understand Cyrillic alphabet), it's kinda hard to understand Dungan by listen it once, I have to repeat and repeat until i finally understand what did he say
It's because it's a dialect. Mandarin dialects can be pretty hard to understand too, but people forget that because when they think of Chinese dialects they always think of the more extremely different dialects like Cantonese and Hokkien
Dats cuz ur Taiwanese duh
Wow
Mandarin speaker here. Dungan sounds like dialects from northwest China.
Dungan language is northwestern mandarin as Dungans originate from the northwestern provinces such as Gansu and shaanxi. It’s a very colloquial language as many people before in those regions were illiterate.
Sounds a little more nasal than standard Mandarin, but that could just be the speaker.
You can find the similar accent in Shan Xi Province. Not sure about Gan Su, I have never been there.
haha.. I can confirm..they came from China, and some where around Shanxi, Gansu.. very local dialect. 以色列王 = 以色列皇上； 所罗门箴言= 所罗门把这些话 给那些人递一； 。。 those in Chinese you can find in google translate as Chiense (Litera) they are not used as the way daily communication does. 使智慧人听见 = 聪明人听见
I shall visit these people haha.
Can you do comparison video of Philippine Hokkien and Mandarin
?? Why Not even close though
@@youtubedeletedmyaccountlma2263 dont have to be close to compare. both hokkien and mandarin is spoken in the philippines by chinese filipinos, so there's a purpose for it to at least show to people who dont know anything about them to see the difference
Dungan would have been better if there was an Arabic display（小兒經）.
xiao er jing ?
BUDDHA BLESS THE SPEAKERS!
and how do they, being a tonal language, convey these very tones in Cyrillic?🤔
Ikr
Wikipedia says they don't, surprisingly, except in dictionaries. Even in dictionaries there are only three representable tones (using the hard sign, soft sign or none). Must be hard to learn to read Dungan.
I have never heard of Dungan :(
@thatonenerd in China they are called something like Hueitsu meaning something like: Chinese muslims. In former Soviet Union countries, where they migrated massively after unsuccessful, bloody riot in Western China back in 1860s - 1880s, they are called Dungans
they are hui muslims who fled to central asia after the dungan revolt: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dungan_Revolt_(1862%E2%80%931877)
Now you do!
Dungan use cyrilic very near to Tocharian, Mongolian and Uyghur in phonetics too. And copy sounds and words of puntunghua🫂👍🥂✅😉
Dungan is a dialect of Mandarin, could understand almost everything as a Mandarin speaker...there are certain other dialects of Mandarin which are harder to understand
For instance, Jianghuai Mandarin dialect.
@@robinchen2754 Agreed, Dungan is much easier to understand than jianghuai mandarin. Jianghuai is almost a different language
江淮官话这个定义感觉有点像垃圾桶，纯粹就是把一堆过渡方言扔到了一起。我家乡是一个江淮官话区，但是我还是觉得和赣方言更近而不是普通话，甚至和吴语的相似处都比普通话更多些。
The Dungan people are biologically the same as the Shaanxi and Gansu people in China. The Dungan language has two dialects, which are respectively the same as the Chinese Shaanxi Guanzhong dialect (belonging to the Central Plains Mandarin) and the Chinese eastern Gansu dialect (belonging to the Lanyin Mandarin). There are no Russian and Turkic loanwords.
Because the migration was urgent at that time, which led to the lack of dictionaries for the migrated population, Chinese characters were lost among this group of people. The loss of Chinese characters may also be due to the low average education level of this group and the lack of high-level intellectuals as well. From this Dungan text, it can be seen that the words and sentences are very colloquial, and there is no literary vocabulary and sentences at all, such as saying 箴言（zhēn yán）/格言（gé yán）(proverb) as 聪明话 (clever words).
Colloquialism in sentence making is same obvious. Here is what this Dungan text would look like written in Chinese characters (there are a few places where the reading and writing are slightly different in this video), Those who can speak Mandarin can clearly feel that the sentences are very colloquial:
这是大卫的儿子的伊斯来由（以色列）国里的皇上苏马内（所罗门）的聪明话，苏马内（所罗门）把这些话给那些人给以哩，是想把聪明的教说知明白，想白（明白）有尔林（知识）的话，把礼仪带到，端路数，公道带实心学好。他想给不尖（不机灵）的人们添些意见，给少年们添些知识带灵分，聪明人听见也得叫学呢，明白人把意见找着呢。这么价把口歌带比方，把聪明人的话，带他们的猜话，要知明白呢。
I've always thought they were a Mongol hybrid
No the Dungans are either Persian or Mekkans Who went East and left Mecca.
As I know, Dungans are mix of Turks, Persians, Chinese, Kazakhs and Mongols. The Dungan language looks like mix Kazakh and Chinese.
yep, i can understand 80% of them as a Mandarin speaker
They are descended from a failed uprising of Hui Muslims led by Bai Yanhu 白彦虎 during the Qing dynasty
The Dungan people are biologically the same as the Shaanxi and Gansu people in China. The Dungan language has two dialects, which are respectively the same as the Chinese Shaanxi Guanzhong dialect (belonging to the Central Plains Mandarin) and the Chinese eastern Gansu dialect (belonging to the Lanyin Mandarin). There are no Russian and Turkic loanwords.
Because the migration was urgent at that time, which led to the lack of dictionaries for the migrated population, Chinese characters were lost among this group of people. The loss of Chinese characters may also be due to the low average education level of this group and the lack of high-level intellectuals as well. From this Dungan text, it can be seen that the words and sentences are very colloquial, and there is no literary vocabulary and sentences at all, such as saying 箴言（zhēn yán）/格言（gé yán）(proverb) as 聪明话 (clever words).
Colloquialism in sentence making is same obvious. Here is what this Dungan text would look like written in Chinese characters (there are a few places where the reading and writing are slightly different in this video), Those who can speak Mandarin can clearly feel that the sentences are very colloquial:
这是大卫的儿子的伊斯来由（以色列）国里的皇上苏马内（所罗门）的聪明话，苏马内（所罗门）把这些话给那些人给以哩，是想把聪明的教说知明白，想白（明白）有尔林（知识）的话，把礼仪带到，端路数，公道带实心学好。他想给不尖（不机灵）的人们添些意见，给少年们添些知识带灵分，聪明人听见也得叫学呢，明白人把意见找着呢。这么价把口歌带比方，把聪明人的话，带他们的猜话，要知明白呢。
What? As a Kazakh, I wouldn’t say like that. We never mixed with Dungans. They came to Kazakhstan in 19th century. Even one word is not clear to us. We are Turkic people😀
Dungan people are just Hui people that migrated out of china...they dont even call themselves Dungan, Turkic and Russian people call them that. They just call themselves Hui just like Hui people from China
I could understand 100% of this part of Dungan as a Mandarin speaker. I just learnt this language (dialect) for 3 months.
I like this Chinese dubber better
Dungan sounds like chinese that use Kyril letters instead Hanzi.
I speak Mandarin but this is very hard to understand. Maybe someone from Gansu can parse it better?
Also, I was expecting a poem from Yasir Shivaza, he's like the premier Dungan poet
Мандарин
Español y Francés es como:
Contrary to common (mis)beliefs that Dungan/Huihui are genetically the same as Han Chinese, Dungan and Hui people are in fact genetically clustered together as a group and are more western-shifted than Northern Han Chinese (and other Han clusters including central and southern Han). Basically they are as distinctive from Han as Tibetans, which can be surprising to many people. Generally speaking, all East Asian ethnic groups (eg Han, Tibetan, Yugur(not the same as Uyghur), Tu, Yi, Hui etc) genetically have a lot more overlaps with each other than ethnicities in other parts of the world. The closest Han Chinese group to Dungan/Huihui is Shanxi Han.
that you have to define what is Han, which really, has no definition.
@@liran547 No it's just like every other ethnicities, there's a range. In the study published on Cell i'm referring to, Han Chinese are categorised into Northern, Central and Southern Han and they cluster with each other on a continuum. Just like the others. In human genome studies, it's pretty clear.
@@bricksclicking9673 geneticly maybe，culturly, the defination is blurred, for example, the hot olympic champion Eleen Gu, is she Han?
@@liran547 I was talking exclusively about genetics in the origin post, if you go back to my first sentence.
@@bricksclicking9673 i wasnt, you replied to say Han is Han, 100% genetic prove, but im not saying genetic is everything, Han or Chinese is purly a culture thing
听起来很熟悉，但是完全听不懂。
Dungan sounds a bit Tibetan to me
The reading part comparison is totally meaningless, I have never heard or seen anyone use the following words: 「智慧人」「少年人」「靈明」, these just sound weird to my native ears, on the contrary, Dungan's "聰明人" (tsunminzhyn) is a commonly used word in Standard Mandarin, I wonder who exactly translated this ???
陕西话😂
听不懂东干话，他们用的词太低级了，一些高级词汇都丢失了？
Here is what this Dungan text would look like written in Chinese characters (there are a few places where the reading and writing are slightly different in this video), Those who can speak Mandarin can clearly feel that the sentences are very colloquial:
这是大卫的儿子的伊斯来由（以色列）国里的皇上苏马内（所罗门）的聪明话，苏马内（所罗门）把这些话给那些人给以哩，是想把聪明的教说知明白，想白（明白）有尔林（知识）的话，把礼仪带到，端路数，公道带实心学好。他想给不尖（不机灵）的人们添些意见，给少年们添些知识带灵分，聪明人听见也得叫学呢，明白人把意见找着呢。这么价把口歌带比方，把聪明人的话，带他们的猜话，要知明白呢。